Welcome to the Disciples of the Watch podcast with your hosts, Gene Vogel and Nate Matnich. Hey, Disciples, welcome back to another fantastic episode of the Disciples of the Watch podcast. In this episode, we're gonna work our way from worst to best on Bolt Thrower's eight full-length studio albums. I'm Nate Matnich.
And I'm Gene Vogel. Thank you for joining us. Before we, of course, dive into all that, maybe we gotta play a little catch-up. And we're face-to-face for the first time in how many years since 2020?
Yep, it's been about five years since we last recorded in the same room together. Yes, this is awesome. I'm glad you could swing by and make that work. You're only up here just to record the podcast, right?
Yep, yep. I drove all this way for that. You know. All the way from Denver to the Minneapolis area.
Hell yeah. That's dedication. Bolt Thrower means that much to you. I know, I'm just super stoked about Bolt Thrower.
No, just, I'm really glad it worked out that we were gonna be in town on the day that we're gonna be recording. And I wanted to get together with you, so this worked out perfect. But I went to the Iron Range first because my nephew graduated. And he had a party, so I went up there just to be there for that.
And, you know, my family lives about three and a half hours north of Minneapolis. So we drove there first from Denver. And it was about nine and a half hours of driving the first day and then about seven hours driving the next day. And then I drove about three and a half hours today to Minneapolis.
Jeepers. So, and I'm really excited about our Airbnb. We took a, you know, a little bit of a gamble as to the location. We didn't, we just weren't sure how the place was gonna be, but it's just a really cool place.
But it's right on Lake Lindale, so people who are familiar with the Twin Cities in Minnesota, you'll know what Lake Lindale is and that kind of area there. The Bryant Lake Bowl is right outside of our bedroom window. And it's right in the heart of Uptown. So, like, there's all kinds of action.
Like Lake Street, you know, the bedroom overlooks Lake Street, you know. It's pretty cool, you know, to be right there in the middle of that for our Airbnb. And the apartment is really nice. Good.
Yeah, that's, you're definitely in the heart of the action right there. Yeah, there's like, uh, uh, Cheapo Records is really close by there on Nicollet. And uh, Extreme Noise Records is really close by there. I was trying to remember the name of it.
I'm like, you're right there by the punk place. What's the name of it? Extreme Noise. I'm gonna go there for sure.
Nice. Yeah, you know, we're gonna be here till Thursday. Today is Sunday. We have some time, like, just to schedule for ourselves.
Like, we're gonna go to Lake Nokomis and they have, like, these swan boats you can rent and kind of paddle them around, you know, with your feet. And we've always looked at them when we were kayaking around Nokomis, but we're actually gonna go rent one and go paddle around Nokomis on one of these swan boats. Nice. Yeah, so definitely looking forward to having some fun, just on our own, you know, because we're, we used to have fun here, of course, when we lived here.
So, yeah, especially when you got that kayak and you discovered your joy of kayaking. Yeah, yeah, a lot of fun. So, it's good to be in town. Yeah, we already went to Reverie, our favorite vegan restaurant.
And I was reminiscing about how we used to go there when they were on, uh, Nicollet and Franklin. It was called the Acadia Coffee Shop, which was an amazing coffee shop. Then that closed, then the Reverie was in there. And they had like, um, you know, it was like a coffee shop, and they had different types of like brewery beer in there and then a limited selection of food.
Then they left there and eventually they ended up where they're at now over on like 35th and Bloomington. And near Powderhorn Park. They've been there now for quite some time, you know, like just before COVID, I think. Oh yeah, nice that they survived that whole mess.
Yeah, the owners are super cool people. They're super involved in the, in the neighborhood that they're in, which is a pretty diverse neighborhood. And it's a little dicey over there as well. Um, but they're super, like, involved with different community groups.
It's real legit, you know, because it's just this couple that run this place. They actually, uh, are part of their community. I guess is what I'm saying. It's just not like a corporate.
Oh, that's right. You know what I'm saying? Anyways, so it's been cool to watch them kind of just grow. And they've been around for quite some time now.
And a lot of people go there and we always hit that place up at least two or three times while we're in town. Are they, are they paying you for saying this on the podcast? No, man. Free dinner or something.
I just like turning people on, you know, to stuff that, you know, that I like. Yeah. Especially if they happen to be in the twin cities area or passing through. I mean, obviously we get a lot of traffic at Mall of America as far as uh, you know, the people coming in from around the world, tourism.
Yeah, totally. Yeah. If you're vegan or even if, you know, like I, I eat eggs and stuff like that and cheese, so I'm more vegetarian, but I still love to eat there. I wasn't fully vegan at one time in my life, but I'm not currently.
Nice. So how is everything up north then? Good. Yep.
Good. Good to see my dad and my sisters and my nephew and step mom and better weather up there than what we're dealing with down here. It's exactly the same thing. So first thing we noticed is like, okay, I used to say like, you know, winters are miserable in Minnesota, but summers are pretty nice.
I'm revising that to now say winters and summers are miserable in Minnesota. And I'm really glad I don't live here anymore. It's just, the humidity is like right immediately. I can feel it in my lungs.
Like my asthma is like, if I feel it slightly in Colorado, I'm feeling it like tenfold here. Wow. And then, uh, nothing fucking dries. Like we stayed in a hotel room for like two nights or three nights and our towels never dried the whole fucking time hanging up, you know, like, I'm not used to that shit anymore.
Cause it's fucking dry in Colorado and you know, shit dries up quick. So we don't have any of that humidity. But anyways, we stayed in Grand Rapids, Minnesota. Got to drive Leslie around, my wife and show her different things cause I grew up there.
Nice. Any fond memories of that, of that area? Oh yeah. Um, most of my childhood fun memories are up on the Iron Range.
Oh nice. Yeah, I was telling you, you know, cause I grew up in the suburbs, you know, Burnsville where you did. Yep. And uh, I never had like friends and stuff, kind of like the same way I did in northern Minnesota because it's a small town.
Like my dad was in a town of 300 people and my dad was friends with all these people who had kids and we were all friends. And so we were all always doing stuff together and we would ride our bikes around town and you know, like go out in the mind dumps on our, our bikes, our BMX bikes and you know, make these little like trails and tracks and shit out there. And um, yeah, most of my like really fun memories of childhood were in that area. It's kind of like uh growing up in the trailer park, you know, you've got that tight community of people.
They're all in the similar living conditions, similar state of uh of existence. Yeah, totally. So it's a little more relatable and a little less spread out, you know, you get older and you get, especially when you're in the twin cities area, it's, it's so massive and uh, you know, you know, even like for us getting to know the neighbors and we're not even like in that big of a town, but compared to what you're dealing with up there, 300 people versus what are shy, be 18,000 or something, right? Yeah.
Super small town. Nice. It's not like that there now, but it was when I was a kid. Oh yeah, I suppose.
Well, it's still growing up there in that, in that area. I know there's been some hardships time and again, but well, ultimately when the iron ore mines closed is when the big wave of devastation came up there cause it was a really prosperous and nice place to live. And most people uh, worked in the iron ore mines and then yeah, they closed those and they've only had like certain ones open at certain times. But uh, most of the people I know who work in the mines get laid off quite a bit at various times.
And uh, but like Grand Rapids, you know, which is the town I was actually born in and it's a little bit bigger town there. That, that appears to like slowly be like revitalizing. There's like, like we went to a brewery that had surprisingly like upscale food. Like I was totally expecting to be disappointed because I mean like we ate in like Sioux Falls, South Dakota.
It You know, it's like if you didn't listen to Bolt Thrower, you've probably seen those album covers if you were at a record store, if you were adjacent to a death metal fan. You know, because it's on the shirts, it's iconic, it's Warhammer 40k, of course, so it's Games Workshop, it's, it's, you know, so it's people that even don't know Bolt Thrower, but they know Games Workshop, know Bolt Thrower because they're like, oh, that's that band that was using the art from the game, you know, that kind of thing. So it was always in my orbit, but I don't ever remember listening to it. Like with Bob, you know, our mutual friend Bob, who we, we kind of share musical exchanges with and, you know, you and him would constantly take training and whatnot.
Him and I really didn't do that, but he definitely turned me on to some stuff and, and, uh, was in my first band for, for one show, for a brief moment, basically, before he went to the military. But I don't remember Bob, like turning me on to Bolt Thrower or anything. I think it was just because it was always out there and through my um wanting to experiment with different bands. And I, I, you know, I don't know if that was when I was getting uh MP3s back when Napster was around or if it was after that.
And I feel like it was after that where I was buying them for cheap through the Russian websites. So I started getting Bolt Thrower via those means, and it was like, I think for me it was an approachable death metal band. You know, it wasn't extreme and the vocals weren't the pig squealy or anything like that. So it was like, hey, wait a minute.
This is, this is more along the lines of the death metal that I feel is interesting to me. So never like a huge fan, and I bought some of their stuff. I don't know if I own anything, like, I know I've ripped CDs, but I think all the stuff I purchased, I want to say, is, is been either used or it's just all digital. So no vinyl.
And uh yeah, it was one that when you proposed it, I was like, you know what, yeah, this will be kind of nice because it's for me, it's been scattershot. It's been, oh hey, this album, oh, I'm gonna, I'm gonna pick that up. You know, and I think it was, I want to say, uh, like their fifth album. I'm trying to remember the name of it, but yeah, so there was like a hit or miss, and then I think when I had a hard drive crash, I lost one of the albums.
So it's been in my orbit, you know, and, and uh it's been a band that I, I enjoy and I've played them, you know, like when I did the radio show in uh when uh Brian Owens had passed away, he was him and I had had some conversations because obviously those guys formed, was it In Memoriam? That the offshoot of um Bolt Thrower? Memoriam. It's just Memoriam.
OK. And I remember him and I were at a show, I think we did, we're, we're doing a show together, his band and my band. And I said, dude, or no, maybe it was on Facebook, but anyway, I, I was like, you got to check out Memoriam. And him and I, then I ran into him again at another show, and he's like, dude, you were right about that.
Those guys are great. So I ended up playing for the radio show as part of a tribute to Brian playing his band and playing some Bolt Thrower. It's one of those bands that, for me, as far as my level of death metal fandom is, is still like I enjoy what they do and the fact that they, they're like the first bands to have a female in the band, especially doing death metal. Joe Bench.
I just, I remember that like being talked about when we were kids. Like they got a chick bass player banned. That was really on. That was really uncommon at that time.
Yes. Now it's every band's got like a female vocalist or they got the female, you know, something, you know, which is perfect. It's fine. It's like, fuck yeah, bring more of it, you know?
And I don't even find that with the stuff we're getting for independent music is like a lot of bands with female lead vocalists and stuff like that. And on occasion, sometimes I'll look at a cover and go, huh, I wonder if that's the singer because I don't want to assume. And then sure enough, nope, it's a guy singing. But uh, yeah, she's on the bass or she's doing, she's doing the drums, or maybe she's another guitar player or maybe the lead guitar player.
So yeah, it's Joe Bench was one of the uh the pioneers of, of like, hey, women can do this too. I mean, I know that we have the runaways and we had Joan Jett and we had, uh, you know, all that uh Leta Ford and stuff, but especially in death metal, just having somebody in that world that's like, hell yeah. And I think, I, you know, from my understanding, is death metal fans, I think we're, we're like a very, like, much respect to Joe Bench being out there and, you know, because I'm sure they had, she had her detractors. There's probably a lot of guys going, dude, it's metal for guys, man.
I, you know, I don't know about that. I'm gonna, I want to actually say something about that because I know that it's, you know, it's often said that, you know, like metal music is male driven and whatnot. And uh we have to remember that first, first of all, like most of the extreme metal didn't happen until the early eighties. You know what I mean?
I'm not talking about like some of the more mainstream metal. I'm talking about where it started to get into the more fringes of stuff. Yeah, Venom. You know, it was, it was very male driven just because, you know, it's testosterone filled type music, you know, it's aggressive and everything.
I mean, just as an example, like growing up women and girls and stuff, they weren't into sports. Like they didn't want to hang out and like watch football, for instance, where like all of a sudden now, like I, that's common. Women are like way into fucking sports. Even my wife sometimes like, well, maybe like mentioned watching football.
And I'm like, there is no fucking way we are watching football. I'm gonna go in the other room or something. But anyways, uh, so I just think, just by design. I mean, it's fairly new that way.
And the fact that it's now been expanded and women are involved in it and they're, you know, hardcore and even with vocals and stuff, some of the women have done some really brutal type vocals and metal and stuff like that. It's just, you know, I don't think anybody really has a problem with it. I don't think anybody was like gatekeeping in the back being like, oh no women can't be a part of this. Well, there's probably still a few.
If you were a poser wearing like a, a Motley Crue shirt and Rick Holt's seen you, you're probably gonna get your ass kicked and your shirt taken. Yeah, of course. So anyways, uh Gary Holt, by the way, Rick Hunto was the other guy. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, right.
Gary Holt. I can't even remember, man. You're doing the death angel thing that I do. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Fuck one of those guys. No, apparently that was a thing. They beat up posers at Warlight, like uh Parametal shirts. But yeah, I mean nowadays, yes, everything's, you know, we've, we've grown so much since the early eighties, mid eighties or whatever to where we're at now, where you're talking about there, there, it's more common now and you know, women being into sports and extreme sports and, you know, fighting and everything else.
You know, that's obviously becoming more common and more popular, you know, even with, not just with women, but, you know, men watching those sports and men watching women beat up each other and stuff in UFC and all that jazz or WWE or whatever they call that. Is it WWE or the wrestling, whatever? The wrestling. I haven't watched it since it was uh AWA.
Oh, maybe a little WWF. WWF a little bit. Yeah. So, but Joe, you know, she was one of those, uh, you know, early death metal pioneers and getting in there and uh I think earning the respect of a little bit more open-minded uh male fans, let's just say.
I know I was, I thought it was really cool and I remember Bob, Bob thought it was really cool. And yeah, we, we both played bass too. So, uh, we had a, definitely had an appreciation for her. My uh introduction to bolt thrower was through the Grind Crusher uh compilation, and it was the song World Eater from Realm of Chaos.
And I had already started listening to death metal and my introduction to death metal, as I've said on this podcast a pride number of times is um obituary slowly rot. And I don't know if Bob would remember this, but I turned him on to death metal. That, that was his introduction to that type of death metal. We both heard stuff like Celtic Frost and things, you know, Venom and stuff like that.
But, you know, this new direction that death metal went, you know. Album that they did with a different vocalist which we'll talk to when we get to it. But what I really appreciate about him and I've talked about this contrast before where, you know, he's got more of like a raspy type of death metal vocal where you can actually kind of like understand what he's saying and it sounds kind of dark, but it's more like just like a raspy style where you'll have like Chris Barnes in the early Cannibal Corpse stuff where it's so over the top guttural that it's like, it's kind of difficult to live with, to hear. You know what I'm saying?
I kind of got turned off with that band really quickly because of that. And then later on hearing like Corpsegrinder who has a much better death metal vocal, then I had some more interest in them again. Anyways, Carl Willett's great vocalist. They started in 1986.
They were influenced by bands like Slayer, Crass, and Discharge. The band was founded by bassist Gavin Ward and guitarist Barry Thompson in a Coventry toilet during a hardcore punk gig. Shortly thereafter, Andrew Whale and Alan West joined on drums and vocals respectively. In 1987, in their In Battle There Is No Law demo was recorded with this lineup.
They did do some switching around. Gavin switched to guitars. They recruited Alex Tweedy to play bass. However, Alex did not show up for the recording and so Gavin played both guitar and bass for the demo two weeks after the recording session, Gavin's girlfriend Jo Bench replaced Tweedy.
With this lineup, they recorded their first Peel session on the 3rd of January, 1988. John Peel is an alternative disc jockey of BBC Radio 1. Very well known, even here in the States. Those of us that know music, I should say.
You couldn't go ask your average radio listener, but I think people that delve into, podcasters and people that dig a little deeper into music would go, Oh yeah, I know that name. I actually thought I had this recording, but it's a Napalm Death Peel sessions that I have. I was kind of excited for a second and then I was like, Ah, fuck it, I don't actually have that one. So he heard about them through their demo.
Then they replaced their singer with driver Carl Willett. In their debut LP, In Battle There Is No Law, demo was recorded with this lineup. They did do some switching around. Gavin switched to guitars.
They recruited Alex Tweedy to play bass. However, Alex did not show up for the recording and so Gavin played both guitar and bass for the demo two weeks after the recording session, Gavin's girlfriend Jo Bench replaced Tweedy. With this lineup, they recorded their first Peel session on the 3rd of January, 1988. John Peel is an alternative disc jockey of BBC Radio 1.
Very well known, even here in the States. Those of us that know music, I should say. You couldn't go ask your average radio listener, but I think people that delve into, you know, podcasters and people that dig a little deeper into music would go, Oh yeah, I know that name. I actually thought I had this recording, but it's a Napalm Death Peel sessions that I have.
I was kind of excited for a second and then I was like, Ah, fuck it, I don't actually have that one. So he heard about them through their demo. Then they replaced their singer with driver Carl Willett. In their debut LP, In Battle There Is No Law, demo was recorded with this lineup.
They did do some switching around. Gavin switched to guitars. They recruited Alex Tweedy to play bass. However, Alex did not show up for the recording and so Gavin played both guitar and bass for the demo two weeks after the recording session, Gavin's girlfriend Jo Bench replaced Tweedy.
With this lineup, they recorded their first Peel session on the 3rd of January, 1988. John Peel is an alternative disc jockey of BBC Radio 1. Very well known, even here in the States. Those of us that know music, I should say.
You couldn't go ask your average radio listener, but I think people that delve into, you know, podcasters and people that dig a little deeper into music would go, Oh yeah, I know that name. I actually thought I had this recording, but it's a Napalm Death Peel sessions that I have. I was kind of excited for a second and then I was like, Ah, fuck it, I don't actually have that one. So he heard about them through their demo.
Then they replaced their singer with driver Carl Willett. In their debut LP, In Battle There Is No Law, demo was recorded with this lineup. They did do some switching around. Gavin switched to guitars.
They recruited Alex Tweedy to play bass. However, Alex did not show up for the recording and so Gavin played both guitar and bass for the demo two weeks after the recording session, Gavin's girlfriend Jo Bench replaced Tweedy. With this lineup, they recorded their first Peel session on the 3rd of January, 1988. John Peel is an alternative disc jockey of BBC Radio 1.
Very well known, even here in the States. Those of us that know music, I should say. You couldn't go ask your average radio listener, but I think people that delve into, you know, podcasters and people that dig a little deeper into music would go, Oh yeah, I know that name. I actually thought I had this recording, but it's a Napalm Death Peel sessions that I have.
I was kind of excited for a second and then I was like, Ah, fuck it, I don't actually have that one. So he heard about them through their demo. Then they replaced their singer with driver Carl Willett. In their debut LP, In Battle There Is No Law, demo was recorded with this lineup.
They did do some switching around. Gavin switched to guitars. They recruited Alex Tweedy to play bass. However, Alex did not show up for the recording and so Gavin played both guitar and bass for the demo two weeks after the recording session, Gavin's girlfriend Jo Bench replaced Tweedy.
With this lineup, they recorded their first Peel session on the 3rd of January, 1988. John Peel is an alternative disc jockey of BBC Radio 1. Very well known, even here in the States. Those of us that know music, I should say.
You couldn't go ask your average radio listener, but I think people that delve into, you know, podcasters and people that dig a little deeper into music would go, Oh yeah, I know that name. I actually thought I had this recording, but it's a Napalm Death Peel sessions that I have. I was kind of excited for a second and then I was like, Ah, fuck it, I don't actually have that one. So he heard about them through their demo.
Then they replaced their singer with driver Carl Willett. In their debut LP, In Battle There Is No Law, demo was recorded with this lineup. They did do some switching around. Gavin switched to guitars.
They recruited Alex Tweedy to play bass. However, Alex did not show up for the recording and so Gavin played both guitar and bass for the demo two weeks after the recording session, Gavin's girlfriend Jo Bench replaced Tweedy. With this lineup, they recorded their first Peel session on the 3rd of January, 1988. John Peel is an alternative disc jockey of BBC Radio 1.
Very well known, even here in the States. Those of us that know music, I should say. You couldn't go ask your average radio listener, but I think people that delve into, you know, podcasters and people that dig a little deeper into music would go, Oh yeah, I know that name. I actually thought I had this recording, but it's a Napalm Death Peel sessions that I have.
I was kind of excited for a second and then I was like, Ah, fuck it, I don't actually have that one. So he heard about them through their demo. Then they replaced their singer with driver Carl Willett. In their debut LP, In Battle There Is No Law, demo was recorded with this lineup.
They did do some switching around. Gavin switched to guitars. They recruited Alex Tweedy to play bass. However, Alex did not show up for the recording and so Gavin played both guitar and bass for the demo two weeks after the recording session, Gavin's girlfriend Jo Bench replaced Tweedy.
With this lineup, they recorded their first Peel session on the 3rd of January, 1988. John Peel is an alternative disc jockey of BBC Radio 1. Very well known, even here in the States. Those of us that know music, I should say.
You couldn't go ask your average radio listener, but I think people that delve into, you know, podcasters and people that dig a little deeper into music would go, Oh yeah, I know that name. I actually thought I had this recording, but it's a Napalm Death Peel sessions that I have. I was kind of excited for a second and then I was like, Ah, fuck it, I don't actually have that one. So he heard about them through their demo.
Then they replaced their singer with driver Carl Willett. In their debut LP, In Battle There Is No Law, demo was recorded with this lineup. They did do some switching around. Gavin switched to guitars.
They recruited Alex Tweedy to play bass. However, Alex did not show up for the recording and so Gavin played both guitar and bass for the demo two weeks after the recording session, Gavin's girlfriend Jo Bench replaced Tweedy. With this lineup, they recorded their first Peel session on the 3rd of January, 1988. John Peel is an alternative disc jockey of BBC Radio 1.
Very well known, even here in the States. Those of us that know music, I'm very impressed with it. Solid collection, for sure. Number seven, we have Mercenary, and this is their sixth release.
The Metal Dad said, I purchased this album upon its release in 1988 and remember thinking then that it would take a few listens to these songs to have it as much staying power as the material that came before it. That's more a nod to how excellent the previous albums were as opposed to a knock on this record. In hindsight, realizing now how much inner turmoil this band was going through at the time, replacing their drummer, their vocalist coming and going, etc., my appreciation for this record has only grown over the years. This is a record that sounds tight and technically proficient in the way that only a band who had been killing it for well over a decade could produce.
When you look out at the death metal landscape in 1998, this album looks even more impressive. More than a few of their contemporaries were falling flat on their gore-soaked faces at that point, while Bolt Thrower just kept producing meaningful material. I wonder if that's like a kickout Cannibal Corpse or something. Candyman's ranking is, he says, Mercenary.
Now, this is more like it. This album is pretty great. The only reason it ranks lower is because of how amazing the rest of the albums are on this list. So number seven, Nate, where do you have Mercenary?
Number seven, you are a detractor. I am. I am all by myself on an island. You are the only Bolt Thrower fan on the planet that did this score.
I know that. I see that. And I even revisited this. I'm like, did I, am I off?
I revisited some of these albums that I was a little bit questionable, and I'm like, nope, this is, this is how I feel. Because, you know, sometimes you'll listen to an album. I don't know if you've ever done this in these worst to best. And then you go and listen to it later on.
You're like, what, was I having a bad day? Or, you know, this song is better than I thought it was. And you kind of tweak some things. So I did that, especially like with this one.
I'm like, was I drunk or, you know, I don't drink that much. But was, you know, what was it that I have a really good day at work and that reflect on this no one. I gave it a three and I hold fast with that. I left it at that number three ranking, but yes, I am on an island and there's some people that have eights in here, but the next one would be five.
Vince from the Daily snob. He gives it, gives it a five and I'm all by myself at number three. So you got seven metal dad's got number seven, hard times. Number seven.
Kaz at six. I already mentioned Vince, uh, metal vibes at seven and question metal at number six. So when all the scores shake out, my three couldn't shake it anywhere near getting up to a, to a higher ranking. It stays at number seven.
And, uh, you know, again, there, there's none of these are bad albums at all. If you, you know, I feel like if you're a fan of death metal or if you're a fan of Bolt Thrower or whatever, you just already know that the whole collection is good. Well, and that's one thing too, that, um, I did go back and revisit is once something, sometimes I will give albums bonus points for iconic or well-known. Like just, you have to play this song every time live.
Otherwise your fans are going to want to burn the building down type of moments. And for me, Bolt Thrower doesn't have those in my mind because I don't know Bolt Thrower well enough to where I could give them those bonus points. I'm sure they probably have some of those songs that are the staples of their live show, but, uh, that, that could, could have skewed some rankings for me. Uh, but in this case, no, it's just every, every song, every album taken and it's just root of, I'm on, I'm almost kind of like a clean slate.
I thought of it as like, I am a clean slate coming into this. Yes, I enjoy both horror, but they were more of a, I'll throw them on is part of a playlist or I'll throw, you know, it's like, Oh, I haven't heard that album in a long time and I'll put it on and it won't be sitting there like absorbing it like it would like a Pink Floyd album or something like that. So that does also reflect on this, this whole ranking system. But also maybe part of the reason that the rankings were very consistent because, you know, everything is just taken at face value and not like, Oh my God, I remember listening to this when Bob and I go smoke a doobie down at the river or something like that.
So I don't, I don't have those memories attached, you know, to any specific songs. But yeah, I'm out there by myself at number three. All right, up next, number six, least number eight, those ones loyal. Confession time.
I think I had simply forgotten just how good this record was upon its release in 2005. I can remember reading somewhere between their hiatus and eventually breakup that the band hadn't rushed to release any more albums because they felt that with those once loyal, they had finally delivered the quote unquote perfect Bolt Thrower record. I don't know about it being perfect, but whatever flaws you wanted to try to point out would be nitpicking at best. With Carl Rillitz returning to vocal duties, this band emerged from the studio with an album that sounded faster, heavier, and more pissed off than any other in recent memory.
Grinded thrash elements returned to the fold. The rhythm section was possibly at its fiercest. The riffs were as meaty as ever, and the production was some of the best they had ever achieved. I almost, almost ranked this album higher than where it currently sits.
And so Candyman says for victory, a possible controversial choice ranking. Yeah, so Candyman has at number six for victory. Yeah, for victory, this low on my list, this album was pretty close to perfection, but I just can't place it any higher because of how amazing the rest of the albums are. I'll be curious to see where Candyman has, which of course we'll find out those ones loyal.
So those ones loyal hit number six. Nate, I have it at number five, a little bit better. I tied with you on this one and have it number five. Nice.
I like this album. And right when it came out, I really liked it. I, you know, I was like, I'll shit a new Bolt Thrower album at this time I was buying a lot of CDs, so I bought the CD and I still have it. And I also have this on vinyl.
I like it. It's kind of like a classic Bolt Thrower album, but modern, I guess. Let's see. Hard Times has it.
Number two. Kaz Wheelan at Astro noise. Number three. Just some guy from album of the year is number six.
Nate, we have a standout as this is the Vince from the Daily Snob has this as his worst. This is number eight. Wow. That's that's surprising.
That's then again, you know, metal dads got number six and again, you're dealing with the albums, but we do have a couple of people who loved it way more than the rest of us. And that is rate your music. Death Uber alley is number one and metal vibes from YouTube at number one. And then Quest for Metal has a number two, same as hard times.
So when all those scores shake out, even with that eighth one there, damn, this comes in at number four. That just goes to show you how strong of an album this is, that there's that many good rankings. Like I thought our rankings were good, but there's like a, there's a number of even better ones all the way up through number one. Yeah.
Two people thought this was the best. I'd really like to hear Vince's argument as to why this is, needs to be a number eight. It's probably something stupid. Like I kept talking shit about these people, but you know, like, Oh, it's just rehashed Bolt Thrower, but everybody who was like a fan of Bolt Thrower is like, Oh yeah, this is like typical Bolt Thrower or classic Bolt Thrower.
That's my opinion. Yeah, you could very well be right. Of course, if you're going to do a ranking of Bolt Thrower, I think you're kind of, you're in on it. You know what you're in for, you know, except for maybe a candyman, you know, because I know he mentioned that some of the stuff his kid hasn't heard before.
I think it's cool that this guy and his kid are doing these rankings together. Hell yeah. They should do a podcast. Seriously.
It'd be fun to check it out. We don't need another podcast. We got to cover Nate. Okay.
At number five, we've got four victory, which is their fifth release. The metal dad said I've read more than one publication's notion that this is the best Bolt Thrower album of the 1990s. While I will respectfully disagree. There's no denying the power and devastating nature of this record expanding on the sludgier elements of their previous releases.
This is an album that alternates between bludgeoning the listener and swarming them with churning riffs. Either way, the heaviness of this record can be downright suffocating. This is another Bolt Thrower record that I ran out to produce a purchase the day it was released in 1994 and instantly became Yeah, I know. Well, she probably just didn't even think I would dare.
That's a good point. And I did dare. You did. Got away with it.
Yeah, fun story. I'll always remember it. That's pretty cool. I also want to say some other stuff about this album before we get through to the other rankings.
There's a lot of people who say The Fourth Crusade is like Doom, like a death Doom album. It's slower and, you know, like just more doomy. I personally think it's really prevalent on their Realm of Chaos album, and I think it really is prevalent on War Master. It's at least as much prevalent as it is on The Fourth Crusade, or even possibly more.
But I don't understand so why so many people then say it's The Fourth Crusade where like this doomy element comes through on their music. But I didn't really pick up on it because, like I said, you know, when I was young, I didn't really know what doom metal was. I didn't know what I wouldn't have known what that was. This was just some heavy ass fucking music, you know.
But now, I remember I was hanging out with this Scott guy in Colorado. I had a really good time hanging out with this guy. He's really into metal, our age. He was from Wisconsin, but he used to come to shows in Minnesota all the time, and he was super into metal and all that stuff.
But he'd come over and we'd get super fucking stoned. Like, we'd take these, you know, edibles. It's always got strong edibles. And then we would just like smoke up these big massive joints, and we would listen to like old death metal and stuff.
And we listened to Realm of Chaos, and I was like, there is some really doomy fucking stuff on this album. Holy shit. You know, it just was like, stood out like a sore thumb, you know. That's just me saying that.
I think that has been an integral part of their sound, at least since Realm of Chaos. And they definitely did a lot of it on War Master. And it's my number one for sure. Well, we're not alone with the number ones.
Kez Whelan also from Astro Noise ranked it as number one. So there's three of us that gave it a one ranking. Hard Times comes in at number four. Just Some Guy at number three.
Vince at number two. Death Uberalis at number three. Metal Vibes at number three. Chris from Metal at number five.
Nate. Ouch. He puts that outside of the top 50%. I don't understand how.
Even Metal Dad has it at number four in Hard Times. But yeah, that's quite the stretch. But when all the scores shake out, this one comes in to the number one slot. Right where it belongs.
All right. He has this one up here pretty high. It's at number three. We've got In Battle There Is No Law, and that's their first release.
Influenced as much, if not more, so by crust and punk bands like Discharge and Crass, they were thrash. Bolt Thrower's crushing 1988 debut is raw, unrelenting affair. There's more grindcore on the record than death metal, and the end result is an album that sounds almost out of place when held up against any of the rest of their catalog. However, it would be a fool's errand to try and diminish the impact or the influence of the record simply because their sound moved away from what was held within.
If you're a fan of grind, crust, and thrash acts that could be considered proto-death metal then, this album should stand as one of your ultimate favorites. I mean, how many are there of those, I wonder. That would specifically fit into that fucking definition. Anyways, the muddy production only aids in giving this record a subterranean feel, and when you compare it to the rest of their discography, it has almost a demo quality to it.
But that's just one of many things that make it utterly endearing in my book. It's raw, it's pissed, and it's an album I can go back over and over again without tiring. Okay, Candyman has this at number three. He has War Master at number three.
And he said, I just can't see why the Metal Dad couldn't rank the album higher. I think this album is actually incredibly underrated, probably because it's sandwiched between two of the greatest death metal albums of all time. But in my opinion, this holds up just as well as the other two albums I have ranked higher. Huh.
Yeah, I wish I would have cut that the way that Candyman was doing this. I could have added him in this as well into the ranking system. Right, right. I was thinking that too, because he's the only one that we're kind of reading a lot of order as to how we're doing the rest of it.
But yeah, it's an interesting comment, I think. Underrated. Most people have this in their top two or three, so it seems precisely related, rated, but... All right.
Well, Nate, he's got it at number three. Where do you have it? In Battle There Is No Law from 1988. You know, I went ahead and put this at number four.
Nate, I put this at number eight. Yeah, this is, I really like his... When he said it's like a demo quality, or it's like a demo type, that's what I get out of it. And it's...
It kind of reminds me of Killing Is My Business. Like, the production's not the greatest, and they're, you know, they're... It's in a rawer fashion. And, but for me, it's more that grind, and that's where, that for me, is a detractor, not so much an added element to it.
So, that ended up falling to my number eight spot. So this is my worst of the whole catalog. I'm not alone, but there's still a lot of other rankings. So we've got a pretty good spread.
Metal Dad is number three, though. You got number four. Hard Times at six. Kez at number five.
Just Some Guy number four. Vince at number six. Death Uberalis at number seven. So almost the worst.
Metal Vibes at number six. And then Quest for Metal agrees with me that this is the worst. So when it's all ranked out, this one sinks three spots. That is surprising he had this in his top, but I guess...
And I had a feeling that, as I was listening to this album, like, I know Nate's gonna have this one possibly way higher than where I have it at. Now, how early do you think you got a hold of this album? No, this one you didn't hear. Yeah, yeah.
I wanted to... I talked about this on a previous episode when I mentioned that I bought the vinyl, which I just bought recently. I, all these years that I've been a fan, I've never listened to this until just recently. And I bought the vinyl and listened to it.
So I really would like to listen to it more closely and definitely will, because I just bought it, so I haven't had a chance to really sit down and listen to it really, you know, intently. You've... Yeah, you still have it at number four, and it's that new of an album for you. So that's...
That's even... Yeah, I'd almost wonder if, do you think this would possibly slide up with more time? I don't know. I'd have to check it out and see how I feel about it over some of the other stuff.
You and the Metal Dad will have to go out for drinks or something. Yeah, right? Yeah. It's, you know, I don't have a problem with, like...
I mean, I love Killing Is My Business. I think that the quality of the sound absolutely is in... rated in line with how the vibe of the whole album. And this album is like...
I like just coming subterranean. Yeah. And it's like, no, now I kind of want to go back to it and kind of think of it in that fashion, where it's like, think of it recorded in the bowels of a castle or something, you know, down in the dungeons. It's like, oh, that might add a little more of the ambiance to it.
It's gritty. But this was my first time hearing the album. It was for ranking it and doing this. I wonder why I don't ever remember seeing this anywhere, you know, like...
Once I discovered, you know, like Realm of Chaos, I started buying their music when I would see it and all that. Do you think that maybe you thought it was like an EP or something? Or maybe a full just, you know, rough tape-recorded demo, although like a black metal style? I don't know.
I mean, honestly, even though, like, you know, we lived in Burnsville, it was pretty far outside of, like, where you were gonna get really deep with some of the stuff. I think, like, the Northern Lights that was downtown, you probably could find some pretty wild stuff, or Cheapo. But where we lived down in Burnsville, I just feel like I got a lot of good stuff, but I wasn't gonna probably find this, you know what I mean? Something like this.
Which was only released on an independent label back then and probably didn't have wide distribution, and they weren't, you know, they weren't on, like, Eric, like they were for Realm of Chaos. Yeah, way different art too, quality-wise. Yeah, absolutely. Coming in at number two, The Fourth Crusade, the fourth album in their catalog.
I definitely have this album ranked higher than most Bolt Thrower fans, but there's solid logic behind it. Released in early 1993 in the U.S., Fourth You rank music as number four, metal vibes from YouTube as a five, and quest for metal at YouTube as a number four, but when it all shakes out, it sinks two spots from metal dads to go to number three. And that's right, so this was the tiebreaker. Between the previous one and this one, there was an exact score, so I went to use all the one rankings.
You know, it's like how many people rank this as the best, and it was exactly the same, so then I had to fall back to number twos. So this one got more or less twos. Yes, less twos than the previous one. So when we get to the full rankings, that's the explanation as to that.
All right, I have to say, Gene, I'm stunting for one thing, but I have some gummies with me that are super fucking strong, okay? They're medical. They're the strongest you can buy in Colorado. I'm going to leave you with one.
You can take a little piece and I'm going to encourage you to go back and listen to those ones you start feeling those edibles. Tell me what you think of this album after I experience it. Sounds good. But it's definitely an improvement on the quality, but for me, it was like they're still evolving that sound that would get better as they went through, or as they get better on the next album and proceed to put out a bunch of albums that I enjoyed even more.
I mean, songs like World Eater, the one I heard on the compilation alone is just, I mean, that's like, when I think of Bolt Thrower, that immediately is the song I think of. And songs like Shred the Sanity are just fucking killer on there. Yeah, I'm so surprised, but I can live with it. It's still in the top three, so I can live with that.
And when I was talking about that spectrum of rankings, the first album, that's like the weakest link out of the whole chain of scores. This one jumps up and becomes more in line with the rest of the catalog for me from this album on. So everything there, there's a little more scapatical across the line from albums two to albums eight. So this one's definitely in that world, and of course you don't rank everything, but just it falls back because it's just not the bolt thrower that I enjoy.
And of course, obviously, I'm alone in that because a lot of everyone's, I'm surprised to see a couple fives in there though. Me too. But I guess there are people who are similar to the sounds that I like. I'm surprised to see number fours, honestly, anything outside of the top three.
Wow. At least that's in the top 50% if you're talking fours, fours and above. But once it gets out outside of the 50% mark, I thought I'd be a little bit more alone on that one. Well, I guess I am because I did rank it the worst at number seven.
But to see that when you gave me those scores, I was like, oh wow, there's some fours and fives in here. That's interesting. And when I was telling you that I was going to send you these lists, I mentioned that there is some interesting variations in the rankings. And this is a good example.
That makes it more fun, as we've said before. Yeah. If everybody agrees with the same thing, there's nothing to like. Nothing to talk about, I guess.
We're like, oh yeah, we all agree this is number one. Yeah. Everybody around the world says these rank this way. Yeah.
That's part of the fun of the discussion. But it's also the, it's like our taste. You know, some people like chocolate pudding, some people like, you know, vanilla pudding. And it's a, you know, you can't account for your tastes.
If we could all enjoy Metallica's Lulu with, what's his name that they recorded that with and, you know, the world would be a different place. Right. There would be no war. You're blaming Lulu for war?
Totally. That was the fucking. The Lou Reed, that's what I was thinking of. Yeah, that was the butterfly effect.
That's where it started. Holy shit. You're on to something. The reverberations of that album has completely destroyed our fucking society.
Yeah, you're right. The world has not been the same since Lulu came out. Holy shit. Are we living in assimilation?
What in the fuck is going on? Holy shit. I think you nailed it. Wow.
If we could go back in time and stop Lulu from being made, can you imagine the utopia we would live in? Right. I mean, it would be peace for all men. Wow.
Holy shit, Nate. Chicken wings for all. If anybody in the future is listening to this, please go back in time if there are time machines and fix this. Oh man.
Well, Nate, here's how everything ranks after we sort all the scores and everything, all that good stuff. So, Honor, Valor, Pride comes in at number eight, and that's where it started. It will stay there. Mercenary at number seven is where the metal dad has it, and that's also where it stays.
Funny thing is, I'm looking at the scores. I ranked those some of the highest out of all the scores that are in the list of those two albums. Hot damn. All right.
And then coming in at number six is In Battle There Is No Law. It started at number three. It drops three spots. We had a couple eights in there, though, too.
But yeah, a lot of four fives and sixes, or a lot of sixes and sevens. Not one seven, but yeah. So, it shakes out at number six, dropping three spots from where metal dad had it. For Victory comes in next at number five, and it stays there.
That's where metal dad has it, and that's where it will stay. For those Once Loyal, metal dad gave it a number six. Everybody else said, nope, it's better than that. It climbs two spots to come in at number four.
Realm of Chaos, Slaves to Darkness from 1989. This was metal dad and his son's candy man's ranking of number one. But when all the scores shake out, it drops two spots to number three. A very respectable number three based on all the rankings that weren't mine, because I had that one at number seven.
Of course, Nate, The Fourth Crusade comes in at number two, and that's where metal dad had it. A lot of people did like this album, except for the hard times. That was the worst score of number five. And War Master will round out the top spot.
Started at number four with metal dad, but there was enough number ones and number twos and threes to get this into the top spot. The hardest ranked one was number five for Quest for Metal. But just those number twos gave it enough of a bump to swap it or to put it in that top ranked spot for our list. So Nate, there you go.
Of all the death metal bands I've listened to in my lifetime, this is one that has continued to be, I've continued to be a fan of. As my taste have evolved over the years, and like now listen to reggae and stuff like that and hip hop and stuff. So death metal is, I still love it. I'm just a little more selective as to which death metal I listen to.
And Bolt Thrower is definitely one of those bands that I continue to get into, you know, continue to like. Is it like the Nookie Blinky, the comfort zone of your listening enjoyment for death metal bands? That's kind of how I, I don't know if I'm saying it the way I mean to, but it's like that old friend that you can rely on kind of a thing. Where you're gonna put on and you know what you're gonna get, and it's always decent.
Yeah, it's always gonna be good. You know, if you look at black metal versus death metal, you know, okay, so Bolt Thrower has a lot of like this doomy type stuff going on with their music. I would say Obituary does as well. There's a lot of like really slow, like chuggy type riff things, you know, riffs going on there from the fucking swamps of Florida, you know.
But, you know, and it's not just about being able to understand vocals because I do love Obituary. And they've even said that some of it's just him making noises, you know what I mean? He's not even actually saying words. It's just using his voice as an instrument.
And I just, I absolutely love that band. I still do. But there's other bands like, you know, I keep, I hate to keep pointing out Cannibal Corpse, but Cannibal Corpse is one where at the time I liked them, but in general, I don't care for them anymore. I used to like Six Feet Under in general.
When I listen to them now, I'm just like, this is just, this isn't that good. There's a number of those bands, but like black metal, there isn't a lot of like the doom elements in any black metal. It's quite a bit more on the fast side, in my opinion. I'd say listen and see if you can check out some of the independent stuff that's out there nowadays because I think you're getting a little bit more variety.
And that's why I bring a lot of the independent bands that we, that send in black metal, because it's not something that's going to necessarily make my top 40 picks, but I will definitely bring it to the radio show and play on the radio show. And I guess I'm interesting commentary from the black metal fans on the discord group. And just because there's some different stuff and I know some people don't like it. You know, some Thank you for listening to Disciples of the Watch.
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