A Chat with Congresswoman Haley Stevens

Late last year, and early into this year, I began sitting down with a number of congressional candidates and candidates for governor in battleground races across the country. I wanted to talk to them about their campaigns, but also—because of our focus here at The Forum— how they saw policy issues related to kids and families.And especially schools—pre-K through higher education. So this week I’m particularly happy to sit down with Congresswoman Haley Stevens from Michigan’s 11th District, who serves on the House Education and Workforce Committee. Haley was first elected to the U.S. House in 2018 at the age of 35, and won tough re-election races in 2020, 2022, and 2024. Before running for office, she had a variety of roles in policy and political staff positions—most notably serving as Chief-of-Staff to Steven Rattner for President Obama’s Auto Rescue Task Force.Haley Stevens is now running against Abdul El-Sayed and State Senator Mallory McMorrow in a hotly contested primary for the Democratic nomination for the U.S. Senate. She’s been endorsed by a number of unions, several fellow members of Congress, former Governor Jennifer Granholm, and the state’s legendary former Senator Debbie Stabenow.We were supposed to talk last week, but we had to reschedule for the House Education Committee meeting that featured U.S. Education Secretary Linda McMahon. During the hearing, Haley Stevens grilled McMahon on a variety of issues, especially the growing teacher shortage in Michigan and beyond.Here’s Our ConversationJOSH: I’m happy today to have Congresswoman Haley Stevens from Michigan’s 11th District on talk about a couple of different things here. Congresswoman Stevens is running for the Senate right now, but also serves in the House Education Committee. So we’re going to talk a little bit about all of that. What’s going on, Haley Stevens?HALEY: Hey, it’s great to be talking with you. I’m glad to be doing this. Obviously, it’s a pretty serious time out there right now. It’s a time of uncertainty and a lot of that and all of it, frankly, is coming down from Donald Trump’s chaos and abuses of power.JOSH: Before we get to your current campaign, tell us a bit about your background. I’m interested in what you did both before getting to Congress and even before that--what was your first job out of college?HALEY: Well, look, I was born here in Michigan—in Southeast Michigan. My dad was actually born in the city of Detroit, grew up in Detroit till he was about 10 years old, and moved to Warren.My parents, when I was growing up, had a small business. It was a landscaping business. My dad was also a public school teacher, though, too. So I just grew up around really hardworking parents who wanted to give us the best, you know, late- 20th century life that they could.I grew up just seeing all that and that kind of motivated my approach to public service and how I started getting involved in, you know, government and political campaigns. It was just about working really hard. But you did ask about one of my first jobs, I think it was out of college, but I had a really, really good first job when I was in high school. I worked at Blockbuster Video. I didn’t last too long. It was like a late summer job, but I went through their training program. That Blockbuster video is long gone now.JOSH: I actually really wanted a job at Blockbuster. They wouldn’t have me. I applied all over to, like, 7 different Blockbusters, so you’re one up on me there.HALEY: I bet if I looked hard enough, I could probably find one of their old pieces of paraphernalia or something like the card or whatnot for you. But look, I would say this. I graduated college right before the Great Recession hit. And when the Great Recession hit, that obviously whacked the place that we call home here in Michigan hardest. So the question for me became, how can I help Michigan? You know, I thought about going and working at a car dealership, but I had also been working on the Obama campaign, and was kind of right there as he was getting ready to transition into office, and I heard that they were going to do something with the auto industry. And so I put up my hand, you know, just kind of right place, right time. Steve Ratner was going to be tapped for that, and Steve needed a chief of staff. I’m pretty sure my thick Midwestern accent just convinced him that I would do a great job. And I was the person from Michigan on that team, you know, taking those phone calls, getting everything set up, making the wheels turn. And it was unbelievable. And obviously we made it through that tough time. But man, oh man, was that an example of good federal policy making, meeting the moment for who we are as Michiganders.Now is not the time in Michigan to be comfortable and to have comfortable leadership. Now is the time to step up and to fight back.—Rep. Haley StevensJOSH: You’re leaving a House seat you’d be heavily favored to win in, to run for the Senate. Walk me through that process: tell me one reason why you might have stayed in that House seat, and one reason that really determined that you’d make the Senate run.HALEY: I will tell you this because I have a feeling that some of your viewers are younger people who are looking forward to a life of making big decisions. One piece of advice I have on that front is when you make a decision, don’t look back. Don’t talk about the alternative, because it doesn’t exist anymore, and you’re just spinning your wheels. And so I’ll say this to what you’re asking me, which is a really great question. I love the work I do for Michigan.I am so grateful and honored and humbled to be in my fourth term in the United States House of Representatives, you know, fighting for us, being recognized as the most effective Democrat for Michigan in the Congress. The most effective Democrat for science and tech issues, actually, alongside Gary Peters in the Senate.Not clear what the California folks are doing, but, you know, Gary and I are writing bills and getting them passed. So, you know, that works. When I ran for Congress, I flipped a seat. And very similarly to when I worked on the auto rescue, I saw Michigan needing something and I wanted to run at it. So I held Michigan’s 11th district in 2018 and 2020. The district now is redrawn. It is a different district. And you’re right, it tends to be, you know, more of what they call a safer seat for Democrats. And I love the work that I do on the Science committee and on the Education Committee, which I know we’re going to talk about. But last year, when a fully paralyzed veteran reached out to me through a mutual friend asking if he was still going to get his benefit check because he saw Elon Musk prancing around a stage with a chainsaw—that really broke me and it just jarred me. And I thought, you know, now is not the time in Michigan to be comfortable and to have comfortable leadership. Now is the time to step up and to fight back.And I can tell you that I am doing more today, you know, serving in the House of Representatives, running for a statewide role to serve Michigan in the United States Senate and to offer ideas and solutions to some of these challenges that we are facing. Mike Rogers [the GOP nominee], who, you know, I know you’re familiar with him, but he’s made it really clear what his priorities are. And I… I’m writing a love letter to Michigan. Mike Rogers, he wants to rubber stamp Donald Trump. I’m out here saying I want to work to lower your costs. Mike Rogers is saying, hey, let’s keep the Gordie Howe Bridge permanently closed, like, and go along with these erratic tariffs at every turn. I mean, give me a break. This isn’t working for Michigan and our manufacturing sector is paying a price.And as someone who is in a big race that’s still going to be playing out, and there’s a lot of different polls, you know, given the day of the week that it is, but every single poll shows the same thing. Which is that I am in the best and strongest position to go and beat Mike Rogers and continue to stand up for Michigan at the law-making table. To continue to make sure that we have, you know, a good, strong auto industry with good federal policies around it, that we have an enshrined 21st century labor movement, and that consumers are getting relief around these gas prices, these utility bills, the health care costs, and of course the cost of food.We don’t even know who’s running for Senate Democratic leadership right now. And I’m not even in the Senate right now. And my deal is just, let’s get there, let’s see who’s going to be running, and my goodness, let me just do the work for Michigan, right?—Rep. Haley StevensJOSH: I've had quite a number of different candidates on. Different Members of Congress, a couple of your colleagues. I'll be honest—and I'm not trying to sub-tweet anyone or troll anyone—but I am losing track of all of the litmus tests Democratic candidates are getting to run for office these days. Who you would vote for, for caucus leader. Which campaign funds are “okay” to accept, which aren’t, and which pledges you’re supposed to take or make. Let me just ask you a broad question: How do you think about all of these problems and questions when it comes to campaign donations, when it comes to potential leadership votes down the line? Just in terms of your own values and what you want to watch out for when you make decisions?HALEY: So look, next year we’re going to reorganize government. We’re going to see, you know, elections happen and a new legislative session of Congress. And there is a lot of speculation about Democratic leadershipBut the thing is, is we don’t even know who’s running right now. And I’m not even in that role right now. And I’ve had a little bit of experience with this, because when I came into the house, you know, there was a lot of question and pushback around the speaker, and who was going to be speaker.And Nancy Pelosi ended up running unopposed, right? And I don’t know if something like that’s going to be the case in the Senate. I really don’t. And my deal is just, let’s get there, let’s see who’s going to be running, and my goodness, let me just do the work for Michigan, right?I am a lawmaker’s lawmaker. I love to write bills and move them to the floor and see them get passed. I am going to continue to, you know, maintain my good relationships in the House of Representatives because we need those relationships to pass the bills, right? And then I think in terms of campaign finance reform. Yeah, look, we’re at a boiling point. We haven’t had reform in decades now, and we’re paying the price for it. I have proudly co-sponsored and voted for comprehensive campaign finance reform every single chance I have gotten. I’m in my fourth year in the minority party, and I will tell you, Republicans aren’t lifting a finger on this front. They do not care about dark money or transparency or, you know, just this, you know, spend a bunch of money on Meta to raise a bunch of money.Look. Mike Rogers will block campaign finance reform in the United States Senate.I saw that when I was in the house. We voted for it in the House, and, you know, the Donald Trump, Mitch McConnell crew didn’t lift a finger on this front. We’ve got to reform, and so this is why, you know, I’ve got an A grading from the leading campaign finance reform organization End Citizens United.I fundraise very similarly to how Gary Peters and Debbie Stabenow have. I’m really proud to have Debbie Stabenow’s endorsement in this race, which came a couple of weeks ago and has been really quite transformativeAnd I remain very deeply committed to my non-millionaire status, you know, in this race right now and getting campaign finance reform done and, you know, being of the people for the people and by the people.After decades and decades and decades of not funding special education at the federal level, we’re leaving school districts and families holding the bag.—Rep. Haley Stevens JOSH: I have many followers from the education community here. You serve on the House Education committee right now--you grilled Linda McMahon last week. What’s one big issue that’s come up in your time on that committee that you’d like folks to know about--that maybe we wouldn’t know or know less about had I not asked?HALEY: One issue that I’ve really taken up and have led around has been the full funding for special education. There’s a member of Congress who has the pen on the bill. His name is Jared Huffman. He came into Congress before me, so I co-sponsor Jared’s bill to fully fund special educationBut what I’ve also done has been very deep back here in Michigan, working with Bob McCann, who runs the K-12 Alliance. You know, working very closely with our heads of county school-wide systems, you know, our head of Oakland schools, Wayne RESA [the intermediate school district surrounding Detroit]. I know my superintendents very well. I got to know them really well during COVID, of course, school principals and educators and alike. And the reason why I’ve really taken up the statewide mantle to achieve the full funding for this unfunded mandate is it is just squeezing us dry. It has been 50 years of, you know, the requirement, thankfully, to say that every child, no matter the ability, can go and get a public education. In my district, we’ve got Wing Lake, which is a special needs school. I know some of the families who send their children there with very, very severe medically complex challenges. And thank goodness they’ve got that school and that they have Medicaid, even though Donald Trump has slashed it, because again, you know, if your kid doesn’t have full walking abilities or language abilities, you’re relying on that good public school. You’re relying on that Medicaid too.[ed. note: a portion of Medicaid can be used to fund children’s health expenses specifically at schools. Roughly $8 billion in Medicaid funding went to kids for school-based services last year, around $200 million to Michigan]But what has happened is it’s been kind of a robbing Peter to pay Paul. And in talking with some of the families, I know that, you know, they have to really, you know, look within the budget systems, make sure that their schools, you know, are getting, you know, the full funding, even students with, you know, some reading comprehension challenges, you know, IEPs and having the right educators around that. And after decades and decades and decades of not funding special education at the federal level, we’re leaving school districts and families holding the bag. This isn’t just one issue for me. It is my North Star. You know, Josh, 2020 hit, okay, the beginning of 2020. I said, this is going to be the year. I’m going to beat the drum on special ed. I had literally in January, a big community event. It was kind of like a town hall type of forum. I had community leaders, special education leaders, families talking. I was going to make that whole year for this push to do special ed. Obviously, then Covid hit. But I think when you, you know, mirror good policymaking with the political, which sometimes ties into how we campaign or how we communicate with voters: I’m out here talking about this. I have made this a part of what I do because I really believe in these children and their parents, and we owe it to them. We really do. So I’ll stop because I could go on and on, and there’s other things I’ve worked on, particularly around the Addressing Teacher Shortages Act, you know, the very frustrating reality that they have completely gutted the Department of Education. We don’t have an Office of Civil Rights—and on and on. I mentioned my dad briefly. He taught public school in Detroit. For the last 15 years of his career, he was first grade. He was at Bethune Elementary School in Pontiac the day Martin Luther King Jr. was murdered. He was a student teacher. He was part of the Jonathan Kozol desegregation, equal access movement on education. So this has just been a policy issue that I just all around want to take up and continue to lead on education in the United States Senate. And you better believe me when I say I’m going to do that, I will.We need good, effective partnership to meet goals and to meet national priorities.—Rep. Haley Stevens.JOSH: Last week I had Amanda Litman on from Run for Something. We talked a little bit about federal education and all this stuff. You mentioned the Department of Ed. And one of the things Amanda said was, you know, Trump wrecked this thing, and I think those of us who’ve been in this space for a long time know that there’s a major change coming in sort of the federal approach to education moving forward. How do you think about this as somebody actually in Congress right now thinking about the future? How do you see the federal role changing when it comes to kids and families?HALEY: We’ve got to fully support families with an equitable and fair tax code. You know, we’ve got to look at who’s paying what marginal tax rate and why the middle class family is oftentimes paying more than the big corporations or the billionaires. We’ve got to stand up for the earned benefits and guarantee those earned benefits for Social Security and Medicare. And here in Michigan, and with regard to our Department of Education: We need partnership. You know, a lot of times Republicans shape this as bureaucracy or the need for limited government. We need good, effective partnership to meet goals and to meet national priorities.JOSH: I want to ask one final question about being a person. You put out a tweet a little while ago about all the attacks that have come your way. Being a person is hard even when you’re not in the public eye and I want to know how you take care of yourself, what’s one thing you do just for you that keeps you grounded and gets you up in the morning.HALEY: Well, this morning I got up and went for a nice jog. Time outside is really a blessing, even in those cold winter days, you know, just taking a couple round walks around the block, you know, stopping to smell the flowers, as they say.But also, you know, I mentioned my parents had the landscape business. So we always take time to send each other pictures of cool trees that we see, which I know sounds kind of dorky, but it’s just really, you know, being in awe of Mother Nature. And we all know that the science is right around that, you know, when you’re in Mother Nature, your blood pressure is lowering, your stress levels are going down, and that’s an easy reset for anybody, right? Because, gosh, you know, whether you’re single or raising a family, you know, you’re working full time, finishing off your degree or your apprenticeship training program: we all need just to find the pleasure in little things. The easy and accessible things like going outside, getting a walk in or a jog. And that’s certainly what I do.Haley Stevens is the Congresswoman from the 11th District in Michigan running for the US Senate in a really crucial race. Congresswoman, thanks so much for giving me a little bit of time today. Thanks for putting your hand up. We’ll talk soon, okay?HALEY: Yes, we will. Thank you. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit joshcowen.substack.com/subscribe