Africans Rise Up Against Illegal Immigration (Fatigue Maxing)

In this Based Camp episode, Simone and Malcolm Collins dive into the rising anti-immigration protests in South Africa — led by Black South Africans against illegal immigrants from other African nations. From “March and March” and Operation Dudula marches to demands for mass deportations, shop closures, and prioritizing citizens for jobs, this movement echoes familiar themes of economic frustration, crime concerns, and strained resources.Is this “Black MAGA”? Why is the global media quick to label it xenophobia while downplaying similar grievances elsewhere? The Collins discuss unemployment realities (32-33%), government responses, comparisons to US/UK/Canada immigration levels, ethnic economic niches, and why South Africans feel under attack from within Africa.Expect unfiltered analysis, humor, genetic tangents, and real talk on immigration policy that transcends race. What happens when citizens fight back against illegal immigration in their own country?Show NotesWhen I think of “anti-immigration protests” the image that pops into my head is of white people being angry about non-white people entering their neighborhoods and taking their jobsThis happens so much that subconsciously even I sometimes find myself assuming this is a “white people clutching their pearls about their land being taken” thing, when it’s notAnd recent anti-immigrant protests in South Africa are proof of this.South Africa has seen a wave of anti-immigration (often described as anti-illegal immigration or xenophobic) protests and related violence in April–May 2026, concentrated in major cities like Pretoria, Johannesburg, Durban, and spreading to others.Key Details* According to the BBC at least, the main driver is the citizen-led group March and March, which advocates for stricter immigration enforcement, border control, mass deportations of undocumented migrants, and prioritizing South Africans for jobs, housing, and services.* Protests have drawn hundreds to thousands of participants, with marches to government buildings (e.g., Union Buildings in Pretoria), shop closures by foreign-owned businesses out of fear, and some “clean-up” campaigns.* Involvement or alignment from Operation Dudula (a vigilante-style anti-immigrant movement meaning “push out” in Zulu), ActionSA, Patriotic Alliance, and other local forums (e.g., Thokoza Abahambe Forum).* Some political figures, like Floyd Shivambu of the Africa Mayibuye Movement, have endorsed the concerns as legitimate ahead of local elections.* As CNN reports (here’s an Instagram link), protesters accuse undocumented migrants (primarily from other African countries, and some Asians) of taking jobs, engaging in crime/drug dealing, overloading public services (health, housing, schools), and straining the economy.* Some issued a June 30, 2026, ultimatum for undocumented foreigners to leave, with warnings of consequences.* Chants and actions target “illegal foreigners.”* THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME RHETORIC YOU HEAR IN THE USASo this is NOT about white people at all, right?* Yeah, the protesters are primarily South African citizens, often from poorer communities, unemployed youth, township residents, and those feeling economic pressure.* See some footage from Sky News posted on reddit here* Note: South Africa’s official unemployment rate is very high (~32-33%), with widespread frustration over service delivery failures after decades of ANC governance, corruption allegations, and inequality.* They’re largely mad about immigrants from other African countries* Nigerians, Zimbabweans, Congolese, Ethiopians, GhanaiansIs immigration uniquely high in South Africa vis a vis other countries? Or other African countries? Is it higher than normal?South Africa’s immigration levels are not uniquely high by global standards, but they stand out significantly within Africa and have risen notably in recent decades.Key Metrics (UN DESA 2024 Data)* South Africa: ~2.63 million international migrants, representing ~4.1% of its total population (up from ~3.2% in 1990 and ~4.3% in 2010). (UN)* Global average: ~3.7% of world population (~304 million migrants). (Migration Policy Intitute)* Africa overall: ~1.9% (29.2 million migrants across the continent). (UN)A few other African countries have higher proportions due to specific factors (e.g., economic pull or refugee hosting):* Côte d’Ivoire: ~9.0% (around 2.88 million migrants) — historically one of the highest in sub-Saharan Africa due to cocoa plantations and labor migration from neighbors like Burkina Faso.* Others like Djibouti (~10.8%), Gabon, or some refugee-hosting nations (e.g., Uganda, Sudan) can show elevated shares in certain years.* Most African countries are well below 2–3%.Many high-income countries have 10–30%+ migrant shares (e.g., Gulf states 30–50%+, Australia ~30%, Europe/North America 12–16% averages). South Africa’s level is comparable to some other emerging economies but amplified by regional disparitiesHow does South Africa’s rates of immigration and illegal immigration compare to those in the USA, Canada, Australia, and the UK?Basically, South Africa’s total migrant share is not high compared to these countries, but its challenges with undocumented migration (relative to enforcement capacity and economic conditions) appear more acute proportionally and socially. High-unemployment townships amplify perceptions of strain from irregular inflows, unlike the more managed systems in the Anglosphere nations.Statements from ProtestersFrom March and March Leaders and ProtestersJacinta Ngobese-Zuma (Founder and National Leader of March and March):“They are not victims... If you walk down the roads, you will find that they take buildings. There are drugs. There is prostitution. There are cartels. There are mafias. So, everything in this country is a fertile ground for criminals to thrive.”“We are under attack from across Africa… The only thing that they do is to label us as xenophobic. There is nothing xenophobic about wanting law and order in your country.”On government inaction: “We’re frustrated, tired, and feel ignored by our own government... Our demand is that our government is moving at a snail’s pace in addressing the issue of illegal immigrants.”Sanele Nkambule (Treasurer, March and March):“Many spaza shops and informal businesses in the townships are owned or run by foreign nationals without proper trading rights... [placing] an unfair burden on citizens who pay taxes.” He called for all such shops to be run by South Africans, audits of immigrants, review of study visas, and army deployment in high-immigrant areas.Anonymous demonstrator (to BBC during Pretoria march):“We are grateful that we now have groups like this that have come up to aid the voice of what we have always been preaching about — illegal immigration is a big problem to our society.” (Referring to the “influx of illegal immigrants” that politicians ignore.)From Associated GroupsThami Madondo (National Executive Committee member, linked to Operation Dudula/March and March-aligned actions):“The immigration laws of the country have never been enforced by the law enforcement agencies... And that’s why we’re sitting with all of these crises. … We are stressing the fact that illegal foreigners in the country must leave.” He criticized “Ubuntu” narratives in this context: “That narrative of Ubuntu, unfortunately, is the nonsense that has put us where we are today. Ubuntu doesn’t mean that you must come into the country illegally.”Tshepo Totwe (Secretary, Abahambe Movement, collaborating with March and March):“We are here to partake and collaborate with March on March on a progressive march that is involving different organisations and also national forums to collaborate and fight against the foreign nationals that are taking advantage of our economic freedom in our country... That is the key purpose for us to indicate and send a message that we are being labelled as xenophobic, and that is not the point.”What are these protests like?* Human Rights Watch (citing “xenophobic attacks”) reports that some protests have escalated into vigilante actions, assaults on migrants (including beatings, shop attacks, and reported deaths—e.g., Nigerians, Ethiopians), and intimidation.* Human Rights Watch and others have noted insufficient police response in places. Foreign governments (Ghana, Nigeria, Kenya, etc.) have issued warnings to their citizens and, in Ghana’s case, offered evacuation flights (with low uptake in one reported instance).What is the South African government doing in response?* As they communicate on the official website of the presidency of the republic of south africa: President Cyril Ramaphosa’s administration and officials (e.g., Deputy President Paul Mashatile) condemn violence and vigilante “lawlessness” while acknowledging legitimate grievances over illegal immigration.* They’ve highlighted deportations (over 100k in recent years) and pledged legal enforcement.* They deny widespread xenophobia, calling incidents isolated or criminalWhat is the larger media narrative about these protests?* When you distill all the coverage together with AI summaries, you’ll see these protests being framed as a recurring pattern of xenophobic tensions in South Africa during economic hardship, seen in prior years (e.g., 2008, 2019, Operation Dudula activities).* High inflows of migrants/refugees amid regional instability, porous borders, and competition for scarce opportunities fuel it.Episode TranscriptSimone Collins: [00:00:00] We are here to fight against the foreign nationals that are taking advantage of our economic freedom in our country. We are being labeled as xenophobic, and that is not the point.” So what are the protests like? AndMalcolm Collins: again, you’re sure, you’re sure this guy was Black, so we’re not gonna get the channel taken down?Simone Collins: I’m, yeah, I’ve, yes.Malcolm Collins: Okay, good.Speaker 2: We are sick and tired with the Somalians, with the Pakistanis, with all, with Nigerians and all illegal immigrants in this country These protesters say they’re declaring war on illegal immigration and want to take their complaints right to the doorsteps of embassies across Pretoria.Speaker 5: The protesters here, um,Speaker 4: plan to raise issue with the Somali Government about activities of their citizens in the country. The group, who are wearing Zulu traditional dress, initially sat down before the embassy gates saying they want to show respect.They demanded answers on a range of issues from crime to illegal immigration, but things got tense when they were unhappy with the answers from [00:01:00] the Somali representatives.Speaker 6: The youth is caught upSpeaker 4: by this country and is taken The group say they’ve given undocumented immigrants until the end of June to leave South Africa.Speaker 7: There’s eight million young people that are not working in South Africa. It is not xenophobia. It is there’s eight million unemployed people,would you like to know more?Simone Collins: Hello, Malcolm. I’m excited to be speaking with you today, because when I think of anti-immigration protests, the image that pops into my head is, is white people being angry about non-white people entering their neighborhoods. Even though that’s like not... I know- True ... that that’s not true. But thank God one of our Base Camp listeners was like, “Hey, you should, you should talk about the anti-immigration protests in South Africa.”Malcolm Collins: It is Black fatigue on an African scale-Simone Collins: Yes ...Malcolm Collins: of Black South Africans being mad about Black immigrants to South Africa. I-Simone Collins: This has nothing to do with us. NothingMalcolm Collins: to do with- I, I found some video footage of it that I’m gonna play- Yeah ... right [00:02:00] here.Speaker 3: Attacker!Malcolm Collins: Oh, sorry, that was the wrong footage.That’s gonna get us in a lot of trouble.Simone Collins: Damn it, Malcolm, why do you... Ah. You-Malcolm Collins: Come on, I wanna put the caveman fighting footage ...Simone Collins: you continue to speed run our... Do you not want to be on YouTu- what is... Anyway. Let... I will bring you back to speed.Malcolm Collins: That clip, by the way, that clip is like a meme clip. It’s from a 1980s representation of Homo erectus fighting Neanderthals.And white populations, by the way, so you can’t say I’m racist. These are historically white populations. in fact, Africans they’re the only people on Earth that don’t have any Neanderthal DNA, so technically I’m making fun of my own- Oh, really? ... ancestors here, not theirs.Simone Collins: That, no, that makes you...Right, right, right. ‘Cause Neander- right. Oh my God. Right, right, of course. I-Malcolm Collins: Yep. [00:03:00] They have D- Denisovan DNA though, but that’s, you know, neither here nor there.Simone Collins: We did a separate episode on that, that stuff. Well, probably multiple. Let, let’s just- It’sMalcolm Collins: one of our spiciest episodes where we go over things that I was unaware of, that there are certain populations in Africa today like the God, I can’t pronounce,The Kosan peopleMalcolm Collins: that are more distant genetically if you’re looking not time-wise.Like, their breakoff wasn’t earlier, but if you look at, like, I think it’s SNP count or something- Mm-hmm ... they are more distant from Europeans than Europeans are from Neanderthals. And a lot of people just- Well,Simone Collins: that’s how it is in Africa in general, right? Like, there are different genetic strains or, like, heri- what is it?Like, sort of n- heritage backgrounds that are- So in a way- ... more genetically different ...Malcolm Collins: they are more justified to be mad about immigration, right? Because- Yeah,Simone Collins: absolutely. Yeah. No, no, no. Yeah. The, the, they’re, they’re more different. They’re more different than, like,Malcolm Collins: Than Europeans are from each other, so yeah.Yes,Simone Collins: yes. Yeah, yeah. Or, like, people from Latin America versus, like, Irish people. Yeah, like, no, way more different. But anyway, South Africa has seen a wave [00:04:00] of anti-immigration some- some people are describing it as anti-illegal immigration or, or xenophobic, if you’re asking Human Rights Watch, protests and rioting violence.I loveMalcolm Collins: that Human Rights Watch didn’t care when they were killing white farmers, but the moment they start protesting Black immigrants from even- horror countries, they freak out.Simone Collins: No, but actually, but actually, and we’re gonna ButMalcolm Collins: actually.Speaker: I want to take time to point out here that this isn’t a racialist thing. The groups that hate us hate us just because we are disproportionately productive and technologically productive when contrasted with other groups, and that’s why they hate the South African blacks. That’s why they want to see them replaced within their own country, and they’re fighting back, which we can learn something fromSimone Collins: Yeah. The, these started breaking out in April. They’re, they’re continuing this month.They’re concentrated in major cities like Pretoria and Johannesburg, Durban, and they’re starting to spread to others. Like, this is kind of the, the momentum is building, and so it’s worth it for us to talk about this. [00:05:00] So according to the BBC at least, the main driver is this citizen-led group called March and March, which is an interesting choice of words. March and March advocates for stricter immigration enforcement. They want border control, they want mass deportations of undocumented migrants, and they want prioritizing South Africans for jobs, housing, and services.Doesn’t it sound so familiar? Doesn’t that sound a little MAGA?Malcolm Collins: Yeah, it does sound a little MAGA.Simone Collins: It’s like, oh my God. We get-Malcolm Collins: Are we gonna call this Black MAGA?Simone Collins: Black, Black MAGA.Malcolm Collins: DarkSimone Collins: MAGA.Malcolm Collins: I don’t know the, the... OkaySimone Collins: I like it. I, I like it. I like it. So the protests, they’ve, they’ve drawn... They’re big. We’re talking hundreds to thousands of participants, and they’re doing things like marching on government buildings, like the union buildings of Pretoria.They’re, they’re enforcing shop closures by foreign-owned businesses. They are... They’re, they’re doing some cleanup campaigns. There’s some also additional groups that are getting involved. One is called Operation Dudula, [00:06:00] that they’re a vigilante-style an- anti-immigration movement, meaning push out in Zulu.We don’t see something going this far in America. You know, like, if this was happening in the United States, they’d be like, just... I, I just know the, the white racist allegations would just go, like, off the charts, but, you know, whatever. Also, there’s another one called Action SA, Patriotic Alliance and there are other local forums like the Phekoza Abahambe Forum.And then there are additional political figures that are really endorsing concerns, just like you’ll see in any... I mean, obviously in the United States, in the UK, there are people who stand out as being like, “Immigration is a problem,” and then they kind of run on that platform. As CNN reports, and in, in my show notes on Patreon and Substack, I’m linking to all my sources.There’s a, there’s a, an Instagram link you can see to, like, the news reports that I’m linking to. Protesters are accusing the undocumented migrants, primarily from other African countries and some Asians, but mostly other African countries, of taking jobs, [00:07:00] engaging in crime and drug dealing, overloading public services like health and housing and schools, and straining the economy.Some issued a, a June 30th- Mm ... 2026 ultimatum for undocumented foreigners to leave, saying, like, “If you don’t leave by the end of June, we’re coming for you.” Which we also haven’t done. I- imagine if, like, a, a, like middle, middle of America Americans were doing this, you know? We’d, we’d be defenestrated.Like, they already are being defenestrated just from us wanting to enforce our own laws. Can weMalcolm Collins: import some Black South Africans to handle- Can we- ... our immigrants?Simone Collins: Actually, yeah. Let’s- Maybe ... So, so Trump needs to expand the whole white South African, like, refugee visa to include these, these xenophobic, IMalcolm Collins: would take South African immigrants over Somalians I- Like, let’s, let’s pick ‘em on the Somalians, right?Like, they understand-Simone Collins: Right, they, I mean, they, yeah. God. I just, I can’t. It’s just, it’s so- I won’t,Malcolm Collins: Iliana Ruhr wouldn’t be able to do sh- you, you have a, a mob go to her house.Simone Collins: I know. The, the Somalians [00:08:00] wish, wish that, that only like, you know, JD Vance was coming after them, right? Like, e- they are lucky.They are lucky. And, and I just, I, I wanted in, in my research for this to be super, super sure that this like has nothing to do with white people in South Africa. And yeah, the protesters are primarily not only South African citizens, but from the poorer communities, the unemployed youth, township residents specifically, and trust me, there are not white people in the townships.We’ve been. And, and people in general feeling economic pressure. And I have footage from Sky News that I found posted on Reddit. It’s, it should be reiterated-Malcolm Collins: So you visually, you did a skin check just to make sure.Simone Collins: Yeah Yeah. It, yes, I did.Okay, you’re good to goSimone Collins: SouthMalcolm Collins: Afric- It’s too okay to talk about, because if it was right, people, we’d have this video taken down in two seconds.Simone Collins: Right. We would be in really... No, genuinely, like, I can’t. So, so I checked.Malcolm Collins: [00:09:00] Any other day, we’d be arrested. We’d have the thought police at our door right now, right?Simone Collins: No, and, and r- remember, HRC is still very mad at these people in the townships. People facing a country with 32 to 33% unemployment, okay? They, they’re gen- like, you know, we think we have it bad that, that illegal immigration is putting some pressure on job availability, plus, you know, AI and all this stuff.But 32 to 33% percent and their social services are not good like ours. So of course they’re mad. And they’re not, they’re, they’re not mad about Indians coming in. They’re not mad about Europeans coming in. They’re mad about Nigerians, Zimbabweans, Congolese, Ethiopians, Ghanaians. That’s who they’re primarily mad about.And that those countries keep issuing warnings to South Africa. They’re like, “You are being m- mean to our people. You must stop.” Like, they’re, they’re actually, like, submitting formal complaints and stuff, and I’m like, I don’t... It’s like stop sucking so much then. Like, they’re leaving your country for a [00:10:00] reason.I don’t know. And so I also wanted to check just i- if immigration in South Africa is uniquely high vis-a-vis other countries or other African countries. And South Africa’s immigration levels aren’t uniquely high by global standards, though they do stand out within Africa. Like, it’s, South Africa’s one of the countries that in Africa is doing, like, relatively okay, I guess.So they are seeing- AndMalcolm Collins: it’s doing terribly, by the way,Simone Collins: Yeah, but Africa sometimes has some troubles, and-Malcolm Collins: They are. I mean, if we’re gonna be realistic I, and I’m saying this as, like, an objective reality of South Africa.Simone Collins: Mm.Malcolm Collins: South Africa had a fairly strong economy- Yeah ... then they started acting in a way that scared away the European population within the country increasingly.And since then primarily due to political corruption in part due to Black tribal infighting within the political scene corruption has reached a level in the [00:11:00] country where basic businesses have failed to continue to operate. Electricity is constantly failing, which means that you can’t easily have things like restaurants without you know, you, you can’t have frozen food, you can’t have refrigerated food, you can’t have without generators, and then generating- Well,Simone Collins: there, there, there are blackouts, there are brownouts, there, there are jar- giant holes in theWe, we have a whole episode on it, just like third South Africa in, under, like, the Base Camp YouTube channel. But,Malcolm Collins: Yeah, but, but my point is is that they’re basically, they’re not really operating on their own anymore. They’re living off of a legacy and slow decay out of that legacy.Simone Collins: Yeah, yeah. So, but the, you know, still, they ha- they once had, and they still kind of have some opportunity that many other places don’t.In fact when I, when we did our South Africa episode, I found a bunch of posts by white UK residents who’d moved to South Africa to work remotely there and enjoy, you know, the relatively low cost of living, and, like, nice gated communities, et cetera. Like, there are, you [00:12:00] know. Anyway, it, it has things going for it.But in terms of where they stand with immigration, South Africa ha- has around 2.63 million international migrants. That’s about 4 point ... Oh, sir, 4.1% of its total population. That’s up from 3.2% in 1990 and 4.3% in 2010. So it’s not at, like, an all-time high, but it’s high-ish. The global average is 3.7 of the world population, and in Africa overall it’s 1.9.So they’re certainly higher than average in Africa though a few other African countries do have higher proportions of overall immigration due to specific factors like th- they have even more economic opportunity or they’re just more friendly to hosting refugees, like the Cote d’Ivoire. I think Djibouti has a lot.Yeah, 10.8. 10.8%, ha- immigrants in Djibouti because there’s a lot of I think people from Uganda, U- Uganda, [00:13:00] Uganda and, and Sudan, S- Sudan, oh my God, showing up there. But yeah, most African countries are below 2 to 3%. So South Africa is, is being relatively more flooded and I, I could see that, you know, putting pressure on them.Yeah. And you know, vis-a-vis- I think we- ... the United States and, and the UK and Canada it’s, it’s n- certainly not... I mean, like, we- Well,Malcolm Collins: okay, I wanna put this in context for people who do not understand why South Africa would be so freaked out by this. Uh-huh. Imagine if your country was this close to Africa, and it was this easy to immigrate into your country.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Like, you’d be pretty pissed too. Yeah ... also, the immigrants, are they primarily Muslim, or are there any, like, religious tension here?Simone Collins: From what I can understand, it’s not religious tension.It’s not about culture. It’s about jobs and economic security and resources. But just to be clear, so, like, South Africa is around 4.1% of the total population is immigrants.Australia, which also has some tension, right? 31 to 32%. [00:14:00] Canada, 22%. UK, 17 to 18%. USA, 15.2 to 15.4%. So all these other countries where it’s, you know, the citizens are getting way more shade for being, like, uncomfortable with the immigration,Malcolm Collins: Yeah, we gotta get some South Africans in here to, to handle our immigration issue.We have- ISimone Collins: know, right? Like, we’re, we’re at, like, three times their amount. And we are, we’re being, we’re, we’re being basically like, “Oh, come on in,” compared to them, where they’re like, “Yeah, if you’re not out by June 30th, I’m just, I’m just gonna say it’s not gonna be good for you.” What? Okay.Malcolm Collins: Can we, can we do that with America’s Black population?Like, let’s do that. They, they’re the ones who are getting their jobs taken, right? You know.Simone Collins: And what are they... Yeah, like we’re, they’re silent in all this, right?Malcolm Collins: RemoveSimone Collins: the whole border. It’s just gonna be one big fight. Yeah. Like, are we... I don’t know if there’s something like where, where journalists don’t want to interview Black Americans when they’re covering anti-immigration because they’re, they’re like, there’s this unspoken thing of like, “Oh, I want, I just wanna make it [00:15:00] look like...”Oh my God, why, why is this... Like, his new thing is screaming. It’s, this is not great for podcasting. Where they just wanna make it seem like-Malcolm Collins: You can’t hear. It doesn’t matter. You can put him in the box or something, Simone. He’s an infant. He’ll survive, all right?Simone Collins: The, the, the Skinner box. What did B.F.Skinner call his baby box again?Malcolm Collins: I don’t remember, but you know they used to put babies in, like, boxes and hang them out windows?Simone Collins: Oh, well, no, no, no. That was just, like, a, like, cute 1950s product, like an urban trendy thing. I don’t know how much it was used.Malcolm Collins: A modern trend, yeah, where you hung a baby out a window.No.Simone Collins: Let me see. It was like a... People still buy boxes like that for their cats now. You could technically just buy one for your cat and put a baby in it. I, I mean, you’d probably have CPS called on you, of course, but Anyway, I don’t, I don’t know what to do withMalcolm Collins: this. Anyway,Simone Collins: Let you know what?Malcolm Collins: By the way, Simone- Yeaha hilarious trend I learned about, if you wanna, if you wanna spice it up with something else-Simone Collins: Okay ...Malcolm Collins: is ballmaxing. What? There’s a community that try to have, th- and they do this through inflating them, the [00:16:00] perfect balls. Vice did an article on it. Your faces are the best. What does thisSimone Collins: have to do with South Africa?Or withMalcolm Collins: streaming? Nothing, it’s just hilarious. I don’t know. Some of these people might be in South Africa.Simone Collins: Well, I mean, we can do that, like, in our episode on, like, is Kim Kardashian a transhumanist? And just talk about... Because also apparently, like, a vaginal optimization is in Okay, you know what? I think maybe he could, can I just- You can’tMalcolm Collins: hear it.It’s irrelevant.Simone Collins: So, let’s go to what, like some actual statements from these protesters to get a picture of what they’re actually saying. Right So here are what some of the March on March leaders and protesters are saying. That’s that, the primary group that’s leading all these, if you recall.This is from, I’m going to butcher this, Jakaynda Ngobazi Zuma. He’s the founder and national leader of March and March. These “They are not victims. If you walk down the [00:17:00] roads, you’ll find that they take buildings. There are drugs. There is prostitution. There are cartels. There are mafias. So everything in this country is a fertile ground for criminals to thrive.We are under attack from across Africa. This only thing that they do is label us as xenophobic. There is nothing xenophobic about wanting law and order in your country. We are frustrated.”Malcolm Collins: Oh, these people are MAGA.Simone Collins: I know. Th- th- the thing is, like, if you just take this out of context and you’re like, “According to, like, James Brown,” like, J- J- well, what, what’s a really white-sounding name?James Carpenter from Ohio, you know, like, you’re just gonna be like, “Yeah, of course.” “We’re frustrated, tired, and feel ignored by our own government. Our demand is that our government is moving at a snail’s pace in addressing this issue of illegal immigrants.” Oh my God, right? It sounds so fricking, like, universal, so American, so UK.This is from Salit Sanele Nka- Nkambule. I’m so sorry. [00:18:00] This is the treasurer of March and March. “Many spaza shops and informal businesses in the townships are owned and run by foreign nationals without proper trading rights, placing an unfair burden on citizens who pay taxes.”He, he goes on to call for these shops to be run by South Africans, and he wants audits of immigrants a review of study visas, and army deployment in high immigrant i- areas. And this is... It’s, it sounds a little bit like a mix of-Malcolm Collins: An army deployment in high immigrant areas?Simone Collins: But they want ice. They want ice Like, MAGAMalcolm Collins: hasn’t even thought of this yet.Come on, g- we gottaSimone Collins: be taking notes from these South Africans. No, they just want ice. They want ice plus the National Guard. That is, like, exactly what we’ve been doing. Okay, great.Malcolm Collins: Okay, yeah, that’s what we need, National Guard in these neighborhoods.Simone Collins: So, yeah. And then it, here’s what BBC quoted one anonymous demonstrator saying as they, they filmed a Pretoria march.“We are grateful that we now have groups like this that have come to aid the voice of what we have always been preaching about. Illegal immigration is a big problem to our society.” And [00:19:00] then additional groups this that, that have been talking about this. Here is Thami Madondo. “The immigration laws of the country have never been enforced by the law enforcement agencies, and that’s why we’re sitting with all these crises.We are stressing the fact that illegal foreigners in the country must leave.” He criticized ubuntu narratives in this context also. “The narrative of ubuntu, unfortunately, is the nonsense that has put us where we are today. Ubuntu does not mean that you must come into the country illegally.” Which is so like him It sounds like an American, you know, being like, “Look, you know, we believe in helping people who are in need, but we have to take care, you know, of our own social services, et cetera, before we let other people in.”Yeah. And so it’s, I, I, I mean, what I like about him referring to Ubuntu is that he’s like, he’s referring to sort of the African version of progressivism of like, “You have to help everyone. Shut up, and like, just give everything away.” And he’s like, “Hold on. I’m not gonna lie down and do that.” Here’s Teshepo Thothwe.This is the, he’s the secretary of the Abahambe movement and they’re also [00:20:00] collaborating with March and March.Malcolm Collins: So for people who are wondering what Ubuntu is, ‘cause I went and looked this up, it is a profound southern African philosophy of humanism often translated as, “I am because we are.” Mm-hmm.Rooted in languages like Zulu it emphasizes a collective wellbeing or universal bond, or the belief that all of humanity are shaped by our relationships with others. Mm-hmm. And I’d point out that this philosophy didn’t go very far. It went about a quarter as far as apparently it went in the West, right?Mm-hmm. So, be aware that these people may talk like they have these philosophies, and everyone’s like, “Oh, these native whatever tribes in Africa, they have these wonderful progressive ideas that hold for about this long.” Okay, continue.Simone Collins: So Deshepo says, “We are here to partake and collaborate with March on March on a progressive march that is involving different organizations and also national forums to collaborate and fight against the foreign nationals that are taking advantage of our economic freedom [00:21:00] in our country.That is the key purpose for us to indicate and send a message that we are being labeled as xenophobic, and that is not the point.” So what are the protests like? AndMalcolm Collins: again, you’re sure, you’re sure this guy was Black, so we’re not gonna get the channel taken down?Simone Collins: I’m, yeah, I’ve, yes.Malcolm Collins: Okay, good.Simone Collins: AllMalcolm Collins: right. I, I,Simone Collins: I did, I did check.And again, I am, I am linking to my sources. You can literally watch the video. This last quote was from... You can see the video. It’s on africanews.en or africanews.com. All right? Just go to Substack or Patreon. I link to my sources, friends. So what are the protests like? Well, Human Rights Watch, surprise, surprise, in, in an, an article citing the xenophobic attacks, reports that some of the protests have ax- escalated into vigilante actions, assaults on migrants, including beatings, shop attacks, and reported deaths.Reported deaths, not confirmed deaths, of Nigerians and Ethiopians-Malcolm Collins: Yeah, those reported deaths of white farmers, they really didn’t care much aboutSimone Collins: Right. Just rep- yeah, who, where are the deaths? Show me the bodies. And intimidation. [00:22:00] Human Rights Watch and others have noted insufficient police response in places.Foreign governments like Ghana, Nigeria, and Kenya have issued warnings to their citizens and, in Ghana’s case, offered evacuation flights with low uptake on when, on reported instances. So they’re like, “Don’t worry, we’ll fly you back.” And, and the migrants are like, “Yeah, I’m good.” They- LowMalcolm Collins: uptake, yeahSimone Collins: They’re gonna stay.So what is the South African government doing in response? As they communicate on the official website of the Presidency of the Republic of South Africa, President Cyril Ram- Ramaphosa’s administration and officials, like the Deputy President Paul Mashatile, condemn the violence. They, they call it vigilante lawlessness.They acknowledge that there are some legitimate grievances over illegal immigration, and they have highlighted that they are deporting people, that they have deported over 100,000 people in recent years, and they’ve pledged [00:23:00] legal enforcement. But they also deny widespread xenophobia, and they call the incidents isolated or criminal.But the larger media narrative about these protests when you distill it all together, Is that they’re being framed as this recurring pattern of xenophobic tensions in South Africa during economic hardships. And they, they point that this is, like, echoing ve- similar activities in 2008 and 2019.People are citing Operation Dudula activities. I don’t know them. And, and basically they’re trying to say that there are high influe- high inflows of migrants and refugees, and while you get this with additional regional instability, which we’ve covered on other podcasts, and you have porous borders and competition for scarce economic opportunity, you’re gonna get stuff like this.But I find it very interesting that when people talk about immigration from a, [00:24:00] a left-leaning standpoint, it’s always xenophobia and people just being, like, just evil racists, when it’s super clear. Like, it doesn’t matter if you’re white, if you’re whatever. Like, people don’t like their jobs being taken.People don’t like people breaking the laws of their countriesMalcolm Collins: And acting differently. A lot of these other African populations, like Somalis, and people are wondering why I said, like, we gotta g- g- they’re, they’re a population that essentially specializes in fraud, right? Like, obviously not every Somalian is a fraudster, but we’re looking at rates in some of these communities that are over 50%.Like, it is astonishing the rate of fraud that we’re getting in some of these communities. This, for example, was a Somali immigrant community. I think it was 84% of Somalian immigrants are on welfare. Like, why are you bringing in a population? And then what was shocking is then somebody said, “Well, Somalian’s earn more than the average American.”And I was like ... And I [00:25:00] looked it up, and it’s true. Like, this is just fraudSpeaker 9: So just to double-click on these numbers here, it is81% of Somalian households are on welfare. 89% of Somalian households with children are on welfare. And that is way higher than any other immigrant group. , That is an astonishingly high number. And even after 10 years in the United States, the rates remain at around those numbers. , And yet, if you look at the average Somalian reported income in the United States, it’s 70 to 80,000 per household., This makes no sense unless they’re predominantly making money through fraudSimone Collins: Yeah, we did another episode on ethnic cartels like the Patel motels and all the Indonesian nail salons in California, and it’s super common. This is, this is not moored to any particular ethnic group but for especially immigrant groups- No, some ethnicMalcolm Collins: groups disproportionately do fraud.Like, we’ve gotta be realisticSimone Collins: about it. But no, I mean, it doesn’t have to be fraud. It’s basically if an ethnic [00:26:00] group especially immigrant groups find an economic niche, often of like- Not glamorous or desirable work. Fraud can fall into that, but so can, like, running motels or doing nail salons, right?Low-paying- I’m okay with evenly- Where you can often skirt laws ... bailable and owners,Malcolm Collins: right? They’re not investors-Simone Collins: I know, but what I’m saying is this is- ... they’re fighting ... I’m trying to point to this just being a natural economic dynamic that happens with immigrant groups, and it just so happens that the ethnic cartel that many Somalis have formed in many states is around, like, the business model of fraud.ToMalcolm Collins: understand how big a part of their culture it is, when US aid was shut down by the Trump administration, Somalia and a bunch of human rights groups put up these giant like, warnings saying that Somalia’s economy collapsed. Hold on, I wanna see what was the percent, ‘cause I wanna get this number right.Simone Collins: And you’re talking about the foreign nation of Somalia, not- I’m sorry, it’s another ... Somalis living in America.Malcolm Collins: They had estimated that the freezing of [00:27:00] USA funding represented an economic exposure or equivalent of 9% of Somalia’s gross national income.9% of their gross national income was coming from USA.Simone Collins: And that’s just USAID. We’re not talking about potential remittances being sent... Sorry.Malcolm Collins: Oh, by the fraudsters that are in theSimone Collins: United States already. From fraud committed, yeah. Because, you know, that, the USAID being shut down didn’t change all of the autism services, all of the Medicare services, all of the home health and transportation and et cetera services that S- Somalians were apparent- or c- daycares fraudulently running in the United States.So yeah, we’ll see. We’ll, we’ll see if... I, I mean, I was really in- intrigued when the Trump administration announced that JD Vance would be, like, the fraud czar in the United States. I haven’t heard any updates from that.Malcolm Collins: Oh, really? He’s done a really good job. So, he shut down tons, this is in California, of hospices that were fake.And he- Oh, really? So heSimone Collins: followed through. [00:28:00]Malcolm Collins: Yeah. He shut down four times the amount that Gavin Newsom has since he took power, and then Gavin Newsom tried to claim that he had actually done the shutdowns.Simone Collins: AreMalcolm Collins: youSimone Collins: kidding me? Oh,Malcolm Collins: no ... when they first whiffed out about them doing the shutdowns, and he tried to act like he was the one who managed it allSimone Collins: God. I think Tim Walz did something similar when a couple take careMalcolm Collins: of her. Oh, they did. Yeah. Tim Walz did. They went to, they shut down planned- He’sSimone Collins: like, “We did it, guys.” And thenMalcolm Collins: he acted like... And they’re like, “Tim Walz’s department has done nothing to help us at all. Like, I do not know why he’s taking credit for this.”Simone Collins: Golly, that’s so bad. Oh my gosh. This though, it really, it helps to fix something. And, and the other thing that this news really hammered home for me was just how effective the media narrative has been, just in my subconscious, in making me, just my evoked set of like, [00:29:00] anti-immigration protests means white people getting their, their panties in a bunch.You know, like I, I know logically that that’s not what it’s about, and yet the just, the, the coverage of it from that angle is so pervasiveMalcolm Collins: Well, and I find it interesting that Bla- like in the United States, I do not think Blacks would make the same sort of argument. These people seem to genuinely be concerned that people are gonna label them as xenophobic, right?Like, I love it that there’s like Black South AfricansSimone Collins: who are like- Wait, you’re saying there are Black people in America who would not want to say that they’re against immigration?Malcolm Collins: No, they don’t, they don’t... In America, you get such a pass for being Black. You know, they’re not gonna immediately come out and be like, “I’m not saying this because I’m a racist.”But in South Africa, the Black protesters are like, “I wanna be clear. I’m not a racist.”Simone Collins: This is not xenophobia. Yeah, that, that is interesting. Yeah, you make a good point there.Malcolm Collins: And I’ve been watching a lot more on American history and like the idea that America was ever a country where [00:30:00] endless immigration from any population was something that we wanted that is not true of historic America.We were very, very strict about who could immigrate into the country. We were very, very strict about who could enter our communities, who could integrate into our communities. You know, it like, I, I... Obviously, what really broke the dam on all of this was the integration of Catholics into America.I, I think-Simone Collins: Wait, wait, why do you say Catholics?Malcolm Collins: It’s factually trueSimone Collins: Everyone, you can reset your counters back to zero. Catholic alert. Ca- take a shot.Malcolm Collins: If you study American history, it’s factually true. That’s where we first allowed a really large immigrant group that didn’t have American culture or American values and was unable to persistently integrate into American values.Mm. Which is really which, which when we made that normalization, like anyone can integrate, anyone can become America, even if they’re still Catholic three generations in or something like that-Yeah ...that is when I think we sort of set the tide where, no, now we’re a country that accepts anyone.[00:31:00]Mm. Now we’re a country that’s just like, wherever you are, anywhere in the world, if it’s hard for you, just come to America. Because that wasn’t the original goal of the you know, the Puritans or the Congregationalists or the you know, original American religious communities. I’ve been doing more research recently on the original Great Awakening which is really fascinating in sort of how it built the American so fun information, Simone, because I probably won’t do a full episode on it ‘cause I don’t think our audience can stomach just education.Oh. But what, what was a really big part of the Great Awakening is when it started you typically only had- Mm-hmm ... preachers that were regional and, Mm ... they began to have traveling preachers, and the traveling preachers were really hated by the local preachers because you were supposed to only have, like, one church in an area and everybody went to that church.Yeah.And in some settlements you could only get into that church if you had had, you know, a, a specific type of, like, religious awakening even. Mm. So it wasn’t even like everyone had to go to the church, it was one [00:32:00] local church was an option, and getting in was exclusive. Wow. And so, then these traveling preachers began to become popular and people really hated it ‘cause they were competing with the traveling preachers.But the traveling preachers ended up sort of spreading and creating a cross American religious identity that was very... It, it took parts of the various original Protestant American groups and sort of formed a Pan-American religious conversation where things that they would do during the Great Awakening that hadn’t really been done before, were things like religions of different Protestant theologies teaching together or going on tour together.And people thought this was very scandalous, right? Like, “How could you do this?” And they’re like, “No, no, no. Like, we... Come on, guys. We agree we hate Catholics. Like, it’s okay that we’re preaching together, right? Like, we, we agree on the important stuff, okay?” And this created this idea that various Protestant groups can have communion with each other, which was not widely agreed upon either outside of America or in America before this[00:33:00]So thenSimone Collins: following- That is really interesting. That is fun. And also I’m, I’m interested to see how these protests unfurl. Huge thanks to, you know who you are the Base Camp listener who suggested this episode. ‘Cause I had no idea. I don’t know. Like it, this isn’t in at least the New York Times-Malcolm Collins: Yeah.Well, it doesn’t fit the narrative. Yeah. They don’t want you to know about it.Simone Collins: I don’t, yeah, I don’t see people discussing it on X. I don’t see the New York Times talking about it. It’s not on, like, Drudge Report, so thank you.Malcolm Collins: Can we get, like, based Africans to form a part of the community? I mean, I know we actually have- I don’t know.We have- ... a significant fan base in Africa, so.Simone Collins: Yeah. Yeah. That would be, that would be fun.That’d be fun ...Malcolm Collins: you know, in terms of where the future of the world goes, it’d be a lot of fun, yeah. Yeah. So let’s, let’s build up that, that African community. Obviously stay in Africa. You know, I’m not saying come over here.What?Simone Collins: I don’t know. I think we need more based Africans here.Malcolm Collins: We do need more based Africans here. Yeah, true.Simone Collins: So actually, come on, [00:34:00] come on over, friends ...Malcolm Collins: if you’re, if you’re willing to help us get rid of the fraudsters.Simone Collins: Again, I mean, I think where we, where we fall down on immigration is, You, you can stay if you are a net tax contributor.I, I think, like, if we just made that the one immigration policy, we would be super fine with immigration.Malcolm Collins: Mm-hmm.Simone Collins: The, the one rule. If your household is a net tax contributor, you can stay. If you are not, you can see yourself out. It’s fine. Okay? Okay? Okay. Great. See, then you can have both porous borders and general so- generous social services.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. No, I agree. That’s really all you have to do, and you can remove the racism, right? Like, just say- Yeah ... anyone who’s a taxSimone Collins: contributor- I don’tMalcolm Collins: care. Yeah ... stays. Anyone who’s a tax contributor- NoSimone Collins: matter where you’re from. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And i- it’s also not one of those, like, ticket price things where like, oh, well, you have to pay, like, you know, this much to get in or, like, invest in a company or something.It’s [00:35:00] no, just like, “Hey, well, it looks like you were negative this month. Thank you. It was lovely having you here. You are now dismissed. K- goodbye.”Malcolm Collins: Get your back and never can come back.Simone Collins: Mm-hmm. Yep, that was your chance. It’s over. Mm-hmm.Malcolm Collins: Yeah.Simone Collins: Yep. I think it’s fine.Malcolm Collins: And people are like, “That’s too harsh,” and it’s like, you can just not take government money, right?Like, if you- Yeah ... lose a job or something. You don’t need to...Simone Collins: Yeah. Like, you can, y- you can, you know, a- ask a church community to, you know, take care of you that month or any number of thingsIs Google Ads harassing you again?Malcolm Collins: Google is very aggressive with their ad campaign.Simone Collins: No, I think people have discovered that ads really don’t make money anymore.Malcolm Collins: So check out rfab.ai, any of our new features, our super search, our... We’re getting close to the Vtuber system being fully functional at this point.Might be by this episode. We’re getting close to, Oh, we got the new based AI. Like, [00:36:00] literally yesterday I was like, “I’m gonna make a based AI.” It’s up, it’s operational. Try it out. It even switches with Alloy model into top AI models with internet connection.Simone Collins: Explain how and why it’s based.Malcolm Collins: Well, it literally uses a prompt injection that you can change that keeps it from being too woke so, you knowSimone Collins: Give it a try, guys.Let us know what you think. Yeah, and anyway, that is all. Sounds good. Goodbye.Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I’ve been, I mean, even with this, putting in more image generation services, so we have, like, one of the fullest image generation... You should look at using RFAB more for title card generation, by the way. Okay. We have all of the models that you’re using, like BlackSimone Collins: Forest- Yeah, I just, I fi- I personally find your prompt inj- injections to be abrasive when it comes to image gen.Malcolm Collins: Then you can take them out.Simone Collins: I, I will. I know. I just-Malcolm Collins: They’re literally... Simone, they’re just auto-added, so you can just delete them.Simone Collins: I will. I, I just have to get over that. I’m, I’m sorry. I’m a horrible wife. I’m a [00:37:00] failure of a wife. Yes,Malcolm Collins: you are a failure of a wife.Simone Collins: I will- Does it use Nano Banana? ‘Cause that’s, I think we use that a lot.You can use NanoMalcolm Collins: Banana. Okay. So it’s, yeah. You canSimone Collins: useMalcolm Collins: any of the major services, Simone.Simone Collins: So it has Midjourney, Nano Banana, Black Forest, and, and, It hasMalcolm Collins: all of those, yes.We actually don’t have Midjourney because they don’t have an API, uh, but that’s the only one we don’t haveSimone Collins: Okay. Okay, good. Okay, good. Well- I’ll, I’ll try it tomorrow morning ...Malcolm Collins: all right, Simone. Love you.Simone Collins: Loveyou.Simone Collins: And I’m recording, just so you know, as you adjust. By the way, I forgot to tell you last night, when I was putting the kids to bed, Titan had decided to make a bed on the, like, tumbling pads that we have. Okay. She had a blanket and everything, and she was all snuggled in. And she looks up with me with that really serious look that she has, and she says, “Mommy, my heart is broken.”And I’m like, “Titan, what’s wrong? Like, are you okay? Why are you sad? What, what’s,Malcolm Collins: what’sSimone Collins: making you soMalcolm Collins: sad?” And sheSimone Collins: just kept saying, “Malcolm Collins: [00:38:00] My heartOctavian Collins: isSimone Collins: broken.”Octavian Collins: Mommy. Mommy, I couldn’t... Mommy.Simone Collins: Yeah?Octavian Collins: It... Mommy, I couldn’t find a place to hang my dartSimone Collins: board. That’s why you need to hang it in the hallway where I set it up.Octavian Collins: And I did.Simone Collins: Then hang it up there again. But there’sOctavian Collins: no place.Simone Collins: Yes, there’s a nail right there.Malcolm Collins: Tell him I’m gonna eat Cutish tonight if he doesn’t stop bugging us.Simone Collins: He’s going to eat Cutish tonight- No ... if you, if you don’t close the door and leave us alone while we record. You can put the dart board in the hallway, though Well, at least he doesn’t wantMalcolm Collins: to eat- Am I abusive?Is this what an abusive father does, is threaten to eat their kid’sSimone Collins: pet? His favorite, his favorite chicken. I love that, like, actually we might eat our chickens. Yeah. It’s, it’s a real threat. It’s not like, “Oh, I’ll eat your cat.” You know? It’s like-Malcolm Collins: Yeah,Simone Collins: no. ... these are working animals. Th- they’re, yeah.It’s, it’s days are numbered. But anyway right. She just kept saying her heart is broken, and I was just getting really worried. I’m like, “Has something made you really sad? Like, what’s wrong?” [00:39:00] And she, like, holds up, it was that heart keychain that my dad had given her, which she was calling her balance time heart.Malcolm Collins: Balance time. It was, andSimone Collins: it was cracked ... her balance time heart. Yes. It had... She’d like, of course, spontaneously disassembled the keychain, and it was a little bit broken. It still looks... She can still play with the heart part, but, “My heart is broken.” MyMalcolm Collins: heart is broken. My heart isSimone Collins: broken. I was so worried.I’m like, “Oh my God, Titan, are you okay?”Malcolm Collins: You’re an astonishingly good mother.Simone Collins: Just her heart is broken. By the way, Suno is so much better now like with genres. ‘Cause like I only want more obscure stuff, and it used to only be good with, you know, country and pop. And now I’m like, okay, you know, make make electro orchestral hip hop, make chiptune- Mmmake electro swing. And it’s really good. Like the stuff that I like listening to instead of just... I mean, I like, obviously I like country, but you can only make so many [00:40:00] country songs.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Interesting thing is I wanted to do full music video generation on RFAB, and, Yeah ... Suno doesn’t offer an API last I checked, so I’m checking again right now, but,Simone Collins: Oh, to do the, the song part.Malcolm Collins: Yeah.Simone Collins: So you basically now would have to just do it to your song, like bring in your own song.Malcolm Collins: We do have not safe for work video generation now. I got that working.Simone Collins: That’s what we really want. It doesn’t work alwaysMalcolm Collins: very well on most of the models, which is frustrating, but whatever.Simone Collins: Mm-hmm. I, I think your average user probably wouldn’t care as much about creating music videos as we would, because our kids love music videos so much, but I don’t know.I I, I still haven’t watched someone’s commentary on YouTube. Some- someone put out a video on like how the music video age is dead, long live the music video age. Like it, they’re, they’re like both dead and not dead, and I wanna see what the thesis is there, but I don’t know yet because I haven’t watched the video.Anyway, I will I’ll kick off the episode, ‘cause I’m, I’m excited to talk about this. I’m, I’m glad [00:41:00] you encouraged me to, to do it. So you ready?Malcolm Collins: All right. Yeah, I’m ready. Love you.Simone Collins: Okay. Oh, he’s resisting. Don’t resist. Sir. Sir. I just gotta get him to, like, calm down. Okay There we go.Speaker 10: That still looks like a silly happy face. Where is your scary face? I do not know. Where is your murdery face? Murdery face. Your murdery face. Is that... Are you g- When you, when you kill your enemies, are you gonna look like that? What face are you gonna use when you’re about to stab them through the heart?That’s the face? That’s your killing face? What i- what... That is, that is what you look like when you kill people? No. Okay. Gi- give me... Strike a pose, buddy. Show me. Show me your best murdery look. Show me, buddy. Okay. Let me [00:42:00] see. So what- Show me your killing face ... this because, this because the secret move goes like this.Speaker 12: This is it. Okay. Show me. Show me. We’re doing a video. I need to see. Oh, okay. No, you’re smiling again. What is this? Are you just gonna s- What, you think everyone’s gonna laugh if you run at them smiling? Yeah, this, this is his... This, yeah, he’s just... They’re gonna laugh, and then he’ll stab them. I, I kinda like it actually.Speaker 10: Yeah? Octavian, can you even defeat me? Ah. Ah. Oh, God. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit basedcamppodcast.substack.com/subscribe