Dunkirk with Bilge Ebiri

Blackjack with Griffin and David. Blackjack with Griffin and David. Don't know what to say or two aspects. All you kids and I was left with the show was Blackjack.

You can practically see it from here. What? Podcast. Sure.

I don't know, right? It's like a dialogue. Yeah. You should have just done a plane.

Just make it made a plane noise. Then I would talk about it. I guess how Nolan was just obviously when he's pitching the movie, he's just like, Ah. Oh.

Oh. I love the idea of Nolan coming in and his crisp suits, right? Hair, slip back. Just give him a one to sit up.

And then took out his shoe box, placed all his miniature 10 airplanes on the floor. He had like personally built it in a garage. Right. Yeah.

Took a deep breath and went, Ah. And Chris here is a check for $200 million. 20 against 20%? Is that half that's right?

Here is a blank check with Griffin and David. Oh, he finally said that to him. This is the name of our podcast. He just called Blank Check the Griffin.

I'm Griffin. I'm David. Sims. We're the two friends that's a hashtag.

It's competitive advantage. No other podcasts. I go in for it. We do.

Here's another thing about us. Kind of source context. You're all over the place. I'm trying to do sensory overload.

Oh, I'm done. Kurt. I'm trying to fucking blitz your brain. This is my guess.

I'm fine. If I'm making sure that massive success early on their career, that gives serious point checks. Sometimes I'll check. Clear.

Sure. Sometimes I'll check. Yeah. Sometimes the bounce.

Maybe not this time. Not this time. It's clearing for sure. And it's a real blank check of a movie.

It is in a weird way, even though it's a war movie. Yeah. The Horriest of genres. Yes.

This is the last film. Oh, my gosh. It's kind of this many series. Yeah.

At that point it will be a one off. It'll be a throwback Thursday. Exactly. When we cover another one.

Another Nolan. Cause we even talk about the films of Christopher Nolan. It's a many series called The Pod Nightcats. The Podkirk.

It's called Podkirk. This is Podkirk. We're talking about the movie. Yeah.

Which came out a month and a half ago now. A month ago. Yeah. That's sweet spot.

Yeah. We're tipping in to September right now. Yeah. And it's still going strong to the box office.

We'd send our interstellar episode that Dunkirk wasn't coming in and I think it's going to pass it the next week or so. It's doing a great job. It's also been the worst month for movies. After, I think, an okay summer, this, like, the last few weeks have been...

Excuse me, have you not seen the leap? The birth of the dragon? Is it leap, colon, birth of the dragon? Yeah.

So, one movie, it's a mashup. Weinstein cannot afford to release movies anymore, so he's smuggling movies inside of other movies. Two leap fever? Yes.

We are only days away today, two days away from the release of Two Le Fever. Have you seen Two Le Fever honored guests? I have not. You want to share a circumstance?

Sure. Hey, read about. You don't like reading his work. You're reading his writing about Christopher Nolan.

I wanted him on this podcast and I'm sorry we couldn't get you on Interstellar, but scheduling was crazy for Interstellar. Just because I feel like you're the biggest Interstellar fan in the world, if I'm a big Interstellar fan. I'm a very big Interstellar fan. I don't know if I'm the biggest fan.

If you put a ton of tar talk, we can put us out of time this episode for some tar talk or regular segment. No, we're just going to do that every week. No, David Reese makes it clear he actually likes case more than tar on that episode. That makes sense.

David Reese is a real case. Uh, uh, critic for the Village Voice. Still exists. It's still here in online form only sadly.

Um, welcome. Thank you so happy to be here. Thank you for the podcast. Huge channel podcast.

I'm pleased to report that I'm actually an hour into this podcast already while you guys are at the table. You're already a different temper. And Ben right now is a week ago. He always is though.

That's not a new producer. Ben, the producer, Ben, the producer, the poet, Laurie, the ha's or finest film critic, the third bike, Benny, the token wet, Benny, the fart master, the meat lover, the fart master, the fart detective, the fuck master. He's not Professor Christie. He is the peeper.

He's graduated certain tells over the course of the many series such as M. Pretty spring and a week I love Ben. Ben, Ben, Sean, Ben, say Ben anything. Uh, it was a dollar sign war has and announcing it here.

Sure. Pretty were bane. Pretty were bane. That's what you settled on.

For do where? Ben Kirk. Not Ben Kirk. Not in Kirk's good.

Not yet. I mean, look, when he catches up with us, he can, he can write him with it. I visit the French town of Ben Kirk. Get a croissant.

Uh, yeah, don't care. Hey guys. Hey, everybody. Um, so, so this, uh, this, this movie, Nolan makes interstellar.

Sure. Our cell does well, but still we thought it was kind of you just a disappointment. I think just in the light of how huge is he has a high bar. You know how previous sci-fi movies like that are done.

Right. Right. Gravity the year before wins, best director makes like a crazy amount of money hand over fist. Right.

There was sort of this revival of adult sci-fi. That's something going on. It's weird. Like every year now there's one high minded adult sci-fi movie.

You think of Arrival last year? What's this year? Uh, I don't, I guess this year, Blade Runner is like the closest equivalent, right? Was, was, was, was Arrival and the Martian the same year?

Or were they different years? No, they're, they're different years. Right. But Martian 2015 arrivals is 2016.

Right. But there's like one kind of like real-time science over larian. Everyone loves life. Like, hey, not a bad movie.

I hate that director with a passion. He's the safe house guy. Safe house guy. The safe house guy.

The child-24 guy. I've not seen either of those movies. Yeah. But life, you know, the whole muscle.

Is he the snab-a-cash guy or whatever? He is the snab-a-cash guy. People love that snab-a-cash, right? I have no idea what you guys are talking about.

He's the snab-a-cash easy money. Yeah, he does what I call it, Snab-a-cash parentheses easy money. Love the title. Which was Dutch.

Is he? Daniel Espinosa is his name? He's a good man. He's a good man and had an interesting strategy, which was to be a good movie.

That was their strategy was what if good? But arrival, gravity, interstellar, the Martian. I feel like there's one more. I feel like every year between September and December there's been one kind of like.

This is a realistic look at space. Yeah. They're spinning. There's a lot of spinning.

Space is not spinning now. Space. Now we're spinning. I'm not saying anything.

I'm sorry we're lacking one this year. Thor Ragnarok. Yeah, that's hard stuff. Hard like a Ragnarok.

Yeah. Yeah. But I think the expectations were very high and it's sort of like you know, And it wasn't like a total flop, it was kind of like, what does he do now? Sure.

What does he do now? Batman's done. Not doing Batman, right? And there were, I feel like rumors for a while, circling things, but he keeps a tight lid on it.

I guess so. He's always just how I would use it. He's close to the chest. Very close to the chest.

Right? Like what's he gonna make now, for example? That's the thing that happens after every Nolan movie, where I think to myself, well, what the hell does he do to kind of impress people again? Yeah, because you have a lot of big directors, so I'm gonna go make a small movie now.

And usually it's because they've done something bloated and obscene in anointing. Like, you know, Michael Day or somebody. Yes. But with Nolan, you know, you don't necessarily, I mean, I would watch whatever he does.

You don't necessarily hear him say, I'm gonna make a small movie now. No, right. Well, he's very good about not being an asshole about his brand, I would say largely. Agreed.

But in terms of where I think people would care to hear that. You know, I mean, I care to hear this. He's in a very interesting position, because as Alex Ross Perry very stupidly said in our episode, he's one of like two or three living filmmakers who can like call the shot and force the entire industry to change if he decides to do something. Okay.

In terms of actual filmmaking process, release strategy, what have you, you know? And I think he like takes that responsibility seriously. So while like, I would love to see him make a little movie, not cause I don't like the big ones, but because it would be interesting to see him go back and forth. I think he's like, I got this power.

I got to do big things to try to like advance filmmaking. So it kind of becomes this question of like, I guess what genre is he gonna take on next? Like he's weirdly in that sort of position now where it's like, oh, a sci-fi movie. And then.

And then it's hard to imagine him making a horror movie. Yeah. Yeah. I can see him producing something, you know, I mean, he produced Man of Steel.

And Transcendence. Right. Last week, forget. Never forgotten.

Maybe he'll make another singularity movie. Yeah. I'd love to see him use it. Cause he's done that thing where he, a couple of years ago with the Brothers Quay, where he helped take their films around and did like a little documentary and actually did appearances with them.

And right around that same time, he also released the Blu-ray of Zevi Agans says Elena, right? Yeah. He's been like paying for like, restorations and stuff. He's kind of like the Scorsese, like Scorsese, like a mode where you're like, you're trying to have some of that stuff.

And also I think maybe a little bit like Coppola in the seventies. Right. I mean, there was that period, I mean, because there was that period where Coppola was indestructible. Right.

And he was like, like, literally destroyed. He helped get croissala films. Yeah. Right.

And Lucas did that too. Lucas did it. Tarantino did it, although it didn't really always work for him, but there was the, in the nineties too, where Quentin presents. I can't express.

I think the problem was that Weinstein ultimately used that. Yeah. I think he started like turning, turning to a brand. Are you saying you don't have to live fever?

Someone asked us on Twitter if we were going to do one offer to a fever. And my response was, how can you do a podcast on a movie that doesn't exist? Were you, have you, you haven't seen it? Were you invited to the screening that they then called me and said, we're not going to have the screening, the day of the screening.

And I was like, okay. And they were like, instead, we will not be screening the movie. Like it wasn't like, we're like, we're rescheduling it to this day. It was like, so we're not going to have the screening.

And instead, there won't be screenings of the film. It's so weird. I mean, because the film has come out in other places. And people have said like, it's bad, but like it's, it's whatever.

Right. Arendas in the shape and lay. It's just like a crappy movie. No worse than the last movie they made.

I mean, there must be some weird contractual thing or maybe, I mean, there's also, I mean, let's not forget Harvey is known for being vindictive with his film releases. Sure. Yeah. But he also has this thing where like he had some upfront deal with getting to Harvey thought.

He had some deal. Christopher Nolan. Yeah. He has been talked about talking about Harvey.

He has this deal with Netflix where they like offer him a certain amount of money upfront for like 10 releases a year. And some of the movies he didn't want to release started like, oh, I'll put it in one theater so then I can put it on Netflix the next week and like get my money back. We're doing that thing where he likes siphon them off to the Lifetime channel, which he's done with like two or three of his like long delayed movies. He did that with Grace Ammonico and he did it with Sui-san says, right.

Like suddenly it just quietly airs on Lifetime as a TV movie. So the like, the two of you things very bizarre because it's like he's used other escape routes to not release a movie. Right. This is maybe he has some clause where he has, I don't know.

Yeah. I mean, that's that said, he has made me want to see to the people. I mean, it's kind of amazing. I wanted to see to the people until now and now they're advertising it as the sexiest thriller of the year.

Yeah, the movie that Harvey Weinstein doesn't want you to see that should be the tagline. Do you read about? I think someone tweeted that there was like a sag screening or like a DJA screening where literally people were in line and they came out and were like, actually never mind. Someone put out a paper sign written in Ballpoint pen that says, sorry, screening canceled.

We are showing Annabelle, which I think you should see the sign because it's so like plain and just sort of like there's no malice to it. It's a sweet little sign that someone drew for the WGA crowd. I just love that like you're like, man, I can't believe they called me and canceled the screening two hours before it started. It was like six hours.

Okay. And those people were like, man, I can't believe they wrote a sign and told us the screening was canceled 30 minutes after the screening was supposed to start. They just played Annabelle and then people were like, that was Annabelle. I mean, no, that was too.

You didn't catch the fever? Yeah, that was too. It was fever anyway. See you later.

Please leave. All right, Dunkirk. So, but this is one of those movies like Inception that he has had boiling for like his whole career. Like he came up for the idea.

The first work movie should be should be done, but I don't have the money or the skill yet or whatever. And he just sort of had it in his pocket. Right. But they feel like he always has them in his pocket.

They play this movie very close to the chest. He he doesn't talk about it much. There's very little kind of information circulating around. A couple big actors who were like, has in smaller supporting parts, but then it was like, Oh, he's mostly using unknown.

He's in it. Oh, I knew he was the hairstylist. I didn't know like Ryland's a brand awareness until I saw the trailer. Like I knew very little.

I just knew he was making a Dunkirk movie. I never tried because he hides it all the way and he never really tried us to dig in. But everyone kind of assumes like, okay, Chris, we're no one's doing a warm movie. He's going to go fucking huge.

He's going to make this big, bombastic. Like, it's going to be two parts. Like what kind of epic is he going to build? And then he releases this weird 90 minute, like, I know, like experimental exercise.

It's a hundred and five minutes. I remember when the news broke that it was a hundred five minutes. Everybody was like, what the fuck? Right.

And my sister would be ever if you exclude following. Right. Should be excluded. Yeah.

Right. She made for a few bucks less than this one, which was an essenly mutual. I think that was part of his fattiara buckle deal. But yeah, no, I do remember we say it on this podcast.

I think you're like, did you hear how short? Yeah. And it's not it's not. After Interstellar, which is as long as movie and is long, right?

I love it, but it's almost three hours long. Yeah. And when the early like word comes out, people are like, it's like, it's very short. You'd like don't really have like character arcs.

There's like very little dialogue. Where did you see this? Like it's like the experimental, experiential movie. Because I started Lincoln Square Press screening.

I assume you did as well. But I had had like some of my friends had seen it already and told like, I just remember Erlich saying, I think Captain Phillips not saving Prevere Ryan. Like that was all he sort of said to me. And I don't know.

Like what did you expect going? I didn't know much going in. One friend who had seen it earlier said it's insane. And that was kind of all he said.

Sure. It is insane. Well, that's good. I think that's good.

And so I was so I was prepared for it to be insane, whatever that meant. Right. And the context of a Christopher Nolan movie. I was prepared for some sort of a sensory experience.

Yeah. Yeah. But that's about it. I don't know.

I was a little frightened. And it is a different well, it's also that very first shot, that very first shot of the soldiers walking through that town with the papers, the leaf. And also it's weird. And I saw it again.

I caught this, although, you know, it's like, it's hard to catch this, but they've just like stood up or something. Like it's like a split second of them cowering. And then they kind of stand up and sort of start walking more casually. And it's such a weird way to begin.

And but immediately pulls you in. I agree. And then he literally sums everything up with just like a one or other leaflet, you know, the we surround you, the like, you us. And then there's just that like loud, clangy, like you saw in Lincoln Square, too.

Right. Yeah. And the big IMAX in New York City and the gunfire where you're just like, and then that's the whole movie. Right.

You're going back on that. Right. But but also like the thing that strikes me in that opening scene is he like kind of throws down his gauntlet, which is like, this is not a movie about the enemy. Right.

This is not a movie about the fight. This is a movie about survival because it's just you're just hearing them. Yeah. You're exclusively hearing them, which immediately is like very unusual.

It adds a really strange energy from that opening scene where it's like we're just watching the back of this kid's head. Yeah. If you own white heads, right? It feels like he's being shot at by ghosts because he's framing it so particularly around this dude who is like, you know, like like such an ideal cinematic cipher, like Nolan found this kid who like had done one short film before, I believe, one episode of a TV show.

I'd never been in a movie before. He'd been in like some miniseries. Yeah. And just like has one of those faces where it's like, yeah, that looks like a kid in more, you know?

Yeah. No, he does. And he has a certain like integrity to him, but is asked mostly to just like survive throughout this entire film. But also this opening sequence, they're like eight or 10 boys who look like him.

I know watching it. I was like, which one's like the lead guy? Sure. And then very quickly, like through press elimination, you're like, well, I guess that's our hero because everyone else is dead now.

The opening is actually, I forgot, of course, it has that does have that title. Yeah. The title card with the, you know, the enemy, the enemy and prank for a miracle, whatever. They're good people on both sides.

On many sides. On many sides. David, yes. Got an intentional air about you today.

Well, I'm more intentional about what I wear day to day. Oh, I lean into pieces that feel easy, comfortable and put together. I'm sure you could get those from anywhere. Right.

Oh, quince. I'm literally wearing quince. Listen to showing tag on me. It's been my go to because very clean fits.

Very nice fabrics. Yeah. Don't they don't feel like cheap fabrics. I hate dirty fits.

I hate cheap fabrics. I am. We're in, you know, if the weather's getting warmer, I really rely on my quince polo shirts for the kind of like exactly like a formal enough piece of clothing. I can go to the office, but it's comfy.

Yes. Because we do have a dress code here. Headblend for options. Uh huh.

Uh huh. So they got those 100% pima cotton tees with a softness. They got a feel. Oh, enjoy.

And for those who don't, David is touching the fabric. Can't sit that same balance, relaxing, comfortable. I got to tell you, I recently had a birthday and my in-laws sent me a quince gift card because they know I like quince so much and I am itching to spend it. That's that's a really strong endorsement.

That's an endorsement. Yes. Right. Yes.

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Hey, David is showing me. Oh, nice. Cashmere zip. I like that color.

It's very nice. Yeah. I wear it all the time. It's got pockets.

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Next time. What did you see you were making the tech? Yeah, I saw it like I guess it was I saw it like maybe two weeks later because I was making the ticket that came out when I was at Comic Con and then I was actually in this other movie. So I saw it a little bit late, but I saw it at iMacs, link it's where and by the point I had seen it, it was like firmly in like dad mode territory.

Right. Like I had like missed the the Nolan bro window of like the the rabid Nolan stands and I saw it in a theater that was mostly like father's and grandparents with their like children being like, no, this is important. Right. Sure.

Sure. You know, I mean you texted me after you saw it and said I'm very curious to see what you think about this. Right. Because I thought of our saving pervaryant episode.

Don't like war movies. You don't like war movies. I have a hard time with them. A war movie with everything stripped out like that you might cling to like character or yeah, sentimentality.

Right. Right. And I like, you know, I was very shell shocked when we did our saving right up the so like I was like, I don't trumpet like just been elected president. I was fucked up by a lot of different things at that time, but I just like that watching that movie the night before recording, I was like fucking losing it like white knuckling at the entire time.

And I feel like my opinion of that movie has grown since we recorded the episode. I feel like I was very complimentary. But I also know you were just not into deal with this movie. Yeah.

But when I like think about it more, I don't know if I have the crucial watch it again. I think that more right. I'm like, I'm like, God, that's what a great fucking movie. But all the things I think about when I replay it in my mind are like the dialogue scenes, the character interactions.

Tom Hanksha. This is real big. I'm not just storming the beach of Normandy in one way or another, like the entire movie is operating at that level of intensity with very little else to grab onto. So it's like, it's a movie designed for me not to like it.

Sure. I haven't said I like it. Sure. Do you like it?

I see you love it. Yeah, it's great. Like I feel like times have you seen it? Four.

Wow. That's a lot of time. I've only seen it twice. I wanted to see, I checked it out in 35 millimeter.

A friend of mine was seeing it. Yes, I did too. I have still not seen it in just regular 70 millimeter and I would like to. Oh, no, right.

No, I saw it in 70. Right. Which was great. I have not seen it in regular 35 millimeter.

In 35 on a smaller screen, which is what I saw at the, I guess, Villages or what's the, and it feels like a different movie. It really does. Interesting. More so than any of his others did kind of in different formats.

I mean, there was a lot of format excitement around this movie. Certainly. Even I think even beyond like film Twitter or Nolan Bros or whatever, I had like a lot of people in my life just asking me like, how should I see it? Like, I know that's important.

You know, like what should I do? That's the point is like he's able to make these things feel important. Like people know that these aren't arbitrary decisions. And even just like they made those t-shirts they were like handing out at the midnight screenings that were like, I saw Dunkin, 70 millimeter.

You know, like it's like a vacation. Like I just, I find iMacs very, very overwhelming in general. I found a very overwhelming for interstellar. I found a very frightening for this.

I can't handle helping this, especially when there's a lot of negative space, which this would be, especially in the air scene, which just makes the air scene so tremendous to me in iMacs. And then I saw it in 70 and I had seen it already. So obviously like a lot of the tension is gone the second time anyway. And I had a great time, like, you know, but I mean, was that just that I was seeing it?

I can't, you know, it's hard for me to. It's weird without the iMacs. It really does feel like a different experience. You know, not less immersive necessarily, but it does feel strangely a little more unified.

It's not, it wasn't as loud also. It's just very, very loud. I like big, loud movies. I love iMacs.

I've been waiting for years for someone to use iMacs properly. Yeah. I think Nolan does it, but you know, when I saw Interstellar, first time I saw Interstellar, I saw it in 35. Sure.

And I loved it. And I think the second time I saw it, I also saw it in 35. I finally, you know, went and saw it in iMacs. And I actually found it kind of distracting in iMacs because it cuts between- The cuts are so much, right.

Whereas this, the cuts are much rarer and briefer. And it's like, or you can see the bars. For 75% iMacs. It seems like 70.

I couldn't, you know, I'm not a man. It seems like 65% of the movie is down now. But you really, I mean, I guess it mostly cuts to the black bars where you're like, you know, on the boat with a Rhyland. That's what I know.

It's mostly for dialogue because it's a sound issue. You know, but there's not much dialogue in it. So the boat stuff mostly felt like it was like it was 35. And then a couple of the brand-offs scenes where he talks for more than 10 consecutive sets.

Sure. You know, but other than that, the like large majority of the movie is in this crazy boxy, overwhelming. Like that's the other thing. Like you see iMacs movies are people shoot like, oh, we shot 20% on it.

And it's like mostly you're watching a letter box image that you're used to. And everyone's like, oh my god, TARS is taking up the entire screen. TARS! Right.

No, I mean, I remember it with Catching Fire, the whole game's where it's not an iMacs until she gets into the arena and then it suddenly expands out. And I remember being like happy that they like tried to take advantage of the form that way. But rarely do you really like, well, I loved it in interstellar, but it was my first time. And I love space just, but I sit in the back.

Yeah, I sit in the closer. I'm a little dork who wants to sit in the backseat because I'm scared of the big picture. Right. And I was, of course, you know, the calling pictures should hate me because you can see me in the middle.

So I was sitting in the corner. My press screening, I'm sitting in those back seats. And this guy is sitting across from me who's got like all these papers around him. And he's like, what are you doing back here?

You should sit over there. And I was like, I like to see the whole screen. I just want to sit. He was like, I'm only sitting back here because I have to do all this work for the studio.

Like I see he was like taking notes the whole movie. And he was like, but Mr. Nolan sits right there. And he like pointed right in the middle.

Like he's like, that's his seat. And I was like, OK. He's keeping it warm for you. Yeah.

I guess that. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I feel like there is an innate glass ceiling to my enjoyment for this movie, just because the kind of film it is.

But I definitely sat there and felt like, OK, this is like pretty exemplary filmmaking. This is an insane achievement. I like game recognized game, you know, one master of iMacs to another. Griffin Nomes tipping his hat to Nolan.

But it is a very bizarre movie in that it doesn't offer you the traditional handles to sort of like hold on to carry you through the story. Other than the Rylance plot, I would argue, which unsurprisingly was the thing that I was the most keyed into. A nice British man driving a little boat. A nice man with nice clothes.

So the gimmick of the movie, if you can call whatever you want, but the format of the movie is at least three time lines. Right. We are hashtag the two friends. These are hashtag the three temporalities.

And I remember reading that beforehand and thinking like, oh, that sounds like a crystalline thing right there. Yeah. But I like that the movie is more is very tries to be explicit about it. Like the mole one week, you know, the sea one day, the air one hour.

Right. It lays out its cards real upfront. Mm-hmm. And I to me, at least the second I saw how it was laid out, it was like, oh, this completely makes sense.

This isn't like a gimmick for gimmick sake. Makes sense to me. I mean, did you have any trouble? I've seen some complaints about the timeline.

I've seen my share of complaints about the timeline. I never really understood what the process is. I guess it's hard to articulate like finding a thing confusing, but. Yeah.

And I didn't find it confusing. I mean, there are moments where you're disoriented, but I think in a pleasant way. I mean, I think all of them likes to be a little ahead of the viewer at various points. Sure.

Yes. And I think he likes to kind of pull you in in that way. I mean, with a film like this, I find it so engrossing and beautiful and just riveting that it makes me an attentive viewer. Mm-hmm.

Right. And that's one of the things that no one does that I really appreciate is that he finds a way to make sure that you're paying attention. Like it's like in the prestige. Are you looking closely?

You're absolutely right. Yeah. He's right. He's trying to make sure your mind doesn't wander.

Yeah. And I'm by nature an inattentive viewer. I mean, a lot of films I've been with it. Yeah.

A lot of films I've reviewed, I have to watch twice before I can kind of figure out what the hell I even think about. And that's why with Nolan, I'm never distracted. I'm never kind of pulled out of it. Almost never pulled out of one of his films.

I mean, I'm always kind of locked in, even when I don't know entirely what's happening. Yeah. I'm totally with him. Well, there's this other element too, which is like, you know, time is obviously this like a big overarching thing in Nolan's whole filmography.

You know, like there's the shift of like, I think his movies like, when we were starting the mainstream, I was like pushing this confidence thing to the hell really hard, you know, all that confidence. There's a certain point that like shifts into being about time, more than anything, like his fascination with time, which I think falls into this bigger thing he's at, which is like, I think to one degree or another, Nolan's always making movies about movies, but unlike some filmmakers who get like tagged with that label and it's like, oh, they're just referencing the movies they grew up loving. I think Nolan movies are about the way that people process movies. Yeah.

You know, like I think they're movies about watching and processing information and how information is told to us and all of that sort of stuff. Like, I mean, inception, like it's literally what that movie is about. The reason why everyone's so into like the metaphor about it, tracking for filmmaking is because it's like, you know, he's like a BFG. He's trying to like cook up some dreams for us, you know, he's trying to like make this artificial world that like we can buy into it.

And then he casts the BFG. Right. Right. In this movie.

Yes. Yes, he does. Which I thought there's a weird amount of farts like. And on the moonstone.

Seeing where they run out of like gas on the boat and Rylance just powers it through farts. You're in oil. You're in oil. You're in oil.

Fudge, windpores, get me to done. Fudge, send it explodes and everybody burns and dies. Yeah, it just felt like that was a weird meshing of tones because I'm one has something very tragic going on. And on other hand, the dogs are farting.

One also, Tom Hardy really could have used it more. You know, like he's the one who's really got a fuel issue in this movie. Right, right. He should have started farting in his hand.

When his propeller stops turning and then he has a fart to get it. Right. He just seems like a pan of beans. They're keeping you know.

Yes, yes, yes. It's your correct is very inappropriate. Was the saving private ride by gas like this? Yeah, probably worse.

Probably worse. Probably worse. Yeah, we're reverent jokesters, I would say. Yes.

Yeah. We're reverent jokesters. Right. But I think this like idea of being so fast about how things play out in real time.

Like people trying to fight against time hits like this. Yeah. Bulling point with this movie. But the other thing, you know, I think stops it from just being like a gimmick or Nolan doing it for like the sake of Nolan loving disjointed narratives and all of that is that like if you were to try to construct this movie chronologically, Tom Hardy would only be in the last like 10 minutes.

Sure. Yeah. You know? Yeah.

It just be and I think it also there's just like something horrifying and very uh suspenseful about the moles stuff for the first half of the movie because you know nothing's going to go right. Right. Because you know they're not making it off the beach. Right.

So all of their schemes such as they are such as like let's try and get on the boat with this guy on the stretcher and like let's try and crawl on to you know like you're just like oh god. Like. But that's the point is like if you were doing it in order, most of the movie would be these guys just not getting saved. Uh sure.

Before these rescue missions to come after them started very late in the area. Or you just start on the last day but then there's nothing. Right. But he doesn't allow you to experience just the desperation of these people just waiting there.

Exactly. And like I mean like same as Praverema Ryan you know you heard at the time better and say like oh it really captured the experience of getting off the boat and just walking into chaos. And I read some interview with a veteran about this movie. It better than any got the idea of how miserable and scary it was to have to be died bombed.

Sure. You know just hear that noise for like a while. Now nothing you can do except just like lay on the ground. Right.

And just hope you don't get blown up. Yeah. And it also captures that thing about those those German bombers which was they could pretty much fly vertically. Right.

And and that great shot which is you know which justifies the iMacs on its own. Oh great. Just that head of the noise. Yeah of that head and foreground with that tiny tiny plane in the distance which you can see it's so clearly an iMacs is just so well done.

Yeah. And just so terrifying. It's very frightening. Especially the first time and it's he just makes it like inhumanly loud as it should be.

Right. That's a good point you make which is like we're watching this movie. We know the different timelines going on. So you're like well there's I mean they're not going to get saved now.

Sure. They're going to have to live through this. Because the first thing they do I mean well we should mention okay so like right we talked about the scene where he's running to the mall. Right.

He gets to the mall what does he try to do he pulls a real Griffin Newman. Finds a oh he tries to take a poop. He tries to take a poop. Which is something you don't see in more movies either too.