How Women Tricked Men into Doing All the Work While Still Playing the Victim (Forbidden History)

In this eye-opening Based Camp episode, Malcolm and Simone Collins dismantle one of the biggest historical myths pushed by both feminists and modern “trad” circles: the idea that women historically stayed home doing minimal work while men did everything.Using cross-cultural evidence from hunter-gatherer societies, medieval Europe, Vikings, Spartans, ultra-Orthodox Jews, Islamic traditions, Africa, Latin America, India, China, Japan, and colonial America — plus genetic evidence from modern birds — they reveal the real division of labor: women handled the majority of reliable, grueling calorie production, farming (pre-plow), management, textiles, marketing, and household economy, while men focused on high-risk, high-reward activities like warfare, raiding, politics, and innovation.They introduce the “Sword and Shield” model of relationships and explain how the industrial era, plow, and wage labor flipped traditional dynamics. A must-watch for anyone interested in real history, gender roles, and escaping modern cultural brainwashing.Episode TranscriptSimone Collins: [00:00:00] The researchers say the finding is clear, but the reason behind it is still unknown. On average, men were able to get about one meter, 3.3 feet closer than women before the birds took off. This pattern appeared consistently across Czechia, France, Germany, Poland, and Spain.It also held true across 37 species so Malcolm immediately turns to me and he’s like, “We know exactly why this is the case.”Malcolm Collins: Yes. This is the question that explains everything we’re going to talk about today, and I think proves without a doubt that this is not some malcolm malcolmnipulation of historical facts. You have been in rural Latin America, right?Simone Collins: Yes.Malcolm Collins: Take an image in your head.Simone Collins: Okay.Malcolm Collins: You’re driving down a rural road. You look out the side of a car, okay? You see somebody with a 60 pound jug of something on their head.Simone Collins: Oh, it’s a woman, obviously. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Always a woman.Simone Collins: Always, always a woman. Yes.Malcolm Collins: you go to Africa, you’ll see this as well. You go to-Simone Collins: China too. Let’s be clear. China too. Right.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. ‘Was it majority women doing the [00:01:00] harder labor when you’re-Simone Collins: Yeah,Malcolm Collins: 100%.Yeah. Yeah. D-Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Guys, you do not know how brain cucked you are if, if a woman has convinced you, “ We just need to go back to the traditional way and I’ll stay at home and you do all this stuff.” Because you’re so strong, look at your muscles, could you open this jar for me? All you see as a woman, I could just never do anything.Would you like to know more?Malcolm Collins: Hello, Simone. Today I’m going to talk to you about the most diabolical brainwashing mind trick that feminists and women have ever pulled on males in human society.And it is that I will hear diet in the wool, males who identify as misogynist, red pill, post pickup artists, trads, go out there and say, “Well, we need to go back to the way things used to be, where women didn’t work and stayed in the household [00:02:00] and just cared for kids.” And I see their wives behind their fans with their villainous faces going.Speaker 5: あ。Simone Collins: oh my God.Malcolm Collins: Their villainous laugh. Tucked their husband’s brains and their husbands believe that historically women didn’t work. AndSpeaker 11: We must letMalcolm Collins: misogynist,Speaker 14: think this was his I all right. That heSpeaker 13: came up with.Speaker 14: AllSpeaker 12: right.Speaker 14: NowSpeaker 13: he’s going tofigureSpeaker 12: it out. Don’t do all. Okay. I know what to take.Speaker 11: You don’t know what to do. Yo talk, talk, talk only.Speaker 12: DoyouSpeaker 14: wantSpeaker 12: my own? Yes,Speaker 11: I want youSpeaker 12: to know.Speaker 14: Vula, how is business?Speaker 12: Oh, wow to me.My weak constitution, my weak mind as a woman, I am simply not fit for it.Speaker 12: Business is bad.Speaker 15: What do you know, what’s the matter? What’s happened?She suffers?Speaker 14: She suffers. She has to be at the travel agency alone all dayWell, her kids are all alone at home.Speaker 14: That’sSpeaker 12: [00:03:00] right.Speaker 15: So,Take the kids with you to work.Speaker 15: You’d be with Taki .Speaker 12: That would be good.Speaker 14: That would be no good. No good. No good. No good. Because, um,When a woman has her kids around, she just can’t focus.Speaker 14: And that’s why that no work. No work.Speaker 15: .I have your answer. Yes.I will do all the work for you and you stay home all day with the kids.Speaker 11: Oh, I, I can’t believe that. Wonderful. Wonderful.Malcolm Collins: and I saw this in the comments again recently where like even- OhSimone Collins: really?Malcolm Collins: Guys were like, “Well, women held some roles historically outside the house, but, you know, they weren’t like cobblers and they weren’t like sailors and they weren’t like, you know, stone masons.”And it’s like all of that is true.Simone Collins: Yeah. However,Malcolm Collins: the way that all of those businesses were managed where if a guy [00:04:00] was a stone mason or a cobbler or anything like that, his books and his inventory sourcing and his client sourcinggenerally would have been handled by the woman, but it wasn’t even just that. It was if you actually look at the statistics around female labor in history, women actually did, if you’re talking about hard labor, the labor that fed the family, right? Women actually did the majority of the work over the vast majority of human history.If you go back to let’s say hunter gatherer society, for example, because we’ve been able to study this in a great detail women produced in terms of daily caloric intake between 80 and 60% of the calories that the family ate.Simone Collins: Oh my gosh, really?Malcolm Collins: This is 90 human history.Simone Collins: Well, this, you know, this also makes sense in other things where you see sexual dimorphism.For example, women being much [00:05:00] having much higher endurance and pain tolerance versus men who are better like sprinters.Malcolm Collins: Yeah.Speaker 6: Or to word it another way, the female body and psychology at an evolutionary level are optimized for grueling labor while the male body in mind are optimized for warfare and disposability. Neither are totally optimal, but the idea that women are beautiful flowers designed to sit inside all day caring for childrenFar from any risk of manual labor is probably the greatest feminist psyops of all time and completely a historic.Simone Collins: . And yeah, that just, that, that really, that implies millions of years of higher workloads.Malcolm Collins: And this is actually even true. And, and we’re gonna talk about like why this is the case because note people can be like, “But those just makes no sense.I thought women, because they’re the weaker, they must do this work.” And it’s like, b***h, have you ever seen how lions make this s**t work? The male [00:06:00] lion sits around all day and the females bring in food because that’s the way human society is supposed to work.Simone Collins: Oh God.Malcolm Collins: And if you go back to the most trad iterations of human society, let’s go with the ultra orthodox Jews, okay?In ultra Orthodox Jewish society, do men work? No.Simone Collins: Oh God.Malcolm Collins: Men don’t work. Women work. Men spend all day studying. You actually see this in,Simone Collins: Studying. ...Malcolm Collins: if you go to more primitive iterations of Islamic society, I remember this- Yeah. ... Morocco and are out in the desert.Simone Collins: Okay.Malcolm Collins: And we met you know, a traditionalist Muslim-Simone Collins: Oh, yes.Yes. ...Malcolm Collins: and the men did not work. That was considered, like, very offensive, even the idea that a man would have a job, that is of course the purview of women to have jobs. And you could say, “Well, Malcolm, surely you don’t want us to be like those, those Muslims or those Jews.” And I’m like, “Well, actually, even if you go back to early European [00:07:00] society, most farming through most of human history was done by women.”People are like, “What? I thought men handled farming.” And it’s like, actually, men only moved to handle the majority of farming after one particular invention. Do you know what it was?Simone Collins: The ... Oh, what was it called? The ... I wanna say spinning Jenning because it’s just the first thing that, like, comes to mind.The plow. The plow. Oh, great. Okay. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Okay. In regions where the plow is not used due to soil conditions and stuff like that-Simone Collins: Yeah. ...Malcolm Collins: the majority of farming is typically done by w- women. Huh. In Europe, before the introduction of the plow, which happened a thousand AD. So pretty recently the majority of farming was done by women unless you were, like, having slaves do it or something like that.But even when you were having slaves do it and you had, like, a big estate, the majority of the family’s work was still done by women because Zane managed the family’s household and finances, which we will get to. And so if you’re like, [00:08:00] wait, okay, if women were doing the majority of actual work throughout human history in terms of calorie acquisition, in terms of financial management what were men doing?What was the male role in human history? Why were women okay taking on this role that seems to be, ... Because like imagine, and, and this is why I’m saying that, like, it’s such a cut thing to not know this, is, is that you’re literally going out there when the truth of human history is women boast manage child rearing and manage calorie acquisition, okay?And you’re going out there and saying, “No, no, no. I’ll do the trad thing and just do all of the labor and women can do a quarter of what women ever did historically.” But sorry, I, I just, I cannot I cannot get over because we’re gonna go over to how the, how somehow women psy-opsed men into believing this.We’re gonna go over traditional marriage structures how they developed [00:09:00] that way because I, like, you were aware of this when we were talking about this, but I just think, like, a lot of guys, they have this, like, cargo cult of trad where they have this vision in their head of what a hunter-gatherer society was like.They have this vision in their head of what early medieval life was like and it allows them to define themselves because if they, if they have this idea of, like, this is what men did back then, and this is what women did back then that that means that, well, if they just emulate this role that they believe is a prehistoric role of what a man is, well, well, well, now it’s fed into their identity, like, “I am man, man does X.”Okay, so what did man actually do historically? Like, what was a man’s actual role in a family? The man’s actual role in a family, and I’ve, I’ve talked about this as a way to model your relationships, and increasingly, I’m realizing that when I go out there and I can say, “Here’s an optional way to [00:10:00] model your relationship.”I’ve increasingly realized I need to stop saying that people are too stupid, and then they just model their relationships in stupid ways. The ideal way to model your relationship is in what we call a sword and shield relationship.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: That means the woman is in charge of making sure the daily caloric needs of the family are met and that you don’t lose all your assets.And this is what women mostly did on a historic basis. The man is in charge of moving the family’s status upwards which means that he’s in charge of high risk, high reward opportunities. Obviously, if you’re only familiar with stereotypes in history the two examples of this that are going to come to mind immediately are going to be Viking Society where the women would manage the farms and the men would go a Viking, and the men would go on these raids to try to get lots of treasure to raise the family status, right?Right. Another example would be Spartan [00:11:00] Society- Yes. ... where women would manage the Hellots and they manage the farm and the men would go out and perform their military duties and they’d come back and they might you know, a- a- acquire stuff. You also had this in Roman society where, where men would go outNow, now less so because Roman took from Greek society and Greek society is one of the few societies where women actually almost did no actual work. Just hitSimone Collins: in the back of the house.Malcolm Collins: Yeah, one of the very few societies in human history where women were actually basically just locked inside twenty four seven.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Now, one of the place, if you wanna look into research on this and I think that she actually significantly understates this- Yeah. ... was a Nobel Prize winning research by Claudia Godlin, Oh. ...who showed the U-shaped pattern in female labor which shows basically what we said before is that around, and I think that she actually gets some of her numbers wrong, but she tries to look at historicalSpeaker 9: . Actually, I went back over her actual data and her work is clearly misstated. If you’re only familiar with the little cartoon, she has a female labor, you’d get this impression that [00:12:00] female labor started to die out in like the 1850s and then bottomed out in the 1910s, , and was never really significantly higher than male labor participation.But if you actually look at her data, you can see that this is nowhere near true. Also just a funny side note here. Have you noticed that her most modern woman is wearing a hijab? Just see, just so you know where she wants society going. , But yeah, this, this cartoon that you may have seen of her work doesn’t align with her actual, , data.What the actual data shows, which I think even she is afraidthat men will look at history and realize they shouldn’t be saying, “Hey woman, get in the kitchen and make me a sandwich.” It’s, “Hey woman, get in the field and cultivate me a sandwich.”Malcolm Collins: whatever.But around 1910 is when or let’s say the 1900s is when male wage labor really began to pick up in any society- Wow. ... the idea that a man would leave the household, and this is when things began to fall apart, because remember- You get her atSimone Collins: the end, yes. ...Malcolm Collins: as society developed, right, okay, well, now you’ve got the [00:13:00] plow, now you’ve got specialization, now you don’t have a woman gathering, now you don’t have a woman on the farm, you have a woman managing the books, and the supply chain, and the, the sales, and the managing the storefront, right?Like, the, the classic example I’ll give is, okay, you have a cobbler, or you have a butcher or something like that. So the guy learns the skill. He learns how to cobble, he learns how to make the shoes, he learns how to handle the, the wrapping of it and everything like that, very complicated. And the woman manages what women are disproportionately good at, which is interpersonal skills and bureaucracy.And so she manages the, the, the, you know, sitting behind the counter, taking the money, marketing the product managing sort of guild bureaucratic stuff, managing the, the finances. Basically women did a sort of middle management job. And as males and, and this would be true, like, with whatever the profession was, whether you made, you were a cobbler or whether you were a butcher or something like that, like, why wouldn’t, like, you’ve gotta [00:14:00] understand, men during this period didn’t have this idea of masculinity that you had, right?They, they had an idea of masculinity, but if you went to them or their wives, and you said something like actually, the husband needs to manage all of this other stuff, right? Both the wife and the husband would be like, “But why?” Like, the husband is focused on the specialized skill that he needs to continue to improve so that our family can make money.I, the woman, have free time on my hands, why would I not be managing the things that allow my husband to focus on his specialty skill?Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Right? Like, it would come off as, like, completely insane that the husband would waste time that they could have cobbling or butchering or whatever their actual skill was to manage the shop, to manage the sales process, to [00:15:00] manage theYeah. I just would come across as like, “Are you complete ... Are you just telling me to, like, waste money?” Like, there are kids, like, we’re making this money for our family and our kids because remember, historically, Simone wouldn’t become Simone Collins, she’d become Mrs. Malcolm Collins, right?Simone Collins: Yeah. Like,Malcolm Collins: people really had a combined identity, this idea of the women’s needs versus the man’s needs different-Simone Collins: I wish we could bring that back, by the way, that you had to address someone by, like, their, their combined partner name going forward.Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Well, because you were one entity afterwards. Yeah. It, it did, it didn’t make sense. This idea of males and females having competing needs is a modern concept that was created by the atomization of the family.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: But anyway, so women had these sorts of roles and then men ... And, and keep in mind, these sorts of roles were roles that women were relegated into after all of the domains that women used to specialize in were taken away from them.Yeah. Like in farming, the reason why women stopped being the majority of farming labor after the invention [00:16:00] of the plow is the plow required more brute strengths. Mm-hmm. So men were able to take it over. But also keep in mind in a, in a society historically, if you can be like, okay, but then why would society structure themselves this way?Like, it, why would societies have women be the majority calorie income generators, right? Like what the heck were men doing if women were doing this, right? So if they were not out doing the high risk, high reward thing, wh- why were men doing high risk, high reward, martial adjacent activities? It was because women suck at war, okay?Simone Collins: We’re really not good at it. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: That’s what men were training on. And this also comes to, to hunter gatherer societies. So, in hunter gatherer societies, and, and again, the meno sphere always freaks out about this because they don’t actually read the research. Leftists will say things like, “Well, actually you know, when you look at large studies like Andreessen et al.2723 women hunted in [00:17:00] 79% to 63% of foraging societies.” So this is hunter gatherer societies. And so they’re like, wo- oh, of course, women wouldn’t go on a mammoth hunt. And it’s like, yeah, that’s true. What were women hunting in these societies, okay? Because they weren’t hunting what men were hunting in these societies.Men were hunting things that would prepare them for war, were allegories for war, because you had to defend your territory. This is why the male lion lays us about all day, okay? What women were hunting were things like squirrels and bunnies and mice. They were hunting a completely different type of game.It was-Simone Collins: Low stakes, yeah.Malcolm Collins: Yeah, low stakes, opportunities-Simone Collins: Low risk, low reward. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. But today as a guy, you’re so, like, dichotomous, which is one of the things we try to break people out of on this channel, like, well, there’s hunting and there’s gathering. And the moment you hear, “Oh, when a [00:18:00] leftist says females were participating in 79% of the hunt, like, like that they hunted meat in 79% of hunter-gatherer societies, why would women arbitrarily not hunt bunnies when they saw a bunny, right?Like when they’re foraging. Why would they opportunistically not make little traps for shrews and mice and stuff like that that might be around the, the campsite, right?Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.Malcolm Collins: Why would they, like, just to arbitrarily be like, no, only men can touch meat. That’s a weird way to just sort of cut your society, right?Like, it makes no sense. And when you think about it a little bit, you’re like, oh yeah, that would make sense. A society where they demanded that men be the primary calorie getters, right, and women just stay at home all day. Well, those men don’t have as much time to train for war anymore, right? And if they don’t have as much time to train for war, well, what happens to those men in the long term?They and their way of life get eradicated. [00:19:00] So what about the societies where you don’t see this in a historic context? Like let’s look at ancient Athens, right, which is a actual historic counter example. And we’ll go through other historic examples here, but ... Okay. So Athenian men because they did not have women managing trade and finance and everything like that, they managed it themselves, right?Yeah. But that meant that they didn’t have time to learn how to war. Mm-hmm. So how did Athenian men fight?Simone Collins: Oh my God, this is why we have democracy. This is why?Malcolm Collins: Yes. They fought with the lower caste and essentially slave labor. That is what powered the trireams that maintain the Athenian naval d- h- hegemony.Mm-hmm. Is, is incredibly ... And, and as Simone was joking, this is where we get early votes being widely distributed because, you know, if you have triery members who you know, are otherwise pretty low cast and you could say, well, now you get to vote, right? Well, you get to vote on which high caste person you want to vote.BecauseSimone Collins: no, no vote, no vote until you what.Malcolm Collins: [00:20:00] Yeah. You gotta do it. Vote, no vote. But that’s where that came from, right? Mm. Is that the Athenian male sort of, citizen they, they ... It’s not that they never fought. Like you, you do see Asthenians fight in history but they leaned really hard on the lower caste in a way that other societies like Spartans and Thieves simply didn’t.But to continue here, let’s get, let’s go as ... Again, we’ve already gone over Vikings. I assume people are pretty familiar with a Viking labor division. But let’s look at medieval Europe. 13-Simone Collins: I always crack up though with that ... What was that co- comedic Viking show where, like, there was one woman who would go raiding- Yeah, the rape.Well, I mean, they’re like, well, of course she, like, she, she rapes in pillages and everything, just like all the other ones. And then, like, her husband’s getting increasingly uncomfortable.Speaker: Are you really proud of your wife, at least? I mean Frøya dove into that pillaging, one hundred percent. Even took part in quite a lot of the rapingMalcolm Collins: yeah, sheSimone Collins: just ... Yeah. [00:21:00] I don’t think that happened very much. Yeah. And in terms of, like, female sailors, there was that one famous female pirate who, like, masqueraded as a man and, and, and developed this ingenious way to urinate without showing that she was a woman.But yeah. Tough times.Malcolm Collins: Anyway so, in medieval Europe the farmland was a joint production unit, but tasks were sharply gendered along lines based on physical demand, risk, and compatibility with childcare. Men handled higher risks, drinks, intensive field work, plowing with oxen. So this is after the plow, by the way, is what I’m going over here.Mowing and threshing grain, women focused on lower risk, more reliable tasks that could be multitasked near young children gleaning leftover grain for the harvest clearing weeds, binding sheaves, making hay, collecting wood, and sheep shearing. Harvesting itself was often shared. Women also manage garden, livestock, dairy, poultry, and most crucially dominated textile production spinning and weaving, which form the backbone of both [00:22:00] household needs and export industry.They produce cloth ale cheese and other goods for home use or local sale. So it’s important- It’sSimone Collins: huge. ...Malcolm Collins: if you were a, a farming family, of the stuff you sold, the majority of it was produced by women.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: These are your cheeses. B- people don’t realize how important cheese was as an export product. It was so important that in medieval Scotland, you would pay your taxes and cheese.Like it was just like, this is the easily durable and I could just imagine the king cellar full of cheeses, right? Like-Simone Collins: Yeah. It’s the chocolate of Europe before-Malcolm Collins: Yeah. ...Simone Collins: chocolate.Malcolm Collins: So you, you they, they would produce that, they would produce the cloth, which was also an easy export product. They would produce your textiles, which was an easy export product.Men were not producing these things. And keep in mind, this is post plow. Yeah. This is post women no longer doing the majority of farming-Simone Collins: Yeah, so this is- ... You had artificially depressed.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. This, this [00:23:00] is, this is women at, like, one of their low points in human history, one of their low regions in human history, still doing a great deal of the labor.Totally.This idea, again, do not allow yourself to be cut into this belief that women just did childcare and education. Mm. They did not. They did the majority of what we would today call labor. Men did speculative ventures which is very different from, like, just labor. And note, they were not building the, because people were like, “Well, were they all, they’re building architecture and new houses and stuff like that?I was like, no, because that is more in the category of speculative venture. To do something like that, what do you need to do? You typically need some form of loan, some sort of existing business supply. These are high ... Building a building is a high risk, high reward thing.Simone Collins: Yes.Malcolm Collins: Building a, a wagon historically was [00:24:00] very expensive.That’s a- Oh yeah. ... higher, high reward thing, okay, that requires some level of artisanal expertise. Those were what men did historically. Yeah. But keeping the family alive is what women did historically. And I’ll note here, I repeatedly see families think they’re doing something like new and progressive and converge back on this.They’re like, “Oh yeah, the wife is like the nurse or the you know, the stable job that makes a decent income-Simone Collins: Yeah. ...Malcolm Collins: and then the husband is the entrepreneur.” Yes. This is the, I’d almost say it’s like the normal structure among most of our friends in, in relationships.Simone Collins: Totally, yeah. Yeah. Wife has like a W-2 steady job.Husband does something risky for sure.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. As historian Jane Whittel noted, by the way drawing on coroner roles, women’s accidental deaths were overwhelmingly domestic or village based 61%. Now I would note that what’s really interesting there is you can say, “Oh, that’s huge. Women [00:25:00] only died within the village at 61% of the time.” Now keep in mind what that means, 49% of women were dying outside of the village.Why were women, if women were like these shut-ins during the medieval period, 1300 to 1500- Yeah. And this is from Jane Whittle’s work, why were so many of them outside of the village?Simone Collins: Well, these are the, specifically though they’re accidental deaths, so that’s unusual too.Malcolm Collins: Well, right, but this means you, you know, you’re, you’re, you’re putting yourself at risk when you go outside the village no matter what, right?Sure.Simone Collins: Absolutely. Yeah. You’reMalcolm Collins: doing these sorts of ... I’m, I’m just pointing out that like, this happened. Now let’s, let’s go to urban settings. Oh, and this is where Simone’s spicy information comes into play. Do you wanna go into it? Genetic evidence shocked you.Simone Collins: Gosh, yes. No, no, no. There’s ... I have to, I still have to post about it, but there’s been this, this mystery going around on X recently related to new research came out.Here’s one of the headlines covering it [00:26:00] in Science Tech Daily. Birds in cities fear women more than men. Scientists don’t know why. A small consistent difference in how birds respond to approaching humans, hence at hidden cues shaping animal behavior. An international team of scientists has uncovered an unexpected pattern in how city birds respond to people.Species such as great tits. Why do they have such great bird names? House sparrows and black birds take to flight sooner when approached by women than by men. The researchers say the finding is clear, but the reason behind it is still unknown. This study took place in five European countries and involved male and female participants matched for height and color clothing, walking directly toward birds and parks and other ergman green spaces.By measuring how close a person could get before the bird flew away, the team assessed what is known as flight initiation , distance. On average, men were able to get about one meter, 3.3 feet closer than women before the birds took off. This pattern appeared [00:27:00] consistently across all study locations, including Czechia, France, Germany, Poland, and Spain.It also held true across 37 species from cautious birds like magpies to more tolerant ones such as pigeons. So Malcolm immediately turns to me and he’s like, “We know exactly why this is the case.”Malcolm Collins: Yes. This is the question that explains everything we’re going to talk about today, and I think proves without a doubt that this is not some malcolm hallucination or some malcolmnipulation of historical facts.There is really no other plausible way you could have getten, gotten this, and it’s actually it’s not surprising to me that scientists don’t know this because they’re not historians. Ah. And they don’t study the parts of history that are hidden from people. Mm-hmm. But have you ever walked around an old European city?Simone Collins: Yeah, like Edenville.Malcolm Collins: You have walked around an old European city, like let’s say Edinburgh is where I’ve really noticed this. You will notice the [00:28:00] second or third stories where you have windows, you will have these little nooks,like right next to the window that look like they’re made for a bird to make a nest there.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: And you could say, “That’s really weird.”Simone Collins: Or you think how cute.Malcolm Collins: How cute. They were, they must have been getting eggs from these nests. And it’s no, that’s not what these were used for. What these were used for is the housewife, because remember I said that women hunt small gang-Simone Collins: mm-hmm. ...Malcolm Collins: men hunt, big game.They would build these into the walls of their houses and birds would come and nest in them and they’d come and grab them and they’re young and cook them up and eat them.Simone Collins: It was Pigeon DoorDash.Malcolm Collins: Pigeon doorSimone Collins: edition. Yeah. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: But it likely wasn’t limited to that. It was likely part of all of life back then.Men did not do things during this period like hunt down city birds. Women did. Mm. And what we’re seeing in this is women did cross [00:29:00] culturally across Europe, across locations, across species, and to such an extent that it is existentially baked into the DNA of multiple bird species.Simone Collins: Yeah. So crazy. It’s so cool.Malcolm Collins: Could there not be stronger proof that women were actually a, at a, at a extremely large level, enough level have an evolutionary impact, disproportionately involved with the acquiring of basic proteins for the family when it was not big hunts. And, and keep in mind like how well this fits into our wider categories.So suppose you have like medieval European society or something, and the man is out there doing his artisan, his art- artisan thing, or out there trying to do some sort of a big deal or something like that or building houses and he needs to come home and there needs to be meat on the table, right? The woman is in charge of making sure [00:30:00] that happens.That was the reality of medieval society. Not what you have been told is the reality of medieval society, and we’re seeing it here in the DNA, but you could say, okay, but what about the nobles? Okay. The, the, certainly if we’re talking about like the medieval to early modern 1,100 to 1700s the noble women stayed at home as delicate little flowers and didn’t do any labor and the men did all the labor.It wasn’t surely in that group, the women did the majority of labor labor and the men did the majority of status and crewing activities. So no one’s core roles were high risk high retorn. Unfortunately, that’s just not the case. Specifically what the men did was military service, crusades, tournaments, court intrigue, and warfare to defend and expand lands, gain favor and seize territory.And, and men were often absent from their how ... House, their property and their investment from years at a time. A man going to war [00:31:00] during this period meant being gone for like half a decade. That’s what it, going on a crusade mean that you could be gone for a decade. Women were managing most stuff. And if they weren’t managing it beforehand, like you can be like, oh, well, when the man was home, the man managed most of the things.And it’s like, no, the woman was observient to the man, but the woman still did the majority of the work. It would have been stupid not to do it that way. The woman and the man both know that the man could at any time disappear for a 10 year period. And yet the woman has the man do most of the labor so that he has a teacher in like a, a few days or something or a week or a month before he disappears.Like what are you, that would be so stupid.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Especially when you consider that most activities and tasks the woman would need to know would be highly seasonal. And so the man would not be able to teach them with enough time before they left on military duty. It just doesn’t make any sense.Simone Collins: By the way by, just by the way that they were called dos or ducots, the, the things that caught the pigeons.Malcolm Collins: Ah.Simone Collins: And they were common [00:32:00] enough. They were like, they were so common that sometimes basically like the local agricultural communities would get really angry about them because the, the people in, in cities would actively cultivate like pigeons, you know, they, especially because that was like your, your source of food if things got kind of lean.So you wanted to make sure there were lots of pigeons because then you would have something to eat like when the winter came. But then in the nearby agricultural communities, they would eat the crops. And so there was this, this inherent conflict between manor houses and also urban dwellings that had these ducots in them and the people in, in farmlands because they’re like, “Dude, stop the pests.I hate this. This is really annoying.” Versus like- “This is my dinner.” Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Like, ... Anyway so, what did the women manage in Nor- European nobility? So they managed the day-to-day estate economy. So you’ve got to keep in mind, that’s most of the daily work of a noble- Yeah. ... [00:33:00] is, is managing the estate’s economy.Simone Collins: The servants and the, the stuff and the finances and the management and the food coming and going. And there’s a lot going on.Malcolm Collins: They also oversaw agricultural production of the estate. Men did not do that. That was a woman’s work on an estate. They collected rent and taxes. Oh, you thought the man was the oneNo, that was the woman, because again, the man may have to disappear at any moment.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: They monitored tenants and goods, handling household finances, budgeting, directing servants, handling hiring and firing, ensuring food security. And they also ran when husbands were away defense and legal affairs. Coroners and men-minoral records show women’s work was overwhelmingly internal/stable while man’s was outwardly/risky.” Okay. So, let’s go into things as they shifted, or we can go a bit cross-cultural here.Where do you see ... Well, I already talked about the hoe difference. So basically if you’re doing [00:34:00] hoe or shifting based agriculture the women typically dominate that. And if you’re doing plow-based agriculture, if you’re wondering where plow-based agriculture never really dominated here you’re looking at Sub-Sahara Africa and parts of Southeast Asia and Latin America and in these areas, women still do the majority of labor.Simone Collins: Is thisMalcolm Collins: whySimone Collins: women are called hos?Malcolm Collins: I don’t know, but I’ll, I’ll tell you this. If you’re like, “Come on. “ Women don’t do the majority of hard manual labor in pre-plo societies, and I’m like, “Okay, have you ever been to Latin America?” And people are like, “Yeah, I mean, I, I guess I’ve been a little bit in Latin America.”I’m like, “Did you ever drive in any rural region?” And people are like, “Well, of course, you know, I’ve been out of, I’m a worldly person.” And I’ve been like, okay, so when you looked along the roadside and you saw people carrying 60 pound jugs on their head, which, which gender was doing that?[00:35:00]Simone Collins: Sorry, no, it, it actually is in reference to a hoe. So the, yeah, hose is- Women wereMalcolm Collins: called hose because they-Simone Collins: Some historians note that in early America, free black women doing farm labor were sometimes dehumanized and literally called hose as if they were just tools, which connects the word to racism and slavery as well as sexism.Malcolm Collins: But it also shows that in early freed black society, women did the majority of the farm labor when it was done. Because,Simone Collins: yeah, because they did the work with the hose. Oh my God. Ah, oh my God. Anyway, sorry, carry on.Malcolm Collins: No, but Simone, I’m trying to get you to grock this. You have been in rural Latin America, right?Simone Collins: Yes. Well, mostly- Take it urban.Malcolm Collins: Take an image in your head.Simone Collins: Okay.Malcolm Collins: You’re driving down a rural road. You look out the side of a car, okay? You see somebody with a 60 pound jug of something on their head.Simone Collins: Oh, it’s a woman, obviously. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Always a woman.Simone Collins: Always, always a woman. Yes.Malcolm Collins: Okay.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: People want to say, oh, in these primitive societies, it’s [00:36:00] men who are doing all the manual labor, all of the hard labor, and it’s like, this is factually-Simone Collins: No, all, all the farming exposure people have had, like, in developed countries is post-industrial farming where, like, yeah, I mean, my evoked set of, like, you know, my, my AI generated image in my mind of, you know, farm is like a man on a giant tractor that costs like a million dollars, you know, 500,000 dollars.Malcolm Collins: Yeah.Simone Collins: Obviously-Malcolm Collins: Well, and I think that guys also get it wrong where they’re like, well, men are stronger, therefore that means that they did the more grueling manual labor. When, if you have actually been to many developing countries, what you will see is the most grueling manual labor where pure strength isn’t what’s at play here is predominantly done by women.And again, when we talk about in Latin America, you see them carrying this huge things of water on the head, the huge [00:37:00] things of food on their heads, on the, the giant packs. If it’s not on their head, you’ll see the, like, the, the beleaguered woman who’s like clearly in her early 30s, but like looks like she’s like 55 or something with the giant backpack on going across the little trail or whatever.You go it’s not just Latin America, you go to Africa, you’ll see this as well. You go to-Simone Collins: China too. Let’s be clear. China too. Right.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. ‘Simone Collins: Cause I, I’ve actually spent a lot more time in rural, like countryside China and Japan actually than,Malcolm Collins: Was it majority women doing the harder labor when you’re-Simone Collins: Yeah,Malcolm Collins: 100%.Yeah. Yeah. D-Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Guys, you do not know how brain cucked you are if, if a woman has convinced you, “We just need to go back to the traditional way and I’ll stay at home and you do all this stuff.” Because you’re so strong, look at your muscles, could you open this jar for me? All you see as a woman, I could just never do anything.Meanwhile these very sane guys have been to Latin America, looked out a car and been like, “Huh, it’s weird that women are doing all the [00:38:00] manual labor in this society. I wonder what the, what the men are doing.” Nothing. That, that must be a strange, strange primitive coincidence. We need to go back to this.We need to go back to a world where women raise children and do the labor, just like I’ve structured in my family. People are like ... That is how women ... Because remember how guys are always like, “Women are hypergamist.” Right? And so how does hypergamy really work, right? SomeSimone Collins: kind of crab meeting dance.What was that supposed to be?Malcolm Collins: Well, no, it’s, it’s, it’s men doing the spasm- Oh, okay. ... hypergenous women. And it’s like, okay, so if women are hypergamist, okay, they want a partner who is there better, okay? Mm-hmm. Intellectually in terms of status, in terms of physicality, whatever. Yeah.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Why did that work historically?Because the women did the labor to justify their worth to the genetically [00:39:00] superior male. Mm-hmm. I’m not saying that’s the way our relationship is structured. I’m just saying,Simone Collins: Everyone knows it, Malcolm. It’s fine. They’ve already said it many times.Malcolm Collins: I want the grateful woman who wants to do the labor, who is excited to do the labor and there are a lot of women, like, you guys would be surprised when a woman hooks into a guy who she thinks is hypergamist to her the amount of effort she will put into holding onto that guy.And if you’re just like, “Okay, we’re not playing any games. It’s about labor. You put a 60 pound jug of water on your head, you walk 30 miles a day, go. “ And she’s like, “Simone Collins: Sir, yes, third. Yeah. She’s- Sorry,Malcolm Collins: sorry. Yes.Simone Collins: For real. ThankMalcolm Collins: you. This is the way I wanted to live. Yeah. Easy.Simone Collins: Which is, I think it’s another reason why our culture’s so toxic in that it it would demean any woman for, like, accepting that frame, admitting that to herself.Like, the, the successful framing presented to women is, okay, [00:40:00] well, now, you know, if, if, if you like a man, you need to pretend that nothing he ever does is impressive, that you will never do any work for him ever et cetera, et cetera. That, that any, any work you do is an imposition and basically a crime against your entire gender and society, it’s, it’s really messed up.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So let’s go to a few other societies here so you can see that this is not just a European phenomenon of anythingSimone Collins: European- Are you ... Hose was it. All, all I need was that. My God.Malcolm Collins: Literally named after hose. Okay. So, if you go to West Africa women have long dominated market trading and local commerce in the region giving them significant control of household budgets, credit networks, and economic decision making.In Ghana, market queens, elected female leaders hey- MarketSimone Collins: queens. ...Malcolm Collins: for specific commodities, food, good, textiles, they regulate prices, resolve disputes, organize self-help groups, and wield political economic influence. This includes mediating with authorities and ensuring food [00:41:00] system stability. If you contrast this with men who do home-based farming men often handle the initial land clearing for certain crops while women perform the ongoing, labor-intensive, but lower risk tasks of plowing, weeding, harvesting, and processing, plus the dominant role in marketing the surplus.Men were involved in higher risk external activities like hunting, fishing, and long haul trade or craft production. So keep in mind, again, you’re seeing this here. What do men do? It is higher risk things, higher artisan training things. Women do the lower risk things and the more economically focused things.Simone Collins: Mm.Malcolm Collins: And again, I’m, I’m, I’m saying you need to alter your perception of what is a male and female role in the economy, not saying that you need to take on a women’s role, you just happen to have been wrong about what, what the woman’s role was.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: And I was really surprised because we have a, like, pretty educated fan base and it made me realize that even within [00:42:00] the educated world, how-Simone Collins: Look, they probably knew but forgot because I would just say the CIOP is so in, in far in the other direction.Malcolm Collins: ItSimone Collins: is. It’s just been memory hold. I, I don’t think this is about ignorance. It’s about repeated blunt force of propaganda in the other direction.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. It’s feminists go out there and they’re like, women were vikings and women hunted mammoths. And women ... And so when they hear something like women were involved in, you know, in, in hunting meat and like 70% of hunter-gatherer societies, they just throw it out because they’re like, oh, that must be biased scientist nonsense, right?Mm-hmm. And then they read the fine print and it was mice and rabbits and squirrels. It’s like, oh, that makes sense. Right? Like the basic kind of meats that would be easier to get on a daily basis to resure that the nutrition that they needed. Yeah. And it’s like, and this is how hypergamy worked traditionally.And it’s like, oh, that’s why a man would choose a lesser woman.Simone Collins: Uh-huh.Malcolm Collins: Because she was walking to and from with a 60 pound goord [00:43:00] on her head. You know, like-Simone Collins: Yeah. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Okay. Let’s go to India.Simone Collins: Okay.Malcolm Collins: So, men, again, handled plowing, irrigation and market sales. So this is one where women handled more market stuff.Women perform lower variants work like sewing, transplanting, weeding, harvesting, gleaning, post-harvest processing plus livestock, kitchen gardens, and household budgeting. They contributed to 70% of agricultural labor in many regions. So again, they’re still doing the majority of agricultural-Simone Collins: These are alsoKeep in mind, like, on our episode on divisions of labor and household and what women report enjoying more, these are things that women still. In, in, in surveys, these are the types of activities women enjoy. These are also more bureaucratic activities, more routine activities, very predictable activities.And you see this also in, like, the lower rates of female entrepreneurship. Women, on average, are just, they, we don’t like the high risk, high reward. It’s very stressful. Like, I know you, you’re constantly trying to loop me [00:44:00] into, like, your VC stuff and it freaks me out and you’re constantly frustrated with the fact that I’m like, “Oh.”Malcolm Collins: Yeah, you don’t fully check the product beforehand. You don’t fully, you know, you’re just like, “I’m gonna do the performative minimum when it comes to high risk, high reward.”Simone Collins: Yeah, because they, I find it extremely stressful and aversive versus like the routine stuff which would literally drive you to madness or if, if not some ambulance.You, you, you know, I, I can do that and be very happy with it.Malcolm Collins: By the way for the people who wanna use a super search feature, feature on our fab, it can be used on things like episode because everyone of the models that runs on it has the capability of searching the internet.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: So you could put something like the URL of this episode in and be like, is this accurate?What’s accurate? What’s not accurate? SoSimone Collins: cool. It’s really well done. It’s really well done.Malcolm Collins: And not just that. I mean, I do encourage you. If you are listening to this and you’re like, “I just do not believe this. I think this is urban monoculture. I think that this is seriously put it into an AI or something, right?Like I do that before any episode [00:45:00] goes live just to look for errors that may be in the episode.”Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Because I take it- That’s soSimone Collins: cool. ...Malcolm Collins: very seriously that I’m getting you guys factually accurate information.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: And it is yeah, important that we actually make a society that works instead of relying on some weird cargo cult of the past, right?Simone Collins: Yeah. Yes.Malcolm Collins: Never exists. So what about the Indian elites? Elite men pursued military conquests, court politics, and imperial administration. Again, all high risk, high rewards. Whereas rural women in the Zinna secluded women’s orders exercised real economic and managerial authority, administering large Jaguar estates, revenue land, controlling finances and salaries patrigene networks, trade, and even intelligent/diplomacy.Figures like Noor Haran and Harm Begin managed commercial enterprises and household governance as a parallel administrative node. The Zena had its own female officers, Dragas, Twitters, and something accounts that operated as an economic [00:46:00] hub. So again, you see the exact same pattern. This is not just like one culture.If we’re gonna go to Asia here if you’re talking about the Imperial Confucian China, men operated the outer sphere, scholar official examples. So this was like intense high stake competition for status and wealth, bureaucracy, warn and trade, trade. This is one of the few areas where men really dominated the bureaucracy and this is because it was an imperial bureaucracy and then highly institutionalized.Failure meant a loss of prestige plus lower elevation of the family. Women were confined to the quote unquote inner sphere managing household finances, education of the children, silk production, food processing, and daily budgeting. Confucian texts such as record of rituals explicitly divided the rules.Men, external public, women, internal domestic. So I, I think that this is really cool here where you can see, even if you’re talking about these incredibly, like Confucianism is considered very sexist and it’s still like, yeah, well, women manage the household of course, right? Like,Simone Collins: Duh. [00:47:00] Yeah.Malcolm Collins: If you go to feudal edo Japan men samuraize the warfare class, did duals, loyalty, lords, political maneuvering whereas women, again, govern the household, financial management, budgeting and even gave their husband’s allowances, which we see in the historical record.They did child education, silicotton production and protected family honor, though, though less so. They learned reading, writing, local administration, et cetera. And wives often, like in Europe, ran the estate during the male absence. Now, if your wife has been running your estate during your absence, not only again, do you need to prep her for doing this, but you can be like, “Okay, but after the men came back and they knew the wives could do it, didn’t they take over again?”And it’s like, no, because they were the dominant member of the household. And if you’re the dominant member of the household and the other person can do something competently, you don’t just take the work back. I’m, I, I’m sorry if that paint’s been in a bad light, but that is the reality of actually being a dominant member within a household.[00:48:00] So let’s go to colonial America, all right? Because people can be like, “Well, this isn’t the American tradition, is it? “ It, men focused, again, on high risk work. They did clearing land which we have a lot of stuff from. And they did some hunting so a, a lot of politicking. Like men were really focused on like- Let’s think aboutSimone Collins: like John and Abigail Adams, the classic American power couple.Yeah.Malcolm Collins: We have really good, if, if you’re not familiar with John and Abigail Adams, Abigail managed all of the investment, all of the estates, all of the hiring and firing, all of the everything. And John went to do the historically important stuff- mm-hmm. ... of setting up the American nation.Simone Collins: And this also was the Washington too.Yeah. I mean, this is like, this was the format. It was the format.Malcolm Collins: It was the format. Women made sure that the man had their allowance and the man made sure that the woman’s name would be mentioned in history, okay? That is the difference between the two roles. That is the way Simone and I structure our relationship, and this [00:49:00] is the way INow I’m just gonna straight out and say it is the better way to structure a relationship. Now that I see how ubiquitous it is throughout history, and that any other mechanism for structuring relationships has largely been experimental and short term like male wage labor for a female who sits at home all day.And, and mind you, even at the height of that particular experiment, like the 50s, all of the women were out of their mind on drugs and going crazy, right? Like the, it wasn’t working, okay? It may have had some like veneer of working in like Hollywood, but the reality- Oh,Simone Collins: if it worked, we, we wouldn’t have needed all those benzos.No, for sure it wasn’t working. It was not working.Malcolm Collins: These people were coked out of their mind. They were benzoed out of their mind. They barely had any idea what was happening because you cannot take a smart, intelligent person and say, “Here, stay at home, do nothing all day,” right? Like that’s you up. Okay.What about women? Women did well, we don’t even need to go into it. You’ve basically gone over Martha Washington, Abigail Adams. I, I [00:50:00] hope most Americans are fairly aware of those stories and what those women did. And, and they were not considered exceptional for their period. Nobody was like, “Oh, Abigail Adams, what like a weird lesbian she is for managing the estate or something, right?”Simone Collins: Cottage core lesbian Abigail Adams with all the children somehow, but whatever.Malcolm Collins: Again, if you go to the backwoods, you go to the frontier lifestyles I mean, I’m sure everybody is aware how much labor the women did in the frontier America, right? Like are, are you not? Like, do you not know that women basically managed everything except protecting the property and plowing and clearing fields?So like I assume ... It’s like people are aware of this. They just don’t reflect on it, I guess. I’m a little like, like-Simone Collins: It just, it goes, it runs so contrary to the popular narratives, I guess. Like I think it’s I don’t know. I don’t know. And here’s the, the funny thing too-Malcolm Collins: When you think of milk.Simone Collins: It’s also that there was noMalcolm Collins: who-Simone Collins: There was no-Malcolm Collins: Cleared the land.Simone Collins: There was no nar- [00:51:00] there was no feminist argument against this weirdly, right? When women complained about things, and you did an, even a very, you know, unflattering to women episode on women who hated men who were early feminist activists- Yeah. ... this was not a complaint. They were not like, “Man, I’m so angry about the fact that I had to do all this work and that I have to do all this work.”No, but it was like, it just comes naturally to women. Women are workhorses.Malcolm Collins: Because you want the family to get to staySimone Collins: alive,Malcolm Collins: right?Simone Collins: The, that’s, I think that’s another reason why this just doesn’t come up is that there’s no, there was never really a narrative to it and that now the narrative is just so heavily on like any work that women do is considered so unforgivable that the, the mere, like the fact that we have this concept of the mental load, that like, I have to think about things, this is horrible.Like, I, I don’t know. Yeah. And I alsoMalcolm Collins: think it’s because men look at history and they’re aware. So if we look at like colonial period, it’s like, okay, what did women do? Okay, so women did cooking, baking, [00:52:00] preserving, which was very important in terms of like exporting long-term family life, et cetera, soap and candle making, clothing making, child brewing, but we’re putting that aside because most people are aware of that.Gardening and livestock, weeding, harvesting, milking, cheese making and curing and often preparing of pelts. So, you know, you hear about those things and you’re like, okay, but how hard is like every one of those individual ... Do you know how hard, like just milking and cheese making is? It is brutal.Do you know how hard weeding is when you are manually weeding not a garden? I don’t know how many men have weeded a garden which is brutal. Weeding an entire field to feed a family. Okay, we are talking about extremely serious amounts of labor here and, and backbreaking labor, brutal labor. Okay. [00:53:00] Let’s keep going here.Then people are like, okay, but by the time the industrial revolution happened, 1790s to 1910s and here we’re talking about like proto-wage labor, surely women stopped working. And the answer is no. Actually, in the early days of industrialization, we still had women working really heavily. In fact, we have entire like towns that were like female labor camps basically especially women who didn’t want to get married.They worked really heavily. But here’s where you’re beginning to have married men begin to care for women at the beginning of industrialization. But this is a modern phenomenon and a phenomenon that never really worked and culminated with drugged out women barely coherent, okay? Women want to be turned into workhorses.They want to be labored and I’m just [00:54:00] encouraging us to break this particular myth that somehow misogynists have adopted and like, let’s go back to it and be like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. A woman’s job is in the field, it’s in the barn, it’s not just in the kitchen, it’s, it’s the children, it’s the education, and it’s most other things as well.And you- Yeah,Simone Collins: but, but very clearly it’s, it’s predictable, routine, repetitive-Malcolm Collins: Yes. ...Simone Collins: at home labor which, you know, you make it sound so horrible, you, you’re, on the flip side of it, it’s this very, you know, cottage core, cozy, hobbit-like romantic life that I think a lot of people crave, you know, and wish, you know, they, they want to retire to that.That, that is the dream.Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, we can go back to this insofar as we have work from home again. If you look at our structured relationship, what does Simone do? She does [00:55:00] emails, she does taxes, she does the bureaucratic sort of low risk work of managing employees, managing hiring and firing she manages clients, she manages all of that stuff.What do I do? I manage building new things, right? I manage building out our fab. I manage building out, like, the new features like Supersearch. I’ve got to work on the card game, which apparently was having some bugs. I work on our vibe coding platform, which you can use with the agents on the website. I, I do our, you know, I’m not safe for work chat bot stuff on ourfab.ai.Like wherever there is work in terms of building stuff, that is where I am, where there is work in terms of maintaining stuff, that is where Simone is. Our relationship could not be more radically traditional if you tried.Which is, I think, really interesting, and it’s something that we should emphasize more in interviews, actually, now that I think about it.Simone Collins: Yeah, it was, it was never something we planned to be fair. It’s [00:56:00] just kind of how things shook out.Malcolm Collins: It’s the natural roles of males and females. Yeah. And if you operateSimone Collins: without- It’s veryYeah, we, because we heavily believe in leaning into our aptitudes and lower token cost. Like, the way we sometimes describe it is like, look, you know, Malcolm could make dinner, but it would cost him 58 tokens and it cost me seven. So I’m gonna make dinner. I could plausibly, you know, build some new startup, but it would cost me 8,000 tokens and it costs him like, you know, 300.So let’s go. Like it, it just, it’s, it’s so obvious over time.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Well, I hope that this breaks the biggest myth that women still weave over the minds of men in our society.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: That it’s, it’s, it’s, oh it’s, it’s very much, oh, don’t throw me into the Briar Pratch. Oh, whatever you do, don’t make me stay at home and do nothing but childcare and education.Oh, [00:57:00] whatever you do, Briar Fox, whatever you do, do not throw me into that Briar patch. For, for people who do not know, this is from the story of Brower Rabbit and Briar Fox and- That’sSimone Collins: one of the jacktales, right?Malcolm Collins: No, was actually an adaptation of an African story, but it’s clearly was adopted to a jacktail format- Ah.because in the Briar Rabbit story, sorry, this is a completely different tangent here, anthropology tangent. Briar Rabbit appears much more like Jack than he appears in the African versions. Oh. In the African versions, he is a trickster God with magical powers. Oh. Where what typically separates Jack from any other figure like him is that he has no magical powers.He is not a God, he just outwits his opponents. And that’s what Briar Rabbit does. Interesting. So he appears much more like a jacktails figure. Mm. And this would’ve been during the period where the slave culture would’ve collided with the backwards culture, so I think that that’s where they picked it up from.Simone Collins: Nice.Malcolm Collins: But basically he’s saying, “Whatever you do, don’t throw me into the briar patch because he’s at home with the briar patch. That’s where he’s safest is in the briar [00:58:00] patch.” That’s the easiest thing for him. But anyway, love you, Simone.Simone Collins: Love you too.Malcolm Collins: Go downstairs and cook me some of those fricking mushrooms that you harvested-Simone Collins: Golden oyster mushrooms.Malcolm Collins: Yeah. And then serve it to me because that is-Simone Collins: That’s my job. ...Malcolm Collins: weird, kinky job you have as a wife, right?Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Love you.Simone Collins: I love you too. You’re the best.Malcolm Collins: Oh how? I’m so mean. I’m so demanding.Simone Collins: No, man. We all, we all asked for this. That’s the, that’s the thing. That’s the thing. And I love it. And I loveMalcolm Collins: you. I love you too.Simone Collins: See you soon.Malcolm Collins: Yes. Okay, so how are you gonna cook these mushrooms you found for me in the woods?Simone Collins: I thought of the, of the ways I’ve seen them prepared that doing a cross section cut and then making mushroom steaks looked the most promising. Because then you could cut little slices of it. Like it’s basically like a slice of it.You know, people make cauliflower steaks by like thinlyMalcolm Collins: cutting- Right, [00:59:00] but is that gonna, is that gonna pair well with a actual steak?Simone Collins: Yeah, because you’re still just cutting small like bites of it.Malcolm Collins: Are you gonna be able to cook them together?Simone Collins: That’s not my plan. Because I think that the temperature at which I would need to cook the, I mean that I’m cooking the steak at you, you make a super, super, super hot cast iron skillet for s- for, for pan seared steak and then for this, you don’t wanna like burn it.You just wanna cook it through. So what I plan on doing is maybe using some of the drippings from the steak for the-Malcolm Collins: That sounds really good, yeah.Simone Collins: Yeah. ‘Cause I, I like to render it in its own fat, but I’ll do that with an additional butter and then we’ll use that butter for the, the mushrooms while the steak sits, because it’s supposed to sit for 10 minutes to do whatever it does.I don’t know what it does. Settles. I don’t know. I, I always, I treat all food like it’s a souffle and it’s about to deflate if I don’t eat it immediately after preparing. So I get super nervous. This idea of letting steak [01:00:00] rest. Anyway, let’s go.Malcolm Collins: All right.Speaker 7: Okay, what are you looking at, buddy? I’m looking at these baby chicks. Oh, do you like baby chicks? Yeah. Are they your friends? What are their names? Oh, this one’s name is,um, I can get up, smell.This one right here is my favorite one. He’s so adorable. What is he called? He’s called cutish. Cutish? Yes. It’s a good name, buddy. Yeah, he’s my favorite, he’s my favorite because he’s orange look. You’re gonna wash your hands afterwards, right? Yeah. Here, you want me to give you kids? Yeah. I love you. I do. I This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit basedcamppodcast.substack.com/subscribe