Meet the Press NOW — March 27

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Conditions apply. Offer includes 1% loyalty rate reduction for qualifying customers. Visit Hyundai Canada.com or your local dealer for details. If it's Monday, breaking news, tragedy in Nashville where three children and three adults are dead after a 28-year-old woman opened fire inside an elementary school before being fatally shot by police.

Plus former President Trump rallies his supporters with doomsday rhetoric and repeated attacks against them in Hatton, DA, as a grand jury hears new witness testimony and weighs criminal charges. And Israel's Prime Minister backtracks announcing a delay in his party's plan to overhaul the country's judicial system amid widespread protests and historic work stoppages that shut down everything from the airport to the McDonald's. Welcome to Meet the Press Now. I'm Kristen Welker.

We begin with devastating and breaking news out of Nashville where three children and three adults are dead after a shooter opened fire this morning at a private religious elementary school. Authorities say they have identified the shooter as a 28-year-old white woman from the Nashville area. She appears to have once attended the school. Police say she gained access through a side entrance armed with two assault-style rifles and a handgun.

Here's how authorities describe the police response to this deadly incident. The police department response was swift. Officers entered the first story of the school, began clearing it. They heard shots coming from the second level.

They immediately went to the gunfire. When the officers got to the second level, they saw a shooter, a female, who was firing. The officers engaged her. She was fatally shot by responding police officers.

A police official says there is video from inside the school that they are analyzing to learn how all of this happened. We expect another briefing from authorities, potentially this hour, and we will bring you that when it happens. According to the Gun Violence Archive, this is the 129th mass shooting in America in 2023. And I want to remind you, we're not through the third month of this year.

So that's 129 mass shootings in 86 days. President Biden addressed the shooting just moments ago, calling it sick and heartbreaking while repeating his call for gun reform legislation in Congress. We have to do more and stop gun violence. It's ripping our communities apart.

Ripping our communities apart. Ripping the soul of this nation. Ripping is a very soul of this nation. And we have to do more to protect our schools, so they aren't turned into prisons.

So I call on Congress again to pass my salt weapons ban. It's about time that we begin to make some more progress. Joining me now on set is NBC News Justice and Intelligence correspondent, Ken Delaney. Also with us is NBC law enforcement analyst, Jim Kavanaugh.

He's a former special agent in charge of the Bureau of Alcohol and Tobacco and Firearms, and a longtime Nashville resident. And NBC's Monica Alba is outside the White House. She's been covering the story all day. Ken, I want to start with you.

We got that briefing from law enforcement officials in Nashville. What have we learned? What were your key takeaways? So a number of things.

One, the police response was extraordinarily fast here. 14 minutes from the time they said the first 911 call came in to the time they killed the shooter. Five officers entering that school going up to the second floor and engaging the shooter. We're also getting reports that some children evacuated that school on their own would suggest there was some kind of active shooter training and that they were employing the technique that the FBI recommends, which is run, hide, fight.

That's the shorthand. It's kind of sad that we have to talk in these terms about school children. They've identified the suspect or the shooter as a 28 year old female. They said who may have attended that school, but very little else is known about a possible motive or identity of this person at this moment.

Those are the basics. Jim, let me turn to you and Ken lays out all of the reasons why this is so horrifying and so tragic. You are a Nashville resident, as we have said. You are familiar with this school, familiar with this area.

What can you tell us about this part of the community? Well, I used to live a block from that place. My daughter was married in that church that's attached to the school. I know it well.

We've been around it many years. I was an agent here. I was a special agent in charge here for eight years. Our office is just down the street.

I'm 15 minutes from the school. I know the area intrinsically. It's wealthy, leafy, a lot of music stars live in the area of people in the music business. It's a very upscale, very nice.

There's an upscale mall. The neighborhood is known as Green Hills. You wouldn't know the schools even there, driving by on the main road. I mean, it's just sort of tucked back.

I mean, you can find the sign if you were looking. But of course, it makes sense that the killer knew, attended the school before and of course, knew where it was and targeted it. And if we just build on Ken's reporting, you know, the 14 minutes, Metro Police, this is where a lot of their beats converge right there on the intersection in Green Hills. So they're coming from, you know, all five points around there on the main road.

They get there pretty quick, but they have to jump in, you know, get their tactical rifles out of the trunk, they throw their vest on, they go in to engage. I will analyze and say, Kristen, I bet that the killer met some locked doors inside, or we wouldn't have a lot more carnage. It's because we, I'm sure that she tried to get in some classrooms or some offices and was not able to get in. So she probably met some locked doors.

She could have shot through glass windows or doors, but it's harder to shoot through wooden doors. And then she confronts the Metro National Police and two of the five officers kill her. You know, it's a horrible case and it's rare as a woman shooter, but it's just part of American life now. Let me follow up with you on that point.

It is incredibly rare for there to be a female mass shooter. What do you make of that? And what do you glean from the fact that she may have attended this school? Well, there's something running through her mind.

I mean, I think that we may find some suicide in here because a lot of things we don't think about, we talk about mental health, but that is, you know, plays a small part of mass shootings, a very small percentage. Mental health problems, but suicide is a much higher percentage of people involved in suicide. And so they put on top of their suicide, homicidal rage, and they go back at the people that they want to take their rage out on, sometimes it's a workplace, violence, revenge, et cetera. This place is a school.

Now, there may be more to her story at the school that she feel was treated there. Was she sexually assaulted when she was young? Was she abused? Was she fired?

Would they not hire as a teacher? Would she let go? We don't know the story. But there's going to be something in her life and something maybe just in her mind completely and the school had nothing to do with it, that she wants to hold this grudge or this place at the school.

And then there's also sometimes Kristen, you know, a little desire for infamy. And that runs through a lot of these things too. They want to be infamous. And this is a way to cause a lot of pain to a community by killing little children.

And it's different than even just any mass shooting. Killing little children is way different in the human psyche in the human mind. And we all talk about Newtown, and I know you've covered it, and I talk for hours on it. And it's just different.

It's just different part of the mind that wants to do that to little children. So it's very deep, emotional, dastardly crime to go in there and kill little bitty, you know, school children that are K-6. So we're going to get a picture of her mind. It's not going to be a pretty thing, I'm afraid.

And Jim, I think everyone feels like, you know, their hearts have been ripped out for the parents who are going through this. And as you say, we do not yet know what the motive is. Ken, it's interesting because officials said that there is a video that they want to review. What do you know about the video?

What could we potentially learn there? Nothing more than what they said at the news conference, Kristen, don't know anything about the video. But obviously it could be incredibly informative in terms of the movements of the shooter, how she got in. They were saying a side door, was it locked?

How teachers and students responded? Do we all remember those horrific, you've all the videos, which actually told us a lot as horrible as they were to watch? But just to reinforce, it's so incredibly rare to see a female mass shooter, in this kind of active shooter situation, even more rare. In fact, I...

You've been covering this horrific tragedy from that perspective throughout the day. Press Secretary of Green John Pierre had some pretty strong words at the briefing. I want to play some of what she said and then get your reaction on the other side. In his State of the Union, the President called in Congress to do something, to stop the epidemic of gun violence, tearing families apart, tearing communities apart.

How many more children have to be murdered before Republicans in Congress will step up and act to pass the assault weapons ban? To close loopholes in our background check system. Or to require the safe storage of guns. We need to do something.

Monica, talk about the thinking behind reiterating that call for action today, and what we heard from the President. He spoke to this as well. Absolutely a strong call to action here, Kristen. But you know, as well as I do, that the political reality of whether Congress can step in here and do what this White House is asking for, which is to pass an assault weapons ban is very much highly unlikely at this point, particularly in divided government.

So we heard from both the First Lady and the President today offering their concerns, their condolences, of course, to these families who have lost their loved ones. The First Lady was a very powerful and evocative word saying, our children in this country do not deserve this. And the President, as he has so many times in the last couple of years, he talked about the fact that he is constantly visiting the sites of these mass shootings, of these tragedies. And just a couple of weeks ago, he was in Monterey Park, California to talk about some of the things he's been able to do through executive action.

So by acting on his own with a stroke of a pen, he's been able to add a little bit to background checks, to safer gun storage areas. But frankly, the President has said many times he needs to see more done, he says, in order to reduce this specific kind of gun violence. So the President, again, called lawmakers to act, he called this tragedy sick and heartbreaking. And he has also asked his cabinet to come up with a kind of federal government response, like we see FEMA going in after natural disasters and doing what they do so well.

He wants other kinds of agencies to be able to go in and offer mental health support, grief support to these communities in the days and weeks after the law enforcement investigation takes center stage. And so that's something else that this White House is currently working on, Kristen. Monica, I'll be powering through those loud sirens behind you, Monica, great reporting. Jim, with our remaining time here that we had, you hear Monica talk about the actions that the White House is calling for.

But I ticked through the fact that 129 mass shootings in the U.S. already this year alone. I mean, you know the laws in Nashville. Would any of the laws that are being proposed, it's too early to know yet if they would have made a difference?

But the thinking behind why this keeps happening? Well, because we don't take the action on the knowledge we've gleaned from all the mass shooters. Let's take these 129 shooters, Kristen. The FBI tells us with their report, 77% of them leak.

So 77% of these 129 shooters are the norm. Then 77% out of the 100 leaked and 77% of 29, we can do the math here, leaked. So that's what, close to 90 something of the shooters out of 129 leaked. We should be able to stop the leakers because they're telling us what they want to do.

But we're not acting on it. We're not acting on that. So we need the laws to stop that instead of talking about things that aren't really going to stop it. I mean, for anything you can do to stop it.

But why not target the people that are leaking that are saying they're going to commit these crimes? And we just say, oh, well, the guy said he was going to commit the crime. Well, nobody told her. We took him to mental health.

And he said he was just joking. And oh, that's our fault. That's America's collective fault for not holding our elected leaders to the fire, voting for the people who give us those laws that have nothing to do with lawful gun ownership or the second amendment when you target people that are talking about committing mass killing. So I don't see the logic.

I don't see why our legislators and our leaders are pressing for those things. I would like to see, I think we can do better on those gun laws. They are effective in stopping a lot of killings. I spent my life doing it.

We stopped many, many of them. And effective gun laws can stop more. Just target the mass shooters with the law. And you'll see some effect.

I think that's the answer. Ken, final point to you. Where does the investigation go from here at this point? Well, they are pouring through this aspect.

So the shooter's social media accounts interviewing friends and relatives trying to divine a motive here and trying to figure out whether there are any missignals. That's really important. And often, as Jim has been saying in these cases, there were people who knew things who didn't say. All right.

Well, here we are again having yet another unbearable tragic conversation about a mass shooting in America. Ken Delaney and Jim Kavanaugh, Monica Alba from the White House. Thank you all for starting us off. We will continue to follow this story.

And if authorities do hold another press conference, we will, of course, bring that to you live. Coming up, we turn to presidential politics and new developments in the Trump-Hushmani probe as the Manhattan Grand Jury reconvenes today to wait criminal charges against the former president. We'll have the very latest next. Plus, divisions and instability in Israel.

Prime Minister Netanyahu now says he's pausing his government's widely criticized judicial overhaul amid protests. You're watching Meet the Press Now. It's here. The fort is a big deal.

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The Grand Jury in Manhattan heard testimony from another witness today as it weighs criminal charges against former president Trump for Hushmani payments he made to an adult film star in 2016. NBC News can confirm David Packer, former CEO of American Media and publisher of the National Inquirer Testified. It would be his second time testifying as part of the investigation. It's not clear whether Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg is any closer to an indictment, but the former president once again lashed out at D.A.

Bragg this weekend during his first major 2024 campaign rally in Waco, Texas. Mr. Trump took on his perceived political and legal enemies falsely claiming the D.A.'s case had been dropped and vowing to destroy this so-called deep state. And what he told his supporters was their final battle.

This is really prosecutorial misconduct. That's what it's called. The use of people makes no difference whatsoever. To these radical left maniacs, prosecutorial misconduct is their new tool and they're willing to use it at levels never seen before in our country.

We must stop them and we must not allow them. Well, before beginning his remarks, the former president stood with his hand on his hardest images of January 6th played on the monitor while a song sung by a group of January 6th defendants called Justice for All played in the background. In the last 24 hours, the former president has continued his attacks accusing Democrats of using prosecutors to cheat and calling the investigations into his conduct election interference. NBC's Garrett Hake joins me now from New York and also with me as NBC's Juan Hilliard near Mar-Lago, he was with former president Trump in Waco, Texas on Saturday night and flew back to Florida with Trump.

Juan, let me start with you. You spoke to former president Trump this weekend. What did he tell you? You asked him about these attacks.

Right. I think this is the important context to all of this here is the political one because when you're talking about Donald Trump, what is directly running perpendicular to these legal proceedings is the fact that he is well ahead in national polling to win the GOP nomination for president again. And what you saw last week was him on social media suggests that if he were to be indicted, there would be, quote, potential death and destruction and he'd suggested that there would be no evidence of turmoil, chaos and hatred. And then you said it, him standing on stage, his hand on his heart, win images, footage from the January 6th insurrection, play on big screens behind him, I thought it was important to put the question to him, take a listen.

The other day you put out that there could be potentially death and destruction if you were to be indicted. Today, up on the rally stage, you had a video of the January 6th playing behind you. My question to you, would potentially violence be justifiable? Was January 6th?

Well, I will say this. No, I don't like violence and I'm not, not for violence at all, but a lot of people are upset. And, you know, they rigged an election, they stole an election, they smiled at my campaign. They did many bad things.

They did a fake dossier. No one was bad news. That's the word he's seen this going over here. I have no idea what's going to happen, but I can tell you that they have no case.

So I think the case is, I think they've already dropped the case. So, Vaughn, I just want to see this. Of course, that is not reality. Go ahead, go ahead.

No, I was going to say obviously the reality, this is coming from a man who predicted he was going to be arrested last Tuesday, that did not happen. And of course, this case is not done because we know that now a new witness has come forward here just today to go before that very grand jury that is hearing this particular case in Manhattan. And we are going to go to Garrett in just one moment, but I want to be clear about what we just heard from former President Trump that highlights for you of what he said. He said, I don't like violence, but people are very upset.

And then he also suggested that the district attorney has no case. Were those your key takeaways? What else did you hear, Vaughn? I also ask some questions, Kristen, about Michael Cohen, because there are a lot of questions that Donald Trump has frankly not answered about this very probe into him.

And at alleged 2016, Ashmani payment to Stormy Daniels. Donald Trump had the opportunity to go testify before this grand jury. He chose not to. And there is a discrepancy between Donald Trump's story and Michael Cohen's story.

Michael Cohen says he was directed by Donald Trump to pay this $130,000 to Stormy Daniels. And the SD and Y federal prosecutors and their sentencing memo of Michael Cohen said Donald Trump or individual one directed that payment. Donald Trump denies that. But what we have never gotten a denial from Donald Trump on was exactly when he did become aware of this arrangement and his personal checks going to Stormy Daniels because he wrote, his personal checks to Michael Cohen to reimburse him as late as December of 2017.

Did Donald Trump know about the Stormy Daniels arrangement at some point? Well, he was still compensating Michael Cohen because if so, then that would suggest that, if in fact, Alvin Bragg is looking to press charges related to election law violation. On that basis, it would suggest that Donald Trump was pretty to that, and he was aware of this alleged crime. And what he would not answer to me was that question of exactly when he became aware of the Stormy Daniels arrangement.

I think that that is something that prosecutors could potentially even look at themselves. And undoubtedly, one of the things they're probably looking at in the grand jury where Garrett is. So Garrett, we know that David Packer testified today. We have now confirmed that.

Tell us what you know about today's witness and what unfolded in the building behind you. Yeah, this case clearly very much not dropped, Kristen, a grand jury back in session today. Hearing from David Packer for a second time, which is very interesting, Packer was the head of AMI, the parent company of the National Enquirer and Services publisher. He's a key figure in all this because it was he who, along with Michael Cohen, came up with what amounted to this catch-and-kill plan to buy both the stories of Stormy Daniels, which Cohen ultimately completed and Karen McDougal, a model who made similar claims.

It was AMI's money, National Enquirer's money that ultimately paid for her silence. The fact that he was back testifying today suggested somewhere along the line, some other witness either raised questions about his earlier testimony or that perhaps some element of his testimony is newly relevant or more relevant to the case that prosecutors are trying to put together. I'm not a lawyer. I can only speculate based on what we know about this case.

But remember, the idea here is to make this case into a felony. You need two charges, essentially. You need this idea of falsification of business records to serve some other purpose, some other criminal purpose. So could something with the McDougal payments, could something in the way that Cohen and Packer structured their dealings be that second charge?

We just don't know. But the fact that this late in the process, it's David Packer, not any other witness who's coming back after Mr. Trump's own witness came to serve as a defense witness last week, is surely relevant and will be more relevant. I suspect when we see how this investigation concludes, either with a matter being dismissed or within indictment, if and when this grand jury is asked to vote.

Very quickly, Garrett. Any idea on timing? You've been standing out there for a long time. I'm looking at my watch now, Chris.

And there's 34 minutes left till five o'clock, which is when this office typically closes for the day. So I can tell you it's still theoretically possible. We could see a vote as early as today. If I were a betting person, I'd say more likely later than that, perhaps later this week.

But this is the challenge with a secret proceeding like this. They can move quickly if they decide to have that vote. And we won't know when they do until it's over or until a judge unseals an indictment or until Adam Bragg stands on perhaps those steps behind me and says he's dismissing the matter. All right.

Well, I know you will continue to watch it closely. Garrett and Vaughn, thank you both so much for your great reporting. Still to come, Trump versus the 2024 field, Republican presidential hopeful test the waters in New Hampshire as Trump mots potential rival Rhonda Santas on the campaign trail. The very latest on the state of the race next, you're watching Meet the Press now.

Welcome back, Florida Republican Governor Rhonda Santas is not yet an announced presidential candidate, but that isn't stopping potential backers from bringing their hands about a DeSantis Trump primary matchup. The NBC News reports a number of DeSantis donors and allies are worried he may not be ready for what promises to be a brutal fight against Mr. Trump for the nomination. Some feel he should accelerate his timeline to get into the presidential race, while others think he should push back a potential run to 2028 when he would not have to go toe-to-toe with Trump.

Joining me now on set is Amy Walter, publisher and editor-in-chief of the political report. Thank you so much, Amy. So glad to be here. We're so glad to have you here on a Monday to kick things off this week.

So let's start right there. You hear the debate inside DeSantis World. And the concern is he's not taking the gloves off soon enough. Let's say you about that concern.

Right. And the concern was raised as folks were looking at some polls that have come in these last couple of weeks now, showing that Trump's lead over DeSantis has grown, Monmouth Poll, Aquinipiac Poll. So that's where you see some of the hand ringing. But what you'll also notice is that opinions about that Ron DeSantis haven't really changed at all.

He still has a very high approval favorable rating among Republican voters. So it's not like Republicans suddenly don't like him anymore. The thing that's happened is, remember, Donald Trump was at his lowest point right after the midterms, because for once he didn't really have a foil. The reason his numbers were as low as they were was the disappointment with the midterms.

And he obviously got a lot of that blame. DeSantis became a great fill-in. Now, here we are all these months later. We're not talking that much about the midterms anymore.

Ron DeSantis, as he said, he's not a candidate. So the attention goes back to Donald Trump and people kind of go back to their priors, right? Well, maybe Trump wasn't that bad. Yeah, I do like him.

I don't know this idea about DeSantis getting out sooner or taking the gloves off. I just don't think that makes a whole lot of sense right now. I think it's still early. I think it's so early.

Yeah. And the debate is going to release August debate and how many we have post-August. That's going to be critical. I was just going back and looking at polling from 2015.

You know, going into that first debate in August of 2015, Trump was coming up in the polls a little bit, but really not making much of it that after that debate. He was leading. And he really never looked back after that. I'm not saying that's what's going to happen this time, but DeSantis has to prove that he can take the hit.

And there is a lot that's going to be writing on that debate. Well, I think you raised such an important point because they're on the debate stage. That's where you see the contrast. Frankly, is DeSantis able to counter-contrast?

And is he able to draw a contrast from a policy perspective? Right? So we haven't really seen that yet, DeSantis. Absolutely.

I'm sorry. Republican voters who say, you know, I like Donald Trump. He was a great president, but I just don't think he can win. I don't know.

I know a lot of people have never voted for him. I'm just saying to see he's young. He looks like he's Trump, but who's a little more disciplined. Let's give this guy a try.

So they've got to test him out. And then there's the question, as you pointed out, of what about another candidate? Right. That's not named one of those two.

Yeah. A lot of candidates circling the wagon. Sununu. Tim Scott.

I mean, you have all of these people who are visiting- Chris, Chris. Yes. Exactly. So what about all of those other potential candidates?

Where do they stand? And how much urgency is there for them? One of the candidates who's not right now, one of the top two in the polls to get in. Well, this is part of the question I heard Governor Sununu a couple of weeks ago say something like, you know, be fun to be up on that debate stage.

So you can get as far as whatever it's going to take to hit the threshold to be invited to come onto the debate stage. See if you can sort of stand in there, make some sort of distinction there. As DeSantis, as these worries about DeSantis become more public and these stories about the hand-ringing and the polling, I think you're going to see a lot of other folks start to test the waters. Yes, your perspective on this conventional wisdom, which is that Trump's legal problems are energizing the things that they actually help him out ultimately.

How do you see this playing out on the trail? We don't know what's going to happen. We don't know if he's going to be indicted in any of the cases swirling around him. But boy, you talk about a foil.

And this has been a perfect foil. And one where once again, he gets all of his, not just the base, and not just the folks in Congress, all the elites and his potential foes, Sununu, as well as DeSantis do a certain extent saying, yeah, that's right. This is a politically motivated attack, so getting them all on his side, which makes it harder than when other legal actions take place for them to come out and say, this wasn't politically motivated. But you know what, Chris, I'm certain to think that this may not tell us as much as we need to know.

As more and more, as we go through this process, if we see something out of Georgia, we see something out of the DOJ, we see something else out of New York, the question, and this goes to our point about the debates, how does somebody like Ron DeSantis turn that not into a direct attack as Donald Trump, you have so many legal actions again, but this guy has too much baggage. You can't win without all these things. Making the case that this may be politically motivated, they may be doing it because they don't want to see Donald Trump return to office, but we can't deny the fact that this baggage is going to make it very hard for him to beat Joe Biden. And it will be fascinating to see if that does make its way onto the debate stage.

That's right. Thank you so much. Really appreciate it. So great to have you here.

Really appreciate it. And you can read more from Amy and all our friends at the Cook Political Report at CookPolitical.com. After the break, I'll talk to a bi-partisan pair of lawmakers about the rising tensions between the US and China, the growing concern about an invasion of Taiwan and the possibility of a new Cold War. You're watching with the press now.

Welcome back. Some breaking news in our top story. As authorities in Nashville responded to today's school shooting, which killed seven people including the female gunman, three law enforcement officials briefed on the matter have identified, the deceased shooting suspect is Audrey Hale, a Nashville resident. This is video that fed in just moments ago of the suspect's house.

Residents nearby told reporters on the scene that they heard what sounded like flash bangs as they watched authorities enter the home. We noted earlier, we are expecting authorities to hold an update potentially this hour. We will bring that to you live. Meanwhile, we do want to turn to some other news now relations between the US and China and two to slide as Washington looks to counter Beijing's growing influence.

In the last month alone, the US has taken a number of actions to counter China, approving the potential sale of $619 million in arms to Taiwan, announcing a submarine deal with the UK and Australia, and ramping up pressure on TikTok to divest from their Chinese parent company, ByteDance. China, meanwhile, is increasing its own diplomatic efforts around the globe. Yesterday, Honduras ended its decades-long relationship with Taiwan and instead established diplomatic ties with China. Joining me now to discuss all of this are Congressman Amy Barra, Democrat from California, and Congressman Andy Barr, Republican from Kentucky, they are co-chairs of the Taiwan Caucus thanks to both of you for being here, and I am sorry that you have to be here on a tragic day.

I do have to start with the breaking news that we are covering. Congressman Barr, let me just start with you and get your reaction to this horrific school shooting in Nashville. What is your response? And is there more than you would like to see Congress do?

Well, just heartbreaking news, and this cannot continue to be the norm in America. Parents and certainly teachers and students deserve better than this, and we need to continue to look for ways to build upon bipartisan legislation that has been passed in the Congress for the last few years, fixing the next, making sure that the National Instant Criminal Background Check System has all the information that it needs. The grant program that we passed on a bipartisan basis, the Stop School Violence Act, we passed bipartisan measures on mental health, so we need to continue to look at that. But by all estimates so far, it looks like this was a quick response by law enforcement, and so our gratitude goes up to those first responders.

Please. I would just echo what Andy said. You know, our hearts go out to the parents and the family members that lost at once. Schools should be the safest places for our kids.

That's how it was when we were growing up going to school, and we've got to figure this epidemic of violence in our schools. Congressman Ami Bear, let me follow up with you on that point. Is there any place for bipartisan agreement on this over the next two years? As you know, we are entering an election season.

You know, I would hope so. I would hope we make it about community safety, keeping our kids safe, and that could be a component of mental health. It could be a component, as Congressman Barr said, about making sure our background checks are secure. We did come together and pass the bipartisan safe for our last Congress, and I think if we thought about this as parents, we would actually think about it very differently.

Congressman Barr, let's turn now and talk about China and Taiwan and all of the other issues surrounding this. We learned over the weekend that China has established diplomatic ties with Honduras. You're reaction to that, and you're concerned it's an indication that the US is not doing enough to counter what seems to be a rising China. Well, the decision by Honduran President Castro to sever ties with Taiwan and recognize China is very disappointing for obvious reasons to side with an authoritarian, totalitarian government that wants to reshape the new world order in its image, instead of siding with a democracy and a beacon of freedom.

This is a very disturbing sign right in our own hemisphere, and it goes to show that we need to step up our efforts in our own hemisphere and around the globe, the counter, the Chinese Belt and Road Initiative, and also communicates with our partners and allies around the world that these are false promises, that China oftentimes tries to coerce these countries with promises of economic assistance, but at the end doesn't deliver, and this doesn't make the world safer, it makes it a more dangerous place. And Congressman Barr, your take and the fact that it comes on the heels of China brokering this deal between Iran and Saudi Arabia, to people who are watching this, do you feel as though China is becoming increasingly emboldened on the world's age? Certainly China is acting in a much more emboldened capacity, you know, Congressman Barr used this word coercion, and they use economic coercion in really interesting ways, you know, we've seen it with Lithuania when they did recognize Taiwan, how China quickly produced the backlash. We actually have bipartisan legislation to empower any president and administration to act in the interest of countries that do get pressured to go one way or another way, and I think we've got to make sure we're using all the tools that we have available, all the resources diplomacy, but also a much cooler defense as well of our allies and friends.

Is it time to update our policy of strategic ambiguity when it comes to Taiwan? Would that, for example, send a stronger message that the U.S. stands with Taiwan? You know, I think we talk about it slightly differently.

I use the term strategic deterrence, but you can't have deterrence without clarity. So the goal here is to deter. We're not looking to get the war with China. China is actually the one who, through their aggression, is changing the status quo in the region.

That's really been prosperous for everyone. So we have to stand up to this bullying tactics that, you know, China is doing in the states and the straits of Taiwan, but we've got to do it in a way to deter China from making a wrong mistake. And I agree. A wholeheartedly with my colleague on this.

We need clarity. We need deterrence. And the reason why we need deterrence is because of what we've seen over the last year with the step of aggression from Beijing with respect to the island democracy of Taiwan, our partner and ally. You know, this is a very strategic and important ally in the United States.

Not only are they a beacon of freedom and share our values, but our trade, they're the the largest trading partner with the United States, 90 billion in trade. They're the largest producer, advanced semiconductors in the world. And in the last year, the People's Republic of China, the Chinese Communist Party has stepped up hostile fire exercises in the Strait of Taiwan. They've increased their incursions into the Taiwan Air Defense zone.

And they've stepped up their disinformation campaign trying to confuse and deceive the people of Taiwan to force unification. So the United States needs to continue to deter economic integration with Taiwan is important and also providing them with the foreign military sales to deter a cross-grade invasion. Congressman Barr, let me follow up with you. And then I have one for both of you on Russia.

You're obviously on the China Select Committee as well. You're calling for the U.S. to the couple itself from China's economy. But a lot of people are wondering, how can that happen when, you know, the administration Congress can't even convince people of the national security concerns about TikTok, for example?

Well, in many ways, this is very distinct from the Cold War with the Soviet Union because we weren't economically integrated with the Soviet Union like we are with China. And so what I have always said to my colleagues on the Select Committee and on the Foreign Affairs Committee is we cannot counter China by becoming more like China. We shouldn't be imitating their Communist industrial-based policy or the theft of our intellectual property or the fact that they want to rewrite the rules of the international order. What we should do is embrace our strengths, our free market capital system, our rules-based system.

We need to support our allies and partners in that effort. And so when we talk about decoupling, it should be strategic focus and targeted, and we should definitely monitor the way in which Americans trade with China and also provide capital to China to make sure the American people are not unwittingly financing the rise of the Chinese military or surveillance state. All right. Let me shift to Russia very quickly before we run out of time.

Over the weekend, we learned that Russia has said that it will deploy tactical nuclear weapons to Belarus. John Kirby told CBS's face the nation he has seen no indication that Russia has moved nuclear weapons. What do you make of this? Congressman Berra first to you.

You know, I heard those reports. I'm sure we're going to get briefed on that in Foreign Affairs as well as in the intelligence committee. We've not seen movement in that direction. Putin has talked about this in the past.

I think it would have been a big mistake if Vladimir Putin was a deployed tactical nuclear weapons to Belarus. Congressman Barr. I agree with that. And back to China, there is an axis between Beijing and Moscow and you saw it on full display last week with the summit between President Putin and Chinese leader Xi in Moscow.

We need to get to the bottom of all of the material assistance that Beijing is providing to a financials war by buying Russian gas and oil, but also lethal assistance. There is evidence through customs and trade records that China is engaged in lethal assistance of the Russian military. Already? That desertion has said they're concerned about it, but they've said they haven't seen any evidence of it.

You're saying you believe that China is already providing some type of equal aid to Russia? There's no doubt about it. There's evidence of it. I challenge Secretary Lincoln for not already recognizing that, acknowledging that and responding with tough sanctions on China because of it, there's records of drone and drone parts being and aircraft parts being centered, even in small arms.

So the customs data, the records, the trade records that's been widely recorded in the print media, the administration needs to do a better job identifying that. And in fact, they reported to Congress, as required by the NDAA, the fact that these customs and trade records exist that show material, lethal assistance from the Chinese to Russia. We need to respond to that. Well, this is big news, what you're saying.

Congressman Barr, are you aware of this as well? I'm not seeing those reports and the message is loud and clear to China that say out of this war. If you want to broker peace, if you want to find a way to get Ukraine and Russia to cease fire, great, have at it, but do not arm Russia. Okay.

Well, we will put those questions to the White House. Thank you very much, Congressman Andy Barr and Ami Barrett. Really appreciate your taking time to come on together. Really appreciate your perspective.

Thank you. Great. Coming up next, the mid unprecedented on rest of Israel, Prime Minister Netanyahu announced this hill delay, the controversial plan to overhaul the judicial system in the country. We are live on the ground in Jerusalem where protesters flooded the streets yet again today.

You're watching at the press now. Welcome back, facing widespread protests as hundreds of thousands of workers on strike earlier today, Israeli or Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu announced he will delay a controversial plan to overhaul the country's judicial system, postponing any attempt to pass the overhaul until Parliament's next session. The decision to delay comes as protests against the proposed changes escalated overnight after Netanyahu fired his defense minister and spoken out against the overhaul, winning divisions, were threatening the country's security, calling Netanyahu's announcement of the delay, the chairman for the country's largest trade union called off the nationwide strike that had paralyzed major sectors of the economy today. Joining me now from Jerusalem is MBC's Raf Sanchez.

Also with me is Amikai Cohen, senior fellow at the Israel Democracy Institute. Raf, let me start with you. What did we hear from Prime Minister Netanyahu today and what is the significance of this decision to delay? Well, Chris and Prime Minister Netanyahu said he was agreeing to this delay in order to avert a potential civil war, which gives you a sense of just how high the rhetoric is right now.

But I think the key thing, Chris, some of these hundreds of thousands of protesters who have turned out on the streets in recent months, is that this is a delay of this plan. Netanyahu has not abandoned it, he is not saying it is over, he is saying that he is delaying. And he has done so, as you said, under really unprecedented pressure today. Not only these enormous protests in the streets of Tel Aviv here in Jerusalem, a sea of white and blue flags surrounding the Parliament, but also this general strike, which is unlike anything Israel has ever seen before.

The country's airport shut down for outgoing flights, and as you know, Israel only has one international airport. So this country basically cut off from the world for a number of hours today. Thanks. Daycare is even McDonald's restaurants were shut down today, and it reached the point I think where Netanyahu, having stood for him for so long, felt he had no choice but to give him at least partially the protesters in Amsterdam.

And Roth, part of the agreement is to establish a national guard under the Ministry of National Security. What's the significance of that? What would the role there be? Yes.

So this is really significant. This is a concession that Netanyahu has made to his far right national security minister in order to win that minister's blessing for the delay. Remember Netanyahu's base far right members inside his own government do not want this legislation to stop. And in order to get the agreements from the far right of his coalition to at least put this on pause, Netanyahu has agreed to the creation of this national guard, and it is under the leadership of one of the most extreme members of Netanyahu's government.

This is a man who has previous convictions for inciting racism, for supporting a terrorist group, as a man American officials are refusing to meet with, but Netanyahu has denied agreed to allow the establishment of a national guard under his leadership. Mr. Cohen, thank you, Ralph Sanchez, for your great reporting from the ground. Mr.

Cohen, let me turn to you, and if you could give us the broader perspective of how Israel got to this point, and the fact that the prime minister is saying he's going to delay these moves to overhaul the judicial system, but that doesn't mean he's not going to move over that eventually. No, that there is a deep disagreement within Israel between the coalition, the ruling coalition, which feels that the fact that the coalition has a majority within the Knesset actually allows it to change the rule of the game, to change the way the judges are appointed, and what has been said by the opposition, and not the political opposition, but the people in the street is that the fact that there is a majority within the Knesset does not mean that you actually have all the power that you can change the rules of the game, that you can change the way judges are appointed. I think behind it is a fear that the ruling coalition once achieves the ability to change the rules of the game will actually undermine a lot of the basic fundamental values of Israel, of the free elections, of the equality of liberal values, smaller liberal values within Israel. And you've seen the size of these protests.

How unique is that? And do you expect them to continue once Prime Minister Netanyahu moves beyond this delay that he's announced? So, first of all, they are extremely in my lifetime, and I think even in my parent's lifetime, there has never been so many people in the streets for so long. And it's not only the question of the streets, it's a coalition of forces, the people in the high-tech industry, and reserve is in elite units in the army, and a coalition of a lot of forces in Israeli society, so it's extremely, extremely.

The question of Netanyahu's delay, of course, one of the tactics clear tactics that Netanyahu is trying to play here is to achieve some kind of weakening of the protests, because it's actually impossible, even though he has the power within the parliament, past almost anything he wants. It's clear that when there's so many people who are in the streets, it's actually impossible for him to pass off. What he's trying to do is weaken the protests, and that's the question we're going now to the past of their vacation, so perhaps this will mean less people in the streets. But we'll have to see, within a few weeks, there are talks now that are supposed to begin regarding a possible compromise, and we'll see if they'll succeed or not.

We have less than a minute left. If you could, this also comes as tensions are mounting over West Bank settlements. How does that contribute to the tensions that we are seeing broadly speaking? In short, a lot of people are thinking that there will go of the coalition.

Why would they want to change the rules? What are the problems? What are the problems with the court? Their real goal is to continue in the fact of annexation of the West Bank enlarging settlements, and without a strong court, the way for them internally within Israel will be open.

Well, we so appreciate your perspective today as we continue to track this ongoing developing crisis that is unfolding right now in Israel. Professor Cohen, thank you so much for your analysis, and thank you for being with us this hour. I will be back tomorrow with more Meet the Press now. NBC News now coverage continues with Hallie Jackson right now.

He was a young Marine. She didn't care about convention. They made a life together. Then one night, the Marine died, and then the death investigation took a while unexpected, and utterly bizarre turn.