Meet the Press NOW – May 8

If it's Monday. Two deadly tragedies in Texas. A suspected neo Nazi sympathizer opened a fire on a shopping mall, killing eight people in one of the deadliest mass shootings this year. And hours later, a vehicle rammed into a group of migrants, killing another eight people, with several more in critical condition.

Plus, President Biden rejects a Republican border security plan as the administration braces for another migrant surge when a series of pandemic error restrictions expire in just three days and the debt ceiling standoff heats up. Senate Republicans dig in as congressional leaders prepare for an Oval Office showdown tomorrow with a deadline to avert a crippling government default fast approaching. And welcome to MEET THE press. Now.

I'm Ryan Nobles in for Kristen Welker. We begin with the latest on two tragedies both in Texas and both ahead of a pivotal week for the White House as the Biden administration faces a critical situation at the border and a fast approaching deadline to avert a government to fall. Right now, White House flags are half staff on orders from President Biden after the second deadliest mass shooting this year left eight people dead at a Dallas area shopping mall on Saturday. The president is again calling on Congress to pass new gun legislation.

And Majority Leader Schumer announced today he's calling a meeting for all Senate Democrats on Thursday to discuss a legislative path forward, although in this political climate, it is next to impossible to see any kind of compromise happening on the issue of guns. Meanwhile, we are learning more about the shooter in the shopping mall massacre. A senior law enforcement official has just confirmed NBC News that a social media page which appears to belong to the gunman include rants against Jews, women and racial minorities. That social media activity is now part of the investigation.

Police say the shooter was armed with a rifle and a handgun while wearing a tactical vest. And they have more weapons and ammunition in his car. Witnesses were counted. The horror of what happened.

So pretty much we were in the store and I was in the sitting room. And then everybody ran into the sitting room. And I ran out to see what was happening and then go to the back of the store. And I was like, I walk around.

Somebody got shot at random. She was crouching in the front and I went to grab her. They shot through the door. And then she reached the back.

There was dead people in the front. And as I was going around, they told me to get away, you know, to move out. And I kept telling them I'm looking for my ladder. That shooting happened just hours before another tragedy in Texas, this one in the border town Brownsville, where an SUV slammed into a group of migrants at a bus stop.

You're looking at security camera footage showing the vehicle in the moments right before the incident. Eight people were killed. At least 10 others were injured. At a brief today, local officials named the suspect and said that they have not ruled out the possibility that it was intentional.

Investigation also revealed that the driver of the vehicle, later identified as George Alvarez, November 9, 1988, had attempted to flee the scene after impact, but was held down by several individuals on scene. George Alvarez says he Brownville with an extensive rap. He has been formally charged and arraigned with eight counts of mass slaughter, 10 counts of aggravated solve the deadly weapon. Now, Brownsville has been a focal point of the crisis of the southern border, particularly ahead of the aspiration of the pandemic era restrictions later this week.

For more now, I'm joined by NBC. Stephen Romo, he is in Allen, Texas. NBC News intelligence and national security correspondent Ken Delaney is with me right here in Washington. And NBC's Gabe Gutierrez is live in Brownsville, Texas.

So Stephen, let's start with you. What are authorities saying about exactly what happened there on Saturday? Yeah, right. It's all unfolded about 3:30 on Saturday at the height of shopping here at the Allen Outlet there, a sprawling outlet mall, open air here where many people from around the metroplex go.

That gunman apparently got out of his people and started firing. There was an officer nearby for an unrelated call. He was able to engage that gunman pretty quickly, but not before he killed eight people, injured several others and just sent chaos throughout here. Many people hiding in stores, other people just trying to flee the area and then trying to reunite with their loved ones.

We also know from a law enforcement source that evidence has been seized at two locations related to the suspect in this his parents home and at a motel where he had it been staying. They're going through that. They're also trying to look to see more of his military record. They know that he was in basic training in the army back in 2008 before being kicked out just three months later.

They're also trying to figure out if he potentially worked in security because neighbors law enforcement that he was often seen in what looked like a security uniform. So we are learning more, but there are so many questions left here. Well, speaking of what we're learning, Steven, have we learned anything about the the type of weapons that the shooter had? Yeah, around we are learning more about those weapons.

Unsurprisingly, he was found with an AR15. We hear in so many of these shoes. He also had a handgun on him at the time, according to authorities, he was wearing a tactical vest. They didn't sort of appear like a police officer in the situation.

And we're here for the reason they actually made it to his car. They saw even more weapons and more ammunition inside his vehicle. They're working right now to trace where those weapons came from. Marquette, let's start you now.

And what investigator saying about the suspect or his motive? Well, we have discovered what appears to be his social media site and confirmed with investigators that they are also looking at this. It's on a Russian social media platform. And what I found there just in the last hour are for example, receipts for those exact web weapons.

That seems just talking about AR15 style rifle and two handguns. There's a photo that appears to be him of a torso with SS and swastika tattoos. There are hundreds of postings with ranting anti women, anti black, anti Jew, white supremacist, neo Nazi kind of ideology, but also just a very confused kind of mishmash of angry, disaffected postings. So you know, just kind of a portrait of someone really disassociated from normal life.

Not really violent threats, though, although there was a photo of this shopping center that he also posted. And how investigators use this type of information as they go through this investigation. I mean, you know, they're going to look to see whether there are any warning signs and who knew about this person's mental state and how he's able to buy these weapons. But at the end of the day, there are a lot of people that say horrible things on social media in the United States.

Most of them don't commit mass violence. This is a confoundation for investigators. You know, we have a First Amendment. People are allowed to post this stuff.

It's a really difficult problem. And we do know that he spent some time in the military. What have you learned about his army service? Well, our colleague Courtney Kubik was able to figure out that he spent three months in basic training but then was removed from service without completing his training over some unspecified mental health issue.

Okay. All right, Ken, thanks for that. And let's go back to Stephen again. Stephen, what reaction have you heard from state lawmakers?

Yeah, right. We're hearing from state lawmakers. We're hearing from the gunner Governor Greg Adams, speaking out over the weekend. He really put the spotlight on mental health as opposed to guns and mental health.

And when pressed on the issue of guns, he told FOX News that other states like blue states like California also deal with mass shootings. And there was a problem everywhere in country. Of course, people are able to travel across the state lines with weapons. And that is something they do.

Texas Democrats, though, state representatives are really pushing for measures appointing to this tragedy. And the UAL Day school shooting, which is still fresh on the minds of many demanding actions on guns. All right, Stephen Romo Catalanian, thank you for your reporting. Let's turn now to Gabe gunierrez for the latest on the situation in Brownsville.

So, Gabe, do investigators believe that this was accidental or is there a possibility that it was intentional? Well, this one, Ryan, they're not saying. They're still saying that this is an ongoing investigation. So they have not ruled out that this may have been intentional.

But this is what the police chief said earlier just a few hours ago. He did say that investigators believe that the driver ran this red light right over my right shoulder and then he swerved and the SUV flipped over and hit this group of migrants at this bus stop right over my shoulder. You can see the makeshift memorial for this growing by the hour. Now the suspect, George, offers, investigators say has an extensive criminal history.

He's now being held on $3.6 million bail, as you mentioned in the introduction, is eight counts of manslaughter. He's facing 10 counts of aggravated assault as well as reckless driving. But more charges or upgrading charges could be pending depending on the results of toxicology reports. And that's what investigators are waiting on before they might confirm whether the suspect was intoxicated.

We have spoken with several migrants here on the grounds and witnesses who did describe him as appearing drunk. One of them saw it firsthand, said that he yelled to him on anti immigrant rhetoric as he was trying to flee the scene. Again, authorities are very careful right now. They cannot substantiate that this was motivated by hate in any way, but they're looking into all possibilities on whether it was intentional.

Meanwhile, several of the injured remained in critical condition, according to the mayor. And this community is stunned. It was a prayer visual here just a few hours ago. And so many people here are wondering what could have possibly motivated or was it an accident that these migrants, many of them, all of them actually from Venezuela, all of them men from Venezuela, what could have killed them after such a grueling journey from their home country.

Now this community, this migrant community here is dealing with this shock, absolute tragedy. Gabe, good era live from Brownsville, Texas. Again, we appreciate it. Thank you.

And as we've noted, the tragedies in Texas are happening as the White House is racing for a pivotal week. First thing Friday, Title 42, which is the pandemic era policy that blocked hundreds of thousands of migrants from crossing the border, will lapse. Some communities have already put themselves in an emergency posture ahead of the deadline as the Pentagon is deploying thousands of active duty troops to help mitigate the situation. Additionally, about 24 hours from now, President Biden will be sitting down with the big four congressional leaders as the US Inches closer and closer to a potential government default.

Joining me now from outside White House is NBC's Mike Mullies. Amanda's been mentioned. It's a big week for President Biden. Let's start at the border.

What do we know about what's going on inside the White house? Is title 42 is set to come to a close this week? Are they starting to feel wary over the situation at the border? Well, what the White House is trying to do is project that months of careful planning have gone into this moment.

One thing you have heard over and over again from administration officials from the Department of Homeland Security is that they inherited a situation at the border, an immigration system itself that needs to be completely rebuilt, that President Trump just completely undid the legal immigration system in this country, made it harder for them to do what needs to be done to keep regular flows coming in and legal flows coming in. So they've emphasized all the work that they've been doing. You saw Alejandro Mayorkas, the DHS secretary, spending some time at the border last week, talking with reporters, emphasizing the degree to which the sprawling department he leads has surged resources there and president authorizing, as you say, the troops go down to serve in a role as well. President Biden in that interview on Friday with Steffi Rule, also emphasizing the diplomatic component of this, how he's worked with some of our allies, including Mexico's president, to try and find other pathways, other places where some of these migrants could be returned to.

Of course, a lot of them are not coming from Mexico, but from places like Venezuela that have governing humanitarian crisis as it relates to the political situation. The president then tries to put it on congressional Republicans saying that ultimately this can only be solved by comprehensive reform. He talked about the need for more workers, farm workers and the like, and that Congress needs to act there. And you saw that the White House today, Kareem John here, the White House Pres.

Secretary, really forcefully rejecting this congressional measure that you'll be covering when it comes up later this week. HR2, you know, it's a big bill. If it has a low number. And this is a messaging bill in the view of the White House by Republicans, that does little to solve the problem.

Green jump here saying that this would be, among other things, a Christmas morning gift for human smugglers. By undoing some of the steps the administration has tried to take to make this system more sane to more functional. So the White House is doing their best to project, they're planning their effort to get the situation under control by acknowledging there's only so much that they can do unilaterally. An immigration bill at this point that doesn't even have enough Republican votes to pass as they are deliberating internally as well.

So let's move on to the debt ceiling now. About 24 hours from now, President is set to host the top congressional leaders. As this deadline is getting closer and closer. You know, the President said he's not going to negotiate on the debt limit.

Is this going to be a pretty short meeting? It really does sound like that. Because when you can't even agree what you're meeting about, what you might be negotiating about, it really speaks to what is a stalemate at this point. As you and I have been talking to our source on both ends of Pen Avenue, a lot of folks are saying they really don't see how this ends.

This is gonna be an opportunity, though, to maybe get a sense afterwards of are there other discussions happening that we're unaware of, other pathways, other potential solutions here? Instead, what we are spending a lot of time talking about are sort of Hail Mary passes, whether it's a discharge petition, sort of then run on leadership that might require some Republicans to break with their party, join Democrats in a clean debt limitary, or is it a unilateral option that President Biden could potentially take the invoking of the 14th Amendment, something that even his own administration is acknowledging, has a surefire legal challenge to come if he just does try to take that. Treasury Secretary Jan Yeon seem to reject that, even if she did completely take it off the table. And then the politics of this come into view based on what the President is doing after this meeting, he's going up to New York, about 20 miles north of New York City, one of those congressional districts that elected a Republican to Congress last fall, but also supported President Biden the election two years before that, the definition of a swing district.

The President trying to put pressure on those Republicans who made him Most vulnerable in 2024. One for the vote that they cast on the GOP's proposal that limit, Save, Grow act, which the White House contends has draconian spending cuts, things like Meals on Wheels, veterans benefits that are politically untenable for them. But also hoping that maybe this political pressure could be brought from the outside in and that they would then pressure speakers for lend and maybe consider some other options here. But a lot of questions about both negotiating strategies as we head into this meeting tomorrow.

And three weeks barely for them to find a way forward. Yeah, not a lot of people freaking out quite yet on Capitol Hill, but maybe that changes. There's no resolution after this meeting tomorrow afternoon. Alright.

Mike Memley at the White House, thank you so much. Coming up, bracing at the border with just three days until a series of pandemic era restrictions expire. We have live reporting from the border where hundreds of asylum seekers have arrived in recent days. Plus my one on one interview with a border state Democrat from Texas.

That's next. And later, as we just said, the standoff over the debt ceiling is intensifying as both sides seem unwilling to budge. And President Biden prepares to meet with congressional leaders tomorrow. You're watching EAT THE PRESS now.

Welcome back. Title 42, the Pandemic Era public policy that has been used millions of times since 2020 to deny migrants entry and expel them more quickly and set to expire in just three days. Officials estimate that roughly 10,000 migrants will attempt to cross the border every day after the ban is lifted. The Biden administration pushed to end the policy because the public health emergency that led to using Title 42 is now over.

But some officials in border states are warning that they do not have the capacity to handle the number of migrants that are expected to arrive in the coming days and weeks. Here's Texas's Governor Greg Abbott this morning lashing out at the Biden administration. Bottom line is it did not have to be this way. So never forget this.

Just three years ago, we had the lowest border crossings in decades. And those low number of border crossings were a result of the policies put in place by the Trump administration. Today, however, we are dealing with the highest number of people coming across the border than ever before and we will set a new all time record this year. All of this is a result of policy decisions by Joe Biden.

Well, the Biden administration has defended its handling of the border, calling the prior administration's policies, quote, inhumane. Holland's secretary Alondra Mayorkas was in Texas last week, says he believes the administration is prepared for the end of fellow 42. And the federal authorities are doing everything they can to can given a broken immigration system that Congress has refused to address me. Guadalangis is near the border in San Diego, California.

So what, what are you seeing at the border ahead of the end of Title 42 later this week? Ryan so at this border, this is between San Diego and Tiquana, we have two barriers. And what we've seen is a camp of migrants that has been growing by the day. You can see some of the tents that they've set up using plastic, using some of the materials that they've been able to find, blankets that the humanitarian organizations have brought for them.

And we've seen a couple hundred every day. They're all across this area that's essentially in between the US And Mexico. It's where the two fences were built. Border patrol has arrived today.

They took a group of about 100 women and children. The people here, they're from all over the world. I've spoken to people from Europe, women from Georgia, There was a family from Morocco, another group from Jamaica. I spoke to some men from Vietnam, people from Colombia, Venezuela.

And you know, we have migrants that are right here in Tijuana, across the world, San Diego, from all parts of the world. Here's the conversation I had with a migrant from Venezuela. He says if they expelling back to Mexico, they'll keep trying because going back to the he doesn't understand what will happen when he's lifted. He's got a godmother in the US that will be a sponsor if he can talk to the virtual agents and seek asylum.

And it's important to point out that a lot of these migrants that I speak to tell me they don't even know what Title 42 is. You know, there's a lot of talk about policies here in the US and lifting Title 42, but the reality is not just for migrants here, but in the last few years, I've been reporting in Mexico and Latin America. And most of the migrants that come up here do not come because Title 42 is in place or is going to be lifted. What they tell me is that they're coming as a result of what happened in their home country.

Three years ago, we had a pandemic hit. We've had economical issues happening in Venezuela and other parts of Latin America. And that's really what has forced a lot of these migrants. Other than that, we have political issues in other countries, like Nicaragua, of course, Cuba, also Venezuela.

And these are some of the circumstances that they tell me force them to come to the US so it's confusing when you discuss policies right title 42, lifting whatever's being done by the US government. Because when it comes to the migrants themselves, they don't completely understand what's happening. They tell me they're coming because this is the only option that they have. Important context live on the border.

Thank you for that report. Let's talk more about this now with Democrat congressman from Texas, Congressman Henry Cuellar. Congressman, obviously you represent a border district. It includes border towns as well as part of San Antonio.

How are you preparing for Thursday's deadlines, and what are your expectations? Is your area prepared to contend with the wave of migrants that we expect? You know, every border is different. Laredo is the second lowest crossing in the whole United States.

So we. We basically just take the overflows from the valley and from other places up here. But keep in mind that, you know, looking at the numbers, I've looked at the numbers that are in the shelters or surrounding shelters on the northern Mexican states, which are right next to the US border. And there's over 150,000 people that we know of Identity.

The ones are in the interior, southern Mexico. And then you count the ones that we know of in, in places like Guatemala and the other places. You're talking about hundreds and hundreds of thousands of people that are gonna be ready to come over. The latest numbers are about 8,700 people a day.

That, of course, will probably go up. You know, my question is, are we gonna be ready for this? I think the administration has some policies, new policies. The only thing is, I think it will be effective.

The only thing is, I think they implemented them a little bit too late, in my opinion. All right, let's talk more about this, because you tweeted that you're prepared to work with DHS and the Border Patrol in order to keep your district safe. And we saw the Homeland Security secretary, America. He's been in Texas since Thursday.

Have you personally spoke with the secretary or anybody else in the administration and expressed your concerns about this delayed implementation and other suggestions you would have to make this process smoother? Yes, absolutely, I have. And I talked to the secretary many times, as you know, the ranking Democrat on homeland appropriations. So I've had an opportunity to talk to and talk to the other folks there.

And look, you know, we've added, in the last two years, you know, from the Trump administration, we've added $2.4 billion to CBP. That's a 15 increase to the budget. So money is important. But it's not only that you got to have the right policies.

And I'll say this works are one thing, but if you don't show actions, and by actions, I'm talking about deporting people back to the countries because they're not supposed to be here, they're going to continue coming. Otherwise they see the border as a speed bump and they'll continue coming. So again, you know, I know sometimes folks say, well, the immigration is broken, the system is broken. Congress needs to do its job.

Keep in mind that actually the lowest crossings were not under Trump. They were actually under Obama. And Obama used Title 8 instead of Title 42, and he did expedited proceedings, which means he removed the ones that were not supposed to be here. And he actually showed people going back.

What was the last time he showed people coming back or being sent back? All we see is videos of people coming in. And those images are powerful messages that people in other places might not understand what Title 42 is, but they see the powerful images of people coming in, and therefore they're going to continue coming unless we have repercussions at the border. The president and his administration now sent, you know, troops to the border to try to help with the situation there.

Do you think that's theater or do you actually think it could help the situation? Or just like President Bush and Obama and Trump, did they send the military out there? Keep in mind, they don't have any power to enforce immigration law. All they do is support work.

Support work, that is, they will be able to free the Border Patrol agents so they can go out of the fields and do the work. And this military folks are not border, but they'll be actually just doing support work. Support Patrol can do its work. All right, let's talk about some of the possible policy prescriptions on Capitol Hill.

We know that Senator Tillis and Cinema on the Senate side are actually working on a piece of legislation that would essentially allow the provisions of Title 42 to continue on. It would be. Title 42 would be essentially a new law. Is that something that you'd be supportive of?

Do you think that that's appropriate that something like Title 42 remain in place? Well, I haven't seen that. But I can tell you of another proposal that Senator John Point, Tony Gonzalez and a couple of us have been working on that basically uses Title 8, which is a law right now. Title 8 is actually more powerful than Title 42 because on Title 42, you expel somebody, but they can come back on the title eight, you actually have some teeth.

Five years, 10 years, 15, 20 years. Bands where they can't Come back again. The way President Obama Secretary Jay Johnston used Title 8, expedited removals will work. And the bottom line is you got to have those immigration judges that sell them officers at the border where they can make some quick decisions.

Somebody stays, somebody goes. Because otherwise, like Mr. Bananas, I said in your story a few minutes ago, you're gonna have people from all over the place. And I've seen it's a mini UN down there.

Yes, you have Venezuelans, yes, you have Cubans, yes, you have Central Americans. But you got people, look at some of the numbers in Ariz. And San Diego. You got people from Turkey as the number one, number three spot, India from there.

And again, you got it from all over the place, including the country of Georgia. Not the state, but the country of Georgia, as your report just came out. Well, let's move on and talk about how your state has just been blocked by a series of tragedies over the weekend. First, the devastating shooting that took place there.

We also had the vehicle incident where eight people believed to be migrants were hit by a car. We still have a motive yet. But can you talk a little bit about what the atmosphere in Texas is like right now? Are these isolated incidents?

Is there a broader problem in your state right now? Well, you know, again, if you look, if you talk about mass shootings, we've seen that in different areas, including states like California and other states. Washington, D.C. is about three or four times more dangerous than Laredo, Texas, my hometown.

When you talk about murder, rape, assaults, you look at the states that have very strict handguns. They still have mass shootings. But again, I look, that is a complex, multifaceted factors. There's several factors.

There's not one factor that causes, you know, the problems. You know, goes from mental health, access to guns, you know, social isolation, extreme ideology, like I think we might have in Allen. Sometimes it's drugs. You know, like the person in Bronzeville.

I think reports will show that he was on heavy drugs. We don't know his motive, but I don't think he was an alcohol, but he was certainly on drugs. So we're seeing different factors. So the, the solution is not one or the other one.

It's more of a multifaceted approach that we need to address. Well, let's talk about one possible solution, and it would specifically apply to the shoot on this incident because we've now discovered a lot of hateful online content, and he seemed to hold pretty extreme beliefs. You've supported red flag laws in the past. Should there be background checks for Gun ownership and should they include checks on people's social media?

You know, I certainly support background checks and I support red flags. Resident Eve 21 force. This person was higher than 21. But the Uvalde shooter was not, I would say.

And I support a lot of pieces of legislation through the bipartisan gun bill that we passed. I supported that. But again, one of the things that we need to look at, and I know there's a First Amendment, uh, right there, but if you look at almost every case, almost every case, there's always some sort of tell sign out there. They, they, they're, you know, they, they speak about it, they write about it, they'll post about it.

There's always something out there, and we just got to do a better job, uh, in following, uh, those particular signs. Almost every case, there was something that there that they posted or they said something, uh, in the past. All right, Congressman Henry Cuyer, obviously this is a very busy time for you and your state. We appreciate you delving into many of these important issues.

Thanks so much. And up next, the clock is ticking for Congress and the White House to avert a catastrophic government default. Will they be able to come up with a solution? The panel is next.

You're watching me Press now. Welcome back. Ahead of tomorrow's big meeting between President Biden and top congressional leaders, both sides appear dug in and unwilling to budge. 43 Senate Republicans, led by Utah's Mike Lee, signed a letter over the weekend saying they would not vote to raise the debt ceiling without spending cuts.

That 43 number important because these Republicans have the numbers to kill any White House effort to pass a clean debt limit in the Senate. Still, Democratic leaders, including President Biden, Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer, and House Minority Leader King Jeffries, insists that they will not negotiate on a bill to raise the debt ceiling. This is what Jeffries told Chuck on the press yesterday. Do you accept the premise that you're not going to get a clean debt ceiling?

I do not. Because we have a constitutional responsibility to make sure that we protect the full faith and credit of the United States of America. Republicans want us to accept these dramatic cuts or accept a catastrophic default on our nation's debt. That is what is the unreasonable position.

Hopefully, in a few days, Republicans will come to their senses and do what's right by the American people. And as the debt clock ticks down, something's got to give if the US Is going to avoid fiscal calamity, which the Biden administration wants to happen as early as June 1st. So maybe they can't figure out what my panel can join me now on Saturday's Daniel Diaz, a congressional reporter for Politico Navi Nayak, who's a Democratic strategist and the president and executive director for the center for American Progress Action Fund and Republican strategist Rick Tyler is also on NBC News. Political analysts so we find ourselves in a very precious position, folks.

Danielle, I'm start with you. What's your reporting telling us about what we're gonna see the White House tomorrow afternoon? I think it's gonna depend. I don't even know if the lawmakers know what's happen if they know.

Ryan, you know that quote that you guys just played, that scene of Jeffrey saying he doesn't want a short term debt limit hike. We were asking lawmakers out that last week. It seems that none of them want that. On the Republican and Democratic side they want to fix this at least for the next year.

But it really matters who's going to blink first? Is it going to be President Joe Biden? Is it going to be McCarthy and on both sides, McConnell, Jefferies agree that this is really between the president and the House Speaker. And I haven't seen anybody willing to buy Jeff, you and the people that you've talked to.

No. Democrats want a clean debt limit hike, raising the debt limit. Republicans pass their bill with a lot of provisions and they want to see at least they know they're gonna have to maybe not get all the provisions. They've admitted that when we spok but they want a lot of the supervision whatever happens.

So you know, I understand the Democratic position here that you don't mess with the full fifth of the United States. But there's also a reality of how Capitol Hill works, right. Republicans have votes. They have a negotiating position here.

You can agree with the morality of it all you want, but there's a situation that exists here that doesn't the president have to give them something in order to get this over the finish line? Right. Actually you're hearing on the exact right point which is why are we accepting this as a legitimate position? This is not.

I mean let's just be really clear. They're saying we're going to put the economy in a recession, kill 6 million jobs Moody said would double the rate of unemployment if they don't get something that is a hostage situation. They're taking our economy hostage and saying if you don't give us something, I think if the president gets in on we are going to be in this situation in worse cases every time we have to raise the debt ceiling. And so I think the President is going to keep making this case that he has a sane, reasonable, responsible position.

And you know, MAGA Republicans are pushing something really extreme. And the NBC Washington Post poll that came out tested really fairly. The two positions said we should only raise the debt ceiling if President Biden agrees to cuts. Only 26% of Americans agree with that.

Or we should pass clean debt ceiling and negotiate on the budget, which is what President Biden's been saying. More than 58% or 56% agree with that position. And so I think that emboldens the White House to be, you know, we're in the right place with this. We just have to keep telling people to stay at the thought bubble above your head.

Rick. And to me it reads Republicans think they won an election here. Right. Is that part of the argument they made to their voters is that they were trying to rein indebted in some ways to do it in some ways?

Yeah. Look, the President has already budged and given in number he said he would not negotiate on the debt ceiling. He has budged. He's now negotiating on the debt ceiling.

He's invited the leaders of Congress to the White House which is correct. And the Democrats strongest argument seems to be that no Congress has ever not passed clean debt ceiling. And yet the strongest argument for the Republicans would be yes and that's why we have a 31 trillion dollar debt. Let me tell you what the draconian cuts are.

It's one penny on the dollar. So for one penny on the dollar we're going to. I would reflect back your words to you. The Democrats hold hostage the economy, half the 8 million jobs, half the Dow industrial average because they won't pass a clean, they won't pass a debt ceiling that just contains a 1 penny on the dollar cut.

I think the difference between you two like and alright, I just want to talk about the House, House bill, yeah, that's a 22% cut but that's not one penny of a dollar. That's a 22% cut in veterans care, a 22% cut in childcare. That is not one penny of a dollar. And the solution that Democrats don't seem to have is see the deadline.

Let's not argue about the debt limit because why do you have a debt limit? Because it has no meaning. Because they just keep passing and explaining the dead limit. The part of this is a perception issue, right.

And what the Washington Post poll told us the other day is that no one's going to win in this fight. Right. It said that who are we going to blame if the United States defaults? 39% say Republicans in Congress, 36% say President Biden, 16% say both.

Correct. So why is it that each time we have this conversation, these lawmakers can't seem to figure out that this is a lose, lose situation for everyone involved? Well, first of all, when you ask the question that way, everyone gets pushed their cars in corners. So it doesn't surprise me that I would kind of break out that way.

I will look at that other question in the poll which shows that when you show the position of the two parties, it is untenable to say that we should default unless we get spending cuts. President Biden has made really clear. We have a budget to pass later this year and funding of government funding that has been run out. There's absolutely a negotiation that has to happen on that.

It does not involve threatening an economic recession. That is a very different thing. We've done government shutdowns. They're not pleasant, but it's different.

We've never, as a country default it. And that's really the sort of. Sort of downplay of Republicans. Is it a win, rick, for Kevin McCarthy then if Joe Biden agrees to some sort of a punt on the debt limit to the fall and tie the negotiations to the budget negotiations, make them two separate pieces of legislation but have them on parallel tracks.

Look, the Democrats don't understand the bicameral nature of the House and the Senate. The House passed a bill, now the Democrats are in control of the Senate. They can very well say we don't want to pass the debt, but then becomes a political argument over whose fault it is. And the fault is pretty well spread around.

I don't think the Congress is going to allow the government to fall. I think in the end you will get a compromise. It probably won't be clean. It probably won't be what everybody wants, but that's how the system's supposed to work.

You might have more faith in Congress than Daniel and I do, but Daniel, let's shift in and talk about guns. Obviously, this has been a pretty rocky week. Another mass shooting. We've seen more mass shootings this year than we have in recent history.

It seems like rinse and repeat. On Capitol Hill where there are thoughts and prayers, people call for change, but it never happens. Chuck Schumer is going to call together his Democratic caucus on Thursday to have a conversation. Is this now where Democrats on Capitol Hill start to put bills out even though they know, Republicans in the House won't pass them as a way to demonstrate where the two sides sit on this issue.

That was the thing Senate Schumer considered doing and putting everyone on the record on this legislation. It doesn't seem that, that, I mean, we don't know. Let me go back a little bit. We don't know what's gonna happen for now, special caucus meeting where all Senate Democrats are gonna meet this Thursday to discuss gun violence and reform.

That is because of that horrible shooting that took place in Allen, Texas. It's actually a home state and that is a reason why they're moving forward to try to continue these discussions. Of course, Chris Murphy is being the lead Democrat on this issue because he's from Connecticut and sometimes Newtown, Connecticut. But really, Ryan, we've seen this time and time again.

We have to be very clear about what's happening in Congress when it comes to guns. And Republicans and Democrats are completely split on the issue. And Democrats cannot pass any sort of gun legislation, gun reform legislation without at least if that's if every Democrat signs on 50 Democrats, at least 519 Republicans to support that legislation. Right now they only have one.

And of course, a lot of Republicans have been put into that very narrow bill that passed last year that would try to keep guns out of the hands, mental health issues, but that's incredibly narrow. And it's undercarriage are calling for ban on assault rifles. We don't see that happening anytime. But what if Chuck Shore puts a ball on the floor that does something that is widely popular according to polls, like background checks at the federal level?

Would that be to vote for some Republicans? I think it should be. I think background checks are necessary. I would go further.

I think you should. If you want to carry against Hill, you should train. Most Republicans don't feel that way because the discussion is mostly around alienating legal gun owners because all they hear is they're coming take my AR15. And there's a lot of misunderstanding because people don't, they don't know the nature of guns.

They don't know how they operate. So there's a lot of ignorance out there about why the AR15 is a popular weapon. And they want to just say, well, we're going to ban the AR15, most popular frame weapon that's out there because many, many people legally own them. And when they hear bans magazine, all these take away confiscation, all these things I'm saying, all they're saying, but enough are that they just get their backup and sit down what if they did that?

What if it was a bill that was in that very narrow scope, widely popular provisions, background checks, training, put that on the floor, force Republicans and vote for. That's something Democrats have been reluctant to. I think governors would vote for it. Well, this is actually the real point as well, which is there's a huge gap between Republican voters and Republican, I have to say, leaders, but Republican elected officials.

The background check is a 90% issue. And you're telling us there's not one Senate Republican that's willing to do that? I think that's sort of, I think gonna have to keep becoming a forcing issue in our politics around this conversation, which is we've had multiple mass shootings in Texas alone in the last three years, in the last week. And the governor immediately says I'm not doing anything.

You have two sitting governors who actually now know somebody who was killed perhaps. Yeah. Yeah. So we'll have to see.

We'll come to this meeting Thursday and then covering Capital Hill long enough, it seems as though you can only beat your head against the wall so many times before you see the same result over and over again. Daniela, Navy and Brick, we appreciate all being here. Thank you. And after the break, Russia launches an overnight onslaught on Ukraine's cities, shelling nations capital and damaging key infrastructure.

We're on the ground in Kiev next. You're watching MEET THE PRESS now. And welcome back. On the eve of Russia's victory day, commemorating the Soviet defeat of Nazi Germany, Moscow has launched a massive drone attack on cities across Ukraine.

Of course, one of Putin's central pieces of propaganda for invading Ukraine was to, quote, denazify its government. It's worth noting that President Zelensky is Jewish and he lost family in the hall cost. According to Keeves mayor, Russia launched as many as 60 drones, including about three dozen on the capital, all of which were shot down by the country's air defenses. Debris from the intercepted damage, though, did damage residential buildings and injured five people.

But fortunately, no one was killed in the attack. Joining me now is Allison Barber. She's live in Kiev. So, Allison, how is Akiva reacting to this latest round of drone attacks?

And is there any sense of relief given that Ukraine's air defenses were able to intercept these attacks? People are always glad when Ukraine's air defense does their job and is able to intercept so many missiles, drones, whatever it may be, on the city. But at the same time, no one wants to be woken up in the middle of the night to the sound of a raid, sirens and booms and what we had happened here in kyiv overnight was 36 Shahid drones sent towards the those are drones that are very noisy. Typically upon arrival, they're known as loitering munitions.

And they kind of are described often as sounding like a moped. They're really scary. And when people hear the booms, even if it's air defense, intercepting, things like that, it's unsettling, unfortunately, attacks on Kyiv, attacks on other cities that are far away from the front lines by missiles, by drones. It's not something that Ukrainians have not experienced in the past.

Right. You think back to the winter where this was kind of a routine thing, where Russia was constantly sending drones to try and target energy infrastructure in places like Kyiv. So in some ways people are used to this. But it has been relatively calm in Kyiv in recent weeks.

But just in the last eight days, there have been four attempted strikes, assaults on this city. And some of the thought has been that this is coming because there is a very important holiday on the horizon in Ukraine that's in Russia rather, that's main night, what's known as Victory Day. And Ukraine officials have been warning people here that Russia could escalate some of their attacks on cities far from the front lines. And all of this has led to a lot of nervous energy, if you will.

And the big question tonight as we head into that important holiday is what Russia might have in store throughout the evening. Elson Barbara, Life R. Kelson, thank you for that report. And still to come, MEET the Press Reports takes a deep dive into the rise of anti drag extremism.

We're taking behind the scenes of that original reporting next. You're watching MEET THE PRESS now. Welcome back. The newest season of MEET the PRESS Reports is officially underway.

And this season premiere takes a deep dive into the new front in the culture wars, which is the anti drag movement. In March, Tennessee became the first state to pass a bill effectively banning drag performances. And that legislation has been temporary, temporarily blocked by a federal judge. With that pause is set to expire later this month.

NBC News correspondent Antonia Hilton traveled to Tennessee to examine the impacts already being felt by drag performers like Story Van Ness. Over the past year, conservatives have launched a campaign against an art form with a centuries old history among LGBTQ performers. Many Republican lawmakers and activists argue that draft performers are inherently in appropriate sexual in nature, impose a threat to children. A new law in Tennessee restricts performances in public.

Repeat offenders could face a felon charge and up to six years in prison. The law is the first of its kind to Pass, but may not be the only. There are similar bills being considered in at least 17 states. For story and her friend who performs under the name Harry Scarry, it's begun to feel like their very existence is a political act.

The agenda is to just exist and to not and to feel valid. The agenda is to be able to go to the bathroom without having to worry about being punched in the face. And all we can do is say that it's bad and it's wrong and please don't do this to us. But they have found us to be a really effective political tool.

Since the tragic shooting at a Christian school in Nashville, the nation's eyes have been on Tennessee. Gun control took center stage the same way the drag law was set to take effect. Historic youth protest broke out at the state capitol. Democrat lawmakers who took part were expelled and reinstated.

And since the police initially identified the shooter as Trans, the state has felt like a powder gag. I was just sick over it. Then I found out about the identity of the shooter. My whole soul just sank.

It's just gonna be one more thing that they're going to use to to try to exterminate us. And joining me now is Antonio Hilton to talk more about her incredible reporting. So Antonio, this a tensi law is currently being halted, but that pause ends later this morning month. How are drag performers preparing if the law does end up taking effect?

That's right, Brian. So this law is under a temporary restraining order, but just for a couple more weeks. And that's the point at which performers are going to find out whether or not they have to go to trial to defend this art form. The lawsuit came from a number of performers living in the Memphis area who argued that this law was a violation of their first amendment rights.

And a Trump appointed judge actually has for the meantime agreed with them. He just minutes before this law was set to go into effect, put this temporary restraining order in place and ask both sides to provide additional information. And so we'll find out later this month whether this law ultimately is set to go into effect or what the performers are going to have to do to perform safely in the meantime. It's already had a chilling effect, though.

You should know. Performers tell us they've changed their routines, they've hired additional security because they're concerned regardless of whether or not this law goes the into effect, about how people in their state may treat them going forward. And the law is pretty broad. In fact, it doesn't even mention the word drag.

Is that the case with other anti drag bills in other states. That's right. And so what you're seeing often is language like adult oriented performance or female and male impersonator. But make no mistake, you know, I've talked to these lawmakers.

I spoke to the person who drafted this legislation, Senate Majority Leader in Tennessee, Jack Johnson. And while the word drag isn't in the bill, this is a law intended to restrict drag performances from in public or any place that a child might see them. And so while the law could technically, due to some of that vague language, apply to, you know, other sexually explicit performances or some people have brought up, you know, restaurants like Hooters, the reality is when you hear from lawmakers about the actions of enforcement that they're looking for, they're consistently talking about drag performances and offer, often referencing LGBTQ operated venues. Okay, Antonio, you so much for that report.

We appreciate it. Chris will be back tomorrow with more Meet the Press now NBC News now its coverage continues with Hallie Jackson right now. He was a young Marine. She didn't care about convention.

They made a life together. Then one night, the Marine died. And then the death investigation took a wild, unexpected and utterly bizarre turn. I'm Josh Magowitz and this is Trace of Suspicion, an all new podcast from Dayline.

Listen to all episodes of Trace of Suspicion now, wherever you get your podcasts,