Resist or Reform? Vanderbilt’s Chancellor Speaks Out

Should colleges actively resist the Trump administration or find ways to engage and compromise? Vanderbilt University’s chancellor, Daniel Diermeier, has emerged as a leading example of engagement — facing a mix of cheers and jeers in the academy. Jeff and Michael talked with Diermeier about why he thinks higher education needs to change, and his ambitions to grow his institution’s prestige and research impact. This episode is made with support from Ascendium Education Group.

Episode 214 of the Future U Podcast - The Pulse of Higher Ed podcast, hosted by Jeff Selingo and Michael Horn, titled "Resist or Reform? Vanderbilt’s Chancellor Speaks Out" was published on December 16, 2025 and runs 60 minutes.

December 16, 2025 ·60m · Future U Podcast - The Pulse of Higher Ed

0:00 / 0:00

Summary

Should colleges actively resist the Trump administration or find ways to engage and compromise? Vanderbilt University’s chancellor, Daniel Diermeier, has emerged as a leading example of engagement — facing a mix of cheers and jeers in the academy. Jeff and Michael talked with Diermeier about why he thinks higher education needs to change, and his ambitions to grow his institution’s prestige and research impact. This episode is made with support from Ascendium Education Group.

Episode Description

Should colleges actively resist the Trump administration or find ways to engage and compromise? Vanderbilt University’s chancellor, Daniel Diermeier, has emerged as a leading example of engagement — facing a mix of cheers and jeers in the academy. Jeff and Michael talked with Diermeier about why he thinks higher education needs to change, and his ambitions to grow his institution’s prestige and research impact. This episode is made with support from Ascendium Education Group.

Relevant Links:

“Live from Milken: One-on-One with Bill Ackman,” preview Future U episode.

“Arizona State’s President Is Pulling Out All the Stops to Get on Trump’s Good Side,” in The New York Times.

“The Elite-University Presidents Who Despise One Another,” in The Atlantic.

“The (Not So) Quiet Schism Among Academic Leaders,” in The Chronicle of Higher Education.

“College-Age Jews Are Heading South,” in The Atlantic.

Chapters

0:00 - Introduction

2:07 - Why Vanderbilt’s Chancellor Stands Out in This Moment

4:46 - Is Vanderbilt Trying to Beat the Ivies?

7:23 - Why Vanderbilt Chose Dialogue With Trump Administration

10:06 - Did Higher Ed Get Too Comfortable?

11:12 - Are Higher Ed Institutions Up to the Challenge of Responding to Trump?

15:22 - What Daniel Diermeier Sees As Most Needed Reform for Higher Ed

17:40 - Will 'Resistance" by Colleges Hurt Federal Funding Broadly?

21:48 - Could the U.S. Lose the Lead In Higher Ed?

23:25 - Why Jewish Students are Flocking to Vanderbilt -

26:58 - A Plan for Expansion to Other Cities

29:03 - Sponsor Break

29:43 - Is Trump the Symptom or Cause of Higher Ed’s Challenges?

34:37 - A Rift Over How to Respond to Skepticism of College

37:40 - How Could the Research Process Be Reformed?

39:41 - The Fallout from October 7 Protests

43:40 - The Challenge of Political Diversity on Campus

49:37 - Can a New Group of Campuses Unseat the Ivy League?

52:06 - The Role of College Athletics in Campus Prestige

53:06 - A Regional Shift in Prominence

57:55 - Lightning Round With Daniel Diermeier

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