Russia Makes Childless Women See a Psychologist (Should We Adopt This System?)

Russia’s Health Ministry just issued new guidelines: during routine reproductive health checks, doctors are now supposed to ask women how many children they want. If a woman says “zero,” the recommendation is to refer her to a medical psychologist to help form “positive attitudes toward childbirth.”In this episode of Based Camp, Simone and Malcolm break down the policy, Russia’s broader pro-natal cultural offensive (including the new ban on childfree propaganda, revived Mother Heroine medals, and “Year of the Family” initiatives), and whether framing voluntary childlessness as a psychological issue worth treating is a smart move or dystopian overreach.They explore:* Why this targets culture rather than just throwing money at the problem* The surprisingly recent history of “aspirational childfree” as a celebrated lifestyle* How societies throughout history viewed women who didn’t want children* Whether therapists could actually help shift mindsets (or if the real power is in the framing)* Bold ideas like no income tax for parents, school choice, and normalizing motherhood againProvocative, data-rich, and unapologetically pro-family. If you’re tired of the “childfree is empowerment” narrative and want to talk seriously about reversing fertility collapse, this one’s for you.Episode TranscriptSimone Collins: [00:00:00] Hello Malcolm. I’m excited to be speaking with you today because Russia has introduced a new health ministry guideline saying that women who say they don’t want children should be referred for psychological counseling.And, and Russian officials present this as a prenatal measure to address, you know, their,Malcolm Collins: and I was like, I heard it and it generally was multi totalitarian things. I don’t like this much. This when I’m like. My gut says yes, I like this. I like framing it as a psychological disorder for a woman to not want children.Simone Collins: Yeah. Yeah. And you, you actually like it, it was fairly late at night. You just burst into my room and you were like, Russia’s making like aspirational dinks, go to see therapists. And we both had a good laugh about it, but then I, I went and I looked up what the policy actually does. So basically during reproductive health assessments, doctors have been told.That they should ask women how many children they want to have, which is a little dystopian. And then if a woman [00:01:00] says that she does not want any children, the guideline says it is recommended or advisable to send her to a medical psychologist, quote, you know, from Russian quote, to form positive attitudes toward childbirth and reports so far.Describe this as part of clinical guidelines from, from the health ministry and, and not, they’re not like a formal criminal or administrative mandate with explicit penalties for refusing counseling.So this isn’t some dystopian thing. In fact, I think that this is. This is important for us to discuss and interesting because this is just one of many Russian measures that are targeting. The one thing we say actually matters when it comes to prenatal laws policy, which is culture. To your point that you’re building this cultural precedent around a.Shifting the way that women contextualize their choices around not having children. And I think that that’s really super interesting. By the way, men are they, they’re not asked equivalent questions.Malcolm Collins: What? That, that’s where they’re [00:02:00] failing. But I do also like that they frame this as like an explicit problem for women.Mm-hmm. Like women. What is wrong with you? That you do not want children? All women want children, right? Unless there’s something seriously psychologically wrong with you.Simone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: It’s what they’re saying.Simone Collins: It is 100% what they’re saying. So, so what we’re gonna go over in this podcast is, is we’re, I’m gonna give you a little refresher on Russia’s larger landscape of prenatal culture investment.Because while they’re doing some of the, the typical things of like, oh, here’s money if you have a child and here’s some limitations on abortions. Again, I think they’re leading somewhat in the cultural initiative. So we’re, we’ll do a quick briefing on that ‘cause they’re actually doing a lot. And we’ll discuss whether or not we think this is actually a smart development.And then, you know, can, can, for example, psychologists actually be trusted to help women form positive attitudes toward childbirth. And and then kinda look at at how recent, actually the concept of not seeing women as [00:03:00] crazy for wanting to be childless is ‘cause it’s actually. Super. Like it’s a crazy aberration when you look at history.So anyway it, here’s what Russia is currently doing culturally, aside from the abortion and like money stuff to encourage. More children. So one, the government has revived the symbolic hero, mother medals for women, which I valiantly attempted to get the Trump administration to consider making an executive order around.Still waiting on that one. I’m ready. Anytime, guys. TheMalcolm Collins: hero medals from other come on.Simone Collins: Six plus kids, you get a medal. It’s, it costs basically nothing. It can just, you, you don’t even, it could be a Zoom meeting for all the, justMalcolm Collins: come on. Yes. And then all the press would freak out. It would be great for the administration because of all the press freaking out about it.Mm-hmm. And people being like, it’s fascist to wanna be a mother.Simone Collins: Yeah. You and else [00:04:00] is like, wait, but so you reward. People for being war heroes and for contributions to science and for putting, you know, their lives on hold, to move forward the arts or technology or academia. But you don’t reward people for setting their, their lives aside to raise productive citizens.Excuse me. It’s, it’s so anti-feminist. But anyway. Anyway, I’m just putting it out there guys. Any, any moment now can bring back the, the medal of motherhood. But anyway, Russia at least is on it. But also they’ve done some more, some more extreme, and I mean, man, if you did these in the US it would be insane.It’s, it’s not, it’s never gonna happen here. We’re not even talking about it here. But what Russia has done is they have anti dink. That’s dual income, no kids propaganda rules. So in November of 2024, and this was their year of the family, like they had this big propaganda year of the family where they’re like, this [00:05:00] isMalcolm Collins: okay, okay, okay.Simone Collins: All about traditional values. They basically tried to reframe Russia as like, well, Russians believe in traditional families and traditional values and having children and the rest of the world is debauched and gross. And they actually even got some, and we did an episode on this at one point. They got some families.To move out to Russia to pursue their traditional values. ‘cause they’re like, yeah, I mean, I guess America’s not the country of traditional values anymore. So Russia even managed to convince a bunch of Americans that they were the, i they’re notMalcolm Collins: liking it that much.Simone Collins: I mean, to be determined. They there, what we covered in that episode was one particular like, village that was being developed, still is being developed. If you wanna buy a plot of land within my links to their website they’ll help you build the house, they’ll help you with your paperwork. I mean, it’s a, a full service business. You, you, you can live in this little village with other expats.And you know. Yeah, there’s Canadians, there’s Americans. It’s a, it’s a whole thing. But anyway in, in [00:06:00] that year of the family the, the Duma passed a law banning propaganda of child free or deliberately childless lifestyles, which covered media, films, and online content. So even if you’re like an influencer, you can’t be like, I’m proudly child free.I’m a dink. I get to go to bed whenever I want, whatever, you know. And because they’re, they’re seen as basically discouraging people from having children because they are the law introduces administrative fines for individuals, officials, and organizations with possible suspension of activities or even deportation for foreign nationals if they’re judged to promote a child-free ideology.So, while the traditional family values. Of foreigners who’ve moved to Russia to pursue them. I guess any like dink influencers who are out there living it up or, or getting deported in the media, the, the state promotes an, like, actively promotes like an ideal of heterosexual family with at least two, but preferably three children, and they use state media and [00:07:00] films and education campaigns to normalize this as the approved model.Which again, I can’t imagine ever happening in the United States. There’s also a much more strict, and this has been around for much longer than the dink ban, an LGBT propaganda ban. So Russia’s, LGBT, and this, there’s like several laws, it’s like a, a constellation of laws. This is, this is like, it’s a whole thing.In in 2013, Russia adopted a law. So this happened, it started so long ago that banned the propaganda of non-traditional sexual relations to minors. Adding Article 6.21 to the administrative code and framing, LGBT content is harmful to children. And it was used to block pride events and shut down LGBT organizations and fine individuals for public support or visibility even before later expansion.So even in the very early beginnings of this 13 years ago, it was pretty strict. Then in December of 2022, Putin signed amendments that expanded the ban from [00:08:00] minors to everyone. So now any propaganda of non-traditional sexual relations information that makes them seem normal. Or that promotes gender transition is prohibited for all age groups.And that that scope covers the internet and media and films and books and advertising public events or even neutral or factual information about LGBT people counts as propaganda.Malcolm Collins: Just, you just cannot talk about gayness being aSimone Collins: thing. Don’t say like literal, don’t say gay people. Like, oh, like literal.Don’t say gay, but it’s thing. No, no, no. Like actually in Russia. Just don’t say gay. Okay? Just should be safe. And even on November of 2023, Russia’s Supreme Court labeled the so-called International LGBT movement as an extremist organization, which effectively made any organized LGBT activism, potentially prosecutable under anti extremism laws, and then a separate 2023 law banned gender affirming medical [00:09:00] care.Legal gender change. And it also, well, I mean, what’sMalcolm Collins: funny is that in the United States, we’re probably going there. If we look at demographic trends right now and who’s having kids in, in their politics, I would not be surprised if we have laws on the books like this was in our lifetime.Simone Collins: It’s so funny because when we started prenatal list.org, the website was all like.Hey, you know, you know, we’ll help, you know, gay and lesbian couples, you know, become parents. We really wanna make this a, a very inclusive world because, you know, if if these groups don’t manage to be high fertility, we’re not gonna see it anymore. And already, like another element of of, of like the Russian law is if you’ve changed your gender, you can’t adopt or foster children.Like, yeah, exactly what we said. Basically, like if these people don’t have kids. You’re not gonna have these values supported. Yeah. You’re not gonna have this option in the future.Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, well, sorry. The reason why I think the, the trans adoption thing is just really high rates of, of a child molestation in that [00:10:00] community.Simone Collins: Yeah. Yeah.Malcolm Collins: So, it makes a lot of sense to not, and, and specifically of adopted children historically. There’s, there’s been a number of cases of that, so,Simone Collins: yeah. No, I mean, I, I get Yeah, I get that. And we, we can’t go there because I’m too triggered by it. By children being hurt. So moving on in terms of just like, actually the, the health ministry’s guidelines, I, I did have to ask myself like.Can psychologists actually be trusted to help women form healthy views? Because the, the health ministry text simply says, women who say they do not want to have children should be referred to a medical psychologist or clinical psychologist to form positive attitudes toward childbirth. And it doesn’t prescribe any special training or method for this.And so I checked to see if like Russia has like some sort of different. Psychology track that might support this. And while they do have perinatal psychology and psychotherapy programs and associations that train specialists in preparing families for pregnancy and birth and dealing with [00:11:00] fears, maybe helping people grow in mothers and fathers roles, the programs focus on people who are already pregnant or planning children and that they use techniques like informational counseling and family therapy and resource-based art therapy to support hood.But that’s. As people who wanted to have kids already. So I don’t think that like repurposing these types of therapists. To change people’s attitudes about wanting kids at all?Malcolm Collins: No, no, no. Even therapist and therapy culture is one of the triggers in our society of so much of the toxic parts of the urban monoculture.Yeah. To weaponize that very faction of society, even just to normalize with therapists if they are not normalizing. The idea that a woman should want children to their patients. That their job is at risk that they could lose. You know, because this, keep in mind, it doesn’t just normalize it as the women, it normalizes it with the therapist.This is how they have to approach childless [00:12:00] women in therapy.Simone Collins: Well, no, no, no. It only normalizes it with the doctors and its guidelines, not laws. So this doesn’t actually say the therapists have to be the same way. And it, it’s different. And so I could see this shifting where it does shift it where like you have to go to a.Government employed therapist who, who does have that skew, for example. This is happening with the way that abortions work in Russia. So Russia one of the ways that they’re trying to sort of discourage abortions without like outright banning them is they are forcing the closure of many. Private abortion clinics and instead directing them to government based clinics where there are a lot more delays and where you have to listen to a heartbeat and undergo counseling.And so when you have government controlled systems like that, you have more of that. But right now, that’s not happening with the psychologists. They’re just like. What what’s really happening is just the doctors are supposed to be like, well, you need to get that checked out. What’sMalcolm Collins: interesting is in Russia, they decrease abortions by trying to do more taxpayer funded abortions.Simone Collins: Yeah. That, and [00:13:00] that’s, that’s actually quite novel and interesting, isn’t it?Malcolm Collins: Yeah, it is. It is.Simone Collins: Especially coming fromMalcolm Collins: AmericaSimone Collins: where, but but, but, so there is one thing where I’m like, well, maybe because. Basically, poor mental health is linked in several studies to lower childbearing intentions or lower fertility.Like actually both can be affected.Malcolm Collins: Well, I, I would, I would argue that seeing a psychologist is, is gonna be linked with these because it’s linked with more and, and self-perceived lower mental health is gonna be linked with seeing a psychologist and that’s gonna be linked with infection by the urban monoculture.Simone Collins: I mean, I don’t know if it’s the same in Russia though.Malcolm Collins: I mean, I, I wouldn’t be surprised if it wasn’t. And, and you still got the same, you know, wider global education system, wider global, urban monoculture of like the educated elite. I dunno.Simone Collins: I mean, the education system in Russia now is built into their propaganda machine which is very oriented around becoming apparent.And they’re, they’re even like, you know, encouraging.Malcolm Collins: I, I would, I would go further and you know, if somebody’s like, well, I’m [00:14:00] already seeing a psychologist you could do something like psychologists, if, if they report that psychologists go on a register for the number of, childless people who are seeing them.So if they have too many childless people seeing them then they basically get a talking to by the state in some form of repercussions.Simone Collins: Oh, like your license might be under review if like. You have a lot of,Malcolm Collins: yeah, so basically it forces mainstream psychologists to be more pro guiding women in this direction.Simone Collins: I could see that, but, but the, the point I was also trying to make is that if you resolve people’s depression, anxiety, et cetera, it can one, help their overall fertility, because fertility can be depressed by things like stress. And also it could increase their intentions of having children. In fact, when you hear.Well, well, even when we look at movements like Antinatalism Yeah. And we, we talk with people who don’t wanna have kids, it’s, they’re often clearly obviously suffering from [00:15:00] clinical depression, clinical anxiety, like genuine mental health problems. And I do wonder if, like, if we treated those, do you think that would go away?Like, do you think they actually, and I mean many people who don’t wanna have kids directly cite that,they’re like, well, how can I bring children into this world?And maybe if they didn’t feel that way. They’d wanna be parents. I’m just saying like maybe, maybe it could actually help even if it doesn’t directly help, but, but I think the really big thing, and you pointed this out at the very top, you pointed this out at the very top, is that the big cultural shift here?Is not the therapy or the lack of therapy or whether the person actually goes to the referred clinical psychologist. It is that it is being framed as a problem like, Hey, I don’t wanna have children. Wow. You better get that checked out. And that is the important thing, is the cultural reframing of not wanting to have kids as like a form of insanity, a kind of disease that might need treatment.Because it, it’s, it’s really [00:16:00] important to just contextualize this narrative that, that not wanting kids is like, okay. Has, has only existed and, and one has existed, like at all as, as, as a, as a minority view since the 1960s. And in terms of existing as, as a more broadly acceptable thing, really post the two thousands before that.Basically you were crazy if you did not want to be a mother as a woman. So in ancient Rome, motherhood was seen as like the core sign of respectability, marriage and childbearing were just core to what it was to be an honorable woman. And then of course, also there were things like the, the Augustinian birth incentive and honors for bearing several children.Malcolm Collins: And youSimone Collins: can see our episode on medals for motherhood. Go way back. Okay, this, come on, Trump administration. You can do this. Thanks.Malcolm Collins: Well, you, you, you, we did an episode on why Roman [00:17:00] Tism failed. So interesting to see if you’re interested in that topic, but continue.Simone Collins: Yeah. Then in the Christian Middle Ages motherhood was seen as a, a, a spiritual and religious vocation.And really the, the only reason why you, you might not be a mother in, in a sort of justifiable religiously or societally acceptable ways if you like, chose to be a nun. So that was kind of one of the few ways where you could be. A full human as a woman and, and not have children, but you were a spiritual mother then.And then in the early modern to 19th century, a motherhood turned to be something patriotic. So enlighten, enlightenment, and revolutionary era discourse in places like the United States and France, it actually recast women instead of making it like a religious vocation. Like, you know, the cult of the Virgin Mary and all that.Yeah. They, they were reframed as Republican mothers who said, I like this.Malcolm Collins: I like this framing.Simone Collins: Yeah. Civic duty was to raise and bear virtuous citizens. So motherhood became sort of a patriotic role. And in, in contrast, [00:18:00] women who did not marry in bear children could be labeled as Unfeminine Idol or unpatriotic.And in some context, their childlessness was treated as some kind of social. In societal betrayal, which I, I dig. I, I like,Malcolm Collins: I love you. You’re fantastic. But no, I, I agree. In, in Australia, there was a campaign I, in the eighties even that said one for the dad, one for the mom, and one for the state.Oh,Simone Collins: I love that. Yeah. One for the, I mean, that’s, I mean, that’s three, that’s, that’s the number that Russia’s going for. So Yeah. Still, still hanging onto that though, in the, in the 20th century, so starting in the 19 hundreds, motherhood shifted from. You know, respectability and reli, religious virtue and patriotism to this like scientific management.So with the rise of industrialization and urbanization and new professions, this, there was this like intensive, expert driven model of motherhood with scientific, childbearing advice and emerging welfare states. And the everything sort of framed [00:19:00] mothers as, as managers of children’s physical and psychological development.You even saw this kind of starting with the Victorian era where like women were in charge of the household and like managing all these things. And this is where you actually get the, the first cracks, but only starting in the 1960s where women were starting to critic. The, the concept of compulsory motherhood.And, and they were like, oh, well this limits my education and my work and my autonomy. And this is of course, the result of families starting to atomize everything and no longer look at families as this cohesive unit, but rather look at everyone as individuals and when, when. Everyone starts leaning out of the family, then it suddenly becomes, well, what about me?What about my education? What about my identity? When really everyone should be leaning into this one thing which is, you know, this unbroken chain you’ve been a part of for millions of years. It shouldn’t terminate with you, but whatever. And then you finally get the rise of the child free movement only really in the early 21st century.So after the year 2000 is when suddenly you start getting things. I mean, the term dink is [00:20:00] super new. Dual income. No. Yeah. Like that’s, yeah.Malcolm Collins: Yeah.Simone Collins: This, this concept of like being proud of it and identifyingMalcolm Collins: of aspirationally child freeSimone Collins: Yeah.Malcolm Collins: Is really modern. It was not true even when I was growing up.Nobody, nobody was aspirationally child free.Simone Collins: Yeah. It was still, still sad. It was like, oh, you know, this is, like it, it was viewed as some form of misfortune or, or, or selfishness or coldness or career obsession. And like, oh, you know, she’s a little off. Like it was still, she’s a little off. And thenMalcolm Collins: you could brag about it.Like it’s not that nobody bragged about it, but they came off. The same way that like a militant lesbian would today or something like that. Right? Like yeah. Somebody who is incredibly detached from society and its values. Yeah. And is attempting to aggressively signal to youSimone Collins: detached they’re societal norms and like mainstream respectability and sort of proudly so.But now this concept of childlessness. Or, or child family [00:21:00] size limitation is something that people even use to virtue signal. Like, you know, Harry and Megan back before they became disgraced being like, well, we’re never gonna have more than two children because it’s bad for the environment. You know, so even people having children.Trying to virtue signal their choice to not have more children. And that, that is really the tipping point. And so here you see with this policy, Russia trying to subtly change that default of, no, this is not virtuous. Something is mentally wrong with you, go see a shrink. Which I think is actually pretty good.I, I like it. It’s favorable. What do you think?Malcolm Collins: Yeah,Simone Collins: it’sMalcolm Collins: good. No, I mean, I, I of all of the strategies I have heard around this, I think this is a very good strategy for multiple reasons. I think that there are better ways it could be implemented Yeah. Than the government shrinks. Like if you implemented this.Through mainstream shrinks. But you said if X percent of your patients, like, you know, we have a registry. Right. And if somebody’s like, I’m [00:22:00] already seeing a shrink, and then you, you, your license was under review. Mm-hmm. You get enormous pressure as a psychologist to talk your patients in to this particular life path.Yeah. And I think that there are, and, and to glorify and normalize being a mom, like, have you thought about it? What’s holding you up? Why don’t you have a partner yet? Right. So it’s like going to your parents’ house every time you go to a shrink. So why don’t you have a partner yet? And did you, did you follow through with the things you were gonna follow through with?And the other thing that I think it could also be expanded into other environments, like high school life counselors evenSimone Collins: bring back those dating instructional videos.Malcolm Collins: Yes. Simone loves thoseSimone Collins: so good.Malcolm Collins: But I think. Yeah, and, and, and, and I think in. Posters in advertisements to talk about the disease of childlessness.Like to frame it [00:23:00] as the way it used to be framed, like a barrenness and pitiable. You know, like having people gossiping about somebody being childless or something. Right. You know, like, oh, do you think, you know, and that would do a lot to,Simone Collins: here’s my thing though, is I kind of. I feel like a lot of these cultural efforts, when you look for example, at what Russia has done it and, and when you see China too, like China’s statues of one child family suddenly turning into three child families and stuff.I feel that that has a very distinct dystopian ring to it. And as much as I love motherhood medals because of that, because it causes the extra buzz, but then causes people to be like, well, but yeah, actually, what’s wrong with rewarding people who sacrifice their lives for, to raise good citizens? I, I.I don’t know, like and may tell me if I’m crazy here. I just feel like over time, intuitively I know it will never happen, and this is why I still lean on culture most as the most feasible intervention. But if I were Empress of the world, the one and [00:24:00] only thing I would doMalcolm Collins: added to the dsm.Simone Collins: No, I would just, for the period when parents are raising children, so they have children in their households that are under 18 years, no income tax.Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I think the, we should do that. The reason why it would never pass like that is you would need to say no income tax until you get to a certain level, becauseSimone Collins: Sure. That’s, that’s fine.Malcolm Collins: Actually, no, that’s not exactly because they, because then people also,Simone Collins: keep in mind, Malcolm, the wealthiest people don’t have income.Malcolm Collins: Yeah, true.Simone Collins: It’s all, it’s all investments and stuff, so I even, I am like, I’m fine with capping it at like, you know, up to whatever, like $500,000 or 200. Like I don’t care, like 200,000. Like whatever. I don’t, I don’t like. But here’s the thing is middle class families are the ones that are hit hardest by the costs of raising children, but they’re also the ones that are producing the highest [00:25:00] tax paying children and citizens who are gonna prop up the social programs.Right. Well, okay,Malcolm Collins: this is the way I would handle this if I was gonna do it. Okay. It would be a progressive thing where you need to have five kids to have no income tax.Simone Collins: Oh yeah.Malcolm Collins: And you get a one fifth of that with every kid that you have potentially scaling. So like, not aSimone Collins: lot. Yeah. I just, I think that people should be rewarded by it more as they make more income.And this is like income generated by work done, you know, not investment income ‘cause you’re not doing work. To,Malcolm Collins: oh, people would freak out so much at that. Would people freak out about having to pay into a tax system that supports other people’s kids? LikeSimone Collins: we do that already. It just happens to be children of people who are not generating any taxes.Malcolm Collins: And we can fix this by shutting down public schools.Simone Collins: Yeah, that’s never gonna happen. But anyway yeah, I mean, I bring it up a lot because it’s never gonna happen and I don’t like talking about should haves ‘cause that’s just, it’s pointless. There’s no pragmatism to it.Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, public schools do [00:26:00] need to be shut down though.Like, I, I, I feel very strongly that they are one of the biggest forces of social negative disruption at this point. And that they are basically torture for children. And that with AI, they become increasingly less relevant.Simone Collins: They kind of always have been though. Like even when you look back at actually I think one of the Bronte sisters died after attending a, a girl’s school.Like ever since external schools existed they’ve been brutal and terrible. I, in, in general, what I’ve learned from the, the people in the base camp network. Who are better at this than I am more informed about all these things, and they’ve introduced me to all of this stuff. Basically when kids start being raised by people who are not related to them by blood stuff goes wrong, they’re not as invested.And when you go back to the very earliest schools as we understand them, sort of this industrial schooling model, it’s just not good. And you know, you have these Dickensian schools, they’re just horrible. You’ve got. [00:27:00] WBS or AKA do The boys school in Nicholas Nickleby, just horrible places. I mean, they always have been terrible.And now they’re, they’re still terrible, but things are so complicated you can’t really shut them down because they’re also a means of distributing a form of childcare in the United States where you’re gonna get arrested if your kid isn’t being minded. So a lot of parents. Can’t function without the public school system because also they’re gonna like,Malcolm Collins: yeah, well, I mean, we need an alternativeSimone Collins: toMalcolm Collins: it somewhere where kids can go and learn by themselves during the day.Simone Collins: I know that’s, that was the whole model we were developing with the Collins Institute is just that you, you, you can’t get support for anything that’s not like some kind of underprivileged child with hepatitis program or, you know, some form of. I don’t know, likeMalcolm Collins: if you wanna try out the Collins Institute, it’s operational, you can try it at paraia doo or collins institute.org.It is inexpensive [00:28:00] and it is a great AI educational thing for slightly older kids, like once they can read fluently. And if you wanna try out our project right now our fab.ai, which is ai like adventure chatbots, companion chatbots, and a agentic models which we are constantly,anyway. I thought this was a interesting one, Simone.Simone Collins: I find it fascinating too.Malcolm Collins: I love the Trump administration even just using this like the next time we do things to the administration. I would 100%, like if, if I could go back and, and do those pitches to the administration, I would include this, because obviously the administration’s not going to, oh,Simone Collins: the, the health health guidelines encouraging.Malcolm Collins: Encouraging single women, women whiz without children to see a therapist about being childless because the media would freak out. ISimone Collins: feel like I like the metal hood mother. Sorry, the metal hood, the motherhood metal more. It’s because this is more positive [00:29:00] and cool.Malcolm Collins: I agree, but it’s less funny. The I mean they did go completely epileptic about that.They were just likeSimone Collins: apoplecticMalcolm Collins: app, whatever, the app, the Apple word. They went apples. They went apples. And they said, oh no. And it’s proof. We finally found the proof that they’re Nazis. Oh mySimone Collins: God.Malcolm Collins: They’re, they got the Nazi medal. They’re, they’re Nazis. TheySimone Collins: always, yeah. TheyMalcolm Collins: love,Simone Collins: they just loved that when we submitted that executive order.Well,Malcolm Collins: thank you. I, I love our public profile, Simone. It’s dead.Simone Collins: It’s great. It’s great.Malcolm Collins: I’m, I’m, I’m scooting on it. I love it. I’m having fun with it. More of that,Simone Collins: more of that always.Malcolm Collins: All right. And for dinner tonight, we are doingSimone Collins: Rendang.Malcolm Collins: Yes. Rendang. Very excited for that. Mm-hmm. Oh, and you can even mix in some peppers if they’re still good.Simone Collins: Yeah. I’ll check. I’ll check.Malcolm Collins: Okay. Okay.Simone Collins: Love [00:30:00] you.Malcolm Collins: Love you. And great episode, Simone. Thank you so much. Do you wanna do another or do you want to,Simone Collins: What do you want for dinner? I’m making Octavian and, and Titan giant pancakes because they’ve demandedMalcolm Collins: giant pound of cakes,Simone Collins: pancakes. Yeah. So this one day I made like normal sized pancakes and then I made one super giant one, and Octavian just thought it was the best thing in the world and like, like a perfectly round Japanese looking one, you know, like.You don’t watch that. I’llMalcolm Collins: have Ang and RiceSimone Collins: Instagram, so I guess you would never knowMalcolm Collins: you’re, you’re pan faring stuff. So I’ll have reang and rice and the, the reang cooked with coconut oil toSimone Collins: coconut milk.Malcolm Collins: Coconut milk, yeah, whatever. To make it a bit less thick. AndSimone Collins: do you want me to put, do you want me to add hoisin sauce or some.SambolMalcolm Collins: Reang. Yeah, I think reang could deal with some hoist and sauce [00:31:00] and a bit of symbolic actually. Yeah. Not as much as normal, but I think that that’ll add a bit of a kick to it.Simone Collins: Alright, we’re on. Okay. Okay. Let me get my. Right. Okay.Speaker: You found flower petals. What? Oh my God. Are they coming from the tree? They’re coming from all these flowers. Wow. Have you ever seen anything like that before? Yeah, but what day is it? Well, it’s spring. That’s why. There’s flower petals everywhere. Yeah. Do you like spring? Yeah. ‘cause I get to.Speaker 2: Flower twice. Okay. I go in flower.Speaker 3: Wow. That’s a lot of flower petals. [00:32:00] I’ve never seen anything like this. This is crazy. I.Speaker: You having a flower pedal fight? Yeah. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit basedcamppodcast.substack.com/subscribe