Terrence Deacon & Michael Levin: What is Life? Complexity, Cognition & the Origin of Purpose episode artwork

EPISODE · May 9, 2025 · 1H 29M

Terrence Deacon & Michael Levin: What is Life? Complexity, Cognition & the Origin of Purpose

from Mind-Body Solution · host Dr Tevin Naidu

Professor Terrence Deacon & Professor Michael Levin have both shaped the fields of developmental evolutionary biology, cognitive science, and so much more. In this episode of Mind-Body Solution, these distinguished giants come together in conversation for the very first time: "A Biology Revolution". Terrence Deacon is Professor and Chair of the Department of Anthropology and member of the Helen Wills Neuroscience Institute at the University of California, Berkeley.Michael Levin is Professor in the Biology department at Tufts University and associate faculty at the Wyss Institute for Bioinspired Engineering at Harvard University. TIMESTAMPS:(0:00) - Introduction(0:42) - Mike on Terry's work(1:32) - Terry on Mike's work (2:48) - Mike & Terry on Daniel Dennett's work(8:10) - Origin of Life & Purpose (Terry's perspective: complexity, thermodynamics, memory)(14:37) - Origin of Life & Purpose (Mike's perspective: models of scaling, polycomputing, spaces of reality)(20:08) - The Self, Beneficiaries & Causal Emergence(26:00) - Strange Loops & Semiotics (Metabolism precedes Neural activity)(29:00) - Causality: Constraints, Morphological Computing & Environmental Offloading (32:50) - Lazy Gene Hypothesis, Inverse Darwinism, Constraints & Energy(40:15) - Regeneration & Memory: Decompression Processes & Complexity(45:30) - Meta-Constraints: Problem Solving Agents & Bioengineering Surprises (beyond genes)(52:57) - Hypothesis Generation & Adaptive Nervous Systems (Competitions between Interpretations)(57:48) - Biologizing Cognition: Evolutionary & Developmental(1:02:40) - Terry's Critique of Mike's work (Preformationism)(1:06:00) - Mike's Response(1:15:22) - Mike's Critique of Terry's work (Teleonomy)(1:18:03) - Terry's Response(1:23:50) - Goal Directedness(1:26:22) - Final Thoughts(1:28:55) - Conclusion EPISODE LINKS:- Mike's Podcast 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6gp-ORTBlU- Mike's Podcast 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMxTS7eKkNM- Mike's Podcast 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1R-tdscgxu4- Mike's Lecture: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQEX-twenkA- Terry's Podcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Kj2OgkxGa0- Terry's Lecture: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=refDeUzgdIg- Daniel Dennett Tribute: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3cWQLUbnKsCONNECT:- Website: https://tevinnaidu.com - Podcast: https://creators.spotify.com/pod/show/mindbodysolution- YouTube: https://youtube.com/mindbodysolution- Twitter: https://twitter.com/drtevinnaidu- Facebook: https://facebook.com/drtevinnaidu - Instagram: https://instagram.com/drtevinnaidu- LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/drtevinnaidu=============================Disclaimer: The information provided on this channel is for educational purposes only. The content is shared in the spirit of open discourse and does not constitute, nor does it substitute, professional or medical advice. We do not accept any liability for any loss or damage incurred from you acting or not acting as a result of listening/watching any of our contents. You acknowledge that you use the information provided at your own risk. Listeners/viewers are advised to conduct their own research and consult with their own experts in the respective fields.

Professor Terrence Deacon & Professor Michael Levin have both shaped the fields of developmental evolutionary biology, cognitive science, and so much more. In this episode of Mind-Body Solution, these distinguished giants come together in conversation for the very first time: "A Biology Revolution". Terrence Deacon is Professor and Chair of the Department of Anthropology and member of the Helen Wills Neuroscience Institute at the University of California, Berkeley.Michael Levin is Professor in the Biology department at Tufts University and associate faculty at the Wyss Institute for Bioinspired Engineering at Harvard University. TIMESTAMPS:(0:00) - Introduction(0:42) - Mike on Terry's work(1:32) - Terry on Mike's work (2:48) - Mike & Terry on Daniel Dennett's work(8:10) - Origin of Life & Purpose (Terry's perspective: complexity, thermodynamics, memory)(14:37) - Origin of Life & Purpose (Mike's perspective: models of scaling, polycomputing, spaces of reality)(20:08) - The Self, Beneficiaries & Causal Emergence(26:00) - Strange Loops & Semiotics (Metabolism precedes Neural activity)(29:00) - Causality: Constraints, Morphological Computing & Environmental Offloading (32:50) - Lazy Gene Hypothesis, Inverse Darwinism, Constraints & Energy(40:15) - Regeneration & Memory: Decompression Processes & Complexity(45:30) - Meta-Constraints: Problem Solving Agents & Bioengineering Surprises (beyond genes)(52:57) - Hypothesis Generation & Adaptive Nervous Systems (Competitions between Interpretations)(57:48) - Biologizing Cognition: Evolutionary & Developmental(1:02:40) - Terry's Critique of Mike's work (Preformationism)(1:06:00) - Mike's Response(1:15:22) - Mike's Critique of Terry's work (Teleonomy)(1:18:03) - Terry's Response(1:23:50) - Goal Directedness(1:26:22) - Final Thoughts(1:28:55) - Conclusion EPISODE LINKS:- Mike's Podcast 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6gp-ORTBlU- Mike's Podcast 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMxTS7eKkNM- Mike's Podcast 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1R-tdscgxu4- Mike's Lecture: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQEX-twenkA- Terry's Podcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Kj2OgkxGa0- Terry's Lecture: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=refDeUzgdIg- Daniel Dennett Tribute: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3cWQLUbnKsCONNECT:- Website: https://tevinnaidu.com - Podcast: https://creators.spotify.com/pod/show/mindbodysolution- YouTube: https://youtube.com/mindbodysolution- Twitter: https://twitter.com/drtevinnaidu- Facebook: https://facebook.com/drtevinnaidu - Instagram: https://instagram.com/drtevinnaidu- LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/drtevinnaidu=============================Disclaimer: The information provided on this channel is for educational purposes only. The content is shared in the spirit of open discourse and does not constitute, nor does it substitute, professional or medical advice. We do not accept any liability for any loss or damage incurred from you acting or not acting as a result of listening/watching any of our contents. You acknowledge that you use the information provided at your own risk. Listeners/viewers are advised to conduct their own research and consult with their own experts in the respective fields.

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This episode was published on May 9, 2025.

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Professor Terrence Deacon & Professor Michael Levin have both shaped the fields of developmental evolutionary biology, cognitive science, and so much more. In this episode of Mind-Body Solution, these distinguished giants come together in...

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