Will this treaty solve ocean plastic? | Where The Ocean Meets: Dr. Patrick Schröder

Where The Ocean Meets: Dr. Patrick Schröder - Inside the Global Plastic Treaty NegotiationsEpisode DescriptionRight now in Geneva, 175 countries are negotiating the world's first global treaty to end plastic pollution - and it's not going smoothly. Dr. Patrick Schröder from Chatham House takes us inside the negotiation rooms where fossil fuel lobbyists outnumber entire country delegations, where a single article could make or break the entire agreement, and where the future of international cooperation hangs in the balance.From microplastics in newborn babies to real-time diplomatic drama, this episode reveals how the world actually creates treaties - and why this one matters for your health, our oceans, and generations to come.The Scale of Plastic Pollution: Why production is set to triple by 2060 and health costs hit $1.5 trillion annuallyHow Treaties Actually Work: From citizen concern to UN resolutions to diplomatic conferencesInside the Negotiation Rooms: Contact groups, bracketed text, and real-time editing on big screensThe Players: High Ambition Coalition vs Like-Minded GroupArticle 6: The make-or-break provision about limiting plastic production that has countries dividedWhat Happens Next: From national action plans to Conference of Parties meetingsNotable Quotes"We have micro and nano plastics in our bodies... in placentas and newborn babies.""Nobody wants plastic pollution. You cannot argue that it's a natural issue. It is manmade.""Some countries actually want to delay the process.""Concluding this successfully is not only about plastics, but about the ability of the international community to work together."About the Guest:Dr. Patrick Schröder is a Senior Research Fellow at Chatham House's Environment and Society Centre, specializing in the global transition to a circular economy. He serves as Coordinating Lead Author for UNEP's Global Environmental Outlook 7 and is a member of the International Science Council's expert group on plastic pollution. He's currently reporting from the INC 5.2 negotiations in Geneva.Lancet Countdown on Plastics Pollution Report (released ahead of INC 5.2)INC Plastic Pollution Negotiations WebsiteChair's Text from Busan (20 articles under negotiation)[02:02] Introduction and Chatham House Rule correction[03:29] Patrick's background in plastic pollution research[06:37] Scale of the plastic pollution problem[10:55] How international treaties actually get started[15:29] Why plastic pollution needs a global treaty[20:51] The breakthrough moment in Nairobi 2022[23:15] Inside the INC negotiation process[31:39] Why negotiations are taking longer than expected[35:22] Article 6: The production debate[39:55] What happens after a treaty is signed[47:04] What makes treaties work vs. just sound good[57:45] Global cooperation in divisive times[1:01:29] Rapid fire: Seahorses and optimismWebsite: chathamhouse.orgPatrick's Articles: Chatham House plastic treaty publicationsFollow the Negotiations: Updates from Geneva at INC 5.2If this episode helped you understand international treaties and plastic pollution, please share it with someone who cares about our oceans. Subscribe for more conversations where complex global issues meet accessible explanations.Recorded August 6, 2025, during the INC 5.2 negotiations in Geneva, Switzerland.