Autism Learning Lab Podcast

Live from the 2026 Autism Symposium, host Chris Blankenship welcomes Dr. Jack Hinman, founder and admissions director of Engage Transitions in Cedar City, Utah, to discuss the benefits of transitional living and therapy for neurodivergent individuals. Dr. Hinman shares how Engage Transitions supports neurodivergent young adults by providing opportunities to explore hobbies and connect with nature—experiences that help build resilience and body awareness. He also emphasizes the importance of strong connections among peers, staff, and onsite therapists, creating a trusting and caring environment for everyone who participates in the Engage Transitions program.Links:Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Transitions: https://engagelifenow.com/Quotes:[11:23-11:27] Dr. Hinman “We believe that it all starts with connection, relationships, and proximity....”[14:08-14:12] Dr. Hinman “When you’re engaged, you're working on connection, independence, and health.” [15:09-15:15] Chris Blankenship “The most predictive factor for success in treatment is whether you feel comfortable with your therapist.”

In this episode host Chris Blankenship talks with Dr. Will White -  author, podcast host, and the Director of Enrollment at The Trade. They explore the value of trade careers and why they can be a meaningful, practical path for young autistic individuals.Resources: Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] from the Field: A Wilderness Therapy PodcastStories from the Field: A History of Wilderness TherapyThe Trade Quotes:[2:49-2:59] Dr. White: “And yet the trades are always going to be needed because AI is not going to build a house." [12:39-12:56] Dr. White: “And so what we’re trying to do is train the apprentices so by the time they leave after nine months to a year, they’re ready to go to a job site because they’ve got used to working 40 hours a week. And they’ve learned the skills.”[16:16-16:21] Dr. White: “And we know that the trades aren't for everyone, but it should be an option for anyone.”[17:37-17:46] Dr. White “There’s so many options right now where it seems like after a four year degree, nobody knows what the options will be.”#AutismLearningLab #Autism #AutisticKids #YoungAdults #TradeWork #Trade #WorkingYoungAdults

Chris welcomes special guest Harry Psaros—a father, autism advocate, and bestselling author of From Struggle to Strength: A Father’s Journey with Autism and the Power of Hope and Positivity. Harry also serves as an executive neuroscience account specialist with AbbVie and sits on the board of directors for the Autism Caring Center.Driven by a mission to amplify the voices of fathers in the autism community, Harry shares his personal journey raising a child with autism, offering powerful insights on resilience, hope, and positivity. This conversation highlights how families can navigate challenges, find strength in their experiences, and build fulfilling, meaningful lives together.Resources: Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Psaros WebsiteHarry Psaros ResourcesFrom Struggle to Strength: A Father's Journey with Autism and the Power of Hope and PositivityQuotes:[6:29-6:37] Harry: “My son will persevere no matter what happens. I’m going to be the engine behind changing his life and assisting him and helping him." [8:14-8:18] Harry: “I call it unrelenting love. That’s what you need to do. You know, you need to settle in on that.”[21:24-21:32] Harry: “But I really firmly believe that your house should be a place of distinct positivity for that child.”[23:44-23:47] Harry “Ask yourself one question. Does God make a mistake? I don’t think he does.”

In this episode of Autism Learning Lab, host Chris Blankenship sits down with Dr. Minh Nguyen, DO, board-certified psychiatrist and founder of Cedar Integrative Psychiatry, for an insightful conversation on what psychiatric care can look like for neurodivergent individuals. Together, they explore what to expect from a first-time appointment, address common fears surrounding medication, and discuss how mental health care can be approached through a neurodiversity-affirming lens. Dr. Nguyen highlights the importance of supporting co-occurring conditions such as anxiety, burnout, sleep challenges, and executive functioning difficulties. Most importantly, this conversation emphasizes treating each patient as a unique individual—prioritizing personalization, autonomy, and compassionate care.Links:Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Integrative Psychiatry: https://cedarintegrativepsychiatry.com/Quotes:[9:23-9:45] Dr. Nguyen “By treating the co-occurring conditions, you're reducing the unnecessary suffering and making it easier to adapt in work and relationships at home. It doesn't fix the issue, but it makes it much, much easier to live with.”[18:38-18:47] Dr. Nguyen “The fear is not understanding and not having freedom in these choices.” [20:00-20:25] Dr. Nguyen “Because there's no real right way to do something. It's just what makes this person the most comfortable knowing that in the at the end of the day they're the one that's taking the medication, you know, like day in and day out they're the one that's going to bed knowing that this is something that's in their body and whether or not this aligns with like their values and what they want out of their life.” [25:15-25:28] Dr. Nguyen “I think I'm called to do this work is to show people that psychiatry itself isn't scary or evil and hurts people and that there is a way to practice that really helps people.”

In the 24th episode of the Autism Learning Lab, host Chris Blankenship discusses the relationship between autism and dietary struggles with nutrition therapist and intuitive eating counselor Estee Glikman. Glikman explains how biology, sensory processing, and neurotransmitters all play a role in the challenges neurodivergent individuals face when eating. She not only provides science-based insight but also offers practical strategies to those navigating dietary challenges. Glikman's main goal is to lead neurodivergent individuals to more freedom and flexibility regarding food. If you or someone you know struggles with rigid eating patterns, sensory sensitivities, or mealtime battles, this episode offers clarity, validation, and hope.Links:Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Meal Planning Tool: https://babybloomnutrition.com/ARFID Treatment and Support: https://equip.health/our-treatmentQuotes:[2:23 -2:41] Estee Glikman “When we talk about meals, meals are one of the few activities in our lives that integrate all five senses. So if someone is struggling with sensory input or their brain is having a lot of information being directed toward them at once they’re going to have a hard time potentially eating. ”[7:41 - 7:52] Estee Glikman “Because our gut is lined with nerves, so there’s just no way that we can have mood changes, neurotransmitter changes without it affecting the gut in some way.  ”[20:12 -20:19 ] Estee Glikman “From my perspective, the bigger the treatment team: the more support and the more support: the more success.”

Chris chats with 15-year-old Kincaid, a passionate theater kid and film making enthusiast. Kincaid reflects on his experience with autism—starting with his initial diagnosis, addressing misunderstandings, and discovering his love for performing arts and videography. With humor and insight, he discusses hyperfixations, the getting involved in inclusive communities, and his belief that a diagnosis should not define a person. This podcast is an uplifting reminder that the greatest role you can play is yourself. Links:Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:[9:43-9:45] Kincaid “If I want something, I will continue to work for that something endlessly.”[12:01-12:06] Kincaid “I like to say that high functioning autism is both the best and worst type of autism to have.”[15:20-15:28] Kincaid “Don't let the diagnosis define you, because as I said, I probably wouldn't have known that I had autism unless I was diagnosed.”

Chris welcomes Dr. Kristen Williamson—a “neuro-spicy” licensed professional counselor, behavior health consultant, and unapologetic champion for neurodivergent minds. Dr. Williamson shares her expertise alongside her personal journey of navigating life as a late-diagnosed autistic and ADHD professional.Chris and Kristen dive into how autism presents in women, the challenges of masking, and the unique experiences of motherhood as a neurodivergent parent. Kristen is relatable, insightful, and inspiring, offering practical strategies and heartfelt wisdom for anyone looking to better understand themselves or the neurodivergent people in their lives. Whether you’re a parent, professional, or neurodivergent individual yourself, this conversation is full of validation, humor, and empowering takeaways.Links:Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Solutions: https://www.empowermindsolutionsllc.com/Quotes:[2:22 - 2:27] Dr. Williamson “I fully believe we have the spice of life.”[13:26-13:43] Dr. Williamson “We have had a lifetime of medical personnel, family personnel, teachers, like everyone's saying, ‘You're either too much, you're not enough, you're fine.' And then it's like we have this death by micro cuts.’”[19:03-19:22] Dr. Williamson “I often times tell people my brain feels like a giant room filled with filing cabinets. Each of the things is just information that I have gathered and collected. Very little is organically brought up. It's all scripted in my brain.”[21:41-21:46] Dr. Williamson “ ‘Trust your gut.’ I don’t trust anything in my gut — it doesn’t even tell me when I’m hungry.”[32:13-32:36] Dr. Williamson “The hunter -gatherer mentality. The hunters were the ADHD brains. They would go out and spend all this time looking, and they don't need to eat. They don't sleep as much. They can just do this. And the gatherers are the autism brains. Look at this wheat. Let me collect. Let me organize this into beautiful little piles. And both are needed to have a fully functioning drive.”

Chris sits down with Dr. Sam Shay—a neurodiverse clinician, functional medicine expert, and stand-up comic—who brings over 25 years of experience to the table. Dr. Sam shares his groundbreaking Neuroharmony Model, designed to helpneurodiverse adults and families create balance in an often overwhelming world.Together, they discuss the relationship between physiology and psychology, the importance of frameworks in personalized health plans, and practical strategies for burned-out parents, autistic adults, and anyone seeking better sleep, nutrition, and resilience. Dr. Sam offers both hope and a roadmap to real change.Links:Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]. Sam Shay: https://drsamshay.com/Quotes:[4:12 - 4:20] Dr. Shay “If the parents are burnt out or unwell, then they can’t be of support to their child.”[6:38 - 6:49] Dr. Shay “Functional medicine is the best of Western medicine lab diagnostics with the best of natural medicines, lifestyle, diet, nutrition, and interventions.”[15:00 -15:10] Dr. Shay “I’m proud to call myself Asperger’s or an Aspie, because it was Asperger’s syndrome that brought the Nazis down. And I can prove it with three names: Oppenheimer, Einstein, and Turing.”[21:39 - 21:47] Dr. Shay “The goal here is not perfection but to make a client feel that they are on track.”[28:39 - 28:47]Dr. Shay “There’s no such thing as a panacea, but consistent, super high-quality sleep is a close second.”

Chris welcomes Rob Meltzer—founder of Northlight Family Services and New Terrain Consulting, certified Gestalt therapist, and educational planner—for a deep dive into the intersection of autism, wellness, and metabolic health. Rob shares how his own health journey led him to explore functional medicine and epigenetics, and how those insights are transforming the way we approach support for autistic individuals. Together, Chris and Rob explore the concept of “treating the terrain”—looking beyond symptoms to the underlying biological, emotional, and environmental factors that shape mental health and neurodivergence. From the benefits of ketogenic diets to the transformative power of outdoor programs, this conversation offers a hopeful, holistic vision of care that honors each person’s unique context.Links:Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Family Services: https://www.northlightfamily.com/Quotes:[2:52 - 3:40] Rob Meltzer “In mainstream medicine, we must look at the symptoms... Once you see what’s wrong, you use evidence-based approaches to treat the symptoms. Using that method, if we were treating a tree with a brown leaf, we would see that the leaf is brown and maybe the most efficient evidence-based way to turn the leaf green again is to inject some green dye into the leaf… when we all know, you gotta water the plant, you gotta tend to the soil.” [16:37-17:00] Rob Meltzer “I don't see anybody saying, I know what the cause of autism is, you know, there's been an intense search for the gene or the genes and they're not finding it. No. (So that to me, it's, you know, this is the important, really important point.) It's not like you have a gene for autism.It's the way that the genes are expressing.”[7:21-7:36] Rob Meltzer “If we've got people—psychies—who are not functioning the way we want to, we can treat that, treat that medically or whatever, but we can also treat the terrain. That’s what I’ve started thinking about.” [24:54 - 25:00] Rob Meltzer “ Necessity is the number one catalyst for change.”

Chris welcomes Brandon Moffitt—executive director of Black Mountain Academy and Intrepid Young Adults—to talk about the importance of connection for autistic youth. They discuss the repeated struggles many autistic individuals face when trying to form relationships—and how these setbacks can take a toll on self- esteem. Brandon offers guidance to parents on how to support their children in navigating social experiences, emphasizing the power of affirmation, encouragement, and helping kids find their “tribe.” He also addresses the impact of growing up in a digital world with fewer face-to-face interactions, and why creating real- life opportunities for connection is more important than ever.Links:Black Mountain Academy:https://theblackmountainacademy.com/Intrepid: https://intrepidyoungadults.com/Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:[13:55-14:09] Brandon: “But we don't want to miss the fact that failure has a tremendous impact on self-esteem and social resilience and self-advocacy and all of these things are so critical to becoming a successful young adult.”[15:15-15:35] Brandon: “Starting with affirmation and support, seeing the best in your child and seeing the best in who they are becoming, their most wonderful qualities. Always speaking to the best of who they are, the best of who they can be, the best of who they want to be, is really a critical part of this.”[19:48-20:14] Brandon: “And I think for all young people, not just people in the spectrum, who are very accustomed, this generation is very accustomed to being online. And again, in and of itself, it's not a bad thing. But it means there's less time, less practice, less face-to-face interaction. And so we just really want to find out meaningful ways, thoughtful ways, enjoyable ways to have that practice, to have those connections, to foster those.”[33:27-33:54] Brandon: “And I want to be that voice of, you matter, what you care about matters. And there’s people out there who will love what you love and will celebrate who you are and keep looking and keep searching for that because it's out there and I love that I get to be a part of finding that sense of a tribe and building social community.”

In this episode, Chris welcomes Paula Leslie—an experienced counselor, parent coach, and therapeutic placement specialist with over 30 years in the mental health field and a parent of a child with autism. Paula shares her personal andprofessional journey, reflecting on the early signs of autism, the challenges of navigating diagnoses, and how to advocate effectively for meaningful support. Together, they explore what it means to lean into a child’s strengths while addressing their struggles, the importance of setting clear, collaborative goals with professionals, and why embracing the hard moments is essential for growth. With compassion and wisdom, Paula offers insight—and hope—into the evolving landscape of autism support and treatment.Links:Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:[8:38-9:05] Chris: “You're saying, all right, there is strength here and there's weakness here, but how can we really lean into these strengths while bolstering these weaknesses? Because just because just because he's not reading at third grade doesn't mean he shouldn't be learning. He absolutely should be. But howcan we give him this information, this content, in a way that he is accessible to him? You're identifying a number of strengths here, too, which I think so often we get stuck on kids weaknesses when we're talking about an autistic person growing up.”[12:25-13:04] Paula: “If you help a chick out of an egg, it doesn't develop right. There's something about pecking itself out that needs to happen and the idea that iron hardens in fire. And that if you don't go through challenging things, then you never become what you're supposed to become. And so I think it's really hard asa parent to watch your child struggle and not wanna come in and remove the struggle, remove the pain. And it's not possible. There are going to be struggles and this is true for all children, but when you have a child in a spectrum, it's different. And the natural instinct to step in and protect is so strong.[13:07-13:28] Paula: “A lot of the work that I do with parents is, first, let's understand your child and what all these numbers and what all this testing means, how to translate that into what the expectations can be in your home and outside of your home and how to build structure that really helps your child thrive.”

Chris welcomes Tracy Markle, founder and co-director of the Digital Media Treatment and Education Center (DTECH) and Collegiate Coaching Services. Tracybrings over 30 years of mental health experience and specializes in helping individuals and families navigate digital media overuse and addiction. Together, Chris and Tracy dive into the unique challenges the autism community faces with gaming addiction and digital media overuse. Tracy explains why autistic individuals are more vulnerable to online victimization, struggle with setting boundaries in digital relationships, and face increased mental health risks like depression. She shares powerful insights on the neurological and emotional impact of excessive screen time, especially in young people. Tracy also outlines practical, actionable steps parents can take to help their children—and themselves —build healthier digital habits. This is a must-listen for anyone concerned about the role technology plays in our lives and the lives of those we love.Links:Digital Media Treatment and Education Center: https://digitalmediatreatment.com/Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:[3:01-3:32] Tracy Markle: “Gaming is a problematic behavior for many people. And it's identified as an official medical diagnosis now, gaming disorder in the general field of psychology and medical professionals. So I want to note that it does give itcredibility and that is an issue that the majority of my clients that I see in practice who come in for treatment identify as being autistic and also struggle to a great deal with gaming.”[8:00-19:20] Tracy Markle: “They'e a vulnerable population in general to being victimized online. So they're not able to have the same critical thinking abilities and to analyze that through a social context as somebody who's neurotypical. And of course, you have to look at developmental age and what have you and that matters to be able to distinguish between whether or not this is somebody I should be sending pictures to. Is this okay and what are the long-term consequences of this? So I want to identify they are a very vulnerable population and find themselves in many different between a rock and a hard place situations. The other piece that I often see them struggling with is engaging in what they believe to be intimate relationships and all or nothing kind of experience where they fall head over heels for this person. Online connection feels good enough to them, yet they're missing all the opportunities of real life interactions to learn more about what a full intimate relationship it's like. So we have to do a lot of education and talk with them about how to balance that and how to work within that realm because we know they're more comfortable there, but that doesn't mean that's better for them.”[12:17-12:40] Tracy Markle: “But if the majority of their entertainment and connection is online, we see an increase in mental health problems. Depression in particular is one of our big risk factors for prolonged media multitasking. And again, a decrease in executive functioning abilities overall and critical thinking skills.”[31:39-32:00] Tracy Markle: “It's a very difficult issue. I have been in the field of mental health for over 30 years. And to me, out of all the compulsive, addictive behaviors I've worked with through my career, this is one of the most problematic to overcome. Again, because it's so pervasive in our society. So there are so many great resources now that are emerging.”

Chris is joined by Dr. Tony Issenmann—licensed therapist, leadership consultant, and founder of Systemic Solutions Coaching—for a thought-provoking discussion on autism in the workplace. They explore how hiring autistic employees benefits organizations, not just through accommodations, but through deeper, second-order changes that improve culture, retention, and overall team performance. This episode highlights how inclusive leadership and a culture of curiosity lead to healthier, more effective workplaces—for everyone.Links:Systemic Solutions Coaching:https://systemicsolutionscoaching.com/Autism Learning Lab: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:[10:17-10:47] Dr. Issenmann: “Ultimately, the employer, even though on a day-to-day basis, they might wish to have fewer "headaches"; that they'e being presented with, what they really want when they have time to step back and think is they want a productive team that is achieving or outperforming their goals. And if they're just putting out fires from day to day, they're not going to be able to focus on the strategic planning long-term objectives that really can only be achieved with that second order change.”[18:47-19:20] Chris Blankenship: “We're not just talking about putting up a poster that says loyal opposition and, you know, point to it every once in a while, we're saying be genuinely curious and encourage your employees to be genuinely curious. And that is a strength that autistic individuals can bring as long as you're open to it and you've created that culture where it is encouraged. And it might actually bleed over to other employees as well, maybe ones who would be a little bit more guarded in order to protect their position. So again, we're talking about accommodations or we're talking about some changes, but really what we're talking about is making a healthier work environment for everyone.”[26:53-27:37] Dr. Issenmann: “It's so much more than just the accommodations for the autistic individual as we're talking about these changes help everybody. When those changes are made in the way that you talked about, like really getting getting to know somebody, really making the changes because there is an investment in the culture. The research shows that autistic individuals are loyal. Retention rates go up, not just for the autistic employee, but for those around them. And the amount of money that is spent on recruiting and hiring and onboarding, it goes down substantially. And that is a byproduct. That is a byproduct of somebody who is leading a company that wants second order change. Somebody who says, ‘I want better retention, so what do I have to do?’”

Chris is joined by Dr. Katie Gaebler, founder of AutismNERD (Neurodiverse Education Resources of Denver), to the show for an important conversation about preparing and supporting autistic teens and young adults as they transition tolife after high school. Dr. Gaebler explains that when considering the true “price” of attending college, it is essential to look beyond just financial costs. She highlights three critical components: financial, experiential, and emotional. Chris and Dr. Gaebler also explore the various accommodations colleges offer to support neurodiverse students — and why understanding these resources ahead of time can make a big difference. Throughout their discussion, Dr. Gaebler emphasizes how essential early preparation is, and how parents play a pivotal role in helping their neurodiverse students successfully navigate the college journey.Links:AutismNERD: https://www.autismnerd.com/Autism Learning Lab Website:https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:[2:22-3:06] Dr. Gaebler: The difference between “college capable” versus “college ready.” I see that “college capable” is the ability to meet admission standards, right? So when a student applies to the college of their choice, can they academically kind of fit what standards are required for that particular college or institution? Whereas the difference of “college ready” would be the ability to meet graduation standards, right? So it's a comparison of what are admission standards versus what would be graduation standards. And there's so much that goes into the whole process of college and there's so many dynamics for it, you know, including the social, emotional, just navigating large systems, executive function needs, you know, just even traveling, are you traveling across the country for where you're attending, all the components that go into that.[11:00-11:40] Dr. Gaebler: And so that's where just having the consciousness of and self-awareness, but also I think it's really important for families and the student to be on the same page as much as possible, as far as what's realistically in the best interest for that individual, as well as what support accommodations that student is gonna be able to provide for themselves, but might be within the context of their environment, right? And having those facilitated conversations before attending, I think is one of the best things that a family can do for themselves, frankly, because we just want everybody to be on the same page.[41:29-42:00] Dr. Gaebler: It's called the Talking College Card Deck. And it's discussion prompts for students with learning differences. And it's a deck of cards. They're basically all these different categories like 15 categories of things that you're gonna experience in college and then you within each of the categories. There's typically three to five cards and each card has, maybe three or four questions on it and everything in there you're gonna face post-high school life somewhere somehow.

Chris welcomes Dr. Ingrid Boveda, Founder of The Hive Psychological Services and co-owner of Cogenuity. As a testing psychologist, Dr. Boveda works with neurodivergent children, adolescents, and adults across the country. Through her work with Cogenuity, she partners with schools and treatment programs nationwide to offer low-cost brain mapping and neurofeedback services. In this episode, Chris and Dr. Boveda discuss the power of self-awareness and self-advocacy—two traits often lost in the push to conform to neurotypical expectations. They explore how behaviors frequently seen as “problems,” like rigidity or hyper-focus, can actually be incredible strengths when embraced and understood in context. This conversation is full of compassion, perspective, and practical wisdom on how to truly support autistic individuals—not by changing who they are, but by helping them thrive as they are.Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Hive Psychological Services: https://hivepsychological.com/Cogenuity: https://cogenuity.net/ Quotes:[21:00-21:28] Dr. Ingrid Boveda: “It's not how close to normal when I think about it. It's not how close to normal or neurotypical that person can become. Because again, there are certain benefits to being able to mask when needed, right? So it's not all bad. But if therapy or treatment or coaching, whatever modality. Like if the goal is let's make them indistinguishable from a neurotypical person, you've just done them a great disservice.”[28:39-29:07] Dr. Ingrid Boveda: “I tell people sometimes, we’ve got to hack your brain. And take the things that you have been told are the sum of your weaknesses and we have to realize how we can use them as strengths. But then also, you know, thinking about, you know, when we talk about weaknesses or struggles or a disability, right? Like, how much of that is based on the standards of society versus how much is a genuine, you know, disability or genuine struggle, right?”[30:32-31:15] Dr. Ingrid Boveda: “I want to help as many people as I can and I recognize that as helping professionals, we're looked to as the decision makers or the experts or whatever. And I just, I don't know about any of labels but but what I do know is that you know these are these are people's lives and and I certainly know what it's like to to be misunderstood or to have my behaviors or what I say or do you know be misconstrued usually for the you know for the negative and and I just I want to help in understanding what this really is beyond what society has told us it is.”

Chris welcomes Lauren Franklin, a 15-year veteran teacher. Lauren has taught Resource Special Education in middle and elementary schools and is currently teaching a self-contained classroom to students with disabilities ranging from Autism to Down Syndrome to Cerebral Palsy. Together, Lauren and Chris discuss classrooms, including accommodations, special education classrooms, IEPs, 504s, and more. If you’re just beginning to navigate school with your ASD child or you’re halfway through and wondering what support is available to you, make sure you save this one.Quotes:[2:22 - 3:14] Lauren: Some students with Autism have these sensory challenges. On an IEP, accommodations could be lowering the lighting, providing noise-cancelling headphones, frequent breaks built throughout the day…Autism challenges with behaviors, we accommodate a lot with like, a token reward system where a student meets 5 prompts and then immediately is given praise or that tangible reward or a break that they prefer. Work is highly modified, assignments are shortened, the curriculum can also be completely modified and completely different. Some students may need a different math curriculum while others can still work from the gen ed curriculum with the modifications made.[3:32 - 4:26] Lauren: So, an IEP is an Individualized Education Plan. So, when you have a student that is diagnosed with a disability, there’s testing that goes on and eligibility is determined in a certain area, and that IEP is then written by a team; teacher, special education teacher, sometimes a process coordinator or someone who represents the district, and then your related services like OT and PT, speech and language - so, all these people come together at the table and they discuss the students present levels of how they’re functioning currently and then they develop goals based on what the evaluations kind of, the data from the evaluations, based on teacher and team recommendations as well - so the IEP is very goal driven and extremely data-driven. [18:43 - 19:30] Lauren: I think teachers are really special people. At the end of the day, teachers want nothing but student success. Some of us get a bad reputation but ultimately, everything we do and every decision we make is for students and what’s in their best interest. And what I think is helpful is if parents can assume positive intent and make the relationship with their child’s case manager, special education teacher, gen ed teacher, whoever it may be - assume positive intent and really work to strengthen that relationship because when we can work together in support of one another, that is the most beneficial for students.

Chris welcomes Dr. Eric Beaudoin. Dr. Beaudoin is a licensed psychologist, the Executive Director at Cornerstones of Maine, and co-founuder of Rubedo Young Adult Transitions. With over 10 years of experience working with neurodivergent young adults, Dr. Beaudoin shares how his program, Rubedo, is truly meeting ASD individuals where they’re at. Through a self-proclaimed “kitchen sink " approach, there are opportunities aplenty for their clients, but that doesn’t mean it's one-size fits all; as Chris and Dr. Beaudoin explain, every individual is unique and requires a tailored approach, something Rubedo’s team is happy to provide. Full of hope, this conversation is brimming with insight on how best to serve those we love in the neurodivergent space.Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] of Maine Website: https://cornerstonesofmaine.com/young-adult-treatment-teamRubedo: Neurodivergent-Affirming Transitional Living: https://cornerstonesofmaine.com/neurodivergent-living-asd-autismQuotes:[16:35 - 7:04] Dr. Beaudoin: I empathize with the plight that we as parents have - there’s a dialectic, I suppose, between protecting our children from all of the expected failures and perceived failures and tragedies of their life experience, and giving them the balance of the opportunity of healthy risk-taking and allowing them to do dangerous things carefully - is easier said than done, so yeah, it’s a, such an integral part of learning is doing and failing upward, as they say. [8:10 - 9:03] Dr. Beaudoin: I think what we are trying to do is, we are trying not to treat Autism, definitively. We are trying to treat depression that is subsequent through the struggles that Autistic people will have, we’re trying to treat anxiety, we’re trying to treat trauma, OCD, and any number of other symptoms that are clinical. We don’t need to treat the way someone perceives another person, we don’t need to treat the way someone expresses verbally to a friend or engages in parallel process or is quirky with their sense of humor - we don’t want to fix that. Rather, we want to celebrate that, in fact. [16:48 - 17:38] Dr. Beaudoin: …what we evolve into is like, ‘Hey, let’s start from the end. What do you want? What’s your goal? Paint me a picture of the life that you want a month from now, a year from now, 5 years from now?’ - that’s not always an easy practice, so we scaffold it accordingly, but, ‘ do you want financial independence, do you want to travel, do you want to have a big house and two lamborghinis, do you want to just have a life that’s relatively simple where you go out to eat once a week and otherwise cook your Annie’s macaroni and cheese for every other meal? Great! Let’s understand what the goal is. And once we do that, we can have some creative conversations and problem solving about what you will need to do to get that.’ And there is an existential acceptance that I think is probably exclusive to no demographic, which is, probably gonna have to work. [24:02 - 24:21] Dr. Beaudoin: …so when we’re being neuro-affirming we’re being accepting, we’re being celebratory, we’re saying, ‘Great! Use your strengths, you don’t need to change a darn thing’ when we’re being neuro-informed we’re saying, ‘And, over here in this domain, it might not work super well, so let’s see what we can tweak’ and I’ve found that language to be really helpful for me.

Chris welcomes Dr. Neal Christensen, a licensed psychologist who has been working with neurodivergent youth with a focus in Outdoor Behavioral Healthcare for over 20 years. In this episode, Chris and Dr. Christensen discuss a little-known behavioral profile called Pathological Demand Avoidance (PDA). PDA is an extreme avoidance of everyday, age-based demands (think of brushing your teeth as a young child). They explore the characteristics of this profile, and different treatment approaches that are effective. This is an insightful conversation full of knowledge for clinicians and laypeople alike.Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Dr. Neal Christensen: https://elementsprograms.com/our-story/our-team/neal-christensen/Eclipse by Elements Program: https://elementsprograms.com/programs/neurodivergent-program/Quotes:[5:57 - 6:23] Dr. Neal: Because there’s so little awareness of PDA (Pathological Demand Avoidance), I think of it as like an invisibility, an invisible disability. And so a lot of professionals you know, will overlook it and say it is something else, it’s a different condition, a different diagnosis, and so, yeah, that’s where I think, unfortunately, like, a lot of these families and individuals suffer because they’re just misunderstood.[13:41 - 14:25] Dr. Neal: When you’re working with kids, in particular, you know, you’re oftentimes setting up, kinda, I’ll just say, you know behavioral schedules, and you know, some form of behavioral modification which would be you know, punishments and rewards right? We do that as, as parents at home with our children, ‘if you unload the dishwasher, you get some game play’ or whatever. But these are, these patterns of what I’d say these kinda more typical behavioral consequencing plans don’t really work because the demand itself is so stressful, that their consequence, whether it be a reward or punishment, isn’t more motivating than the, than the motivation to avoid the stressor. [17:04 - 18:03] Dr. Neal: I will say that we have to look at these individuals from a person standpoint rather than a behavior standpoint. Recognizing that these individuals have difficulty, genuine difficulty, right, it’s not, they’re not, I would say when we’re talking about PDA it’s not willful, they don’t want to make their lives and everybody else’s lives hard, it’s that they don’t believe they’re capable or that it’s possible and they’re just trying to help themselves feel better - all of us are. You know, we just, I’ll say maybe you and I, maybe have a better ability to cope with you know, challenge and stress. We’ve internalized those things and our nervous systems are better regulated and so, remembering we’ve got to start with the individual and then remembering, right, that we’ve gotta work on helping them feel safe in their own bodies…

Chris welcomes Ranpreet Anthony, a transmasculine Two-Spirit and neurodivergent Somatic Experiencing® Practitioner (SEP) with over twenty years of experience in the mental health field. Together, Chris and Ranpreet explore SE, Ranpreet’s own journey to self-discovery, and how his late-in-life diagnosis came at the perfect time. This conversation is a beautiful reminder that while growing into yourself takes time, stepping confidently into who you’re meant to be is worth the wait. Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] about Ranpreet Anthony: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/about-ranpreetSomatic Experiencing: https://www.somaticexperiencing.com/somatic-experiencingQuotes:[4:51 - 5:08] Ranpreet: Somatic Experiencing is Peter Levine’s life’s work and it’s based on the idea that trauma isn’t in the event but it’s what becomes stuck in the nervous system as a result of not having the chance to go through a completion. [7:21 - 7:58] Ranpreet: So, we’re kind of like, piecing it apart and then getting curious about what happens when they begin to feel the first signs of dysregulation. So, what tightens? Is it the jaw, is it the legs, where do you, where do you brace? And then that’s generally when I would recommend, that’s when you might be able to do a Somatic Experiencing technique to see if you can come back into your window a little bit, right? And then that way it’s not getting so big and it’s, ideally, reducing shutdown states. [9:15 - 9:55] Ranpreet: I think it wasn’t until I started transitioning and I started to feel more comfortable in my body, in who I was, that the stimming behaviors came to the surface a little bit more. But I had a turbulent childhood and so, if somebody had asked me years before, are you Autistic? I would have said, oh, no, I think it’s just probably nervous system dysregulation from complex trauma. And so it, it had to get to a place where I could differentiate between nervous system dysregulation from trauma and just Autistic stimming behaviors.

Chris welcomes back licensed professional counselor Maura Nolan, who is pursuing her passions in nature-based and wilderness therapy and working towards licensure as a psychedelic-assisted therapist and facilitator in Colorado. This conversation centers on the many facets of Psychedelic-Assisted Therapy: What exactly is it? How does it work? What are the pros and cons? How do you find a provider? and more. This is an incredibly fascinating discussion that helps shed light on this new form of therapy and the overwhelmingly positive results following its recent research and implementation. Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] with Maura: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/therapists/maura-r-nolan-durango-co/369024Resources Mentioned:Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies – MAPS – Psychedelic Research for Psychological HealingIntegrative Psychiatry InstituteBoard of Psychedelic Medicine & TherapiesAmerican Psychedelic Practitioners AssociationQuotes:[8:27 - 9:08] Maura: You know, something that I, I do want to say in going into this question and something I’m really passionate about when it comes to psychedelic-assisted therapy, is that the brain does all of the healing. So, in that way, it can be so incredibly self-empowering to know that the individual is going into the experience and honestly the facilitator isn’t, isn’t really hands-on. So, the individual, their brain is unlocking the trauma, doing the healing - so that I think is one of the most profound things about the experience as a whole, is that it just, it falls back on the individual's brain to do the healing. [14:43 - 15:22] Maura: While the research specifically to Autism and psilocybin and ketamine is fairly new, there is a lot of research already around ketamine and psilocybin for co-occurring mental health issues, right, that a lot of folks with individual, or, that a lot of folks with Autism, right, may have. Anxiety, depression, PTSD, CPTSD, trauma, right? So, an individual with Autism might also really benefit from having a psychedelic experience and being able to process some of the trauma, right, that is at the root, right, and core of some of their experiences. [28:00 - 29:13] Maura: Clinical trials with psilocybin, two sessions: significant reduction in depressive and anxiety symptoms - this is actually a study done out of John Hopkins that found with two doses of psilocybin, significant decrease in depressive symptoms. MDMA, three sessions: 98% reduction in symptoms of depression and PTSD, okay? So you look at three MDMA sessions, two psilocybin sessions compared to, that’s something that might take 3 months when I do EMDR with somebody and like, 3-5 years in talk therapy. So, this works and it’s also new and edgy and I encourage people to like, do your own research. Be skeptical about it, question it all, see what you come up with. But the results can be astounding and healing - like truly healing. Getting to the root of symptoms and trauma and it changes people’s lives and it totally relies on you, your brain to do the healing.

Chris welcomes Brenna, an autistic 28-year-old math teacher for middle schoolers in Boulder, CO, and one of his clients. Brenna shares her story of receiving her ASD diagnosis late in life, what the diagnosis meant for how she now understands and loves herself, how she navigates the beauty and complexity of relationships, and how she engages with the children she teaches. This is a beautiful interview of Brenna’s journey to self-discovery. Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:[4:25 - 5:16] Brenna: I felt like I was finally able to stop wondering what to do with all the other things in my head and all the guesses, and I was able to start focusing more so on, now that I have this information, what can I do with it? How can I learn some social skills, figure out how to do something like small talk, getting off of my couch and going and seeing the world because I know how to talk to people now, and maybe it doesn’t have to be so scary. So I, I know that for sure I was stuck for a long, long time and I think this diagnosis helped me embrace myself more, love myself more, and be able to learn more, to be able to interact with others. [10:04 - 10:56] Brenna: I think the big thing is, don’t be afraid to ask for help. Schools and working in the classroom and working with young people in general can get overwhelming and it can get really loud and when I learned that some of my overwhelm and overstimulated symptoms from ASD, were, well, when I learned they were from ASD, that was when I was able to feel more comfortable asking for help. And sometimes that looks like having another person just step in for a minute so I’m not the only adult in the room, sometimes that looks like me being able to, like take a step out, just take a breath for a second, and also knowing that I feel more comfortable in my own skin to know what’s going on for me helps me to be able to get through the day…[24:45 - 25:10] Brenna: I would say that it’s okay to be yourself. Don't be afraid to be yourself with the diagnosis or without the diagnosis. I spent so much of my life not knowing how to be me, and if I could get any of those years back, I’d definitely spend it accepting who I was and who I am - so don’t be afraid to be yourself.

Chris welcomes Maura Nolan, a licensed professional counselor who specializes in working with young adults, families, and adults with PTSD, neurodivergence, and psychosis spectrum disorders. She is currently pursuing her passions in nature-based and wilderness therapy and is working towards licensure as a psychedelic-assisted therapist and facilitator in Colorado. Together, Chris and Maura discuss Autism Learning Lab’s family retreat model and the specific benefits that parents and other family members can expect to experience through their unique program structure. Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:[3:45 - 4:26] Maura: The other piece to this, beyond diagnosis, is that I’ve found psychological testing can be a lot about empowerment. So, when individuals and families are understanding more of the why behind certain struggles or behaviors, they can start to make more informed decisions, right? So it can shift this narrative from, what’s wrong, to how do we support this moving forward, right? And ultimately, individuals becoming the experts on their brain and it can also really help with individuals feeling seen and understood, right? So with this knowledge, they can advocate for themselves, develop new strategies that truly work for their unique experience and their brains. [5:25 - 5:49] Maura: That’s why these retreats are designed not just around psycho-education but a lot of experiential learning as well, right? So, we want to be able to address family dynamics as they’re happening in the moment, give parents and families opportunity to practice new skills to better communicate - so they feel like they’re walking away with knowledge of how to handle maybe difficult situations moving forward.[19:05 -19:57] Maura: It’s really, really important for parents to explore their own emotions, parenting styles, the ways that they communicate when navigating their child’s Autism diagnosis. This self-awareness will directly impact how they support their child, right, and foster that stronger parent-child connection. So Autism shapes, right, how an individual experiences the world. Whether it’s through communication, social interaction, sensory processing - so for parents, there’s such an importance of them understanding how Autism influences their child's functioning, right? Because that is key to how they respond from an understanding, empathic, and also an effective, and productive place. So, the retreat will support parents in a couple of different ways. 

Chris welcomes Dr. Jenn Brown, the Director at Psychological Solutions. Dr. Brown has over 10 years of experience in psychological assessments in wilderness and residential treatment programs with adolescents and young adults and has written well over 700 evaluations covering a range of topics including bipolar disorders, high-functioning autism, and personality disorders, to name a few. Together, they focus on the evaluation process between men and women and how masking or differing social skills affect the ease of an official diagnosis.Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]. Jenn Brown: https://www.psychologicalsolutions.org/our-group/jenn-brown/Psychological Solutions Website: https://www.psychologicalsolutions.org/

Chris welcomes Amy Wood, the Executive Director of Cottonwood Day School, and Michelle Bjelland, the Director of Cottonwood Day School - the first and only private non-profit elementary school for students with learning challenges in Bozeman, MT. Amy and Michelle discuss how they’ve developed a unique learning environment to cater to each student and how they partner with families for long-term success. This episode is a great resource not only for teachers working with individuals on the spectrum but also for parents looking for practical tools to assist the neurodiverse child in their life. Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected] Day School: https://www.cottonwooddayschool.org/Contact Cottonwood Day School: [email protected]

Chris welcomes Dr. Aaron Wallis, a licensed psychologist with a background in college counseling and outdoor behavioral health. Dr. Wallis is currently partnered with Psychologist Solutions and is passionate about how substance use ties into attachment and trauma, specifically with those on the Autistic spectrum. Chris and Dr. Wallis discuss the trends they are starting to see between those on the spectrum and severe substance abuse, why overgeneralization is a dangerous practice, and how “typical” treatment may need to be adapted to fit the unique needs of the neurodiverse individual.Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]. Aaron Wallis: https://www.psychologicalsolutions.org/our-group/aaron-wallis/Psychological Solutions Website: https://www.psychologicalsolutions.org/

Chris welcomes back Dr. Melissa Horne, a licensed psychologist with Psychological Solutions to discuss the science of sleep and how those on the spectrum can improve their sleep experience. This fascinating episode covers the importance of sleep for your brain and body to function at their optimal ability and also how to improve your quality of rest with some simple implementations. Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/ Email: [email protected]. Melissa Horne: https://www.psychologicalsolutions.org/our-group/melissa-horne/Psychological Solutions Website: https://www.psychologicalsolutions.org/Cognitive Behavioral Therapy for Insomnia Info: https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/insomnia/in-depth/insomnia-treatment/art-20046677

Chris welcomes Dr. Melissa Horne, a licensed psychologist working with Psychological Solutions. A self-proclaimed psych testing nerd, Dr. Horne covers everything from the basics of psychological testing (what it is) to finding a professional to work with, what testing entails, and what to expect when you’re presented with the results. As Chris and Dr. Horne explain, comprehensive psychological testing is more than a “rubber stamp” label of you as a person - it’s an insight into your wonderful and complex story - ideally resulting in a thorough understanding of your unique makeup and how this knowledge can shape your future. Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]. Melissa Horne: https://www.psychologicalsolutions.org/our-group/melissa-horne/Psychological Solutions Website: https://www.psychologicalsolutions.org/

Welcome to the Autism Learning Lab Podcast, an exploration of the full spectrum of the Autistic experience hosted by clinical therapist Chris Blankenship. On our flagship episode, Chris welcomes Claire, the mother of an 18-year-old daughter who was diagnosed with Autism Spectrum Disorder at the age of 16. Claire recounts how her daughter was recognized as gifted by the age of 4 but was later diagnosed in middle school with ADHD, slow processing speed, and executive dysfunction. She describes the challenges her daughter faced during remote learning due to COVID-19, which led to self-harming behaviors and marijuana use. Eventually, her daughter acknowledged the need for professional help. Now, Claire candidly shares the ups and downs of their ongoing journey as their family continues to adapt to this new “normal.”Links:Autism Learning Lab Website: https://www.autismlearninglab.com/Email: [email protected]:Strong Female Character by Fern Brady: https://a.co/d/dbUY1Vt