The Curious Bartender Podcast

Liam Davy is Director of Bars at Hawksmoor, the British steakhouse group that's grown from a single Spitalfields opening in 2006 to fourteen sites across the UK, Ireland and the US, with Boston due in September. We sat down after a night at Hawksmoor's new St Pancras Martini Bar, which has sold over twenty thousand martinis since November.On the episode we dig into what it's like running a bar programme across cities and countries: what travels, what doesn't, and why a steakhouse group has bet so hard on the martini. We talk about the gin boom and its bust, why the Hawksmoor cocktail list is deliberately unfussy and built around the steakhouse experience, and what genuine training looks like inside a fast-growing group. We also get into his time outside Hawksmoor — running the Bad Sports taco place on Hackney Road and co-creating the War in Terroir Instagram account, the wine influencer parody that started during a stretch of unemployment and ended up shaping how a lot of the trade now talks about natural wine. Along the way we cover the cost of going out, what Gen Z actually want from bars, hospitality in the age of top-50 lists and content creators, the operators he genuinely rates — Dukes, the Connaught, Attaboy, Three Sheets, Bar Snack — the institutions that never miss, the elegant decline of bars that fall off lists, the state of British pubs, the resurgence of mezcal, and of course Shaky Pete's Ginger Brew.🍷 War on Terroir - https://www.instagram.com/waronterroir/A shout out to our sponsors:🍋‍🟩 Fever-Tree - For the very best mixers that taste pretty damn good even by themselves☕ Algebra Drinks - The world's best coffee liqueur (partly because it's low in sugar - get 15% off at https://www.algebradrinks.com with the code CURIOUS15🌾 Belvedere Vodka - Organic vodka, with substance, made from Polish rye with absolutely no additives🍷 Denver & Liely - The best glassware on the planet - get 15% off at https://www.denverandliely.com with the code CURIOUS1500:00:00 Hawksmoor's new Martini Bar at St Pancras00:02:34 14 restaurants and Boston coming next00:03:19 Why a martini bar00:05:08 The martini's cultural moment00:08:13 Gin's boom, bubble and aftermath00:09:52 Running a bar programme across cities and countries00:13:37 Lessons from the great American steakhouses00:17:03 How a British steakhouse plays in America00:21:39 Recruitment and training inside a growing group00:27:07 Liam's Hawksmoor history00:28:45 Bad Sports, hot dogs and Surfside Cornwall00:43:06 Lessons for anyone opening their own place00:47:38 The state of pubs and independents00:52:28 Who's doing it right00:55:33 The cost of going out01:00:19 Gen Z, phones and the truth about drinking habits01:09:59 War on Terroir: the wine parody Instagram01:14:51 Tribal drinking, natural wine, mezcal01:21:15 We are not normal: rethinking who bars are for01:25:26 Hospitality as entertainment and top 50 culture01:32:26 Dukes, Connaught, attaboy: institutions that don't miss01:39:52 Awards, recognition and elegant decline01:43:50 Shaky Pete's Ginger Brew01:46:45 20,000 martinis since November01:47:42 The Sour Cherry Negroni's lockdown roots01:48:36 Boston Hawksmoor01:55:05 Bringing UK bars on tour01:59:07 Mezcal, education and final thoughts📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Thibaut Hontanx is only the seventh master blender in Courvoisier's nearly 200-year history, but that might not be the most interesting thing about his incredibly eclectic career. From growing up around his grandfather's sawmill in France, to arriving in South Africa at 21 with a brief and a blank piece of paper to build the country's first agave spirits distillery from scratch, to seven years at Hennessy deepening his understanding of cognac ageing — all while completing an oenology degree in Bordeaux mid-career. Thibaut has accumulated a breadth of experience that very few people in this industry can match. We follow him to Martinique, where he oversaw production at Rhum Clément, and explore the surprising parallels between rhum agricole and cognac — two AOC-protected, terroir-driven spirits that share a philosophy but feel like completely different worlds. Back in Cognac, we get into the technical craft behind Courvoisier's house style, the challenges of recent vintages in a changing climate, new grape varieties being trialled within the AOC, and what it means to hold a role where the decisions you make today will be drunk by someone thirty years from now. And why growing up around a sawmill turns out to be surprisingly useful preparation for a life spent thinking about oak.To support the show please subscribe. It really means a lot to me.With thanks to our sponsors:Fever-Tree mixers for incredible mixers and soft drinksBelvedere Vodka making vodka the right way, with characterful organic rye, and absolutely no additives.

Dave Mulligan is the owner of Dublin's Bar 1661 and The Sackville Lounge, founder of Bán Poitín, and one of the most committed advocates for Ireland's oldest spirit currently working the floor. Poitín was banned by the British Crown in 1661 and remained illegal for 336 years, surviving in the hills of Connemara and Donegal as both an act of cultural defiance and a working farmer's economy. Now legal, GI-protected, and slowly finding its place on the world's best back bars, the category is at one of the most interesting moments in its history. On the episode we trace the spirit's origins back through the 1500s and earlier, separating monkish folklore from the documentary record. We taste a remarkable bottle from the 1830s that may rewrite some of what we think we know about Irish distillation. And we work through a flight of contemporary expressions including Micil's malted barley poitín, the Micil x Kneecap collaboration finished in Buckfast casks, Killowen's peated Dead & Buried, Bán Poitín itself, a Bán expression finished in cocktail-seasoned casks, and an unlabelled brown-paper-bag illicit bottle from an unnamed distiller ;-)We talk about what 1997 legalisation actually changed, why the 2008 PGI imposed a ten-week barrel limit, and why every poitín we taste sits as a fully resolved spirit in its own right rather than a stop on the way to something else. We also get into the early days of Sibín in Kentish Town, the founding of Bar 1661 and The Sackville Lounge, the Belfast Coffee origin story, and what it would take for poitín to become a serious global spirit category.POITÍN TASTED IN THIS EPISODEIn rough order of tasting:​Bán Poitín (in the Belfast Coffee at the open, then neat later in the episode) — Dave's own brand. Blended from malted barley, Comber potatoes and Irish grain, distilled at Echlinville. https://www.ban-poitin.com​A forgotten ~1830s spirit from County Tyrone — discovered around 2019–2020. Not commercially available.​Micil Poitín — six-generation family recipe dating to 1848. https://micildistillery.com​Micil x Kneecap Poitín — limited collaboration, Buckfast-cask seasoned. Available via Micil. https://micildistillery.com​Killowen Dead & Buried — peated, 67.9% ABV, distilled by Brendan Carty in collaboration with historian Fionnán O'Connor. https://www.killowendistillery.com​Bán 1661 (cocktail-cask finish) — limited release finished in casks seasoned with Bar 1661's own cocktails. https://www.ban-poitin.com​A mystery stout based poitín — from a sizable distillery; not yet released.​An illicit, unlabelled bottle — currently being made off-grid; not commercially available.Featured venues: Bar 1661 — https://www.bar1661.ie · The Sackville Lounge — https://thesackvillelounge.comFionnán O'Connor is the mentioned author of A Glass Apart

Edward Slingerland is a distinguished University Scholar and Professor of Philosophy at the University of British Columbia, whose research spans early Chinese thought, cognitive science, and evolutionary psychology. He is, among other works, the author of Drunk: How We Sipped, Danced, and Stumbled Our Way to Civilization. Our conversation starts by traging the origins of his thinking on alcohol to his earlier work on wu wei, the ancient Chinese concept of effortless action, and explore how downregulating the prefrontal cortex, whether through drinking, flow states, or long-distance running, unlocks the lateral thinking and spontaneity that the self-conscious mind tends to suppress. We get into the Ballmer Peak, the Google whisky room, and our own experiences of writing and creating under the influence, before turning to the central argument: that alcohol is not an evolutionary mistake but a genuine cultural technology, one that has been helping humans solve the problems of creativity and large-scale cooperation for at least 13,000 years. We dig into what the archaeological record reveals, from Gobekli Tepe to the Epic of Gilgamesh, making the case that the desire for intoxication may have preceded and even driven the development of agriculture and civilisation itself. We explore the hidden social intelligence embedded in drinking rituals, the way toasting customs, rounds at the pub, and the unspoken etiquette of sharing a bottle all serve to pace and regulate consumption within a group, before examining the two conditions that make alcohol most dangerous: distillation and isolation. We compare northern and southern European drinking cultures, look at what Italy's historically low alcoholism rates can teach us, and ask what cultures that abstain entirely reveal about alcohol's social role. Along the way we taste through two whiskies, discuss whether a pill that replicated alcohol's effects would ever replace the real thing, and hear Ed's thoughts on his next book, which turns his evolutionary lens on foraging, food, and our need to reconnect with the natural world.00:00:00 Introduction00:00:06 From Wu Wei to Whisky: How This Book Came About00:03:56 Flow State, Wu Wei and the Prefrontal Cortex00:10:45 Why Does a Poison Persist in Every Culture?00:11:07 Alcohol and Religion: Costly Behaviours, Hidden Benefits00:14:18 The Brain Hijack Theory and Why It Falls Short00:27:02 Humans as the Creative and Communal Animal00:29:20 Creativity, Lateral Thinking and the Maturing PFC00:33:05 The Ballmer Peak and Google's Whisky Room00:35:22 Writing Drunk: Personal Experiences with Alcohol and Creativity00:37:34 The Negroni That Wrote the Book Proposal00:52:59 The Pub as Social Infrastructure00:57:01 Whisky Tasting: Kilchoman00:58:30 Toasting Rituals and the Hidden Etiquette of Drinking Together01:01:28 The Twin Dangers: Distillation and Isolation01:05:15 Getting Drunk: The Bonding Functions Beyond 0.0801:09:35 Those Who Puke Together Stay Together01:10:07 Archaeology: The Beer Before Bread Hypothesis01:16:32 The Epic of Gilgamesh: Beer Makes You Human01:19:31 Hard Numbers vs the Intangible Benefits of Alcohol01:21:23 Northern vs Southern Drinking Cultures01:24:16 Italy as a Natural Experiment01:28:00 Cultures That Don't Drink: Islam and Mormonism01:29:34 Whisky Tasting: Highland Park 1401:49:00 Ed's Next Book: Foraging and Reconnecting with Nature01:51:24 Alcohol as Culture, Place and Technology01:53:19 Would We Still Drink if a Pill Could Replace It?📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Mathieu Sabbagh spent fifteen years navigating the corporate corridors of Pernod Ricard, working on the relaunches of absinthe and Suze, before packing it in, driving around France looking for something real, and ending up buying a mobile still in Beaune. He's now the sole travelling distiller in Burgundy, running Alambic Bourguignon and his own label Sab's — and in this episode we pull apart how that happened and why it matters. We talk about the slow industrial death of France's once-thriving network of mobile distilleries, the customs regulations that govern when a still is allowed to run, and the three-pot preheating system that means someone has to be up at 4am during distilling season. Mat explains the difference between Marc de Bourgogne and Fin de Bourgogne, why Burgundy's grapes (Pinot noir and Chardonnay harvested at full maturity) make a fundamentally different spirit to cognac or Armagnac, and how he sources wine barrels from some of the most sought-after producers on earth because, quite simply, they're next door. We taste through an extraordinary range: four gins (including a navy strength, a barrel-aged expression and one infused with Pinot pomace), aged Marc and Fin finished in Islay whisky and mezcal casks, and three unaged fruit eaux-de-vie from apricot, mirabelle and pear. The conversation keeps circling back to the same idea: a great spirit is just great ingredients honestly handled.Find Mathieu and the full Sab's range at alambic-bourguignon.com.

Franz-Arthur MacElhone is the fourth-generation custodian of Harry's New York Bar, the legendary Paris institution founded in 1911 when its original Manhattan fittings were shipped across the Atlantic. His great-grandfather Harry MacElhone — a young Scotsman who arrived in Paris via Ciro's in London — bought the bar in 1923, put his name above the door, and set about building one of the most consequential addresses in cocktail history. Franz now runs the bar day to day, oversees its social media, has opened a second Harry's Bar, and has recently revived the International Bar Flies — Harry's original membership society.In this episode, recorded inside the bar itself, we work through the cocktails that made Harry's a cornerstone of the canon: the Bloody Mary (anchored by a 1967 Newsweek interview as the key documentary evidence), the Sidecar, the White Lady in both its original and better-known gin form, and the French 75 — originally made with Calvados, named after a piece of WWI artillery, and still the bar's best-seller. We also dig into Harry MacElhone as a personality: a WWI Royal Flying Corps pilot, a gifted self-promoter who distributed crying towels and earplugs during the 1929 financial crash, and — as Franz argues — someone who invented marketing before marketing was even really a word. Franz reflects on what it means to be born into that legacy: the daily responsibility of keeping 115-year-old American mahogany in good repair, serving 600 cocktails a day, and running through thousands of bottles of Cognac a year, while living by the philosophy he has coined to capture the whole thing: traditionally inventive.🥃 Get 15% off the world's best drinking vessels at Denver & Liely using the discount code CURIOUS15 at checkout - ☕ Get 15% off the best coffee liqueur I have tried at Algebra Drinks with code CURIOUS15📷 Follow me on Instagram📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails

Kami Newton is a flavour expert, sensory analyst, and founder of Sensory Advantage, whose career took him from wine shelves at Oddbins to leading tasting panels at the Scotch Malt Whisky Society — and eventually to one of the most fascinating corners of the drinks world: the gap between chemistry and perception.This is one of the most illuminating conversations about flavour we've ever had on the show. Kami unpacks why the drinks industry has become extraordinarily good at talking about technical production while almost entirely ignoring how chemistry becomes experience — and why that matters enormously for how people engage with spirits. We explore flavour as a cross-modal, non-conscious construct involving all of the senses; why tasting notes are snapshots of a movie that's constantly changing; how genetics, mood, environment and even your microbiome shape what you taste; and why the real difference between a novice and an expert taster is fundamentally about language, not sensitivity.Sponsored by Denver & Liely whose whisky tasting glass will level up your flavour experience - get 15% of their glassware with this linkFollow Kami on Instagram:

Padraig Fox has spent 21 years at Guinness, starting out as a tour guide at the Storehouse in Dublin and working his way through sales, quality, and trade before landing the title of Global Brand Ambassador.In this episode, Padraig takes us deep into the world of Guinness: what's behind the brand's remarkable recent surge in popularity, the surprisingly exacting science of pouring the perfect pint, and why the two-part pour is a hill Padraig is prepared to die on. We get into the history: Arthur Guinness's audacious 9,000-year lease on a rundown Dublin brewery in 1759, the switch from ale to Porter recorded on a single turned-over page of a recipe book, and the Welshman who quietly invented draught Guinness in a London lab. We also explore how a brand that refused to advertise for 150 years eventually gave the world the toucan, the surfer ad, and the Guinness Book of Records. And what it actually means to pour the same beer consistently from Dublin to Astana.Get 15% off the world's best drinking vessels at Denver & Liely using the discount code CURIOUS15 at checkout - https://denverandliely.comGet 15% off my favourite coffee liqueur at Algebradrinks.com with code CURIOUS1500:00 Why is Guinness Having a Moment? Taste, Look, Quality03:50 Arthur Guinness’ 9000 Year Lease, Bringing Porter to Dublin, The Difference Between Stout & Porter07:30 The Size of the Guinness Today09:05 Guinness Variants: Guinness Original, Guinness Foreign Extra Stout, Draught Guinness, Innovation Products, Foreign Markets11:42 Ingredients for Guinness: Roasted Barley, Malt, Hops, Yeast14:35 Why Is Guinness Creamy? Introducing Nitrogen Gas, What Nitrogen Does to Flavour17:00 Why Is Guinness Poured in Two Parts?18:30 Where is Guinness Brewed?19:40 What Temperature Should Guinness Be Served At? Guinness Extra Cold21:50 What is the Correct Mix of Gas for Guinness?23:30 The Secret to A Great Tasting Pint of Guinness: Line Hygiene 27:00 The Correct Glass for Guinness31:35 The Cult of Guinness, Discernment & Taste Acquisition35:20 Best Guinness in Dublin37:30 Why Is the Irish Bar Exported? Difference to British Pub, Balancing Irishness42:00 Guinness Advertising: The Surfer, the Toucan, Evolution Ad47:45 Association with Rugby & Other Sports49:45 Guinness Goes Viral51:02 Guinness 0.0 - Production, Scale53:20 Guinness Book of Records55:20 Is the Trend for Guinness Sustainable?56:20 The Opengate Brewery: Innovation, Nitrogen Foreign Extra Stout, Barrel Aged Guinness59:00 Being the Guinness Brand Ambassador1:00:00 The Guinness Storehouse Experience1:01:40 Is Guinness a Craft Beer?📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Hannah Sharman-Cox and Siobhán Payne are the co-founders of London Cocktail Week and the Pinnacle Guide. Having launched London Cocktail Week 16 years ago, they have built one of the drinks industry's most recognised consumer-facing events, taking it through multiple ownership structures - from its origins under Simon Difford, through the Whisky Exchange and Pernod Ricard — before buying it back outright in January 2026. Together with business partner Dan Dove, they also created the Pinnacle Guide, a Michelin-inspired rating system that awards one, two, or three pins to bars across 14 countries and counting.In this conversation, Hannah and Siobhán talk about the decision to move London Cocktail Week from October to March, how the event has evolved from its early days of London buses and pop-up bars in Seven Dials to a more purpose-driven celebration of bartenders and bar culture. They go deep on the Pinnacle Guide — its two-year consultation process, the extensive application form, how bars are assessed and reviewed, and the deliberate "skew of kindness" built into the system. They also reveal Curate Your City, a new venture that will offer a turnkey framework for anyone to create their own multi-venue festival in any industry, anywhere in the world. Plus, some quick questions from Jake Burger at the end on the golden age of UK bartending.https://londoncocktailweek.com/https://www.thepinnacleguide.com/Get 15% off the world's best drinking vessels at Denver & Liely using the discount code CURIOUS15 at checkout Get 15% off my favourite coffee liqueur at Algebradrinks.com with code CURIOUS15📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/00:00:00 Introduction00:02:12 London Cocktail Week: 16 Years and Counting00:03:09 Taking Back Full Ownership00:04:12 Moving LCW from October to March00:08:04 How London Cocktail Week Has Changed00:10:31 The Cocktail Village Era00:14:38 Wristbands, Guidebooks and Building Community00:17:01 The Evolution of London's Cocktail Scene00:21:21 The Ownership Journey: Difford, Whisky Exchange and Pernod Ricard00:24:43 Burnout, the Pandemic and Pivoting00:27:36 What's Next for LCW in 202700:33:14 Introducing the Pinnacle Guide00:38:50 The Scoring System and "Skew of Kindness"00:43:21 Reviewers: Industry Pros and Interested Amateurs00:48:48 How the Application Form Elevates the Industry00:54:48 Global Expansion: 146 Bars Across 14 Countries00:57:36 How the Pinnacle Guide Will Make Money01:05:53 Curate Your City: A New Venture for Festival Creators01:14:52 The Hannah and Siobhán Partnership01:16:19 Is the Golden Age of UK Bartending Behind Us?

Agostino Perrone is the Director of Mixology at The Connaught Bar in London — one of the most acclaimed bar programmes in the world, and the only bar to have featured in the World's 50 Best Bars list every year since its inception, claiming the top spot in both 2020 and 2021. Originally from Lake Como in northern Italy, Ago moved to London in 2003 and worked his way through the city's bar scene — from Dusk in Battersea to the beloved neighbourhood bar Montgomery Place in Notting Hill — before being approached in 2008 to launch and lead the newly reimagined Connaught Bar. What followed is nothing short of a legacy: he has been recognised as Industry Icon at the World's 50 Best Bars 2022, Best International Bar Mentor at Tales of the Cocktail Spirited Awards 2023, and in 2024 saw the publication of The Connaught Bar book with Phaidon. He is also an accomplished fine art photographer, with exhibitions across Europe and beyond.On the episode we explore what it really means to build something that lasts. Ago takes us through the philosophy of Italian hospitality, how growing up in a culture of community, generosity, and warmth provides a natural foundation for world-class service, and why those soft skills translate seamlessly to the highest stages in the world. We discuss patience as a professional virtue in an industry increasingly driven by speed and visibility, and how the slow, organic accumulation of experience ultimately wins out over ambition alone. We get into the famous Connaught Martini Trolley — its origins, its evolution, and the clever way it turns flavour into a conversation about how a guest is actually feeling. We talk about the balance between creativity and innovation, the symbiotic relationship between a bartender and their bar, what it takes to build a team that endures, and how to stay mentally healthy when awards and recognition start reshaping your world. Ago also reflects on photography as meditation, legacy as mentorship, and what he would say to his younger self walking into the Connaught Bar for the very first time.Be sure to check out The Connaught Bar book, published by Phaidon, and follow Ago's photography work on Instagram @agodragos @a_perrone_photographyhttps://www.the-connaught.co.uk/bars/connaught-barGet 15% off the world's best drinking vessels at Denver & Liely using the discount code CURIOUS15 at checkout - https://denverandliely.comGet 15% off my favourite coffee liqueur at Algebradrinks.com with code CURIOUS15📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/00:00 Watering the Plants of Opportunity03:10 Paying Attention - Learning the Basics, 50,000 Hours06:10 The Vision of The Connaught, Changing Fashions08:40 Montgomery Place: Inspiration & Style12:00 Fundamentals of Hospitality & Italian Culture, Generosity, Patience22:10 The Relationship Between Bar & Bartender, Understanding Business Needs, Humility29:30 The Martini Trolley: Bitters, Menu Development in 2008, Theatre38:00 Creativity: Evolution of the Connaught, Innovation, Beauty in Bars, Theatre in Pouring & Ice49:05 The History of The Connaught Hotel & Connaught Bar50:37 A Home Away From Home55:50 Longevity, Consistency, Enjoyment, Sustainability, Approach to Awards1:10:02 Recruitment at The Connaught1:13:10 Visual Content at The Connaught1:18:40 What Brings You Joy? Photography as a Snapshot of Life, Exhibitions, Art, Meditation1:27:05 Advice To Your Younger Self

Tom Oliver is one of the UK’s most respected cider and perry makers, based in Herefordshire. A farmer first and foremost, he works with traditional orchards, rare varieties and long, slow fermentations to produce some of the most expressive cider and perry in the country. His approach is hands-on, low intervention, and deeply rooted in place.In this conversation we get into why perry is so difficult to make well. From awkward fruit that sinks instead of floats, to tannins that can return in bottle, to fermentations that refuse to behave. Tom explains why you can do everything “right” and still end up fighting nature. And why that struggle is exactly what gives great perry its depth.We get into the agricultural reality of managing orchards across the full calendar year, from winter pruning and wassailing through to blossom, pollination, frost risk and the impact of drought. Tom explains why perry pears demand extraordinary patience. Some can take up to twenty years before yielding properly, yet once established they may live and produce for centuries. That long view shapes everything.We also discuss fire blight and the very real threat it poses to traditional pear trees, along with the biannual nature of cropping, shifting climate patterns and the hard economics of growing fruit in Herefordshire. It is a precarious balance between agriculture, time and cashflow.On the production side, we explore wild fermentation and the idea of house character. Where does the yeast really come from. The fruit, the air, or the buildings themselves. We talk about why cider can ferment for months, sometimes right through winter, and how that slow, unmanaged process builds complexity you simply do not get in rapid fermentations.From there we move into keeving, residual sugar and bottle conditioning, and how sweetness, tannin and acidity can be structured with intent rather than correction. We debate blending versus single variety bottlings, and whether the romance of a named orchard fruit sometimes overshadows the craft and judgement of the blender.Finally, we look at premium cider as an alternative to wine. Not just in theory, but at the table. Can cider outperform wine with food. And if it can, why is it still fighting for that recognition.Along the way we taste a still, barrel-aged perry that would sit comfortably alongside white Burgundy, and debate whether apples suffer from over-familiarity. If they grow everywhere, do we take them for granted?https://oliversciderandperry.co.uk00:00 The Incredible Challenges of Making Perry, Perry as Route Into Premium Cider05:50 Cider & Perry as an Alternative to Beer & Wine, Respect09:30 Managing an Orchard: Traditional vs Bush, Tree & Fruit Development, Harvesting, Yield, Fire Blight32:30 A Year of Cider Making: Wassail, Pruning, Weather, Climate Change, Foxwell Apple, Fermentation & Yeast*, Blending53:40 Tasting Eskimo Eyes Still Perry - Barrel Ageing56:30 Keeving - Process, Purpose, Tannin & Sweetness & Alcohol1:08:40 Filtration. Pasteurisation & Bottling, Bottle Fermented Perry1:12:40 Cider Regions: Hereford & Somerset1:16:00 Single Variety Cider vs. Blends, Intention of the Cider Maker, Oliver’s Orchard Variites1:23:00 Origin Stories: Why Become a Cider & Perry Maker?1:26:00 The Search for Good Eau de Vie, Apple Pommeau, Royal Cider, Development of Cider Brandy📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

The Temperley family oversee the Somerset Cider Brandy Company, which became the UK's first independent distillery in living memory when it commenced operations in 1987. Thus, for almost 40 years, the Temperley family have been committed to reviving and preserving England’s traditional apple spirits. They have planted and maintained orchards with over 100 apple varieties, and earned a coveted Protected Geographical Indication for their cider brandy. Matilda handles day‑to‑day operations and looks to the future, while her father Julian draws on decades of craft knowledge and a passion for Somerset’s agricultural heritage.In this wide‑ranging conversation, we trace the fascinating history of cider brandy in England: how clandestine stills and museum licences paved the way for the Temperleys to become the country’s first licensed craft distillers. We explore the family’s deep connection to their land: planting pear and oak trees for generations yet to come, fostering a "if we don't grow it we don't use it" policy, and championing the unique character of Somerset’s smallholdings. Matilda and Julian explain the strict rules they set to mirror Calvados production, their use of Coffey stills to retain fruit character, and the impact of different casks, from sherry and port to locally coopered Somerset oak.Along the way we taste through their range, from perfumed eau‑de‑vie to five and ten‑year cider brandys, and the dessert‑style Pomona. We also discuss the romance and pragmatism of running a family farm, and hear how collaborations with whisky makers like Glenfiddich showcase the versatility of cider‑brandy casks. The episode concludes with reflections on the meaning of “craft,” the challenges of taxation and regulation, and what the future holds for Somerset’s apple‑spirit tradition.00:00 Why Make Cider Brandy? Cider, Heritage, Pride07:30 Where Does Cider Brandy Fit Into the Cider World09:15 Origins of Somerset Cider Brandy: Local Tradition, French Tradition14:22 Licensing a Cider Brandy Distillery in the 1980s - Bertrand Bulmer, Precedent, Customs, Museum Licenses, Protected Geographical Indication (PGI), Changing Regulation21:20 The Importance of Being a Family Business: Building for Future Generations, Planting Pear Trees25:00 Tasting Apple Eau de Vie, Apple Varieties & Styles29:10 Comparing Somerset Cider Brandy to Calvados31:20 Distillation at Somerset Cider Brandy, Continuous Distillation36:11 Tasting 10 Year Old Somerset Cider Brandy, Cask Management, Somerset Barrels47:50 Tasting Alchemy, PX Casks, Evaporative Losses and Bottling Strength53:00 Tasting 20 Year Old Cider Brandy, Partnering with Glenfiddich58:00 Tasting Pomona & Kingston Black Aperitif1:02:15 Why Aren’t There More Cider Brandy Distillers? Pride in Somerset, Politics1:08:45 Somerset vs Herefordshire, Loss of Orchards1:12:15 The South West of England Cidermakers’ Association1:14:00 Can Cider Brandy Become a Bigger Category? Applejack1:23:45 Glastonbury Festival1:27:35 Tasting Quince Liqueur, Growing Fruit1:32:10 The Craft Distillery Movement, Business & Passion, Marketing, 101M Views on Instagram1:45:45 The Prospect of 30 Year Old Cider brandy*, Apple Blossom, Seasons1:51:28 New Product Development1:54:45 Comparing 15 Year Old to 20 Year Old1:59:00 Tasting 2 Year Old Cider Brandy Aged in Somerset Oak2:03:15 Balancing Romance & Businesshttps://somersetciderbrandy.com/📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Henry Jeffreys is a drinks writer and historian. On this episode we talk about how deeply the British Empire shaped the way the world drinks. We start with a simple counterfactual: If the British Empire had never existed, which drinks would look completely different today, or perhaps not exist at all.Henry reflects on his book Empire of Booze, now nearly ten years old, and why the book has had such a long, slow life. From there, the conversation widens into a broad look at how British tastes, trade networks, and commercial priorities influenced everything from port and Madeira to Marsala, Bordeaux, cognac, rum, and Scotch whisky. Not just where these drinks were sold, but how they were made, fortified, blended, and priced.We talk about early booze marketing, the rise of Bordeaux as a prestige wine deliberately aimed at London, and the way fortified wines evolved as much in response to consumer demand as to the practical realities of long sea voyages. Marsala’s forgotten golden age, Madeira’s strange modern undervaluation, and the loss of clear drinking rituals around these wines all come into play.Beyond wine, we dig into empire, alcohol, and power. Why the British seemed compelled to make alcohol wherever they went, rather than simply importing it. How rum functioned as currency, medicine, morale booster, and disciplinary tool in the Royal Navy. And how booze sat at the intersection of curiosity, science, commerce, and conquest in a way that feels distinctly British.We finish by talking about historical drinking habits, Winston Churchill’s often misunderstood relationship with alcohol, and how modern attitudes to daytime drinking differ sharply from those of the past. It’s a wide-ranging conversation about how history, taste, trade, and alcohol are far more entangled than we usually admit.00:00 Writing and Promoting Empire of Booze03:15 If the British Empire Never Existed Which Drinks Would Never Have Existed?05:45 How the English Established Bordeaux Wine10:30 The Birth of Cognac: Dutch, English 13:00 Why Fortify Wine? Transport & Taste, Thomas Jefferson16:15 What is Marsala Wine? History, Production, Brands, Comparison to Sherry24:45 What’s Up with Madeira Wine?29:15 Did the British Empire Need Booze to Function? Brokering, Producing, Trading36:10 The British Navy & Rum40:10 Was Winston Churchill an Alcoholic? Day Drinking, Beer for Recovery52:45 Drinking with George Washington: Toasting, Rum, Revolution57:20 Becoming a Writer59:03 English Wine: Development, People, Quality1:06:05 Gin - Craft vs. Classics, Cocktails1:10:20 Favourite Cocktails, Exploring Flavours of the World1:16:10 Is Cider England’s Wine? 1:20:47 The Invention of ‘Strong Glass Bottles’ 1:24:20 John Mytton - Legendary Drinker and Party Animal1:26:20 Future Project: Wine & Class⁠Henry on Substack⁠ *DISCOUNTS ON STUFF I LOVE*☕ The best coffee liqueur from ⁠Algebra⁠ - use discount code CURIOUS15 for 15% off in their web shop.🍷 Get 15% off the world's best drinking vessels at Denver & Liely using ⁠this link⁠📷  ⁠Follow me on Instagram⁠ 📚 I've written ⁠quite a few books⁠ on spirits and cocktails

Tom Dyer is a flair bartender, founder of the World Flair Association, and a bartending educator. Tom rose through the ranks of the flair bartending in the early 2000s and over a fifteen year stretch he won 12 UK championship titles, 2 World Championship titles and over 80 international flair bartending competitions across the globe. Unlike many of his contemporaries Tom has remained one of the leading figures in the flair community to this day, so is uniquely positioned to comment on the history and current status of this often misunderstood side of bartending. Tom has recently co-written the Flair Bartending book, which chronicles in great detail the story of flair going back almost 400 years!On the episode we discuss the history of flair, from the early days of TGI Fridays, through to the movie Cocktail, and into flair competitions, the so-called 'golden age' of flair in the noughts, right up to present day stars of flair. We also touch on the evolution of flair, discussing craft flair, bar magic, and much more.This was such a fun conversation and Tom is genuinely the best ambassador for flair bartending that I can imagine.⁠The Flair Bartending Book is available here⁠*DISCOUNTS ON STUFF I LOVE*☕ The best coffee liqueur from Algebra - use discount code CURIOUS15 for 15% off in ⁠their web shop⁠.🍷 Get 15% off the world's best drinking vessels at Denver & Liely using ⁠this link ⁠00:00 Documenting the History of Flair Bartending04:20 *What it Takes to Become a World Class Flair Bartender07:10 How Flair Competitions Work - IBA, FBA, WFA - Competition Structure, What Its Like Competing in a Flair Final, How Competitions Have Evolved15:35 The Flair Bartending Book18:24 The Origins of Flair Bartending - Jan Steen, Jerry Thomas, Japanese Flair20:47 John Mescall - The First Modern Flair Bartender, TGI Friday’s21:40 Cocktail Movie - Tom Cruise, John Bandy25:40 The First Flair Competition - Bartender Olympics26:37 Regional Distinctions Between Flair: US vs European, Lee Miller & Bottle/Tin31:25 Working in Flair: Bennigan’s, TGI’s, Ray Blade, Everyone’s a Flair Bartender36:00 Craft Flair: Marian Beke, 5-Star Flair40:30 Flair During a Bar Shift 45:10 Bar Magic, Dickens50:07 The Golden Era of Flair - Nicholas Saint Jean, Christian Delpeche, Tom Dyer, Neil Lowey59:15 Flair in Las Vegas in 2004: Mindaugas Gradeckas1:01:35 Tom Dyer Flair: Bottle Tin Is King1:02:35 Legendary Flair Bars, Opening a Flair Bar Today - Pressure, Failure1:08:20 Social Media: Flair Education, Entertainment, Exposure1:12:52 The Difficulty of Originality1:15:00 Physical Punishment of Flair Bartending1:17:42 Current Flair Competitions: Arctic Flair, Las Vegas, Food Town Flair, Legends World Flair1:19:42 Who are The Current Best Flair Bartenders in the World? Who are the Best of All Time?1:22:50 Learnings from Writing the Book📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Sunny Hodge is an author, bar owner, and wine educator. He is the founder of two London wine bars: Diogenes The Dog and Aspen & Meursault. Sunny recently published his first book 'A Cynics Guide to Wine', which takes a refreshingly scientific approach to exploring the viniculture and wine making and shatters a few romantic notions in the process. On the episode we delve deep into the science of roots, soil, minerals, and nutrients, exploring how soil impacts the health of vines and the flavour of grapes. This takes us right down to the atomic level, through plant biology, and into the drink in the glass. We also discuss rootstocks and how they impact viniculture and wine, delve into other drink categories such as agave spirits, discuss the importance of telling (true) stores, and linger on wine service and education.This one gets very technical at times, but hopefully there's enough there to begin to get to grips with what is happening underground. Be sure to check out Sunny's book for more!https://www.diogenesthedog.co.ukhttps://www.baraspen.co.ukGet 15% off the world's best drinking vessels at Denver & Liely using the discount code CURIOUS15 or clicking this link.00:00 Why Are Cynics Important? Diogenes The Dog04:35 Being Cynical about Terroir - Defining Terroir18:00 VERY TECHNICAL: Does Soil Matter for Growing Grapes? Soil Composition, Roots, Rain, Minerals, Nutrients, Water Chemistry, Cations & Anions41:45 Potassium, Tartrate Crystals & Cold Stabilisation44:35 The Right Amount of Nutrients - Green Growth and Fruit Optimisation48:30 Killing The Romance: Education, WSET, Inertia to Change1:00:10 Does Dust and Dust Flavour Wine? Natural Fermentation1:04:30 Rootstocks, Grape Species, Phylloxera 1:10:20 Updating Education & Stories1:19:10 Terroir in Agave Spirits: Ocho, Atanasio1:21:30 Biological Terroir and Pesticides & Herbicides 1:27:20 Sunny’s Wine Bars: Diogenes The Dog, Wine Service, Demystifying Spirits & Wine

Peter Dorelli has worked in UK hospitality for 65 years, having moved from Rome in the 1950's when he was 18. He is best known as the sixth head bartender of the American Bar at the Savoy (arguably the top bar job in the world) where he worked for over two decades. Despite his 'retirement' in 2003, Peter is still a regular feature on the London and international bar scene, serving as a judge for World Class and often seen at parties with his partner in crime, Salvatore Calabrese (who has also been on the show).On the episode Peter shares stories from his early years as an illegal immigrant in the UK, which include drinking competitions with Scottish trawler men, how a surprise fire burnt down the hotel he was working at in Leamington, and what it was like working under the legendary Joe Gilmore at the Savoy. We also get into a bit of a debate about whether bartenders should taste drinks before serving them. It was a great pleasure to interview Peter and I'm grateful to him for lending his time to the show.If you like these conversations, please consider subscribing, liking it, and sharing with other people who will like it too. This genuinely helps grow and support the show, and will allow me to continue recording conversations with people like Peter.00:00 The Last of the Dinosaurs - How Has Bartending Changed? The Cycle of Classic Cocktails, Creating Stories07:45 Has Bartending Lost Some of its Romance? Ambition and Pace of Younger Bartenders, Knowledgee Acquisition 14:20 Peter’s Early Career - Arriving in UK, Pendower Hotel, Becoming a bartender27:00 Becoming a Fugitive, Challenging a Scottish Trawler Man to a Drinking Competition* 40:35 Burnt Down Hotels in Leamington & Becoming a Butler, Going Legal53:00 Stones Restaurant, Pebbles Bar: Roger Moore, Alec Guinness1:02:55 The American Bar & Joe Gilmore: Art of Hospitality, Becoming a Master1:15:50 The American Bar in the 1980’s: Team, Operations, Cocktails, Savoy Cocktail Book, Harry Craddock & Ada Coleman, Being a Custodian, Peter’s Style1:34:30 DEBATE: Is it Necessary to Taste Every Drink Before Serving?1:47:40 The UKBG: Founding and Function1:51:20 Cocktail Competitions, Ego, Lessons Learned: Shoes2:00:00 Retiring & Closure of the Savoy (2004 - 2010), American Bar Stories, DeathSpotify not accepting videos from me for some reason - video version of this podcast is available on YouTube along with images to illustrate some of Peter's stories.📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Spotify will now include a video version of the podcast 🎉 Which also means I've done away with the introduction (probably also a 🎉 for most of you). These show notes will offer a glimpse though, as well as the chapter markers.To support please share, like & subscirbe.Claire is a veteran of the hospitality industry having served as Global Belvedere Vodka Ambassador for many years, before moving into the non-alc space when she co-founded Æcorn Aperitifs with Seedlip founder Ben Branson. She has served as the Head of Luxury brands at Diageo, is a non-exec at Tales of the Cocktail, and spends great deal of time these days extolling the virtues of third spaces, social connection, and responsible consumption.This episode is sponsored by Algebra Drinks - use code CURIOUS15 to get 15% off at https://algebradrinks.com/00:00 Is Dry January Still Relevant?05:01 The Gamification of Health07:35 The Growth of Alcohol Free Brands - Function, Marketing, Occasions18:10 The Cost of Non-Alcoholic Brands vs. Alcohol, Homemade Non-Alcohol Spirits, Legacy of Seedlip24:40 Is Alcohol An Important Part of Socialising?29:05 How is Socialising Changing? Atrophy of the Social Muscle40:30 The Loneliness Epidemic44:58 Hospitality as a Framework for Social Development52:25 What Are Gen Z Doing if They’re Not Drinking?55:02 Can Being Fit Mitigate the Effects of Moderate Alcohol Consumption?1:04:40 Is Sugar Still Bad? Sweeteners: Taste & Health1:08:30 Alcohol & Sleep1:10:30 Solutions to the Hospitality & Social Crisis: Evolution of Hospitality1:15:55 GLP1 Inhibitors and Hospitality1:19:10 Is Health Just Another Trend?

Is the British pub dying?In this episode I’m joined by beer and pub writer Will Hawkes, who has spent years travelling the country and visiting thousands of pubs for his reporting. We talk honestly about where British pub culture stands in the 2020's: the closures, the economic pressures, but also the surprising resurgence of affection for traditional boozers with carpets, darts boards and multiple rooms. Will argues that while the industry has been shrinking for over a century, what people still crave is the warmth, social glue and sense of belonging that only a great pub can provide. From there we explore how pubs have evolved since the post-war years, from the dominance of breweries and the rise of the Big Six, through to gastropubs, craft beer and the shifting power of pub companies. Will explains why the person running a pub matters more than anything else, how regional quirks still define pub culture, and why some fiercely idiosyncratic rural pubs continue to thrive despite being miles from anywhere. We also dive into pub history – from gin palaces and tiled Victorian interiors to misleading claims about “the oldest pub in England” – and what really separates a pub from a bar or restaurant. It’s a wide-ranging conversation about class, nostalgia, architecture, community and why, despite everything, pubs still matter.https://www.willhawkes.net/Thanks for listening, to support please share, like and subscribe.

Rémy is the founder and co-founder of some of the most talked-about venues of the last five years, including A Bar with Shapes for a Name, Bar Nouveau, and his most recent Paris project, Abstract. His work is unapologetically high-concept, with design, intent and philosophy baked into every decision.This is one of the most thought-provoking and, at times, intellectually demanding conversations I’ve recorded so far. Together we dig into the fundamentals of art, creativity, motivation and human nature, using drinks and bars as the jumping-off point.We discuss whether drinks can truly be considered art, why it can sometimes be useful to make guests feel uncomfortable, how Rémy develops new cocktails, and why children might actually help us understand flavour better. We explore where the line between art and craft begins to blur, whether legacy really matters, what technology might offer hospitality, and how it could just as easily threaten it. There’s also a full lowdown on all of Rémy’s venues, plus a wider discussion on whether bars can still play a meaningful role in society.Whether this is your first episode or you’ve been listening for a while, welcome to 2026. I’ve got an exceptional run of guests lined up over the coming weeks, so make sure you’re subscribed. Missing out would be a pretty poor way to start the year.LinksRémy Savage (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/remysavageA Bar with Shapes for a Name: https://www.abarwithshapesforaname.comBar Nouveau: https://www.instagram.com/barnouveauparisAbstract Paris: https://www.instagram.com/abstract.paris

Big thanks to all of my guests this year - every one of you brought amazing things to the conversation and I am incredible grateful to you all. Here though are 12 conversations that really stood out - if you like what you hear be sure to check out the full episode if you haven't already.See you next year...00:00 Introduction02:50 Sandor Katz - The History of Fermentation05:50 Serge Valentin - Are We Taking Whisky too Seriously?08:15 Tony Cecchini - How the Cosmopolitan Was Invented24:10 Harold McGee - That Magic of Salt & Seasoning27:15 Jeffrey Morgenthaler - How To Start a Trend31:06 Jared Brown & Anastasia Miller - The Origins of Distillation34:34 Kevin Armstrong - Souring Agents in Cocktails37:07 Dave Broom - On Writing and Researching40:36 Henrietta Lovell - Where Does Tea Come From?43:46 David Mabberley - Is Citrus Doomed?47:01 Luca Gargano - Haiti and Clairin53:04 Megs Miller - Exploring Agave Species for Wellness

Gabe Cook (aka Ciderologist) is a cider expert and educator based in the UK. On the episode (recorded at Haywood Cider Farm in Cornwall) we take a deep dive into the culture, history and appreciation of cider, tasting our way through half a dozen English and American ciders. See links below for those producers and products.Find Gabe here - https://www.theciderologist.com/Tasty Stuff -https://www.haywoodfarmcider.co.uk/https://www.wildingcider.co.ukhttps://www.baumanscider.comhttps://www.greggs-pit.co.ukhttps://oliversciderandperry.co.uk/https://chancecider.com/

Simon is a writer, publisher and business entrepreneur. He is the founder of Diffordsguide.com, Class Magazine and Difford's Guide to Cocktails book Series which is now in its 18th Edition.To support the show please rate and subscribe - thanks!

Dr. Johnny Drain is a materials scientist turned fermentation obsessive, flavour innovator, and co-founder of the cocoa-free chocolate company pushing the industry to rethink everything it thought it knew about cacao.Johnny’s one of those rare thinkers who can sit comfortably in the worlds of cutting-edge science and high-end hospitality. He’s worked with some of the most boundary-pushing restaurants and bars on the planet, helping them unlock new flavours, reduce waste, and harness the incredible power of microbes. His new book, Adventures in Fermentation, is part manifesto, part manual, part love-letter to the invisible life that shapes what we eat and drink.In this episode, we get into the evolution of chocolate, the future of fermentation, how microbes actually make flavour, why pasteurisation isn’t the enemy, what gut science is really telling us, and what a “sound-tuned” ferment might taste like. It’s a conversation about flavour, sustainability, identity, and the weird, wonderful magic of transformation.Settle in — this is a fascinating deep dive with one of the most interesting flavour thinkers working today.Where to find Johnny:Website: drjohnnydrain.comBook: Adventures in Fermentation (available now in print + audiobook)podscan_ABnstXrbweK9idIY2nCk9XKfeChCbWtD

In this episode, Richard Seale of Foursquare Distillery joins me for a fast-moving deep dive into the history, culture and technology of rum — from 17th-century Barbados to the modern distillery.Key Topics:Is Barbados the birthplace of rum?Richard explains why the island is the true origin of cultural rum-making — not because it was “first”, but because it produced the earliest consequential, documented rum industry with skilled distillers, equipment, trade routes and scale. Sugar, the Dutch, and the rise of an industryWe explore how Dutch traders brought Brazilian sugar technology, how Barbados’ wind and water resources made large-scale production possible, and how early planters rapidly adopted boiling, milling and distillation methods. Early rum wasn’t crudeContrary to modern assumptions, 17th-century rum was sophisticated: spontaneous fermentations managed with skimmings and dunder, double distillation in copper, and a deep practical understanding of acidity and microbial balance. Export markets and the fall from dominanceBarbados supplied the American colonies with vast volumes of rum until war, revolution and hurricanes collapsed its export market — paving the way for Jamaica and others to dominate. The sugar industry’s long arcRichard traces the rise, centralisation and 20th-century collapse of Barbados sugar, from hundreds of estates to the single remaining factory today. The double retort pot stillA highlight of the conversation: why the double retort became the Caribbean’s signature still. Richard explains its structure, how low wines and high wines recycling works, and why it produces high proof, clean separations and excellent ester development. Batch vs continuous distillationWe cut through common myths: pot stills versus continuous stills, why “hybrid still” is a misnomer, why strength doesn’t equal flavour loss, and how batch and continuous distillation differ fundamentally in chemistry and output.

Jeff Morgenthaler has been a defining voice in the bar world for more than two decades. Bartender, blogger, and author, he’s shaped modern drinks culture through his long-running blog — still one of the most valuable resources on bar technique — his years at Portland’s much-missed Clyde Common, and his influential writing, including The Bar Book. Today he continues to travel, teach, and inspire, sharing clear, grounded insight into every corner of cocktail craft.Jeff played a part in my own development early on, too. His blend of logic, humour, and precision helped validate the path taken by so many of us, and his influence on the industry — direct and indirect — is larger than most realise.Although Jeff and I have known of each other for nearly twenty years, this was our first time sitting down together. The conversation ranged widely across the landscape of bars, technique, and drinks culture.In this episode you’ll hear how Jeff found his way behind the bar, why baijiu deserves more appreciation, how to make your own cola, the early-2000s figures who shaped both our careers, how he riffs on eggnog, the common mistakes people make when batching syrups (and how his tools can fix them), what it’s really like to write a book, our thoughts on the World’s 50 Best Bars, what defines a truly great bar, and plenty more.www.jeffreymorgenathaler.com

In this episode of The Curious Bartender Podcast, we welcome Jota Tanaka, Master Blender for Kirin’s Fuji Gotemba Distillery and Executive Fellow, Kirin Whisky. His career spans brewing, winemaking, American bourbon and Japanese whisky.Jota joined Kirin Distillery Co. in 1988 and after roles in Japan and the United States, including a period at Four Roses Distillery where he helped launch the Small Batch range, he returned to Japan and became Master Blender of Kirin Whisky in 2017.We explore his career, the story of Fuji Gotemba at the foot of Mount Fuji, and the evolving world of Japanese whisky including its history, methods, sensibilities, controversies, consumption and future.Fuji Gotemba Distillery bio: https://www.fujigotemba-distillery.com/en/takumi/01/

Camper English is a San Francisco–based drinks writer and educator, best known for his long-running website Alcademics.com, an invaluable resource for bartenders and drinks enthusiasts alike. He’s the author of Doctors and Distillers: The Remarkable Medicinal History of Beer, Wine, Spirits, and Cocktails (2022) and The Ice Book.I sat down with Camper recently in San Francisco to talk about the city’s distinctive bar scene — from its historic haunts to its cutting-edge cocktail bars. We then dive into the fascinating world of ice (a subject Camper has explored more deeply than anyone), discuss Doctors and Distillers, and wrap up with a conversation about mineral water — including how to make your own.Doctors & Distillers - https://alcademics.com/doctors-and-distillers-the-remarkable-medicinal-history-of-beer-wine-spirits-and-cocktails/The Ice Book - https://alcademics.com/the-ice-book-by-camper-english/📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Harold McGee is a man that requires no introduction if you are someone who has worked in food and drink in any capacity at all. In 1984 he published McGee On Food & Cooking and brought the science and technology of cooking and flavour to the masses. A second edition in 2004 served as the practical manual for any chef worth their salt, and elevated Harold to the status of godfather - or perhaps even god - of culinary science. More recently, he published a book called Nose Dive, which investigates aroma and smell, which is a topic we explore during our conversationAlso on the menu:Why humans enjoy bitterness, how herbs have co-opted us, how salt makes food more delicious, how water opens up the aromas of spirits, what happens when wine matures in the bottle, why some drinks have ‘length’, how evolution and culture have shaped our flavour preferences, what we mean when we say a drink or dish is balanced, what the next frontiers of flavour science look like, and much more.📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Today I am speaking with Serge Valentin. Serge is a whisky expert and the founder of a whiskyfun.com - which is widely regarded as the go-to review repository for whisky tasting notes and scores on the internet. Over the past 23 years Serge has tasted over 20,000 bottles ranging from entry level staples to some of the rarest in the world. His scoring system has become the de facto benchmark by which many measure the quality of a dram, and Serge has become a cult hero amongst the world’s whisky geeks.On the episode we discuss tasting whisky - personal preferences over objective goodness, the hubris of blind tasting, whether whisky is too serious, the role of independent bottlers, how whisky changes in the bottle, recent exceptional whiskies, weird whisky, the founding of whiskyfun.com, the importance of education, changing tastes, whisky myths, and much more.

In today’s episode, I’m joined by one of the true mavericks of American distilling — Lance Winters of St. George Spirits. This is a journey that begins in the orchard, with pears, quinces and raspberries destined for eau de vie, and stretches all the way to absinthe, American gin, rum and even highballs built on umeshu and Baller whisky.We trace the roots of St. George back to Jörg Rupf and the early days of California craft distilling in the 1980s, and follow Lance’s arrival and the evolution of a house defined not by category, but by philosophy. Along the way we dive into the uncompromising art of eau de vie — fruit selection, fermentation, and the stills that shape every spirit they make — and ask how that sensibility influences whisky, rum and beyond.From jalapeño vodka to acorn spirits, from dill lactones in oak to the question of consistency versus expression, this conversation is about more than products. It’s about place, curiosity, and a willingness to let flavour lead. We explore American gin through Californian botanicals, the rebirth of absinthe, the origins of Baller, the future of eau de vie, and where all this innovation leaves the legacy of St. George.This is not a tour through a portfolio — it’s a look inside a creative engine. To support the show please rate, subscribe and share - thanks!

Charles Denby is the co-founder and CEO of Berkeley Yeast, a company that’s reimagining fermentation through genetics. With a PhD in molecular and cell biology from UC Berkeley, Charles and his team are using genetic science not to replace brewing tradition, but to enhance it — designing new yeast strains that can transform how beer, wine, and even spirits are made.In this conversation, we dive deep into the biology that underpins flavour. We unpack what yeast actually is, why it produces alcohol, and how its metabolism creates the esters and aromatics we love in drinks. Charles explains how fermentation conditions shape flavour, how lager and ale yeasts differ, and what really happens inside the tank at every stage of fermentation.From there, we go microscopic — exploring yeast genetics, DNA modification, and the molecular tools that make it all possible. Charles shares how Berkeley Yeast engineers strains to enhance tropical aromas in hazy IPAs, introduce new layers of bitterness, or even make brewing non-alcoholic and healthier beers more efficient.We also discuss the broader implications of this technology — from applications in wine and spirits to the stigma surrounding GMOs and what “responsible innovation” really means in the drinks world.This is a fascinating deep dive into the invisible world that drives fermentation — and how science is quietly shaping the future of flavour.If you like this content please consider subscribing.00:00 Introduction02:34 Charles’ Background in Science & Origins of Berkeley Yeast10:29 What is Yeast? Why Does it Produce Alcohol? Yeast Metabolism16:49 Fermentation Conditions, Ester Metabolism22:04 Yeast Species: Lager & Ale Yeasts24:24 Stages of Fermentation28:34 Nutrients for Fermentation, Amino Acid Synthesis, Diacetyl Production36:34 Why Is Beer Fizzy? Production of CO2 During Fermentation37:34 Yeast Genetics, Cell Biology, Evolutionary Biology42:29 Modifying Yeast DNA, Molecular Scissors, Polymerase Chain Reaction55:54 The Complex Web of Genetic Modification1:01:14 Testing Yeast in Berkeley Yeast’s Microbrewery1:04:04 Comparing Hazy IPA Yeasts, Creating Tropical Aromas1:09:19 Engineering Yeast for Bitterness1:12:04 Brewing Non-Alcohol Beer, Vacuum Distillation: Method, Downsides1:16:54 Brewing Beer for Health1:22:17 Applications in Wine: Flavour, Low-Alcohol, Cultural Knock on Effect1:26:14 Residual Sugar in No/Low Alcohol Ferments1:27:59 Applications in Spirits: Flavour & Efficiency1:30:49 The Berkeley Yeast Business Model, Lifespan of Yeast Cultures, Competition1:35:44 Overcoming the Stigma of GMO, Responsible Technology, Defining GMO in Beer

Megs Miller is a bartender, educator, and all-round agave obsessive — whose journey has taken her across multiple continents but most recently to Mexico City, where she runs Salón de Agave, a tasting room dedicated to exploring the depth and diversity of Mexico’s native spirits.In this episode, you can expect to learn about agave species and taxonomy, how different agave species affect the mind and body — Megs and her co-worker Sophie have been conducting a two-year experiment on this — insights into retailing agave spirits in Mexico, the nuances of terroir and regional flavour mapping, and the joy of glass-matured mezcal.We also dive into sotol, pulque, and the evolving conversation around responsibility, sourcing, and politics in agave spirits. From the cheesiness of Inaequidens to the pine forests of Chihuahua, and from women’s progress in the industry to the cultural storytelling behind each bottle — this is a deep and generous look at the Mexican spirit.Megs was so generous, in fact, that we tasted around 25 different distillates — and as someone who’s tasted quite a few in my time, I wasn’t surprised to find that there were many amazing surprises. I wasn’t able to write down or document them all, but if you’re interested in anything in particular, I suggest giving Salón de Agave a follow on Instagram or booking a session with them next time you’re in Mexico City. It’s awesome.https://salondeagave.com/00:00 Intro02:25 Meg’s Trip to Durango06:25 Agave Species and Taxonomy, Tequila11:25 How Different Agaves Affect Your Body, Agave Spirits Distillation15:35 Retail of Agave Spirits in Mexico16:35 Terpenes in Agave Spirits, Health18:55 Moving to Mexico – Opening Salón de Agave26:25 Glass-Matured Mezcal, Pechuga, Salt & Lime37:25 Agave Education, Price & Value45:05 Mapping Flavour Around Mexico, Terroir49:55 Tasting Maguey Inaequidens Agave, Cheesiness, Narcos56:45 Back to Durango, Maguey Lampranillo, Label Design1:00:35 Tasting Vino del Norte from Pechotierra, Pulque Production, Appreciating Pulque1:06:40 The Evolving Flavour of Agave Spirits, Appreciating Agave Spirits, Glassware1:08:15 Sotol, Dasylirion1:10:32 Texture and Mouthfeel in Agave Spirits, Tuning Your Flavour Perception, Context in Tasting1:19:25 Mezcal Labelling, DO, Rebellion, World Agave Spirits, Mezcal Politics, Responsible Sourcing1:28:25 Chihuahua Sotol, Pine Forests, Cultural Terroir1:31:42 Women in Agave Spirits: Challenges, Progress1:40:25 Guerrero Cupreata, Inconsistency, Scarcity, Bottle Killing1:45:15 Distilado de Pulque from Salmiana, Mango Distillate1:48:45 Identifying Agave by Smell: Inaequidens & Salmiana, San Luis Potosí Agave Cooking1:51:45 Challenging Preconceptions in Agave Spirits, Smokiness1:54:25 Oaxaca, Small-Batch Cupreata, Cowhide Fermentation1:56:35 Tasting Notes, Describing Flavour, Context

Richard Hart is one of the world’s most respected bakers and a celebrated author. He first rose to prominence in the early 2000s while working at the legendary Tartine Bakery, San Francisco. From there, he co-founded Hart Bageri with René Redzepi in Copenhagen, before relocating to Mexico City, where he recently opened his latest venture, Green Rhino. Richard is also the author of the James Beard Award–winning book Richard Hart Bread, and is widely regarded as one of the greatest exponents of sourdough bread on the planet.In this episode, we dive deep into the craft and science of sourdough: how Richard’s methods and protocols have evolved over the years, the role of different cereals and milling techniques, the importance of water in bread, yeast management, ovens and baking temperatures, and practical tips for baking at home. We also explore bread culture and chew over some wonderfully contentious questions — from whether a pizza qualifies as a sandwich to the eternal mystery of the Jaffa Cake.Although this is primarily a podcast about spirits, cocktails, and bars, The Curious Bartender is ultimately about curiosity. Bread has always fascinated me, and sitting down with one of the key figures who helped popularise sourdough worldwide was an opportunity I simply couldn’t turn down. It didn’t disappoint.00:00 Introduction01:44 Drinks Preferences 02:44 Balancing Eating & Exercise as a Chef & Baker, Working Hours 06:14 Baking Schedule & Flavour Considerations 08:44 Baking at Tartine in San Francisco, Instagram & Fame 12:29 Working with Rene Redzepi, Copenhagen, Hart Bageri, Danish Bread Culture, Family 19:29 Moving to Mexico City, City Life, Gentrification 23:14 Opening Green Rhino, Baking for Life, Incorporating Mexican Food, Chocolate, Corn, R&D, Fucking People Up 30:54 Flour, Milling, Selecting Wheat, Sourdough Process: Temperature & Time, Gluten 39:04 Water for Baking 40:59 Sourdough Starters: Superstition, Protocols, Effects of Altitude in Mexico City 48:29 Pursuing the Perfect Loaf, Defining a Perfect Loaf, Tweaking Parameters, Comparison to Cooking and Cocktails 54:04 Working with Rye, Danish Bread Culture 57:34 Other Grains: Oats, Spelt, Durum, Einkorn 1:00:44 Water Substitutes: Beer, Tea 1:03:04 Making Brioche, Burger Buns 1:05:44 Stoneground flour, Wood fired ovens, Thermo-oil vs Electric Ovens, Oven Dynamics 1:08:58 Baking Bread at Home - Techniques and Tips, Temperature & Steam 1:12:01 Is Bread The Best it’s Ever Been? Fixing Supermarket Bread 1:15:11 Bread Guilty Pleasures 1:15:53 Is a Pizza a Sandwich? 1:18:58 Burger Flipping Masochism 1:20:50 Is a Jaffa Cake a Cake or a Biscuit? 1:21:14 Sandwich Filling & Bread Pairing

Dave Broom is one of the most prominent and influential voices in the world of whisky and over the course of his career he has written some of the most important books on whisky and spirits including The World Atlas of Whisky, Whisky: The Manual, A Sense of Place, and The Way of Whisky — works that have shaped the way both enthusiasts and professionals understand flavour, culture, and the people behind the glass.On the episode we delve into the all important sense of place — from the cultural terroir of Scotland to the artistry and craft of distilling, and how flavour finds its way into the glass. Dave takes us from Japan to New Zealand, from English farms to French stills, as we explore the global spread of malt whisky and why everyone seems to be making it.We also get into his writing: the discipline, the methodology, the architecture of narrative non-fiction, and the influence of mentors like Michael Jackson. Along the way, we talk music, art, storytelling, and the state of drinks journalism today.And we taste some stuff too — French sorghum whisky, Breton malts, German rye, and the genius of Chichibu, and a sneak preview of the whisky from my new project at Rosemaund Farm — each dram opening the door to wider conversations about style, strength, regionality and the shape of whisky itself.And we close with the big themes: whisky’s current bubble, the secondary market, daily drams, and favourite distilleries.02:37 A Sense of Place - Terroir in Spirits, Scotch Whisky Cultural Terroir10:02 Artistry & Craft in Whisky Making - Learning from Masters, Adapting Tradition, Economics and Law15:07 How Do Flavours Find Their Way Into Whisky? The Way of Whisky and Japan19:42 Whisky In New Zealand - Codrona, Burning Manuka Wood, Waiheke Distillery22:17 Why is Everyone Making Malt Whisky?23:59 Writing - Latest Project, Mixing American Whiskey, Untold American Whiskey History, Researching History34:27 Dave’s Writing Process - Research, Poetry, Methodology - The World Atlas of Whisky: Influence, Practicality39:48 Writing Narrative non-fiction - Road Trip Books, Telling Stories, Narrative Architecture, The State of Drinks Journalism, Content and distraction, Photography52:17 The Arts & Spirits - Music, Art, Culture56:47 Tasting Bows French Sorghum Whisky - The French Whisky Category, Regionality, Eau de Vie1:02:07 *Dave’s Methodology for Assessing Whisky - Writing Tasting Notes, The Shape of Whisky1:07:37 The Macbeth Whisky Series - Making Whisky Fun through Communication of Flavour1:11:07 Tasting Rosemaund Farm 10 Year Old English Whisky1:17:30 Whisky Bottling Strength - The English Whisky Category1:20:42 Dave’s Early Career - Writing, Oddbins, Pubs, Becoming a Spirits Writer1:25:37 The Influence of Michael Jackson - Writing Style, Beer, Writing for Consumers1:28:57 Dave’s Writing Style - Poetry, Discipline, Trade Knowledge1:32:42 Tone of Voice in Writing1:34:07 Tasting Breton Whisky from Distillerie La Mine D'or ‘Galad’, Armorik Distillery, Development of French Whisky Market1:37:12 *The Bursting of the Whisky Bubble - Overproduction, Lessons from the Past, Pricing, Perception of Whisky1:48:47 Secondary Whisky Market - Auction House Bubble, Karuizawa, American Whiskey1:51:42 Opening Rare Bottles, Buying Whisky, Daily Drams, Changing Preferences for Taste1:57:27 Tasting Hardenberg German Straight Whisky - Leopold Bros.2:00:09 Chichibu Tasting - The Genius of Ichiro Akuto, Malting, Barley, Mizunara2:03:56 Quickfire QuestionsDave's site - https://thewhiskymanual.ukDave on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/davewasabi/Liquid Antiquarian YouTube Channel - https://www.youtube.com/c/TheLiquidAntiquarianRosemaund Farm Distillery - http://www.rosemaund.com📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

This week I’m joined by Nick Strangeway, one of the most influential British bartenders of the modern era. With almost 40 years in and around the London drinks scene, Nick has tended bar at legendary spots like Fred’s Club, The Atlantic Bar & Grill, and Che, designed drinks programmes for Hawksmoor, Hix, and The Groucho Club, and consulted for venues worldwide. He’s also ventured into spirits production — from creating flavoured vodkas with Absolut under the Absolut Craft label, to co-founding Hepple Gin and Second Sip, a low-ABV gin.Nick’s career is deeply intertwined with the late, great Dick Bradsell. They worked together on and off for over a decade, and much of the first part of our conversation explores Soho’s 1980s and 1990s bar scene — the people, brands, drinks, and wild stories that defined the era.We go on to cover everything from the art of serving a martini, creativity in bartending, the brilliance of batching, the gentrification of London, Simon Difford and Class magazine, taking inspiration from the kitchen, the beauty of punch, the problem with bars you can’t sit at, fighting customers, and Nick’s latest venture — a new basement bar beneath a jeweller in Burlington Arcade, which opened just last week.If you’re not yet subscribed, now’s the time. Next week, I’ll be speaking with perhaps the greatest living whisky writer, followed by a two-week trip across Mexico and the USA to record with some true heavyweights of the food and drink world. Don’t miss out — it’s free.00:00 Introduction02:42 Frozen Glasses, Martinis, Champagne, Specifications, Vermouth 06:59 Nick’s Entry into Bars - The Allure of Bars, Fred’s Club 11:42 Working with Dick Bradsell - Bramble, Vodka Espresso 15:42 The Changing Nature of London - 1980’s to 2020’s - Drinking Dens in Soho, Gentrification, Community, Class 24:12 Modern Bartending: Influencers, Competence, Creativity, Hospitality, Bar as a Barrier 34:22 Working at Che - The Customer Perspective, Fighting in Bars, Dick Bradsell Vaulting Over the Bar 39:57 Following Dick Bradsell to Atlantic Bar & Grill, Detroit, The Flamingo, Dick Bradsell’s Approach to Hospitality & The Scene 53:19 Creating Cocktails - Modifying Classics, Simon Difford - Class Magazine, Sauce Guides 59:22 American Cocktails vs. UK, Punches 1:04:22 Shifting to Restaurant Bars - Challenges, Chef Approach to Drinks, Batching Cocktails, Theatre, Bars that You Can’t Sit At 1:24:42 The Origins of Hawksmoor - The Benefits of No Uniform, Building a Great Team, Obsession, Eating Pencils, Jonathan Downey & the Smoking Ban 1:43:21 Developing spirits for Absolut 1:48:57 The Birth of Hepple Gin - Valentine Warner, Walter Riddel, Northumbria, Wild Juniper, Technology - Super Critical CO2 Extraction 2:00:37 Second Sip Low ABV Gin - Development, Leo Robitschek, Overcoming Technical Challenges - Texture, Louche 2:11:02 No Regrets Bar - Designing a New Bar Concept for Mayfair, Curating Clientele 2:18:12 Other Projects - Richard Corrigan, Valentine Warner & Wild Kitchen Episode sponsored by Fever-Tree

Henrietta Lovell is the founder and CEO of The Rare Tea company, a tea educator and author of the book Infused: Adventures in Tea. Over a career of more than 20 years Henrietta has travelled around the foothills of the Himalayas, across China, Japan, India, and Malawi, sourcing some of the best teas in the world and learning from the communities that grow them. She has worked with world class chefs and bartenders, including supplying tea at some of the bars I have owned over the years. In fact we first met around 15 years ago when I opened the Worship Street Whistling Shop in London.This episode is a tea masterclass that covers the basics of growing, processing, brewing and tasting tea, but also explores, history, economics, sustainability, agricuture, health, poverty, and some of the most expensive teas on the planet. Expect to learn where most of the world’s tea is grown - clue it isn’t china or India, why it is the Emperors Golden Eyebrows costs in excess of £250 for a 30g bag, why you shouldn’t ever brew good tea for three minutes, best practices for making tea infusions in spirits and for the bar, and much more.To support this podcast please like and subscribe.🙏 This episode is sponsored by Fever-Tree📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/00:00 Introduction 01:41 Cold Brewed Tea - Avoiding oxidation, Osmosis, Method06:21 The Remarkable way that high end Jasmine Tea is Made, tasting, uses of Jasmine tea Noma10:56 Tea as an Alternative to Wine - tasting Himalayan First Spring blended with Japanese Sencha13:24 Tea Varietals, Colonial History, Early Tea Drinks in India, Blending Tea & Comparisons to whisky19:11 Tea Types - White, Green, Oolong, Black, Pu’erh - Controlling Oxidation, Drying, Terroir and Agriculture, Fermentation25:24 Where Tea Grows - Environment26:41 East Africa, The Problem with Commodity Tea, Brokers, Responsible Tea Drinking, Direct Trade32:46 finding the Best Teas - Flavour, Independent, Organic Practices (vs. Organic Certification), Polyculture Framing, Impact of other Flora on Tea38:27 The Lifespan of a Tea Plant, Harvesting (Machine vs. Hand), Risk of Tech on Tea Communities45:51 Perception of Tea - Taste Testing, The Problem with Tea Bags, Practicality of Brewing Tea vs. Coffee54:16 Fruit Teas - Flavour Essences, Fruit Extracts01:00:46 Trading Up on Tea - What to Look For, Margins on Tea1:05:44 Tasting Coffee Leaf Tea1:08:31 Pu’erh Tea - Pairing for Food, Flavour, Ageing Tea, Tea Cakes, Tea Collectors, Tong Mu Village, Emperor’s Golden Eyebrow Tea1:17:21 Brewing Techniques - Equipment, Temperature, Brew Ratio, Time1:28:14 Carbonating Tea, Salting tea, Pairing with Cheese1:30:18 Matcha - Colour, Origins, Production (traditional vs modern), Commodity Matcha Syrups & Matcha Trend, Matcha and Coconut Water1:40:23 Caffeine in Tea - Inconsistency, vs. Coffee, Decaf Tea1:43:53 Alcohol based Tea Extractions - Protocols, Flavour, demo with Gin Infusion, Tea Cocktails1:52:11 Closing Words - Tea in the Present Day, Yerba Maté

Dale is a bartender, author, brand owner, and the co-founder of the Museum of the American cocktail. In the late 90’s working at NYC’s Rainbow Rooms Dale was probably the most famous bartender on the planet and has remained one of the best loved bartenders to this day. I sat down with Dale in Manhattan a few weeks ago, looking out over the Empire State Building as the sun went down. The interview was scheduled during a very tight window of opportunity between Dale arriving back from Tales of the Cocktail in New Orleans and me catching a flight back to London. We had just 90 minutes, which wasn’t nearly enough time for a man with some many stories and such a sharp memory.In fact chronologically we barely got to 1990 before I had to turn off the microphones and hot foot it to catch my flight. For that reason, I am calling this interview Part one and hope to sit down with Dale to record the second part next year - and who knows, maybe we will need a third part.What you are about to hear is less a story of Dale’s career and more a tour of New York and Los Angeles hospitality from the late 1950’s through to the 80’s, exploring its jazz clubs, neighbourhood bars, and some of the greatest restaurants and hotels of the 20th century. Dale recounts the musicians that provided the soundtrack, the chefs that designed the cuisine, and the architects that imagined the buildings, all in vivid detail.Perhaps the most significant of these people to Dale, was Joe Baum - one of the United States most significant restauranteurs who introduced the concept of themed restaurant tot he world with no expense spared. Working with acclaimed chefs like Julia Child and James Beard, he opened hundreds of restaurants across America, most notably The Four Seasons Restaurant, Windows of the World at the top of the world trade centre, and the Rainbow Room at the Rockefeller Centre. You’ll hear about other venues during the course of our conversation too.We also discuss the founding and challenging upbringing of the Museum of the American Cocktail, the incredible aesthetic and culinary vision of Joe Baum, the establishment of modern American cuisine, what it was like working at the Bel Air Hotel in the 1980’s, the establishment of The Rainbow Room, and much much more.There are perhaps 100 different names and venues mentioned in this episode and it can get quite confusing. If you’re of the mind to do so I recommend watching the episode on YouTube when you get a chance, as I have provided archive images and captions to help paint the picture.Episode sponsored by Fever-Tree Mixershttps://degroffspirits.com00:00 Introduction03:11 Tales of the Cocktail06:41 Building the Museum of the American Cocktail - Jared Brown & The Rainbow Room, Ted Haigh, History of the Cocktail, Building the Collection, Locations20:09 Dale’s Early Life - Acting, Moving to Manhattan, Packing Bibles*, Restaurant Associates, Howard Johnson’s, Jazz Clubs*, McGlade’s Bar38:11 Working with Joe Baum, Restaurant Associates, Charlie O’s, Newarker, Four Seasons at the Seagrams Building, Modern American Cuisine, James Beard, La Fonda del Sol53:59 The Rainbow Room: Early History, Design55:11 Bel Air Hotel in Los Angeles - Cocktails, 7/11 Mix, Martini Rituals*1:06:32 Aurora Restaurant, Reviving Classic Cocktails, Fresh Juices, Jerry Thomas1:08:11 Building the Rainbow Room - Researching Classics, Recruiting Teams1:18:01 Becoming Famous, Impact on cocktail culture around NYC, Consulting with Keith McNally - Balthazar, Pravda, Lucky Strike

Today I am speaking with Alexandre Gabriel. Alexandre is the founder of Maison Ferrand, Citadelle Gin, and Plantation—now Planetary—Rum. Expect to learn how a Burgundian farm boy turned his hand to bartending in New York and then went on to innovate across the categories of cognac, gin and rum. We take a deep dive into the production of Cognac - terroir, grape varieties, distillation, maturation, and discuss the changing market of cognac in France and abroad.From there we turn to gin, covering the birth of Citadelle in 1996 and the challenges of establishing the world’s first modern craft gin distillery. The conversation then shifts to rum—Alexandre’s early encounters, the founding of Plantation, double maturation, Jamaican and Barbadian styles, muck, dunder, and the acquisition of West Indies Rum Distillery. We taste our way through the Rockley still, and high-ester ferments, and discuss geographical indications, tradition and community. We also discuss the decision to change the Plantation brand name to Planetary, and much more.00:00 Introduction & Clarification on Jamaican Rum GI05:16 Origin Stories - Childhood, Farming, Marc de Bourgogne, Growing What You Sell, Wine vs. Brandy, Bartending in NYC16:06 Cognac - Acquiring Ferrand, The Cognac Market18:16 The Cognac Regions, Cognac Houses, Geology & Flavour, Terroir, Yeast30:56 Grape Varietes in Cognac - Ugni Blanc & Colombard - Acidity, Stability, Producing Seasons33:36 Emphasis of Distillation over Fermentation37:18 Maturation in Cognac - Coopers, Elevage, Limousin Oak, Gastronomic Approach, Trancais, Fill Strength51:41 Tasting Ferrand 1840 - Finding old Cognac, Perception of Flavour based on Dilution, Historical Recipes, David Wondrich & Mint Juleps, Ancient Still Designs, The Evolution of Tradition1:04:09 Dosage in Cognac - Methods, Purpose, History - Physiology of sweetness and salt perception, sugar quality1:11:59 Changing Perceptions of Cognac - Cognac highballs, Misconceptions and Understanding1:17:52 Creating Citadelle Gin - Gin Market in 1996, First Craft Gin Distillery of Modern Era, Growing Juniper, Legislation, Plymouth Gin, Ferran Adrià1:32:24 Rum: Alexandre’s Early Experiences with Rum1:34:16 Thierry Gardère and Barbancourt, buying barrels, the origins of Plantation, Navy Rum & Mr Fogg1:42:56 Establishing the Plantation Brand - Nicolas Wine Shop Distribution, Naming the brand Plantation, First products, West Indies Rum Distillery team, Amaretto Cask Rum1:47:04 Double Maturation in Rum - Tropical and Continental - History, Benefits1:52:06 Jamaican Rum GI - Regulation Regarding Overseas Ageing, Myers, Captain Morgan - comparison to Single Malt Scotch2:00:18 Clarendon & Long Pond Distilleries - Southern vs. Northern Distilleries Styles in Jamaica - Historical reasons for styles, Esters, Export2:06:16 Muck, Dunder, Cane Vinegar & Bacteria in Rum Fermentation2:09:12 Acquisition of West Indies Rum Distillery (WIRD) in Barbados - George Stade (Founder), Origins of NRJ2:19:41 Stade’s Rum - Rockley Still: World’s Oldest Rum Still, Restoration, First Distillation2:26:22 What is Barbados Rum? Varieties of Stills, History, Using Seawater in Rum Production2:30:58 Tasting Hogo Monster - 2000ppm Esters2:36:05 Stiggin’s Pineapple Rum, Pushing the Limits2:38:16 Barbados Community, Growing Cane on Barbados, Curacao2:41:49 Next Steps: Cognac grapes, Renovating more stills, Navy Rum R&D, Paraguay2:46:41 Changing from Plantation to Planetary - Language, History, ConsultationEpisode Sponsored by Fever-Tree

Sandor Katz is ften called a “fermentation revivalist,” Sandor has spent decades exploring how microbes shape our food, our drinks, our culture, and even our sense of place. He has written a number of book son the subject including Wild Fermentation, The Art of Fermentation, Fermentation as Metaphor, and Fermentation Journeys — the latter chronicling his travels to meet fermentation practitioners across the globe. His bestselling The Art of Fermentation won a James Beard Award and has become the definitive modern guide to the craft. In this conversation, we journey from the very origins of fermentation and the metabolism of alcohol to the staggering variety of fermented foods and drinks in our diets — and why they’re so much more than just flavour. We dismantle common misconceptions around health, freshness, and speed, and dive deep into Sandor’s own path into this microbial worldAlong the way, we unpack the fascinating interplay of bacteria, yeast, and mould, the difference between wild and cultured ferments, and how fermentation can capture the essence of a place, from mezcal to sourdough. We explore everything from lightly fermented tonic beverages and experimental meads to the wonders of koji mould and its transformative enzymes. And yes — we even get into the bad, weird, and downright challenging ferments, from stinky tofu to the notorious surströmming.Whether you’re a brewer, bartender, chef, or simply curious about the invisible life that feeds us, this episode is a deep dive into a living tradition — one that’s as old as civilisation, and as alive as the microbes themselves.02:55 The Origins of Fermentation - Metabolism of Alcohol06:42 The Breadth of Fermented Foods in our Diets - Flavour, Preservation, Texture09:45 Misconceptions About Fermented Food & Drink - Language, Health, Germophobia, Challenging the Notions of Fresh & Fast21:04 Sandor’s Journey in Fermentation - Childhood Encounters, Macrobiotic Diet24:25 Gardening, Fermenting Tomatoes, Other Preservation Techniques, Fermentation Traditions29:50 Microbes: Bacteria, Yeast & Mould - Isolation, Symbiosis, Environmental Conditions, Making Sauerkraut37:14 Pathogenic Bacteria vs. Lactic Acid Bacteria38:17 Wild vs. Cultured Fermentation - Backslopping, Sourdough, Making Yoghurt, Pure Culture Starters, Natto Bacteria47:25 Fermentation as a Manifestation of Place - Mezcal, Bioprospecting for Yeast58:00 Yeast - Efficiency vs. Flavour59:49 Experiments in Alcohol Fermentation - Rice, Chinese Yeast Balls, Sumac Mead, Turmeric Mead1:03:24 Tips for Wild Alcohol Fermentation - Stirring, Sugar, The Myth of Sterilisation, Protocols1:09:00 Lightly Fermented Tonic Beverages - Tepache, Chicha, Country Wines, Orange Blossom Cordial, Meadowsweet Wine, Spruce Tip Wine, Root Beer, Ginger Beer1:14:10 Water Kefir & Kombucha - Biology, Flavour Development, Alcohol Development, Commercialisation of Kefir & Kombucha, Origins1:23:11 Koji Mould - Biology, Applications, Protease Enzymes, Sake, Soy Sauce1:30:25 Use of Fermented ingredients in Bars and Restaurants - Cocktail Hacks, Sustainability, Narrative1:37:41 Life Changing Ferments - Cheese. Stinky Tofu, Conditioning to Fermented Flavours1:40:40 Bad/Weird/Disgusting Ferments - surströmming 

Toby Cecchini is a bartender of some 40 years, the author of Cosmopolitan which remains the best memoir on the life of a bartender, but perhaps best known for inventing the drink by the same name, which defined an era and still attracts love and hate from consumers and bartenders alike. With a storied career spanning decades at some of New York City's most iconic bars, Toby's insights into bar culture, drink creation, and hospitality continue to influence bartenders around the globe.I revisited Toby’s memoir, "Cosmopolitan: A Bartender's Life," ahead of our conversation in New York. It captures a raw and candid snapshot of the New York bar scene of the late '80s and '90s. We being the conversation talking about his shifting perceptions of the book—and the industry itself—over the past two decades.We also address the shifting role of bars as vital social spaces, we discuss cocktail batching, the guest bartending phenomenon, and the blurred lines between bartenders and chefs. Toby also shares some anecdotes from the 80’s including some brutally honest takes on Andy Warhol.Sharp, direct, and refreshingly unapologetic, Toby offers a much-needed perspective for anyone interested in the real nuts and bolts of cocktails and hospitality. From a personal point of view this was a conversation I have been wanting to have for years and it was one of the must fun ones I’ve had on the podcast to date.This episode is sponsored by Fever-Tree MixersTo support the podcast please rate it, subscribe and share. Thanks!02:22 Cosmopolitan the Book - Toby’s Relfections 21 Years Later07:08 The Bar as a Third Place - Purpose, Function, Niches, Democratisation, Performance, Money, Japanese Bars, Hotel Bars18:07 Bartending Then & Now - Staff, Problem Solving, Working the Floor21:18 The Myriad Problems with Guest Shifts24:09 Batched Cocktails vs. A La Minute - Changing perception of a Bartender’s Function, Chef vs. Bartender36:05 Split Basing Cocktails, Rum, Bourbon, Scotch39:56 Creating Unsettling Atmospheres in Bars - 10 Second Theory, Vibes, Music46:10 The Changing Nature of Bartending, Cocktail Renaissance, New York, Public Perception of Cocktails, Nerds53:18 The Psychology of New Yorkers vs. Brits1:00:40 Reminiscing the 80’s & 90’s Bar Scene - Getting Old, Sering Artists (Warhol, Haring, Basquait)1:02:42 Treatment of Hospitality Staff by Famous People, Treatment of Guests by Bartenders, Hospitality1:08:52 Inventing the Cosmopolitan cocktail, The Odeon, Other Claims, Absolute Citron, Formulas & Garnishing1:25:23 Revisiting Cosmopolitan the book1:28:08 The Story of Long Island Bar

Joy is a true legend of the spirits industry. As Master Blender at Appleton Estate in Jamaica, she holds the historic distinction of being the first woman ever appointed Master Blender in the world. A trained chemist, Joy’s remarkable sensory talents and scientific rigour have been instrumental in Appleton’s rise to global prominence, making her one of the most respected figures in rum today.I first met Joy several years ago in Jamaica and have remained fascinated by her pioneering story ever since.In this episode, we delve deeply into what makes Jamaican rum so distinctive, exploring the chemistry behind its bold flavours.We discuss the difference between pot and column stills in respect of rum styles or marques, the Appleton maturation processes, the unique geography of the Appleton Estate, and the detailed chemical processes, including ester formation and higher alcohols and the crucial role of fermentation and ageing in flavour development. We also talk about the newly released Appleton 51 year old - the oldest ever tropical aged rum that has been brought to market and we also discuss the broader challenges facing the rum category, from overcoming misconceptions around quality and value to navigating the complexities of geographical indications On that note - Jamaican Rum GI was established in  In October last year, Jamaica’s Intellectual Property Office amended the GI for Jamaica Rum, originally established in 2016, to ban ageing overseas. This move, pushed by the Spirits Pool Association representing Jamaica’s six distilleries, aims to strengthen the GI However, the change sparked controversy from National Rums of Jamaica (NRJ)—which owns Long Pond and Clarendon—because Maison Ferrand relies on ageing rum abroad. Beyond rum itself, Joy shares the extraordinary personal story of how she became Master Blender, overcoming societal expectations and barriers in Jamaica to carve out a groundbreaking career. She reflects openly on mentorship, innovation, her personal blending style, and her hopes for the future of premium rum.Episode sponsored by Fever-Tree00:00 Intro08:15 What Makes Jamaica Rum Special? Pot Stills, Weight, Diversity13:55 Becoming a Master Blender - Challenges, Chemistry, Culture of Rum23:30 Blending Rum - Consistency, Innovation, Joy’Marques, Hearts Collection, Pot vs. Column28:55 Sugar Cane, Molasses, Water, Fermentation, Chemistry of Appleton, Flocking & Stability40:28 Maturation - Fill Strength, Angel’s Share, Refilling, Cask Types43:35 Appleton Estate 51yo The Source, Ultra Premium Rum, Appleton 8yo, Diversity of Rum Styles, Coconut54:06 Jamaica Rum Geographical Indication (GI)58:33 Future of Jamaica Rum, A Global Rum G, Additives, Nutritional Information1:05:48 The Appleton Estate Effect, Visitors Centre1:08:55 Wray & Nephew Rum - Culture, Uses, Wray & Nephew 17

Esteban is the founder of Casa Endemica which is a stable of brands that includes La Venenosa Raicilla, Derumbes Mezcal, La Higuera Sotol. He has been a major force in championing mezcal outside of he state of Oaxaca (where 91% of mezcal is made) and really led the charge on exposing the amazing spirits of ancestral raicilla (the mezcal of the state of Jalisco).I met Esteban about a year ago when I was writing my agave spirits book, and was instantly blown away by his knowledge of the vast landscape of agave spirits producers but also his deep rooted respect and admiration he has for the culture and methodologies of the communities that make these spirits.This conversation is really a revisit to that same conversation we had in Guadalajara. You can expect to learn how it Filipinos instigated the production of mezcal in Mexico during the 17the century, how archaeological finds near the Colima volcano might hint at a more ancient form of distillation in Mexico that would upend the history books if it were true, the regionality of mezcal and how people and plants play into that, how the mezcal and proposed raicilla DO - designation of origin - falls short and what needs to be done about it, and at the end we talk about Esteban’s latest project - his first distillery… making tequila.Big thanks to Davide Segat from The Nomad Hotel for letting us record there and Gaby Moncada for helping with scheduling!Episode Sponsored by Fever-TreeBuy my agave spirits book here - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Curious-Bartenders-Agave-Safari-appreciating/dp/1788796799Casa Endemica - https://www.casaendemica.com/en/home-eng/00:00 Introduction02:27 Fillipino Distillation Technocoly Arrvies in Mexico07:21 Captcha Clay Pot Distillation Theory16:02 Capacha Still Design, Wixárika Stills26:47 The Mezcal Industry Today - Derrumbes Brand30:37 Raicilla, 400 Cornejos and Mayahuel39:52 Regionality in Mezcal43:02 Sourcing Great Mezcal - Humans Culture, Quality, Economics45:12 Mezcal: Congeners, Industry, Politics, Scale, Value & Opportunity1:09:33 The Mezcal DO - Growing the DO, Infrastructure, Regulating Bodies, Potential Solutions1:17:30 Raicilla - DO, Draft NOM, Fermentation Vessels1:33:13 Bagaso Tequila Distillery - Carbon Neutral Tequila, Sustainability in Agave Spirits

Francois Thibault is the co-creator of Grey Goose vodka, which launched in 1997  quickly became the world’s most respected super premium vodka brand. I travelled to Picardy in Northern France alongside Grey Goose’s global brand ambassador, Joe McCanta to meet Francois, and visit the wheat fields of the region the distillery where Grey Goose is made. I should say at this point that Grey goose didn’t pay me anything - I was genuinely interested to learn more about the product and to meet Francois, And Joe had some space on a trip with some journalists from the US.00:00 Introduction04:44 The vision of Sydney Frank and Grey Goose06:34 Becoming a Maitre de Chai - Cognac Cellar Master10:29 Transitioning to vodka from cognac 12:42 Wheat - Picardy, agriculture15:16 Improvements and Refinements of the Grey Goose process20:16 Water and its importance to vodka - Grey Goose Altius23:37 Character vs. Purity in Vodka28:14 Vodka Misconceptions33:16 The Future of Vodka42:28 Closing Thoughts

Jared Brown and Anastasia Miller are internationally acclaimed authors, historians, distillers. They are the co-founders of Mixellany Limited, they have consulted for spirits brands and bars worldwide, contributing significantly to contemporary cocktail culture. It’s also Jared and Anastasia we have to thank for discovering the first known written reference to a 'cocktail' - from 1798.They have written quite a few books including "Shaken Not Stirred: A Celebration of the Martini" and "Spirituous Journey: A History of Drink," additionally they have reprinted classic cocktail books and distilling manuals such as the Cafe Royal Cocktail book and The Distiller of London (which comes up in the conversation) .Jared has been the master distiller of Sipsmith since the distillery was built in 2009 and Anastasia was recently awarded a doctorate in brewing and distilling history - which is rumoured to be the first in history.Their most recent book is called A Most Noble Water, which is a book about gin that takes the established conventions of gin history head on and pretty much destroys them all. On the episode you can expect to learn how and why tonic water was really mixed with gin during the time of the British Raj, how German and Austrian housewives factor into the story of gin, how the royal family influenced drinking culture in the 17th and 18th centuries, the most popular drinks in the Netherlands in the late seventeenth century century (hint - it wasn’t genever, but it does go in a martini), the significance of a 1639 book called The Distiller of London, why the gin craze wasn’t the gin craze, and at the end, a question about who really wrote the savoy cocktail book - plus much much more.03:16 The Commonly Held Myths of English Gin: Dutch Courage, William of Orange, Gin Craze, Gin Acts14:23 Gin & Tonic Mythology, Bonus Daiquiri/Cuba Libre History, Mark Twain’s Doctor, Carbonated Beverages as Medicine24:40 The Origins of Distillation: Silk Roads, Persians, Moors, Arrival in Europe28:21 The 15th Century Female Distillers of Austria and Germany32:19 The Introduction of Juniper into Spirits: Biology, Distribution, Medicine, Early Distillation Manuals & Early Gin-like Drinks42:31 Distillation Technology in the 15th Century – The Migration of Distillation Technology, Historical Research48:56 Albertus Magnus and Roger Bacon, Arnaud de Villanueva, The Philosopher’s Stone53:36 The Royal Families, Conspicuous Consumption, Influencers56:06 Unlicensed Distillers of London, Molasses Spirit, Distilling Books of the 17th Century59:42 The Trajectory of Distilling Knowledge Through Europe Italy: University of Salerno in 12th Century, Responsible Historical Research1:02:56 Netherlands and the Low Countries: The Origins of Genever, Single Shot Rye Distillations, Vermouth Trends in the 17th Century1:06:21 The Distiller of London (1639), The First English Gin, Pink Gin, ‘Sweets’1:13:20 Measuring Alcoholic Strength Throughout The Years: Proof, Hydrometers, Bubble Tests1:15:52 Aqua Crapulum, Recreating Aqua Fructum, Decoding The Distiller of London1:21:59 Continuous Distillation and Neutral Spirit: Charles Derosne, Celier Blumenthal, Anaeas Coffey1:24:07 The Economics of Distilling & Brewing in the 18th Century, Class Divide, FOMO, Female Distillers & Compounders1:29:17 Lower Class Gin – Vitriol, Turpentine, Lime, Ethyl Ether1:32:46 Alcohol Consumption in England in the 18th Century – Social Reform, The ‘Gin Acts’ – Sellers, Distillers, Compounders, Informants – First Reference of ‘Gin’ 1714 – The Fable of the Bees1:45:51 The Gentrification of Gin – Cost to do Business, Introduction of Minimum Still Size – Emergence of London Dry (by 1860) & Old Tom (1811) – Purchasing Gin1:52:41 How Gin Was Being Consumed through the Centuries – Gin Lane, Ginger Bread, Gin Cocktails2:00:20 The Mystery of the Savoy Cocktail Book & Kokuteeru🙏 This episode is sponsored by Fever-Tree

Professor David Mabberley is a world renowned botanist, writer and public speaker, who specialises in the taxonomy of tropical plants. Over more than 50 years he has authored countless scientific papers and identified dozens of new plant species through fieldwork conducted in Africa, Asia, the Pacific, and Australia. He is a former Keeper of the Herbarium, Library, Art and Archives at the Royal Botanic Gardens Kew & Director Emeritus of Royal Botanic Gardens Sydney. He is an emeritus fellow at Wadham College, University of Oxford; adjunct professor at Macquarie University, Sydney; and professor emeritus at the University of Leiden. He has been awarded the Engler Medal in Silver, José Cuatrecasas Medal for Excellence in Tropical Botany and the Linnean Medal - twice. He is also the author of the recently published book Citrus: A World History (link below).The citrus fruit industry is heading for complete collapse and there may not be anything anyone can do about it. We discuss exactly why this is happening and what the potential solutions are, but also take a deep dive into the history of citrus fruits, from their unique biology, early cultivation, hybridisation and mutation, and discover the great grand parents of the modern citrus fruit industry. We delve into the history of citrus as medicine, perfume and culinary uses, as well as their appearance in art and design. Then we discuss the modern citrus industry, the discovery of new species, and hopes for the future. Citrus: A World History - https://www.thamesandhudsonusa.com/books/citrus-a-world-history-hardcover00:00 Introduction03:05 Is the Citrus Fruit Industry Doomed?05:05 The Origins of Citrus Fruit, Asia, Citron, Pomelo, Mandarin, Wild Citrus Fruits, Hybrids09:20 Ancient Farming and Cultivation of Citrus - Arab Trading, Alexander the Great11:12 Citrus in the Renaissance Period, Medici, European Orangeries, Art14:25 Uses of Citrus Fruit Through History16:40 Coca-Cola, Perfume & Early Grey Tea: Bergamots and Neroli20:30 Morphology of Citrus Fruit - Peel, Segments, Seeds, Vesicles24:02 Distribution Strategies of Citrus Fruit & Life Cycle26:30 Presence of Caffeine and DMT in Citrus27:48 Citrus as Medicine, Makruts and Limes, Contraception, Scurvy33:35 Rose’s Lime Cordial & Marmalade36:53 Limes: Key Lime vs. Tahiti, Seedless Mutants39:37 Sweet Orange Varieties: Clementines, Tangerines & Satsumas, Diversification43:05 Grapefruits: Origins and Genetics, Effects on Medication45:15 The Citrus Market: Growing, Insecticides, Hunalonbing, Challenges, Collapse of US Industry52:10 Possible Scenarios for the Citrus Industry, Asian Citrus Psyllid, Importance of Diversity57:57 Closing Thoughts🙏 This episode is sponsored by Fever-Tree📷 Follow me on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tristanstephenson/📚 I've written quite a few books on spirits and cocktails - https://www.thecuriousbartender.com/

Kevin Armstrong is a bartender, bar owner, spirits and cocktail educator and the author of Round Building, a manual for the professional bartender. Kevin rose to fame in the London bar scene over 20 years ago as the group bar manager for the Match Bar Group. He wrote and deployed the most comprehensive cocktail training program of the era, contributing significantly to the critical acclaim of bars like Milk & Honey, The Player, Trailer Happiness, and Sosho to name a few. He has since gone on to open Satan’s Whiskers, which over its 12 years of existence has become one of the best loved bars in London and more recently featured in the World’s Best Bars. Kev and I were together in Scotland a few weeks ago and got inthralled in some deep conversations about cocktails and bars. He is known to have strong and well thought out opinions on various topics pertaining to drinks and drinking, so I was delighted when he agreed to come on the podcast. I was also keen to hear about the rise of Satans Whiskers as a globally recognised venue.On the episode you can expect to hear about Kev’s early career in bars and how he transitioned to the match bar group, you can hear us remeniss over the London bar scene as it was in the early noughties, we talk about his time at Soul Shakers working with Michael butt and bars like Mahiki, then becoming a bar operator, first with pubs and then Satan's whiskers. We spend some time talking about modern cocktail bars, both the things we like and don’t like, including homogeneity, ingredients, batching, and more, then we touch on bar awards and finally finish with a surprise quiz! Well, a surprise for Kev that is - not me.Episode Sponsored by Fever-Tree

Iván Saldaña is a Mexican biologist and internationally recognised expert on agave spirits. With a PhD from the University of Sussex, his research focuses on agave ecology and evolution. Saldaña co-founded Montelobos Mezcal and Casa Lumbre, launching innovative brands like Ancho Reyes, Abasolo whisky, and Sotol Nocheluna. He blends scientific expertise with sustainable practices, and is one of the leading voices in the global agave and spirits industries.In this episode, we explore the fascinating world of agave, from biology and genetic diversity to the risks of monoculture farming and crucial pollinators like bats. We discuss the role of terroir in tequila, explore fermentation variables before delving into Mezcal's denominations of origin, ancestral methods, environmental politics, and the balance between tradition and modernity. Lastly, we cover other intriguing Mexican spirits such as Sotol—including celebrity-backed brands like Nocheluna—as well as innovative non-alcoholic spirits like Almave, and concluded with Abasolo Whisky and the cultural significance of nixtamalised corn drinks.This episode is sponsored by Fever-TreeFind Casa Lumbre (and all their products) here - https://www.casalumbretour.comThanks to Paolo for making this happen, and to Carlos for letting us record at Café Pacifico.

Luca Gargano, CEO of Velier, is one of the most influential figures in rum, known for transforming the rum category globally. Based in Genoa, Italy, Luca's expertise spans wine and spirits trading, authorship, and deep-rooted connections within the Caribbean rum world.In this episode, Luca discusses his extensive experience travelling the Caribbean, beginning with his early life and connections to Rhum St James in Martinique. He explores the evolution of the Italian rum market, influenced by historical events like communism and the popularity of Cuban rum. Luca provides insights into rum classification based on raw materials and distillation methods, alongside discussions on tropical ageing, angel's share economics, esterification, and authenticity in production. The conversation touches on critical issues of transparency and labelling regarding additives and sugar in rum.He reflects on the dynamics of partnerships versus independent bottling, highlighting his collaboration with Foursquare Distillery and Richard Seale. Luca offers detailed knowledge of Haiti's Clairin, including historical context, production methods, logistical challenges, and the ageing process. The narrative then turns to his discovery and revitalisation of Trinidad’s Caroni rum. He discusses the philosophy behind knowledge sharing in hospitality, the importance of seminars, and balancing tradition with modern technology.Finally, Luca introduces his visionary "Nomad Project" inspired by HMS Walrus, a floating rum distillery, and Mother Mesccia, an innovative Haitian and Monaco rum project aged in Marsala and Vermouth casks, offering insights into future rum innovations.Velier Official Website: www.velier.itFoursquare Rum Distillery: www.foursquare-rum.comCaroni History: Caroni Rum HistoryClairin - The Spirit of Haiti: Clairin Rum Information

Desmond Payne MBE is Master Distiller Emeritus of Beefeater, one of the world's best loved and most respected gin brands. He is the longest serving gin master distiller in the world, having also spent a 20 year stint at Plymouth Gin. And he is perhaps the most respected gin distiller alive today.I sat down with him in his office at the Beefeater Distillery in London to discuss the history of the brand, the challenges that gin distillers face, the tension between innovation and tradition, what Desmond thinks about the current state and future prospects of the gin category, and much more.If you enjoy this podcast please give it a rating.Episode sponsored by Fever-Tree

Jonathan, known to his friends as JD, is a bar and restaurant operator of nearly 30 years who has been responsible for some of the best loved and most influential cocktail bars of the early 21st century. In 1997 he founded the Match Bar group which through JD’s uncompromising vision and an illustrious cast of future superstar bartenders, made for groundbreaking venues as Match Bar, The Player, Milk & Honey London, Sosho and more. These bars along with the likes of LAB, Lonsdale and others set the standard for cocktail excellence in London through the first decade of the century, defining a generation of drinking in the capital and inspiring all that came after globally. JD then went on to found Street Feast which brought together small food and drink vendors in disused or otherwise useless spaces (like old car parks or former markets) with music and entertainment. Street feast was a casualty of covid however, but JD is now back and involved with a couple of new restaurant projects which we touch on briefly at the end of the conversation.The main part of our chat is centred around the remarkable story of the Match Bar group. Expect to learn how JD met Dick Bradsell by pure chance and convinced him to help open the first Match Bar. How Dale DeGroff became the director of cocktails for Match Bars and introduced Jonathan to a certain Sasha Petraske and a new and title known bar in New York called Milk & Honey. How Sosho and the East Rooms burned to the ground in 2010 jeopardising the whole business, what in JD’s eyes makes a great bar, what he thinks of the current state of cocktail bars in London, and much more.This episode is sponsored by Fever-Tree mixers.