Zero Click Marketing

AI search is changing SEO, but not because SEO is dead. It’s changing because search is becoming more zero-click.In this episode, I explain GEO — Generative Engine Optimization — and why it’s less about chasing AI hacks and more about making your content easier to retrieve, understand, cite, trust, and remember. I break down four practical mechanics of GEO: retrievability, extractability, credibility, and public evidence — and show why good AI visibility still starts with good marketing.Timestamps00:00 Why AI search is changing SEO01:35 What GEO actually means03:10 Why GEO is a zero-click marketing problem04:30 The four mechanics of GEO, beginning with retrievability08:30 Extractability: can your content be understood and reused?11:00 Credibility: why generic SEO content falls short13:30 Public evidence: why your brand’s off-site record matters18:45 Why GEO is not magic — it’s good marketingResources:Ahrefs study: AI Overviews Reduce Clicks by 58%Pre-order the Zero Click Marketing book (yes, there’s a chapter on AI marketing!)Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com 

Zero Click Marketing: How to Build Brands and Earn Customers on a Traffic-Starved Web is officially available for pre-order.YOU HEARD RIGHT, CUTIES! I announce my and Rand Fishkin's upcoming book, explain why pre-orders matter, and tell you how to claim the pre-order bonuses.Pre-order the book at zeroclickmarketing.co/book.Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

Marketers say they want good strategy. Then they optimize for whatever’s easiest to measure.This episode is about why easy-to-see metrics like traffic, likes, attributed pipeline, and rankings can create false confidence. Instead, better measurement can look like this: off-platform sharing, stronger sales conversations, customer education, adoption of your language, and content that does more than one job. In a zero-click world, the easiest metric to report is not always the one that matters most.Timestamps00:00 Why marketers optimize for what’s easiest to measure01:36 How SEO gets too much credit for capturing demand04:23 The Fitbit B2B example and content as a service06:09 Better ways to judge content quality07:54 Why the best content does more than one job11:12 What better measurement looks like in a zero-click worldYou can do audience research with all kinds of tools and networks like Google Trends, Exploding Topics, Reddit, and of course, my employer, SparkToro. You can create an always-free account and get 5 reports per month on sparktoro.com.Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com 

For years, marketers were told to create the ultimate guide: one page that covers everything on a topic. That advice worked when the goal was to rank, earn the click, and keep people on your site. But that era is coming to an end. In this episode, I walk through new research on Google and ChatGPT that points in the same direction: broad, catch-all content is getting weaker, while focused, hard-to-replace value is getting stronger. I break down what winning websites actually have in common, why relevance now beats comprehensiveness, and how to rethink your content strategy for a zero-click world.Research cited in this episode:5 Data-Backed Features of Websites Winning Google in 2026 by Cyrus ShepardThe Fan-Out Effect: What Happens Between a Query and a Citation by Kevin Indig and AirOpsTimestamps:00:00 Intro00:21 The rise of the “ultimate guide” playbook00:53 Why broad, catch-all content is getting weaker01:00 What Google’s winners have in common02:19 The difference between reading and doing02:36 Why destination sites win02:57 Brand vs. discoverability03:52 What ChatGPT actually rewards04:30 Why answering one question beats answering five04:56 The new standard: defensibility + focus05:55 How to rethink your content strategy06:36 Why brand matters more than ever07:00 Final takeawaysLearn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com 

Best practices can help you avoid obvious mistakes — but they can also make your marketing forgettable. In this episode, I explain why the real problem isn’t best practices themselves, but using them without personalization, taste, or audience insight. Drawing on my experience at Fitbit, I’ll show you how audience research leads to stronger content, smarter channel choices, and more compelling marketing — plus a few practical ways to get started without spending much money or time. This episode is an expansion of my blog post, “Best Practices Are Meaningless Without Audience Research.”Timestamps:00:00 How best practices turn into beige marketing01:27 The antidote: audience research02:01 The Fitbit example and the real B2B challenge03:43 Good marketers have always done some version of this05:08 More examples: marketers, skincare, and sports betting06:36 How to start doing audience research07:40 How to spot patterns faster09:38 Best practices only tell you the format10:05 How audience research improves taste11:02 Best practices get you on the field. Audience research helps you win.You can do audience research with all kinds of tools and networks like Google Trends, Exploding Topics, Reddit, and of course, my launch sponsor, SparkToro. You can create an always-free account and get 5 reports per month on sparktoro.com.Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com 

Before someone clicks your website, they may already have formed an opinion about your brand from the public record — snippets, Reddit threads, reviews, and AI answers. So today, I’m sharing a 7-step playbook for shaping your brand’s public record. I’ll help you audit what’s visible, identify weak claims versus strong facts, publish more credible proof, make that proof easier to retrieve and cite, and track whether the public story around your brand is getting stronger over time. It’s a practical episode about reputation, visibility, and what marketers can still influence in a world of fragmented discovery.This episode pairs nicely with the previous week’s “Why Better Attribution Won’t Fix Your Measurement Problem.” You might want to check that one out after this one. :)Timestamps:00:00 Why your brand’s public record matters02:00 The 7-step playbook02:35 Audit the story the internet is already telling about you04:00 Treat third-party services as an extension of your brand05:25 Separate weak claims from strong facts07:22 Make your content easy to retrieve, cite, and summarize09:01 Measure whether your public record is getting strongerResources:Wil Reynolds’s “GEO Experiment: How AI highlighted the 1 bad review we got in 24 years”Ross Simmonds’s “Reddit’s Impact on B2B Search” studySearch Engine Land’s “Why your content doesn’t appear in AI Overviews”Alertmouse for brand monitoringSparkToro for audience researchLearn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com

A lot of marketers say they want better measurement. Usually, what they really want is cleaner attribution.In this episode, I argue that those are two different jobs. Attribution tends to reward the channel that captured demand once the buyer was already in motion. SparkToro's latest research proves that influence happens everywhere. So what we really need is better measurement — to help us understand lift: are more people searching for you, remembering you, mentioning you, and showing up ready to buy? If you confuse the two, you’ll keep overvaluing what’s easiest to credit and underestimating what actually drives demand.Timestamps:00:00 The real problem: buyers are influenced before the click01:41 Attribution vs. measurement: two different jobs04:33 Stop giving the wrong channels all the credit...05:10 ...because influence happens everywhere! 08:05 Why measurement needs to get broader and simpler09:30 Why we (accidentally?) end up starving our demand creation channels10:47 Measurement needs to grow up.11:24 Next week: influencing the public recordLearn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com 

Today I'm sharing my notes on recent news/research in the worlds of AI and Google Search.  I'm breaking down 3 key pieces:Ross Simmonds of Foundation Inc shows how Reddit influences buyer discovery earlier than many marketers realize. Cyrus Shepard of Zyppy Signal argues that clicks still matter — not as a vanity metric, but as a signal of relevance and satisfaction. Wil Reynolds of Seer Interactive offers a brutal real-world reminder that if you don’t publish defensible facts about your brand, AI may fill in the gaps with whatever scraps it can find.If you want a more polished version of this episode along with a spiffy graph, read my blog post.Timestamps:00:00 Intro00:27 Why these three studies belong together01:05 Ross Simmonds on Reddit’s growing role in SaaS search03:05 Cyrus Shepard on why clicks still matter04:18 Zero-click does not mean clicks stopped mattering06:10 Wil Reynolds on AI surfacing an old negative review07:26 Why “the truth is out there” is not enough if it isn’t published09:08 What marketers should do nowBig thank you to my launch sponsor, SparkToro, the makers of fine audience research software. Rand Fishkin/SparkToro did the research that also supports the ideas in this episode.ZCM Field Notes are short reactions to news or observations of what’s happening in the field. Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

A lot of marketers confuse polished with effective. Or they confuse consistency with substance. But neither one guarantees the work is actually good.In this episode, I make the case for a higher bar: usefulness. In a zero-click world, your content has to stand on its own. So before you worry about making it prettier or posting more often, ask whether the idea is actually strong enough to deserve attention.New here? Start with Episode 2: What Zero Click Marketing Actually IsJoin us next week — I’ll break down why marketers overvalue what’s easiest to count.Timestamps: 00:00 Intro 00:37 The tension between polish and volume 01:24 Why polish can signal care but not guarantee value 02:02 Why volume can create momentum but still say very little 02:38 The real bar: usefulness 03:15 Respecting your audience by assuming they’re smart 04:54 A simple test: strip away the design and ask whether the idea still holds up 05:20 What Amazon’s memo culture gets right 06:30 What to do when the idea itself is the problem 07:01 Three signs a piece of content is ready to publish 09:28 The hierarchy of useful marketing content 11:03 Why this matters even more in a zero-click world 11:46 The question to ask before you publish 12:15 Next week: why marketers overvalue what’s easiest to countLearn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsProduced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com 

My buddy Brendan Hufford drops by! We talk about his journey from old-school SEO to zero-click marketing. We cover the early days of SEO, the content habits that helped him build a reputation, and why he stopped trying to win by playing the obvious game.We also get into why zero-click marketing works, why it was happening long before it had a name, and why attribution gets messy fast in B2B. Brendan shares how he thinks about buyer journeys, self-reported attribution, becoming your audience’s favorite, and the simplest way to start measuring zero-click impact today.This was a fun one because Brendan brings both the receipts and the realism. If you’ve ever struggled to explain marketing impact beyond first-click or last-click attribution, this episode is for you.00:00 Intro00:15 Brendan’s early path from teaching and side hustles into SEO02:03 The SEO era when useful, original content started to matter more04:54 The “100 Days of SEO” project and building a body of work in public07:56 From SEO specialist to audience-first marketer09:36 Why Brendan had been doing zero click marketing before it had a name10:17 Why “zero click marketing” works as a phrase — and why naming matters11:56 Rand’s earlier search for a term for “marketing to sources of influence”13:14 Why zero-click marketing is effective but hard to sell internally14:38 The rise and limits of software-based attribution16:06 How Brendan talks to leaders about marketing impact beyond hard attribution19:10 Why people buy when they’re ready — and why attribution gets messy23:10 My take: make it easy for people to choose you when they’re ready23:35 “Don’t be the best. Be their favorite.”25:25 Brendan’s zero-click ask: follow his work and learn along the way27:08 Brendan’s practical advice for getting started with zero-click measurement28:30 OutroThis episode was edited by Share Your Genius (shareyourgenius.com)Connect with Brendan Hufford and check out his work: LinkedIn | GrowthSprints.co for B2B SaaS growth | BrendanHufford.com for his personal site Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

Once you understand the concept of Zero Click Marketing, the next question is obvious: Where should you actually be doing this?In this episode, I break down the four environments where Zero Click Marketing thrives — the places on the internet where influence happens before someone ever clicks a link. From social feeds to AI answers, these platforms reward content that delivers value natively. If you understand where ZCM happens, you can create content that builds trust, recognition, and demand — even when you can’t track the click.I also share three real-world examples of Zero Click Marketing in action, including a fascinating product launch from Seattle Ultrasonics that shows how a single piece of content can explain — and sell — an entirely new category.New here? Start with Episode 2: What Zero Click Marketing Actually Is.Timestamps:00:00 Intro and orientation01:00 Where ZCM generally works best01:30 The four environments where ZCM specifically works best05:25 The pattern of ZCM05:55 3 case studies of ZCM in the wild06:01 ZCM when you've created a totally new category07:56 ZCM in a highly-competitive space09:12 ZCM with a core idea and remixing across channels/formats10:33 Next week: Brendan Hufford tells his firsthand experience with ZCM!Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

ZCM Field Notes are short reactions to news or observations of what’s happening in the field. Today, we're talking about the LinkedIn algorithm — because Christopher S. Penn just published an unofficial guide on how LinkedIn's algorithm works right now — and I have some quick notes and a "party" analogy I want to share. Subscribe to Christopher's Almost Timely newsletter on Substack for lots more on AI, data science, and marketing. And download his report and read it yourself! :)IMO, some of the best pages to read in the 150-page report:pg. 19-29: great high-level explainer of how LinkedIn workspg. 91-94: addresses the things you/your brand could likely improveThank you to my launch sponsor, SparkToro, the makers of fine audience research software. This show wouldn't be possible without 'em!Oh also, I tried to find when I posted something about social media being a party, and I couldn't find it, but I did find this awesome blog post from Grace at Demand Curve where she explains how I built my Twitter following and she includes my party analogy. Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

You know the zero click problem is real. But how do you get your CEO or CMO on board — and how do you prove it's working once they are? In this episode, I chat with Rand Fishkin to talk measurement frameworks, his new AI visibility research, and why correlation (not causation) is the name of the game.Guest: Rand Fishkin, Co-founder and CEO of SparkToroKey takeaway:Zero Click Marketing is not about giving up on sales or clicks. It’s about accepting that influence often happens before the click — and measuring that influence more honestly.Timestamps:00:00 "All the things that happen in a zero click environment will eventually lead to the same thing that clicks led to"01:13 What do you tell an executive who believes in zero click but doesn't know what to do next?04:20 How to start thinking about measurement when there's no single dashboard to point to07:41 The double standard: executives are comfortable with fuzzy measurement for TV and display ads, but demand perfect attribution for content, influencers, and PR11:02 Where your competitors refuse to invest leaves more room for you14:07 AI hype as a Trojan horse to convince skeptics: if you believe AI is the future, what's the logical conclusion of AI summarizing content?17:22 AI as both the cause of and a mental model for zero click19:14 Rand and Gumshoe's AI visibility research: Rand noticed AI gives different answers to the same prompt every time, which made him skeptical of the entire AI rank-tracking industry24:12 The big finding: you'd need ~1,000 prompts to get the same ranked answer — rank tracking is unreliable. But brand visibility percentage is real.29:08 AI visibility as a trackable indicator for zero click marketing success33:36 Myth busting: zero click marketing ≠ zero sales, and it's not just a Google problem — it's every platformThis episode is brought to you by SparkToro — the audience research tool that helps you find where your audience spends time, what they read, watch, and listen to, and who influences them. Learn more at sparktoro.com. And be sure to check out Gumshoe.ai for search and AI visibility. Edited by Share Your Genius (shareyourgenius.com)Learn more about Zero Click Marketing and Amanda Natividad:zeroclickmarketing.coamandanat.comAmanda's LinkedIn and Instagram

I (Amanda Natividad) define Zero Click Marketing, share a simple mental model (the ZCM Ladder), and give you a mini playbook you can use this week.What you’ll learn:What Zero Click Marketing is (and what it isn’t)The ZCM Ladder: Seen → Understood → Remembered → Preferred → Sought outThe scoreboard: what to measure when clicks aren’t the whole story3 moves to start doing ZCM this week (without burning out)And here's your free ZCM one-pager!Timestamps:00:00 Zero-click isn’t anti-click. It’s pro-reality.01:20 The definition (and why it’s not “no clicks”)03:10 What ZCM is not: “ignore your website,” “post more,” “just brand vibes”07:10 The ZCM Ladder: Seen → Understood → Remembered → Preferred → Sought out10:30 Why “remembered” matters in B2B (buyers do most deciding without vendors)13:40 The scoreboard: leading indicators vs. lagging indicators16:20 Mini playbook: 3 moves you can try this weekThis episode is brought to you by SparkToro — the audience research tool that helps you find where your audience spends time, what they read, watch, and listen to, and who influences them. Learn more at sparktoro.com.This episode was edited by Share Your Genius (shareyourgenius.com)Learn more about Zero Click Marketing and Amanda Natividad:zeroclickmarketing.coamandanat.comFollow @amandanat on LinkedIn and Instagram

If clicks are your primary success metric, you're probably undercounting what's working — and over-rewarding what isn't. In the debut episode of Zero Click Marketing, I (Amanda Natividad) make the case that the click-based funnel isn't just outdated, it's actively misleading. And the cost isn't just bad measurement — it's bad decisions.In this episode:Why the click-based funnel made sense for a while — and exactly when it brokeHow Google, Instagram, LinkedIn, TikTok, and X all quietly started hoarding traffic What "dark social" is, and why it's a bigger deal than most teams realizeWhy AI tools like ChatGPT are the next frontier of zero-click — and what that means for your brandThe 95/5 rule: why optimizing for conversions means ignoring 80% of your future buyersAmanda's own story: how she grew from 1,000 to 100,000+ followers without ever spending a dimeKey insight from this episode:"When you stop optimizing for the click and start optimizing for genuine value in the platform, you end up with better clicks — more intentional ones from people who actually want to be there."This episode is brought to you by SparkToro — the audience research tool that helps you find where your audience spends time, what they read, watch, and listen to, and who influences them. Learn more at sparktoro.com.This episode was edited by Share Your Genius (shareyourgenius.com)Learn more about Zero Click Marketing and Amanda Natividad:zeroclickmarketing.coamandanat.comFollow @amandanat on LinkedIn and Instagram