Tessa Kendal of the NSS on the Girl Guides' Promise

The British girl guides association sees promoting a certain kind of spirituality as one of it's core missions. Maddie Willet, a non-religious seven year old girl felt that she couldnt join her friends in the brownies because the organization requires it's members to say a pledge promising to "love god". I spoke with Tessa Kendal, the Senior Senior Campaigns Officer for the National Secular Society. I began by asking Tessa whether she felt this young girl was right to to feel excluded? --- After the interview Tessa drew my attention to the fact that in the 1920s Lord Baden-Powel, (the founder of the scouting movmeent) granted six countries - Belgium, Czechoslovakia, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, and Finland) the freedom to use an alternative promise without any reference to God. Furthemore the Israeli scouts and guides have never had any religious wording in their promise. It doesn't seem so far-fetched to believe that the British scout and guide associations might one day adopt a similarly inclusive policy. SF for the PD --- Tessa Kendal, Senior Campaigns Officer for the National Secular Society Q. Maddie Willet, a non-religious seven year old girl felt that she couldnt join the brownies because the requires it's members to say a pledge promising to "love god" - do you think she was right to feel excluded? - I just want an opinion here. - I'm sure less principled girls would have simply taken the pledge dishonestly... it's probably what I would have done if I had wanted to join an organization! Q. I'm sure that there will be some who will accuse you of being a hater for wanting to change this traditional organization. Do you hate the girl guides? - Can you talk about your own involvement with the organization and emphasize the good times. - Can you talk about how you'd like it to to be relevant to as many people as possible so that others can enjoy what you enjoyed? Q. The pledge in it's entirity goes like this... "I promise that I will do my best; To do my duty to God, To serve the Queen and my country To help other people and keep the Guide law. ... according to the Guides associatiomn they will accept pledges which have similar wording. When asked to qualify what they meant by similar they explained to me that they meant this in a very literal sense - so love could be replaced by Adore and God could be replaced by Allah. But they wouldnt accept the humanist concept of being in awe of the natural universe. Basically their inclusivity policy only works if you are a Christian, Jew or Muslim. - Can you talk about how much more effective their inclusivity policy would be if they did so without a religious framework? - Can you point out how many people this rigid religious framework excludes? Q. Do you think it's reasonable to expect that the British Girl-guides organization could change? After all, they were founded by an christian individual - are we being unreasonable to expect this historic organization to conform to modern norms of inclusivity? - Can you talk about the canadian pledge? - Any idea how it came about? Q. The canadian version seems so... civilized. I also checked out the United States version of the pledge, which is even worse than the British version. North American guides have to promise to not just love god, but to serve him as well. In my book that's only one step away from joining a convent! - I'm just after an opinion about the American guides, make it as flippant as you want (if you want).