Between Sessions: A Liminal Space for Therapists

In this episode, Janet Penny and Ellen Yun explore the complex emotional, cultural, and political atmospheres that therapists navigate in their practice.They discuss the impact of societal narratives on personal experiences, the importance of reflexivity and relational safety in therapy, and the ongoing journey of learning and unlearning in the therapeutic relationship.The conversation highlights the significance of naming experiences, understanding power dynamics, and the role of vulnerability and shame in therapy. They conclude with reflective questions for listeners to consider in their own practice.TakeawaysThe 'soup' we swim in includes emotional, cultural, and political atmospheres.Therapists must navigate their own responses to societal narratives.Powerlessness can lead to avoidance in both therapists and clients.Reflexivity is crucial in understanding power dynamics in therapy.Naming experiences can be liberating and empowering.Racism and societal narratives impact the therapeutic relationship.Relational safety is essential for effective therapy.Informed consent should include transparency about the therapist's identity.Vulnerability and shame are common in therapeutic settings.The journey of learning and unlearning is ongoing for therapists.KeywordsTherapy, emotional atmosphere, cultural narratives, power dynamics, relational safety, privilege, reflexivity, racism, vulnerability, informed consent.Chapters00:00 Introduction to the Podcast and Its Purpose06:01 Diverging Responses to the Current Climate13:02 The Impact of Identity on Experience19:58 The Normalization of Racism in Society27:02 Finding Safe Spaces in a Polarized World34:34 The Importance of Reflexivity in Practice39:57 Unlearning and Relearning in Therapeutic Relationships50:57 Navigating Differences in TherapyReflective QuestionsWhat did you notice in your body as you listened today?Any tightening, heat, numbness, fogginess, energy? What might that be signalling?What’s in your “soup” right now?What are you breathing in socially, culturally, politically, relationally — locally or globally?Do you notice cognitive narrowing in yourself?Any pull toward all-or-nothing thinking, certainty-seeking, or getting rid of ambiguity?Do you notice yourself scanning for threat?Where does your system go on alert? What does that do to your capacity for nuance and connection?Where has nuance been lost for you lately?In yourself, in your circles, in online spaces, in the therapy room?What helps widen your window of tolerance/capacity?What helps you power down in your body and reconnect with yourself (internal resources, external supports, people, practices)?How is “the soup” affecting equity and power in your practice?Where might you (alone, with peers, or in supervision) name what’s impacting you, and the differences between you, so you can be more present with clients?Is there anything you feel you’re trying to protect?What do you notice about your responses (retreating, avoiding, performing, defending, appeasing, speaking out)? Is it protective in a helpful way—or something that needs more reflection?

Join Ellen Yun and Dr. Janet Penny in this introduction episode as they explore identity, culture, and authenticity in a series of honest conversations.This episode invites listeners to reflect on their personal and professional journeys, encouraging courageous conversations and the creation of safe spaces for growth.KeywordsIdentity, culture, authenticity, therapy, personal growth, professional transformation, safe spaces, courageous conversations, race, faithTakeawaysIdentity is a complex and multifaceted journey.Culture shapes our experiences and perspectives.Authenticity requires courage and vulnerability.Safe spaces are essential for meaningful dialogue.Race and faith intersect in powerful ways.Therapists must navigate personal and professional identities.Courageous conversations lead to growth and understanding.Reflective practice enhances personal and professional development.Intersectionality is key to understanding diverse experiences.Creating courageous spaces fosters transformation.Chapters00:00:00 Welcome and Introductions00:05:00 Exploring Identity and Culture00:15:00 Navigating Race and Faith00:25:00 The Journey of Authenticity00:35:00 Creating Safe Spaces for Dialogue00:45:00 Closing Reflections and InvitationsReflective questions for this introduction episode:What drew you here today?What edges are alive for you right now?What identities are present in your work — and what gets silenced?What do you avoid talking about in supervision, and why?Who could you begin to dialogue with — internally, and relationally?Read the previous articles Ellen and Janet wrote which has led to Between Sessions | A Liminal Space for Therapists podcast: https://linktr.ee/thebetweensessionspodcastBetween Sessions Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thebetweensessionspodcastEllen can be found at:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/forcyclebreakers/Counselling Directory: https://www.counselling-directory.org.uk/counsellors/ellen-yunJanet can be found at:https://drjanetpenny.com/home/

Welcome to Between Sessions: a Liminal Space for Therapists, where therapeutic Integrity begins within.This podcast is for therapists, but everyone is welcome on this reflective journey.This podcast is brought to you by Ellen Yun, an integrative psychotherapist specialising in Internal Family Systems (IFS) and Intimacy From The Inside Out (IFIO) models of psychotherapy, and Dr Janet Penny, a counselling psychologist and psychotherapist. We're also clinical supervisors, writers, and we identify as Christians.This isn't therapy or supervision but an invitation to pause for honest conversations as therapists and the humans behind the role. Each episode brings you into a spacious, reflective conversation between two therapists exploring the edges of their own awareness, moving towards difficult conversations, the stuck places, the internalised oppressions and the questions that rarely find airtime in the therapy room.Together, we linger in the in-between: the threshold where personal and professional selves meet, where discomfort becomes possibility, and where deeper ethical practice is born.At the end of each episode, we offer contemplative questions for your reflective journey.