Rough Drafts

On this episode of Rough Drafts, L and M interview political cartoonist Ben Passmore about his newly released graphic novel Black Arms to Hold You Up, a book about Black armed struggle histories in the United States. L introduces Ben at the beginning of the episode and talks about his involvement as a researcher for the book. Ben talks about inserting himself into the novel (15:55) as a character in relation to Black radical histories. The conversation also touches on humor in the graphic novel when writing about Black radical histories with a respect and reverence (24:45). M asks Ben about his artistic process, panels and inspirations in regard to the graphic novel (30:30). Finally, Ben talks about white readership and career opportunities as a Black author (48:08). Ben has an upcoming release event on October 9th at Making Worlds in West Philadelphia. You can buy the book wherever books are sold. Follow him at @daygloayhole on Instagram and Patreon.    Notes and Sources:  Maus by Art Spiegelman (mentioned by Ben early in the episode) Letter from a Stone Mountain Jail: https://thenib.com/letter-from-a-stone-mountain-jail/ Your Black Friend:  https://www.silversprocket.net/your-black-friend/    

What does war mean in the context of the 21st century? How has 9/11 and the so-called War on Terror shaped American life? And, what do the conflicts of the future look like?  M reflects on his brief stint at the United States Military Academy, and L shares about the military’s influence on the manosphere. They think about the role of technological innovations like drones, artificial intelligence, and robots, as well as present-day conflicts such as Russia-Ukraine, and the formidability of non-state actors in Myanmar and Hamas (18:30). They further reflect on the military’s relationship with shaping national pride and identity, tracing the shift away from the draft to a professionalized military with family ties (35:30). They conclude by asking what war will look like when it is brought against the state’s own citizens, with particular attention to the roles National Guards may play (44:00).  Notes and Sources *This episode was recorded in October 2024; since then, the U.S. armed forces under Pete Hegseth have banned affirmative action at service academies * “America Isn’t Ready for the Wars of the Future,” Mark A. Milley and Eric Schmidt, https://www.foreignaffairs.com/united-states/ai-america-ready-wars-future-ukraine-israel-mark-milley-eric-schmidt?utm_medium=social “Barack Obama doubles US troop levels for War against ISIS in Iraq” https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2014/nov/07/obama-doubles-us-troop-levels-iraq-isis  Frederic Jameson, “An American Utopia: Dual Power and the Universal Army” https://archive.org/details/americanutopiadu0000jame  “Megacities and Urban Warfare in the 21st Century: The City as Cemetery of Revolutionaries and Resources”  https://digitalcommons.usf.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2189&context=jss “Robot-delivered lethal explosive in Dallas police standoff was a first, experts say” https://www.pbs.org/newshour/science/robot-delivered-lethal-explosive-in-dallas-police-standoff-was-a-first-experts-say  “The U.S. Military’s Recruiting Crisis” https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2025/02/10/the-us-militarys-recruiting-crisis

What is a parasocial relationship, and have you ever been in one? In this episode, Luke and Maurice invite Dimo back to the pod to define and share stories about their primary social relationships (with references to One Direction, Frank Ocean, Bob Dylan and Tyler the Creator). They break down the historical evolution of parasocial relationships–mediated by different medium forms such as radio, television, and social media–as well as the various types of parasocial relationships, including fictophilia (26:00). The group also discusses the impact of parasocial relationships in the political sphere, including its impact on Zohran Mamdani’s primary victory in the New York City mayoral race. Throughout the episode they return to the affective registers of entitlement and sincerity that influence our seeking out of parasocial relationships.   Notes and Sources: Arthur C. Brooks, “Parasocial Relationships Are Just Imaginary Friends for Adults”  https://www.theatlantic.com/family/archive/2023/04/parasocial-relationships-imaginary-connections-fans-celebrities/673645/  Monique Judge, “What we should leave behind: Parasocial relationships with celebrities”:  https://andscape.com/features/snoop-dogg-trump-inauguration-parasocial-relationships/  National Geographic, “What are parasocial relationships doing to our brains?” https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/parasocial-relationships-social-media  The (not so) Simple Life: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WAavEUyxMg  Being Bobby Brown: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HS4u3896mdk  Free Britney: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GegdKMHnxxY

Major Eason is a PhD student at Harvard University in the Department of Sociology who studies environmental racism and environmental justice. In a wide-ranging conversation with L+M, Major addresses attacks on DEI, the relationship between race, sport and childhood (17:00), and American car culture (31:00). They also discuss the phenomenon of Dr. Umar (42:50), Black Lives Matter Global (48:50), and grifting/black misleadership more broadly. They return to themes of narrative and perception in social movements, as well as the ritual/drama of modern political theater.    Elijah Anderson, A Place on the Corner (1978): https://press.uchicago.edu/ucp/books/book/chicago/P/bo3619613.html  Zandria Robinson, The B-Side of Blackness: https://www.thebeliever.net/the-b-side-of-blackness/ Ellen Cushing, Americans Need to Party More: https://www.theatlantic.com/family/archive/2025/01/throw-more-parties-loneliness/681203/   Common, The Corner: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mnKNr2Tiq8 Monaleo, Beating Down your Block: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnMPEfV0bSA Project Row Houses, Houston TX: https://projectrowhouses.org/

In this episode, Luke and Maurice sit with Vinson Cunningham’s novel, Great Expectations (2024). The novel follows the campaign of a historic presidential campaign narrated by a young Black man who works on the campaign. The hosts reflect on their own memories of the campaign, with Maurice reflecting on having to “act” as Obama for a school performance, and Luke sharing his own school reminiscences. They put Cunningham’s text in conversation with Alexander Chee’s How to Write an Autobiographical Novel, and a documentary of the Obama campaign. Ultimately, they wonder about the impact of the campaign on contemporary political movements, returning to their themes of political hope and nihilism.   Note: Luke spends significant time in the episode recounting a false memory of seeing Obama on the campaign trail; the hosts have included that part rather than redacting to emphasize the overarching allure/power of the campaign on individual and collective memory.    Great Expectations: A Novel by Vinson Cunningham https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/690565/great-expectations-by-vinson-cunningham/  “How Barack Obama Won the 2008 Presidential Election: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7EmNLpkP8s  How to Write An Autobiographical Novel: Essays by Alexander Chee  https://www.alexanderchee.net/autobiographical-novel   

In this episode, we interview Vernon Jordan III, a Philly born and bred writer, filmmaker and poet. For this episode, we read Vernon’s feature film script “Lavender Boy” which is currently in development as their feature film debut. We discuss the project and talk about their inspirations, afro-futurism and queer cinema.  If you want more, check out Vernon's acclaimed short proof of concept film ONE MAGENTA AFTERNOON (2022), which played at 14 film festivals nationally and internationally. It's free to stream on KWELI TV.  https://www.kweli.tv/watch/kweli/one-magenta-afternoon        

In a conversation recorded after Valentine’s Day, ZekeUltra joins Rough Drafts for a conversation about music, political formation, and intellectual trajectories.  Zeke is a musician based in Dover, Delaware. A friend of Luke’s, the two reminisce on how they met and shows performed together over the years. During the conversation Zeke reflects on his perseverance in his music journey. He talks about the influence of SoundCloud, “abstract rap” -think Earl Sweatshirt— early Chicago drill (Chief Keef’s Sosa) as well as figures such as Fela Kuti on his music. Rastafarianism and Pan-Africanism also informs the music Zeke creates.   His new album, Babel Tower (prod. with Shengu) dropped May 1 and is now available on all platforms. It gets a hearty recommendation from the hosts of Rough Drafts - tune in!   Introduction Song “Good Company”  https://open.spotify.com/track/3txKs9CQ2YACyKIt3WXXPw?si=luKNr_NVQ9yQpJdng-k_ow Credit song  “6 Speed” https://open.spotify.com/track/019Xq9arImGSZDmgf5Hzc7?si=23W1co_NRqGbEC0qZ8PPHA

What constitutes a martial art? In this episode recorded in Nov. 2024, L and M work out their respective understandings of what a martial art is; they swap stories about their early experiences with martial arts, thinking about visual representations (in television, movies, anime, etc.) or from personal experience. They draw on historical figures such as Jack Johnson, and think with the legacies of Jet Li and Bruce Lee on Black culture.    Notes and Sources: Luke mentions a boxer from Rockford, his name is Angel Martinez.   Fighting In the Age of Loneliness:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DoaUyMGPWI    “How 1970’s Kung Fu Films Revolutionized Black Culture”, Snobhob:  https://www.snobhop.com/how-1970s-kung-fu-films-revolutionized-black-culture/    Malcom X, “You Need Some Karate and Judo”:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQCKMxC0SX4   Maryam Aziz, Our Fist is Black: Martial Arts, Black Arts, and Black Power in the 1960s and 1970s: https://chinesemartialstudies.com/2016/01/21/our-fist-is-black-martial-arts-black-arts-and-black-power-in-the-1960s-and-1970s/   “They Punched Black: Martial Arts, Black Arts, and Sports in the Urban North and West, 1968-1979”:  https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/epdf/10.1086/713680   Theresa Rundstedler, Jack Johnson, Rebel Sojoyner: Boxing in the Shadow of the Global Color Line:  https://www.ucpress.edu/books/jack-johnson-rebel-sojourner/paper    Why Bruce lee and kung fu films hit home with black audiences, Phil Hoad, The Guardian:  https://www.theguardian.com/film/filmblog/2012/jul/18/bruce-lee-films-black-audiences

What would it look like if there was a civil war conflict, and how would journalists cover it in the United States? In a conversation recorded November 1, 2024 L and M invite their friend Dimo Ortiz to the podcast to reflect on the film ‘Civil War’ which portrays the experiences of journalists covering a domestic conflict in the mainland United States. In a wide-ranging conversation, they reflect their respective relationships with journalism and how journalism influences their perception of the political/social moment.   In particular, they sit with the tension between institutions that have captured the mainstream (the corporate media conglomerate, and the social media platforms that have captured collective attention), and  “movement journalism”, which was coined by Anna Simmonton in 2017, as a term to think about journalism in service of liberation.    Dimo studied journalism while at Temple University and their formative experiences came as a student journalist covering Trump’s rise in 2016. They reflect on that experience in light of the past few years which has seen heightened surveillance and police violence, some targeted at journalists covering social movements.    They think critically about who is a movement journalist, sitting with the legacy of Ida B. Wells, and the Chicago Defender, and think about the contemporary role of independent media and the potentiality//pitfalls of America’s celebrity-influencer culture. What is the consequence of news becoming ‘content’ or ‘entertainment’?    Notes and Sources: This conversation includes spoilers about the movie Civil War.  Civil War: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt17279496/  https://www.niemanlab.org/2025/03/fivethirtyeight-is-shutting-down-as-part-of-broader-cuts-at-abc-and-disney/  https://www.reuters.com/business/media-telecom/washington-post-opinion-head-leaves-paper-section-shifts-focus-2025-02-26/  https://culturalpower.org/media/pdfs/CCP_doc_01_Tina_r4b.pdf

In a conversation recorded on New Years Eve 2024, L and M reflect on artistic and cultural highlights of the year, their respective “ins” and “outs” for 2025, and forecast what the year/second half of the 2020s will hold. 

Episode 5: Hope and Nihilism (Jan. 20)   L and M ask: what roles do hope and/or nihilism play in shaping political culture. In a meditative discussion held shortly after the US 2024 General Election, they reflect on how social movements and artistic expression hold potential to counter the isolation/alienation/exhaustion of the season ahead.    Tressie Cottom, Daily Show https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nno64FGj8d0 WEB DuBois, Black Reconstruction in America (1935) https://cominsitu.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/w-e-b-du-bois-black-reconstruction-an-essay-toward-a-history-of-the-part-which-black-folk-played-in-the-attempt-to-reconstruct-democracy-2.pdf  Jiirgen Habermas, The Structural Transformation of the Public Sphere https://arditiesp.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/habermas_structural_transf_public_sphere.pdf Ursula Le Guin, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et9Nf-rsALk Robert Putnam, Bowling Alone: The Collapse and Revival of American Community (2000) Gabriel Winant, Exit Right https://www.dissentmagazine.org/online_articles/exit-right/ Calvin Warren, Abandoning Time: Black Nihilism and the Democratic Imagination https://amst.winter-verlag.de/article/amst/2021/1/40  

How has Amtrak shaped American transit historically and in the contemporary period?  L and M share their experiences riding the rail; they reflect on trips they’ve taken up and down the coast, and cross country. They swap stories about folks they’ve met, and look at the local and national impact of the Biden Infrastructure bill on Amtrak.    Sources:  “All Aboard Obama Express”, CBS News, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2GRwvk8EmI   Amtrak Fiscal year 2023 (https://www.amtrak.com/content/dam/projects/dotcom/english/public/documents/corporate/nationalfactsheets/Amtrak-Company-Profile-FY2023-041824.pdf) “Amtrak is Set to Carry More Passengers than Ever Before” NPR, Aug. 2 2024 https://www.npr.org/2024/08/03/nx-s1-5060436/amtrak-is-set-to-carry-more-passengers-than-ever-before-this-year The Northeast Corridor: The Trains, the People, the History, the Region by David Alff  

What is the state of the Black Bourgeoisie? And who even is the Black Bourgeoisie? L gives M a preliminary entrance exam to see if he can make it (he fails). They reflect on common misconceptions of the Black bourgeoisie, with particular attention to the distinctions between “class” and “status”, and “wealth versus “income.” They swap examples from family and their dating lives, and pose questions about the future vitality of the Black bourgeoisie in relation to politics and literature.   Sources: Ralph Ellison, Invisible Man Margo Jefferson, Negroland Franklin Frazier, Black Bourgeoisie Lawrence Otis Graham, Our Kind of People  Mary Patillo, Black Picket Fences Kenneth W. Warren, What was African American Literature?    

What is the state of jazz in contemporary American culture? Maurice and Luke reconnect with their friend Seth, an independent jazz scholar and musician who shares his perspective cultivated by his reading and practice. Seth gives a historical overview of how the genre evolved through some of its most impactful contributors. In addition, he provides commentary on the relationship between jazz and white spectatorship and imitators (Jack Harlow maybe catches some strays).   Seth’s reflections urge us to think about the refined exploitation in the music industry and in black cultural expression more broadly.    **Disclaimer: Luke’s segregation take may make certain folks blush and offend others; in the spirit of Rough Drafts, he is unserious (though not uninformed). Despite what he says, he looks forward to seeing his mother come holiday season and is a strong supporter of a multicultural democracy :)   Sources: Thelonious Monk: The Life and Times of an American Original by Robin D.G. Kelley (2010) https://www.harvard.com/book/9781439190463    As Serious As Your Life: Black Music and The Free Jazz Revolution By Val Wilmer (2018) https://mastbooks.com/products/as-serious-as-your-life    Free Jazz/Black Power By Philppe Carles and Jean-Louis Comolli; translated by Gregory Pierrot https://www.upress.state.ms.us/Books/F/Free-Jazz-Black-Power    Jazz and Justice: Racism and the Political Economy of Music by Gerald Horne   References: How it Feels To Be Colored Me, by Zora Neale Hurston (1929) https://core-docs.s3.amazonaws.com/documents/asset/uploaded_file/619238/D12_How_it_Feels_to_be_Colored_ZNH_students__1___1___1_.pdf    Blues People: Negro Music in White America  by Amiri Baraka https://archive.org/details/bluespeoplenegroexp00bara  https://www.amherst.edu/media/view/91518/original/Baraka+-+The+Modern+Scene.pdf    Solar Myth https://metrophiladelphia.com/solar-myth-john-coltrane-birthday/  screening director Shahkeem E. Williams’ new short film ‘Speakn’ Trane’ (written and produced by John Coltrane Symposium founder Anyabwile Love,     On the Road by Jack Kerouac Howl by Allan Ginsburg   Soul (Disney Pixar)   Fact Checks:  Sun Ra was definitely Black Arts Movement  Immanuel *Wilkins* (not wilkerson)  

Maurice and Luke, old friends from college, reconnected after their respective odysseys of the early 2020s, through their work at a bookstore. They decided to finally start that podcast they always talked about. They prepared three questions each for this episode to (re)introduce themselves to listeners and give a personal meditation on what Rough Drafts is | can | and could be!

The podcasts’ Founding Fathers started with the questions: what does it mean to be a man in the 21st century American context? And, how are these different types of masculinities being formed? Perhaps apropos, they started with bell hooks. They reflect on the legacies of brothers, friends, and formative men in their lives. Critiques were had of Andrew Tate, Fresh and Fit, Kevin Samuels, and the (Black) Manosphere.   Sources:  Fast Facts: Title IX NCES: https://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=93 https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/24/key-facts-about-public-school-teachers-in-the-u-s/ Understanding the (Black) Manosphere with https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upt_ks61_70 “Schooling Black Males”, in We real cool: Black men and Masculinity https://theindigenist.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/we-real-cool_black-men-masculinity-by-bell-hooks.pdf A Man among Other Men by Jordanna Motlon https://www.cornellpress.cornell.edu/book/9781501762932/a-man-among-other-men/   References:  Driving with O.J Simpson by Harmony Holiday https://www.theparisreview.org/blog/2024/07/19/driving-with-o-j-simpson/ Men are Lonely. We Explore Some Reasons Why, and What Can Be Done About It https://laist.com/news/kpcc-archive/how-to-la/men-are-lonely-we-explore-some-reasons-why-and-what-can-be-done-about-it What’s the Left’s Response to Andrew Tate? https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mtFPwRR2kz1Z7Qe5ZgtZn44Dz-1eE08NnP2dGcvDKSk/edit?ouid=108479077797216976854&usp=docs_home&ths=true Luke’s substack: https://substack.com/home/post/p-148583471 Ezra Klein, “The Men–and Boys–are not Alright” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zX2qQ2Smkbg