112 - Doctor Sleep (2019)

Hey Dan, how's it going? Hey Rob. Yeah pretty good about I'm excited to talk about This week's movie on the show. Oh me too.

Yeah, what's what's up with the hat? The hat I'm wearing. Yeah that one. Yeah, um, so I don't know it's is that a top hat?

Yeah, it's a bit of a top hat. It's a deluxe top hat I got it at Hats in the bell free here in Philadelphia nice and it's a real store actually they closed recently. Oh no As soon as I yeah Just like pay for that hat that they were able to close the store. Yeah, they just it was marked up 400% there's they're having a sale.

Oh wow. Yeah, they marked it up for the sale. You don't see a lot of that Yeah, and for them to only mark it up 400% be able to retire on that I mean it was already priced at you know like five million dollars. So wow I'm a bit in the hole.

Hey, um Yeah, by the way real quick over to patreon.com slash king-pod Like you know subscribe five dollars a month. No, that's not my plug the patreon before we even get into it Because uh well I you know I'm in a bit of trouble. Yeah. Well, yeah, you're completely underwater on this hat But um here's the nice thing about the hat.

Yeah, it's a magic hat. Oh meaning uh-huh the more I wear it the more it seems to give me a certain youth Vitality I get it. Yeah, so are you still by the way are you still planning on coming over this weekend for the Super Bowl? Oh Dan You know well first off yes, and I know you're just I feel it.

I see it in your eye. I see it in your hat You just want my steam, don't you? It's okay. No, I don't interest.

No, I don't want your like the hat gives me like a look You know like a young I look like a young person with a job like you look like you look like you want to breathe in my steam is what You look like I It's good. I guess I can understand what some people who wear top ads breathe in people's team That's not me. That's not what I meant. I don't I really want to breathe your steam.

Oh, that's not you. Okay. No I don't want my steam. Why don't you breathe my steam?

No, I mean I mean it like that what's you say it? I mean we've got we've done this podcast for years now and I feel like that's kind of what we don't you're kind of you're kind of Right on the edge of understanding. We've been doing the podcast for years years and years many years You've got you've got some years on you how dare you? Well, I'm just saying you're shines Not what it used to be bro.

My steam is delicious All right, well you like like a fine whiskey and I look I see bars I don't mean to undercut the work you've been putting in I know you've been eating a ton of pineapple to try to get your steam tasting better None of my business. I read that in a cosmopolitan that makes you seem to taste better. Oh, no, it's worth a shot, you know anything to You know anything to entice people to consume more my steam, you know what I'm saying? I never should have put this hat on this week on King me dare to go back.

This is dr Rob this is dr. Slee you fucking amateur King me King me let you say it first make sure I saw it coming maybe Yeah, maybe you should eat my steam It sounds like you're a steam deficient Yeah, I bought I eat my steam. It sounds like a sounds like an old-timey insult when steam sure does and held more weight, you know It sure does it looks it's like something a guy in this hat would say yeah Can I take it off by the way if you want yeah Rob made me wear an actual top hat for the intro Yeah, I made you wear that yeah, I would have loved if there was a rabbit up Still got the still got no rabbit, but there is a spirit Halloween tag dangling from it You can just put that in if you're oh and if you're watching the if you're subscribed to the YouTube the video version Yeah, you not only saw the hat go flying through the background But also you see the deep line in my forehead. Yeah, was it was a hat that tight on your head.

I have a gigantic head Do you really I did you know this I mean you seem like you have a normal size head? Well, it's because I have a giant body to I just I guess yeah, yeah if if I were If my BMI situation were normal, I would look like golden eye big head mode That hat on you'd be like was that golden eye big head mode odd job What's the other guy the voodoo guy I forgot Jaws no no no Baron Samini yeah, yeah the Baron Baron yeah, no we have the same problem. I cannot I couldn't possibly find a hat like a fitted hat that would fit me Yeah, it's they just don't make them or don't or you you can get somebody to make one But they're like we need to use all of this material. It's gonna cost you thousand.

Yeah, that's how that's how you run hats in the belfry out of business right right So here's what I'll say Rob yeah about the intro this week's intro okay Listeners would not know this without me saying it, but that was take two It was take two that's true the other thing I want to know about it is that I have a better idea now Oh, do you want to start over entirely no no what's your idea now? Do you want to say idea was gonna be that you were Charlie Manx out of work because Rose the hat was like you but better I Mean it's true. It's a bit like that. The only difference is the kids don't get to live yeah, not even as one peers No, they just they just turn into Dead bodies.

Yeah It's like this yeah. Oh man. It's this crazy crazy effect where after they die they turn into dead bodies right what you bury them They get stinky I keep wanting to say Timothy Chalamet, but that's not the kid's name the little baseball boy the actor or the yeah, no the actor Yeah, Jacob Tremblay Jacob Tremblay J-Treme J-Treme play. It's like what's his deal?

Who is he he is? I mean he's uh, I don't know he's like very popular child actor. He was in that movie room not the room. Oh, yes Yes, that's where I know the name.

Yeah, I think he's just like He's like one of those kid actors. That's in a bunch of like good stuff. Maybe maybe not I don't know but in any case I always confuse his name and Timothy Chalamet Because I'm old and my brain is calcified and I and to you they are they seem like they're the same age Yes, I can't tell yeah, I mean any you know what anybody under 30 you're all the same age to me I don't care see you can tell 19 year old like me from a I don't know hole in the ground. No, that's true That is speaking of it was fun starting Jacob Tremblay with you when you were 12 years old.

Yeah And I mean hindsight it was kind of weird that you're always like god you're so mature for your age So go on go on I was gonna say 19 Jacob Tremblay. Yep, that reminds me of our movie for this week Dr. Sleep Ah, oh by the way, welcome to KME the official Stephen King movie podcast official podcast of KME the official podcast of murdering baseball boy Right remember that yeah, I was like I was like wow That one really hit home for me cuz uh every time Paige gets mad at me she writes that on the wall Baseball boy due to my love of the great American past time I when you got up to get your drink. I heard you guys talking a bit.

I heard you say something about the patreon I'm all business, baby Yeah She was saying her joke her bit is that we always say we love it and she gets she's like like I'll walk out of the bedroom The recording studio. Yeah and be like and she'll be like how was it I'll be like it was fine. I don't know I don't know what happened in there and she's like she's like just like two hours She's like did you guys did you guys say you like the movie? Oh, be like no no no we never said I bet you did but this time I said we say we like the movie on the free version And that's it we just say I like it and then we go and if you sign up for the patreon will say I don't like it We have a can we have a contrarian version of like a parallel episode.

Oh, yeah, that'd be fun That's funny That's a fun little bit. I also whenever If somebody asks how the podcast went I Say it's fine. I don't know I think it was good. It's impossible to know even on playback.

Yeah, no way. There's no way to know But you know what Dan what this week's movie. I liked it. You liked it.

I did all right But you know jump over to the patreon to hear my other take My anti-take mm-hmm. Okay, so doctor sleep 2019 one of your own sleepy doctor. Oh Hey, um wouldn't want this guy operating on me. I wouldn't want him doing my Tummy tuck yeah, can we get this guy coffee or something geez?

So dr. Sleep. Yeah, not a doctor. No, it's an honorary I gotta say I am so fucking stupid that the The explanation of the title.

This is a classic case of say the name of the movie in the movie. Yeah Yeah, I was totally blindsided by it. I wasn't making the doc connection at all. Okay, I Didn't reveal that you what do you mean you were blindsided?

So when the that character says I mean I watch an hour of the blindside Before I read the wrong movie on a second. Why does Danny Torent show up? Yeah, I was like this is a of course a wonderful film But I don't think that I think I'm the wrong theater No, but you when the guy said called him dr. Sleep.

You didn't make the connection. No, no, I mean at that point It's like oh, yes, it's the name of the movie. Yeah, yeah I was like surely he's saying that because of the title of this film I mean more like him being doc like that angle. Oh, okay.

Like I didn't see the payoff for that coming At all I didn't realize Danny was not your sleep in fact looking at just like photos and stuff I assumed Rose the Hat was dr. Sleep. Oh She puts people to sleep. Yeah, fucking gives him fucking dirt naps.

That's what she does. That's right She turns a lot of people into dead people through magic. That's right All right, you want to get into 19 this movie's nine hours long It is long running time. I'm seeing here nine hours and 45 minutes Well, it's directed by mike Flanagan edited by no one they kept all the footage in well wait a second What that's not entirely true.

So you watched it on plex correct. Mm-hmm. Oh, is that a director's cut? It is the director's cut the the theatrical cut is a half hour shorter But it's also from what I understand I haven't seen it but from what I understand it's worse I guess it doesn't uh It doesn't I guess the pacing is weird and it doesn't you know?

You get more background. I guess more character development in this version. Yeah, you know, I could totally see that So I was like looking at reviews after I finished the movie right and a lot of negative reviews a lot of negative reviews Not all some people were into it But a lot of complaints about the things you're describing just feeling like it um Was like missing something was like an only that's like verbatim is like can't help but feel like something has been subtracted from the story Like it doesn't it doesn't quite Resound emotionally in the way you kind of feel like it should based on like all of the way things are set up right Like I don't know about you But I I felt like the version that we watched had a had a pretty decent and pretty nice emotional payoff I think so too um I think I do still kind of feel like the the danny abra relationship is kind of rushed. Sure.

Um also like Uh not for nothing but danny and uh, what's his friend's name billy Uh, is that the yeah Curtis uh, yeah, yeah, um Their friendship the fact that we flash forward eight years in time Obviously I understand the need to do that just like from a movie making standpoint, but right we're kind of just like The only like it's a we get a tell don't show situation where dan excused me. He's an adult now. He's older He's just dan Um, he's just like billy. I guess billy's my best friend.

He's kind of like looks into the camera He's like billy is my best friend. I'm dan torence and billy freeman is my best friend I mean, I think that's when he says it to abra when she's like astral projected in the backseat of the car right? Yeah, and she's like who's this and he's like it's my friend and then then he's like maybe my best friend. Yeah, yeah, yeah So I don't know those relationships like I think they're very like they worked I would have liked a little more time.

Yeah, because like all right. I don't know when when dan and Oh, she I call him william. She's kidding when dan and billy show up at abra's house and his dad's like who the fuck are you guys? Yeah, I'm kind of like yeah You guys even once even once she's talking about like she's like kind of unconvincing and yeah, you're right.

I'm like I do agree with you the only thing the only Pushback I'm gonna give is because I also I kind of agreed to like if If your kid like if two men showed up at your house to see your teenage daughter, right? You would She's calling one of them uncle. Yeah. Yeah, it's like it's a bad scene the only I guess like the only difference between that and like a you know this and like some sort of real world situation is that like Her parents abra's parents know all about abra's like powers and that's true and they've experienced them and they know how Like crazy they can get so like when she's like, you know, oh, this is a guy who I've been telekinetically, you know talking to he has the same powers yada yada yada, it's not like It's not as uh, I guess it doesn't raise his money flags then that's that's fair point.

I um I was also thinking like I don't know but when they by the time they have that sort of like final conversation which we'll get to in a moment uh, yeah In a moment in like an hour. I'm sure but um right in our I didn't feel like um Between them but you know it depends on whose story you treat this as more because if this is more Dan's story Which I think is kind of fair to say yeah, right? Yeah, um Then he it's like him becoming right they set it up with doc and the not doc fucking scat-man Yeah, uh dick hollering dick. Yeah, um, I know it's not scat-man.

I just can't remember character. Yeah, he was played by scat-man for others Um as he's played by carl lumbly. Yes, it does a great job. I really liked him.

Um But he you know dick says sort of like he talks about how they were like he was just like brought into danny's life kind of at random And now he is like paying the- not paying the price, but he's like, you know still living with the ramifications of teaching him How to like use his power and stuff. I wrote that line down because I thought it was really funny. What was it exactly? Hold on.

Um, it was like uh, oh, he's like he was like you walked into my kitchen and I'm still on the hook. There we go. Yeah, yes That's I mean, that's really funny. Uh, really funny thing to say coming from like a ghost A ghost who died because of your dumb dad.

Right? Yeah, um Yeah, so I mean, it's really just like Dan sort of like taking you know like stepping into that role for someone else. It's like him. Sure It's kind of like it's like a hero's journey where the last phase of it is answering the call to action.

Yeah, I mean Okay, so I think one of the Overall, I really do like this movie. I didn't I Don't think I think you and McGregor is a good actor. I think he's like finding this. I think he's a little miscast though Um, only because like I know you know, there's like train spotting he went you and McGregor, but he hasn't been that in so long and to see like I mean, you and McGregor is like, I don't know to me.

He's like too good looking to uh seems When he's like, you know, like kind of like being uh trying to make himself small or like, you know, like just appear like a Like a emotionally small or whatever. Yeah, um, I just don't buy it, you know You know, it's funny you say that because I kind of liked I liked how he played it a little bit Yeah, I don't know. I was on board for a lot of it I also felt him struggling with the accent. Yes.

Well, and I think that that can hinder a performance for sure like take you out of it a little bit Yeah, like I know we're we're supposed to believe that um, you and McGregor who's in his mid I don't know mid 40s. He's probably older but like playing this character maybe he's like mid to late 40 something and Uh, he's been spending the last, you know, 35 or so years just like drinking and drugs and like, you know, just living this like Hard life. Yeah, you know, and I just don't see that in in his face, you know, um, like I we just watched uh midnight mass, right and the guy who plays Joe collie in that right like the town drunk. He's in this movie, right?

Yes, and I completely understand that you cannot put that guy in the lead role of this movie But like you want you want Robert Longstreet. Yeah, bury the chunk himself. Right. Yes, but you know, like somebody like that With maybe a little bit more you could see maybe some of the the road on his face.

Yeah, well, you know what I was gonna say is like Henry Thomas would have been interested. Henry Thomas would have this movie. Yeah, now does Henry Thomas kind of knock it out of the park as Jack Torrance? Yeah, I would say so.

I think he I think he does such a great job like that That's actually a consistent thing throughout this movie is like it does a I know pretty good job up until they maybe get to the hotel at the end Um of just putting enough Kubrick shining in without it being cloying. Yes So that was one of the things I remember when this movie was coming out there were like interviews and stuff and there was I guess a question for my Flanagan of like whether or not this was gonna be a movie to the or a sequel to the movie or the book And he he said that he was gonna try and do both, right? And he did. Yeah, I think it does like it does the movie uh like a nice service and then also, you know, he's such a Stephen King fan so like Obviously like more people have seen the movie than read the book So he's going to like you have to make it You have to bring people in with the movie aspect of it But I feel like there's enough of the book in there with like just just stuff just things that go or the story Yeah, and I think I think the reason this is like a weirdly well suited um Where that is a weirdly well suited to sort of like do that with make that like hybrid of like the 1980 shining is Not plot heavy, you know, it's like it's very simple in storytelling and the Elements that really stick with people are all visual.

Yeah, so I just think I think that makes it like incredibly easy to just sort of like Lift the things that are like sort of universally loved about that movie Um, I think even I I'm gonna go ahead and speak for like die-hard king fans who renounce the film Sure and say that like you just objectively the shining is like a beautiful fucking movie Like people complain about Kubrick as a director is that he's too um, it's it looks too good It's yeah, it's like beautiful to the point of sterility. Yes, which I don't endorse that opinion, but no, I don't agree with that at all But yeah, so like you just like you take the carpet you take the elevator full of blood Yeah, and then you just go from there you drive you give boy Danny a little bowl cut right, you know, right? So right the who see actress Alex Esau. Yeah, aka Mildred What's her name from midnight mass the old lady who turns young.

Yes the world's hottest old lady World's hottest octogenarian So she so she plays Wendy Torrance, right? Yes, and even that like there are moments when Uh, you know, maybe she's like maybe turning the dial up on like the Shelly Duvall But even so like it's not it's not over much. No, and it's not uh, they're not impressions You know, uh like the same thing with Henry Thomas like doing I mean the guy is playing up the same part as Jack Nicholson, right? Uh, he's playing essentially Jack Nicholson.

Yeah, but he's not doing like yeah, he's not doing the Jack. Yeah, get your drink. Yeah Go Lakers Right I think Everybody all the characters that are played by different actors that come back here Wendy Jack What's uh, halleren? Yeah, um, all of those actors do a really nice job of like maintaining the character Um being you know, not like not doing a like exact imitation, but like there's enough of a imitation there to I don't know.

I think satisfy people. Yeah, right? So I think the other thing like I don't know in the last like 10 years, right? Uh, fucking we paint houses or I heard you paint houses Everybody is being like digitally Deaged and then they just play the younger person self or you get like, um, is it is it rogue one with grandmoff?

Yes where it's just fully cg. Yeah, and it's like very upsetting. Yes video game cutscene ass. Yeah, uh, When like, I don't know, you know before all of that they just cast new people.

Yeah, and you know what that still fucking works You could still do that. I wish I wish Mike Flanagan would have been like well I felt I had to honor the film but also, you know, Stephen King's vision as well as the mini series starring Stephen Webber Yeah, um Was there really no room for head-made animals and Stephen Webber? Yeah, I mean they could have used a Stephen Webber in here somewhere Always you see whatever. Yeah, we run another half hour on what I got time clearly.

He's right. You know, he's obviously he's too old at this point Steve but uh Like a younger Steve Webber would have been a good Danny Torren still. Yeah, um Oh, no, that's interesting. Yeah.

Well, okay. So, um, while we're talking about, you know, because we mentioned Alex S. Oh, please Wendy in I gotta say that real quick on Wendy that wig I was just like wig wig wig wig that's a wig that's a wig wig wig wig wig Quite it was such a wig but it was it was a wig. Yeah, but while we're you know, we mentioned Alex We mentioned Robert Longstreet bearing the chunk himself Um, uh, a couple other flan members of the flan repertory theater.

Yeah, we have carol Stricken the moonlight man himself Uh, he's here. You love to see it. You literally do love to see it. He's so big my goodness So, um, also though, uh, we mentioned Henry Thomas as well Bruce Greenwood's back.

Yeah King alum. Yes playing dr. John Right. Uh, of course new Orleans has great dr.

John I do feel like that's a good opportunity to move into this movie a discussion of this movie's obsession with stupid hats Yeah, I mean dr. John this guy. I mean talk about being in the right place at the wrong time. I'm all right Yeah, wait, you're talking about i'm just talking about dr.

John Well, you don't like uh, you don't like a little echo echo. Is that dr. John? He does a version It's like it's I don't know.

It just sounds like fucking dr. John. I'm like a dr. John impression Yeah, do it doctor.

Do your doctor? No, I won't be doing that because it's offensive when he does Okay, he's just a weird cajun man. I don't know. Yeah, um, okay.

Wait, uh, What were we we're talking about hats. Oh hats Stupid hats rose the hat rose the hat played by rebecca fergusson fucking Step on me. Yeah Yeah, yeah, truly and like specifically rose the hat stephanies suck my steam suck all the steam out of my mind. Oh, you can have it I will hand it to you.

Will jam a finger in my carotid artery Like mommy please Is just uh just a gorgeous woman truly yeah if um Yeah, we hadn't really mentioned it yet, but she's a gorgeous woman And her as rose the hat being like the leader of this group Extremely dangerous buddy. Just uh, you're just you're ringing all my bells here Um also the fact that she's got like that crazy accent. Yeah, she's like it and the accent too That was like she did that all of that on purpose because she was probably so old That yes, right and they mentioned all different plate right. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, so actually okay Well, should we set the table story? Yeah, let's have a table So danny torrents he got old you got a little older. So now he's Dan.

Right drop the knee. It's cleaner Um, that's dick said that to him in a meeting Before he sold napster. Yeah, um And he uh ends up in the small town in new hamstrings trying to get clean from drinking he's an alcoholic Yeah, right. That's where that's where he starts off at the same time.

Mm-hmm There's a band of marauding um, basically like soul vampires kind of basically yeah, not really souls You still get to keep your soul. I think I think maybe I don't know actually that's unclear. Yeah, it's a little unclear I don't know. I hope so.

I I shudder to I don't like the idea of uh, little boy getting yeah his soul drink That that open Open oh rob. Oh rob back check. Hello. All right.

Um that cold open with Uh rosa hat and It's my am I breaking up here? Yeah, what the what the I mean you're back now just with it Uh, that's where the movie opens 1980 Uh, which is the same year as the shining one what takes place there so while you know danny torrents is you know running around the Overlook hotel elsewhere rosa hat is luring a little girl over with some flowers the scene that scene you like you get so much from uh Rebecca Ferguson's character you you like the way that she offers the flowers with like her arm fully extended and then the girl draw Yes. Yeah. Yeah as the girl reaches where she like draws her arm back in yeah, like she's luring a small animal in Um, and then she's just like she she eats the flower because it's like a beautiful thing and then you know Whatever she just like it goes from like oh, this is like a nice person too.

Like oh, this is like very sinister Yes, and it happens very and it but there's no like I don't know. There's no change in her demeanor or anything. It just shifts. Yes.

Yeah the um Kind of flex a little of course think the flower eating may have also been a reference to the frickin greek myth Of lotus eaters. Oh that one. No, they're like a they're people that just like indulgent pleasure Uh, that's all they do. They just eat lotuses and it gets them high and they just frickin sit there forever dude And they um it's got the same pretty cool.

Yeah, they're pretty cool And I don't know it's just sort of like it's not really central to what the the where they called the knot Yeah, the knot that there's another the true knot. Yes, yes the true. Um, yeah It's like a little play on words also. Yeah, it's true not They do really they play they do that joke like one too many times in the movie Yeah, I would say there's a lot of instances of one too too many times in the movie Not really just the old not the 1980 shining stuff really at the end.

I was like Yeah, we probably didn't have to go back there like the third time. Yes to the past, you know Um, but anyway, yeah, so that's that's our cold open and yeah, she's so great and like it's such a king trope to Um, like that kind of it's penny wise. It's yes. It is that exact thing.

It's a killer kid Let you know how high the stakes are right? Um, yeah, and and just be like a little yeah a little charmer, you know, um, so Right we meet up with Should we go? I don't want to jump too far ahead, but also like there are some like Important things that happen in like the first like 10 or 15 minutes. We're like we see young Dainatorrence in his apartment.

Yes his own apartment. Yeah, it's a little apartment. He's got a little stove. Yeah, my first bachelor pad Um No, but he gets up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom and he walks in and there's a bath hag in the bathroom She's just there and you know creeping out.

I mean whatever it's she's a bath hag. What is she gonna do? She's gonna get out of the bath right that's what she got starts in the bath and then she gets out of the bath Yeah, and we get full frontal bath hag Um, there was a lot of hag It was it was tip to tip to you know, snap the tail. Yeah for sure for sure every part of the hag was used in the making Um, but then young Danny has a he has one of his little meetings with decalarin and Dick sort of explains.

He's like yeah, I mean like the spirits most of the time they can't you know, they can't hurt you But then like sometimes well what he says basically is like so danny's like you told me they couldn't hurt me that they were like pictures in a book And he said for me, that's all they were but I don't I don't shine like you bro. Yeah, we we bro He's basically like you're too powerful. You're so powerful that you conjure goes for real for real And so danny he's like here's what you can do. This is what I did.

He's like he pulls out this ornate little box and he's like He's basically like he doesn't say what to do with the box. He's just kind of like Learn this box like learn the feel of it. You know memorize how it looks smell it Like you gotta you gotta get all that down and then the next thing we see is It's danny at home with Wendy. They're watching pugs bunny.

That's a good time and danny just sort of like Also, we get the the score that sort of like lets you know when something spooky is happening is literally just like It's like a drum like a bass drum that sounds like a heartbeat. Yep, it's very stressful Um as someone with probably elevated blood pressure. I can't help wondering if this is it for me For three hours. Um he goes to the bathroom sees the bath tag closes the door behind him.

Yeah, I'm like Is this kid gonna fuck? Is he fucking a bad guy? Dude, I wouldn't but more power to you brother I I I thought that I love that shot of him like like the bath bag is like standing there And he just walks in there and closes the door pretty badass for a little kid to be like all right You're going in the box. Yeah.

Yeah, the door closes you hear her scream not in sexual ecstasy. No, I want to put that to bed right now Um and then he comes back out and like sits back down on the couch and sort of like Embraces Wendy. Yeah, she's like is everything okay and she's like and he hasn't talked he hasn't spoken at all Since the overlook and and and then he says yeah, mom. I'm doing good and and yeah a little danny.

Yeah, there you go So then we we catch up with older dan and he's a fucking disaster. Um, he wakes up in kind of cool Yeah, I mean he's like he wakes up next to you Some woman he doesn't he barely remembers he starts putting the pieces together of last night because he was so drunk Got into a fight. He went home with this woman. They had sex He got into a hell of a fight.

Yeah picked up a pulled ball and started beating the guy's face with it Yeah, pretty cool. That's what I mean when I say he's pretty cool. Yeah, he's pretty cool. You heard that man.

That's cool Uh, and then the woman that he goes home with uh, she's like, do you think she you killed that guy? I hope he killed him And then uh in the morning he wakes he wakes up before and he's like He starts go he opens his wallet. There's no money in there. Yep And he he's like, well, damn.

I need money. Mm-hmm. Danny need money And he goes into her wallet grabs a big water cache and dick pops and he's like don't do that man. He's like, he's like Um, what's he say about his like memories or the they're the real ghosts?

They're the ghost she can't put in the box. That's what it is He tries to like put the memory of stealing the money in the box and it's like it doesn't work like that right Um surprise. That was the first time you ever tried it. Yeah, pretty good idea.

Yeah, I feel like that would have come up before Yeah, probably has some memories he doesn't want to keep around. Yeah, you were thought but um Then he also sees the lady's kid. It was like a toddler. Oh, yeah in diapers, but walking around And he puts the money.

No, he keeps the money he does keeps the money and he leaves right and puts the baby with the mom And then and the mom is like fully asleep. She is she's alive I said because you can see her breathing, but she is like past the fuck out. Yeah Um, yeah, um So I I kind of what do you think of that moment where they come back a little later? Well, hated it.

It is so brutal. I'm horrible. Yeah, it's it's so uh, you know, Danny. Obviously he could see ghosts and stuff and then he once he's Started his new life in uh, is it Connecticut?

It's New Hampshire, New Hampshire. Yeah, you can't tell the story of redemption in the cesspool of Connecticut No, you can't nothing good has ever happened there. No, um Yeah, but like so he uh he wakes up and he he feels like a hand on him and then he looks over and it's that woman And she is dead and she says they still haven't found us um Which is just like oh my god And then you know, she's like the baby Was crying for for days or something like that and everybody just assumed you know They all the neighbors and stuff had been so used to it because she used to go out so much and leave it by itself um And then and then the the baby rolls over and the baby is also dead Yeah, and just sort of like blinks and it says like mama or something like that. Yeah.

Yeah, um and Dan is like, uh, No And Dan was like, uh, no, I know that's that scene is hard to watch That's like really hard to watch scenes in this movie. Yeah, uh, you know, we're we're reading sail in slot two and as we discussed on on our part two episode, um There's a another scene with an infant death in it and it's like I mean it Oh man, it's like infant death and neglectful mother and right just like yeah the supreme tragedy of those things It's just like so hard to fucking stomach and this isn't a movie with a brutal child murder scene Yes Traffic yeah, I did think at that moment. I was like well shortly it can't get worse than this And then it went ahead and did do that for me. Did you know about that scene going into this?

I knew kind of about that scene I knew that like, um Well when they were trying to get a rating for it like that that was like a big issue. Um, I and You know, I looked into after watching it. I looked into it a little bit and like apparently it was very hard for everybody Except for Jacob Trembling. Yeah, who was like just a professional about the whole thing We love a little professional.

Yeah, we love it. We love to see it Um, yeah, I'm not like not in detail. I did not know how upsetting that scene would be. Yeah, which it very like it really is There's blood.

Oh my god. It's like truly shocking. Yeah. My goodness.

Yeah. I mean like you just you don't see that shit in movies. Not really don't Um Yeah, um, okay, so we'll go there. Yeah.

Yeah, so Danny Dan he moves to new Hampshire He's like right off the bus and he he meets uh bill or billy and billy is like Like I've seen that look before and he doesn't know Dan's like full story, but he knows of it You know, he's like I could tell this guy's been through the fucking ringer probably has like some sort of drug issues Maybe out of jail or something like that, but looking for a fresh start, right? Yeah, there's that line where like uh billy Asim like what are you running from and dan says myself and he's like That's the shame that's the thing about running away from yourself. He's always he's always there with you Yeah, it's like yeah, it's a motherfucker or something Um, but then billy so but billy sets him up with like a boarding house like a like an attic room Like you know, nothing crazy nothing fancy, but just like you know nice place. It's cool It's pretty cool that big wall with the chalkboard paints on it.

Yep, right? I forgot what the explanation is whoever lived there before him Yeah, it was like some artist kid who did it and then he didn't paint over it But then the landlady was like that's fine because i'm gonna write down how much money you owe me These are the rules you pay me this and you behave Yeah, it was like 80 dollars a week behave. Yeah Uh, and then uh and then billy gets his landlord Austin powers. Oh I'm not gonna say And then yeah billy takes him to an a meeting right and helps him get sober And and while this is happening elsewhere.

There's a young girl named abra who is Uh, we find out she has powers. She has the shining. She has the ability to move things with her mind Um When she's a kid we don't really see the extent of her powers. We just know that she has them Well, we see her do is uh put a bunch of spoons on the ceiling right she stands spoons on their end off the ceiling Yes, there's there's a whole thing she has like a birthday party and there's a magician He doesn't trick with a spoon and she's like I can do that he's like that's great kid Yeah, real poor bedside manner on that magician.

I would say yeah, I mean I'll tell you what he had me laughin though when all that stuff was falling all over the place. It's funny Fumbling magician great bit. Yeah, the amazing Jonathan. Oh, I love the image again.

I forget it. It's funny. Okay. So yes abra has powers What did you think of her name being abra?

Real classic king bullshit. Yeah, I Absolutely did not care. I abra salutley did not care for it. Yeah, no Um, do you think because they're so named abra is magic.

There's no double meaning. It's just like it's one meeting What's it's like what's it's short for abrogale like? It's just it just is the first half of abrogate abra. Yes.

Yeah, that that was annoying to me You could could just name there's something normal name er um Danielle Torrance Daniel Torincina. Yeah, the femur has seen uh So yeah, so the parents are like totally freaked out about the little girl and her powers and stuff and they they don't want her to be Using them and whatnot. Um, but really freaked out cut to eight years later and we get that nice I mean it's the flam man You're not gonna get out of here without some monologues and we get a nice monologue from dan at an a meeting After he has eight years sober and he talks about how Uh, his dad had a chip like that. Uh, he was I think five or six months over before uh, he died or whatever and he goes into like um You know His addiction and how when he got drunk, he broke Dan's arm Um, he sort of like covers for him a little bit.

He was like, you know, he did that and then he like then he got sober Right and then like it wasn't bad and then you know, and then he died Um, and then he's like this you know, he dedicates the the eight-year chip to jack torrance. Yes I can't is it i'm guessing it's probably in his first time he speaks at the meeting or whatever but Or no, maybe it is that that speech where he talks about how he used to drink because that That was the only way that he could connect or like understand him right? Yeah, right the the the part of dan that would come out when he would drink would be like the rage and All of these like negative emotions and he's like I got all those from my father Yeah, that was the only way I could like, you know feel what he was like connect with him like that's it's it's a pretty cool Choice, I mean not really a choice isn't the right word, but I liked that element of it because it's like This is a guy who talks to ghosts regularly right right and the one one ghost he cannot Communed with and understand is his dad right yeah, just so he's got to get like blind drunk to not talk to him But to to connect with him in the only way he can yeah, um, yeah, so he uh Uh, we get uh, let's see. There's the jig of tromblaze stuff that doesn't well one thing I want to touch on while we're talking about like unnecessary nods to 1980 shining okay, um, so there's that scene where Um, it's it's at that same meeting where so the meetings are led by Bruce green.

Oh, dr. Yeah, and um Yeah, dan notices. Yeah dan notices dr. John like kind of like grabbing at his wrist a little bit And he's like he comes up to him at the end of the night He's like you're looking for your watch you left it, you know, wherever at work He like he rattles off like the whole thing is like you wash your hands because of this and you left it on like the soap dispenser or something It's at work.

Yeah, and then right there's that scene cut to the scene in dr. John's office and for no reason his office is the office of the Manager of the overlook. Yeah, right the whole It's Yeah, it's not the exact office, but it just it just looks exactly like that He's got the the huge window behind him, which is like letting too much right in or whatever It's got the american flag on his desk, which weirdly was the thing that made me be like I see now Yeah, um And everything in the shot like in the in that scene between them in the office is just everything is framed exactly like the shining which like it's I totally understand what you're saying that like that was like maybe a little bit overboard and yeah That might not age as well like if you know, this is like a newer movie or whatever But if you know in 10 or 15 years somebody like just watches like the shining and then this like it might seem like goofy Yeah, but at the same time like We already we have the dr. Sleep movie right it exists in the world Before it existed in the world there was talk of a sequel to the shining and people are like what are you talking about?

You can't make a sequel to the shining what do you how do you make a sequel to that? What are you talking about right? What does that even look like and I get like I think this movie is definitely between like characters and plot and all these things Uh different than the original movie right sure Um, but it is so undeniably connected to it like obviously like the final like showdown or whatever But also like everything about like there's always going to be the shining cloud hanging over a sequel, you know Um, it's like when they did uh 2010 like the sequel to 2001 like how do you do that? Which is also based on a novel.

Yes, right? So but like I understand what you're saying like it was like it may have been a bit much to have the essentially a very similar scene Right in but there's I mean, there's also no denying the fact that like I mean I think probably rightly the flan man understood that like People would balk at this if there wasn't like I don't know There is where we're living through the age of fan service. Yes and I yes I think that there has to be a certain level of like if you want to call them easter eggs or whatever But like I mean, this is like a fairly obvious one Um But I I don't I don't know it to me like I see it and if you're like, I'm sure that there are people that watched this movie And watch that scene and didn't make that connection right? We have a steven king podcast.

So like We that doesn't mean I know anything. No, it doesn't but also we've seen the shining a couple times and you know, we get it right, uh I don't know. I I like the way that they like okay, they frame the shots up everything. It looks, you know, it's the same whatever but also like they There's no Like explicit uh sort of attention drawn to it.

It's not like that's true It's not like he's like there's like in a lesser movie. There's a stupid line. That's like I just have the weirdest feeling i've been here before Yes, yeah, right like I so much fan service now is like Uh They show the thing that is like the fan service and then they have somebody call attention to it It can't just exist where I feel like this exists like yeah, is it fan service? Yes, is it over the top?

I don't think so Yeah, just my thing. No, I I'm with you. I'm with you um but I'm not so but I'm not so but I think I think you're bringing up some some very valid points here. Uh, so dr John offers him a a position as an orderly in this nursing home and So Danny except she doesn't have a job or he's got like some like kind of shitty job or whatever There's like yeah, well, yeah, he's like working two days at like a toy store or something What it is is um, so remember when he meets billy There's like that like model of the town.

Yeah, the main town. Yeah, yeah And there's like yeah the the fake train that like little kids ride on he billy works the fake train and gives him work Conducting the fake train right so he yes, okay, so he accepts the job and and he's just an orderly like he's just like, you know Helping clean up just doing whatever right and he sees There's like a cat that just sort of like lives at the nursing home And just like great cat you know what it looks like it looks like you know that have you ever seen that meme of like a taxidermy white cat that has like human hands No, jesus christ hold on. Let me uh, i'm gonna pull it up because we can okay, we have the tech all right, um Okay, post it in the chat here. Oh, no, I can screen share.

That's why I mean oh, yeah, yeah Okay, hold on. I feel like you probably seen this i've got it open here. I just want to make it as large as possible before I okay Let's see open image a new tab. That's perfect.

All right, my screen sharing here and Here we go. Oh It looks like that don't you think it does I do I do I do know that mean okay, yeah fair enough Um, so but this cat knows it knows when when people are gonna die right so like throw yeah can throw So it goes into their room and just like sits on their bed and just like stays with these people when they're gonna die right so Danny goes in you know, he's like hold on let me get this cat and the guy's like no it's fine He it's and he explains like the cat only does this one like you know, somebody's about to die or whatever and the guy starts like He starts talking to Dan about like dying You know, he's scared and all of these things and like he starts like really getting scared. He's like what's gonna happen in my and then Dan Using his shining powers Comms the guy it calms him down and just takes away all of his fear and And he says that he sees his wife I don't know if Dan is putting those that image in his head or if it's like if he's actually like seeing you know, like He's gonna cross over or whatever. I think I think we're led to believe that he really is because there's Another patient later in the movie and Dan is like he's like I see your kids or whatever, right?

Yes. Yeah Yeah, I think I think that's meant to be real. Okay. Yeah, so so And then this guy dies and Dan Dan just stays there He's saying like he just he stays with the guy he helps with all the like the fear and and all of these like Negative emotions and just helped the guy like dying piece.

Yeah, this is where we get the origin of his cool nickname He comes doctor sleep. Yeah, the guy's like guys basically like oh doctor He's like oh, I'm not a doctor. He's like you're kind of a day You're kind of being a doctor right now And what Dan keeps saying to like calm him down. He's like he's like there's nothing to be afraid of It's just sleep.

He's like it's it's the first restful sleep You've probably ever had or what I know like all that kind of stuff He's like I guess you're kind of like a doctor of sleep. I know what I'll call you I'll call you doctor The rest of the movie is him trying to figure out what his cool nickname should be It's a weird turn for the shining sequel That old king trope of trying to figure out what your nickname should be So that becomes on top of being an orderly he He gets he becomes doctor sleep. He for years. He goes on and he helps these elderly people Die in peace and him and that cat like the cat shows him who's about to die and then he goes in there and he does you know does this thing So while while this is going on, right He I forget exactly how it starts, but the girl Abra Can can see Dan like sort of mentally.

Yeah, actually see him It's like um, it's it's like Danny and dick where like they could just kind of sense each other because they both had that power Because each of them is more powerful. They can basically just like transmit farther. Yes, right? And they start they start communicating with each other via the the chalkboard wall where they're you know Dan like wakes up and it says hello on there and then he says he writes high and then they sort of had like this conversation You know just like little shit back and forth.

Um, and then at a certain point, uh, abra comes out to see Dan and You know they talk about it a bit. Um, she's like Does she know about the the true knot at that point or is it just like? I don't think so. I think she remember.

Yeah, I think at that point. She's just like she's more like uh talking about her powers and like, um, are there more people like us and that kind of thing? Um, I you know, no, I'm not sure because no she must know at that point because I have like a distinct memory of like so She finds out about the true knot when jig of treme play is assassinated and Um, she does but it doesn't she doesn't she visit him before that? I think the reason I think it's after is because she writes like you know, she writes red rum on the chalkboard Hey like that other movie and um at the end of you know, he's like who and she says baseball boy And he says hope you're okay.

No, yep And then I think after you're right I think because she like she's like screaming and better whatever and her parents have to comfort her And then the next day like she goes off to school or whatever and seems like very dis disinterest disengaged or whatever And then skip school to get on a bus to go meet Right. Okay. So let's talk about the jig of treme play scene. Uh, he is a young he's a little league, uh, see pitcher or no I can't remember he's a little bit of a ball what they say is like, uh, uh At the game there's like a couple dads talking like this kid hits every single time he gets up Hey, it's like one thing alone One of his dads Really is yep one of those dads there is the original danny torrents all grown up.

You're kidding. No, that's that's him. Oh, that's great Yeah, it's fun. There's two guys that are sitting there.

He's the one on the left Um, wow totally miss that. Yeah, um Well, okay, so danny torrents and another man Yeah Yeah, i'm talking about how the kid's gonna, you know He's like one of these like, you know, one of these days, uh, one of those scouts is gonna show up to these games Right and meanwhile, you know a little dramatic irony rose the hats right hand man crow daddy Played by kron mcclarnin right who is like that guy fucking rules. Yeah, he's cool as hell He's cool as hell. Uh, he was on he was season two of fargo, which yes the most fucking bad ass guy Yeah, just fucking everybody up.

Yeah, I was like I could not place him. Damn. Okay. Yeah, he's great.

Um So he's like at the game. Basically, he's gonna go like steal this place. Oh, he's coming in. Yeah, he's scatting for sure Um, so jaykabtradley talk about snake bite andy either which is another huge fucking thing Yeah, um, so what I think we can loop back around to that because okay.

This is her like Is this her initiate? No, this is her first this her first. Yeah. Yeah, okay her first steam bath.

Yes Jesus christ Um Not everybody has the same shining power People have different can do different things and snake bite andy Is a 15 year old girl who lures? Uh, like perverts Like off the internet or whatever and she has ability to like they call her a pusher Which she just she says something and people do it So she's there another movie real quick. Is there another movie we've done where someone with that power is referred to as a pusher I don't know. Okay.

Um, it's all familiar. Yeah, but she So she she does that she you know puts this guy to sleep He said, you know, she says sleep and he just knocks you know, knocks off and she's like she takes out a knife And she she cuts a little like two little marks into his cheek and she steals his wallet And and she's like a stolen wallet you'll be able to explain to your wife But you're not gonna be able to explain uh, these cuts on your face And she's like every time you look in the mirror and you see this you have to say out loud I like little girls and if you ever she says something else like if you ever try and do this again, I'll kill you Right and while this is going on rosa hat and crow daddy are hanging back. They're watching all of this go down They're like they were going to take her steam it seemed like and then Crow daddy's like we should turn her and she should you know join the the true not we haven't had a pusher in a while, right? So they talked to her Um, the kidnapper ros explains like, you know, if you if you join us basically you'll Uh, when she she says you'll eat well and live long and so this link by nandy agrees and there's this whole ceremony where she Uh like transforms and it's a it's like this beautiful shot.

It's all shot at night all of this stuff, right? And we see more of the true not there Um, and then the next time we see her like she's just waking up and they're on the beach And she's been asleep for like days at this point And it's just them they're like hanging out on the beach. They're like grilling. They're just like, you know, just hanging It's real bojo.

Yeah, totally. They all drive around like rv's and campers and shit bunch of fucking rusted root fan So so she joins up and she's like, uh, that's her power So when jake and trombley is walking home this van pulls up next to him and uh, what's his name? The chunk? Oh, um, berry the chump.

Yeah, berry berry the chunk is like hey number 19 Well, he says hey 19. Oh, he does say hey 19 which 19 is like a steven king number. Yes and hey 19 Steely dance song Uh, but yes 19 comes up all the damn time guy loves 19 So, uh, berry the chunk tries to he says why why don't we give you a ride or whatever and the kids like no No, thank you and then the door slides open and it's snake by nandy and she said, you know She says you want to come with us and the kids like he just gets in the van Yeah, uh cut to later that night There's like a circle of like the rv's around the spot and these people are like, uh, nailing spikes into the ground And berry the chunk grabs a kid who's like flailing and crying and they tie him up and he is begging and pleading for his life Yeah, it's that's the upsetting shit. It's really fucking horrible and then there's just like one Scream before anything even happens to him.

Yeah, it's just like yeah, it's it's it's a really brutal scene Uh, you know rose a hat And she's like she has this knife and and the kid asks are you gonna hurt me and she says oh, yes And she's um because apparently like fear and pain purify the steam So so they start like torturing this kid and stabbing him and doing all the shit And he is releasing this steam and they're all just inhaling it They're all like they crowd around and they just are breathing it in and then like shotgunning it to each other Yeah, it's pretty high to glowing Yeah, yeah And it is like a sex thing for them that like I was talking about They're all like it's very horny the way that they're acting with each other Yeah, they're definitely gonna like go fuck in the other RVs or right out in the open Yeah, um now rob yeah, is this movie about a dream a chrome harvesting? Yes or no Yeah, that's probably right all of these like I think rose the hat Opie and grove There we go. We're that a word that you said that's nowhere in the movie. We see the connection I think this rose the hat is a bit of a hillary the rhodom clinton type Man let's hey Do you know what happened to those yeah, what happened to those hard drives?

I want to see biden's laptop hunter Biden. I do too. I heard there's a horsecock on there I didn't hear that. Oh, not like literally.

I just heard he humongous dick. No does Hunter it's uh, it's his name for his cock He calls it the hunter. Oh rob. Oh, I'm sorry.

Oh, that's where I draw the line. That's right too much All right, not that just show just right there So uh, they kill this boy and they drink up all of his steam They have these like canisters that they they save steam in so you know save it for later They keep they yeah, but they do keep saying that like steam is becoming more and more rare Um, probably because they're fucking killing all these people but this was a bit of like a jerk-off motion moment for me Uh, although I do think it's funny that they specifically they're like, okay. So what um who says it? Is it chroma?

Crodaddy? Yeah, it's crodaddy or rose. I can't remember so croat Yeah, um, they're just talking about it. I think croataddy is the one who's like, yeah I don't know what it is if it's uh, they're the smartphones or freaking netflix Oh or whatever and as annoying as like that idea is that the What true as it may be I don't even I'm not even disagree.

I'm just saying it's annoying to mention it But you're right it is annoying to mention it because we all know that these things are killing us We just we're all fucking addicted to it and fuck off Um, but yeah, I thought it was funny that they mentioned that flick specifically just because mike flanigans very productive relationship with netflix Until recently which I guess he had like a falling out and now he's over at amazon I didn't realize it was a falling out type of situation. I just thought I think it was damn Um, yeah, I mean like we know that mike flanigan is a loyal person, right? Like I don't know him at all, but I know bad about him. Yeah, he's like carol striking Well, actually I would cast that guy in absolutely everything if I go my guy.

Yes. Yeah bad example that so that guy I was looking at I mean he's been in he was in twin peaks Um, which he totally looks like he belongs in twin peaks. He plays the giant of course And he also played lurch in those adams family movies. They're right.

Yeah, um for him He's got dialogue in this too, which was nice. Yeah, he's like yes. He's like a full-on like a real character He's not just there to be like scary or anything. Yeah, he gets a he gets a death scene.

Yeah, he's right he plays like Uh, you know if rose is like the leader of the group or whatever Uh, this guy is the oldest one. He's sort of like the elder. Yes, and he may have led them at one point But at this point he's like semi retired Yeah, he's uh, he's grandpa flake is his name. Right?

And uh eating little boys steam is his game. Are you One could make a case. Um So so the murder or you know red rum or whatever um There's uh the scene where uh, so what's her name? Uh abra She using her shining power.

She can see everything that happened to jacob tremblay. Um his whole filmography Yeah, she saw all of it. Um, no, she sees it and uh, she tries to tell dan about it and she gets really like Uh freaked out. There's like a whole thing.

Um where she like projects like it I don't know. It's like this hard earthquake thing and shakes his house and the chalk wall just spells out murder Yeah, but dan first sees it in the mirror and which spells out red rum and you know how I mean dan is rolling his eyes so hard right now He needs to do it buddy. It's a see you how much how much of the stuff though is in the book Good question. Don't know we don't like we don't talk about the books.

This is king me baby. Yeah, not king me babies though Um, no, well we talk about the book and king. Right. Uh, yeah I don't know I think I'm sure that a lot of this like connection stuff and like the the red rum and whatever Has to be from like the red rum specifically that has to be in the book That is like way too overboard to just be like an easter.

Yeah, fair fair enough Uh, okay. Yes. Yeah, and then we get that scene where rose is in the uh, the supermarket and abra Like projects into the supermarket and pushes her. Yeah, so when jake of tromblades called abra senses it and like projects Into that scene and rose spots her and abra spots her back So they're aware of each other Um rose is like we got to find that girl.

She's like the most powerful Little little girl i've ever seen she's like yeah, no, yeah going um So then yeah, yeah, I was just gonna say fast forward to the scene at the supermarket when rose is buying I guess they also eat snacks. Yeah, they eat regular food in addition to the steam that okay, I would maybe I would maybe take that bargain It's like uh, yeah, it's you're not quite a vampire vampires can't like eat regular food And this is like being right there can like go to a cookout and shit I mean honestly as like a sort of like metaphor for Sorry class upper upper class like the the blood you must extract in order to like live that kind of lifestyle I think there's something uh very rings very true for me about that But anyway, so um, yeah, she's shopping. She's at the supermarket and abra Projects into her right we get that point of view shot of um what's her name? It's a reflection in yeah in the Cold case.

Yes. So she's like in rose's body which like it happens a couple times hubba hubba and yeah Wouldn't we all want to be giving me a position didn't me? So um rose rose like clocks or whatever and tries to sort of like snatch her I don't know it's all very Metaphysical and kind of hard to yeah, there's a lot of stuff that's like she just does like a magical thing because she's astral projecting Or she's in somebody else's mind or body or whatever. Yeah, so she's like, you know Say she's in she's in rose's mind and then rose within her own mind tries to like grab hold of her and like, you know control over Um and abra responds by like going asplosionae on the cold case Right big old earthquake Shatters the cold case gives rose of bloody nose roses freaked out man She is she tells like this when she's telling like roda she's like i've never felt something that's powerful before And he's like do you think we should actually like go after her?

She could be too powerful and roses just like I want her yeah fucking want her yeah like so she's just like this is it I'm doing this uh that's when abra, you know gets on a bus and goes and visits uncle dan Um and then she basically asks him for help with this because right she knows about the true not and she saw the baseball boy die and all the stuff and Dan's advice Forget about all that. She's gonna. Yeah. Yeah.

It's been the next 30 years drinking Work for me. Yeah, and then now I have a now. I have a really cool best friend Yeah, you know it's the we're talking about the hero's journey before he's refusing the call to action Yes, I was I was joking earlier. I think it's like a pretty normal hero journey kind of thing Um, so he refuses and then later that night He's visited by dick hollering who I guess they haven't seen each other in a while and he's like last time I saw you you were in bad shape and he's like yeah straight down whatever and tick is like you have to help this little girl like and Um, this is the last time that you're gonna see me and I this this whole like material like physical world Yeah, I don't even really remember it anymore.

It's been so long. So I'm not gonna be coming back. This is it for me It's just like helped a little girl. Yeah, uh, that's that conversation.

We're talking about at the beginning where he's like yeah I helped you know you help her right and again like the last time you're gonna see your mentor is when you become the mentor Uh, right the mentee becomes mentor. That's right. Um, the danny becomes the dan Uh, and that so rosa hat is her plan is to astral project Into this little girl's house or room and find out more about her find out where she is And we got some pretty cool shots of like her astral projected body like floating. Yeah, I liked it It was really cool.

It was good. There's a lot of like the wall becomes the floor type stuff, right? Yes and there's a shot of Rose like floating in outer space and Is he like the curvature of the earth? Yeah, well, I mean, I don't know if that's the curvature of the earth dan We could talk about that Um, we see it.

Yeah, I guess this is not really curved as it she's too close to the surface to see it It's this beautiful shot though of it's uh, you know, uh, it's this horizontal shot and she is floating through the air But she is it she's like vertical and the clouds are like cutting the screen in half basically So she's like floating above the clouds like going up it looks like it's just like, I don't know It's just a different perspective on something that we've seen so many times It's like it reminded me of the uh, that shot in uh, spider verse or whatever when he jumps off the building and then the city is upside down Totally it's similar to that. Yeah, it's it's like the world is like she's fixed and the world is sort of like rotating around her It's sort of the effect of it. Yes, uh, it looks very cool It looks great and then she sort of like flies into new amshire lands on the street barefooted um, no problem though. I that actually like there was such a Momentum and like wait to that shot of her landing on her feet I know like there's like a little bit of like fully of just like the sound of like the pads of your feet hitting the ground And it I was just like whoa like I it was like it was almost like first person video of like a roller coaster It was like the way it made me a great shot such a little moment, but it was it was very cool really like I don't know sucked me in So uh rose goes into abbers room and this is like Uh, it's in she's going into her mind basically and you know If you've been around king long enough, you know that we all have a mind palace This is no different Uh, she's uh abra has like this wall of like filing cabinets and whatever and she's the rose sees this and she opens One of them and she starts like rifling through files.

Mustn't do that. No, no, no, don't do that Um, so she starts going through that and uh The drawer slams on her hand and just catches her she can't like she can't get her hand out of the drawer And abra comes out and she's like, uh, I knew you were coming Basically like do you think that like I I am not in control of this right now and Abra goes into uh Rose's mind palace, which is a little bit nicer. It's like an old-fashioned like, you know, Victorian library or something Um, she's an old school kind of girl. Right real classy broad I think oh jeez we got that that shot of her like taking her hand out of the drawer.

Yeah. Oh, we'll get we'll get back to that during king tropes but king drops pretty gross pretty gross And yeah, so she Abra like totally freaks her out and sends her back where she came from Which she was like meditating on top of an rv and when she like when her astral projection comes back It like knocks her off of the rv and she falls on the ground. Yeah, and her hand is still fucked up her hands all fucked up Um And and that's when uh grandpa flick dies as well. Um, and we we see what happens when these i'm gonna call them on peers Yeah, they're basically vampires when they die.

It's um, it's also pretty harrowing like it seems like it hurts a lot Um, they're terrified, you know, he's like he's very scared and it's um, it is a it's a cool contrast to uh, Dan's sort of like His like speech that he gives to the first guy who dies in the hospital or whatever. Um, whatever you would call that and She's like where's he's like he's like it's sleep. It's rest. It's beautiful She's just sort of like she has to double down on the decisions.

They've made like that's all she really has like there's no looking forward because Their whole existence Is in this world, right? So right she's just like she's like you she's like you're not afraid She just like she's not even like don't be afraid. She says you're not afraid You have seen empires rise and fall. You've seen, you know, kings be made and unmade all that stuff and she's like She's like you're a god and gods aren't afraid or something like that, right?

And then he screams in in horror as he Is there a steam steam? There we go. Yeah, yeah, uh, which that that shot is like an overhead shot of like Uh him dying, right? He's like his body his skin keeps like flashing like turning like transparent and like it's see like his Skeleton and shit, but then like then he dies and when he dies right his whole body becomes turns into steam And it's just sitting there, right?

And then like all at once they all sort of like descend on it and start breathing it in yeah, so like These these people you see it like obviously they've killed but they're also like they're kind of like animals They're almost like cannibals where they're eating each other, you know, like there's no like it's steam A steam baby wherever he comes from i'm in, you know So at this point dan, uh, he knows that he has to help abra so they he gets uh billy to take a ride with him He's like you have to um I'm gonna tell you a story and do every do your best to believe me here, right? And so they're going to drive out to where the baseball boy was killed and they do and they dig him up and there he is And again monologues we see Cliff Curtis he gives a monologue about how he went hunting and he shot it a buck and it took off and then like a couple days later He found it it had been like it got like tangled in a tree or some shit And he said that's it was like the worst smell he's ever smelled and he's like this is the same smell and And they dig him up and I think they They let i think the plan is to let the authorities know that the boy is there Um, but that's when dan and billy they go to abra's house. Well, no the plan seems to just be getting the glove Oh, is that it? I think so because like I thought they said something about like letting the parents bury their kid like properly or something Oh, maybe maybe it was that yeah, um So they they go to abra's house and her dad's like who are you blah blah blah whatever and so they're like they explain everything and They they do get the glove abra.

I guess uses the glove to do what? I don't know Um she uses it to I mean she yeah she projects they come up with a plan on how to kill the true knot, right? They They decide to the whole caravan of people go decide they're gonna go get this girl and They tell rose to stay because she's injured whatever and they're like we got it It's fine and they all go out there and they use abra as bait Danny and billy use hers bait and snake bite and he like walks up to her And jabs and needle in her neck and like knocks her out and she's like that wasn't so hard And then like she turns away and when she looks back there's just like a stuffed animal there Because abra's not really there. It's just all projections, right?

And that's when uh fucking Billy and Danny just start fucking firing on them. They're like perched up in the woods and just start shooting So unexpected even though he was like you still got those hunting rifles. I was not expecting a shootout in the middle. I know I mean so much of this movie has been like astral projection.

Yeah, my magic mind palaces and shit like that And then they're like now what we fucking eat lead vampire Which um, I mean and we'll get to king tropes, but a a gunslinger overpowering a magic man. Hey Using a cold Lead. Yeah, that's right. Um So they they start shooting all these people and they're all dying in horrible ways the same as like grandpa flake we saw him um and Snake bite Andy is the only one left alive and So she uh what's that?

Danny comes down from his like, you know, he's up in the woods or whatever he walks down to where everybody was and then like Andy gets a drop on him and she says something like fucking men or whatever and But that billy shoots her in the neck and she starts dying Uh, but before she dies she looks at billy and says kill yourself Yeah, uh, and then billy just takes the gun and fucking puts it under his chin and blows his head Billies poor billy poor billy man. He just got roped in all this. I know he's like, I don't I didn't want to but he's a good friend Probably Dan's best friend. Hey Um, my name is Dan.

I'm just realizing this. Hey, wait a second. Um, so abra's still at her house and she's like She says something like where's the crow and the crow is in her house. Um, he goes He's gonna kidnap her.

He kills her father stabs the father and kidnaps her Um, and while there she's like drugs and in the backseat of the van and they're driving at night and Dan Uh, like sort of she's like very knocked out and then dan like inhabits her mind body Whatever and she's like much more lucid and then she she starts talking and and it becomes clear that it's not the little girl anymore And uh, crow daddy's like, uh, who are you and he says something Um, just get like keep some talking whatever And he says the little girl dan whatever says something about like, um, not wearing your seat belt And They end up crashing into a tree sending crow daddy flying through the windshield. Yes, it's great shot Kills him but good. Um Um much like on dry 3000 predicted He crashed. Well, he crashed crashed crashed into a ditch Just playing Uh Well, so okay.

Yeah, okay. So did you feel like now that the entire not is dead the entire tranada? Except for rose the hat. Yeah.

Well, is one person really a not? Good good question. Did you feel like that all happened very quickly? Were you expecting a bit more picking them off?

I yes, I did. Um, it feels like a little it makes sense like Within the movie like they all travel together or whatever and it but it was like kind of unsatisfying. I don't know You know, I think Most of the true not we don't even get to know so just like uh, there's like Uh, berry the chunk rose the hat Grandpa flick and crow daddy and and sink by the andi and then there's like four or five other people that there's a blind guy back there who we never hear Yeah, um, I would have liked a lot more of them frankly. Yeah, I mean we could have probably gone for like more Uh more interaction from all of them.

Yeah, not just I'll clarify extras right either You give them more to do or you give each of them a crazy distinct look sure it's like there's rose the hat There's frickin there's bear the chunk who's he's a chunk. That's his thing. Um, there's a 15 year old and obviously crow daddy looks like Tall man. They're saying tall man, but then just like I would say seven people Like seven like graduate students.

Yeah, yeah You're right. They all look like they're from the same town. Yeah, you know, it's very weird No, you're right. You're 100 right.

I think we probably could have gone You know what it's like uh, they do the same movies where like you'll get to just spend like time hanging out with characters, right? Just like it's just character development stuff and it's just hanging out and After snake bite Andy was turned and they're having that like barbecue or whatever on the beach That would have been a nice like moment or whatever to spend like a few minutes with this group. Yeah, find out what everyone's deal is real quick Yeah, find out what their deal is you also like could get to like them a little bit Which you know, that's always like a fun thing when you can like have the audience conflicted about like how you feel about the villains Yeah, um like I think a good obviously there are a million examples of this but like I'm thinking of um once upon a time in hollywood like That whole movie is just like right there. Basically the manson family that true.

Not is the manson family and like Yeah, you just you can get a little more they can all be like of a type and still like give everyone a little bit of a thing to do you know, yeah I guess we keep from going. Uh get get a squeaker going uh, so Danny he uh picks up abra and They're like, you know abra's like we you know, whatever they Uh, every rosa had a stall around and she's you know, she wants she still wants me whatever She's still coming after me and danny's like they're never she's never gonna stop So we got to handle this right and they drive to the overlook hotel and cholera outside Yep, they're outside and he tells her to stay there and she's like, what are you gonna do? He's like i'm gonna wake it up And he goes in and at this so this is like the last like half hour 40 minutes of the movie takes place in the overlook uh, what do you think of this as a Set for the final showdown. How do you feel about it?

Uh, what do you think? You know, do you think it's overkill? Do you not like it? Do you like it?

How do you feel about it? I'm a little conflicted like I think what's tough is that kind of like we were saying earlier like This begins and ends as being I would say Dan's story. Yeah, this is like Dan Torrance's story The middle introduces so much it makes this so much bigger than him and is and there's no real attention paid to his struggles like once he gets sober really kind of until he gets back to the hotel that like Making it that personal for him felt a little unearned, I guess You know what I mean? Like uh not exactly no so like so you're saying because we don't know we only know Uh, Danny as like an alcoholic and now a sober person Uh, you feel like him going back to the overlook.

It doesn't seem like that hotel is hanging so large over his life. I yes and because he like we've also been introduced to this entire world of People with powers and yes, this sort of like meters. It's like eternal conflict. That's just always been brewing um and suddenly Him grappling with his personal demons doesn't seem very important Okay, it seems less important and part of it though.

I think is like yes that other thing of just like he seems kind of fine Like we get one shot of there's like one scene where he is like I forget what has him distraught But he's got a bottle in his hand. Yeah, he almost he almost relapses and then he decides not to right um It just doesn't yeah, I don't know. I don't know Maybe just like maybe this is me not having that lived experience that I don't under like I don't recognize the ways in which it's just like maybe always simmering in the background like if yeah, I mean Yeah, I can understand what you're saying from the perspective of like just this movie because like Uh If you had not seen the shining and you just watched this movie I think most of it could stand on its own But then everything about the hotel and you know the past and whatever doesn't make a lot of sense Now this is a sequel so like, you know, I got the creators or whatever going in assuming you've seen the first one But like I think that's kind of where you're coming from is that like we You know, we talked about the hotel. We see it a couple times, but it's not this fucking, you know monster.

That's hanging over It's not the final boss Yeah, you know, yeah, it I mean I think Somehow the middle of the movie loses focus on Dan to an extent that going back there and having the climax of the movie be about him in that way to that degree Yeah, it feels Yeah, I don't know like do you think do you feel like it's unarmed completely kind? not completely it just feels like His emotional journey takes a real backseat to the action of the movie. Uh, um, in the last third Yeah, uh I think I could I think I understand what you're saying I'm like, I don't know so much of You know in the beginning, right? He's in like this rock bottom of his life and that is directly because of You know the events of when he was fucking six years old at this hotel.

Yeah, right? Um So like and that's you know, obviously that's where dad died. That's where his dad tried to kill him and his mom Ghosts all of that dick hollering all of this stuff. It's so much a part of his life and it's it also seems like it's It's I don't know I can agree with it like it comes I think what we're supposed to feel is that like he's confronting something now that he's He hasn't dealt with right the the hotel itself and all the spirits and all that shit And yeah, if maybe it was a little bit tighter or if there was maybe a little bit more emphasis on that in the second act It would make more sense.

It does feel like it kind of comes out of nowhere Uh when he's like we have to drive to this old hotel It's it's a long story. Whatever, right? Yeah, um Yeah, I I can see it. It is.

I just feel like within the within the Action like within the conflict with like the not he shifts gears into like taking action really quickly and There's I don't know once he gets over that first time He's kind of just like in total control of the situation I think what what might have helped is like I understand that like abra like part of that character is that like she's She's the powerful one right like she's really in kind of in control of the situation more than anyone else But I feel like the fact that Dan starts with her from a place of like you need to like keep this power under your hat There's like a clear protective feeling that he has That like I think sort of like seeing more of himself in her throughout Like making that like making that a little clearer might have might have helped a lot because it just it just sort of felt like He was like I have a really kick-ass plan to shoot all of These vampires and I need you to act as a as a decoy for me. Right. So like I think that's sort of more where my issue is like He's just like kind of kicking ass and taking names as soon as he commits to it, you know I I think a bumpier journey would have made that climax more satisfying I think you're right. Thank you the the shoot out thing.

Although it does it is kind of fun Um Yeah, it probably should not have been so easy and that's probably why uh Billy dies then because you need some sort of stakes and you can't kill Dan so Uh, we have to keep going here. Um Yeah, I can agree with that where if like maybe it was a little bit more And in like story writing and whatnot, right? Uh the beginning of the third act your protagonists are supposed to be in this impossible situation, right? Yes, it doesn't feel like they are.

That's a great point. Yes, you know, like You I do it like I'll watch a movie and be like all right. They're not in the impossible no-win situation yet Oh, there it is. And now comes the turn in the action or the client act Yeah, like I thought I thought for sure Dan and abra being separated was going to be a much bigger part of the plot not just him getting her out lickety split, you know and like and again like you know, this is probably more a critique of the the book and the story there but like if You know, Dan or Dan's plan is to wake up the Overlook Hotel and then unleash all of these spirits that he's you know kept locked up for so long Right.

He's he's gonna unleash those on rose the hat more fun and maybe more interesting and more Thematically concise if like the the true not like most of the group Went to the Overlook Hotel, you know, and maybe they got picked off by some of those spirits, you know, oh hell yeah Like that that you're yeah, I mean, but again, that's we're doing punch up on a book that's already, you know, fucking Stephen King is like I wrote the shining and I didn't like the movie. I'm gonna like the sequel and I want a movie that you know We're so excited. Well, I don't say my understanding is that the screenplay diverges from the book kind of like I think increasingly as as you get to that third act like because at the end of the shining the book the hotel explodes much like It sure does yes. Um, so like all of that.

I think oh, yeah must be an invention of yeah I guess yeah, well, yeah, maybe we'll you know what after we were done recording this I'm gonna look into that And we laughed Yeah Yeah, that's I honestly all joking aside. Yeah, that's serious. Yeah, what makes us a lovable? Yeah, what are these moments?

Yeah, so yeah, I mean we kind of just like I don't really think there's much to start now No, no now thinking about it. I want to watch the movie where like the true not end up in in the Overlook Hotel. Yeah, predator Yeah, kind of yeah, you know, I think I would have been like what a fucking Barry the chunk Just ended up at the same like New Year's Eve party like that's going on in the shining You know where they're like everybody's in tuxes and he's just like wait what yeah. Oh my god.

Oh my god, Rob Incredible. Yeah, am I doing like a punch-up on this? We always do this though like fine I mean it is like a little bit money morning quarterbacking but like yeah, but it also that's what podcasts are yeah exactly like I don't know think about that shoot out where the only person who dies is snake bite Andy like right isn't that already? Like doesn't that raise the stakes for the group more because it's like damn We just got this new girl and and knew what people are in such short supply right that well Yeah, you know like they killed they killed our legacy basically and if you think of her as like the sort of like evil inverse of Abra a little bit like they're in sort of the same position just on opposite teams.

Um, that just makes more sense, man Sense you're right. It does. It also like it adds stakes to the situation adds more Risk or whatever if if snake bite Andy and maybe one of the other like losers from the true not fucking get yeah capped at the like in the woods there um, but then they they're They start chasing You know dan and abra right so Billy dies there too and but now now they have the whole like true not on on their tail and Now you have whatever Six or five or six of these like powerful, uh, you know psychic vampire people after them and none of them are like dan and abra Together aren't strong enough so uh dan has to go to the overlook and Use like the most powerful evil that he knows of to kill these other people right rather than what we do get Which is roasting all of her friends dying and then chugging all the steam that they have Storage super powered What if rose drink like we just watched her drink like two monster energy drinks It's just crushes them. She's like fun.

Revealing revealing her monster energy drink tattoo on her She opens the cabinet knocks all the steam canisters out of the way and grabs two monster energies with coffee Like clacks them together like So, okay, so we're at the overlook dan goes in And all this yeah, yeah, I mean it's most the part I mean the most interesting part here he walks in and he goes into the ballroom and he walks up to the bar and You know again mirroring the shining all like the same sort of camera movements and lighting and whatnot And he sits down at the bar, but it's not loyed the bartender this time. It's uh, it's his father And but he's like actually my name is Lloyd. Yeah, he's uh, my name is Lloyd and he's like no it's not your name is dad Everyone knows yeah, and he pours pours dan. He had drink and he's like, you know So long like I saw I used to see these bottles like all over like in the house and whatever Uh, this used to be your drink of choice and they start talking about his mom and how when she died Um, she was in like such bad shape that he couldn't even look at her and and she saw that she knew that and he feels really ashamed of that And you know, he you know, he's blaming his father for some of the stuff and the whole time Henry Thomas is just really He's in the zone man.

He's he's just fucking playing jack dorance. Um And then he like spills something on his jacket and they they go into the bathroom the red and white bathroom again Um, and yeah, I mean that's one of those things are like, okay. Why are we here? I mean, it's a cool room.

It's a cool room and they're I mean once you're in the overlook You just have to redo all of the you got to see all the shit Yeah, I guess you do it like rose rose walks in and she's like walking through the hallways And she passes the elevator which opens up with the blood and starts like just like flooding out The same way it does in the original movie and and she just like She I guess she could she could yeah. Yeah, she sees that it's just like whatever sort of Spirit projection kind of a thing so she's not like really freaked out by it Um, but you just got to play all the old hits, you know, you don't want to You don't want to hear the new stuff man. I can hit I mean some of this does play like a cover song though. It's really like it feels like fan fiction at a certain point Um, it's steven king who fucking wrote it.

I do the re-is zone afterwards. You know how they say most people are their own worst critics He's a big man um So then abra and dan they Uh, they go into rose's mind. They put her in the maze just she's walking around there. They do like I don't know It's like a back and forth mind battle thing um We like dan Eventually she gets she breaks free of that and abra goes running off Then we get that scene where dan is slowly backing up the stairs with the axe in his hand while rose walks up the stairs mirroring Yeah, the you know, Wendy with the baseball bat and I did like that um Rose is doing the I'm not gonna hurt your hands.

Oh, yeah, I was I don't I'm just gonna bash her fucking brains in and she could do. Oh, she told me she absolutely is welcome to do that um then she starts so uh she she gets the upper hand and Uh, she cuts he swings the axe and like cuts her arm But then she like grabs a hold of it and like jabs him in the uh, what's it the femoral artery in your thigh? Yeah, one of those So and he's always bleeding out pretty good. She like she jams her finger into the The hole yeah, and he starts steaming he's given off steam.

Oh, he's steaming real good And that's she's like, oh, this is good steam that you taste like whiskey I also she does keep calling him handsome. Yeah, which I appreciate I appreciate someone acknowledging when someone looks like you in McGregor I also really like that. Uh, yeah, like she's no she's there for like the girl She knows that this guy's like sort of standing in the way and she's like I just got a tip I just real quick got a tip my ridiculous Amy Sherman paladino had at you Uh So she starts breathing in the steam and uh And then Dan Danny unlocks all of the boxes that he's had locked up in his mind palace And then we're full of you know spirits from the hotel and by the way his mind palace is the hedge mass of course Um Did you know this movie is she's shining? She says something like what's in the boxes is it special or something like that and he says it's not special They're starving.

Oh, yeah, I forgot what the line is, but that is what it's about like his little like drop moment Yeah, and then all of these spirits uh they come out and they grab her and they start like uh like pulling her Kind of apart like killing her they they want spirit like sticks his hand like under the skin in her face Um, yeah, you know just like killing her real good. She's steaming. You know pretty good Uh the spirits are uh, you know really digging into her and then she dies she becomes you know steam and then they turn on dan And it's winds turn on him. Yeah, right.

Um, and then they like sort of they possess him Right. Yeah, he goes he goes jack torrance mode. He's swinging the axe around he's chasing an abra He's he's got he's got the limp going and he's doing like basically Daddy, but with her name and said Uh, but he he snaps out of it and uh it tells her to uh, oh no, I'm sorry Um She she starts like laughing or something and he's like why are you laughing? And she's like because I know that the first thing danny did when he got here was go straight to the boiler room Right and he's like fuck So the spirits uh he has like a moment where he regains control of himself He's just like get get out of here or whatever then they take over he runs down to the boiler room And it's very funny.

Just like how many ghosts does it take to turn a boiler off? Yep, this plus apparently Yeah, so the boiler starts uh, you know overheating starts catching fire and then Uh in his last moment, he sees uh his mother and he turns into the little boy And then the whole fucking the whole hotel catches fire and burns down and The next scene is Aversating on the uh on her bed and she's saying, um, you know, I was standing out there and I saw the thing burn down or whatever and I knew and there's a pause and she's like, I knew you were fine And then cut you know reverse shot. He's standing there in her room just hanging out Uh, but he turns out to be a spirit. Yeah, now he is the dick hollering Uh to her and she you know gonna be some sort of a spiritual mentor or whatever Um, you know says that there are more people out there like the true or not but you know Uh, I think you're she's prepared for it now, right and he's gonna be there to help her Yeah, and then the last moment of the movie is like her mom coming up to get her And she's like who are you talking to?

She's like no one and then a beat and she's like, okay, I lied. I was talking uncle dan Um, he's okay. She's like dad's okay too because we forgot to mention Um, wasn't that crowed crow daddy kills her? Oh, you did okay.

All right. Sorry. Um, but that's it. That's the end of the movie Yeah, right The last shot is her walking into the bathroom which has a bath bag in there and doing the same thing she's closing the door Because she's like i'm gonna handle this shit.

I'm like fucking like a badass. Yeah, like a little magician. That's it. Yep Um, all right dan.

Yes, let's get into some segments. Do it. We hit me Oh, that hurts my heart. This is all that hurts hurts.

Oh dan what? Oh, you're poor parts Oh boo boo my part too You're the only one on this podcast with her parts. I'm sick of it. What uh what hurt your parts the most well Hmm Excessive shining references.

Yeah, I know that's unreasonable given the movie Given the movie that we're watching it would have made a lot less sense. That's was not the shining sequel Yeah, it would have been but it did kind of like I don't know So obviously I think every time this was like great. I think Alex s. I was a little less great as Wendy Um wig It's not her fault, but that all those characters gave me the vibe of like You know when they make like a marvel video game and they can't use the likenesses of like the cinematic versions even though that's clearly what they're based on Yeah, it kind of like it gave me that vibe a little bit.

Um, did that hurt my parts the most? Yeah, why the hell not? I don't know. I like I like the movie.