Tonight on 360, Vice President Harrison Liz Cheney in search of swing state Republicans looking to bail on Trump. The former president making free appearances in North Carolina, still spreading false weather about hurricane relief. After weekend, it saw him marvel out loud at what legendary golfer Arnold Palmer was carrying on the course. And later, John King all over the map, talking to Michigan auto workers, key voters in a crucial state just 15 days from now.
Good evening, thanks very much for joining us with the election two weeks from tomorrow. It doesn't take political scientists to know which places matter most in the eyes of two campaigns. Just look at the live shots from the Harris event just about to get underway in Wisconsin, and the Trump speech in North Carolina. Locations speak volumes.
Three stops in North Carolina for the former president today. Vice President Harris, appearances in Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin, the so-called Blue Wall States. Vice President campaigning today with former Republican Congresswoman Liz Cheney. I know that the most conservative of all conservative principles is being faithful to the Constitution.
And you have to choose in this race between someone who has been faithful to the Constitution, who will be faithful, and Donald Trump. That was this morning in Malvern, Pennsylvania outside Philadelphia outside Detroit. She said this to Harris curious Republicans. I would just remind people, if you're at all concerned, you can vote your conscience and not ever have to say a word to anybody.
But can't I mean time call for a boost in the federal minimum wage? The current federal minimum wage is $7.25 an hour, which means that the person who is working a full day and working full weeks will make $15,000 a year, which is essentially poverty wages. I absolutely believe we must raise minimum wage. The former president was asked about doing just that at a photo op at a Pennsylvania McDonald's over the weekend.
He did not answer. He did not ever say this about golfer and local legend Arnold Palmer at a rally in his western Pennsylvania hometown on Saturday. But Arnold Palmer was old man. I say that in all due respect to women and I love women.
But this guy, this guy, this is a guy that was old man. His man was strong and tough. And I refused to say it, but when he took showers with the other pros, they came out of there and said, oh my God, that's unbelievable. Well, his locker room talked about a phrase through the attention of Palmer's daughter, Peg, who told the Associated Press that she wasn't upset, but that it wasn't her words, a poor choice of approaches to remembering my father, but what he's going to do.
At the same event, he also said this about his opponent. So you have to tell Kamala Harris that you've had enough that you just can't take it anymore. We can't stand you. You're a shit vice president.
You're the worst vice president. Kamala, you're fired. Get the hell out of here. Get out of here.
Get the hell out of here, Kamala. He also doubled out on the weekend on calling his political opponents. In this case, Congress members Adam Schiff and Nancy Pelosi quote the enemy from within. And today renewed his call to invoke a law against migrant criminals that was last used during the Second World War.
I will invoke the Alien Enemies Act of 18-0 of 1798. Think of that. 1798. That's when we had real politicians that said we're not going to play games.
We have to go back to 1798. Also today, while surveying the hurricane destruction in Western North Carolina, he repeated a debunked lie that he's been repeatedly telling him that FEMA relief money's been diverted to migrants. But look, a lot of the money is gone. They don't have any money.
They have to have a meeting in Washington, a special meeting in Washington to get money. It's all gone. They've spent it on illegal migrants. Now, the individual you saw standing next to him, as he said that as Republican Congressman Chuck Edwards, he has a whole webpage on his congressional site just for debunking hurricane response myths and outright lies, including the one the former president told today in front of him.
Join us tonight, Washington Post White House Bureau Chief Toulou Olu Runipa, the Republican media consultant, Stradgetz Bratat, also seen in political commentators, Ashley Allison, and former Republican Congressman. And King Iser who now supports the vice president, Toulou, I practice that so many times when I set it up. So there's seven so-called swing states. What are the most important ones right now?
Well, clearly Pennsylvania is a key state where both of these candidates are going to be spending a lot of time over the next two weeks. But the entire blue wall is incredibly important for Kamala Harris. That's why she was in all three blue wall states today, Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania. She knows that she wins those three states and the second district in Nebraska, she's going to be the next president.
And so she's going to be spending a lot of time there. But for Trump, he's going to be playing a little bit of defense. He realizes that he needs to win North Carolina again. He needs to win Georgia, which he lost the last time.
And he needs to pick off Pennsylvania. And so he's going to be spending a lot of time in sort of that Eastern flank, which is sort of an Eastern wall that Republicans have put together, saying that if he can win Pennsylvania and Georgia, Pennsylvania, and North Carolina, that he'll be the next president. And so that's why you're going to spend a lot of those candidates spending a lot of their time in those states over the next two weeks. I just want to put on the screen a couple of headlines after Trump's Saturday rally.
I'm just going to read to Trump kicks off a Pennsylvania round by talking about Arnold Palmer's genitalia, Trump fixates on Arnold Palmer as all men and showers during profane rally. I mean, given the amount of time we're in, are those the headlines the campaign wants out there this weekend? No, I think it doesn't serve him to generate headlines like that. He ought to be talking about Kamala Harris's liberal position.
She took when she ran for president the first time. The fact that she doesn't disagree with anything the Biden administration has done, which most voters in the country disagree with. But you know, rally, political rallies are a time when you see a lot of outlandish speech. Last Thursday, we had a heckler who came into one of Vice President Harris's rallies and demeaned it.
And she said that is this for committing genocide? And she said, I hear what he's saying. I respect what he's saying. It's real.
It's real. We're not talking about that. But rallies, a lot of times the speakers get carried away with the moment. They try to amuse themselves and appease the crowd.
Both these candidates are doing that. Ashley, what are the challenges of running a campaign against someone who's, the off the cup speaking style, it certainly works in the crowd there. And is it something she should respond? I mean, it gets a lot of attention.
Well, okay, let's first Donald Trump's off the cuss. It looked like he was actually reading a teleprompter. So some of the things he was actually saying his team wrote and he was staying on script even though it was the loudest of the lot of things that we've heard probably in a presidential election. And then he goes off to script and just when you think it can't get too bad, it goes into another dimension where we're talking about another man's doing it.
And tell you for whatever reason, I'm not sure. I'm not sure that's what's going to convince Pennsylvania swing voters. But maybe you have some data. I don't know.
There's a joke in there somewhere. Sadly, but I think the vice president, she has been coming off the cuff a little bit as well. And I think she is finding her stride in it. Being able to have comebacks telling people you're in the wrong rally.
You need to go to the smaller rally. That's not in the wrong way. She said someone said Jesus is more. I think that is being misinterpreted.
But I think those quick comebacks are landing well with her. And I think but for Donald Trump, he can say what it's sad. He can say whatever he wants. And people just accept that they expect him to be crass.
They expect him to be locker room talk. But the one thing I just want to point out is that if he wins, remember when he won last time, he still wasn't satisfied. He still didn't stop going after people saying that the election wasn't corrupt and whatnot. So if he wins this time and we're seeing this version, just imagine what the next four years are going to be.
Congress, do you think the support permission structure that you list any other pipe profile conservatives are trying to build for disinfected Republicans to vote for Kamala Harris? Do you think it's working? Because obviously the polls cannot be closer. Yeah, I mean, I do because look, if you're a pollster, it's all kind of an art or science, I guess, whatever, and you're trying to figure out what is democratic turnout going to be, what's Republican turnout.
And all of it, you're kind of turning these knobs as you try to figure it out. So I don't think you can really get much of an understanding of what percent of Republicans are going to vote for Harris. Look, if it's, I think it was like 8% that Biden got. If Harris gets 9% or 10%, that's huge.
So we're not talking a quarter of Republicans, but I do think it's going to be significant. And by the way, to compare Trump's off the cuff to Kamala's off the cuff is just nonsense. It's absolutely nonsense. Trump is, he's an entertainer.
He's trying to entertain. He's trying to, you know, he's trying to win over men with those jokes and a certain portion of them think it's funny. And that's all he's trying to do. But to compare him to Kamala in seriousness is just a little outlandish.
Toulu, what do you think about the sort of closing messages that we're hearing now from these campaigns? I mean, obviously Harris is really leading to her claims that Trump is unstable, exhausted. He's leading into claims. She's lax and border security.
Never worked with McDonald's. According to him, for some reason, he seems obsessed with that. And lying about FEMA stuff. They're going after different audiences in his final stage.
They're trying to gin up support from their base as well as trying to win for Kamala Harris's stance. She's trying to win a number of women voters. You see her with Liz Cheney. You see her speaking with groups in the Midwest that are very female-dominated.
In part because they are trying to run up the numbers with women because Trump is targeting men in his final stage. He's trying to run up the number with, as the former congressman said, men who find him funny, men who like him being sort of edgy, men who like the fact that he talks about Arnold Palmer on the debate stage. And you never will hear another candidate speak like that. And so they are targeting different audiences.
They are trying to have these different closing messages. Normally in a campaign, you're focusing on undecided voters. It seems like right now they're all about turnout of their base and people who are already with them or who are going to be convinced to turn out because of what they're hearing in favor of themselves. I'm curious for just from all three.
Everybody who's interested in this campaign is looking every day at polls and all this stuff. Brad, what do you look at in this closing? And what are the things you look at every day to see like who's up who's there? Well, very clearly, the Harris campaign believes that their closing stride must be to try to peel some Republicans and Republican-level media.
That's why Liz Cheney's featured today. I think she's missing a step, though. I watched her whole rally to our conversation, Liz Cheney's today. And when the one who's a Cali and American stood up, she said, I'm a Catholic, I'm a conservative.
I would like to know why I can be comfortable in voting for you. And that was the moment where she needed to say, well, you know, I've learned I used to be more liberal than I am now. And I've learned some things. I was wrong about some things when I was far out California liberal.
Instead what she came up with, I'm going to give you home health care. And I don't think the vice president understands that if she wants to pull people who are right of her, she has to explain why she's not left anymore. And that's the thing that's just missing. This is a vibe campaign and a vibe campaign only.
And she can't do that for the next two weeks. I want to ask the same question to the others. We're going to take a quick break. Everybody's returning coming up next John King with more and why the candidates are where they are right down to the county level.
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His latest thing you see this yesterday was he finds the peace talks boring. Not my favorite guy, but I got to be honest with you. I know exactly what he's talking about. He's not negotiating.
He's not in the room. But how do you think he receives the information? Because I got an, uh, sir, because they all saw him. Sir, would you like to hear the latest?
They should make like a comic strip out of it. Have a guy who's for years check us out on Apple, Amazon Music, wherever you're podcast. Even though you can watch the podcast on Spotify. Welcome back to looking at their vice president Harris in Brookfield, Wisconsin outside Milwaukee.
And crucially part of a county you'll be hearing much more about, especially as the votes come in, seen as John King's at the Magic Wall, right now. The political geography of 2024. So what can you tell us about the counties vice president Harris and Liz Cheney are focusing on today? Critical suburbs where they hope to find disaffected Republicans.
Let's take a look. She's in Wisconsin right now. As you noted, let's pop it up on the map and get it to come on out. There we go.
A little tape delay. She's here to the west of Milwaukee in Waukeshire County is where you see her right now. And you see how red this is right now. Uh, 60% for Donald Trump against Joe Biden.
But these counties, the Waukes, the three, one, two, three, right around Milwaukee are becoming more suburban. As they become more suburban, they come more available for Democrats. Why are they there? Let's look at the 2024 Republican primaries.
Nikki Haley got 14%. Not a huge number, but 14% in the status closest Wisconsin. What you're hoping with Liz Cheney and these other Republicans to say, hey, there's some protest votes out here. There's some people in the primary who didn't want to vote for Donald Trump.
Can we get them in the general election? That's Milwaukee County where she is right now. Now let's move over. She was earlier today in Michigan.
Again, let's come out of the Republican primaries and come to 2020. She was here. She was in Oakland County. This used to be a Republican suburb when I started doing this.
Now Oakland County is Democratic in Macomb County to its east, which used to be Democratic. More blue collar is Republican. It's, but you come here to Oakland County. And again, what are you looking for?
You're looking for disaffected Republicans. This is close to Detroit as you move further up. You get more Republican up here. And again, let's look at the Republican primaries.
Nikki Haley got 33, almost 34% of the vote here. So Liz Cheney, Kamala Harris, the Vice President. No, there are some Republicans here who did nearly 50,000 who did not want to vote for Donald Trump. If the Vice President can get 1,500 or more of those, she's in business.
And the first stop Anderson for the campaign. Let me come back here and let's go back to 2020 again. We're here in Pennsylvania, where down here, Southeast Pennsylvania, Chester County, one of the collar counties around Philadelphia, more and more Democratic. But still, look at this.
Joe Biden got 58% there, but go back to those Republican primaries. Nikki Haley got 24% of the vote in this county in Pennsylvania two months after she dropped out of the race. So again, are you going to get all 9,338 of those people? Maybe not.
In the state of closest, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin, what they're doing here is to try to say we know there are a bunch of Republicans out there who do not want to vote for Donald Trump. Can't we win them over to our side? Let's talk about the former president. He was on the trail of North Carolina today.
Where are the counties where his campaign is opening maximum. This is really interesting. If you look at this, we talk a lot about the battlegrounds, Joe Biden won and how close they were. This is a battleground.
That's Virginia. Let's pop down south. This is a battleground Donald Trump won. Look, 75,000 votes, just shy of 75,000 votes.
Look at 2016. Donald Trump's margin was 173,000 plus in 2016. It was only 74,000 plus in 2020. So it's a state that is leaning, becoming more open to the Democrats, particularly the suburbs.
So where was the former president? He started out here in their Asheville. Number one, he's out here because this area was hard hit by the hurricane. He's out here apart because he's lying about the federal response about the hurricane.
But that's not the only reason. Look, 60% for Joe Biden in 2020. So you say, why is Donald Trump here? Again, remember how close it was?
We're going to vote counts for Donald Trump, just like every vote counts as the vice president tries to get Republicans, right? Let's go back and look at those Republican primaries again. In Buncombe County, 33% for Nikki Haley. So Donald Trump trying to show up his own base there, too.
He's not just trying to win over Democrats who might be mad about the hurricane. He's trying to show up his own base. So let's go back and see where else he was. He was here just to the east of Charlotte.
This is Mecklenburg County, the largest where Charlotte is. Colorado County here, the Charlotte Motor Speedway is right here. More than 100,000 people have moved to this county in the last 20 years. What does that mean?
It's becoming more suburban, more open to the Democrats. Again, Donald Trump got 54% in 2020. But look at Nikki Haley in those Republican primaries, 24%. So almost a quarter of Republicans in this county that we don't want Donald Trump.
So he is there again to shorten his base. And let's end it by coming back here. This is the former president's last stop was in Pitt County out here in Eastern, North Carolina. Joe Biden won by almost 10 points.
He would say, why is Donald Trump here? Again, you want to get every vote you can? He's trying to get people to switch over one last time to want to be a broken record. But Nikki Haley got 20% of the vote here in the Republican primary this year.
So as Donald Trump makes his stuff, Kamala Harris is looking for new votes. She's trying to get Republicans to come over. Donald Trump is going to places where his own map says we've got to touch base with the base to make sure we can get those Haley voters to come home. So we're jumping stick around back here with the panel.
Actually, you've been part of campaigns. What are the teams on the ground need to do to kind of execute the strategy that John's talking about? Well, right now it's what? 821 Eastern Standard Time.
And so it's dark outside. So canvassers are probably coming back from off the doors and they're turning in their walk packets and they're saying, I had 50 doors that I needed to knock. I talked to 20 and I converted five to go vote. And so those go then people start entering their data.
And you really, that's why we always say ground games. Some of those people are paid. But a lot of those people are volunteers. They're people that really believe in this can.
It want to do either maybe for Senate race or the President or city council race. They are locked in. They're calling, confirming. So do they then follow up with those people?
They follow up with those people they say. And then they go into the database and they say, did they turn in their ballot? Because normally in most states voter rolls get updated that you voted and say who you voted for. But they say, OK, we converted this person to early voter.
And so we don't have to knock on that door anymore. So that's like money in the bank. So when you see all these early voters in Georgia in North Carolina, that's it's not only shows enthusiasm for either candidate, but it also it's a relief to poll workers or to people on the ground game because they don't have to deal with those people. Well, that's a complicated question because it depends on where those early votes are coming from, right?
So you would think in a Georgia, if the density of voters are coming from Atlanta, that's most likely a Democratic vote. So the higher that is, the better the hairs campaign is feeling. But if it's coming for a more rural area that Donald Trump is, you're like, oh, we got to make sure our folks are getting out. And the interesting thing is that Republicans traditionally didn't want to do early.
I mean, Donald Trump demonized early votes. So there is no indicator since COVID of which party is the early vote party. Congress, I want to play something else before President said today in North Carolina. They said millions and millions of ballots out there don't know what the hell's happening.
Do you ever hear the expression that the vote counter is far more important than the candidate? And unfortunately, we can't let that happen. We've got to take it back. I mean, you obviously investigate the former president's lies about the previous election being rigged.
What is your response to what he is saying there? Yeah, I mean, look, this is what he does. He's he can never admit. I mean, he could lose literally every state and he'll never admit he lost.
That's what a narcissist does. They can't admit it. So he's laying the ground where not just for his ego, but to challenge the election and get the folks on his side to do what they did last time. And the thing that should frighten us a little bit is they were kind of building the plane as they were going after the last election until January 6.
Now they have a plan in place. What I worry about are these different state houses and what goes on when those certifications come forward. So yeah, this is him, of course, laying the groundwork. And this is important too, just on the early voting stuff.
If you think about it, any given day, like 1% of the country is sick. Okay. So when if there's a state where say a million people vote, 1% of that's 10,000 votes, you figure a number of those folks won't go vote. So if you on your side can start banking those votes early, that's a benefit as well.
So Kamala, by the way, has a much, much stronger, much stronger ground game than Donald Trump does. And I think that's going to work through her favor in basically a title action. Totally. I mean, the former president has been spending a lot of time on sort of male centric podcasts going for maybe voters who are citizens who may not have voted before or may not be so inclined to vote.
Do you think it's working? Also, we're definitely working with some male voters, specifically younger male voters. He's going to sort of the online bro culture and really trying to present himself as this counter cultural figure, which is a little bit strange because he's the former president. But it does seem to be working with specific subgroups of voters.
He's making inroads with black men, with Hispanic men, with younger men of different demographic backgrounds. And it makes it very clear that he is trying- I think there's tension like Arnold Palmer's been a telly-up. He is trying to show that he's not just an everyday politician. Whether or not it works, that remains to be seen.
But he's saying things that no politician has said before. He's making himself part of the online culture. He's showing that he respects that culture by showing up to popular streamers and podcasters, whether or not people actually turn out that remains to be seen. But it's a clear strategy for trying to run up the male vote because he's not doing very well with one of them.
Right. I think it's a different electorate this year. We now have a coalition where Republicans benefit from infrequent voters. And the Trump campaign is working hard on it.
They actually worked hard on it for two years to register people to vote. You can see that in the swing states. You know, marginal voters will hold the key for Donald Trump. Thank you all.
Appreciate it. Coming up. The latest in Swellman and John King's all over the map series this time. John's in Michigan talking to auto workers when they're back.
Recent polling tonight from Michigan. It comes from Wall Street Journal. Vice President Harris ahead by 47% to 45%. But still within the margin of error, I mean, no clear leader.
John King recently returned to the state as part of his all over the map series. He talked to voters there. And there were a few voters in Michigan. A few voters are watching more in Michigan than the auto workers.
Signs of the season. McCone County, Michigan. The suburbs just north of Detroit are a blue collar bellwether. Joseph Knowles about to send a message.
About to defy his union leadership. About to vote Republican for President for the first time. About to vote for Donald Trump. At this point now, I'm desperate.
So I'm willing to try anything right now to make sure that I can fulfill my responsibility and to take care of my wife and kids. That's all I care about. Knowles is a union auto worker. One of 1100 just laid off by Stellantis.
The parent company of Chrysler Jeep. He blames corporate greed the most but doesn't stop there. The second lane I will put it on Joe Biden and the Democratic Party. Why?
Because of the EV's mandates. I thought the Democratic Party was for the working class. People that average Joe like me. That's what I thought.
There are more American auto jobs now than at any point of the Trump presidency. But auto workers supporting Trump here echo his attacks on Biden's clean energy incentives. And his claim that legal immigrants are to blame for lost jobs. But if you do it the wrong way, I think you should get round up and just don't know.
I don't wrong with that. Because it jeopardized my way up above my kids. If they take jobs. Knowles waves off friends who call Trump racist.
Says he doesn't believe Vice President Harris is up to the job. And he spars with family members who say he should stay a Democrat. Oh man, that took it from my auntie, cousin, sister. They came at me.
You'll go V.A. is a 30 plus year union worker at Ford. And he has this cypus as cleaning car under bodies. When we first visited four months ago, he was a fan of Robert Kennedy Jr.
Now he will cast his third ballot for Trump. Our FK joining Trump effectively, I couldn't script it any better the way I would like it to be. I love the idea of Donald Trump being the commander in chief. I love the idea of how Donald Trump handles the nefarious characters in the world.
Goya believes more than half of UAW members at his Ford plant will vote Trump. He says Harris laughs too much and he can't take her seriously. So what is it? You're the incumbent who wouldn't do anything different.
Or are you the underdog that wants change? And he says critics take Trump too literally. He does it for effect. I don't believe that Trump really believes someone's eating cats and dogs.
I don't believe that he's going to call the National Guard out and at gunpoint round up every migrant and force him across the lower board. I don't believe that for a second. Count this early voting way in County for Harris. And Count Tonia Rincon is a Democrat who long ago lost patience with Ford coworkers who shrug off Trump attacks on immigrants on judges on vote counts on critics.
There's a lot of people that they just take the crazy with Trump as it's baked in the cake and we're just willing to ignore it. Whereas if we heard that out of our loved ones, we'd be like, okay, grandpa, it's time to take your keys. Rincon just retired from the Wayne Assembly plant and is helping the UAW register and turn out voters. She says her June bet that her local was with 50-50 in the Trump Biden race is still about right with Harris now atop the Democratic ticket.
There's a little bit more enthusiasm among some of my female coworkers. A couple of my male coworkers are pretty ambivalent about Harris. We may have lost a tiny margin of support because sexism is a real thing. They're just like, I'm not sure she can do it.
I don't think the country's ready for a female president. Walter Robinson Jr. says there's more energy since the switch to Harris, but also more offensive chatter on the assembly line. They have been saying some very disperience things about the vice president, things about how she rolls up through the ranks and some of the things that she might have done.
They only had to say that to me once before they understood they can't say that to me again. So they paired what he puts out there. D.J. How did Union households break for Clinton in 2016 and Biden in 2020 when they ran against the former president?
It's a very important number. I'll show it to you in one second. I just want to set the table with this. Joe Biden won Michigan by 154,000 votes in 2020.
He became president. Hillary Clinton lost Michigan in all the blue wall states in 2016. She lost Michigan by 10,704 votes. So every vote matters.
So let's come back to 2020 and let's answer your question. And let's bring this out. Forgive me. I just want to stretch it out.
I'll turn my back for a second. Nationally, Clinton beat Trump by nine points among Union households in Michigan by 13 points. So she won by 13 points, but it wasn't enough. She lost the state.
And Biden won Michigan Union households by almost twice that. Plus 25 points over Trump and by plus 16 points nationally among Union households. So what happened? Hillary Clinton won the popular vote, but she lost the presidency because she lost the blue wall states.
Joe Biden, a bigger win in the popular vote and he wins Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania because the share of the Union vote was hired in Hillary Clinton almost doubled in battleground Michigan. That's why when you look at this and you see where Vice President Harris is tonight, yes, she's with Liz Cheney trying to court Republicans. Guess what? A lot of those Republicans are also water workers.
You've been noting the voters now, I mean, all over the map series for months. The people in this piece seem pretty sure, very sure, who's going to get their vote. I mean, it's the fact that undecided voters are starting to break in one direction or another. All the data tells you they're not breaking sharply in one direction or another.
I do think for past experience, this is my tenth campaign. It does tend to break late. So that's Michigan you just saw there. Tomorrow morning I'm getting on a train and I'm going back to the Philadelphia suburbs where we have a Haley voter group to see them as well.
I'm of the view Anderson that there are very few truly undecided voters right now. There are people who are leaning one way or the other, but who are anguished about it. Republicans who don't want to vote for Trump. Long time Democrats who aren't sure the vice president is up to the job.
So you have this very narrow segment yet and we have two weeks to track them down and try to get to tell us what they're going to do. Alright, John, look forward to see what you find tomorrow. Thanks very much. One quick reminder going to be moderating.
Cine Town Hall with Vice President Harris this Wednesday at 9 p.m. Eastern from Pennsylvania. Join us. Still ahead, the vice president tonight and her outreach to moderate Republicans.
Another live shot from Brookfield, Wisconsin outside Milwaukee. The third stop in third day with former Republican councilman Liz Cheney in search of independent voters and moderate Republicans. Three stops today, even on a topic as divisive as abortion. This is what they said.
I think there are many of us around the country who have been pro-life, but who have watched what's going on in our states since the Dobs decision. They have watched state legislatures put in place laws that are resulting in women not getting the care they need. And so I think this is not an issue that we're seeing break down across party lines, but I think we're seeing people come together to say what has happened to women when women are facing situations where they can't get the care they need. That's not sustainable for us as a country and it has to change.
And with us now is Michaela Carformer, Chief of Staff for Speaker Kevin McCarthy, also John Favreau, former speechwriter for President Obama. He co-hosts the podcast Pod Save America. He and his co-hosts are the authors in the New York Times bestseller Democracy or else How to Save America in 10 Easy Steps. So John, how big a deal is it for someone to socially conservatively to invoke reproductive rights as she urges voters to support Kamala Harris?
I think it's a huge deal. I mean, the Harris Wall's campaign believes that there is a big portion of undecided voters, or at least persuadable voters, who are disproportionately women, republican leaning women, either independents or right leaning Republicans who, you know, they don't like Donald Trump. They sort of already made up their mind about Donald Trump, but they're not sold on Kamala Harris yet. And to hear someone like Liz Cheney say that the conservative thing to do is to pledge a nose to the Constitution.
And that's what Kamala Harris would do when Donald Trump is violated his oath to the Constitution. And then to also say, hey, even if you're, don't agree with her on every issue, even if you're not for abortion, the Republican Party under Donald Trump has become extreme, even on the issue of abortion. She also said there that Ken Paxson, who's the Attorney General of Texas, was actually suing so that he could get women's private medical records so he could see if they cross state lines to get an abortion. And I think that's what Liz Cheney was referring to when she talked about how the parties just become extreme.
So I think that gives a, she's creating a permission structure for republican women to feel okay about voting for Kamala Harris. Michaela, do you think that's a convincing argument for some Republicans who may not like Donald Trump that you can be against abortion and still vote for Harris? I think the problem is it doesn't feel authentic. It's been the problem all along, especially with Vice President Harris.
She ran so far to the left when she was running for president in 2019. And now this whip saw to, I'm moderate and I'm conservative. It isn't, or I'm moderate, center of left candidate. It isn't believable when she's unwilling to say that she's changed her position on anything.
And then to have conservative politicians say it's okay to not vote the way that you believe on abortion. It doesn't feel authentic for Cheney who continuously for years was a very pro-life candidate to now say that the rollback of Roe, which is something that conservatives fought for 50 years has gone too far. It doesn't feel authentic. I think that's a real problem with the campaign.
Do you think that Donald Trump has changed the expectation that people have? I mean, he's changed his position on pretty much everything over the years. Does flip-flopping have the same negative connotation that it once did? Or does he sort of made it permissible?
Is he talking about a permission structure? Has he given a permission structure for everybody just flip-flop? I don't know whether he's done that. But I think in terms of what Michaela was just saying about Kamala Harris, look, she's had four years as Vice President, where she and Joe Biden have done a lot to bring people together.
And they've reached across the IELDA by partisan infrastructure law, the CHPS Act, the first gun safety legislation in 30 years. So I think that she and she said this herself. She has learned over the last several years that what it's like to govern the whole country and to work across the aisle. And so I think that voters are going to give her credit that I think they already are.
And I also think that there's so many Republicans who believe that even on the issue of abortion, even pro-life Republicans, that the party, especially in some of these states, has become way too extreme, has instituted bans with no exceptions, in some cases, for rape, incest, or the life or health of the mother, has put IVF at risk, is potentially going to go after contraception. So I think that there's a lot of pro-life Republicans who don't want this kind of future in the Republican party or for the country. And there was some talk that the former president might do an event with Nikki Haley, unclear whether that's really actually in his mind or whether he'd be willing to do that. But would that be a wise idea for him?
I think in a race that's close to every vote matters. And the attempt by the Harris campaign to try to get to this elusive undecided voter this close to the election is a really good move. The problem is what we're seeing by the numbers and by the polls is that that undecided voter cares about issues. They care about the economy, they care about the border, and they're not comfortable with how unstable things feel.
Things don't feel certain with crises in the Middle East and crises overseas and wars in Ukraine and war in Israel and inflation where it is. They don't feel like things are stable and they care about issues and he's leading on issues where she is not. John, it's been a while since you were a personal Obama's chief speech writer, you said you helped a bit with the DNC speech of the summer. I wonder what he made of his campaign appearances so far, specifically his message to black man, which some criticizes him kind of folding.
Well, I think, look, I heard him over the weekend when he was in Las Vegas and he talks about Donald Trump and said, look, this was your grandpa. You'd be calling up your relatives, asking them all, like, what happened to him and when are we going to take away the keys? Because do we really want Donald Trump, who's older and looneer to be in charge of the nuclear weapons in the United States? So I think he's having a lot of fun, poking fun at Donald Trump while also, you know, as Kamala Harris, I said, Donald Trump is an unserious man, but there'd be a lot of serious consequences, which is, I think, the message that Barack Obama is trying to communicate.
But also, you know, I think when he was talking to, he realizes that Kamala Harris has to earn every vote and then whether you're white, black, Latino, man, woman, that you might have some reservations. And so I think they are talking to every group of voters that they can, trying to say, look, this is a choice between two people, who's going to actually improve your life? And I think that voters do care about issues. But I think that there's a strong case that Kamala Harris can make, that even if you think things are unstable, Donald Trump is not the person that is going to bring stability to the country.
And I think that when he campaigns every day and says what he does, it's evidence that he's not exactly the candidate of stability at this point. John Fabro, McIn the car, thanks so much for coming up. Next, Elon Musk pledged to give away a million dollar daily to registered voters in battleground and states and whether or not that's even legal. Placing his don't even know what Musk's super fan seen in the former president.
Welcome back, Elon Musk, the world's richest man who's certainly proportionally on the envelope in the tech world. Now he is taking that approach in politics. Over the weekend he pledged to give away a million dollars each day to one registered voter in a battleground state who signed a petition in support of the first and second amendments. That's where the legal questions come in, seen in legal analyst Elliott Williams joins us shortly.
But first, Antonio Sullivan over the weekend spent some time at one of the most pro-Trump rallies in Pennsylvania. Elon Musk is a smart man in the room. Elon is a genius. This is a one-time opportunity to see him.
I'm a super star trekking. When those rockets came down, you've got to be kidding. I respect his opinion. I understand the way he thinks, being an engineer myself, I can understand some of the quirky things that maybe other people take the wrong way.
Elon Musk is holding this town hall happening here in Harrisburg, trying to get the vote out for former president Donald Trump. Musk is pouring tens of millions of dollars into getting Trump elected, even offering cash prizes to registered voters in battleground states. So every day between now and the election will be awarding a million dollars starting tonight. This, experts say, could be breaking election law.
I've been to a lot of Trump rallies, but this has the feel of like part comic con, right? Trump rally, right? There's tons of young people, which I was surprised. I think usually, you know, like, there's a lot of people like me in a Trump rally, you know, like, getting ready to drop over.
These are Elon Musk fans. He's so cool, man. Why not? Right?
I mean, he's just so inspirational. What an amazing guy. What I think he offers is being able to use his platform to bring the truth to more people, people that may not otherwise even give a crap about politics. With all the polarization that there is now, I feel like it's really tough to yank somebody out of their camp.
Everybody sees what algorithms show them. I think most of the people that are big Elon Musk fans are probably on the side of Trump and all that already. Yeah, I voted for Biden, you know, in 2020. I did.
I want change. You know, I know when Trump was in office, I saw more money on my paycheck. I was definitely a bit of a Trump hater, I guess. So 2020, you weren't a Trump guy?
I have now, now. I think I was more on down the middle. Didn't really care about it. I felt everything's just too crazy.
I don't want to get involved. And this is, I guess, is the most involved. I'm getting I haven't gotten any other rallies and I probably won't. So you haven't been to any other political event?
No, no. And you eat it. This might be the very last election. That's a real election.
And some of these town halls, Musk has just been repeating election conspiracy theories. Statistically, there's some very strange things that happen. I'm big in a science side. Do I T for living?
So I'm here. See you on here. But not every Musk superfan is a Trump voter. Don Bico is a Pennsylvania State Government employee.
My P for Elon is a lot of the way he likes to break conventions. Working in government for as long as I like to sometimes smash the silos and just break everything down and build everything back up again. I had voted for Trump in the past. I traditionally vote Republican.
I don't think I'm going to vote for Republican this time. You don't think Musk is going to change your mind? I mean, it's gonna strike me as possible. Don says Musk's debunks conspiracy theories are dangerous.
I think probably Elon's problem is he's so down the rabbit hole what he isn't in X now that it's really hard to know what's right wrong. I won Town Hall and most brought up Dominion Bogey Machines, a frequent subject of conspiracy theories. It might be we should only do paper ballots hand counted. That's it.
Here's the funny thing. Even with Dominion, there's still a paper trail. So you can still hand recount that. I've been working for Save for many years and my father before me.
Like I'm going to be my father before me. He worked for the Save for many years. So I grew up as a state kid and I know how to stay worse a lot of respect. So yeah, it's kind of sad when people like me who are considered like the quote, any within or the deep state were just doing our jobs.
Don't you solve in CNN, Harrisburg, Pennsylvania? Fascinating. Joining us now is former federal prosecutor, Senator legal analyst, Elliot Williams. So is this cash offers this legal?
Anderson, I feel like this was designed in a laboratory by a law professor to step right up to the line and probably over it. Look, it's unlawful to make it more designed by some very smart tech guys. Whoever it was, but it steps right over the line. Now, it's unlawful to make a payment or expenditure to induce someone to vote or to induce someone to register to vote.
Now, what they're doing is adding in this other thing of a petition, the Second Amendment, which blurries it and muddies it a little bit. You have to be a registered voter to sign the petition. And if they simply just lifted the registered voter rule out of there, be perfectly fine because you just be asking people to sign the Second Amendment First Amendment petition. But what they're doing is in effect inducing people to think about it.
It's only happening in swing states. One of them expired at midnight the night of the Pennsylvania registration deadline. You can't keep a straight face and say that the goal here is not to encourage people to vote a certain way. Would it be likely to actually have a prosecutor or someone to send a cease and desist letter or what they do is just simply open an investigation and start requesting documents, start requesting information?
And you can probably, in most cases, if this were a normal world, get the person to change the thing they're doing or just stop doing it now. This is not a normal world, so it's hard to know what effect they'll have. And obviously, you know, Musk has been spreading misinformation about the Dominion Voting System on social media. Could he be opening himself up to litigation like Fox?
Yes, we've been to this party before. Dominion will sue you for defamation and you can lose. Fox will lost $787 million. You say things were demonstrably not true.
It's not true. And that's the standard for defamation. If you say something that's not true, no to be true. And it hurts someone's reputation or business interest.
You can lose. In the one-way-one-way-one-place-where you're saying there were Dominion voting machines that were not Dominion voting machines. These are lies, Anderson. Dominion voting machines, I did a six-minute speech on this.
There are paper ballots. It's, yeah, there's paper ballots. They're literally paper ballots, so it's, you know, the law is quite clear on this and what the standard is what you get in trouble for. I don't know what to tell you other than...
He's got a legal team that he's got a legal team for the legal defense. He's got a legal team. He's got a legal team. He's got a legal team.
He's got a legal team. He's got a legal team. He can pay for the legal defense. He actually can't pay some, I just think, $7 million.
But he probably goes. Thanks very much. That's it for us. The news continues.
I hope you join us tomorrow and for the Town Hall of Kamala Harris. On Wednesday from Pennsylvania, the source of Kaylen Collins starts now. From the descendants of history makers involved in the Louisiana purchase to the Lewis and Clark expedition, discover the untold stories of American expansion in the CNN original series, This Land, premiering June 7 on CNN. Hey, I'm Anderson Cooper.
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