#218 Why $20M Doesn’t Mean You’ve Made It

In this episode of Owned and Operated, John and Jack unpack what leadership looks like inside a $20–40 million home service business—and why that size still feels small. They explore how companies in this range often remain personality-driven, even with impressive revenue, and what it really takes to level up. From forming HR and marketing departments to structuring a true senior leadership team, they dig into the growing pains and leadership gaps most businesses face on the way to maturity.The conversation dives deep into leadership development, internal promotions, and when to hire key external roles like controllers. John and Jack share why the sophistication of a business doesn’t always match the revenue—and how building the right team early creates long-term stability and growth. If you're scaling past $10 million and thinking about what’s next, this episode lays out a real-world playbook for building a well-rounded, leadership-driven operation.🔹 In This Episode, We Cover: What leadership looks like at $20–40M in revenue Why revenue doesn’t always equal business sophistication The challenges of building a senior leadership team Promoting internally vs. hiring externally When to build HR, marketing, and finance departments How leadership development programs drive retention and growth Creating a stable, mature business beyond personality-driven leadership🌐 More resources💼 Shoutout to Quick Staffers LLC Need trained HVAC & plumbing CSRs at a fraction of the cost? Quick Staffers LLC specializes in placing top-tier global talent with the best SOPs and scripts. 🔥 Get $1,000 off your first placement here 👤 Hosted by:John Wilson Jack Carr Send Us Mail!More Ways To Connect with O&OJohn's Podcast YouTube ChannelOwned and Operated Newsletter Bonus Videos From JohnLeave a ReviewJohn Wilson, CEO of Wilson CompaniesJack Carr, CEO of Rapid HVAC📌 Disclaimer: Some links may include UTM parameters or affiliate relationships, meaning we may earn a commission if you make a purchase. Episodes may feature sponsors, but all opinions expressed are our own.