Welcome to Career Crashers, where we tell the stories of those who are not content to wait around following rules and hoping for good things to happen. Their careers aren't found, they're forged. It's time to crash the party. All right, on this episode of Career Crashers, keeping with the theme of sort of the early season two episodes of talking with people who work here at Crash on the team because they all have great stories, today I'm joined by Morgan Van Gunten, who, did I even get Van Gunten, is that the right pronunciation?
No, it's Von Gunten. Oh, that's it. Obviously there's an L. It's a, yeah, it's okay.
Well, I usually just call you MVG. Here we go, that works. No worries. So MVG here works on our marketing team and she's absolutely awesome and completely embodies sort of the approach that we're trying to help people with in terms of crashing their careers.
So let's just start right off with how did you get the job at Crash? That is a great question. So yeah, I was kind of on the hunt for an enjoyable job at a startup. Didn't really know what I wanted to do, but I just saw an email with this job opening really late one night and they were like, hey, this guy called Isaac Morehouse is interested in you for a content creator role and you need to send him a pitch really, really fast.
It just needs to be one page. And so I saw that and I didn't know what a community manager did, didn't know what type of content the role would be doing or creating. So I just kind of Googled and I was like, all right, I'm just going to do this. And basically made this one page document for you guys and was like, hey, here are some like basic tasks I could do in my first six months.
Here are some like really basic strategies. I had no idea if they would work. Just kind of jumped in and did it and wrote that up like within an hour. But it was super late.
And I was like, okay, I'm just going to wait. I'm going to sleep on this. And, you know, because I'm a little bit of a perfectionist. And so just kind of waited.
And then the next morning just sent it off. I was like, hey, here's my pitch. You can learn more about me. Sent you links to my website, different projects I had done.
And then, yeah, Mitchell, who was the marketing director at the time, saw that, responded really fast. He's like, hey, let's set up an interview. And he's like, well, it was a Friday. And he's like, well, we can meet this afternoon or we can meet on Monday.
I was like, I really like this job. So I'm going to let's do it today. So that was a Friday. So we interviewed.
Honestly, I don't think it went that well. And Mitchell and I talked for like 30 minutes. But it was, I mean, it was an interview. And interviews are always kind of tricky.
But so my thought was like, oh, I don't think this went so well. I don't think I'm going to get this. So over the weekend, Mitchell was like, hey, I'll reach out to you by Tuesday. You'll find out what we're going to do and what next.
I was like, okay, over the weekend. And over the weekend, Crash, at the time of the previous season of Career Crashers, had been out. And there was this one episode about this one girl who really wanted to get this job. And so she sent a burrito to a startup CEO.
And so I was like, okay, what can you do? Mitchell really likes books. So I started like, you know, I looked at his book. He was like, what books has he read?
What books hasn't he read? So I tried to figure out like what I could send him to get noticed. And it was just super fast on emails. And then that Tuesday, he just reached back out.
And he was like, hey, we think you're awesome. We want to hire you. Here's so much we'll pay you. Here's what you're going to do.
When would you like to start? So that's kind of how that happened. So I can fill in a little bit of the decision on our end and why you made it so easy for us to offer you. But before I do that, I want to back up a little bit.
So the reason you got the email saying, hey, you know, Crash is interested in you for this role is because you had joined an apprenticeship program to practice. You had done the boot camp. And now you were in the portion where you were looking for your apprenticeship. And you did this instead of going to college.
Talk about that decision a little bit. When you got to the point where you were ready for the next step in life, what made you choose to go to the startup apprenticeship program instead of going to college or something else? Yeah. So that was a really big slash hard decision.
I had grown up in a very entrepreneurial family. I started writing and knew that I wanted to do something to do something that had to do with writing and entrepreneurship. I didn't want to just be a writer. I wanted to do something in the business world.
But whenever I would talk to people, they were like, you need an English degree. You should just go get an English degree. I was like, OK. So I went and tried to do like I did like four weeks at community college for like a screenwriting class.
And then went and visited different schools. And it didn't really like nothing just fit. It was either too expensive or I was like, I don't know why I need a degree. Like that doesn't seem like that's if I can already do the job.
Like why am I going to go learn about it for four years? And so I found out about practice. I actually read one of your blog posts all about how you can, like what would happen if we taught careers the way that we teach kids how to ride a bike. I was like, oh, this really makes sense.
So I applied. But when I applied, I thought it was a different practice because I just like visited with some other company that was also about practice. And so my application, I was like, oh, yeah, I met your CEO. He's awesome.
But it wasn't like it wasn't you. But I applied. I had no idea what I was getting into. But as I went through the application process, I really realized I was like, this is so cool because I wanted something that was craft specific.
I didn't want to just learn the head knowledge. I didn't want to have a head full of ideas on how to think. I wanted to be like equipped with the tools. But also it would be very practical.
I wanted to learn by doing that was something that practice just kept repeating. So that after I went through the application process, and they were like, hey, we'd like to have you come do this program. That was really just the moment. I was like, this is the path that I want to go down.
So when we decided at Crash, hey, we need an assistant. We need somebody here to help out with doing social media content, just kind of a hodgepodge of marketing-related tasks or a community manager. We had like a virtual waiting room for people waiting to get on the platform at the time. Mitchell and I, we're this early-stage startup.
We're trying to be as scrappy and frugal as possible. And so we knew we wanted to bring on somebody, one, that would be kind of short-term, like six months, so that in case it didn't work out or whatever, it wouldn't be a huge deal. And two, it wasn't very expensive. And so the apprentices through Praxis started like $15 an hour for the six-month apprenticeship.
And they know that they're going for kind of like a six-month stint to kind of prove themselves and maybe earn a full-time spot. And so that was very good to us. And so I went and looked at all of the different people who were currently in the program that were available to Apprentice. And there were half a dozen that were really interesting to Mitchell and I.
And you were on the list, but you were not the number one on the list. And I don't say that as an instant. No, I know it. Like, okay, there's nothing about you that's bad.
You look good. But there's a few people that stood out more. And so we kind of put out the invitation to everybody that looks sort of interesting. Hey, you know, I think I just told somebody over there at Praxis, let all these people that I would love to see apply for this and have them send me a pitch.
And I don't even think we defined it very much. Maybe it was what you would do on the job or something. And what made it really easy, a couple of things to say yes to you. First, I sent that email probably in the afternoon.
And the next morning, you had already sent us a pitch. And the next person, I think somebody later that evening did. And then the other four or five trickled in over the next few days. And at that point, no matter how good those other people were, they were competing against you now.
You already had more points in our book than anybody else. You were so fast on it. And as a company, people forget this applying. Like, you want to be wanted.
You want people to be excited. And so if you say, hey, here's a job opportunity, and you know someone has seen it, every hour that passes after that makes you feel like they're less and less interested. And then it's just hard. Like, even if they send you a great pitch four days later, you're like, well, why did it take so long?
Did you not want this job? Were you waiting to see other things? Were you making stitches for other companies? Exactly.
Yeah. And like, the reality is people are looking for other companies. But something about that etherness, like, you were so quick. Like, Mitchell and I were both like, whoa.
I really wanted the job. Yeah, it was really awesome. And I want to ask you about when you saw the opportunity, you said you didn't even know exactly what the job title meant. What made you have the confidence to give it a shot anyway?
You said you went and Googled it to, like, look up what you should even put in a plan for what you would do. Yeah, that is a good question. I think since, so going through practice, we had made a lot of content. So we blogged for 30 days.
And I, like, tweeted a little bit and started a LinkedIn account. And, you know, knew a little bit about making videos, making graphics, and had, like, previously made some, like, different website designs or whatever. So I saw a content creator. I was like, okay, I can do that.
But, like, the community manager part, I was like, I have no idea what this is. And, like, honestly, there were a bunch of blog posts, and they didn't really explain it either. So I just decided, hey, I like the company. I didn't really know what the company was doing, because it was just a website.
It was a blog. It was a cool blog post. And there was a podcast. I, like, got in the first email, and I sent it to be on a waiting list, but there wasn't, like, I didn't know what was happening.
But I liked the company enough. And, you know, I had, like, heard about you and, like, what Mitchell was doing. And I was like, okay, this team is doing something. And I had seen, you know, what the practice team was doing.
And you guys, you know, crash and practice are kind of like sister companies in a way. And so I think the excitement for the company and the excitement for the team was enough to make me look at this role that I was like, I don't really have experience for it. I don't really know what I would be doing. But it sounds so much more exciting than a role that's like, oh, I know how to do that.
I know how to do that. But the company isn't very exciting to me. The team isn't very exciting. So I think that really played into me making that decision to be like, I'm just going to make a pitch.
I don't know if it's going to be good, but hopefully the fact that, like, I just want to show how excited I am about this company versus like trying to pull out all this experience. Yeah, that is a great insight that if you find a company or product that's really interesting to you, finding a way to get on board there is almost always better than trying to optimize for the perfect title or role at a company that you don't care as much about. Okay, so I know a little bit about you and from working with you, I know that you are kind of a perfectionist and you want to get things really right. You're not a rough draft type of person that's going to send something half-baked.
So I want to ask, how were you able to overcome that tendency for perfectionism and put together a pitch for a role you really didn't understand that well for a company that was not entirely clear what they were up to yet and turn it around so quickly? Was that a difficult thing for you to overcome mentally? I know a lot of people are sitting on pitches or proposals that are 80% done and they're afraid to send them because they're not perfect. I would say fast is better than perfect.
But how did you deal with that? That is a great question. I know we were talking about this the other day too. Because yes, I can be so much of a perfectness that I will be sitting on things that are like 80% done and I won't send them because I'm like, well, it's not proofread.
Or I just want to add this one more thing. And I think, you know, that kind of played into me choosing to sleep on it before sending. But that was something much faster than my normal process. I'm trying to remember what that was like.
I think just trying, like in that moment, reading this email and be like, okay, I have to get a pitch and they're like, you know, the email is like ASAP. You know, we need this ASAP. And, you know, recently I've been working on shipping projects within a week. And so I knew that like every week I was going to show some part of my work.
But I think what really helped there is just realizing in that moment, I'm just trying to like, in a sense, believe in myself a little bit and realize that it doesn't matter if it's perfect. And I need to, and instead like defining my own perfect for that pitch. And perfect in that sense was something that was one page that I could send out. That was clear.
And so, yeah, that kind of answers your question. Yeah, you saw the urgency and you saw this as an opportunity. So I kind of just was like, you know what, professionalism, I'm not going to listen to you right now and we're just going to do this because it's more important than being perfect. Yeah, I've noticed that perfectionists, they're, what they think stuff that's not good enough yet is almost always good enough for what it needs.
And people who are not perfectionistic, like me, what I think is good enough is often not good enough yet. So whatever you think, it's usually a little bit the opposite. So what would you say to somebody who is ready to kind of get their first career job and they're interested in marketing? It's a very broad thing, but what would you recommend to a young person who's trying to win a job in marketing?
Yeah, the first thing on my mind is I would encourage you to start writing publicly, regardless if you become a social media manager or if you're writing marketing copy or if you're doing emails or if instead you're doing more of like analytics and spreadsheets, the act of writing publicly, whether it's a tweet, whether it's a blog post, whether it's a LinkedIn post, whether it's, you know, a funny Instagram caption or something, you know, putting the words on the page teaches you how to, one, put your ideas or like make your ideas reality. And so you have this concept in your head and you're putting it on paper, but then the act of actually putting that into the world and especially daily is going to really strengthen you. And it's going to build, not only that still being able to communicate an idea and try to promote like a brand, you know, even if that brand in the moment is just yourself, will really set you up in whatever role you do in marketing because you'll be able to write something. It doesn't have to be good writing.
It can just be writing at this point and then be able to actually show it when it's not perfect or ship something daily is so important. Overcoming that fear of like the unknown and fear of like disapproval, but also being able to do what marketers do, which is marketers create things and they put them out into the world. And Morgan practices what she preaches. Not only does she make a lot of content in her day job here at Crash, but she's got a newsletter where she's putting out stuff weekly.
She's working on a novel and she'll share pieces of that from time to time. So it's not just words. Morgan, thank you so much for coming on and telling your story. I know you are very early in your career and you have a lot more.
You'll have so many more stories later, but I think it's a great example. I mean, I just, the speed alone, I tell people all the time, if you are really, really quick to jump on an opportunity, if you're one of the first, those first two or three, four people in the inbox get more attention than everybody that comes after. And so that just gives you a huge advantage. I think you're a great, a great example of that.
So thanks so much, Morgan. Yeah, thanks so much for having me. It was fun. Yep.
Like what you hear? Go to Crash.co and join the career revolution. If you want to share your own career crash story, send it directly to me at Isaac at Crash.co.