#2510 - Devon Larratt

The Joe Rogan experience So happy to see you. Wow. Thank you so much for your like you know you are the loudspeaker of the planet man And I'm so honored to be here. That's a very uncomfortable position to be in Yeah, I bet I bet but look it I mean you talked to everybody in the planet and I think I'm honored to be your first arm wrestler Well, if I'm gonna have an arm wrestle it has to be the coach.

Oh highly debated highly debated, but I'll take here in the conversation Yeah, I mean there's a couple of us. I think John Bresink. I don't know how close do you follow arm wrestling very little yeah, I follow you well most vastly by the fact You can't extend your arm Yeah, yeah is ours don't straight now. No, they don't unfortunately.

That's crazy. Yeah, it didn't work when I was trying to fight Thor either I kind of limited the extension, but when did that start happening? So I was I got into club arm wrestling like I'm wrestling with my when I was a kid But I got in a club arm wrestling around like 18 by time I was 20 or so we have this champion called crazy George Okay, he's like a very old very decorated champion and he famously at the time for me He couldn't straighten his elbows and I was like oh man. I can't wait for my elbows straight Silly wish right so it started early like I think I was like probably like in my late 20s And it just the range started to shrink how what is that from it's just pressure mostly like just the constant pressure on the elbow joint Causes you know osteophytes potentially like it doesn't happen all the arm wrestlers.

Have you got an MRI? I've had three surgeries to straighten them out to remove bone and scar tissue just chip bones and stuff chip bones Dr. Pollock bless his soul at the Ottawa Hospital has extended my career till till this age, you know Yeah, it can that's probably one of the worst chronic conditions arm wrestlers get is you know if the bone girls gets bad enough It can start to constrict your nerves or blood flow and that's when it becomes a problem has that happened? Yeah 100% Yeah, so I was what I was probably it was like 2013 so like 13 years ago was when I had my first surgery And at that point like trying to move forward trying to move forward and put it out as far as you can go That's it.

That's it buddy. That's it. Yeah left is a little more than the right Probably a little bit. Yeah, and I've had two surgeries on the right one on the left But in my mind, you know, it's a small price to pay You know like I'm I'm as all in in arm wrestling as you can possibly be and this is our cost of admission for some of us Mm-hmm, you know and this doesn't happen to every armrest?

No, no, no. There's lots of arm wrestlers. It's it's a style thing It's a genetic predisposition. It's I rolled the dice wrong one day and had a bad match You know, I think what happens is it's really it's the pressure It's the bones over time if you're and then it's if you're a dummy and you know keep on doing it when you should probably rest That probably doesn't help and I'm guilty, you know, so like most of the greats Anyways, I'm everything it doesn't affect me in the sport.

I actually I call it weaponized arthritis Because there are ways you can kind of make your loss of range work for you at times really yeah because there's like right You know like if you're doing an armbar, okay Like your body resists with the ligaments and the tendons Mm-hmm, so that starts higher for me and I think that there's a muscular strength component that kicks in as well right at the end of the Range to protect you so I just have a higher You know arm bar, you know does it help you in arm bars as well? Oh, no, it doesn't. I'm good. You did to guys still gonna He's still gonna arm bar me.

It's also the bones would just now. Yeah, it's gonna snap higher. Yeah, it's not been bad places Yeah, did you ever try hanging from like a chin up bar to straighten it out? I've tried a lot of things.

I saw a video with you in juju Mufu. Yeah, that's what he says name. Yeah juju juju Mufu. Yeah juju Mufu Okay, John call.

Yeah, he's great. He's great He's such character, but they were rolling they were trying to like do some stuff with like these big metal bars Yeah, you know, and you were in fucking agony. Yeah, I was like that is crazy to watch like you really can't straighten your arm when they were trying You were screaming. Yeah, yeah, it's terrible.

I I've kind of just accepted it. Did you ever try to hang? I've tried so many things but I When I was young when I was 20 I was wishing for the day that I could be like crazy George We are so it's interesting, you know Like I'm not if I was like all about straightening my arm I could probably still do it because the bone is actually removed now. It's a sheath There's like a capsule that surrounds a joint that is probably the root cause of it.

What is the capsule name of? I believe it's was a fascia just connective structure. I think it encapsulates the joint So everything is just sort of condensed to hold the joint together. I think so.

Yeah Yeah, it's kind of a unique study if you were like a physiologist you're studying human anatomy You would say okay, like what is possible? Yeah, you know like you know about David Goggins's knees I know David Goggins. I don't know about his knees His knees are so great. He's bone on bone with both knees and he went to the doctor said I don't know how you can walk with these knees forget about run thousands of miles So his knees had the it's what is it called?

Jamie? It's like wolf something it's like there's a condition when you're bone on bone for so long where the bone actually spreads out and The doctor said I heard about this in theory. I've never seen an actual human being where his knee the bone had grown out So weird that his knees were moving at like odd angles So they had a saw his tibia and moved his knee down So he's still bone on bone But now he has a flat surface and so they cut it and then screwed it into place And then he just wrote a stationary bike for like fucking five months like a maniac and then started running again bone on bone Beautiful love it. It's crazy.

He's wild. See if you can see if you can find what the condition is it's called wolf's law Biological principle stating that bones adapting growth thicker and denser physical stress. I think that yeah Yeah, and his grew thicker and like kind of mushroomed out at the top of the knee because there's nothing there There's no and it's just bang bang bang bang bang bang. So it just kept growing out and if you see do we have the images of the surgery?

I know I sent it to you a long-ass time. Yeah, I mean it's showing a bunch of pictures from when he was on here So see that where he the fingerprints on his shin That's because he had so much edema on his leg that he could squeeze it and put his that's after the surgery Awesome. Yeah, but look at the actual yeah, look at that the photo of what the knee looks like that's on him Where's that's the image of what it looks like? Okay, so they saw it and then they screw it down in place They saw it slightly like a wedge off a piece of wood you lower it level it out and then screw it in place This episode is brought to you by square space if you're thinking about building a website you should try square space I know because I use it.

That's right Joe Rogan calm is powered by square space It has all the features that you need to create a stand-out website like an AI enhanced website builder SEO optimization tools and seamless Checkouts with mobile pay links head to square space calm Slash Rogan for a free trial and when you are ready to launch use the offer code Rogan to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or Domain this episode is brought to you by uber eats hockey seasons here and uber eats is delivering game-day deals on Favorites like wings pizza fries and snacks and you can order more than food like gear to rep your team or fresh batteries for the remote When your watch party gets hungry or you just need anything Order in and keep everyone's attention on the ice score great deals on uber eats all season long because hockey is for the hungry Terms apply product availability varies by region see app for details. Yeah for sure. I have something similar I've been bone on bone for probably two decades really. Yeah, I was gone nothing So when I went in got my surgery doctor told me I have no like there's nothing there but bone He said down in maybe we can extend maybe we can give you another couple years on your on your career.

Maybe how long ago to say this? That was like 15 years ago I'm probably no kidding. I probably pulled off my best show ever six weeks ago So really how old are you 51? It's amazing and and I have another shot at the world title.

I'm still number one in divisions So, you know, I'm lucky but I think it's all it's the doctors will say something, but it's just not true You can you can do anything. Well, Goggins is a perfect example that and I guess over you It's like the idea that you can't do something is based on when most people quit Yeah Pain is a interesting thing to try and master, you know It's it's information and you have to be able to live with it and work with it, but it's it's good It's good to have this pain because it's kind of a guide on where you need to get better You know the tendons and the tenderness structures of the elbow are super super taxed in arm wrestling and the process of rehabilitation and development of these structures Under great duress and trauma is difficult and it requires a lot of time and monotony Which a lot of people aren't willing to put in I'm shocked at how much time grip training takes Yeah, it takes forever I've been trying to jack my my those grip strength things the strongest ever got to is 164 and I'm like I want to get to 200 I feel like in my lifetime I can get to 200. I can't get past 164 and the thing is like I keep lifting weights with my arms I keep and I've always tired so like every time I squeeze that thing My hands are always sore so I'm like shit I gotta take some time off to see if I can get it stronger And so I'm doing all these wrist curls and I've got the forearm finisher from golden grip Yeah, and I've got these big fat things that I use were for cables to rotate wrist and my hands got bigger I'm definitely stronger, but it's like I don't know when to lay off of it and when to put how many days a week do you do grip training? What's your guess every day?

Of course every day and is that the way to do it? Is that the smart way to do it? I know you talked a lot of those rock climber guys. They have the craziest grip strength One of the things that I'll just say right away is a lot of people associate grip with arm wrestling and 100% It's a massive importance But the real technical nuance of the sport is to try and make the other person hold on to you Mmm, right so it's not necessary grip is more like defense and added offense But the first step is to try and tax the other person's grip, but how do you do that?

I think that everything there's we are opening up like technical arm wrestling, okay Open it up. Yeah, okay So I think in from my position the opening move in arm wrestling is a concept called rising like you know the movie over the top Mm-hmm This is the opening step of the sport and what it is basically an attempt to get a better grip and if I can the concept of making the other opponent hold on to you That's the first step in technical supremacy Okay, if you can make the other person along you if you can touch their fingers if you can get their fingers activated and they're holding on to you That's their they're less efficient. Yeah, so it's about attacking weakness more than it is about going where you're strong So they're the most efficient when it's pommed upon and everything's gripped nice and tight as soon as you get like out here You want the pressure? Interaction to be unfair to your advantage right right like if we were to arm wrestle you would want to put the pressure in my fingertips Like it's like almost like a hammer type motion, right?

So you're basically it's almost like a curl It's it's more complicated But that's like the first way to start to think about it like people think about arm wrestling to think about pinning each other Right and this is this is a very short-sighted way to think about the sport You think about pulling the match close to you this concept of rising is this upwards Spinning slipping motion where the end result is you have a better grip and anything that they try and do it's gonna Go through the weakest system. They have which is their fingertips. Yeah, so it is great to have an awesome grip really I So like proportionally in my workload if I was doing 21 sets 21 or I think I do 21 working sets typically in my workouts One of them is dedicated purely to grip every day all day all day. So you just do them throughout the day I Lead a very simple life at the moment.

So structure like how do you do it? My structure right now And I think that I'm probably one of the most dedicated armrestors in the world in time in terms of like what I do with my life And how much energy I give the sport is I base it off of a week. Okay, so I train with the club probably twice a week That's changes but typically I'm going twice a week and these are my hardest days And I go in there and I just completely redline and max out in the sport. Okay, all the exactly what I got to do I'm doing it my highest highest capacity.

I have my family where all my friends are selling my kid And he's a pro too. Yeah, he's competing this weekend. That's crazy So we like we have our own thing where we'll hit a hit a mat like we'll train together But really two hard sessions a week and then whatever I've been in with my kids And then the rest of the days are like mindless not just the monotony levels extreme my wife and I I'm retired, right? So I have nothing but time and I try to make I just try and put everything into it So like it's all day.

It's all day. I wake up and I'm training like all day So these machines like this is some of the shit that you have Yeah, is this a machine that's specifically designed for arm wrestling? Did this exist or did you go? Did you help create this?

This actually machine is handed down from me from the best female arm wrestler ever to exist Leanne de Frank Johnny Robins, so this is like a very standard arm wrestling equipment It's basically an arm wrestling table with a cable system and this is super old. Okay, this this table you're looking out here That's like 40 year old table and it's still working But yeah, you can buy a police system on a table and that's really like this is basically all I do I work on off of a table different angles different pressures that all just replicate the pressures and arm wrestling So you have a fat grip looks like a PVC tube and then you're using that to work your fingertips and roll your wrists And just get to be really strong at that position where you turn in someone's wrist over We call that a multi-spinner and what's interesting about it is you see it's a single point attachment Mm-hmm, so it's a little bit like Swiss ball for the wrist So it's it's our small you know like a Swiss ball like people do like squats on them like the ball in the gym People do like like a Bosey ball. So it's mostly like a half right? Oh, that was like this ball is like just a big round balls it Okay, yeah, and you see people yoga ball.

Yeah, they call them right you ever jumped on a Swiss ball and unsquatch or anything No, okay. Well, I have the half one. Yeah, yeah Swiss ball is way more unstable So it's a similar concept where it's it's very unstable through the wrist and there's different wraps But there's like a few bass moves and arm wrestling probably top rolling Hooking and pressing and you just do shit like this all day all day and this is in my tape, okay? I know it's crazy.

That's the hardest part. This is in your what room? This is in my basement. Oh, you're based.

Yeah, and what you see here This was actually my final workout before I pulled the Russian champion of Italian 11 like six seven weeks ago So I've tapered normally all these movements you see I'm doing like a hundred repetitions So lots of blood flow and when you're doing a hundred repetitions like what 50% max? No, what do you wait nothing like 20 pounds? I'm like yeah, really is that the key? I'm a bit I experiment a lot.

Okay. I've done so many different systems But this is what I've come up with that I think is best So I basically it all revolves around these arm wrestling practice days where it's hundred percent This is what I want my body to to maximize about but the off days the Tuesday the Wednesday the it's all day Just doing blood flow just increasing the amount of blood that flows through the fascia flows through these chains in arm wrestling motions And the hundred is all I'm trying to do is increase my circulation Especially through my connective structures and movement is so essential Why that over why is that more beneficial than like hard strength training like small reps like low numbers of rest but highway? So super debatable, okay, and I've done all of it What I found is in my opinion You only have so much energy and this is something we got it really weigh in because if I could just smash You know heavy stuff all time and take steps forward I do it But I found that you don't want to detract from the thing you're really really trying to do so anything that takes away from your Ability to do that I think you should look at cutting the best part of my training is on the table So anything that kind of messes with that I don't want to do it I've done a lot of systems where I'm lifting heavy But the thing is is they take energy they take resources and what I really want to do is prepare my body So I can do that specific task as good as possible The the high rep training heals me it heals me a lot of people are like oh that's a lot of work And I'm like it's really not it's just it's a form of healing almost. Yeah, interesting Yeah, just the blood flow and the consistent movement and high repetitions.

Yes It's this is highly debated, okay, but I'm proving it over and over over the years I started doing because I'm messing the strength sport no doubt about it So right away people think oh, you know heavy weight and you know high reps is dangerous because you're gonna become an endurance guy And it's it's gonna make you weaker But when you go low your your work volume is tremendous Okay, if you're doing light light weight all day long I mean the amount of total weight that you're lifting becomes astronomical And I think that that adaptation over long periods is wonderful and you can't get the blood flow through the connective structures without movement So this is this is really why I do it the healing aspects the overall metabolic conditioning that you get Yeah, and the taper is a big part of it as well, you know But yeah, I'm doing all my heavy lifting specifically in the sport I'm not I'm not doing my heavy lifting at this time in my career and also John 51 and I'm plagued with injuries So I have to be very specific. I'd be very precise. Yeah, this is the best formula I've come up with and when you were younger Did you approach it differently? I have made so many mistakes.

What was the initial approach? Just lift as heavy as you can. Yeah lift as heavy as I can. We're giant dude already, right?

So you already naturally have like big bones big genetics. So did you power lift like what did you do initially? I was a judo guy. I was a basketball guy I was a military guy.

So I did a lot of different stuff. I was very cross-strain. I even I even did Ironman for a bit But it's gonna be so hard for you. Yeah, it's all that weight.

Uh, yeah, so I would when I say Ironman apologies not traditional military Ironman So what's the difference? A military Ironman you're doing it with a backpack you're portaging a canoe you're paddling you're running with a backpack So that race, you know a winning time is you know, probably anything under six hours like five and a half to six hours So it's long duration, but it's slightly heavier. So I'm still big even for that like most champions Most guys who win the Ironman are you know average size or even smaller, but uh, yeah, this side I mean I'm a bigger person But yeah, I did a lot of different sports, but I've always loved our wrestling. It's always been the one I've come back to it's you know What is it about it?

I think that there's a lot of things about it You know for me personally it was my first sport like I started on wrestling with my grandmother when I was like four years old Was it grandmother? Yeah, really never underestimate the power of a grandmother Yeah, yeah, um, I was a rowdy little kid and you know in a in a with a German mother who didn't let me do too much crazy stuff around the house And my grandmother used to come over and it was a reward system. She told me to do chores and the result was I got to arm wrestle with her Yeah, I never beat her. That's crazy.

I never beat her It's it's funny. Um her name was levon Um, and the current super heavyweight world champion is levon. I saw I've never beat either of them Yeah, it's been a bit trippy. Uh Yeah, so I started I started young um, I I love arm wrestling because it's uh, it's a very safe fight Okay, like I I love fighting everything in my life has been about fighting and um arm wrestling is one of those fight sports that has super low Cost like we don't punch each other in the head.

I'll be able to walk Nothing on my spine My elbows don't straighten, you know, so it's low cost you can do it your whole life like we have we've had world champions in the open division Who are almost 70 what yeah? What that's cool, right? That's incredible. I love it.

How's that possible? Yeah, the hand is weird Like this thing here is designed for volume and it just slowly builds You know the hand is the structure has so much connective tissues in it so much tendon And that's just it takes so long to build you know age is an advantage in a lot of ways because you just have more time to get further in arm wrestling Yeah, I'm 51. I'm telling you I probably competed at the highest level and I believe I can still go further It's non-typical, you know, it's non-typical and the thing that I love most about it The very most is is the family and the bonds armrest and clubs are special places Uh, it's very blue collar. It's open doors, man There's there's not a lot of money associated with the sport in terms of membership fees I mean, yeah, I'm just letting each other's garages and houses and um and it breeds a very tight family Like I consider the club that I train with like they're my family like so, um, that's my I mean That's what sports all about, you know, yeah, yeah, and arm wrestling is very conducive to that So when you say it's non-typical that you could compete at this level at this age what what how old are like most of the top guys?

I'd say that you hit your probably peak typically when you are low 30s. So very standard, you know, that's my buddy pork chop Oh, there's crazy George. This is the guy. Okay.

So this guy one's crazy dude who's down there Uh, not the guy in the green shirt. So these are both my good buddy. This is the guy who can't straighten his arms on Uh, he can't though. He's super locked up.

Okay, but so he's doing this move called a king's move or outside top rule And you see pork chops wrist has bent back. I love porky. I train with porky twice a week Um, but yeah crazy George and crazy George is like 160 pounds and porky. Yeah, and porky's like 230 completely tremendously jacked and strong Yeah, and pork chop is like a professional arm wrestler pulling at east versus west.

Okay. That's our highest league and crazy George is Yeah, he's that's incredible. Yeah, it's completely incredible. Um, yeah As another guy from our club matt smith against crazy George.

I think matt actually may have beaten him here This is actually the time period of crazy Georgia downfall. Okay, so how old is crazy George in this film? He probably late 60s here. Okay.

Wow. Yeah He's an absolute legend to me in sport like technically so this guy He spent the first like 20 years in the sport two up two down. Okay. Go to tournament double elimination He's and that's the Canadian champ.

These guys are all champions that you see him arm wrestling with And he invented basically even invented but there were very few people doing this style of arm wrestling Okay, we call it an outside top role or kings move and he really figured it out and Very difficult very difficult to deal with and what is he doing? He's dropping down and lowering his body weight Yeah, so there's many kind of main strengths in arm wrestling. Okay, there's Rising strength. There's pronational strength.

There's cupping strength and this pronational. Let's see this like this is like my favorite example Jesus Christ. Look at that thing. That's so weird.

Yeah show that show that Who the fuck has that? Right so that Right so mine is non-existent. I was gonna interrupt. I saw it on the thumb down.

I was gonna say what That's fucking crazy It's one of my dreams to have bodybuilders when they're you know i've BB just to be doing pronator poses one day one day It's the one you got it first turn your thumb down And pop your wrist back there it is see it There you go Yeah So like different styles in arm wrestling. Okay, like they have different roots, okay And the kings move top rolling in general outside top rolling is super dependent on pronation Twisting it It's it's weaponized right we get really strong and and there's a relationship between all the angles in the hand is very complex Right all sorts of stuff it can do and The main two drivers is cupping we call it flexion and pronation and these two interact So when one pronates it attacks the other one's cup So there's a relationship between them. So crazy George is like the master of Pronational styles kings move is pronation style. I over the course of my career change techniques change techniques Probably my best technique is an open top role or kings move down Yeah, and I learned a lot it's like the guy that one of my first coaches got called Troy Eaton He he can never be George.

He couldn't be George. We tried we tried we tried for years to figure him out So and that was back when I was like 20 right so I've been I've been studying this now for 30 years And yeah, it's it's a combination of locks and giveaways and balancing arm wrestling things happen really quickly very very quickly But it's a balancing act of all these different strengths So what is it about you that's able to keep competing at a very high level into your 50s? I think is it this approach where you're just doing all these reps all day long Do you think that's a big part of it huge huge part of it because you're constantly forcing your muscles to work You're constantly getting blood flow and you're not losing any strength. Yeah as you get older.

It's a huge part of it Yeah, the my work volume probably exceeds most people in the sport with that So metabolically and from a health perspective it keeps my tendons and ligaments really functional And you know, I'm just I'm just a very simple and obsessed person and just I arm wrestle at every opportunity Don't you also have some very freaky genetics? Oh, didn't Ryan? Yeah, yeah, what is his last name? Rossner.

He's this guy's the best very interesting guy Smartest person I know geneticist and he was explaining to me how unusual your genes are We all have unusual genes. Yeah, but you have really unusual genes Well That's that topic is so big, you know the genetic piece I think that what a massive piece going forward for our species, you know, the mastery of genetics It's right at the top. I think of our highest priorities You know, there was a thing that they were talking about last night in the green room See if you could find this they think they might have figured out a way to end Down syndrome They think they might have figured out a way with genetic engineering with CRISPR or whatever they're using whatever modalities they're using To end Down syndrome, which is why I think that there's so many answers with genetics, you know from I personally believe that and you know, this is a big topic with freedom and everything like that But I really believe that when you're born you should be swabbed and it should accompany your health, you know card or whatever and just as a information You know, there's so much well probably will be in the future as these all these techniques and all this new stuff comes out CRISPR takes a bold leap towards silencing Down syndrome's extra chromosome Wow, so scientists have taken important step towards a gene therapy that could one day turn off the genetic material that causes Down syndrome Down syndrome is a genetic condition caused by an extra chromosome 21 and consequently hundreds of triplicate genes that lead to developmental and neurological issues According to Washington based National Down syndrome Society one in every 640 babies in the United States is born with Down syndrome that makes the most common chromosomal condition So there so was it doing here? Okay, so Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center and Harvard Medical School found a way to silence much of the extra chromosomes activity in the cell at once Details with the research are published in a paper in the journal proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

Wow So what is weird about your genes though Ryan told me that I don't remember he goes you gotta talk to him Well Ryan's actually got to talk to I mean, I'm a high school educated guy and I I've been down to Austin several times to hang out with Ryan. I absorb everything I can from this guy but I think that my genetics I think I'm predisposed to Endurance actually endurance. I think so. I think if you take an overall look at my genetics I think I have a lot of you know favorable mutations that are you know predisposed me to To good, but it's weird.

I don't know man. Listen to the genetic side of things I'll say on silly if I try and talk too much about it I'll just tell you that there are there are favorable genetics for sure, you know, there's favorable mutations and It's amazing, you know, if you could capture all of them from everybody and You know put it together and you never know what you get branchaw. We've scanned brian That's the thing. So this this this project that ryan is doing and I like to help him out a little bit uh, we've been um, we've been looking at elite performers and with the with a goal to find favorable mutations and yeah, we scanned brian He's a rival.

Yeah, that guy's naive. He's like, you know, david and goliath. Yeah, that's they're real people out there like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, brine So his genetics are one out of every 500 million people.

Isn't that something crazy along those lines? Yeah, he's he's completely a And he's he's right at the peak of human performance right from a genetic standpoint just freakish free density Yeah, everything and it's not just his bone density that dudes mindset like there's many pieces of brine's genetics that make him a champion But yeah, he has some stuff in him that that that ryan's never seen Yeah, no nobody nobody had and I probably shouldn't be speaking about other people's medical stuff But I love brian and he can sue me if he wants, uh, nobody has his uh, girl hormone He has a different type of growth hormone. What do you mean? I don't think it's the same what I don't think he has a We're opening something so cool because you talked about the the down syndrome and there's some very interesting stuff with that but uh, um, yeah brian I don't believe that uh brian's growth hormone is the same as yours and mine What does that mean?

It might be molecularly different or it might have uh, you're gonna have to talk to ryan But it's growth hormone is difficult. He has a kind of growth hormone. He has a mutation in his growth hormone Well, that makes sense. Yeah, it does.

I mean, he's almost seven feet tall and he's four hundred pounds Yeah, and he doesn't stop It doesn't stop but it's weird the whole like down syndrome thing they can do stopcoats like some genes like some mutations that you get From what I understand there's like a stopcode on a gene So whatever your gene is uh when the I guess mr I lands on it and starts to do its thing like there can be a stopcode or something that just stops that gene from expressing And I think that that's likely what they do with that They somehow insert a stopcode But I mean there's people out there who have like world records like for things like deadlift That don't have fast twitch muscle according to their genetics. So it's really weird What do you mean they don't have faster like they have a stopcode on their fast twitch genetics? Just natural doesn't make any sense at all. They're just born weird born super weird Yeah, they're capable of being world records on the deadlift.

So when you think that deadlift is a fast twitch thing Yeah, so I don't understand I don't either um it's an amazing field genetics is an amazing field Is that a lack of understanding of what fast twitch do or is it they can compensate with the other muscles in some way? I don't think it's other muscles because I think that it would probably apply to all the musculature So there's something that we don't understand. There's something weird going on uh, Eddie you can sue me. Eddie all I love you Uh, Eddie's got a stopcode in his jeans on fast twitch muscle makes no sense.

Well that doesn't make any sense It's no team moves so fast. I know and he hits so fucking hard. That's crazy. It's crazy How's that possible?

I don't see that guy hit mitts. I know right? I know this is what the Hercules no nothing else. No, okay Oh, that's my own statin.

That's my own statin inhibitors. Yeah, so regulates the production of my own statin protein stops I'm also from growing too large. So with my own statin inhibitors, they've done that with I'm sure you've seen those whipets Yes, of course, so whipets are a weird dog It's a very skinny fast dog and some whipets are born with this genetic mutation. It's a milestone inhibitor and they look like the Hulk It's the crate show an image of that please.

It is the craziest That doesn't look like a real dog. That's a bug crazy bodybuilder dog because if you see a regular whip it show me a regular whip it now, please Yeah, regular whip it's that's a yeah, look at the regular whip it like a real fast Like almost like a greyhound looking dog and then you see the ones with the milestone inhibitor gene and you're like what the hell is going on? They look like like the most freakish bodybuilder of all time, but in a dog form and some humans have that Blues also the Belgian cows. Yes.

Yeah, and they have it too. Yeah, so they offer already genetic genetic therapy that gives you full statin So there's a balance between full statin and myostatin from what I understand like the key that turns on the cell for growth is um Is full statin and myostatin tells the cell to stop growing you're big enough right important very important And so if you don't have myostatin all that that that turnkey gets is full of statin So the only thing that you're ever getting with a myostatin deficiency is full statin and so yeah So they offer a genetic therapy that increases your full stat. They offer it to who? Anybody anybody ready to get jacked with enough money Yeah, yeah There's there's a bunch of genetic therapies that they've already created full statin is one of them And so that would be for powerlifters or football players or someone just wanted to get fucking huge I think initially it was created for longevity because as you age your full statin drops and that's why people get smaller They shrink as they get older right and full statin just helps you maintain muscle mass.

Yes, so it's I think it's mostly Promoted as an anti-aging remedy, but absolutely you want to get your performance up. Yeah, they're doing so many wild things now Yeah, I've got this new therapy now for people with disc degeneration I'm sure you have it. I have it a lot of people have it Especially anybody does jujitsu has it your your discs just get worn out from getting cranked on and like heavy lifters always have it lower back issues Your the disc is the soft cushion in between the spinal columns and those those big bones push down that disc and over time and all the compression Squashes, but now they've got stuff that they can inject into the disc that inflates the discs And so all these people that have been getting artificial discs and fusions and all the problems that come with that because there's massive problems They're gonna be able to eliminate that which is amazing super cool. Oh, so super cool If you could avoid back surgery, please avoid back surgery.

Don't fuck it. There's a lot of different like I always tell everybody and I'll tell everybody again Luis Simmons his invention that that invention the reverse hyper Fucking incredible one of the greatest invention ever for people with lower back problems. I have one here in the studio I have one at my house. I fucking swear by that machine It's so good it decompresses the spine on the on the D cell and on the uplift when you're lifting up the weights It strengthens the muscles out.

It's like a perfect exercise for lower back issues. Yeah That's wild when we look at the future in terms of performance and how far the age is being pushed like we see crazy George, but I think I'm optimistic that all the ages are just gonna be pushed and pushed until you probably may not be a champion for your sexy That's crazy. Right. That's crazy.

Well, that's where armless. Well, I went with what's gonna happen with regular sports The stuff that's pushing this stuff is performance enhancing drugs You know peptides stem cells not really that's not really performance That's but for injuries, but testosterone all these different steroids all these different things The thing about like combat sports in particular is that you can't use those things They're not allowed but when you can use them you see these older athletes that have the mind of an older athlete But the body that works like a young guy, right? My favorite example that is v2 or bell four when he was in his prime Trt bell four Yeah, grt v2 was the scariest fucking guy ever. Yeah, because he was jacked up with testosterone He was also 37 years old with a lifetime of combat sport experience a lifetime intelligence But hadn't lost any speed hadn't lost any strength in fact had like superhuman speed and strength because it was Juicy super juicy, but yeah, but it makes you think like man What would the sport look like if that was open to everybody right?

Yeah, interesting it is interesting because there's a lot of guys that want to keep competing But their body just doesn't respond the way it used to to training because they're 37 or 38 or 39 or yeah But if you could get them on the sauce, yeah, right? Where's the limit? Yeah, right? And why not let them?

Absolutely, why not? You know, I'm a big believer in tested sport, you know, I think that that's wonderful And I think that that'll never go away and I think it's it's important But I'm also a believer in open up the gates and let everybody play well That's why I really love this whole idea of doing the enhanced games It didn't really pan out the way everybody hoped nobody really won any records other than the one guy in the swimming but he wore a prohibited suit that lets you swim quicker apparently Yeah, but yeah, but I was hoping like you're gonna see some freakish super human performances But I feel like if that's gonna happen that's gonna take years I don't think you would get the kind of gains that these people are hoping to get to achieve like world records super free human performance Unless you're doing that stuff for a long like you know as well as anybody that training takes forever Take to build strength to build speed to build endurance takes a long-ass time Yeah, you gotta get strength in three months like you get a little stronger for sure, but you're not gonna get freakish Strength for fucking years takes years years. That case like you move food like how long I got in lift weights. That guy's a fucking free Yeah, yeah, yeah, you can't build this stuff overnight and I bet he would melt a piss cup Listen, I think that chance do you do you look at something look at myself included?

You know I care about performance. This is this is what what I care about and so many people fall into the same boat look at that guy Hey, I'll tell you you know, I'll tell you Juji is probably amazing though. They can do that that kind of flexibility with that kind of mass is look at that while overhead pressing a full Side squat of side split that's nuts on chairs Jean Claude van Damme style. Juji started out tricking.

Okay, so I mean like it's a form of the That sounds like yeah, so so he actually started out sounds like he's picking up guys. Yeah, no, no, Juji is super cool It's like flipping his own America's got talent. Yeah. Yeah, it's like a form of like acrobatics or gymnastics, right?

Yeah, well, I've seen him do acrobatics stuff and it's really nuts right like his Physical ability like it defies what you expect from a guy with that kind of mass right? Yeah, so he's a combined like almost gymnast and bodybuilder And he's probably better now than ever and he's I mean, I think Jujis in his 40s Wow, yeah, and yeah, he's massive and healthy and you know absolutely kicking that's probably the most positive human being that I've met We seem super positive. Yeah, it's YouTube videos. Yeah, and we have snorted his fucking smells.

Yeah, it's strong He does we've snorted his stuff about a hundred times on this show Yeah, actually do it flip. Yeah, that's crazy that a guy with that kind of mass can move like that Juji is actually the inspiration for this modern this latest way that I'm training It was actually really yeah, yeah, Juji came up to my place probably about a year and a half ago And we were just redlining in our two hand work. Okay, and it was so good to him work Yeah, so okay, so I would be considered like the senior guy in my club Okay So and we have this kind of rule in the clubs to make things work properly senior holds junior works Okay So so the senior is kind of staying with you floating with you and the junior is able to control their intensity So the guy who would normally win the match doesn't win. He just holding you okay, right like defense work in jujitsu exactly Okay, but just to help out that that guy typically will do two arm work Okay to kind of flip the script for him So somebody can hold like me with two arms and kind of let me get the red line Yeah, so jujitsu now we're doing that like a year and a half ago and it was so good.

It was so much fun I was like what am I doing? You know having anything kind of cut into this and that's when I stopped doing heavy lifting It was as a result of training with jujitsu So there's two arm work of just holding and just work on that you feel is more important than all the lifting and all the other stuff Yeah, because it's sport specific exactly and does he arm wrestle he does a little bit jujitsu is everything But why did it you working with him make you train differently jujitsu special guy Um, I think that just you don't have to be the best in your field if you have a certain energy or certain thing with you Juji is a wonderful creative hardworking guy and when you get a chance to train with him It doesn't matter that his skill level. It's just his level of energy is so good that when we work together. It helps me I don't know he I don't know how it happened, but he unlocked this Understanding of the priority of that training for me.

I've always done it, but never how did he unlock it? I'm not getting it I think that our training session, uh, I okay. So what happened was juji came over And I normally on days that I do table work. I do not hit the gym Okay, because I don't want anything to kind of impact my my my table work And because I only had a day with juji I wanted to show him how I was training and at the time I was training very heavy I was training very heavy so we did this circuit I showed him all my latest exercises that I was prioritizing and then we went to the club that night And we had this awesome two arm work, but I felt as though you know the singles and everything that I've done earlier in the day How does life effect not like I can't ever let that happen again I need to put make sure I put all my energy into this table table training And it's funny.

You know being 51 and having over 30 years competitively in the sport I still feel like I learn, you know, I still feel like I change things from from event to event. Yeah. Well, that's a sign You're doing something fun. Yeah, right?

That's the key continue to get better at it and continue to grow at it key life So just the one training session with him changed your perspective on that because you just weren't performing as well That was a tipping point. That was a tipping point for me So I generally have a protocol like a training kind of balance a recipe that I'm gonna follow pretty much from event to event And this is all made by you is made by me. Um, and I I watch everything, you know, I I love arm wrestling But I'm looking at sports. I'm always trying to get better.

Um, so yeah, it's my protocol that I come up with and then I'll tweak it Based off of my results. Okay. So if I'm doing good not much changes If if uh, if I don't do as good as I think I should do or there's like something I'll tweak it from event to event And yeah, and that night Uh was the night that I decided I need to get rid of heavy weights because this is so good This training is so good when done properly and that's a key when done properly like to arm work can suck Like if you do to arm work wrong, it can hurt you it can set you back but when done properly It's the best training that there can be yeah for specifically super specific And do you do stuff that's not specific for arm wrestling? Just for overall body strength Like do you feel like there's a balance to be achieved?

This is uh the greatest criticism that I always receive as an athlete, uh, is because I don't really just arm wrestling stuff I go for walks. That's it. Oh, really? No lunges.

No, I'm trying a little bit to work it back in in some minimal way Uh, but it's it's interesting, you know cross training versus specialization I have a long background in in very broad training. Okay Like I once upon a time was a fit human being in many aspects But I really care about being a champ, you know, and I could probably be a healthier guy And be able to run squat and deadlift Uh, or I can be a little bit of a cripple and be pulling for world title shots is the way I kind of look at it I chose that uh, wow I should do more squats Well, my only thought would be that if you conditioned and strengthened your overall body It would just help your overall strength Yeah I mean that is the thought about deadlifting and squatting is that it helps everything because your whole body just becomes stronger And it would just not like naturally like your base everything your core everything would just be much more Your foundation would be stronger. I hear you. I don't know.

I'm not honestly. I'm not arm wrestling I don't know either. Okay, everything. I'm playing with everything.

Uh, this is constantly what pretty much every reasonable person tells me And I just I'm like I get to a point where I do my arm wrestling work and I'm like, okay Here I am if I want to beat levon Um, what do I do from here and I just don't like more risk girls? You know, uh, look at my zdew Uh, he's a bit more bouncy me he he levon lifts super heavyweights, uh, like stupid. What does this dude looks like? Show me show me levon.

What is his last name? Saggamish really whoa, this is the pinnacle of our sport. Okay. This is the guy how big is this dude?

He gets about 420 Yeah, oh my god. I love this guy. This size is motherfucker. This is holy shit.

Yeah, that can't be real Is that ai? No, that's right there. That's real. Oh my this is I don't know Jamie.

That might be real. He might just be pumped levon is the pinnacle. Okay. We scanned him too and surprised He's a weirdo also.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, look at the size of that motherfucker. He's in little rock in two days Little rock Arkansas.

Yeah, where's he live right now? Georgia Georgia the country. There's so many weirdos that come from Georgia Really? Yeah proportionately their strength is is not normal.

Jordan levon is uh, he hasn't nobody has beat this guy since 2017 He has absolutely flattened the field. Okay. Like he's so hairy too. Oh, he looks like a primitive man He looks like a science project.

Look at the fucking size of that guy. Oh my god Smart guy. Who very cool guy. Um, I absolutely love levon Um, he has beaten the piss out of me at every opportunity.

He's so big. Yeah, he is he is so big and uh, and he's so good He's like he grew up in the trenches arm wrestling. Okay. He didn't he's not one of these guys who came in Uh, you know, he made his way through the world championships.

Yeah, he hasn't lost in 10 years And so he does he do different stuff than you do? He does. Um, a lot of the guys have different formulas Okay, levon does a lot of pull ups really heavy ones and he does a lot of really heavy curls This is the base but he does all the same like we do all the same exercises just different different formulas Um, now when you hear the best guy is doing things different than you. Yeah What keeps you from doing what he does?

So we are all different, right? Um, that's what you look like Shout out Shout out shout out to all the scientists out there He's very young in that first photo of course, you know He he slowly evolved through the world championships to what he is today Um Yeah, it's interesting when when you see different champions and I try and learn from everybody I watch what everybody does. I see what they're doing Uh, you have to also consider where your body's at. Okay.

I can't do the things I did when I was 25 physical I just can't I have I have like I said, I've had surgeries Um, but yeah, you can still arm wrestle. Yeah, so so obviously you're very strong in these particular areas and it's not holding you back at all So what what is holding you back? Um, say injuries Well arm wrestling is a big thing. Okay, there's several things that you can kind of choose to focus on Probably my biggest limiting factor is my elbow Because I had multiple surgeries on it.

I burn it out like at the beginning of my career I was more of a hook style arm wrestler That's where like the primary kind of drive in the sport is the flexion of the wrist and you're moving forward with your shoulder And you're kind of trying to attack the person's arm more Uh, but over time my elbows got broke down to the point where you know, I just don't have a lot of stability Now I continue to work on it and quite honestly my hooking now my this stability is probably pretty good Um I think I think that we do we all as athletes do the best thing we think we can And um, I think that the work that I do is very precise Like the way the lavone trains and I and please I don't like to criticize lavone. He's the best Okay, um, but Egotistically and arrogantly, I'm gonna say that my training is more precise than his okay So I'm working on very precise angles where he's a sledgehammer at times You know, um, like I'm working on very fine angles through my wrist You know a lot of pronation in my style a lot of hand control a lot of table time like i'm doing a lot of skill-based training Uh, lavone's base movements his his his role is is I mean, he's doing he's doing a 180 kilo curl You know two hands or one hand two, but that's a that's crazy The amount of weight that he's risk curling. I'm never gonna get there. Okay.

I'm never gonna catch him there Okay, I need to catch him through something smaller Like I need to be able to like a pit will like somehow nip on to like his fingertip and not let it go Um because you're never gonna be as big as him probably not But do you think that it would benefit you at all to add size to get I try it for every single prep that I do i'm trying in a super heavy weight division I'm trying to get as big as strong as I can what do you wait now? Today i'm probably 265 and so you're giving up a lot of Sitterable amount of weight when I compete I can get up to 300 okay when i'm competing Uh, and hopefully by the time I face him again, I'll be my biggest ever. I hope when I pull him i'll be 310 or 320 You know and when you do that, what would you do to get that big would you add a bunch of weightlifting stuff? No, no, what would you do just eat?

Stay in my basement, you know Uh, but he's doing all this other stuff. This is why i'm confused like have you tried adding all those chin-ups and all the different things that he does I'm very far down the road. I'm very very far down the road. I've been doing this for like 32 years competitively I've gone through so many systems.

Um, while it is incredible to have a great row while it is incredible to have a great um A great wrist flexion while it's incredible to have great legs Like I go to tournaments sometimes my legs are sore But typically the reason why you win and lose the match is very small things in the hand on the wrist Like this is typically the failure point So I just try and put everything into the most valuable pieces that I think is actually going to determine my victory And look at apart from levonne. It's working You know this guy has raised he's raised the sport, you know, and I continue to chase him I continue to try and beat this dude, you know my wife got close The first time the first time he tore my bicep. Oh, whoa, you know, see see that tattoo. Uh-huh See it's a cat with 415 I used to call him a 415 pound pussy You know in the work up to the match I'll tease him and in georgin It says levonne was here because he ripped it second round.

So that was the first time was a wash Uh the second time I pulled him I stopped him I stopped him round one What does that mean? So a lot of times in arm wrestling get everything straight don't move go and Uh to stop a match means there's no movement. So no one's winning. No one's winning and you don't just keep going to the death Oh, yeah, you do.

Oh, yeah, 100% yeah But I I got like if you look up the second time that I arm wrestled for round one Yeah, okay So this is this is the last time I pulled him which is 124 and when you say pulled him which means you match with him. Yeah, that's right. Okay. So everything goes to straps And I'll tell you like so that what happens when the match doesn't work out and the hands slip away from each other straps straps Do you guys put powder in your hands or anything?

Yeah, you was chalk, but Yeah, every this sport is a strap based sport at this point like rules are evolving and arm wrestling It used to be well in some leagues still you get a foul if you if there's a slip somebody's intentionally did it or it's a neutral slip And then they go to the straps Um, but yeah, so we get to the straps and this first round is the closest I've gotten to them Um, and in this match, I think he might have ripped my spine apart like yeah, I couldn't walk properly for like four months I really yeah, okay, so on top rolling I get into his wrist and uh, and I'm just like I'm in shock I'm like I can't believe so I kind of I think I had the opportunity here to do a little bit more like to seize the initiative But I was in such shock that I got him to this point Um, you know, I'm just and then here we go his wrist is starting to go and so that's a flapper's press and I get a foul Okay, first see my shoulder goes below the table. Uh-huh. This is called decline humorous And it's and it's a foul you can't you can't do so you start from scratch Well, I'm actually on my second foul So that's a loss because I was being too much of an idiot in the setup and they gave me a foul And then from here on he just he just runs me so it's on loss. What do you mean?

So in arm wrestling if you get two fouls, uh-huh, it's a loss so the match is over matches over But see this is best of seven so from here he runs me over But this is the closest I've gotten okay. We've practiced since then we've we've gone. I'll probably practice within this weekend Um, but I'm slated to pull this monster again. It's gonna happen one more time for sure It's uh, it's what keeps me in my basement.

It's one guy this guy He's awesome. Oh, he's a he's a beautiful human. I love I love this guy. He's he's lifting the sport in terms of performance You know like he's so hard to deal with yeah, and that's it man.

It just gets worse. It just gets worse but uh Yeah, so I can still win in like a hundred and fifteen heel division in 105 heel division I think I've got those ones pretty much wrapped up. It's but but it's the open to be the best. Yeah regardless of weight Um, that's how much weight to give up.

I know but you're giving up 135 pounds Yeah, but it's so cool to try You know, it's so cool to try and what he does is he cleans my life up if it wasn't for him. I wouldn't do all this really No, I'd be happy being the champ. You know, but when you're not the champ You're not happy and you're gonna do everything you can so so even though you're a champ at your weight class It's the open that opens you open haunts you. Yeah, I've been there before like so in 2008 I was actually I won against this legendary figure the sport jombers ink.

He's considered the greatest of all time John bersink, uh, basically for 40 years 40 years from the time he was like 18 to like almost 60. Okay. He went undefeated for like basically undefeated for like 25 years Yeah in american this guy this guy super cool. Okay, different era and you'll see the difference Okay, so you'll see that this sport has changed.

Can we pull him up? John bersink. John bersink's the goat Yeah, yeah, he'll be there this weekend too. And is he still competing?

John is not really competing, but he's just so tied into the sport. I think it's inevitable that he comes back But how old is he's like 60 61 Yeah, wow. Yeah, he's the man this guy's the man. So you know the movie over the top.

Mm-hmm. Uh, so Sylvester That's actually john the tournament was real. Oh, yeah That was a real the movie followed the tournament and john is actually the guy you wanted and john's not that big No, he's not how much does john way on a good day on a great day john's like 230 But but when he was young and healthy probably 195 like so when he was winning when he like he went like he went like 25 years Around 210 pounds beating every single person on the planet. How he's awesome.

He's awesome John bersink so john started arm wrestling was when he was a kid with his dad and he's one of the first guys John's one of the first guys who arm wrestling has kind of evolved in its Respectiveness, okay as a sport. I think if he went back like 40 years and you talk about arm wrestling People would be like oh, that's cool. Yeah, let's go arm wrestle like and i'm gonna get better by arm wrestling by doing pecs and glutes And you know get my whole body strong and john was kind of one of the first guys who was like i'm an arm wrestler I practice arm wrestling. I go to tournaments.

I don't need to lift weights. Okay, so he started young The dude's thumb is probably like bigger than mine and he's like, you know, six foot one six foot two So he's to a certain degree built for it, but um masterful technician. Um, so he doesn't lift weights No, so all he did was arm wrestle to train for arm wrestling in that wow that's crazy. So it gave this not a big no It's not that's a former russian champion zauer actually knows our might be georgia.

He might have been russian at this time But he's a georgia. Um, yeah, yeah john's technique was way above everybody's way way above Uh, I remember coming up like I had heard about john bersink for years before I ever saw him because you know It's pre-internet, right? John bersink like silently ruled the arm wrestling world for decades, you know pre-internet pre pre pre all this stuff And yeah, and he went around the world beating all the monsters all the and this is who I actually got the the world title from So I beat john in 2008 for the world title And it looks very different now, you know like so before so I was probably the last of the small super heavy weights If you call if you call me small like i'm bigger than john, but not by a lot not by a lot Uh, Dennis the plank off on the left that guy's a really famous arm wrestler He was one of the guys who really raised the level so that guy had a strength level Dennis He came in and he won the world title without really doing anything. Yeah, I can't believe he doesn't lift weights.

He doesn't lift weights All he does is arm wrestle. All he does is arm wrestle. No other kind of physical training at all. He's a mechanic He's a special that's incredible man The arm wrestle world loves and worships jumpers and he's he's the goat.

He's like a forefather like, um, I remember when I was coming up I read everything this dude wrote. He is The one of the reasons why we all kind of respect table time don't need weight so much specialization john is kind of poster boy for Specialization and what kind of training did he do? He arm wrestle just arm wrestle he would do specific things when he was arm wrestling that we keep asking the same questions about john Um, like we think like some people think he had like a secret stuff in his basement and stuff like But everything kind of points towards, um, even if he's kind of kidding us and tricking us. It's certainly not a lot Uh, he arm wrestle with his dad as a kid Okay, and you know, they're practicing all the time.

So this ice man. Okay, that's that's the guy who john beat to become kind of the best Okay, this guy is like the guy before john So he was the original king of arm wrestling. He is johnnie walker. Yeah, ice man Uh, and he he was the best for a long time, but john eventually beat him You know, you see that's john is like a kid.

Right john's probably like 17 there Wow. Yeah. Yeah, but no john arm wrestle all john like arm wrestling is gonna make you strong Oh match. Oh you you will get And that's a lot of reason why we get guys into the sport who are in the strength fields like if you're a strong man If you're powerless, you try arm wrestling you'll be so sore You'll be like, oh my god because people look for that right like people something that can get you really sore arm wrestling will get you so sore That you can barely move i i've been so sore from arm wrestling actually can you walk i can't even get up for for days For days like yeah, yeah, yeah unbelievable because it's something about the way the body's designed like We are actually probably designed to resist things from happening more than we are to make things happen So we're very very strong to stop things from happening arm wrestling is what that that's the strength We really hone in on right because we're locking we get into these lock positions and then we're trying to open the other person up And this process of being ripped open is super taxing super super taxing so Yeah, john john ruled arm wrestling world for like 25 years.

Uh, he's still around. Yeah, i'll get to i'll get to talk to them tomorrow Yeah, and so do you think he thinks about competing again? Of course he does of course he does but he doesn't one was last time he did it last time he competed was in ballast He competed against guy called yoshi canai who's the number one guy from japan Um john is way past his prime. Okay, like john john when john was like In his 30s.

He was like levon but 210 pounds nobody could beat him. It took a while But the thing is arm wrestling got cool, you know to a degree where we were on espn Governments started to recognize it so if you were from the right country, you know You could be a pro arm wrestler like if you're from georgia or turgy or kazak snan, you know So the level started rising when did this start happening? Um, I think that government started to recognize it I'm going to guess here that a lot of them started to do it around the turn of the millennia Okay, probably they started around then but it takes a long time for it all to like get in and some countries are still switching over I think sweden just got recognized like I think within the last year or so But once a country recognizes it as a sport. It's a massive influx of cash and support.

So that'll raise the level um But what happened was we got there was all these leagues Like there was the pa l in europe. There's the wal in north america and it and it got the sport To a point where if you were the best, you could probably quit your job. Okay, and that was a huge step forward because you know, um Yeah, it's a big step, right and that happened around 2015 and do you think that's because the internet like youtube videos like popularity increases tiktok instagram that kind of shit That was massive, but that happened a bit later. Um, first what happened a lot of small little steps Uh, you know, there was a documentary pulling john that came out There was a couple rich guys who thought our wrestling was cool and they just started to run leagues Uh, robert drank with the ual Ultimately you got california.

I mean it went from like when I first started the sport michael class if we won 500 bucks It was the greatest day of our life, you know, it was so cool. We won 500 bucks like, you know, um, that was it Uh, and then with by by 2010 or so do even for that the pa l we were talking with thousand dollars $10,000 Wal came along we got a massive influx of money you were talking about $20,000, okay And then we were on his pns the responders, okay, so you could get some sponsor money if you were the best You could barely make it you could barely make it and then uh, and then covid happened And covid burnt down everything burnt down all the leagues which were kind of fractioning the sport Right. We had the best guys from euro competing together best guys from north america when all the leagues burnt down from the ashes And a lot of people that's when tiktok and youtube really started kicking because everybody was locking their house and somehow armresting got found And our views went through the roof people started to follow armrest is good for tiktok attention span, you know You can see sure. Yep, and uh, and then yes, so east versus west came along and Now we're everything you have see we're like the ufc of armresting now east versus west all the best guys in the world All pulley's versus west and there's an event every seven weeks international.

So what does a top guy make to win a tournament now? Um, you know, it's tricky when we talk about money, but you will make like if you're if you're a top armrestor now You're you're definitely you definitely don't need a side job. You definitely don't Um, and you're and you're you're probably definitely making a healthy healthy six figures, you know, definitely Um, so yeah, so east versus west kind of raised the level after covid It's not the same sport. It's not like the champions now like It's tough.

It's tough to win a world way harder to win a world title now than it was 10 or 15 20 years ago Yeah, yeah now we have levon right is there any drug testing at east versus west? There's not okay. So it's it's f1, you know everything everything goes, but what does f1 mean? You know like indy car.

Uh-huh everybody's got the same car right f1 like innovation right innovation. Um, uh, WAF government funded that has testing what is wow? Sorry world armresting federation So world armresting federation is kind of like the base of the sport. Okay, it's it's uh a world level So every country kind of plugs into it.

They have uh state or provincial Uh, then they have national they have like europeans and north americans and then they have a world championships annually different part of the world every year Let's test it. It's such a universal thing like I remember armrestling kids in high school You know everybody knows how to armrestle it's always been around it's always been a thing So it's really interesting to think that it's becoming more popular now than ever It is it's wonderful. I love the sport Uh, I think that it's a great sport because of its safety. It's longevity Simplicity, yeah beautiful sport, but there's a lot of aspects to it.

It's simple, but you're still learning it is so it can be that simple Like anything, you know the more you dive into something the more it opens. Yeah, yeah at the level that i'm at now Uh, you know, I continue to learn subtleties on a technical level But it overflows more now into more vague and kind of like lifestyle principles And I feel like that's how I get my big gains now is you know, is the way I live my life like the sport, you know Kind of cleans up my whole life. Yeah Because you want to perform well, that's it and so you're just so dedicated that like you're on top of your nutrition and your sleep everything Yeah, yeah somewhere between the balance between chaos and order perfect performance is found Mm. Yeah, the balance between chaos and order is interesting because you kind of to become great You kind of have to have some chaos.

It's so essential. Yeah chaos is a huge talk to me about that. Oh, this is this is I love this one. This is so good This is one of my latest learning points that I've taken into account And it's massively affected my planning the way I the way I plan events So I have met many people in my life and I've met probably in my entire life probably like two people who I would consider completely pure You know, like basically like a jesus christ kind of person like no sin Okay, but and on the other side of met only like a couple people who I thought were generally pure evil or you know But I think most people are somewhere in the middle.

Okay, and they need that balance in their life, you know Um, and I think that you need to if you're talking about performance on a single date This balance of what you are needs to be structured. Um, so I think that actually in the fight Like when you're actually fighting a lot of people I think perform best in chaos. Okay, so when you get into this day You have to be completely wild No rules like you need to be completely unhinged Um, but leading up to it. You need to structure you need to Really become very ordered and the more you can bring order into your life the better.

Um, I went to a Um, kind of a presentation By this by this guy mac okay, he's a geneticist as well And he was talking about how life only exists in this balance between chaos and order and and from that I I brought that into my training by making sticker charts So when I was young my mom used to motivate me through sticker charts So when I did a good job, she'd give me a sticker and I loved it So I have brought this concept into my training where uh, there's only two stickers There's there's a blue sticker, which is uh, you didn't quite make it. It's representative of chaos and uh, and and a white sticker which is a representative of order and After I compete I purposefully move into chaos and it's not as though like oh I'm in chaos and I let everything catch on fire I just I don't need structure. I can go wherever I can learn new things. I can try new things I can open up my mind to whatever I want.

Nothing's required But really I'm trying to gather data put together a plan so that when I move into structure. I have a new kind of plan Um, so how do you structure that? Yeah, like when you say you move into chaos so you allow yourself to not have a plan Yeah, this is obviously very planned. Yes.

Yeah, so I will move from major my life is structured that I'm move It's in blocks. Okay, so I move from major event to major event I am now at the very beginning of probably the longest block that I've ever had my life I'm gonna face that guy live on in like 16 months. It's forever. It's an eternity, you know So I am now in this period when I can travel I can I can just I can be more open Um in a way it helps get me there You know, I am trying to come up with what I think is the perfect blend so when I lock into my basement I'm being super accurate But I do believe that if you just try and be good every day if you try and live a certain way every day it creeps into your life I need like a finish line.

Okay, like if I know I only have to be like this for four months or five months I can make it, you know, if I'm like I have to be like this my whole life everything creeps in it falls apart But it's a it's a aid for me psychologically to remain disciplined And it's and it's a way for me to fit chaos into my life where it satisfies me as a human being And I get to have fun and I get to go outside of my box but That's the hardest thing to be a world champion of 51 is to put all your energy into something so simple This is the most difficult piece is the psychological Dedication to do 10 hours of risk curls in a day, you know, this is the difficult you do 10 hours of risk girls do I do I'll go I'll get up in the morning And my wife jody will help me. Okay, we'll have food and I'm doing like And that's a thing so right now. I'm coming up with the formula for the next one, but I was doing 14 Seven times two because I was doing right and left. I'm going back to pumpkin training, which is right hand only Pumpkin training, you know about growing giant pumpkins.

No, you know, you know, you ever seen those fairs where they have like a Yeah, so what that tell what that teaches is if you want to have a giant pumpkin you pinch off all the flowers on the vine except for one My giant pumpkin So I've tried and put everything into the right I put all and this is so this is specialization So I've done this project for like I did it for like six years before so when you're saying you put everything in the right I mean you don't do live risk curls or anything with your left hand nothing. No, really? Yeah Yeah, now this is a energy resource allocation. Yes.

Yeah, it's interesting interesting. Yeah, this is the difference from your right and your left Yeah, yeah, so you see and I came up with this theory, you know a little bit because of just nature, okay? And I see how nature works, but Yeah, you have one giant The difference is a bit it's a bit bigger twice as big okay, and I was balanced Okay, I was equal. I was left hand world champion also Okay, I've but but as of age I'm like how can I remain at the top of sport?

I'm gonna have to cut things, you know, but why doesn't training your left arm take away from your right arm? I think we only have so much energy. I think there's like a finite amount of energy that we have And if I tell my body that my energy goes here more of it will go there and more development will happen I don't think it's like I have this limited list amount of energy where I can be like a proportionate bodybuilder and be a world champion I think that to be at the very top you need to be very specialized and very focused That's that's what I believe this comes a lot of people criticize me for this. Okay, I get I get heaps of criticism And I'm very well aware of it.

And I think that if you were just gonna stop the yeah, we say heaps of criticism by who and is it valid? I don't think it's valid. So it's criticizing it I think that most of the criticism comes from more junior players. Okay, I think that most senior arm wrestlers most guys who are like on my level They understand it and to a certain degree.

We all do it. Okay. I'm just an extreme example, but a lot of guys do it Okay, a lot of guys do this in the sport There's a couple things that lead me to this. Okay, the the pump cane is just a fun metaphor.

Okay, but When you get hurt in the one side, I think that a lot of people notice that somehow there's this amazing compensation that happens Another thing is we have freaks in the sport. We have we attract some real weirdos. Okay, I called oleg zock or Or matae ischlitty. Okay, and these are hell boys Real-life hell boys.

Okay, so they have like one arm. It is crazy jacked. I've seen this one cat He's a small dude. Yeah, and he has one arm.

That's like a leg. Yeah, what is his name? Probably Oleg? It's Oleg or matae There are best examples.

Oleg is better like Oleg Oleg's world champion. What's his last name? Zock We're great name. Oh, he's so cool.

Yeah, and see the dude. Yeah, that's the dude. Yeah, and I thought him I look at the size of his fucking left arm. That is that is insanity.

Yeah, okay I actually pulled this guy at the UAL many years ago and he was like 165 pounds And I was how was the current world champion and the kid almost beat me. Okay, yeah left-handed. Yeah, um, jesus christ's arm is insane. That's awesome That is so crazy.

Yeah, he has the arm of a 300 pound man dude at 170 pounds He was almost not even the world champion in his division. He was almost the world champion in the open Okay, look at his left arm and it's crazy and what's extra crazy about it is the insertion points It's not just that he's hypertrophy and blown up like the insertion points are different He's like the angles of his musculature the development like it's it's wild And how is that genetic is that built? He was born like that to a certain degree. He is normal normal So how is it so different on his left arm?

So it's my theory. Okay, that he has a bit of a blood flow disorder Okay, I believe that so the arterial spread in the body for most of us is all the same We have like an even distribution across our body But I believe that his arterial spread is different I think he's got a heavy heavy arterial flow to one side. This is your own personal theory I've heard i talked to Matthias. Matthias is another guy with this disorder He was the one who kind of led me to believe that this is what was going on with him and um So this made me believe That there was so much value in blood flow alone when it comes to the expression of what you are Like I think anything that just gets more blood flow enhances Yeah, the expression of the human being Is largely determined by the circulation of that the genetic, you know, peace receives Um, and I think with guys like this it happened like in utero That is that lemme arm is fucking crazy.

Yeah. Yeah, and he got in a vicious car crash Horrible one almost killed him. Um, and he's he rehabbed and he's and once again He's he's the world champ again in the 85-kille division completely and he like he should be dead Like he broke everything like super trauma and he's still the best He's pieced it back together again. Yeah, pieced it back together and he's still the man.

Um, but yeah, but what what he taught me And what other people taught me is the value and I believe it's all theories. Okay, I could be wrong on everything But I think that it's the blood flow that really it heals it strengthens Um, and a lot of the thing is is um, the heart isn't strong enough to feed all the structures and that's where movement comes in So that's why I train this way Increase circulation. Yeah. Wow.

So But I still don't understand like clearly he's working that one arm more than he's working the left arm Yeah, I think to a certain degree But because of the way he was yeah, this is Matias, right? Same deal Yeah, and he's and he's like German German national champion kind of level Yeah, and like it's just it's hard to compete with right But how much of that is just work with the right side over and over again and how much of it is you think a genetic component? With these guys it's a lot of genetic Really? Yeah, with them, but I believe the reason why it's expressing that way is because of our arterial spread Okay, I'm talking about Tias.

He's the one that led me to believe that initially Is that arterial spread influenced by work? Like does it change the expression of the arteries in the in the muscles? I think you can influence blood flow for sure like I think if you are repeatedly working one region very heavily Your your circulatory system is going to adapt like my endurance capabilities on my right and my left are completely different And that's from years of doing this and so I have to think that you know, it's not just a cellular thing It's got to be the blood flow. It's got to be everything that's adapted over years Yeah, and look it I really care about being the best and All the information that I have makes me I'm doing it again Like I laid off it for a couple of years, but I've started to do it again as I do my final prep one more time when you say do it again What are you doing differently?

I'll go back to so my work Capacity work work amount that I'm doing between my right and left arm. It's sometimes it's equal Sometimes is what I do with the right is what I do with the left Sometimes when I go to the club I'll do right arm left arm and now I've just swung it back So I go to the club and I'm basically arm wrestling everybody I can't right hand and tell people are kind of bored and then I'll do some left hand work But the right is the priority and the same thing when I do my homework and the basement I'm doing like 85 to 90 percent work on the right and maybe like just 10 percent like just you know Just for timing and whatever on the left. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah super specialized Yeah, yeah, it's it's insane. I I was I'm sorry I was so worried like that I was gonna develop like back issues in balance issues. Yeah none of that ever happened Huh guys do that from archery they develop imbalance issues just from pulling a bow one-sided like my friend evan He got a left-handed bow just so he could practice left-handed as well because he felt like it would balance him out Right.

I think balance is overrated really. Yeah, I think balance is a nice concept for like some imaginary world that you live in But if I live in a world where I'm trying to win a world title right-handed Then I need to let my body know that this is what I'm getting ready for it. I'm not confusing There's an interesting comparison in jiu-jitsu because there's a lot of guys that have like a very strong right-side attack like Eddie Bravo For instance Eddie Bravo's attack is almost always on the right side of the body Obviously he has a black belt level attack on the left But his right side attack is where he puts all his energy to and his philosophy was along those same lines If he's developed this one side like so lethal. Yeah, I think that um so much is about you know being able to have an icebreaker you know something that stops a match or wins you to match and At a world level, it's everything like if you can if you can bring something from a 99 to 100 You know, but it takes 15 points off your left That's a trade that a lot of people are willing to make You know if I can do anything to push my right a level up if it let makes me you know wither away in my left Good trade one of the things that I've watched that I thought was really interesting I've been watching a lot of these rock climbers and their ridiculous grip strength Yeah, a lot of these guys.

There's that cat that has a youtube channel. I know you've been on it Magnus Magnus How do you say it's not saying it though? And he had that one dude who's just a super freak. He's Greville.

Yes. He trains with me. Okay That guy went right into arm wrestling. It was fucking people up right away Which is crazy which makes me think that maybe that kind of specialized training is like a cheat code close close Yeah, right guy also has like enormous leg-sized forearms eve Greville See you find him training with Magnus because they're in Eve's basement where he does all his training and he's doing these like how many millimeters is The hole okay, so he's doing two millimeter holes with his fingers where he's hanging I'll tell you it makes no sense.

He's such a freak. It makes zero sense Um like Magnus is is super stud okay Magnus is like world level climber Eve when it comes to the strength component of climbing It's it doesn't even make sense. I don't even understand how it's how anybody could even do it Like it's like credit card. He can do pull-ups off of a credit card.

That's insane. Yeah, how I don't know I don't know how he does it it doesn't and like he has like rounded surfaces where there is nothing to bite right there There's nothing so he's just talking up his fingers and he hangs off those. There's nothing there I don't know how he does it. Um, there's nothing to bite.

There's nothing and he's pulling up off I can't even understand how he does it so he came into arm wrestling Um, and he's like 150 pounds and but it's 40 pounds of his forearms So we have a tournament in in Ottawa where we both live It's called Ottawa Open and it attracts the strongest dudes in the region to win the Ottawa Open is really tough He wanted his first year after arm wrestling six weeks Anyways, what 150 pounds? Oh my god. Even Greval is a complete weirdo I've never in my life met somebody who can do the stuff with grip that he can do and it's all that training that he's doing He's doing all this insane grip training. Yeah, which makes me think like what if you did that?

Yeah Yes, let me tell you as good as Eve is now. He's getting better. Okay, I can only imagine. Yeah, nobody is touching Eve's fingers but Like I talked about earlier.

So if you kind of relate it to climbing, okay, can you show me some stuff with that guy doing things? Well, I was trying to find that one But it just showed me some of the other freakish things he does because he could pick up things from the ground that nobody could pick up Yeah, he does grip competition too. So so that's another world that's closely tied to arm wrestling is the grip championships Right where they're just it's like powerlifting for grip, right? Yeah, and he's the best at that too Yeah, it's just nuts.

Yeah, it's really nuts. Yeah, so there is a high degree of crossover, right? There is but there are slight intricacies like a kind of way to think about in climbing if you have a great grip You are able to climb the wall. Okay, but in actual arm wrestling.

You actually don't want to be the climber You want to be the wall, right? You want to make it hard for the other person's grip You don't necessarily he's capable of climbing any wall. Okay, but once he figures out how to be the wall instead He's gonna be so so difficult It's fun to work with him our club in Ottawa. We have like super freaks now We have all these new guys with ridiculous potential.

We got a guy come in who's bigger in bran shop Did you ask this kinsh Robinson video? There's a bunch right and I'm on his channel to him like that's bouncing back in between So here's doing fat grip. Yeah, I'm chin-ups. Did you see the Thomas inch?

You know, it's the Thomas inch. Yes, right? Nobody picks up the Thomas inch when they 150 You know that's not like this kind of grip is just insane. Oh my god.

That's crazy. He's pinch gripping Yeah, and that guy Magnus is strong shit too Like I saw a video of him training with Eddie Hall crazy strong And he's doing these one-armed rows with like 180 pounds on each side And I'm like that is bananas because he's not a big guy. No, but he's ridiculously strong as well and that and him He's dwarfed by this guy strength. Yeah, which is crazy.

Yeah, Eve is considered the strongest climber in the world And did you ask him when he started this and how he got that strong? I've talked to Eve a lot about his training. He's so detailed like the way he trains is very interesting very progressive very science-based Look at those forms. That's bonkers.

Yeah. Yeah, Eve is uh, and he's an artist too. He makes masks masks Yeah, you know like movie movie masks. Oh wow.

That's that's his main job. He makes masks and he can climb anything It's super cool guy. Yeah So seeing that though makes me think of a guy is that small and he has that kind of grip strength that that has to be a massive factor It is in your ability to arm muscle. So why wouldn't everybody do that if a guy is 150 pounds and he could do that shit And he's doing it with two arms.

I mean both of his arms are super jacked There are levels of specialization, right? Do you think it's maybe too late for you to do what he's doing because he's been doing this for decades and decades? I believe that he Is so good at all his grip work and his grip work is so high and it does have a lot of crossover It does what I want that strength. Yes, of course I just think that the motions that i'm doing are actually even more dangerous for the sport of arm wrestling like if I was to advise even I do I talk To eve like every week.

Um, I tell Eve, you know the way he's gonna progress his game is by probably doing these more precise movements to become the wall You know to become the thing that's hard to hold on to right? He has an amazing ability to hold on to anybody. Okay, and that's gonna take him really really far in the sport Uh, but I think that as he's i've told him he he's older in terms of entry, but he has world championship potential, you know He's less than a year in the sport. Wow.

Yeah, he's been arm wrestling since like last November Yeah, give him give him like a give him like a year or two or three and he's gonna be knocking on the north american like You know top pro level. Yeah, we'll take him home Yeah, he's he's a freak for one and he's super smart and arm wrestling is a very nice crossover for climbers because so many of the strengths are similar Really similar. Um, and when you say so he's very scientific about his training like what does he do? The thing that struck me when I spoke to him about his training is he kind of does testing I found that very very different from the way I train Uh, so before he does his workout he does these tests like with his grip and he like says how easy or hard they are and if and if he's not feeling right He won't do the training so he'll continue to rest he'll abort a training session because it doesn't feel right.

Yeah, yeah And I Interesting. Yeah, look at whatever. I've seen it. It's very detailed.

It's um, where did he learn this from? I think he's he's crazy. He loves armor. He loves he loves climbing and I think he's just obsessed And I think he probably digests everything.

I probably I think he's probably studies everything about climbing and strength and he just put it all together So what's he doing here? It looks like a static wrist test looks like he's measuring it through a Way to see how much in a static capacity if he can generate Wow. Yeah, I see metrics. Yeah.

Yeah So all just wrist curling isi-metric. Yeah, maximum output, which is really the main Strength that armrestors need that locked isometric or even negative strength. Um, and all his squeeze and it's crazy. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. He's very special That is crazy Yeah, so that's the thing he's got all these charts And so he's doing this all himself because there's probably no one that could teach him this stuff Because he's probably at the top of the food chain with this. Yeah.

Wow. Yeah. Yeah, he's a gift to have come around We love that we love that we've kind of got him because uh, oh, I'm sure because when you get a freak like that Like out of nowhere What is he doing here? Right?

So he's working his curls and he's adding resistance through the elastic So you can see he's this is not a climber exercise. I don't think anymore. He's really switching, you know, so I think I think he's got the bug Yeah Wow, it won't be long. It won't be long.

He'll be at east versus west for a seven kiloworld title Well, it's such an enormous advantage to have these fucking gigantic forearms and insane strength And it's just so weird that you could get these guys that are so physically small that are so damn strong Like when Magnus was doing rose you're like where's the force coming from? You have 150 pound 160 pound body and you're doing these 180 pound single arm rose Like where's the force coming from like where's the is it a tendon strength? Is it where's the tissue right like you look at eddy hall? You're like okay, that makes sense that guy could lift that much weight it's massive This guy's not massive.

If you saw me a t-shirt you wouldn't even unless you looked at his forearms You wouldn't even think he was strong. He'd say well, it probably runs or something looks like a normal guy that spit It doesn't look like a guy can do 180 pound one arm rose. So what what is that? How do you do that?

Where's it coming from? Yeah, I think that for I think that arm wrestlers climbers a lot of athletes fighters too They start to recognize the value of the hand, you know Uh a lot of guys, you know in the in the communities like strong man powerlifting other strength disciplines They get immense strength through their body through their shoulders and different parts that by the time it goes through the chain Through the elbow through the wrist and through the fingers only a small portion of that is able to get managed Right, I see that with guys when they work out with straps I've never used straps right because to me with jujitsu grip is so important I never wanted to rely only on my muscles and not have a strong grip It didn't make any sense to me in so many functional things the hand is the shortcoming or the feet or the feet Yeah, I talked to Nick kerson once who's a strength conditioning trainer and I said what do you think is like the number one thing that fighters Lack on he said foot strength. Yeah, I said foot strength. Yeah, foot strength goes once it foot strength breaks down Everything breaks down you're moving breaks down your power breaks down your ability to get out of the way of things the ability to close the distance Yeah, yeah What is it?

What did he get? That's crazy. I got more than him. Yeah, he just did it really hard.

That's crazy, but that makes sense. I'm 200 pounds, right? But it's it's it's a chain and grip is a part of the functional hand chain, right? You know, well clearly he's way stronger than me with rose The interesting thing with grip is grip is only a small part of control.

Oh, it's got it. What's that guy's name? He's he's actually the best Andre right? What did he get?

He's actually the best climber of the world right now? 161 same thing Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah, Derek Lewis got 218 Derek Lewis the guy fights in the UFC and he did it casually. Yeah, he just got any Derek's got giant paws like catcher's met paws Yeah, and he he pulled 218 you got higher than anybody and it didn't even look he was trying the guy I just arm wrestled.

I think had the world record for some time. Vitaly Lelethon. What was that? I don't know what the numbers was, but I know he had the world record.

Vitaly Lelethon. He so I'm actually not being on grip I'm not really I'm not but most people are there's a guy that I follow on Instagram. Jamie pull him up His name is Michael Eckert and 351 is that Vitaly? Yeah.

Yeah. Oh my god. So listen. So listen So mine is probably like 70 pounds, but I beat him.

Wait a minute. You know, no, no terrible. No, no, I'm crippled. Shut the fuck up.

There's no way I'm stuck I'm like, yeah, you do. That's not possible. That's literally not possible. I'm telling you.

He's like 69 like he's about three. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

That is so crazy Colograms is so bananas. Yeah, that's so strong. You can only do 70 that doesn't make any sense when I was younger I could do like eight or nine reps of the number three captains a crush So I can do this sucker here on the table. Yeah, what is that?

Yeah, uh, uh, oh god 200 pounds. So this isn't a cap and a crush. This is uh, I think it is. It's not about the way they just have a number on the can't do a job can't do it.

Can't do it. Come on. I don't have to. I don't have You should come and arm wrestle with us.

No, I could be able to suck. Grip is interesting. Okay. Grip is a part of control, but so much of the control through your hand has to do with the ability to control the angles You know, can you control this way this way this way this way?

You know, can you spin? You know, the grip is like the final inflection points the final piece to add right? Yeah, well, I understand that it's not everything I'm just a thing that I've been obsessed with lately because I'm not strong at it. That's beautiful So this 162 kilograms.

Yeah, geez I just guy Michael Eckert on Instagram. He's a guy that I follow and he has all these grip strength tutorials He's a marine and I guess that's him and he can do 220 and he doesn't look like a very big guy either But he does like crazy one arm pull-ups and and he has massive forearms, but like look at his thing right there Uh, there's a thing below it. You see numbers there it is Oh, so this is what he's lifting. This is he's doing this for chin-ups But he has the grip strength thing the really good one is the one that has knurled metal It has very little play in it and so you get a real accurate He said it's the most accurate one of all of them.

Um, that one right there. See what says 119. So I think that's 119 kilograms Handed with it. Yeah, what is that?

262 so he could do 262 and he's not a very big guy So he does a hundred pounds more than me and he's not a big guy Yeah, I mean when you look at him, but he does crazy like chin-up stuff 256. That's fucking nuts So his it's uh, Michael Eckert Ellekart no eck eck ert eck ert so it's Michael Eckert's Underscore fit on instagram and this guy's turned me on to a bunch of stuff told me stuff to get and what to work out with But I just blown away because I look at him and I go well, you're not that big. That's what's crazy Like you look at his forearms are obviously very big. Yeah very strong, but he's not like this massive guy like who's that giant Russian cat?

My ass. Yeah, boy He's he's not real that makes if that guy pulled 262. I go okay, that makes sense But I look at Michael and I'm like he's not the biggest guy in the world, but he does so much grip stuff stuff Yeah, we're praying for smile to come into the sport. Oh my god.

Yeah that guy's a fucking freak freakiest Not just freak freaky s. Yeah, how's he alive? Like you gotta think there's not a lot of time on that hourglass Live hard die fast. Yeah.