369: How Did One Viognier Go From the Brink of Extinction to Being Planted Around the World? episode artwork

EPISODE · Dec 24, 2025 · 55 MIN

369: How Did One Viognier Go From the Brink of Extinction to Being Planted Around the World?

from Unreserved Wine Talk · host Natalie MacLean, Matt Walls

How did one Viognier go from the brink of extinction to being planted around the world? Why is the Mistral one of the most miserable experiences for people, yet a saviour for Rhône vineyards? Why is working with bush vines so much harder than trellised vineyards? In this episode of the Unreserved Wine Talk podcast, I'm chatting with Matt Walls, author of the terrific new book The Smart Traveller's Wine Guide to the Rhone Valley. You can find the wines we discussed at https://www.nataliemaclean.com/winepicks.   Giveaway Two of you are going to win a copy of Matt Walls' terrific new book, The Smart Traveller's Wine Guide to the Rhone Valley. To qualify, all you have to do is email me at [email protected] and let me know that you've posted a review of the podcast. I'll choose two people randomly from those who contact me. Good luck!   Highlights What are the famous galets roulés of Châteauneuf du Pape and what is it like to experience them in person? How do the galets affect vineyard work and vine training? What is the Mistral wind and why is it both miserable for people and essential for vineyard health? Why is Hermitage Hill considered one of the clearest visual explanations of terroir anywhere in France? What does tasting Hermitage at the top of the hill reveal about the emotional connection to place and wine? How does whole bunch fermentation change the aroma, texture, and alcohol level of Syrah in the northern Rhône? How close did Viognier come to extinction after World War II, and who was responsible for saving it in Condrieu? What makes Viognier from Condrieu feel different than versions grown in warmer regions? How did Château Rayas redefine Châteauneuf-du-Pape? Why did the extreme heat of the 2022 vintage affect Rhône wines? Why is Tavel better understood as a pale red rather than a modern Rosé?   Key Takeaways How did one Viognier go from the brink of extinction to being planted around the world? Very close. So there was about 6 or 7 hectares left... about the size of three football pitches. That's it. That was the only place in the world. I mean, that's where it comes from. In the 1960s and after the Second World War, a lot of the vineyards died. People couldn't fetch high prices for wine, so quantity was more important than quality. So people were just planting on the flat, basically where it was easy to farm instead of on the slopes of Condrieu, which are very difficult to grow on. So it got pretty much abandoned. It was down to one man whose name was Georges Vernay from Domaine Georges Vernay, which still exists today, still makes excellent wines. And he rallied the local winemakers. He believed in the grape. He knew how good it could be, and he encouraged people to replant, to rework the vineyards and, and saved the grape. You find it all around the world. And so if it wasn't for Georges back in the 60s, deciding, no, I want to save this variety, maybe we wouldn't have it at all, which would be terrible. Why is the Mistral one of the most miserable experiences for people, yet a saviour for Rhône vineyards? The mistral is a very strong north wind. It whistles down the valley. It can be extremely boisterous. It's cold north wind. if it's quite a hot day, it's never nice. It's always horrible. Even on a hot day. When it blows hard, it can be quite difficult to stand up in a vineyard. It's an amazing phenomenon. It's cold and it's really dry. So often when it does rain in the southern Rhône and in the northern Rhône, you risk getting vineyard diseases. But the mistral often it blows after it rains. So it will dry out the vineyards. It's like a natural disinfectant. it means that you can keep your grapes hanging on the vine for longer. So it is a huge benefit. Why is working with bush vines so much harder than trellised vineyards? You hear about these galets roulés, these rounded stones, but when you see them, just in the vineyards for as far as the eye can see, they're very striking to see and difficult to walk on. you can quite easily turn your ankle if you're not careful with what you're doing. So if you're in a vineyard of galets, what you'll see is these bush vines. That's the most common way of training vines in the southern Rhône, particularly Châteauneuf-du-Pape. You do see a bit of trellising, but with Grenache, you don't have to… they're naturally self-supporting. With Syrah, for example, you do have to train it on wires because it just grows like mad, and otherwise it would just be flopping around all over the floor. And you need to lift up the foliage in order to get it exposed to the sun and get the grapes off the ground. Grenache doesn't grow in such an exuberant fashion. It grows a little bit more slowly, and the trunks get a little bit thicker. But they're much harder to work as well. So, the thing about those bush vines is that you have to tend them in a 360 degree fashion rather than trellis vines, which you kind of have to work on both sides, but without kind of working around it 360 degrees. But the galets… they are troublesome and they are difficult to move and they take a lot of strength. So, yeah, I wouldn't like to work on them personally. That takes a lot of work.   About Matt Walls Matt Walls is an award-winning freelance wine writer, author and consultant who contributes to various UK and international publications such as Club Oenologique and Decanter, where he is a contributing editor. He also judges wine and food competitions, develops wine apps and presents trade and consumer tastings. Matt is interested in all areas of wine, but specialises in the Rhône Valley – he is Regional Chair for the Rhône at the Decanter World Wine Awards.           To learn more, visit https://www.nataliemaclean.com/369.

NOW PLAYING

369: How Did One Viognier Go From the Brink of Extinction to Being Planted Around the World?

0:00 55:11

No transcript for this episode yet

We transcribe on demand. Request one and we'll notify you when it's ready — usually under 10 minutes.

Humanizing Change Tremendousness Join us each episode as we talk with innovators in their respective fields about their unique journeys and how they humanize change in their own work, right here, on Humanizing Change. AI Erik's Podcast Audio Erik Conn The AI News Podcast where we talk AI. NEWMORROW SESSIONS - A PodCast Series on the Future of Hospitality Mario C. Bauer, Florian Schneider, Axel Weber & Dr. Tillman Bardt The Newmorrow PodCast is more than a podcast — it's a platform for open dialog on the future of our business, a platform for those building what doesn’t exist yet. Here, we share and embrace our passion for the hospitality industry, but we won’t romanticize the journey. We ask the tough questions, confront uncomfortable truths, and prepare for a future that resists easy answers. We believe that the tougher and wilder times become, the more openly, honestly and humanely people need to talk to each other and act together. We believe, openness, togetherness, and truthfulness should also be cornerstones of a professional community to develop our utopian idea of „open source“. This is a space where visionaries don’t just imagine the future — they wrestle with the paradoxes that shape it: success vs. happiness, data vs. instinct, stability vs. reinvention. Join leaders, entrepreneurs, and thinkers as they share not what made them — but what’s actively shaping them, now and next. So tune in Canine Fitness Fanatics Podcast Hannah Johnson Do you think your dog might benefit from a little extra fitness? Maybe you want to tighten those left turns in agility or tighten their box turn in flyball? Or maybe they are a bit clumsy and just need a little more body awareness? Welcome to the Canine Fitness Fanatics podcast! With your host Hannah Johnson join us as we talk dog fitness and other areas of canine health too! Our mission is to help condition dogs to reduce the risk of injury and increase longevity, whether that’s in sporting dogs, working dogs or pet dogs. All dogs can benefit from a little extra fitness!

Frequently Asked Questions

How long is this episode of Unreserved Wine Talk?

This episode is 55 minutes long.

When was this Unreserved Wine Talk episode published?

This episode was published on December 24, 2025.

What is this episode about?

How did one Viognier go from the brink of extinction to being planted around the world? Why is the Mistral one of the most miserable experiences for people, yet a saviour for Rhône vineyards? Why is working with bush vines so much harder than...

Can I download this Unreserved Wine Talk episode?

Yes, you can download this episode by clicking the download button on the episode player, or subscribe to the podcast in your preferred podcast app for automatic downloads.
URL copied to clipboard!