#482 "My biggest Lessons and Mistakes from 26 Years in Design Remodeling"

In this episode of the Contractor Growth Network podcast, Logan sits down with Jef Forward—founder of Forward Design Build Remodel—to unpack what it really looks like to build a remodeling business from the ground up… the hard way. Jef shares the unfiltered story of his first five years in business—projects going months over schedule, losing money, taking on debt, and nearly reinforcing every negative stereotype about contractors. But instead of quitting, he used those failures as the foundation for what would become a 40+ person design-build firm. From digging out of financial holes (having just $0.16 for every $1 owed) to learning how to price correctly, hire the right people, and step into leadership, Jef walks through the exact inflection points that transformed his business. He also shares how joining a peer group, embracing sales training, and building a leadership team allowed him to finally step out of the day-to-day and start thinking about the long-term future of the company. If you're feeling stuck, underpaid, or overwhelmed in your remodeling business, this episode is a powerful reminder that the breakthrough often comes after the lowest point—and that building the right systems, team, and mindset can completely change your trajectory. Key Takeaways Failure Early Can Be Your Greatest Advantage → Jef's first two projects lost money, ran late, and delivered poor client experiences. → Those early failures forced him to rethink everything—and ultimately built a stronger foundation. You Can't Outwork a Broken Business Model → Working more hours didn't fix his problems—it just prolonged them. → Real progress came from learning how to price correctly and understand financials. Know Your Numbers (Or They'll Control You) → Discovering he had only $0.16 for every $1 owed was a turning point. → Understanding financials like profit, WIP, and job costing changed everything. Hiring Isn't About Talent—It's About Fit → Early hires were based on skill, not alignment, leading to poor team cohesion. → Building a strong culture became the foundation for long-term growth. Sales Is About Asking Better Questions, Not Pushing Harder → Jef initially resisted sales training due to fear of being "salesy." → Learning how to guide conversations and uncover client needs transformed his close rate. Delegation Is the Gateway to Growth → Growth didn't happen until Jef stopped doing everything himself. → Hiring designers, estimators, and project teams allowed him to focus on leadership. Recessions Reward Decisive Leaders → During 2008, Jef made early, tough decisions that kept the business alive. → Lean operations actually made the company more profitable during that time. Your Role Must Evolve as the Business Grows → From carpenter → operator → leader → coach → Each stage requires different skills and mindset shifts. Transparency Builds Stronger Teams → Sharing personal struggles (like his wife's cancer diagnosis) created trust and unity. → Giving the team ownership and permission to fail led to one of their best years. The End Goal Isn't Just Growth—It's Sustainability Without You → Jef is now focused on building leaders and planning his eventual exit. → Long-term success means the business can thrive without the owner. 🎯 Timestamps 00:00 — Meet Jef Forward and his journey into design-build 04:45 — The brutal reality of his first five years in business 09:08 — Why failing early ended up being a long-term advantage 12:31 — The wake-up call: having only $0.16 for every $1 owed 14:56 — Climbing out of debt and learning to price correctly 19:23 — Early hiring mistakes and why culture matters more than talent 23:57 — Navigating the 2008 recession and making hard decisions early 27:32 — The 5 stages of a remodeling business (and where Jef is now) 29:24 — Overcoming resistance to sales training and building a sales team 37:04 — Building leaders and preparing the business to run without you