Hello and welcome to Retrospection, a podcast in which we take an old TV-shawn film and see if it is faster than a speeding bullet or like chowing down on a bowl of kryptonite. My name's Colin and look at that, Dingleberry. And I'm Paul and we don't make you used to be reading tea leaves at Lake Tahoe. I probably would actually.
I'm glad you went on with it. In this episode we're taking a look at Supergirl from 1984. After losing a powerful orb, Kara, Zara, Elle, Superman's cousin comes to Earth to retrieve it and instead finds herself up against her. You can't, you've got to be careful what you put your powerful oat.
Yeah, you don't want to put them anywhere. I like a powerful orb. So do I. I've got to be nice.
I thought you were sitting uncomfortable. The film stars Helen Slater as Supergirl, Faye Donaway as Selena, Peter O'Toole, Azulta, Brenda Vachera as Bianca, Peter Cook as Nigel, Merk McClough as you need also. The only actor to appear in four Superman films and this one. What a joy for him it must have been.
It's a payday. And her to Bogna as he feels. It's a fairly good cat. Yeah, it is surprisingly.
Yeah. Peter Cook's been doing it himself. He appears to be, yes. Did you read how he actually got the part?
No, tell me. Well, it was offered to Dudley Moore first. He didn't want to touch it with a barge ball. I don't think.
A ten? Yeah, that ten ball. That's his film. Yes, I get it.
So he said he suggested Peter Cook for it. Wow, wait. That'd be like, that's like me going with that shit. I don't want to do that.
But not somebody who did it. Paul would love to do that. I'd love to do that. No, I probably take it as well.
You do anything for money. I'll take this one a second. Whoa. Too early.
Usually, too early. That's why it's like... Music by Jerry Goldsmith. And I like the music.
It's a good score, isn't it? Yeah. It's always reliable, Jerry Goldsmith, isn't it? It's true.
But I like the sound. I don't know whether it's like a scraping on a string sound. I don't know if you know what I mean. I really like that.
It's good. It's directed by Jerry Goldsmith. It's a great song. It's a great song.
It's a great song. It's a great song. It's a great song. It's a great song.
It's a great song. It's directed by Jerry Goldsmith. It's directed by Jerry Goldsmith. Just scraping on a string sound.
I don't know if you know what I mean. But I really like that. Yes. It's good.
I like the action you would do in there. I like the action you were doing that. Yes, I have a one-king action. Or a scraping gun, I hope not.
I'm always going to say, I've got some funny looks in the orchestra of the other day. OK, what is he doing? Well, I don't know. He's ever enjoying this piece.
Rather too much. Or he's scraping the harp. Which is what I call my personal tie. Scraping the harp.
So, it's directed by Jeannout Sowak. It's the work. I'm glad you did that one. Who's famous for?
Oh, here we go. No, no, wait for you to fill in. I don't know. I haven't looked at you doing all this.
I haven't done that. No, okay. Nope. I'm sure he's worked before.
Is it even a man? Probably not afterwards. Well, probably Robert Weiss turned down the directing. And Lester?
Yes, he did. He felt a bit burned after Superman II and Superman III, didn't he? Yeah. I like his films.
He would have put some humor into it, I think. Yeah, he would have. Some humor that actually worked. Yeah, that would be nice, The weird thing about Superman III and this film is I saw this on the cinema as a double bill with Superman III at the time.
Which one was first? Superman III was first. Okay. And then Supergirl came out the year later, I think.
And they re-released Superman III as a double bill with Supergirl. Oh, actually. Because they were convinced that nobody was going to go and see Supergirl. Right.
No, actually, what I meant was like, in a double bill, which one came first and then which one came second? Supergirl came first. Okay, and then Superman III. Yeah.
I remember liking it at the time. What, Supergirl? Yeah. Okay.
I was young then. I was probably impressionable. Yeah. But now you're only 50% that.
What young? No, impressionable. Okay. Good.
So Christopher Eve was asked to make an appearance but turned it down. Yeah. See, he was quite, quite busy. Packety's tights or something.
Packety's tights, yeah. Both Demimar and Brooke Shields tried out for the role. Can't imagine that. Can you?
Certainly not Demimar. Not Demimar. I can imagine Brooke Shields, but not Demimar. That's funny.
Does it make me think about Demimar? I don't really see her anymore. I guess she spends much time producing rather than acting. Yeah, she doesn't need to, does she?
No. And Dolly Parton turned down the role of Selena. I can imagine that. Apparently she didn't want to play Witch.
Well, that would have been alright because Selena isn't really a witch. Only in the fact that they call her a witch doesn't do any witchy stuff. That would have been an easy fix. She doesn't do spells.
She does. She's got a cauldron at one point. Oh, that's all you need for two spells is just happen to have a cauldron. You can do a cauldron.
You've got a cauldron and you you psychopless spells and that makes your witch. But that's after she's got the orb. Yeah. Well, yes, the orb powers it, isn't it.
So she's the orb doing the works. She's a bit rough, isn't she? I mean, isn't Dudley Moore not Dudley Moore. Peter Cooky's a warlock, isn't he?
Oh, that's not very nice. I think to say about him, he's okay. Yes, he's a warlock. I've got nothing but respect for Peter Cook, especially after this film.
Yeah. So do you have any more info? John Travolta declined the role of Ethan as well. John Travolta?
Yeah, they offered it to John Travolta and he went, no, thank you. Well, you know you're in trouble when John Travolta turned you down. He was probably hot though in 1985, isn't he? Yeah, maybe.
Yeah. The budget for this film was 35 million, but domestically in the US, it made 14 million back. If you put that into some kind of a context, Superman 4 made 15 million in the US. So Supergirl is actually the worst performing Superman based movie of the time.
Oh, which isn't good, is it? No. Have you ever seen Superman 4? Crust for peace.
That's the one, yeah. That's all with it right now, money, right? We're making it. Yes, it was a cannon movie.
Ah, okay. Good old cannon. We never watched a cannon movie in a while. No, we should do one.
Just for real time's sake. We did go from a phase of every film that we did was a cannon movie. Yeah, you did. I still do.
I've got lots of them. Wow. Anything else? One of others originally decided not to release it and tristered and picked it up and heavily recut it.
Oh, interesting. The trailer actually says it's made by Farn EMI. Yeah, well, isn't Farn EMI the British subsidiary of something, aren't they? Yeah, because they don't exist.
The British subsidiary of something. Of something. Okay. But as we get in there.
Personally, I was surprised you weren't even that far. Oh, I do some research, not a lot, but I do do some. The film was shot at Pinewood for the most part. Yeah, and it's considered a British film.
It is. It's a conversation itself of what's a British film and what's not, because the Superman films are British too. Technically. No.
It's in Britain's Batman films, British. So I was British. In John Jones. British.
Apparently. It's an interesting concept, I think. Well, maybe we can do a whole podcast about. We could.
Yeah, probably one. Apparently, there's over an hour's worth of footage still missing in the vault somewhere. Let's hope it stays there. Can you imagine that?
Oh, don't give it away too soon. Oh, sorry. I'll remove that. You're speaking.
I'll cut that out. Cut that out. No, don't do it anymore. Cut that out.
A whole hour. Wow. A whole hour. Imagine that, another hour of this.
I'm trying not to. And the other thing that amused me is the tag line for the movie was, it's a first great adventure. And last. Yeah, it kind of implies there's going to be more.
Yeah, it does. Although the tag line for the trailer is, adventure stays in the family or something. Run runs in the family, I think it is. It runs in the family.
I hope it runs and not stays in the family. Yeah, the adventure stays in the family. It's a very different film. It was the 80s.
I suppose you had to wait another 30 years to get Supergirl done. And a little bit better. Yeah. Yeah, the TV series you're talking about.
Mm-hmm. A lot of it makes a lot more sense than this. I haven't seen it. You're obviously a huge fan.
I am a huge fan. Yeah. So here's a question for you. When does Supergirl become Superwoman?
She never becomes Superwoman. Wait, does she age? Yeah, but she's still Supergirl. So who's Superwoman?
There is no Superwoman. There's no Superwoman? There's Spiderwoman and the Spidergirl. I think technically there is a Superwoman in a comics.
Right, but it's not Supergirl. So she can be like 40 years old and still be called Supergirl? I guess so. It's the same way as the Batwoman and the Batgirl, isn't it?
Why is it not Superperson? Two different people. Superperson. You know what?
In this day and age, there probably will be. Yeah, Superperson. Superperson. Yeah.
You cover in all your bases then, aren't you? Yeah. Yeah. When do we get the Superdog film?
Hopefully never. Because you know there was two, right? Two Superdogs. Oh, I know there's two Superdogs.
I have the comic book with them in it. There's a Superdog in the new Titans TV show. Did you have a cape? Because in the comic books, I actually had a cape.
Be shocked if they give him a cape. He's in one of the very last shots of the first season of Titans. So I'll presume he's going to be in the second season. Oh, I hope he has a cape.
So the dogs love capes. Wait, he's called Krypto? Krypto, the superdog, yeah. They named him after the substance that kills him.
That's right. That's not right. Yeah, that's not right. Right.
I suppose, yeah. But no, he's Krypto the superdog. Krypto the superdog. He was a little collar with a little less that hangs down on his chest.
For some reason I think he's going to say G-string for so long. That's a whole different thing. Yeah. He wears a dog collar.
Religious dog. Religious? Oh, right. Yeah.
Reverend Superdog. Oh, now you get it. You're making it all religious now. Yeah, sorry about that.
All right, so back to this. Do you have any more information? Or should we go for the trailer? Oh, let's listen to the trailer.
Here it is. Oh, is she? You know I think I recognize the costume. The question remains is, who on earth are you?
On earth I'm Lee. Linda Lee. Why don't you just leave this poor kid alone and worry about the other one that flies? Because nobody gets in my way.
Wait a minute, wait a minute. You can do the whole number of Lee tall buildings and single-bound and look great through things. Yes. Vince the Abard?
Yes. Joy, your prison supergirl. Ever. And ever.
Alexander Sultein presents the action-packed adventure for the dazzling new superhero. Starring Peter O'Too. I must be sent to the Phantom Zone. They done away.
Me of Faro. Venus. When? Vinda Macaro.
Mark McClure. That's Clark Kent's cousin. Hart Bockner. And introducing Ellen Slater as supergirl.
Adventure runs in the family. Well that tells you everything you need to know, doesn't it? It's the trailer. Actually mirrors the excitement of the movie quite well.
I'm getting a feeling from you, Ian. Nope, no feelings. Don't do those. Oh, I'm sorry about that.
You know, you know, you know, well, you know, technically you are. Old school though, because you're all about feelings now. Jesus Christ. Yeah, have you seen the output of the BBC?
Yeah. Yeah, that trailer's kind of weird. I'm not being funny, but what could they have done? Yeah, that's true.
With what they had, you know. That's true. All right, shall we go for it? Yeah, so we get the opening credits, which apparently cost $1 million to make.
I like them. Yeah, and they work really well with the music, don't they? Yeah, the music's great. And I like the neon kind of reddish cloud and the actual, um, fun.
You like a big fan of fun. Oh yeah, I love a good fun. We're back to Reverend Super Dog again. Yes.
I've heard that about you. Yeah. Um, no, it's, um, I think the music as well, it kind of feels like a cousin to the John Williams score, which is ironic, really considering that she is Superman's cousin. Oh yeah, yeah.
Nice. I like that. Yes, I can see that. I did notice in the credits though, when a certain person's name came up, Derek Medins.
Oh, yes. Yes, good old Derek with his model work. I think the model work is fine. It's the flying sequences are a little dodgy, but I don't think they're anything to do with him.
Some of the flying sequences depends. I think the wire work stuff's very good. I think the back projected blue screen stuff's a bit dodgy. Yeah, the only problem with the wire work is you can see the wires.
You can see the wires in Blu-ray, yes. I don't think they were ever designed to be shown in such high definition. Fine. I think it was designed to be shown every again.
Just the ones. Just the ones. So we zoom into the crystalline city of Argo, which is an amazing looking place. It's kind of a combination of model work and matte painting.
And I think it works. Yeah, it looks big. It's nice. Mm-hmm.
Yeah. I like the set. You can't fault the sex in this movie. Yeah, they are huge.
No, no, when it actually zooms in and starts showing people sitting at tables, it does look like a Swedish cafe. Yes, it does a bit. Okay, waiting for people to order meatballs. Oh, I don't want to meet both.
That was just racist. That's just racist. That's just racist calling. The exterior is kind of across between, not the exterior.
So the interior is across between organic crystalline, sort of a honeycomb mixed with 60, 70s, sort of decor, isn't it? Yes. I go mad. Very psychedelic looking.
Yeah, it's good. So we see Cara Zorrell, who's wandering around saying hello to everyone. Yeah, and the other people go like, why? She's saying a lot to us.
Because she's so wide-eyed and curfree and wonderstruck, isn't she? Yeah. Oh, you don't like them like that. Yeah, I forgot.
So she catches up with Zolta, who's using his magic wand to grow in approximation of a tree. I beg your pardon? I'll say again, he's using his magic wand. Oh, don't want to do that.
Grow. In public. So what's a tree she asks? Oh, it's a wonderful thing that grows on the earth.
Earth, she says? You mean we're not causing when? So that's our first mention of Superman. Yeah, she didn't understand it because you pronounced the earth and you should have pronounced it.
Oof. Yes. So she's got it. Last garden there.
See previous podcast. Yes, episode 50, I do believe. So rather theatrical, he's also tells her that one day he might go to earth himself. Using a big spaceship thing he called the binary ship.
Not to be confused with the binary ship. Oh, no. He's just a completely different. Yeah.
You put your ones and zeros. Binary joke, Paul. That's the kind of classy podcast we own. It is, yeah.
Binary joke. You have a laugh. You have a laugh and you don't. One than zeros.
Mostly dumb. Just zeros. Hmm. There were people listening, huh?
Yeah. Where the fuck? Gags. Yeah.
No, binary from now on. Bit of hexadecimal for only interest for, you know, the learned listener. Ooh, okay. What are you getting on GCSE, Matt?
That's not going to that. Did the, did the GSE now fax a dating me? Like a bloody tree. They still do GCSE.
Okay, that's good. Yes. I'm so I've been informed. Okay.
So Cara doesn't believe him, but it's also sounds like life on our guys beginning to bore him a bit, doesn't he? And so let's talk about Peter O'Toole's performance for a minute. He's drunk, right? I mean, it's hard to tell.
Let's be honest with Peter O'Toole. I mean, let me just get one thing right. If Peter O'Toole is in a film, the film is heightened immediately, just by his very presence. I love Peter O'Toole in anything.
I will watch a film that is garbage if it's got Peter O'Toole in. Evidence before you. But yeah, I think this was just a payday, right? Yeah.
But he looks like he's enjoying himself, doesn't he? He does. I guess the sets are great. Costumes are interesting.
So why not? And in many ways, he's performing this. Reminds me of his performance in Caligula. Wow.
Okay. You know, he's very, he's very theatrical and over the top, more than he usually is. And he's a bit drunk. Right.
Okay. And have you seen Caligula? Sorry, that description just sounded like you. It's theatrical over the top and drunk.
Only at the weekend. So it is about not being able to do maths. Most great artists find mathematics troublesome, he says. So that's been my problem all these years, obviously.
You are a great artist. I am a very good artist. Piss artist. Thank you.
I think you're going to say that. I led you there like a horse or a horse or a new one for it. Thank you. See, he says we're not a great double act.
Everybody. Everybody. So he goes on to explain that finance like Earth and Saturn are in outer space. Well, I'll go.
He's in inner space. Inner space. I've seen that field. Yeah, let's watch that field.
I like that field. It's great. That's got Meg Ryan in it when she was Meg Ryan. Yes.
Yes. Yeah. That's a lot of it. Let's have a silent second for the passing of Meg Ryan.
As we knew. You passed her. No, I'm just saying we should have a silent second for the Meg Ryan that we knew. Yes.
Yes. Ah. Okay. We started the exact same point.
I know. Trust me in the edit. But even closer. Oh, excellent.
So he explains that Ergo has two power sources before pulling one of the mag of his pocket. And it's called an omega-pentry. Oh, yeah. It's a weird relationship with his.
What is she, his niece? I don't actually say what is your relationship with her, is it? Yeah, I'm not surprised. What was the 80s?
Keep it at quiet. Yeah, I know. But he says that the place has got two power sources, but we never find out what the second one is, do we? Oh, no, we don't.
No. Also, this is this power source. So why is it so important if there's two of them? Yeah, because you've got a backup, haven't you?
Yeah. But anyway. So this is this. It's a power source that go on.
I was going to say this is a meager headrun. It's kind of like a small spinning fabric, isn't it? Yeah. And it's powers the planet or just the city?
Well, it's not really a planet, is it? It's the city that's floating in in a place. Okay. It seems rather easy to take the only power source that runs the entire city.
Yeah, like it should line around. Yeah. I mean, it's easier to take this power source from the city of Argo than it is to take a small miniature pen from Argo. That's true.
I mean, I don't get that. Well, they never have any. No, so I just don't understand why he just takes it. Why would you even take it?
What was the motive for that? Because he uses it to use the powers to make his little trees and stuff. Well, he does. He uses it in a minute, doesn't he?
That's just ridiculous. Yeah. All right. It should be arrested on many charges.
Hey, I'll tell you something. Before you steal the power source, you want to make sure you get the full HP first. Full HP. Yeah.
What's that? Sauce? HP tools? Oh, got it.
Yeah. I'm sorry. What a lame dad joke that was. It came to be in the bathroom.
And you should have kept it there. Oh, many things do. That was free. That one.
He can use that one. Oh, all right. I'll store it away for future. All right.
It's a fun, simple effect. That wasn't the way it spins in his hand. I mean, he's clearly just holding it between his fingers. Yeah, and there must be something going between the fingers and spins it.
But yeah, it is. So it turns out that Zolta borrowed it for the afternoon, you're on it. Yeah. Ridiculous.
He says he borrowed it for inspiration, which consists of him just using it to quickly finish his sculpture. So the balls doing the work? Pretty much. Not the first time the balls done the work, right?
I rude. So that's tickle being that big. That's all my balls tickle. Yes.
I regret it as I said it. So Zolta says that the, sorry again, because I was laughing at it. Zolta doing it. Don't.
Sorry, go on. Zolta says that the Amigahedrin can only create the illusion of life, not actual life itself. You got to say, is info dumps go? This is getting a lot done this scene, isn't it?
It is. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah.
I have exposition going out. And, but it doesn't, I didn't feel too strange, but you know, sometimes you sit there and your exposition goes on, you're like, oh my God. But I didn't get that from this. It wasn't too bad.
I guess because, you know, Peter Touly delivers it in such a way that keeps you interested. Well, even though the dialogue's kind of like, but now he's not. Yeah. Yeah.
You know, I guess that's what it is. Yeah. So then Cara's mother, Elura, played by Mia Farro for some bizarre reason. Yeah.
She arrives and Zolta gives Cara his magic wand. And he says to her, put your fingers here, Cara, and press hard. Yep. That's a line I'm pretty sure he used in colligula as well.
Oh, it is. Pretty sure he says that in colligula. Probably. So Cara goes off to use the wand while Elura confronts Zolta about the rumor that he wants to leave saying that he can't because he's the one that founded Ergo City, apparently.
Yeah. So he founded it like he designed it? I'm guessing so because he's like an artist, isn't he? We should say that for people that aren't familiar with this whole sort of supermancy big old story, Ergo City was a city that was on Krypton.
And just before Krypton exploded, some scientists got together and transported it into inner space so that it was the only city on Krypton that avoided being destroyed. Now, is this backstory in the film? No, it's in the comics. He never explains it in the film.
OK. And actually in the comics, it isn't the only city because there's other cities as well that survived. So there's this whole last son of Krypton thing, Artobolic. Oh, OK.
Just to be clear. So Cara creates a giant dragonfly with the wand. And for some reason Zolta, seriously, and I don't get why he does this, he rolls the Amigahedron on the floor of Takara. He then picks it up and somehow, although being a complete novice, uses it to make the dragonfly come to life.
Now, I assumed he rolled it to her to hide it from Mia Farrow's character, so she didn't see it. So that's why he did it. Yeah. I wonder whether he was passing it to her so that she could use it.
It seems a bit much to roll the ultimate power source to the entire city to, you know. How did he get it on the floor? Because he had it in his hand. Yeah, he stood up.
He's not like he's sitting on the ground. He would have dropped and then rolled and Mia Farrow would have been like, what was that that just made that loud footing sound? He rolled it down his trousers like. Yeah, like in Great Escape.
Great Escape, yeah. It's just like switching his pants and it just rolls down. Yeah, that's how he did it. We'll go with that.
So this dragonfly comes to life. It's a bit 1970s Doctor Whoaish, isn't it? A little bit, yeah. So it flies around before smashing through Ergo's protective cling film layer.
Yeah, well, this layer seems very weak that a big insect can fly through it. It's like he's on a made of paper. And he's also designed it. He's a bit, he's a bit rubbish.
Suckdash. Yeah, yeah. I've had workers like that in the kitchen. He's a bit of a cobalt, isn't he?
A little bit, yeah. So it creates a vacuum and it starts to suck out everything in Ergo, including the Omega headroom, which then flies out into it in space. Yeah. So Cara's office almost sucked out before they managed to pull it back in and salt her seals the tour with his wand.
Yeah. He's gonna say, yeah. Just watching your face. Why?
I don't know. I'm seeing what he's gonna do. I thought he was amusing. So Cara's father then turns up and he's played by Simon Ward.
Oh, Simon Ward. That's the one, him, yeah. Who'd have thought he'd have turned up in this film? Not me.
Not you, I'll tell you anything, not you. And he accuses his altar of stealing the headroom. You chucked it, he says, no, I lost it, he replies. That's a good line.
Yeah, it's a good line, but it doesn't help your situation. He doesn't, but he's delivered well and I think it works even better because it's Peter O'Toole that said it. He has this utter disgust for everyone to write. That is true.
So Cara's mum and dad have a melt down, explaining that without the headroom, everything will start to fall apart in the city, even though they've got this second power source. Yeah, I didn't realise that until you said it. Mm-mm. I wonder whether this second power source is something that's in this hour of footage that's locked away in some vault somewhere.
Maybe. So Zolta says that he'll go to the end of inner space to get it back. Does it inner space have an end? I'll just be afraid it becomes outer space.
That's the end, is it? Yeah. We see it, the end seems to lead into a lake as we find out soon. Or a rift tree.
But we'll get to that. So meanwhile, Cara, who feels responsible, sneaks off and for some reason gets into the binary ship. Is she an idiot? Yeah, and then she sits in a very weird way.
Yeah, sort of cross the lake, isn't she? Yeah, it's very odd. Mm-mm. So the ship then takes off and it leaves her go.
And this is a scene that reminds me a bit of Superman's pod leaving Krypton in the first Superman movie. Do you think it's on that on purpose? Yeah, I would something so. They're trying to emulate it a little bit, aren't they?
Trying to capture the magic. It's not working. No. She'll be killed, says mom and dad.
But Zolta explains that she'll be safe in the binary warp or some such gobbledygook. Does he actually say that? He might as well do because I've got to tell you what he's talking about. Okay.
Nope. And I'm fully into this stuff but I make no sense to play. Okay. Zolta then says that he will agree to be sent to the Phantom Zone as punishment.
It's a little harsh. Yeah, I mean, he's not playing it right, is he? I mean, he's not playing it right, is he? We back out of it by anybody's business, wouldn't we?
Well, not only that but surely he should be the one to do something to fix it. And not just say, oh, go on then. Ship me off. Yeah, it's almost like David Cameron leaving after Brexit.
It is, isn't it? It's a lot. I created this mistake. I've messed up.
Bye. And he's getting off lightly because he knows that that city is going to start falling apart. So he gets them to send him to the Phantom Zone. Yeah.
One of the many old fox. Thank you. I'm glad you said. I wonder what you were going to say.
So next we get Cara's journey through the binary, which is done using old, the old effect staple of mixing colored water and oil together, isn't it? Yeah. Looks OK. Yeah, it looks fine.