I hate to watch the world. Yep, the Daily Talk show episode, 558. Our brother. Jai.
Welcome, Jai. You can clap. I love you clapping. Just lift that energy.
It's not normal, but it feels normal. It feels right, doesn't it? I was kind of clapping. Isn't it an appreciative clap?
No, I think that there's a huge amount of confidence to be able to clap, especially because sometimes in a group setting they might be like, oh, I want to thank everyone. Tommy and James for being here. It's a good opportunity. When someone walks in the room, it's nice to just clap.
You just change his everything. Oh, hey. I'm all right. Thanks.
I'm cruising. I'm slow. Is that good? If you were the other way, you'd say it.
I'm fast. Hey, fuck you. I reckon probably you're pushing back on the whole busy thing. It's like we always want to say we're doing something and everything's happening where it's like, it's also okay just to be slow.
Just be taking things in. So what was the opposite of slide feet? Consistent. Not turning my brain off.
I always wanted to do something. At the end of last year, I had a pretty bad panic attack. Then I realized that was seeded and feeling like I'm not good enough unless I'm contributing or anything. So I stopped contributing things to like Tom and Brain that I'm okay not to.
You and I first became friends with me in 2012. We're working at the same radio station. Then, funnily enough, I think it was four years ago that we went around the city. It was like this time, four years ago that we went around the city filming a video around how you could help people.
I watched that on YouTube and then it went into a CPR course. Yeah, that was good. You're making, making, making. It's a contribution.
I think that's the whole thing. I think Jez and I have always been on that path of wanting to self-develop, wanting to create wanting to understand what the next thing is. I'll take it back. How many years?
When did you have, maybe when you came to my personal training studio? Yeah. This is like before I even knew what live was and you were doing live, this is a live show. Oh no, no one's watching.
No one's watching. There's not any Wayne's World or you kind of internet show. I had no understanding of what was going on. We had fun.
It was really fun. We wanted to do it from the personal training studio. Back then the internet, like, wife, I was so shit and we couldn't run the cord long enough. It's not like the cord, isn't it?
No, it's not. Like, you know, things that haven't been recorded because the cord's not long enough. Don't do it. I mean, you've been creating for a long time.
Yeah. It's time to be slow. It's like, I don't feel like there's enough encouragement in culture, in our culture, that perpetuates mindfulness or slowing down. I feel like I've always been encouraged to do more and do more, more, more, more, more.
I think it's just a very, very, I've found it very, very challenging to do little. This is a safety mechanism because I guess doing more means that you can pay rent. So whenever we think of slow, we think of not being able to pay rent, not being able to honor our commitments. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, true. That's a definite contributing factor. Was it something that you considered? Like, did you just have to create a scenario where it's like, those things are off the table, so you could create the level of safety, so you don't need to find that moment of panic every month trying to make ends make.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I guess so. Yeah.
I feel like I've been really lucky with my work, so I don't have to worry about that. But yeah. So I feel very privileged to be in a position where I don't need to, I can, I'm still doing work, but it's not a hectic amount of work. Anyway, but yeah, it's really, it was a very, it was much harder than I expected it to.
So the contributing to the world through content, I know you've had a job for significant amount of time with Amish and Andy's that content producer, online content producer, what connection is money to the creation and putting out to the world? What do you mean? So for instance, you've got a job, so you could say, like most people create now, they put irons in the fire, they're putting out content to land something to create money from this thing, right? So you go, I make, make, to make, to make, to make, to make over here, make money.
Whereas you've had a job, so, well, you were making money. So what was it linked to money, the creating and putting out into the world, or was it? I'm a side hustle type of thing. Yeah, it's more side hustle stuff.
It's like making a producer in the album or doing like a rap record, or doing a live internet show, or doing a band, or a podcast. And I think I just, I've always, I just love that thing. I think since I was like 13, 14, when I did my first band, the punk band in the UK, and you know, I was just at the enthusiasm and create the website, and I hit your mail code at GOC, it's like nearly 20 years ago. And it was that kind of, that's what I love about the internet, I think, is that you can do anything, and no one's red tape in it.
So I think I've always said that thing, but I jumped from project to project so much that none of them really have enough time to fly. So the Hampshire and Andy work has been my longest consistency. We've been with them nearly 12 years now. And that, I think, that's the area that I'm obviously strongest in, is producing comedy or short videos.
What have you learned about consistency working on H&A? I think good work is simple. Like when you say how to do a good thing, it's such a simple thing. Like the nuances of like times and beats in a narrative, you guys know about this like a video edit, and initially, like it takes so much trial and error, and things to fall over before you realize how to make things work in terms of telling a story in a video.
And I think the longer you do it, the simpler you realize it is. And so sometimes when you're like, you've got an intern, or someone you're working with, and you're telling them, like this is how I do it, you want to be the right way, but this is what I learned. You often feel like, fuck, I've done a lot of work for not really much knowledge. It doesn't feel like much knowledge, but it's potent.
And it's, yeah. What's that second simplicity idea? We've got Dr. Jason Fox, who's coming on the show, New Year's Eve is here coming on.
And he talks about something called second simplicity, which is basically, you have things that are simple, and then you have complexity. So things are really hard. And then you have second simplicity, which is doing all of this work, all this complex work, fucking up and trying all these different things to arrive at what the answer is, which is still very simple. I guess it's that point of understanding story beats, understanding how those things work.
You have to saturate the doors, but try everything to really be convicted. It's all research, and it's like, that's all the life is just continual research. What are your boys' biggest learnings from doing this podcast? Or what if you, characteristics are producing the show, like it's stuck the most?
In terms of the consistency thing, how we feel about it isn't necessarily how it's being perceived. So you could feel like it wasn't great, so when it may be related to feedback, it's not necessarily how it's perceived by an audience, or someone who is a fan of the show, or somebody comes into contact with it. Because everyone's in a slightly different headspace, and taken something different out that you didn't see or something. Yeah, yeah, and so, you know, a good idea is, that whole concept is subjective, because someone will interpret as good, and someone interpreters no good for them.
And so when it comes to feedback, when it comes to how you feel about what you're doing, and so it will end up in flow. So it's not necessarily going to feel great all the time. And so you're in the game of riding through, it being great, it being high, and everywhere in between. It almost feels like we've done 558 drafts.
So I think that whenever you're trying to work with this idea, that you're working on this complete final piece, that's where it becomes a problem. And so, by saying we're committed to doing the show for 10 years, by doing 10 years, we've got heaps and heaps of drafts that we can work on. I think that that's probably a mechanism to make sure that we don't suffer from perfectionism. We don't even suffer from the potential hype that can come around things.
So it's like, if you're just doing a draft, someone's feedback you're okay with, because you know that it's in draft form, whereas when you show an edit to someone and you have said in your mind, this is the final version, this is it, it always is a little bit more painful, getting feedback. And so I think even within our client side of our business, what we do is bring people in earlier into the process, and we show them the process and the iterative approach to it. And what that means is they can then have a hand in creating it rather than it just being this thing that we show at the end, and then have to unwork a bunch of stuff. That's a really strong learning, I reckon, because it's like the biggest trip up with any credit and anything is that perfectionist thing, it's the whole 80, 20 principle, it takes you the shortest period to get it to 80% of it, and that 20% refinement takes a fucking waste of time.
I think you and I both love the launch phase of anything, right? It's that idea of like having the Instagram account, having the domain name, having the logo, and so feels completely. And so part of I guess with the Daily Talk show, it was also about not adding too many other brands and things to it. So letting it build slowly over time.
Exactly. So I think that you could easily say, I mean, I think that you can easily see in your network through heaps of things, have heaps of shows, and that's what my natural inclination is, is to add more. And so if you take that off the table and say I'm only going to add to the Daily Talk show, and we're only focusing on this brand, and we're not getting excited about the shiny object outside, what are the shiny objects inside that are all adding to the same thing? I mean, the hack might, using the term hack might infer that it's a quick way to success or something, but the hack really is doing it every day.
Like, I think about if I did something when I was young every day, it gets overlooked because everything is so shiny, and maybe everyone thinks that they're going to be the success story where it does just pop. But that's the unicorn these days. It's the Tom Cruise of the internet, right? Tom Cruise, there's very few people that will ever be as famous as him.
And so for online, the success that we look to in other people is so far from the reality. The percentage of us being able to attain success of a Logan Paul for 99.999% of the world is, yeah, it's not going to happen. And so that's where it is so easy to look left and right. But if you can, stay focused.
The hack is just stick out whatever it is consistently. Yeah, I love that. I mean, Ryan, my friend were talking about this the other day. If you're in love with the process, you're invincible.
Because it's only when you're in love with the outcome. I mean, it's such a waste of time. If you're looking at a linear time, like the outcome is like a second. If you want to publish it or whatever.
And the process may be like, you know, hours and hours. So if you have that love of the process, then, I mean, I'm speaking to the convert, I'm sure you know that. But like, that's one thing I love is like, and then it never feels like you need to attain. Like you do, and I think to be in love with the process, I find you need to be in love with the purpose of it.
Because if you're doing it for just a feeling of giving someone a sense of joy or liberation of thinking or whatever, like crack open in my brain a little bit or just making giggle, that feeling of contribution makes you happy, doesn't it? What is it? What's something you've stuck to personally that you're proud of? In terms of, it could be work or...
Maybe it's not a work just personal, is there anything? I think meditating every day for like eight years. It's a classic. I think that, and then for six of those years, it was twice a day, that kind of really, that consistency gave me a lot of grounding and ability to witness myself, a great level of self-awareness and awareness of how other people have motivated.
I think that was unreally proud of. I think also consistently being in my relationship, my partner, in terms of bringing myself with love and attention and not always trying to feel good and look at different things. I find that more and more, and with family as well, a really nourishing aspect of my life. For me, I think relationships and experiences are the most valuable thing in life.
So I think I've particularly learned that this year is that feeling of bringing another person a smile just by being in the moment and being happy and playful yourself and curious and looking for laughs, that is the best feeling in the world. And I used to always capture those moments, because it's like producing funny stuff, or fun stuff should I say. I didn't like the word funny, because it's like, again, that feels like an outcome, but fun is a process-oriented thing. You're again, invincible when you're focusing on just having fun, and no one can say, you're not having fun, because it doesn't really matter about printing.
But you cannot be funny. Exactly. It's a subjective thing. But fun isn't.
So, I mean, fun is not subjective, but at least it's a time. It's a turn to your orientation. The only thing we promise is the daily bit. That's pretty sensible, right?
Yeah, yeah, true. It's like, we didn't, like, we can't get mad at that. Yeah. And so what was the, if you were to look at the week leading up to the panic attack, what were the signs, or what was the state of mind and the state of the world that you'd sort of created that could now looking back being telltale signs?
That's a good question. I think it was the same thing before. Like I got hit with pretty bad depression about four years prior to that. And that's why it's actually more than four years ago, actually.
But that's what meditation got me out of, I just googled how to fix your brain, and that was my answer. But then with anxiety, it was like this. I think I was ignoring my effect on my partner at the time, and ignoring my effect on what I was, again, deriving my sense of worth, worthiness from. It was forever external.
And I resolved a lot of that when I did all that meditating. But this was, like, I think this is more a deeper wound that was linked to my childhood. And I grew up in, like, a pretty extreme Christian sect. I talk about extreme, like, is in, like, not, like, sexually fucking you up or anything.
It's more like super intense psychological spiritual manipulation, which is a very hard thing. It's a very specific nuance that's, it's only been, like, I started to support group for a few years ago, and that, like, hearing people's stories about how they, like, it's, I mean, I would say that it's like, it's a hard thing to explain the little pocket of psychological formatting. What was the feeling that you got from the experiences? Guilt, is that, like, what do you think that that sort of psychological extreme rejection and conditional, like, almost like you feel bipolar, like, you got as part of yourself it's bad and evil, and you got to get part of yourself that's really good.
And you reject the bad side of yourself with this intense narrative week after week. And we had this, also, weird mechanism that was about sharing vulnerability and laying your life down. So this notion of, I'm doing anything in my life right now, if you're in the church, I mean, like, I could say, oh, you know, I really enjoyed my day to work this week, but I've got a bit much out of it, and again, this will sound weird, but like, you're very hyper self aware of your motivations of things, and if anything selfish, you automatically speak it out, and people reflect how you've been selfish, or like, where God can take that position, or this notion of God, which I suppose is just more of this idea of loving this energy that's apparently got a personality and emotion, which is absurd. But like, when you're born into it, it's crazy how much, like, oh, well, this just is the reality.
And to look at everyone outside of the church is like, selfish and other and living for their own cardinal sins, essentially. So that week before, is it so external? So it's the, I guess, to connect with others, it's the feeling that you, you're not complete, or that you're not enough as I am, and I'm not okay as I am. So it's kind of like this.
I mean, I love my family to bits, and I've got no problem with anyone still in the church. I want everyone to be happy, and that it's working for them. But for me, I had an immense sense of going from a place, and I never really resolved this until my panic attack really brought it up. That's what my circle, I just said, it was like my nervous system just shake it, like, or suppress it, and then your nervous system just pisses it out, and you literally fuck.
It's like you feel like you're gonna die. It's the worst feeling in the world. Like, I'll take depression over anxiety any day. Like, you feel like your nervous system.
What a gang show with that bit? Come on, Jeremy, welcome to the show. We're trying to be willing to, here we go. Uh-oh, it's landed in the middle, bit of both.
It would be a nightmare. But so you would pick, so did the anxiety affected you in it. Is it just because it was so, it's debilitating, and it's also very frightening. Like, depression's like a more of like a sedation, and you wanna take your life, and that was a fanciful thing, in comparison to this dark, dark darkness.
But anxiety's like, it's like, I guess a higher frequency, or just a shot shoots your nervous system, and it's just awful. It's such an awful experience, and you can't, it's so hard to, again, that's what this is. You know, it's been about 20, really why my brain's not having just thinking, and you see what the triggers are, and you see what the remedies are, and you just slowly have to do the work to remedy it. And it is clearly something you can remedy.
I believe that all these illnesses, like pain, impressions, and stuff, and we can resolve, it's just finding the tools in the community and the support, and the friends to facilitate that. And not, I'm a firm believer, not band-aid in it. Because what a band-aids tend to look like, do you think? To me, they were medication, or distracting myself of drinking or partying, or anything that's avoiding shutting your eyes, being still, allowing that feeling to come up as ugly or as horrible as it is, and allowing myself to just process and be with it, and not run away from it.
And then it comes from through you, as quickly as the motion of laughter does, like it, if you, we just don't like the negative feelings. And so if we treat them as the same attitude as a positive feeling, they pass just as quickly as a positive feeling too. I heard Sam Harris recently say that anxiety and excitement are a very similar internal response. And so it's just a different framing.
That's interesting. When you're scared, you could get anxious, you know, excited. And so it's just this completely different label on it that shifts, but internally, though, from a physiological response, it's like the same thing. Are you, before a panic attack, is it living with anxiety, daily feeling it, and then when it happens, a panic attack, it's an extreme amount of it?
Yeah. Was it just constantly happening, and then boom, or nothing, and then boom. It was for me, it was nothing, and then boom, and then residual anxiety. Like, I think I'd always, like my mum's a bit anxious, and I knew I had anxiety, but it just all came to the surface unexpectedly.
Like, well, something happens in my personal life in my relationship that just triggered it, which essentially made me, was a feeling of I'm not enough. And then it just brought up all the feelings of like, feeling like I'm not enough on my family standards, because they used to have the relationships with me, and now I'm being selfish or bad, or don't have their worldview, and all the sense of rejection and not being good enough. And all that pain, I kind of mirrored into my relationship, and had that kind of weakness. And anyway, so anxiety was just a reflection of that suppressed pain coming up through my anatomy, and it was like breathing fast.
There was, I think, there's a difference between, I can't remember the difference, there's a difference between like having a panic attack and just having anxiety. Panic attacks like where the anxiety just, like I think what you said, like just climaxes. And you can do very real things to, one thing, one key thing I've learned about anxiety is like I can't resolve it on the level of the problem. So for me, it's in my mind, and I can't really do cognitive behavior effectively.
I've got to kind of sink down into deeper parts of my body and my chakras, and feel those energy centers and be still in that, and then inform my mind from that deeper being. This is my self, and that's what meditation is like, for me, it's like sinking down into deeper states of what I am, and then allowing that stuff to just piss on up out through me. So does that mean not so if you're having this? Is it like, okay, I need to not be necessarily communicate?
Like say, you know, you hear it's like, if you're angry or whatever, just give it like five minutes, because you definitely enter into this thing. It's like, oh, I'm on a roll right now. No, no, fuck you. Yeah, no, fuck you.
It's like it can be quite energizing. And it also feeds into that whole world that you've created for yourself in that moment. So is it realizing that, oh, whenever that happens, that's actually not, there's never a good outcome in that regard. Exactly.
And then so what can you do? What do you replace from a communication, within the relationship sense, you're feeling that from someone, or you're feeling like you want to enter into the anxiety, or you're feeling what do you do? A breathe is the biggest one. And that's what I mean, like in terms of having to focus on a different energy center, it's like your chest or your gut, and doing this thing that SAS do before they go into, well, there's maybe seals in people with different country, but they do before they enter like a intense military, they operation, they go, they just do this breathing thing and it's 10 in, 10 seconds in, hold it for 10 seconds, 10 seconds out, hold it for 10 seconds.
And you jumpstart your body, it's like the Wim Hof stuff, it like jumps, jumpsstart your body into a state of the excitement. You've always been in an area of that self-development faith, trying to find, you know, if there is an answer. In my conscious head. If there's an answer, you've found a few answers in your life and then realize potentially they're not, or like I feel like you've had a lot of experiences.
Going to a psychologist, did they challenge part of that, of the idea of finding a single truth or a single answer? Yeah, which is a great interest in areas in it. Because there's, I think there's commonalities in all these people's worldviews and the more you research. That's what I think life is about to me.
That's what I'm most excited about, just research. So right now I'm not meditating much at all because I want to have more groundly drink a beer, get drunk, just more earthly experiences, which a lot of meditation teachers don't do. They once you start, the more you meditate, you just ramp it up. But you come very ethereal and disconnected from reality.
Which also plays into I guess the thing that you're broken and need fixing, right? Like so, like you can not drink and not do all these sorts of things based on I'm not good enough. And so I don't, like I can't be. Yeah, it can be OCD with it.
Yeah, yeah. And you think you're only therefore, and that's actually interesting, because that's what I did do when I started doing Vedic meditations. I made that money, Colt. You know, I'm Jordy Shaw's friend, Jordys.
I'm a podcast and he was telling me all this stuff. And he was like, it sounds like you're a cult, obvious. Because I just, I replaced that mechanical mechanism in my mind where I wanted to attach my sense of, that's the answer. Well, if you've got this extreme, so like you've got this pathway and it's extreme.
And then you're like, it's easy to, if you've got a hole and you've, you've replaced the hole with something and you take it out, it's very easy to replace it with an extreme thing, right? It's like, for me, food. And my extreme eating, it's why you can extreme eating. It's just like, shuckers.
Extreme eating then leads into like, extreme dieting or extreme. Like it's very hard. So it's a bit, then what do you say, for instance, you realize the cult thing, it's not the cult, but you realize that you take it away, implement no rule, so no consistency. So you, like food thing, I think people struggle without some kind of framework, food call it framework rule.
So the daily meditation thing, for someone taking a month off, is like throwing them back into the wild. Which, but that's why I think that is the key. Because anyone why is it I've come across. Like there's only a handful of people that I'm like, you fucking, you're on it.
And the people that have this ability to, because I mean, it's a premise, my framework, or my understanding of the nature of existence is that the greatest desire is for us to evolve and that ignorance is a mechanic for us to become aware of that evolution and love pulls us towards that evolution. So I think for me, it's like, the more different situations I can jump into, the better I'm adapting and therefore evolving. So if the least things I can grab onto and the more fluid I can be, it's the other than the other way, it's like fluidity is life rigidity is death. And that ability to just always be in change.
I mean, that's why I did things like, we've lived with pigs like that you come and saw me do it a few years ago. In China, it's like, it threw me out of my comfort zone and forced me to adapt. And there's something very exciting about my brain pulling towards that. I think it's because I grew up in a framework that was so, like, freedom was so bound.
And that's what so many people live about it. It's like, you are free, shackled to this thing. That's literally the words I kind of use. And I believe that the Jesus is bride or wife now and all these kind of really quiet arm preposterous things, but they're just stories, I guess.
But anyway, I'm detouring. So the, like the pig example, something that's pretty extreme, you know, going to a restaurant farm or whatever, and living with some pigs, it got to the point where a morning show came, like filmed you and stuff. So that there is an extreme nature to that. You've got fond memories of that.
And look at that fondly. When does extreme serve you and when doesn't it serve you? Yeah, that's a good question. Because when it serves me, it is giving me a sense of liberation of my thinking or breaking down boundaries of what I thought was true.
And pushing the boundaries, I guess. When it doesn't serve me, it's kind of, it's a different form of, yeah, I feel like I read something recently that's about this. It's actually, it's like, there's two forms of, not ignorance, but there's two forms of something or other. And I can't remember what it is.
So that's, I'm sorry. But I think what I'm trying to say is that, like I feel like in some cases like that, it helps you and it's great. But in some cases, you're doing it for a non-evolutional purpose. Well, yeah, it can be like, there's multiple truths, I guess is part of it too, which is like, which I think is, yeah, I think extreme in general is, like, I think I've got extreme personality as well.
And I think that it's hard as, like, if you are creating something or even with relationships to understand how, how you fit in, how do you fit in when you're bigger than the whole of the world provided. Do you think it's outcome focused when we think that, doing something, so you're seeing a head right, so you go, put myself out of my comfort zone to sort of heighten my understanding or feeling? Like, there is some thinking around the thing you'll get from it, which is the outcome. But then if you don't do that, you're just a receiver of whatever the world throws at you.
But then there's this balance between trying to push yourself into creating that stuff. How do you create drive without outcome? Yeah, yeah, and so, because then you don't want to just be loose as fucking knocks the plan and put yourself out there, or so there's a, yeah, like this paradox. Because if you're also wanting to, if you're traveling, if you're wanting to go somewhere, there's comfort in sort of knowing that there is a destination or an outcome for that travel.
So the idea of like, if you're going from, you know, LA to San Francisco, you know that how much time you have, and then so you can almost create stories and things and work out the parameters to then have adventure. Whereas if you don't know where you're gonna end up, there's almost no parameters, no framework, no boundaries. And so then you can't actually, that's exciting. Yeah, well, it's exciting, but I guess it doesn't necessarily, potentially on a long road, it can be darker.
I suppose it turns out you want, I think the first example is like the best times you have in life are unexpected, I find like all surprises or, I mean, that's what laughter is like, it's always an unexpected thing. But the best nights I have is when we didn't plan, or we were gonna bed and then we ended up doing this and going out here. And do you never find you trying to hack that? So it's like, ah, I'm sure it's gonna bed as well.
Or maybe not. Let's go out. That's why Uber Eats is great, right? Because it's like, ah, it'd be outrageous to have dessert now.
Yeah. But Uber Eats has free picalina. Bit of paper. Oh, yeah, but that's right.
Yeah, which one? Which one is which? There's one Smith, anyway, I think I've got to get bogged down with it. I find that it's quite hard in summer, because they're OG, gelato, they don't hold as well, they get liquidy.
So if your personality's saying how it's extreme, what's your outcome for it? What do you remedy that? Or how do you comfort? Or how do you please it?
Well, I think it's like the draft thing, right? It's like the drafts of showing up every day, having consistent things, lowering the barrier of what success looks like. So I think that potentially I look too far too big, and not like, and so when I go too far too big, the real small things that actually have impact go by the wayside. So things like actually being conscious about email, and just sending the email back to the put, or even doing washing, or those types of things, where it's like, I think that in the extreme mindset, sometimes you can be like, I can't think about that.
I don't have time to be thinking about these small dumb things, because I'm trying to work out this big thing. I think you've done a good job, Josh, this year of not knowing, you could say outcome, but not being able to have the answer of what something we're doing is going to bring us or do for us or evolve to. So then knowing something will come out of it. Well, that's it.
But you don't know what it is. So it's like a detachment of outcome, but also recognizing that this is the outcome. Like, so the thing is, if the show had to stop for whatever reason today, like, if it wasn't on to my own. It's a good idea.
But we would still love having this conversation. And that's like what you were talking with Ryan about the process. If you love the process, and it's like, okay, all of a sudden the internet goes down, we'll probably just get a campfire or whatever. And still talk.
I mean, like when I was trying to sense what you guys love about this, and I'd suggest it might be connection. It's just like having that curiosity or a space to connect with one another and connect with other people. I mean, that's what I love about my purpose, it's just an opportunity to sit down, look in the eyes and just connect with one another. I mean, that's what you must love doing it together with.
Like, your friendship must have really grown and flourished and become somewhat of a marriage, I suppose. Yeah, I mean, they're also interested, like catching up with people that I haven't seen in a long time. And then the depth you go to, like we go to with the people is a very unique thing. It's like this, it's so unusual.
It's so unusual. It's what primitive, I think. Like how we sit around fires and test audience and share experiences and share research. And so if slow is your word for the year or you've been trying to slow it right down, what does it look like moving forward?
I think being more conscious of what, how I accelerate. So be aware and do it in a more content. I've done a lot, like this is all I've done, I've done contented projects before, but like be more absolutely content in what I create. I create in it for the love of the purpose of it, rather than a focused outcome.
And I get to say this many times, but like I feel like that's such a fuck up in my brain. I'm thinking where I can't do that. So you say big, I think that, which is I think like an exciting thing, right? Which is like, I think like the conversations you and I have, it's like how to create the multi-million dollar business, right?
And like I've done the same thing. It's like, well, you got to, it's that whole thing. Like you're gonna make a dollar before you make $10 and $10 before you make $100 and $100 before a thousand. And so what is some of those smaller, what's the small thing that's not outcome driven that you're excited about for 2020, do you think?
Small, I'm making little videos that I think got somewhat of a thought provoking mind expanding, liberating sense about. I love those edits that you've, what's the... So I'm on the... So just taking something that I think is funny and then making it more absurd and try to interweave something that makes people think differently.
I think it's, I'm hoping to do some more work with Russell around next year as well. I've worked for him a bit in the past and... Can we talk? Yeah.
Yeah. And so doing something... Stay at your place. Doing something that's like I really like his work in that sense that it's laughter, but there's enlightened thinking interwoven with it.
And I think that's, for me that's... That's a newer ground of content or I guess. Like, because these are the fires, the phones are the fires of what fires used to be. Our phones are that kind of...
No, I'm a pyromaniac, you know? 24, 7. There. There's always one loose unit around the five.
Always there? You snoo here, Jeff. So do you spend a lot of time on your phone, Jeff? No, not really.
But I think just offering something into that space where everyone's attention is in this day and age that actually does something that helps them, but doing in a way that's fun. So you kind of appeal to their level of short attention span thinking, but you're actually delivering something that's insightful that will actually help them. I feel like that's a two punch, really. And I'm learning how to do that better.
Like I want to do that really, really well. What's in the platform? It's like McDonald's doing salads, you know? You've got someone who's going in.
Do you get an irrelevant platform? Well, yeah, no, like it's... But you've got the attention. And it's like doing something...
You've got people who are potentially unhealthy or whatever, and you don't get interested in it. Just doing it for... Because I'll push it. We've got to make this work joint look a little bit healthy.
Is anyone ever had a salad from Maccans? No, it would be craft-roaring. So drug dealer who gives these customers a bit of pentadol because they've got a headache from the night before? Yeah.
Did I do that? Maybe. It's not a bad idea. I actually think that notion is what's...
Because you need to be relevant. If you're going to drop insightful wisdom, like Dalai Lama, it's like you're going to do it on TikTok. I love Dalai Lama on TikTok. Yeah, yeah.
Like that. But then it shows like my mum is a yogi and has meditated for the last 50 years. I said, do you have a table where you're not? No.
She just does it. She's not intense about it. She's just baked in. She's always just doing her meditation and yoga and it's her life.
And she has her gurus that she looks to and part of my hands are yoggananda. He's a guru for thousands of people around the world. Old school. What he was when he was on earth and what he is now.
Like it probably excels beyond what he believes, probably was even capable. And so the thing is, it's interesting because it's almost still outcome focused when we're thinking that the content we're creating and being relevant to the platforms and where it goes, there is an outcome. We need to get to the people. Whereas these people back in the day, no social media, they wrote books, they documented their life and people around them.
They probably heard whispers of them and now they're exceeding that based on these platforms and stuff. And so it's a weird thing because you don't want to just write stuff on a piece of paper and it's not happening. I think it's holding it lightly, I'd say. Because you need to be relevant.
I mean, if you contribute something, it's important. I think it's worthwhile being relevant because if you contribute in something that you think will help people, it's worth taking a moment to try to appeal to their level of thinking. And that's why I think it's like how loosely it's not like unmasked. That's why I like that Vadik principle, which is a bit yogi as well.
And it's like, you surrender preference and it's a particular outcome, but you hold it loosely. You know what you think will work. I think it's that lightness that is the key. So, yeah, because it's a hard one because it's the times of change.
And so you're not the platform. I think it's an Andy in the time that they've been there within sort of media and mainstream, things have changed tapes. And so all the principles remain the same. The medium is not the monster necessarily.
You just adjust comedy. We've got all these universal truths. And so part of it is like, there's things that are funny and there's things that aren't funny or there's stuff that will were potentially better on certain things. So being able to do quick, funny stuff versus sort of longer burn, slower burn time.
When Instagram was 15 seconds. Yeah. So the whole thing is like, I think that the... Had the film in the app.
You had to stitch him in the... Okay. So it's like there's the universal, like I guess, even if you look at self-development, I guess what I love is even with authors, when I read a book that I really love that's being done in 2019 or 2018 or wherever it is, I want to be like, oh, when is, what were they reading? And then it ends up being stuff that's super fucking old.
It's like Ryan Holiday with stoicism and all that sort of thing. These things are actually universal and they're just doing a great job of making it relevant for the students. And that's what profits are or whatever. It's like, okay, creating a relevant message through metaphors and all the real stories, however you want to view it.
I guess that's part of it. I love that. I think the other people that are really charming, for me, two examples are Johnny Pollard, who's a meditation teacher. And he's taken this ancient, you know, like, I guess psychology around the mind and spirit and made it super relevant and so charming.
And like, just the way he's almost, it feels so such little ego in his teaching that he just feels so, like, he gravitates towards him and also empower, who's an incredible Tantra teacher, which is not all sexual. It's just living life to the fullest essentially and understanding, having a great self awareness. But she does it in such an attractive way that you're so charmed. And I think that there's so many teachers out there in terms of the spiritual and personal development.
What is it called? Tantra? Tantra is life. Not sexual.
I never know. Tantra is sex. I mean, Tantra is more like a... Look at that, 97.
Please. I've been in a couple workshops, I don't know. But it's essentially about understanding your body's energy centers and understanding how you can communicate with another person and their love languages and... Dada.
So, what is the definition? What are they? Tantra says, so it's a holistic practice. It's not about sex or orgasm.
It's about the journey you take to get there. Maybe that could be sort of... Life hack, boy. Yeah, life hack.
So, Mr. 97 is, he's got a club for 2020 and it's the life hack of club. So, looking at different sort of things that life hack of club could do. That sounds very outcome focused.
That's what I love about this. That's why I love about this. It's not outcome because it's all about the journey. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, so it's Western variation of Tantra associated with new religious movements. Is it foreplay? No, it's actually not...
I mean, like the main thing I love. I mean, the foreplay doesn't have to have orgasms in it. Sex is always an orgasm. It's like an organisation.
Really? I mean, if it's good enough, folks. But actually it's not an episode of foreplay. That doesn't count as foreplay.
No, no, no, no. Yeah, true. It's like before the... Yeah, before the...
What does it spell with F-O-U-R? Like, four? F-O-R? How do you spell foreplay?
F-O-I-E. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Four. Is that like before?
Can you look at the word foreplay? Yeah, four. That's number. That's interesting.
Yeah, I mean, what's the... The sexual activity that proceeds into course. So, it's the sexual activity. So, I guess the thing about what's it called again?
Tantra. Tantra isn't necessarily sexual. No, but the... A big component of it is like, yeah, enjoying the pleasure of the component of the sexual without having orgas, in particular for men.
And then the multiple buttons and women are understanding those. Is it one of the chakras sexual? Yeah, the root chakra. Like, so then it's a lot to do a breathing exercise to see like a blueboard, essentially.
So, you send the energy up to higher chakras so you can just go for it longer. Feel it in the chest. Yeah, yeah. So, this is like a...
What's it called if you... What's it called if you... Jack it quickly? Prove it to your heart.
So, this is a potential mechanism to... It's a... So, rather than taking a nasal spray or something, you could potentially... How is that going to show?
The chakra thing. Maybe I take that from a sign. Do you want it? I've got a position.
Don't mean to describe it. Yeah. Okay. This is called the Lotus.
Sorry, James. This is what we do. Step one, have your partner sit cross-legged. Sit on your partners, upper thighs and cross your ankles behind their back.
Okay. Breathe in sync and stare into each other's eyes. Okay. Great.
Or you can do it by yourself. Sit cross-legged with your back straight. Place your palms on your knees. Begin to breathe slowly and deeply.
That's meditation, essentially. Yeah. And it's basically like a whole of that in deep connections. There's a lot of eye gaze and stuff.
A lot of it is essentially like with staying in from orgasm. And you can actually charge yourself a lot of energy. The more you don't come, the more energy you can... You actually feel a greater amount of vital energy in your day.
It's very interesting. I'll try once I've learned about it. I was like, this is ridiculous that I always... This is like the November thing.
Yeah, it actually is. It actually came from itself. So do you try and then... So have you paired back the amount of times you're coming in a week?
Yeah. So you don't. Is that removing masturbation? No, you do that.
But then you... Before you... You're a monster. So you don't orgasm but you masturbate?
Yeah. So you don't do it to material. You do it for longer and you don't... The intention is not to climax.
So you just ride this wave that essentially looks like a graph. So if you... And eventually your pleasure curves because you never climax. It's like that.
You know that... Like building a load essentially. Yeah, building a load. Seriously.
Yeah. The higher you bring this pleasure curve and drop and then ride it again and drop it. And never climax. That pleasure curve ends up being like way higher than an orgasm would be if you just busted a nut.
Same feeling. Same feeling. Yeah. It's insane.
Like it's almost like a deli. You're saying that it feels like so without busting a nut. That's the term isn't it? Without a jacket you can have an orgasm without ejaculating.
Is that what you're saying? Exactly. And so how do you know... What's the different...
How do I know? It's like a full body sensation. Like you know when it really goes. And you know the difference between...
Like because I guess my concern would be that I fucking think of it one's the other and I just end up... Yeah. It's fasten. I really encourage people to drive it because it's like...
So how do we start? If we want to sit myself up like we're gonna start. No, I do know. It's right in a pleasure wave rather than looking at for an outcome.
It's essentially what we're talking about. Enjoying the process and keep riding that process curve and never having that outcome means that you have way more energy, like vital energy in the day. But dreams. Yeah.
You can curve that by like not setting intentions before you sleep, not pleasuring yourself before you sleep, all these kind of things. Well think about young men, maybe women, but men masturbating to pornography. Quick. Yeah.
Quickly can I get it done sort of thing. That's a great example. Which then leads to the primitive ejaculation stuff. It's like you're geared to as soon as you have sex.
I want to go. Yeah. I've done the... Doing some training.
Just testing. Yeah, you don't. You push it out. Because most young men's pattern would be wank wank wank, come, do porn quickly because I need to get done.
I got six of these to get through for today. And I really like this. Well, it's such a quiet day. And so then the opposite is don't let it happen to you.
So it's not always familiar with the ejaculation. Yeah. You change your relationship to the pleasure. It's super interesting.
It's super interesting. It's super interesting. And the more you start doing it, you're like, this is ridiculous and I've never done this before. Why are people talking about this?
I mean, this is all this new age shit. It gets woo woo woo. And it gets, like even though not November, there's so much ignorant talk around it. But that's the fun of it.
That's the ignorant bit. Just like I'm understanding about the intention. Why are you actually doing it? Why are you actually doing it?
Why would you not bust it? I'm not like minimally into bust nuts. I think I just saw some real testosterone field. Don't take my fucking orgasm away from me.
But yeah, I think, and what I'm saying, the non-enerimpro just understanding that it's about connection and a deeper, the most psychedelic experience I've had during meditation and during sex compared to and then doing acid and then doing the same thing. So how many of you got close to it without something? Yeah, yeah. Which I think is really important to know.
How many days have you gone in a row of like the build up where you are self-pleasuring but not busting enough? About four weeks. Nothing crazy. But people do it for like a lot longer than that.
I'm new to this. I only started doing this tonch of stuff about three or four months ago. But it's something that a lot of people like naturally do a really good partner anyway. It's not like it's just building framework and thinking and practices around it that makes you expand your ability to do it more.
But no doubt like, you know, a lot of people do tonch or like sex just because they're really in the moment of their partner. Right? It's a nice event for a lot for you, isn't it? Yeah, yeah.
Anything to us before we have to get out? No, I appreciate it. I'm not a meditatation. You've been generously doing workshops and teaching people eva- is a Vedic meditation?
It's kind of like that. It's a bit like TM, a bit like Vedic meditation. It's basically a mantra based meditation where you hold your awareness on this mantra which is a Sanskrit sound that mantra is just a mind vehicle and you just have your awareness on it for 20 minutes twice a day and it allows you to sink into- it's like a weight in the ocean. It allows you to sink into the deepest states of what you are or deeper, deeper experience of what you are.
And the more you familiarize yourself with it, like I would say the baseline of what you are which is just a innocent be-in-ness. The more you can witness or the higher levels of thinking, the neurotic, continual thought patterns that are all unconscious that we don't. Isn't Freud that said like 95% of our intentions or our behavior is motivated from the unconscious I think. So it's like when you sink into these deeper states of being or experiencing your be-in-ness you kind of have an ability to watch and observe and analyze I guess or reflect on all this unconscious behavior that you're acting from.
And I think it's insane because we don't prioritize that more in society because we're running around like being motivated and acting from a fucking huge part of ourselves that we're not even aware we're doing. Like you speak to some people sometimes and it's like- Just reacting and responding to the reaction and not really listening. Again this is Tantra stuff, it's really focused on listening. There's a bunch of other things that talk about this stuff.
But having the ability to listen which is obviously what you guys do is all because you have to do it in this space to be a good listener. You really have to let go of your reaction to what they're saying. You almost like go completely your eyes completely on their brain. Incently absorbing their experience without this compulsive thing to- Oh yeah, I did that once.
Well if the answer is not more stimulus or information. So that's the age we're in right? And so people don't need more thought. It's actually stepping back to observe the thousand, sixty thousand plus thoughts we have a day.
Even if we don't need more toys, use the toys that you've got in your fucking toy room. No, I don't even use them. Look at them from the door. Actually you sort them first.
Sure. But then you've got to step to the door and look at them. And then think about what are these things? I think it's okay to enter the door.
Potentially move them around and adjust and get out. I think it'd be in and out. You spend all day in the toy room, it's not healthy. That's right.
So we're parenting podcasts. Like getting super deep with it. I've been doing this practice in Sam Harris's app where he gets you to look at an object. And so we're the subject and the object over there, the camera right here is the object, focus on the object.
So you're putting however we do that, however we focus, you're doing that. And then look to the object. Where is that focus coming from? And it's like, I don't have the answer.
I don't even know. But it does. What it does is he's purposes to become one with it all rather than have it as an object over there. So it's almost like is it potentially like looking at an object, a camera, a missing 97.
And then take the focus away from looking at this 97 to reverse look back at who he's doing the focus. But then on top of that, it is what is the fucking focusing? What is that whole thing? That's truth.