#72: Timefall

Frozen lasagna medium power 15 minutes sounds like oh Joe time let's play I forget about lasagna let's celebrate Sacred symbols a PlayStation podcast is brought to you by well you if you want to learn how to support our show go to Collins last Dan calm greetings and citations welcome back to sacred symbols a PlayStation podcast. This is episode 72 My name is Colin Moriarty. I'm joined as always by Chris ray gun bridges Chris. Thank you so much for joining me today Of course, do you think a lot of people will get that reference?

I assume a lot of people get that reference I assume so yeah, it's a death stranding reference It is and finally Chris and I had the opportunity to go to the game so we can buy it to start playing the game We're gonna talk in depth about that today and just a little while. I'm really excited Yeah, I think Chris about it because I don't really know exactly what he's thinking about it You know, I don't know I can't I can't assume to know all these things. I'm not I can't be everywhere. Okay.

Yeah Right, yeah, yeah, I don't wield the mystical and arcane powers that you wield in order to Randomly bring these games into existence that we talk about and so I'm trying to get in touch with my arcane Third eye. Let's call it. Yeah, they're not is there a third year Yes, yeah, I would assume so right there's a third there's a there's an additional everything probably addition Yeah, anything you can sense. Yeah, like a third nostril or a second nose right right right.

Yeah. Yeah, I think that makes sense I love that. That's perfect. Thank you so much for that Chris.

All right Chris Let's get right into what I think is some news that we we have to get it over with we've been hiding we've had a little secret you and I yeah and You know, it's not a first time a few secrets some of them are romantic We're not gonna tell you about all of our secrets. Yeah, but this particular secret about sacred symbols is that as I announced today on patreon And everyone can read it whether a patron or not. So go check it out. I am moving I am officially after 12 and a half years 12 and a half years since Chris was born I've lived in California and I'm finally leaving I'm moving to Richmond, Virginia to be with my family I'm gonna buy a house and hang out I'm gonna be an Italian son for just a little while, you know with my mom I'm gonna hang out with my family kind of bounds around a little bit I think that I think I can get away with that for a little while, you know Get fanned up a little bit do all that kind of stuff But I know that people had been and I anticipated this and Chris knew that I was anticipating this I was like people are gonna be worried about our ability to do the show remotely What are we gonna do about it?

And we're doing this show remotely right now, but in secret We did episode 69 of the show remotely episode 71 of the show remotely sacred symbols plus 10 and sacred symbols plus 11 all done remotely How many people noticed? Yeah, we've done we've done like a bunch of them. How many people noticed nobody nobody noticed? So no, no, I think I think one person wrote in asking if it was because they noticed some and I don't know what it was but we have a lot of listeners many tens of thousands of people listen to our show and No one noticed so I think we're good.

What do you think that Chris? I think that's great super convenient for me. Definitely I know I think that I mean even today Chris was actually gonna come over I'm still in LA right now I'm actually gonna go to Virginia for a few weeks starting next week to just kind of hang out and start to settle myself and Bea I'm gonna do there But I texted Chris this morning because he was gonna come over and I'm like what's even the point? I'm coming over at this point.

It's just you being in a car for a combined three hours of your life wasting money We don't the show is just as good the audience lets us know when something is wrong. Yeah, I mean this is the internet Yeah, though, I know they'll relentlessly you know Chris is what they're gonna do So that's happening and I'm excited about it. Nothing changes you guys I'm gonna read the letter but a lot of this really has to do with me and kind of my own emotional well-being and that I don't think that I've tended to myself Appropriately in building Collins last day and I think I've ignored a lot of pain and a lot of turmoil inside of myself and kind of built a wall Around myself and Chris really is one of the only people I ever see so because Chris is one of my trust So I have to change that I think part of me changing that Chris is going home and being around my family and Richmond even though We are Islanders my mom and step dad to live down there now both of my sisters and their families live down there my uncle and Aunt and cousin live down there my brother Dagan's only an hour flight away my dad is only an hour flight away on the island so I think this is gonna be good for me and I think necessary and I really wanted to make sure that we took care of the Product and we are we took care of it. You guys didn't notice and that's all I needed and I was so nervous not only about that but about announcing and I was a nervous that people were gonna be mad at me for some reason and the Thousands of comments that I've gotten today across Twitter and page round and Facebook and elsewhere and tech and my phone's blown up all positive So I really do appreciate and thank you so much for that And I really do think Chris as well because he's really been a sounding board for me for months as I've meticulously and common like fashion work through this in my mind Yeah, it's been it's been a journey it has so I appreciate your patience on that Chris I'm glad that you're excited and happy with it too because I think our show can go on for many years to come in this remote format So definitely all right so as people know our show is born on patreon.com slash Collins last and we do an extra episode of sacred symbols each week Called sacred symbols plus that is only for patrons last week's was an investigation into kind of game journalism and what's going on?

With the taco and dead spin and the go media people and stuff it's a little bit of a political conversation You can go check that out this week's sacred symbols plus is gonna be a little more lighthearted We're gonna jump back into the mailbag and as people know we've been saving your questions comments concerns often ideas that we can't quite wedge Into a normal show so we're gonna start wheeling down that list as well And I'm really excited and looking forward to do that because I really do feel bad We get so many inquiries from the audience on patreon and we just can't use them all it's it I feel bad about that. Yeah, I wish I could see him. I know I gotta I gotta get you a patreon like I really gotta Like lean on them now. You're on patreon too So you know how it is with them, but yeah, it's annoying.

They don't really seem to improve the product very much, you know on the back end anyway for the front end I think it gets improved but one of the things I've been asking them for like administration access from not only for you But for dustin and for other people I run up. It's my business You know, it's not like I'm like some dude working and this is my side gig So I don't have all the tools that might disposal and one of those tools why have I have the greatest tool of all my Disalls which is Chris, but I was I was fun. It was nice. It was all mean I mean, it was nice.

It was like it was mean, but it was like it was like East Coast. I mean which is like vaguely nice I'm getting it all back into my veins. Yeah, so yeah, we need those tools and I'll keep leaning on them I know a lot of people are having problems with the RSS to remember I'm sorry not the RSS to be the patreon app remember that you can use our RSS to just not use the patreon app So there you go very easy so look forward to that Chris as always we have a few corrections comments concerns thoughts ideas notions Attention that I want to get before we get into what we're playing which is Death's branding. So let's take these in the order that I've written them down here.

No specific order of course Christian Colter wrote in with some patreon. It says hey Colin just a quickie Is it money or time consuming to change the album art on an episode by episode basis in the podcast feed those pictures I come with the podcast on YouTube look at nice. Do we get them on the audio? It's a good question question So I actually make them nails for each episode of the show which people on patreon see YouTube and certain podcast services I don't know Chris why certain podcast services do not take album art on a episode by episode basis We're uploading this album art to the to the podcast feed to the RSS like launcher But it's not finding its way in certain places all the podcast I listen to have the same issue I use the Apple podcast.

I don't know. I don't know how I can fix that for you. No idea David Colin Copeland Maybe related to the great drummer Stuart Copeland from the police says hey slightly by curious Colin and creamy because everyone likes calling you creamy That is I don't like that. Yeah, it's very It doesn't conjure a nice visage.

No very well put Colin How does it he has no he takes issue with me with this thing? I've been complaining about PS VR and I wanted to read this aloud He says Colin how does it not make sense that wires come out of both ends of the PS VR processing unit if you look at it It's a baby PlayStation which has courts coming out of the back Which go to the TV and cords that come out of the front to charge the controller It would make absolutely no sense that all the courts come out of the back of the device only on the back All the cords go towards your PS4 and TV on the front the courts come out to the thing you wear in your head makes perfect sense And you are wrong well mr. Coblin first of all you smell your middle name Colin with two else You know how I feel about that Now I have a problem with this because we do complain I specifically complain about the PS VR unit having these wires coming out of both ends But it's not the same as charging controller in front of PS4 PS3 Everyone look at your PS4 right now And you can see how the cord in front of it is removable and in fact, it's just a flat surface Yeah, that looks clean the PS VR unit looks like a home brewed 1970s Apple computer with all the cords coming out of it all the way It's very in elegant is the best way to put it in feeling so I don't know Maybe I'm wrong David Colin Copeland with two L's David Colin Copeland two L's he had a problem with this And I don't know if he's a loaner others also take on bridge with what I have to say about the PS VR unit I find it quite an elegant. Yeah, I mean it is I think it's objectively like it's the it is a very cumbersome thing VR in general is like this is kind of just a problem with VR It's just it's very just messy and in elegant and very unpleasant to look at when it's not being used even when it is being used It's quite Lee.

It's quite not pleasant to see indeed jump around and sweating. Yeah, I don't want I mean I sweat enough just staying still yeah, exactly so you can imagine what I look like when I'm playing PS VR Garrett Roberts wrote in was a CNC minor correction for episode 71 while talking about Call of Duty's Dev cycle You said the next year's game is being developed by sledgehammer while this was initially the case sledgehammer and Raven Rachely pulled off of the project and whatever they had developed was given to Treyarch I'll be putting Call of Duty Black Ops 5 I didn't hear anything about black ops 5 Which is heavily rumored to be a soft reboot of the black ops some franchise similar to what the new modern warfare is a lot of people wrote in about this Chris I was an error about this. I don't know what sludge I was doing then hopefully something else Yeah, what the hell is that then and of course precious Raven who I always wanted to see make a new game with a I know I don't think Ravens made a game of their own like a decade now So it's kind of sad I think singularity in that Wolverine game where the last and that was last generation So yeah, Garrett and others. Thank you for the correction duly noted Nick You shinske wrote into us about Shenmue which we talked about last week for some reason he says hey guys in the last episode You talked about there being no hype for Shenmue 3 it comes out on the 19th for $60 and best buys leaked black Friday Ed Shenmue 3 will be $35 that's less than two weeks from its initial release the publisher must know this game is going to I Did see it yeah somehow for some reason I'm very in tune with Shenmue news and I did manage to see this I don't know I think they understand that it's a niche product and they just want to get it out to as many people who might be able to Afford it might be curious enough to buy it.

I mean we talked about this last time. It's such a niche game man It really is it was not a system that was a niche system. So I mean like what do you do? That's true.

Yeah, Dreamcast only sold about 12 million units before it was discontinued Unceremoniously in the spring of 2001 I remember very well see 2001 was really tough because in the spring we had Dreamcast Decommission that's where and then we had 9-11. Yeah, so it was not a it was not a great year But yeah Shenmue 3 already preemptively discounted $25 on best buys black Friday at apparently leaked it So if you're looking forward to playing Shenmue 3 and you can wait And I don't see why you wouldn't be able to wait two weeks because there's so many or there are so many games out right now And coming out then you can save a cool 25 bucks and then yeah, I mean you can subscribe to Collins last day I'm 25 dollars at the $2 per month level will pay for an entire year of Collins last day on Patreon By the way, and that will let you get all the access secrets of all these kinds of things I just had to throw that out there Just in case you're just in case you're looking to save some money on Shenmue 3 and that money's burning a hole in your pocket Very large Shenmue 3 fan community. So for some reason I we probably do yeah probably Cameron O'Neill wrote in what said hey See during last week's podcast you both seemed perplexed about why you we saw that other publishers would be announcing PS4 and PS5 games And not just one skew to me It seemed perfectly clear that the reason is PS5 games will be 69 99 not 59 99 This seems to be keeping with your long-held theory that game prices are bound to rise eventually Do you guys think this could contribute to why the backwards and forwards compatibility verbiage has been cryptic from Sony? Thanks for all the hard work Cameron might be honest on something here Chris, but God forbid that that that's actually true because that's gonna be really confusing to people I don't know if I'm sold on that I think of anything they'd want to keep prices the same specifically because the digital storefronts are now like the Main way that people buy video games and also because they've got all these subscription services that are hooking people onto the platform So I don't actually necessarily think there is as much of a need for a rise in price as there used to be now If that makes sense No, it does it's all about like you're saying it's about volume versus price And the argument always goes in economics that if you lower the price you can push more volume and theoretically if your margins are high enough You can actually make more of a profit by selling more at a lower price I mean not just basic economics, but the what's confusing to me about Cameron's idea here is he's on to something I think they do think prices are gonna ubiquitously go up next generation But with PS5's forward compatibility it really does put people in a dicey situation because if the PS5 version of watchdogs Legion or whatever is 70 and then PS4 version that goes in your PS5 is 60 then that just means that no one's gonna P5 games even if they have a PS5 which is only my not care about it the third party's might not care about but That's why I think that all of the game prices have to go up on a console or in an ecosystem So you can release goes to Sushima as a PS4 game natively if $60 and keep it there But killzone whatever five is gonna cost $70.

I think that's the way it's gonna go now If anything would make more sense to have them be the same price So that way you're like oh well I might as well just get the PS5 one Yeah, that's a good point because why would I get the why would I get the probably worst one maybe I don't if however the hell they're doing this I just I just feel like we're gonna be talking about this for just ad nauseam for months. It's gonna be it's gonna be a relentless conversation I don't know. I'm excited to learn more simply so we don't have to have the conversation But we'll have it I mean that's what you want. We'll have it Fuck it Jordan wrote in West said fellas I was initially going to let this slide but I feel like the information is too important to go instead and this is a weird one I don't know Jordan, but I'm gonna read it What we're really gonna do this it says last week we were all lamenting a young man that shit himself on a date now Probably ended poorly for him.

I can't believe I have to say this but you shake yourself in public going to a bathroom So I'll clean yourself up take off your underwear and dump them in the trash going command Oh until you get back home is a vast improvement over walking around with shitty underwear if this information just saves one date The three of us will be heroes for having disseminated to the masses may you go forth with draws on chat now Jordan I feel like you're really jumping the gun here because last week when we talked about the young man who went on a date and Shout himself. I don't feel like we had any detail information that he just kept did we talk about how we just kept the underwear his dirty underwear on I mean I see that way. Yeah, why would you why would you do that? Yeah?

I don't see that seems so that seems like such a bad Like even just from a basic mammalian survival instinct standpoint like it seems like you would like You'd not want to walk around and ruined underwear and people got plenty of underwear It's not like a nice shirt, right? You're like, oh man. I don't want to throw my nice shirt away You know there's that he definitely threw it away. There's like that's that's a stranger something on your assumption on your part Jordan Yeah, Jordan.

I think I mean do you have a scat fetish? I mean you could be honest with me. I'm not gonna judge you If you can't answer me, I will judge I will judge Chris is gonna judge you for sure But I mean I guess my I don't know because if I want to know what the nature of this chart was because if it was not that catastrophic Where it's just a little bit on your cheeks and so you could probably clean it up thoroughly enough to keep your underwear on No, no, no, no, no, no because then you risk that I mean because then you have nothing no barrier To a potential further disaster. I mean this is kind of what I'm talking about I'm how many times how many times do you shake yourself more than once in a day though?

Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah, that's like that's not a that's not like a shotgun scenario. Sure. That's a good point That's a good point.

I don't think I should myself more than once on a day today I mean that would be unbelievable. Yeah, you know now I got an endoscopy and colonoscopy a few times and I had a clean myself out for that over like an 18-hour period and I was I mean you don't Holy moly dude the things that they give you and the things they tell you to go buy and take so that you clear yourself out for the Sir for the procedure. You've never seen a situation quite like that. Yeah, I'm quite glad I'm quite glad I have not Let's just put it like that.

Finally before we get to the games we're playing Brad Erode and what's it? Hey, CNC I write seeking your sympathies and advice I consider myself an adult and like to think I can handle life struggles, but I've been shaken to my core yesterday I played Rocket League online and was ruthlessly bullied by a gang of children I was relentlessly bombarded with such hateful things we cannot even speak of them I'm a sensitive guy and these kids just eventually got to me and started I started sweating could barely hold the controller the little bastards mentally broke me when my wife came home I went for their arms like a little baby. So I asked what does a man do when one does one one does not shit talk? How about you two you always get pushed around?

How do you cope? My wife said she's gonna sell my PS4 if I keep crying Please help and thanks for the sport. Well, thank you Brad. I assume you're joking.

Maybe you're not I've always been kind of interested in this because you're more of an online much more online gamer You hear people you talk people online for sure what you do when you don't want a shit talk See or you don't want to play that game, you know And you just want to play the game you're playing in other words you don't want to play the med game Oh, yeah, it's very it's very rare that I don't feel like relentlessly bullying people who don't deserve it But sure on the off chance that I don't I just mute people You can people pretty easily I usually do that anyway when I just when I play a game and I'm trying to relax even when people are Nice and they're saying like oh nice work. I'm like, I don't want to hear you I don't want to hear you So I'll just go through the menu and go through the roster and just mute everybody preemptively most of them Most smart smart, but you gotta gotta gotta toughen up man. They're just children. They're gonna be you know depressed real soon I know yeah I mean wait until those children are adults and they adults wait until you're like wait until they're like vaguely vaguely 18 Right and then they're gonna be already like smitten with with with disaster in loss They're I mean they're gonna especially in the generation they're gonna be used to it they're gonna be real used to it Do you think Brad really had a nervous breakdown when he was playing a rock really no I don't think so either But I do think you got to talk about children though.

Yeah, I mean that's rough I'm afraid of kids. I haven't talked about this on the show in the past like I'm scared of kids Because they're so judgmental kids are scary because they're honest and they have they've not yet developed empathy yet Right and you're not you're not quite sure whether or not you know a kid is like fully like There as far as like just having basic human human consideration. Yeah, it's too much like I was supposed to go read a book I think I thought about this show supposed to read a book to like my nephew's class and I wasn't able to for unrelated reasons But I was thinking about I'm like man these kids gonna like harass me and make fun of me because I'm fat or something You know or like I'm ugly, you know, there's a lot of things out there You gotta like I remember being a kid being like guys I guys fat and dumb. Yeah, you know I remember probably saying that verbatim.

Yeah, sure. I mean children mean they're very yeah, and really I mean in this 21st century life they have not very little live for at this point so never for fortnight like the kid that video the kid beating the Shout on the bush outside his house That's like one of my favorite thing that's the only positive thing that I Associate with fortnight. All right, let's get into what we're playing. We're both playing death stranding Yeah, Stephen Stable wrote into us.

He said hey guys not a question but a comment I kind of like that you aren't getting games early anymore normally gaming podcast talk about a game and by the time the public Yes, the play they have already moved on talking about the next new game for example That's raining. I'm playing without knowing what you guys think of it yet. It's like we get to experience it together Anyway, just a silver lining of the industry shitting on you That's kind of fun. Yeah, it is.

Hold some idea. It's it's kind of relieved the stress valve in my own mind for me as well It's stressful and not have the games and I have access and some people do send us games I don't wanna make it seem like no one sends us games But not having to play games are not feeling the need to like be part of the conversation quotes as we say I do and I hate that fucking term Kind of stress free for me because it doesn't seem like the audience really cares. So yeah, it's like a lot of I find that That's like a common opinion with most content nowadays It's like people will wait for like people will wait for donkey to say something and it's fine because it's don't he's opinion He could be like years late really right and you're the new as we understand you're the new donkey. Yes, yeah You're definitely the pie hilarious.

You are you very funny now Chris. Let's talk about that stranding What do you think of kojima's new game? I was really looking forward to hating it and I knew from the second I heard the pitch for it I was like this is this is terrible I'm gonna hate this is gonna be a disaster and somehow I really really love it I did not anticipate feeling that way and I'm kind of still kind of whiplash by that But it does something super cool that I just didn't anticipate and it just I think it's just the gameplay of it The story I still feel is like I don't know what the hell's going on I don't really care that much, but man this gameplay is so mundane and also somehow super engaging I don't know what the hell is going on. It's funny man because I feel a similar way in the sense that I anticipated Being bored or unimpressed by this game and now I've not or I didn't I should say pay too close attention to the different developments of it And the trailers are really soft watching everything about I would say like three years ago Maybe and I saw a little bit of gameplay and a little bit about what the game was and all that but I just I like to say I'm doing the same with the last lesson goes to shima where I'm trying to stay away from games I'm really looking forward to anticipating but I must admit that I was also not really paying attention to that stranding because I just Thought it looked kind of stupid.

Yeah, and I'm with you I'm like in love with it, but it's one of those games that really sets itself in your head and People had been people have been talking about the kojima bump. We talked about the Nintendo bump and the non-dog bump and all that stuff Did this game get a kojima bump? Yeah, probably did but the ironic thing about this game to me is is that Well, because people are asking Chris it could anyone would anyone care about this game of kojima didn't make it would it have this crazy level Of hype and sales success and critical success and I answer like no it wouldn't but no one would have been able to make this game Not because they wouldn't have been unable to but because kojima is one of the very few game creators that can go demand a hundred Million dollars to make his game and come up with a result just like this so that's what I think the most interesting thing Is about death training that yeah kojima is giving this game a bump But it comes from his mind and really he's one of the only people that would really be able to realize this game as it is Is that making sense? So I agree completely and I don't even know if there's necessarily a bump now because like there's so many reviews that are like This is garbage or this is like this is not fun This is bad and it makes total sense This is like a very specific kind of game that your average person might not be totally down for I don't know if it got a bump as much as a Metal Gear game would have gotten a bump because like I said like I like Metal Gear Just fine, but I don't really care about could you I hated Metal Gear Solid 4 like with a burning passion like I couldn't sand it Yeah, it's like actually it's one of my least favorite games I think probably of all time and The fact that I can go into this game looking at Death Stranding No-Hype Expecting to really really not like it and somehow come out Genuinely really really appreciating and genuinely enjoying Most of my time if not pretty much all of it with it I think that says something I think that says there's something there and I don't really know how to really talk about it Because it is a walking sim it's a walking simulator, but not in like a derogatory way if that makes sense Yeah, it's a mechanical walking simulator.

Yeah, we actually have a letter about this from Michael Casper who said Hey, see for all the talk about that string being a walking simulator It's got to be the best damn walking I've ever experienced in my life The walking is a better Michael than the walking in your real life The walking is the moment-to-moment gameplay just like destiny is a shooter Death Stranding is a walker I've never seen something so mundane be so engaging where you're trying to carry as much as possible balance avoid the BT's where the enemies in the game keep your Cargo containers at 100% strength introverse treacherous landscapes all while you have this towering So besides low trap to your back really curious to hear your thoughts on the game and whether you fall into the pretentious Gojima or industry pioneer gojima camp after experiencing the first few hours of the game Well, I think we've already mentioned that last part Michael I think that it's a little bit of both, but I think they come together and you can only get this game out of Gojima now For me Chris, I was here's my fundamental confusion about Death Stranding and this was my confusion going way back was Metal Gear Solid 5 came out four years ago almost to the date actually recording this it came out four years and ten days ago from the time I'm recording this was I remember it was oh no it was actually long than I thought it was November 1st It was actually September 1st as I recall so a little more than four years ago and assuming the exit with Konami Gojima takes a little bit of time he gets a team together he figures things out He ultimately gets with Sony you have to shove the calendar to at least 2016 right? Yeah, I was confused like how the fuck did they make this game so quickly and I realized when I was playing it exactly How they made the game so quickly with very rare exception there are no enemies in the game the game is completely empty any of the AI Counter is basically on a computer or on these little consoles so in other words there's not much to build apart from the expansive world the menu based systems and the story and when you when you think about it through that lens I'm like okay three and a half years Including about 75 people from gorilla that worked on the game because it's a decimal running game I'm like okay that makes a little more sense so that was one of the things that I walked away with when I was playing It was I was like it it's not that it hard to believe that they made this in three and a half years actually because there's Because there's not that much to it when you really think about it. It's not like it's not really involving You know I mean yeah, there's not there's not a lot of surface stuff There's not like a bunch of levels and like a bunch of different, you know scenarios that you have to play through anything But man is this is a beautiful game. This is a crazy good looking game.

It does look great. It does look great He says like pretentious kajima and industry pioneer It's like it's weird because I feel like kajima thinks he's brilliant in all the ways that he isn't but he is brilliant It's like weird like this is this game places him is super cool and super new and super interesting and I love it But I feel like he just he thinks his stories are so incredible when I just feel I don't feel it I don't feel it with the story. It's like really still the dialogue really over explained I guess it's just kind of him. It's like how quinterrentino always has these like, you know really dialogue heavy sequences We're not really much happens.

I don't know if you saw once upon time in Hollywood. No, I haven't I haven't seen that That's a very much like nothing happens kind of movie and it's a movie that really only he could make because he has the you know The clout to demand You know the ability to make such a thing. I feel like it's it's the same thing here But like I think the gameplay systems here and the social systems here and just the the traversal mechanics and the sprawling nature and the loneliness of the map It makes this weird kind of vaguely multiplayer shadow of the Colossus kind of hiking game. That's somehow Really incredible.

I don't really get it. Yeah I would not have been with this because I would have thought like how could you even do this? Well, that was my that's kind of my point is that I think that when people are talking about the industry pioneer the Cojima or the pretentious Cojima would anyone care about the same without for Cojima? We've had a similar situation with Zelda Breath of the Wild which kind of is parallel to this It's just is one of those things where I think it's just the perfect storm where this game just comes in this specific environment from this specific person It's only possible that way so we would never had to answer this question because I don't think we would have been able to even have gotten it Yeah, from anyone else and I feel like Chris that I mean in my opinion I feel like this game was greenlit really quickly and I think that this game could have gone either way and they made something Here's the thing and this is what I tweeted about when I was playing it for the really getting into it this weekend was There really isn't anything like this like when you play a game you can find its Factimally elsewhere in the world or what inspired it, but I've never played anything like this I mean I've been playing games for 30 years in my life and I don't think I've ever played a game even remotely like this and so Finding something like that in the triple a space where you usually find new experiences for better for worse in the indie space I think is actually probably the most extraordinary feat of death stranding is that it's a triple a game that is not like Anything else in the triple a space and that's exceedingly fucking rare.

So that's what I really love about it personally. Yeah, I would agree with it Now as far as the story is concerned now, I should point out we're gonna do a six-plus episode all about this game And we'll do one about the outer worlds later on too So we'll touch on both of these games both those games in deeper ways in terms of mechanics and story And obviously solicit tons of your questions comments concerns lots and ideas when we do that But I will touch on just briefly the story I I disagree with you in the sense that I think the story while incredibly heavy-handed is quite timely and maybe it's just where I am in my own life right now But it's it's resonating with me in a weird way where it's kind of like journey back in 2012 Yeah, actually kind of similar games in way in some respects where you're experiencing this really ethereal and strange experience with other people around you Though you don't really get to interact or know them and draw different conclusions on your experience And so from that angle I've really enjoyed it as well because I don't really care for the whole reconnecting america thing and all this and his obsession with american american politics is obviously well known and established throughout the metal gear franchise, but I like the the underlying message of Interconnectivity and 21st century sadness and this idea that we don't We don't give into each other anymore in a weird interpersonal way like one of the cool things that he establishes in the story early on And I don't think this is a spoiler because it's so early in the game Is if you read one of the pieces of intel you get they talk about how Society started to go towards where we are now in the real world Which is like automation and I wanted to do anything and then we actually tried to reverse it and go back But we couldn't and I think that that's so Pressy and and I like it. I don't know see that's what's interesting about this game is it being incubated for so long It didn't seem as timely back when he was I guess forming this idea it seems so timely now though And that's why I know that the story's a little weird and a little You know, it's full of ephemera and we weird shit and I don't know how much of it matters and there seems to be a bunch of my guffins in the game But I like it. I think it's I think it's really cool.

I definitely don't hate it. I just think there's a really interesting world there that is that is That needs to kind of hop over these barriers of his like still to dialogue to really shine You know, like I like the world and I like the entry of the characters and like the the themes of it are really cool But I just feel like man if you're not at all okay, just like not explain everything to me Like he's a like he's a game manual. That'd be really sick. Yeah, that's that's true And I like how it's just his body, but they have like someone else doing the voice because I guess I guess I guess like a glaremo day author couldn't be asked to Sit in a fucking you know, Vyobooth for a day and read some lines.

So that was interesting. I thought it was cool But it is a it is a game that I would I don't even know how I could recommend it necessarily because it's just so strange But I would recommend experiencing it definitely you know what I mean Yeah, like it's such a niche thing. It feels like I don't know how many people are really gonna resonate with this I've already seen like a drastic mix of opinions on it people I really like I really hate it There's very few people who are if he on it and it does feel like a game that you can't really be if he on I would pay attention to it though Like it this is really cool. There's nothing like it definitely Surprised me and it's definitely on my list of like possible to game of the years depending on the rest of the year shakes up But man, this is cool and I'm excited to just I'm excited to just play it honestly like I want to play it right now Yeah, me too.

I think about it a lot which is which is funny like I don't know it took a little bit for me to warm up to it I know that everyone's saying that you really have to get through chapter three for the game to really expand itself And I'm towards the end of chapter three now. So I think I'm getting to that point But yeah up to that point I've really I really enjoyed it and I can't say why I can't I can't help but think of like the FedEx or UPS driver that listen store show that goes home and plays games and then they're gonna Packages. Yeah, it's like a little meta, but I have to give up to them like this is this really is something unique and Whether that's good unique or bad unique is up to the player, but yeah I don't know man I for me I really look at that specific uniqueness in the triple A space and I just I become an average with it because we have We have games that are so samey that we literally call them like ubsauf type games or checkbox games and open world shooters And these are all great, but I like this and hey man It's another one of these games that where you really don't have to be violent and I enjoy it Yeah, I've been I've been running away. I haven't fought a single thing I've been avoiding combat like crazy And it's actually super intense It's never ever been chased by like these people who are trying to steal my cargo or whatever the mules Yeah, the mules and I was like on this treacherous mountain and I was like oh my god I've got I've got to run so fast, but I'll lose my balance and fall if I'm not super careful It was like probably the most stressful situation I've ever played in any kind of open world game like this Where I get spotted by something I'm just trying to like the map is an enemy and that's so cool That's sick man.

I love it. That's really well put I like too that they there's just no option to put a hood on the screen like a map hood or a radar Yes, so you're always kind of going blind and that is in itself a unique kind of situation I don't know how I feel about that, but yeah, I was thinking the same thing I was like man I wish I wish I kind of had a marker but I learned to kind of get over the fact that I didn't the only complaint Like the UI is like being like a mess. I'm pretty sure I'm only figuring out how to use it successfully just by sheer accident Um, I feel like I've just been stumbling into the right ways to use it It seems like the menus give you a lot of information you don't need and they are busy as hell. It's so funny I don't understand what happened with kojima.

I'd have it around peace walker. I guess when he just started becoming obsessed with like rankings and Repeatable missions and so like this wasn't at all what metal gear and this is a metal gear But this is what all code like even with Zoe and other games that kojima worked on wasn't it all the way he operated and then suddenly out of nowhere, he became really interested in repeatable missions ranks all those kinds of things and I think that this in some way is like the Inevitable conclusion of that. Yeah, what I like about that training too is that I don't I mean I haven't seen the ending So maybe it's a crazy ending. I've only met the villain of the game once so far who's played by trebaker And the villain is excellent.

I really really like the way the villain looks and the kind of Egyptian flair that they give the character. I think it's like really weird and really very very kojima which is cool And I like also the naming conventions in this game just like I'll yourself read the names conventions Die Hardman. Yeah, die hardman and like heart man and all these kinds of things pretty cool Reminds me of like the fury and the pain or whatever those guys wear back I think I'm out of your salary. So there's a lot to really enjoy here But there's more for us to get into Chamarlo max wrote in said greetings c dubs with best training now available to the masses I want to know your thoughts on the varied reviews of the game I feel some reviewers were very lazy in their assessment as painting this game is just a walking simulator when the game has so much more death But yet praise games like what breath of the wild which is very similar to the overall structure of the game with traversal inventory management and simplified combat Do you think the overall trend of saying this game is boring affected some of these reviews?

I understand everyone is entitled to their own tastes But it seems like a few of these critics didn't progress far enough into the game past chapter three to give a fair assessment Keep up the great work. Well, as I always say Chris and I'll say to Chamar If you want to see how far a critic out in a game just go look at their trophies There's there's no way to hide it. There's just there's no way to hide So if you first of all someone review the game only getting into the third chapter of what is like a what a 10 chapter game or something like that They should be totally embarrassed. So if you know who's doing that then you should definitely not trust that person anymore But I and Chris had talked about this.

I see how a person goes into this game and doesn't like it I mean I totally see that and I don't know that there's gonna be much gradient as Chris said earlier So whether you like it or not, I think it's gonna be like very Situational and unique to each person because I can see someone playing this game be like this fucking sucks And I can see someone playing the game be like this is the most enamored I've been with a video game in years I can see both both of those yeah, Jake and Cooster House sort of knows said hey Colin an incredibly near-sighted My question is mostly for Colin, but how do you feel about about platinum's like in Death Stranding? I take 175 hours. This is a huge turn off for me and because of it I will never consider trying to platinum it. What is the maximum amount of hours you will spend a platinum game not 175 hours when I saw that Chris for the first There's a trophy that takes 175 hours together.

What's the what's the yeah? So cumulative platinum trophy apparently is predicted to be 125 to 175 according to power picks p that's power p yx which is a website I just think power picks was actually like one person that was just an incredible work of haul it But that's not actually true and they make these great trophy guys now I criticized their trophy guys in the past because I always think that they actually underestimate how long platinum trophies take so when I saw the 170 hour prediction I was like oh no because I've never hit like they predicted something like four and eight hours or something from Medieval and it took me way longer than that so I feel like it's really annoying But what's confusing to me about Death Stranding trophies and I'm sure you've noticed this Chris is they give you trophies like crazy in this game So the fact that you have to like slowly stack up your trophies and to get the platinum itself will take 175 hours while I'm 20 hours into the game And I have 30% of the trophies already. I just feel like that's a little unbalanced and not fun Well, maybe yeah, I guess it's more of a thing for a trophy people. I don't really I see a trophy I'm like I'll meet okay And I don't think about it until the next thing comes up in fact I kind of find them distracting I usually turn notifications off for trophies.

Oh interesting especially because they tend to just ruin gameplay recordings. That's true. They do do that Yeah, but yeah, I don't know it's definitely doesn't bother me I could so I'm sorry about hours. That's a that's a bit it's weird because Sony first well This isn't this is technically a second party game, but Sony published games typically Well, they have a really varied look and feel to them like the Uncharted games are one thing the last of us had the incredible Multi-player trophies that we want to worry about the last part too Thankfully, but then you have games like God of War and days gone that just take time and effort to get them And then you have a game like Death Stranding that is virtually impossible again unless you want to like play death straining full time So I don't know I feel like that's a design flaw I don't know why you'd want someone to play your game that long Yeah, I can imagine making a game where I would want anyone to play it for 175 hours Then what a little sir.

Yeah, maybe maybe a game like this But I mean I can't even I can I'm certain that I played destiny too for longer than a hundred seventy five hours Well, I suppose that's a little different those are persistent games, but yeah This is a I don't know I just don't I can't I like that's raining a lot I can't see myself at a hundred and seventy five hours. No, I think it but we'll see how that all goes and finally Chris Well, actually yeah, we have one more question about that's right We have one more question after that actually but the Wayne handkins run in those hello gents curious if you saw Martin Square says he's op-ed in the New York Times I was particularly struck by this paragraph quote in the past 20 years as we all know the movie business has changed on all fronts But the most ominous change has happened stealthily and undercover of night the gradual but steady elimination of risk many films today are perfect products manufactured for immediate consumption Many of them are well made by teams of talented individuals all the same They lack something essential to cinema the unifying vision of an individual artist because of course the individual artist is the riskiest factor of all And quote do you see this happening in games has already happened? I can't help but think of games like that's branding which has a mixed bag of review scores with the unifying vision of Kojima as its main selling point now I feel like Martin Source easy wrote this op-ed in light of his comments about Marvel movies that were kind of controversial Did you see yeah, I did say they weren't similar or something right? So I feel like this is him like kind of writing and maybe trying to make that a little better but with his with whoever he upset about that Which were probably a lot of people in the industry, but it's interesting delays point is interesting because You don't have many games and as we discussed in the past This was in the 10th with Activision and electronic arts in the 80s to kind of overcome this But they weren't able to to have a guy like kojima at the front now kojima being kojima is one of the reasons that can only Want to get rid of him because he was bigger than them and it's hard to get money and Runway to make games like this when you are a kojima, but I'll just reiterate what I've said It's just a very unique situation and I feel like that stranding is a nice realization of what an a tour So to speak you can accomplish for video games and so I like a lot of people get mad I think it's funny like when you start that stranding up kojima's name appears like seven thousand times in the credits Like if you it's like this it's like one person then kojima and then this and like a day Oh kojima will come up again And I thought that was funny and I definitely noticed that but I feel like With a guy like kojima doing a game like that stranding everything kind of funnels through his heart through his mind Through his soul and so you can understand it I guess through that perspective like one of the really interesting things that I think is In that stranding I'm really surprised I thought I've really been seeking out too much But then I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone talk about is that the game is categorically pro life The game has a massive pro life message in it.

It's not even hidden and you could look at that as being like a Japanese culturally Conservative thing or you can look at that as being a kojima productions thing, but no, I think that's hideo kojima And so it's cool to you know Scorsese here is like exactly it's just cool to see movies through that lens and I Like that where I wish that there were more like this more people aren't many people in games that are like I think of maybe Even then it's like it's like a varying quality. It's like it's a kojima David cage I guess you could qualify as one of those people who just sort of does the thing that he wants to do To varying degrees of success right I know kind of even somebody that I respect a lot But I can't think of many it's not nearly as much as there are in like music or film It's interesting. Yeah, definitely not and even when they have a studio like Naughty Dog with Neil Druckman is really creative powerhouse That studio now they never really make it out him and Neil I think to his credit tries to not make it about him too Which is yeah something that David Cage doesn't do very well Although I will give it the PlayStation I mean they publish David Cage's games and they publish kojima's games and I think that they get squashed we have now Especially in the light of this word that kojima kind of wants to make films and stuff which has been coming out over the last week Are they gonna block this guy down for another game or they gonna make this studio first party does kojima not what this kojima Props is not gonna want to make another game or they doing it just to get some capital There's a lot of questions that need to be answered now in regard to this You know what's interesting? I really feel like this a game like this and we've been seeing it more and more as as as video games have become more and more Like powerful and more popular and more and technologies advanced I think we're seeing a new age of kind of not interactive cinema not in the sense of like until dawn or like or the fact that we have like a very narrative focused games But we have video games seen as a medium where like actors are getting attached to them in ways that they're pretty proud of You know so I don't even know if kojima necessarily would need to make a movie at this point because I feel like we're reaching a point Where so many actors would totally be down to be in a dayo kojima game Or like even you know plenty of games moving forward.

It's a really interesting time Especially now because making a Marvel movie how different is it from making a game at this point? Like you stand in a green room. You're covered in dots, you know half of it CG anyway The I feel like the lines are really blurring here That's a great point and I think also He's gotten such a star studded cast to be in this game to begin with yeah Nicholas winding ref in it like what? Director it's actually kind of like a kojima actually it's interesting.

I mean it's definitely there's definitely much to learn about this entire Development experience about how quickly games can be made and I feel like I mean I want to leave it here for now Because I think we'll talk about this much. Yeah, obviously in the spoiler cast later on But I underestimated kojima and I'll be the first to admit it I think that I think that when you because I can relate to this when you leave a job or you move on and you take like the First thing that comes to you or whatever or people start offering you things and you're eager to say yes to them It felt like that's what happened with kojima in PlayStation But I think that they were able with decima and with the help of gorilla and obviously the sheer amount of talent kojima productions And Sony first party they pulled this game together and it's much more than I thought it was and it's much more impressive than I thought It was and I think that even if a person doesn't like the game itself I would I would be hard pressed to imagine a real gamer I don't want to use that term but like a hardcore gamer I'd be hard to imagine a person not turning this game on being like yeah This isn't for me, but this is kind of impressive in terms of what it tries to do It's kind of how I feel about like fortnight where I'm like yeah, it's super fucking impressive I don't buy it but You can't do that what it does right and so I'm interested in the long tail of this game The sales of the game especially this fall a lot of interesting stuff to be in to watch out for for sure Chris before we bail out Though I do want to re-gram Lee's question which has nothing in fact to do with death stranding He says hey lads is fall in order on your radar at all I have pumped for it and have pre-ordered it which I don't usually do but I had cash a month back It wasn't sure if I would unreleased what do you think of it from the previous stuff so far and EA send you a copy Well, I've asked EA for a copy but haven't heard back yet and to be honest with you I don't Care to get an early copy because I have no room to even play it even if I got it The only reason I actually started even crawling around is because our friend Bunty was asking me for an EA contact So I reached out to my EA contact and got a bounce back So I guess he quit so then I had a kind of go in there and try to figure it out But I'm looking forward to the game. I think it looks really cool the problem is that there's just so much keeping me busy right now That like I really want to get through the outer worlds and death stranding before I even bother playing fallen order or call of duty Yeah, I'm in a similar position, but like I don't know what it is with EA man They'd really like to just do respawn dirty like I've seen very little marketing for this I've heard nothing about it other than like maybe like a handful of previews It's really strange how willing they are to just not advertise for respawn games. I don't get it I wonder I mean it makes you a little nervous right I wonder if the game's good.

No, I mean it's probably great Honestly, it makes me if anything it's like us probably another time for situation We got a fucking brilliant game that they just don't give a shit about for some reason Like I'm I don't know. I'm just like weirdly kind of okay with it But it's at the same time. It's like it's got a stuff for respawn like it's coming up pretty soon Yeah, I mean by the time we're recording this for days So actually go by the time when this goes to public feeds free feeds. It'll be Star Wars Jedi fall on order will be out I'm looking forward to playing it But to the point that was made by Graham here, you know, I don't have much excitement for because what Chris said it's true I think I've seen a few ads for it on YouTube videos and stuff, but and it's not like I've been going out of my way It's a look for it but I feel like a lot of this has to do with like the The minishing returns that Star Wars is creating which I think was predictable I think a lot of it.

There's doesn't seem to be a lot of excitement about episode nine and I think people are Star Wars out I watch this one web or watch this YouTube channel It's really funny called world shit or world-class bullshitters And I listen to it in the background sometimes and this guy goes to like toy store sometimes It just looks at the Star Wars section of the and like makes fun of it because like it because it's they're really subtle signals that Star Wars just is losing incredible amounts of cash and it starts on the ground with people not buying the merchandise and so Maybe fallen orders suffering from a similar problem I don't know and maybe Disney is like well, we don't want to confuse See, this is why Star Wars game should even be coming out right now because maybe they're saying like we don't want to confuse the messaging with our movie Which is much more important. So keep the advertising to a minimum. I don't know. It's all speculative.

Yeah, all right Chris Let's get into the news There's not a great volume of news together this week But some important pieces of news have come out that we must touch on number one a significant shakeup has occurred at the top of PlayStation's leadership structure And the moves made appear to be very wise indeed for starters PlayStation's worldwide studios the umbrella under which its fully owned studios exist from naughty dog and bend the media molecule and insomnia And others has a new leader Herman host the co-founder of Sony only gorilla games and its longtime creative director who will now Hell in the larger ship and will be in charge of all 14 teams Host gorilla games was founded as lost boy games in 2000 in the Netherlands and was sold to Sony in 2005 following the successful launch Replacing to his kill zone so he's been in the Sony family for a long time in the wake of this shift worldwide studios long time shepherd Shou Hei Yoshida will be leading a new internal initiative to take care of Sony's relationships with indie developers and discover great new smaller Team games for PlayStation platforms Yoshida has been with the Sony with Sony since the mid-80s and was with the PlayStation brand from its advent in 1993 He was the executive producer of games like Rizmo the legend of dragoon and 8biscape and became one of the most important faces of PlayStation during the PS3 era and into the PS4 era Though he's been conspicuously shelved in recent years I think anyone can with two eyes can notice that Sony shut him down for some reason yeah Now this news is pretty interesting because we know that last month the old CEO and then chairman Sean laden of PlayStation was Left and it seemed like it was because of some sort of power struggle with the new CEO Ryan who we don't we don't really know if that's true or not by the way I mean that's a speculation, but I believe it some executive palace intrigue Let's say what's going on there with his removal our friend geocorcy who was ahead of second party recently left So there's a lot of there's just a lot of tumble. Yeah, it's a lot of movement going on now I think that Herman I know Herman most and I met him on many occasions is a really nice guy And I think that he is a great choice And I think he's a great choice for multiple reasons I think number one he's European which I think continues to bring balance to this new american initiative that is overtaking PlayStation where a lot of Like american pr and marketing and all these guys have a lot of power and Jim Ryan seems to be really Yeah absorbing that and I think bringing a guy from the netherlands who works at a Dutch studio Who's in the european game scene, which is incredibly important for PlayStation? I think it's an incredibly wise move to to let him helmet as opposed to american or japanese guy I think it just brings geographic balance to the brand and as far as shoe hay Moving over to indie games. I think that's essential.

I think even more than Herman wholes move I think getting Yoshida involved in indie dev and finding those new small games is essential because as I said on the show and as has been widely reported Sony's really shitting the bed with indies and indie developers don't feel like they're being well taken care of anymore And a lot of indy devs blame sony for their games not selling well. I'm ps4 like they used to and I wonder why maybe because there's 75 games Yes, and maybe sony like when concrete genie comes out and so which sony made and they can't even be asked to To give a shit about it. I'm of course not care about your game. So chris.

What is your what is your take of this whole shakeup? Yeah, I think I would agree I'm not really sure about Herman because I just don't really know much about him or we're really good real as far as the studio goes But I do I do think shoe hay in this role is super super smart Especially because he's just been just down for the count for some reason for ages. I don't know why Is there any real reason why yeah, I think so as far as I understand and I don't think this is unique to sony or unique The PlayStation as a corporate entity, but like I said, there's just a lot of palace intrigue at the top and I think she way or she was just becoming too powerful as uh, not a brand but as like a face and he wasn't really like an endorsed Face right like he just ended up becoming this you know, I gotta say I'm not trying to be a dickhead or like pat myself in the back But we kind of had a lot to do with it at iGN and beyond of making shoe hay or she to into this like cult figure because we like started Including him and reaching out to him and we had all these funny pictures of him and we started bringing him on the podcast and stuff I think we definitely had something to do with that and I don't think it was ever the intention for him to be like that Right and I think that they lost control of the message with someone like your shida at the top Who has such a good relationship with players and like I said, I think his shelving has been totally conspicuous I think anyone that plays a potential place they should know is full well that this guy was put on the shelf And so I think that him re-emerging with this new indian initiative is so wise because Sony's missing this and I think you need someone at the top to Encourage the power brokers of sony to be like these games matter and These small teams have given us like we've cultivated and I by we i'm saying like in terms of shio shida saying we have sony We've cultivated some of the greatest and most acclaimed indie in quote games ever including games like journey Right and we don't do that anymore and we should and so I think it's awesome He's definitely the best person to do it. I feel like because he's at the top He doesn't feel like he's like at the top, you know what I mean?

Right and it's no it's no insult to sean laden who is a fluent Japanese speaker who worked at sean japan who produced I mean sean laden has roots going all the way back to 90s and sam yakan no i mean he's been around for a long time But I just don't feel like he had the same heartening or heartened relationship with the audience I think shio Layden came in and pushed you hey to the side to try to be shio hey and it hurt the brand because You know, I don't want to categorize sony as the japanese company that those Japanese things but they are a japanese company And so I think having a japanese guy like shio shida that speaks fluent english that was educated in the us He went to ucla and all these kinds of things I think bridge that east west divide in such a way that shio Layden just in and so I think that in a world of characters Whether you're talking about a wada back in nintendo rip or you're talking about the height and character kind of building that they're doing with the xbox brand and putting people in front This matters and so I think it's great and I think that this is a good move across the board Ethan fidget jerel wrote in on patreon he said hey corinary kalen that's probably accurate and cantankerous christ my question is simple What does hermit host becoming the head of playstation world-wide studios mean for gorilla as a big fan of killzone and horizon I can't help but be a little worried about this new role in the impact that may have on gorilla Thanks for all you do and keep preaching the five guys gospel. Well, I don't think you have too much to worry about Uh, even gorilla is sony's biggest studio at almost 300 heads. So which is on which is fucking crazy And that's why we all know that they're working on more than one game Although I assume that one of those gribbilla people also now tend to decimas well, but For me, I feel like it doesn't really matter because they have angie and all these other people at the top their production pipeline That's really been at the top since the original killzone that's just moving in to take his place So I don't think hermit host leaving is gonna have a great effect on gorilla And I really wouldn't worry too deeply about it. Remember that he didn't have a great deal to do with horizon So he's a killzone guy and so if you like the way gorilla is moving Then hermit host leaving might actually be a good thing for you Because he's able to bring his expertise and his decades of experience in the industry and at gorilla and elsewhere and with decima and all this other stuff He's now able to be a global evangelist for all that kind of stuff I think it's I think it's gonna be good.

Yeah, I think so. Joshua gershman says with hermit host departure from gorilla Do you think this means horizon two is close to done? Uh, no, I don't think horizon two is close to done And I don't think hermit leaving has anything to do with that one way or the other remember her hermit host is so far above His old role as like the sole creative director of a killzone centric gorilla that you can't really compare apples to oranges now You know when they started making shadowfall and horizon in tandem That's when the team became bigger than just you know hermit host and his team So I wouldn't worry about it. No, I don't think horizon to a school student Mark's he wrote junior rodent and said hello conicris this week We saw a big power change at Sony with shio shida stepping down as president of worldwide studios with gorilla games hermit Holes to replace him though.

I'm excited to see shoes new role within Sony I can't help but think this may be more of a demotion for him with Sean laden's unexpected departure included What the hell is happening behind the scenes of Sony? I love to know your thoughts Thank you and have a nice day We talked a little bit about this already mark, but I do want to reiterate christen I don't know if you have anything to add to this I don't know that this is a demotion I feel like in terms of what makes you know, I know she was she personally now I said that earlier about hermit holes, but I really do know she hey like personally as a person not just a guy I had some dinners with or whatever yeah, but I know him and Even though we don't talk too much anymore. We actually talked recently which was really nice But even though I don't talk to him anymore. I just know him well enough to know that this probably makes him happier than a pig and shit Because he loves traveling he loves being on the plane he loves going to different countries He loves interfacing with devs and unlike a lot of people like we make kind of Sony's PR team because they don't play video games and they don't Again, there's one person on Sony PR team that I can name that plays video games But that's not the case with the guys who come from the game-centric production side This is a man with a wealth of knowledge to share and I think sitting in a tokyo high rise for the rest of his career Is probably not the best use of his skill.

So yeah, it's probably probably pretty depressing Yeah, I would assume so you know, he's now he has to he has twin daughters and he's away from home all the time and all that kind of stuff And I'm sure that that's gonna make this more difficult, but it's just a waste of his talent He's not just some nameless executive heat like I said he this is the guy that produced a biscuit This is the guy that produced the legend or jagoon, you know, like this is no no fool And I'm really excited to see what his Enthusiastic love of video games, which is what he really has I'm excited to see what that injects into what will hopefully be a new resurgent PlayStation 5 centric indie initiative Similar to what we had at the start at the advent of the ps4 era Which was so important to the ps4 success and I think we've lost sight of that six years later But you know, you remember the the PlayStation loves indies. Does anyone remember that? I remember that wasn't that long ago. Yeah, it's amazing how quickly it just shifted But uh it did it's gone now.

It's totally gone. They don't care about their own fucking developers unless they're making a triple a game So chris let's move on to the next story Number two, so yes created a new first party studio. Well kind of according to games industry international the new studio will eat Will be located in malaysia and will open for business in 2020 However, it's not a true first party studio like suckerpondrip or if near the many others in the family that make games from stem to stern instead PlayStation's malaysian studio is being crafted to offer support on internally developed ps5 games providing art and animation such a move Allow Sony to tap the largely unseen malaysian game dev scene and according to PlayStation CEO and president Jim Ryan government support from alaysia likely in the form of Tax breaks or subsidies like seen in Canada and elsewhere help the corporation to make this decision Malaysia is a country in southeast Asia with a population of more than 30 million people and an emerging and steady market streamline studios Which works out of malaysia and has worked on games like Street Fighter 5 bioshock infinite and others in support role is currently the largest Existing Malaysian game studio with over 200 employees. That's likely to change very very soon Adam over And said and said hey said this Christ and siplorn Colin.

I think I'd say Chris everyone's calling a Christ which is a well, that's fine I'm all right with that Sony just opened a new studio in Malaysia and with the news that 70 devs from gorilla helped with death stranding I started to wonder how big all the dev teams in Sony are I'm a huge fan of xbox as much as Sony and seeing their new studio is basically double in size now and still growing I was wondering just how big some teams are in Sony's first party Thanks and keep making Tuesdays great. We will add them so team sizes and PlayStation's studio first party stable They vary from small and so medium molecules about 50 and it goes all the way up to the big end So we mentioned earlier that gorilla games is about 250 studio depending on how you count that is a similar head count Yeah, studios like Sony bender in the middle about 125 But they definitely they definitely went up there used to be about 75 So the team sizes vary and and adam I must warn you you don't want studios to double in size just to grow You're excited to see Xbox do that, but that's meaningless Yeah, and it's yeah And Xbox has been doing kind of the opposite where they have like teams like the state decay team Which is like significantly smaller than I think it's played in if I'm not mistaken But like yeah, I think they're in a similar situation to where they've got some smaller teams and bigger teams But like a bigger team doesn't necessarily mean a better team and it's important to realize that definitely not by the way The team is undead labs played out is made a that's right on them limbo right play dead made Not a big not a big error, but people yell you so I want to thank you now Chris What do you make about this new relations to do? I mean to me this seems to be very similar to what we've been talking about with China or with Japan's Sony Japan's initiative in China In common is China to try to extract some of those teams out of that closed all country and bring them on place They've really been the first to do that and so to me this seems like going to Malaysia small country of 30 million But with some untapped potential in talent This just seems to me Maybe a wise though risky move for Sony to move in and say like we don't really know what's happening here We might as well try to make something of this and see what we can do in this in this place where there's probably a ton of talent That's willing to work and I have to put this in there willing to work for extremely cheap compared to American and European deaths What do you make of it? I mean it's a move I would definitely wouldn't have thought about Malaysia at all But that's why I'm not so I'm not a PlayStation executive Yeah, well it reminds me of like when in especially in the 80s I mean this was still true in the 90s even today but a lot of the 80s cartoons we love so much like Yeah, Joe and Transformers all that was made in South Korea because at the time it was incredibly cheap and it's still cheap to get Korea No, there's plenty of animation is still done in Korea.

Right still So I think that this is both a nuanced let's find talent move and maybe we can make a real studio here But the other thing is I mean we can make we can have them run support on PlayStation games for animation and art Which are really expensive in first world countries we can do this out of a developing nation a second world country or whatever And pay less for it. So I think we have to throw that in for fairness is sake. No, it's not like Sony's going to Malaysian health Malaysian people Yeah Number three as it does each month Sony has revealed the best selling games on the PlayStation store this time for October not surprisingly this month's best selling game was Call of Duty modern warfare followed by and this I was surprised by this go through your comp breakpoint And then the outer world FIFA 20 and Minecraft other notable games include Borderlands 3 at 10 God of War at 15 spider-man at 16 and this is a weird one the forest at 19 It must have been on sales that game sucks the best selling PS VR game was yet again beat saver followed by super hot VR and Skyrim VR Fortnite and Apex Legends remain PS4's most popular free-play games and Fortnite and Destiny 2 dominate the top DLC and expansion charts So nothing too groundbreaking there although breakpoint at number two stands and start contrast to Ubisoft seeming disappointment in it to the point where they changed everything about their roadmap because and yet the game Was still the second best selling game of October which to me indicates what I've already said about you Soled the reinforces it that I think that they care about the game or more than a lot of these publishers do Yeah, no definitely it's super heavy to see destiny to on the top of DLC that makes me really Really happy with me. Yeah, shena tier.

I think shadowkeep was number two. I think there was a point like piece of DLC That was number one. So that's yeah, so congratulations to all of those that were on the charts I will note medieval and people notice this no concrete genie on this list and obviously the game didn't sell very well Yeah, well, and when evil's not on either so that's true medieval came out on the 29th or the right no 25th the 25th so concrete genie came out the beginning of the month so the word out of Europe is that medieval's actually selling really Respectively, but we're gonna see about that. We're gonna see about that number Chris This is an interesting one number four remember deep down No, it was a ps4 game being developed by Capcom in Japan and was supposed to be a methodical dungeon crawler It was amongst the first next gen games revealed and was actually shown off in February of 2013 when Sony showed PlayStation 4 itself It was playable at TGS that year actually played it and Capcom had talked about it actively through 2015 when the project went quiet Although Capcom kept the trademark of the game alive now Thanks to an interview from a Eurogamer with Capcom's Yoshi neuro.

Oh, no I haven't heard from him in a while We have a better idea of what happened to the halted and seemingly canceled project He told Eurogamer in part quote the original team is clearly no longer together at this point But people might have noticed that we've kept the trademark registered and it's not been completely given upon every year We examine titles were doing in the future and we bring our projects to approve and move forward There's not much I can say about it and quote as deep down seem to be a project focused more on creating a proprietary engine for Capcom Which was calling panda ray initially it's perhaps not a huge surprise that the game stalled but that Capcom is keeping it alive suggest We may just see it in the future Kenneth owns already know it said hey Colin and platanos Chris At least at the food. Oh, please that like plantain. Yeah, it's like a plot on us. It's like a basically plan That's so plantain It seems deep down is not dead the executive producer Yoshinoro Oh, no has said that that they've haven't completely given up on it Do you think Capcom bit off more than they can chew or did the project scope change to new features for us PS5 and monster hunter world success?

Anyways, please stop murdering those babies. They help us navigate through the bt's that's a good point Oh, yeah, Kenneth and we will keep that in mind moving forward with the strong pro life sentiments of death stranding Chris You said at the top you don't remember this game deep down. No, I remember the name But I don't remember anything about it So I was at that February 2013 meeting when they showed ps4 and there were only a few third party game shown And that was one of them and it was called deep down and it was basically supposed to be this procedurally generated dungeon crawler And they were cap on was hyping up because there was this really unfortunate Enamed engine that they were working on called panthere PA NTA HR HEA people go look up what they want and this was supposed to be kind of the showcase for it very similar to how shadowfall was kind of the showcase For decima. Oh, okay.

I remember this so at TGS that year actually went to go game show 2013 and I played the game And I remember playing it. I was like this is really not good I don't know what this is and then a lot of people wrote about it and had some stuff to say about it And then the game kind of just disappeared and it became vaporware for ps4 But what's so fascinating about is vaporware status kind of similar actually to some of the rockstar stuff that was supposed to be Was that they kind of announced to reveal this before like bio shotgun vida where they kind of announced it before it was a really green Lit and so it never happened and I always love deep down updates because God Almighty I don't know what it's been six years since we really even saw it and yeah Yeah, I remember it now now. I'm looking at pictures of it. I totally forgot that this was called deep down Yeah, not a great name not a great name for the game not a great name for the engine Yoshi or oh no great name.

That's a good name, but yeah, you'd expect that deep down is mostly dead But if you're interested by the way that interview with the ocean or oh no on your game or actually mostly surround street fighter So you guys want to go check that out you can't there's nothing really interesting for this audience But number five speaking of Capcom the company recently released a fresh set of numbers for many of its million plus selling games So across platforms and retail and digital through September 30th of this year the numbers were relayed by website I'm not so I just want to come out really at the top before I talk about some of these numbers these numbers go all the way back to the 80s It's really awesome. So you can see like very specific numbers for NES games and SNES games It's cool, and I love that they released those publicly So monster hunter world which came out in January 2018 remains Capcom's best selling game of all time at 14.1 million units resident evil 5 is in second place 7.5 million unit sold which is unfortunate and resident evil 6 at 3 with 7.4 million units sold so the second and best and third best selling Capcom games wall time are bad resident evil games Resident evil 7 at fourth with 6.8 million sold and then SNES is Street Fighter 2 which comes in fifth at 6.3 million units sold other notable games include resident evil 2 remake which has recently sold 4.7 million copies only 200,000 copies behind the PS1 original that's crazy and so cool and Mega Man 11 which came out in October last year and just surpassed a million unit sold so congratulations to them Capcom has released 93 games that have sold a million copies or more That's so cool. That's wild. So people can go the list is really cool I mean like Mega Man 3 is on there Mega Man 2 is on there Like all sorts of violent commandos on there really cool stuff old stuff number six a new patent from Sony has reignited the faint hope that we may get a third PlayStation handheld then again patents don't mean anything if they're not used so temper your expectations according to push square Which sites a Dutch website called let's go digital the patent is for a new tiny cartridge just like Vida's But as the site wisely points out a cartridge patent Sony file last year ended up being for a Japanese-only children's toy called the Toyo And this may be another similar patent as was submitted by the same Sony designer a toy By the way, it's about to I owe for anyone who wants to go get up still the patent information itself is interesting showing us schematic for a cartridge or card That appears to be larger than Vida's and she's more like Nintendo DS cards What it is where it'll end up being used in PlayStation hardware elsewhere in Sony's constellation remains to be seen So nothing to get too excited about there.

Yeah, number seven last week We discussed the imminent shutdown of sink stars long-running online store and other online functionality Which will begin rolling out at the end of January however? Where now comes that drive club servers are also going to be shut down shortly after sink stars demise according to PlayStation.com The online servers for PS4 drive club as well as drive club VR and drive club bikes will be shut off permanently as of March 31st of 2020 according to Sony quote all online features including multiplayer modes will cease on that date You will still be able to play and enjoy these games in single-player offline modes and quote I like how they say you can still enjoy them. Thank you Yeah, as you recall drive club itself cannot be purchased anymore in PlayStation store as of late August which was setting off this inevitable shutdown Drive Club was originally intended to be a PS4 launch game in late 2013 But was delayed a year as it was in disastrous shape when it was supposed to launch when it came out in October of 2014 It was still broken from most players although it improved over time and sold respectively still Sony shut down the studio that created an Evolution in 2016 and much of that team went on to create Codemasters Evo and internment an internal Codemaster studio that created 2018's racer on Rush As far as I understand most of that studio has been disbanded because on Rush didn't sell very well So drive club is done So and if you want to get that so first Well, you can't even buy it So you don't own it too bad But I think that you might be sealed off from the platinum trophy if you don't if you're unable to get online So this is something that people are gonna need to pay attention to similar to the last of us being shut down on PS3 If you care about that sort of thing, but still no more job club By the way Chris doesn't seem like they're making room for Grand Turismo with all these drive club moves. I think so Yeah, well, it's we got one more year before a new system launches.

So that's about right Yeah, I think Grand Turismo is gonna come back in a major way I think they have to do that because of the amazing success that Microsoft has found with Forza really stealing the steam Indeed from Grand Turismo, which was like Grand Turismo for 15 years or so is the undisputed champion of sim racers And I don't think that's the case anymore. No, definitely not Although I don't give a shit cuz I'm not a fucking nerd. Yeah, I for some reason own several Forza games even though I don't play them Well, that doesn't make any sense and I think I bought one of them too. So like that shows you how fucking smart I am You are a genius.

There's no doubt about it. Chris the final note number eight is a wrap up The PlayStation blog reports at adventure game where the water tastes like wine is coming to PS4 on December 2nd and that long and developing cartoon game Wottum is coming to PS4 on December 17th that game has been in development forever website Come out to reports that VR puzzle game tale of a fragmented star or of the fragmented star will be coming to PSBR in the spring of 2020 that card Centric RPG card pocket is coming to PS4 on December 12th that self-shooter I GI origins is coming to PS4 at some point in 2021 and that previously dated rhythm action game of each E in vector has been delayed a mere five days and will not come out on PS4 on December 10th instead of December 5th website Push Square reports that coffee shop adventure game coffee talk will be coming to PS4 on 2020 that game looks super cool By the way, you guys should look it up games about reports that the outer world sales have surpassed take two interactive expectations take to owning private division Which published the game I actually didn't know that in play with that By the way, I'm a little embarrassed by that that take two owns private division I didn't know that it makes a little more sense how they got obsidian's attention I was always I was always way more impressed that this random publisher publisher game But I guess I should look further and finally developer IO interactive has confirmed that the follow-up to its popular reignite And series presumably hit and three is underway Yes, Chris let's talk about the new game releases and as tradition dictates you will read first No, all righty Astrineer comes to PS4 Astrineer is a space sandbox adventure where players can work together to build custom bases above or below ground Create vehicles to explore a vast solar system and use terrain to create anything they can imagine a player's creativity and ingenuity are key to thriving on exciting planetary adventures It was a grammatically correct write-up so it was even though on our Google Doc. It's telling me that part of it is wrong Yeah, that's bullshit. It's not so I don't know what that's gonna be Google is incorrect and they should be fine Sons of bitches be simulator.

Yes comes to PS4. See the world through the eyes of the be Explore a world inspired by Central Park where you can take part in B races What Colin from rare flowers into five dangerous wasps play with friends or family in three-game modes including co-op and PVP on splitscreen sounds a little bit like that PS2 game mr. Mosquito. Yeah, that's too.

It was N64 for some reason oh definitely not yeah Try to speed speed by my blunder contagion VR outbreak comes to PS VR dive deep into the events of the initial zombie outbreak Yeah, explore the world through different perspectives and experience the beginning of the end in our single player campaign with limited resources make your way out in free roam I'm free room in a single alright familiarize yourself with each weapon in the firing range to bet I don't know best and best your scores best your scores if you can I guess it's a VR game Yes, it's a little too specific. Yeah, I'm gonna say yeah You have a firing range so does like Metro 23 what the fuck do I care? Fire right every game is a firing range can play you can't play Metro and VR though that's true, but you can play another zombie game yet another Zombie game doctor who the edge of time comes to PS4 I feel like the schemes are already out a new series enemy threatens to tear apart the universe and only you can stop them Doctor who the edge of time lets players embark on an adventure through space and time travel across the universe visit alien locations pilot the TARDIS and solve the mystery of the controlling force behind the reality buyers. I feel like Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel like that game was on PS3, but I mean I could be wrong about that Yeah, that sounds super familiar for some some reason Fratured minds comes to PS4 fractured minds is an immersive I was so autistic immersive artistic short game exploring anxiety and mental health issues and bark on a journey through the human psyche to experience the everyday Challenges associated with these conditions winner of the BAFTA young game designers award interesting Here's my thing about these games though Chris because I talk about my anxiety and my mental health a lot And I like to do that, but when you make a piece of art I feel like you shouldn't be telling me that It's like I know the words Let me play the game and explore it and figure out what it is myself because I don't know like I like for instance journey We brought that up earlier is a really emotional and sad game, but they never told you to be sad right when you played it You just were I don't know maybe I'm being a little hard on the I don't know on these young people Hey, they want to think I'm a word so they did they want to back the word which is which is quite prestigious Golem comes to PSBR.

I almost said golem wrote in but actually Enter a mysterious story book world and take the role of twine an adventurous kid who has been seriously injured in an accident Even though you are unable to leave your bed during your recovery You never stop dreaming of exploring the outside world That is until you discover that you have the ability to create and control stone creatures called golems seeing through their eyes and controlling their actions That's actually a I don't care about the goal of part of that actually need idea to be in a kid Who's bedridden's mind? Yeah, I'm actually kind of excited for this. This is a I believe this is high wire games This is a studio that this is a studio that Mario Donald who did the obviously the renowned soundtrack for the Halo games He went to after they fired him from Bungie. So this is a very least I'm expecting pretty great music out of this one very cool Yeah, kitten Comes the PS VR take care of cute kittens lots and lots of cute kittens get points for keeping them happy and lose points for everything They destroy you Use points to upgrade your tools get an automatic food dispenser or clean up poop faster with the poop soup 3000 What awaits inside the next box?

Hmm interesting. I love cats. What if I could throw a kitten in there? It's a game right?

Oh, I think I'm gonna throw a cat in the real world into the VR game But you mean throw a cat in the VR world in the VR world. Yeah. Yeah, I don't see why you wanna be able to do that Fuck them. They always land on their feet.

They're fine. Exactly last labyrinth comes to PS4 A scuba merciless mansion alongside a girl words cannot reach and an escape the room adventure game that can only be experienced in VR players must work to escape a Mansion full of hidden dangers with a mysterious girl that appears before them, okay Mad games tycoon comes to PS4 in mad games tycoon build your own gaming empire got hate it Build your own gaming empire start your own game studio in the early 80s The journey begins in a small garage with a little money and limited resources create new game concepts Set up your team and develop the next million hit million hit research new technologies train employees and bill and buy new and larger office I like that everything in the 80s starts in a garage. You have to start a garage whether you're an apple or Intel or what you got a Start a garage. Yeah doesn't count if you uh you start anywhere else.

No, definitely not Mercenaries wings the fate the fail Phoenix. Oh the false Phoenix I was like the fail Phoenix stuff Mercenaries wings. Why does that be called mercenaries wings? It reminds me of demons souls.

I hate that. Oh, I hate it Mercenaries wings the false Phoenix is a tactical RPG Oh now I like it in which players take control of mercenaries were hired hired by a king on a mission to reclaim his kingdom The group of mercenaries are set the fight the rebel army has commanded risking life in exchange for a precious coin Well now you have my attention. Yeah, look at that. You got something never winter nights enhanced edition comes to PS4 Slink through the shadows as a deadly half-elven rogue weird fearsome magics as a powerful gnomish sorcerer Venk was your foes as an armor-clad dwarven paladin whatever hero you create incredible adventures away This is an old one right?

Yeah, no it's your night. That's a I remember for a while ago I'll look this up when you read next but I think never winter has never been on console before yeah I think that's probably correct romancing saga three comes to PS4 and Vida and you'll remember that Romancing saga 3-1 Vida game of the show either because it was the only video game there the celebrated RPG classic comes west for the first time Developed by industry veterans romancing saga 3 was originally released in Japan in 1995 this HD remaster of the legendary RPG masterpiece Include introduces optimized graphics a new dungeon to explore new scenarios and a new game plus function This is exciting for people that are fans of the mana series because previously There were only fan translations of that I don't know if that's really a thing anymore But when I was a kid or when I was younger people used to translate these unreleased games in ROMs And so for those that were not able to do that or for those that want to play the proper way Which is kind of me it's an exciting moment I'll be buying that full price just to show my support to swear And X for their continued Vida support and I hope a lot of you got out there decide to do the same look at you Sparklite comes to PS4 Sparklite is an action adventure set in a whimsical oh in the in V whimsical and ever-changing land of Geodia Go-jia Geodia Geodia Geodia Joe Joe Joe Joe Joe Joe Joe Joe I want to die Georgia Battle folks in top-down action using an arsenal of gadgets guns and gear explore dangerous corners of the procedurally generated world take down titans of the mining industry What and harness the power of sparklite? Okay, well interesting. That's interesting.

I'm watching a season two right now of Jack Ryan and which I really like by the way and That's about taking down a powerful mining operation Huh interesting thing by the way, I looked up never winter nights came to PC in 2002 and the summer 2002 has never been Consulant in fact, I don't think everyone saw re-release. So pretty crazy. It's just one of those series of games Never when it's a bioware game. I don't know who owns who owns the idea.

I don't look deeper I won't do it live. This is what I usually do when I fucking waste all my time on the internet That's why I have this ridiculous knowledge of PlayStation games I guess but yeah never winter is part of this I think this movement of bringing a lot of these late 90s early 2000s Dungeon RPGs and CRPGs took on for the first time because we've seen this with like icewind dale is coming and Baldur's gate and shit So it's kind of cool because I have never played any of this stuff So not that I'm necessarily sit there and play these now and there's so much else to play But knowing that I can now is kind of exciting. I gotta be honest with you It bodes well for the library if anything Star Wars Jedi fall in order comes to PS4 And I just want to say that I hate the coal where the colon's placed, you know in this because it's always Jedi colon fallen order I just wish it was called Jedi colon fallen order. We all know what the Jedi is I don't think we need the star wars in there but a Galaxy spanning adventure awaits in Star Wars Jedi fallen order a third person action adventure title from respawn entertainment and abandoned padawan must complete his training Develop new powerful force abilities and master the art of the lightsaber all while staying one step ahead of the empire I am looking forward to it.

Yeah, me too VR ping pong pro comes to PSVR Racket's at the ready VR ping pong pro is the follow-up to the hit table tennis simulator of 2016 VR ping pong Test your skills with a variety of challenging game modes as you rise up the ranks to become the true ping pong pro Do you have what it takes pick up your virtual racket and find out dude ping pong is so hard It is like when you find someone that really knows how to play like holy shit I like you you have to be really nice to the other person when you're playing because you just like slam the ball You know and I'm deeply off put by anybody who is incredible at playing anything Like my friend's neck is like in like a savant with Tetris the point where you can play like super fast without looking at this Green and it's uh honestly scares me. Yeah, it's a little unsettling. Yeah, it's sorry It's what's on my call Eldritch. Yeah, and by the way VR ping pong pro VR ping pong pro VR ping pong I can't say multiple times.

I just want to try Woven comes to PS4 or a woman world where stuff animals once lived in peace search for hidden secrets and customize your character with different animal shapes To solve puzzles and epic adventure with two very unlikely heroes in a story narrated in rhyme. You know what that reminds me Although it shouldn't is one of my favorite one of the games I want to say favorite It's a good idea was naughty bear. Oh, yeah, yeah I think five or five ones that if I recall they have to do something with that that was so funny that I was a good Prime is I was back when we saw a lot of comedy games. We saw more comedy games back then right especially in a space like a mid-tier space Yeah, I think that that really works kind of like that Leisure suit Larry.

I should know my brother worked on the most recent leader suit Larry. So just throw it out there But it's kind of like that mid-space Leisure suit Larry thing where you can get a little humor and be a little crude But for people that don't know I'd be there was a game about outcast teddy bear who lived on this island with other teddy bears You didn't like them and they would always party without them They would have like birthday parties and New Year's parties and all this stuff and they would never invite them So naughty bear would go around and kill them all during their parties like secretly and it was so fucking good It was so funny. Yeah, it's like a premise for a game I love it. It's also yeah, he was like the no one liked them So he just became like this really out of out of his mind teddy bear that would murder everyone and you would instead of blood like Stuffing would come out of them and stuff.

It was cool. That was only console, right? I believe well, you know, I don't know the answer that that's why I played on PS3 I think it didn't run on PS3. I definitely feel like it's one of those games That's like stranded on a console because like if that game was on PC I probably would own it already and it would probably run way better Which is a shame yaga comes to ps4 smash clobber and bash the murderous legends of Slavic mythology in this darkly funny action role-playing game That changes every time you play play as Ivan a one-handed blacksmith With incredibly bad luck who mistake on the impossible tasks give it to him by by the star or whatever by the stars are That how is our spell in that?

It can be T S a r t z a r or csa r c c. I like this premise a lot. This sounds really cool. Yeah, it does It does by the way Chris.

I looked up naughty bear came out in 2010. It's actually an iOS, but it's a house 3 and 360 came out Yeah 2010 and it was published by five oh five So they only IP and they still exist five oh five most recently published control as you guys might recall But the developer of it I forgot about this developer of it is behavior interactive and they used to be known as artificial mind and movement for people I don't remember or might remember them and they just worked out a lot of random games But I'm looking at their run of games today and you guys will be maybe not too pleased to learn They are a support team now that works with other big publishers including on games like star citizen, which is never gonna come out Oh wow, and also fall in shelter. Oh cool. Look forward to look at that Chris.

I think that's all of The games now we do have a question to wrap up on and I do want to do that before we get into the actual questions I'm sorry. Yes, but I assume we want to point out Was there anything we want to point out on this? I don't know yeah, I think I saw was that I fall in order is definitely one that comes to mind I I really like the write-up and the premise for yoga I can't speak to how good it is because I haven't seen it, but I dig that a lot of stuff is like cool I think so it's not really it's not really explored that much I assume it's based on Bobby Iga or whatever the hell and I am very curious about dolam for reasons That I think are pretty obvious, but uh, no those are the three that I think I'm most curious about Well, I was gonna ask you about golem. Are you gonna play it on PS VR?

Are you gonna play it on oculus? You know what I'll bust out the PS VR to play good boy. I'll do it I think my I think one of my roommates one of my 200 roommates has a PlayStation I that I can borrow I'm for sure he's not using You're such a good boy. By the way, the PlayStation I think reminds me an IGN when PS4 was coming out They had the camera and they were talking about all of the you know So he was talking about the peripherals you can go by and we kept calling the camera the PlayStation I and They got really mad about it and they kept telling us the correct it the PlayStation camera and we never did yeah I'm sorry the PlayStation I sounds cool.

Yeah, so much better than the PlayStation camera Shut the fuck up. Do you remember by the way the PlayStation camera was there was a massive shortage of it? When PS4 launched they didn't manufacture almost any cameras because they didn't think anyone would care and camera started selling like really quickly because Of the ability to stream natively on the console. So like the first six months you couldn't find a PlayStation camera people Remember that's kind of amazing.

I want to give a shout-out to the romancing saga three as I said earlier It's a vida game It is a it's not one of these shitty vida games as a triple-a vida game from a triple-a publisher So go show them some love but make sure watch your video first You don't want to just buy it blindly Jared Kellogg did write into us though before we get into the actual read or mail This isn't gonna count towards that He said hey cockroach Colin and condominium Chris long time first time on the last podcast you two were talking about the Blizzard situation a little More and Colin essentially talked about the importance of voting with your wallet when it comes to controversial companies like lizard And EA aka not buying their games this guy Thinking about Jedi fall in order seemingly the first racially developed single-player star wars experience since force on leash 2 I go so far as argues in scotour to or republic commando. I think you're going a little too far for that But my question is I would go back to yoda stories personally My question is as follows with EA holding the star wars license hostage for another four years at least is it not our duty to buy this game Therefore showing EA that this is what we want as gamers granted all those seem to be writing on how it reviews But given the recent 20 or so minutes of gameplay released by game-former and other outlets generic protagonists aside This game is looking like a wonderful concoction of some of gaming's best mechanics I'm personally waiting until the release to decide but this is just something I have been grappling with for the past few weeks as it may be A chance to reshape the way EA thinks about the content they produce this is a very insightful comment jerry Kellogg Hopefully you are from the Kellogg family that gave us the wonderful corn corn flakes and if you are thank you for that now Chris what Jared's basically saying here is that there's a conundrum because if you want to hold EA to task for the way that they've treated star wars maybe the way that they've treated respawn maybe the way that they whatever the case might be their microtransactions Apex legends whatever but if we don't buy fall in order Then aren't they getting just another maybe even contradictory message in other words? What do you do? You buy the games that you want to support it's quite simple.

I think it's I think we're focusing too much on the company It's like oh we got to show EA what's what's for it's like because they did all this shitty shitty garbage to all these different studios I should personally personally listen. I'm for real I still have a grudge because they shut down pandemic like I'm not even kidding like I still think about that every time of the Year game comes out I think about pandemic because I love that studio so dearly But you know I mean I think yeah if you want to send a message that this is the kind of game that you want I think it's I think you should buy it if you want to send that message and if you want to play that game I think you use your wallet on a title basis not necessarily on a company basis if that makes sense it does well My thing with this Chris is I think that this is an almost impossible situation Right it reminds me a lot of like some Economic movements around the world to try to punish a country or punish a group like the divestment and embargo situation That goes on with Israel for instance where it's really hard to balance that like I remember people You know what you know what soda stream is the company soda stream that goes like that's an Israeli company Just as an example and I remember reading a story where a guy was like part of the Palestinian Divestment and embargo movement whatever it's called BDS sanction movement and then about how they had a bounce That because they like they like some of the products that were coming out of Israel And like is it really possible to be all in on holding to account major companies major political parties And I think that it is but I think it comes out of sacrifice and I think you have to ask yourself What kind of sacrifice you're willing to make and EA is has its tendrils like other publishers and so many Public in so many developers and so many games and so many types of games That's really hard to hold them as an entity to account That's kind of a similar thing with lizard where even if you held blizzard what count Activision owns blizzard Activision just made $600 million in one day on call of duty in one day, right? You know so like I don't know that you shunning down your blizzard account is really making a dent And I think that's the unfortunate reality is that we don't have the power to make change the way We do I think sometimes because we're all not on the same page Which it makes a lot of sense so when you have a situation like this I agree with Chris I think you kind of gotta you either have to be really consistent like it goes back to Mass Effect Breathe with EA right where everyone's that's what everyone really started bitching about EA well They really started bitching about EA probably five years before that with the EA spouse letter do you remember that no? So people can go look this up this happened in 2005 or 2006 This was one of the first like viral pre-social media gaming industry things where a woman presumably a woman wrote about her husband working at EA And it was called the EA spouses blog and it was basically calling EA out for Crunching ruining these guys lives and stuff like that and ever it's really a famous thing back and they guys really look it up and check it out It's interesting but after that that's what everyone started bitching about EA and then it really kind of came to a head again With Mass Effect 3 and then came to a head again with Andromeda But I just don't know that we're capable of hurting them because even if you wanted to I don't really want to I don't care But even if you were capable of hurting them you have to account for the 20 million people that play FIFA right or the Did you see all the rumors about how they might release a Mass Effect trilogy next year on PS4 like that's gonna sell millions of copies Regardless of what they've done and so I think it's tough.

It's tough to be principled. It's tough. That's why you should just not have any principles Yeah, exactly All right, Chris as tradition dictates will read six questions comments concerns about some ideas from the audience beginning With Zach which I remember you can support some patreon.com I stand to get your inquiries read on the air we've already read so many of them will do six more He says C6 if Disney ends their star wars relationship with EA What are the chances that Sony strikes a deal to land the IP exclusively on PlayStation? How much would this change the landscape for the next generation?

This is an interesting question Chris for two reasons number one is that EA's relationship with Disney over the Star Wars IP is finite and the second I think it ends in 2022 I could be wrong on that but I think that's what it ends and The now they can renew of course I think that's one the initial agreement and the second thing is that Disney also owns Marvel who is in bed with PlayStation on an exclusive series So I don't I don't think that's likely I think it's incredibly unlikely the Star Wars is so huge But it wouldn't surprise me by any stretch of the imagination if a Star Wars game Like one Star Wars game ended up exclusively on PS5. That was a prize middle. Yeah, and I would agree with you I think that's pretty much my assessment of it too. I doubt you're gonna see it's not where complete Star Wars Exclusivity on a PlayStation platform, but I can see a one-off being there for sure Well, it's what they've done as we said with Marvel They're able to kind of piecemeal that right they gave a game marble game a game to switch There's a switch exclusive marble game and multiple marble open lines three.

There's a PlayStation exclusive game with Spider-Man There's a third party triple-a game with the Avengers So they're able to kind of split things off like that And so they could do the same thing this next go around and I would absolutely love To see one of Sony's first parties unleash on Star Wars and the team that comes to mind for me is sucker punch for some reason I don't know why no I could see that totally that makes total sense Then maybe really even we could do something like that, but with Jedi fall in order We're gonna see if the proofs in the pudding I think that if this game's bad which I don't think it's going to be or if it sells poorly Which I don't think it will but assuming either those things happen I think that Disney would pull the plug on this relationship immediately Because even though the battlefront games have sold appreciably the PR has not been good now for this And I don't think Disney is in the want of money like Disney got out of game publishing to stop having so much headaches So many headaches in making and publishing games and they just haven't avoided them because they were foolish enough to get in bed with EA when I think that they probably could have found much better partners than yeah And I've always been confused why they didn't want to go through the trouble of publishing and developing their own games That also made no sense to me. Yeah, I think they had a really hard time I know people that worked on Star Wars 13 13 and I know that that was a really painful experience or everyone involved especially because it was So it's supposed to be so good and Disney kind of ended up killing that just got switched between the Lucas film purchase Disney and all that but yeah, exactly we'll see but I wouldn't be surprised to see a spider-man like game Let's say like a like a tie fighter versus X actually game or something on PlayStation. I'll be pretty cool. Yeah Maybe PS VR game actually that would be even better actually because it's just a we need a cool third party proof of concept for Like a $60 PS VR game that isn't blood and truth or something like that.

Yeah Joe John Quinn wrote in and said hey space rangers should first pretty games be added to offerings of PlayStation now at the time of their initial release Might take is they should not I feel like gamers are actually starting to ask for too much value shorting profits Do a dangerous margin is counterintuitive to the health and wellness of the industry you guys talk all the time about how gamers are cheap Our games are cheaper than ever. I think it's a gamers are cheaper than ever Which they also are a joke pushing the price and even further down can possible be good for the devs publishers You want a healthy vibrant and profitable industry Chris? It's funny Joe brought this up because in the Andrew Ryan interview that's on games industry International's website which people should go check out is really quite a fascinating read this and a bunch of other stuff does come up and He says that Sony has no plan on bringing day and date first party games to play the show now And that they're not going to be doing that and that is in stark contrast to what Xbox has done with their first party games Now the contrast can also be drawn that PlayStation first party games are just leagues ahead at this point of Xbox's And so Xbox is going towards a volume approach as opposed to a quality approach and so they want those things on Xbox game Pass, but do you feel like or I get me back up is what Joe John Quinn saying? Does that resonate with you because he does make a good point that if we want if we do care about the wellness of the industry at large Then even though it's consumers where does we are trained to look for the best savings?

We can get it does come at a cost and we don't want to bear the cost of that down the road Well, there's just no reason for them to do that They're the reason that Xbox is doing it is because they're the underdog this generation and they've come out on the bottom And this is a good way to get this is a good consumer focus way to get in the public's good graces This is a consumer friendly thing to do, but Sony doesn't need to do it So I would I would be hard pressed to convince them, you know, I would like Chris Although I don't know that this would be possible. Maybe this is bad business I don't know I know I run a business I don't know that I'm the greatest or smartest business man Maybe this will prove that but wouldn't it be cool if they click clock on it where they were like PlayStation now is Is full of first party offerings that are older as well as a ton of third party offerings based on the desires of publishers and developers at 180 days six months from the release of every exclusive it'll be on PlayStation now and at that time We will drop the price I like telegraphing that kind of stuff because it really puts people on the clock and puts the pressure on them Okay, this game's gonna be $39.99 and six months. They already said it It's gonna be on PlayStation now in six months. They reset it.

Can you wait? Can you wait? And I like that is kind of a bait like baiting the line a little bit to get people on PlayStation now All the PlayStation now is doing appreciably as we talked about an episode or two ago So I like that so he's taking this tactic I think you're absolutely correct that Xbox wouldn't be giving away Gears 5 for free basically if they could get away with not giving Gears 5 away for free So because I've been seeing a lot of these deals that were people are getting like a dollar of game pass for a month for like For a one buck and that's like a that's like incredible No, yeah, it's insane, but but Microsoft wouldn't do that if this was 2010 So, you know, you have to you have to balance that I appreciate what's being said here And I appreciate the conversation happening around this but PlayStation now is not Sony's future It is part of Sony's future and if Microsoft wants Xbox Xbox games pass to be like the center of gravity of their future Then they can do that they're well on their way, but I don't know if that's wise. Yeah, so we'll see We'll see how that all goes Kyle Listerman wrote in and said he kick ass Chris and she'll call him with a delay of the last of us Two is there any chance the ghost of Tsushima will be ready for the first quarter of next year I think this will show more success for the game with PS5 not hitting full swing at that point in the marketing department I know it would be an announcement of the date close to the release But it could be smart to wait till after the fall rush though.

It gets more attention. Thanks for the best I don't think there's any way that that's gonna happen Kyle the rumor is that The last was to his delay has been serially affected death or a ghost of Tsushima's release date But not pushing it forward pushing it back. So I don't think they're gonna be ready to go Don't think it's gonna be ready to go. I still think it's possible that this is gonna be a cross-generation release Yeah, I think so too now I'm so tired of saying this person I hate to be the same drum and sound like I'm the same same thing over and over again Although I am cross-gen releases are just not gonna mean the same thing next time So I don't know what that means right?

I don't know what that means But I feel like it's gonna be really so close to the next gen that they're not they're gonna have a hard time avoiding this It reminds me a little bit of Beyond two souls Which was the second of three quantum dream games that were made for Sony the first being heavy rain that they're being Detroit people will remember that beyond two souls came out like a few weeks before PS4 came out and it was locked on PS3 and It gave Sony a little bit of a hard time because they didn't really know what to do with it And they don't really have that same problem with the forwards and backwards and paddadole of PS5 So again, we're gonna see what this marketing looks like but no Kyle do not look forward to playing death strand Ergo to shimmer either before the last of us part two you will not I mean you could you could wait and play Yeah, yeah, I guess whether or not come out that way that's cheating, but yeah, yeah, you can prove me wrong I guess Jordan DeBeau wrote in the West and said HACM squared I was wondering why PlayStation doesn't have a flagship franchise Mario will always have a game and princess Well, we have a game in Princess Zelda has done everything but pull up her skirt Well dirty, isn't it? Microsoft will run gears and halo as far as possible. But PlayStation doesn't have a franchise That's anonymous with it like this. I was wondering what it would be if you guys could pick I thought maybe twisted metal But those games seem dead thoughts.

Yeah, twisted metal is long dead There's been a new twist in metal game in almost a decade, but it's actually been eight years next year But Chris I do feel like they don't have that flagship. They've had them over time. They've had their crash bandicoot They've had I think they have console that they have like generational flagships. Yes, like I feel like you know So the ps1 had crash and Spyro and maybe snake Towards as like viable kind of mascots Although I would argue that crashes obviously the one that people think of the most definitely PlayStation 2 obviously had like Jack and Daxxer and Ratchet and Clank It's like Cooper PlayStation 3 was a little bit less heavy.

I think it was you know infamous uncharted and Yeah, it's probably it may be sack away. Yes, I was one of my yeah Yes, four really is the only one that I think hasn't although I think maybe recently has with the death strandings kind of iconographic visual Sure, and back of course and neck of course. Yeah, I can't forget neck But I don't know I don't think it's necessarily a a good or bad thing that they don't have you know a flagship It's been with them from the beginning I think it's totally fine that they have a generational approach to things in fact I think it's kind of help them I think absolutely right I was exactly what I was gonna say was I think you could look at this as a gambit that Like their first of all was Spyro and with crash the ironic thing about those being PS1 era late 90s PlayStation icons that Sony never own them so that was like the whole weird Situation there and then with Jack and Daxxer and Ratchet like you said with the platformers on PS2 But I think over time they're willingness to abandon or refresh platform things like they basically abandoned uncharted Although you're gonna see more on charmed on PS5 from the San Diego team I think and they remade God of War basically into a new game I like that they're willing to shake things up and that there's no convention that can't be broken because I personally I love Nintendo like I always have a soft-sparked Nintendo, but I think it's fucking boring that you can always expect a Mario game And as Zelda game and there's nothing new you know There's like there's almost nothing new if you think about like new meaningful IP from Nintendo in the last 20 years You have pickin in maybe and then you have Splatoon maybe and that's basically it So I don't know that that's necessarily super healthy either So I like the idea It's all about personal preference, but I like the idea that we're moving forward and that we know no No, you know I was not making a chart again that we know sucker punch isn't making infamous like uber again that we know that even teams like Bend might not be doing a days gone sequel necessarily. We don't know there and I think that's fun I think that's cool.

Yeah, yeah, it makes for a more interesting ecosystem without a doubt Jeff Pollard run it What's instead? Hey Colin Chris the trophy count display shows a number with a star next to it mine is currently 17 with 25% Towards the next level. What is this number? How is it calculated?

Does it even serve a purpose? Thanks? Well, no, it serves no purpose. I think we've already been over that Chris.

Let's get let's get real nerdy here about this I'm gonna teach her how this works a long time ago when trophies came out in 2008 and into 2009 people sat around and tried to figure out Exactly how this was working because what is being described here by Jeff is when you go online in your intro You see your little number in the star in the little it's like a role playing game bar of experience and you see that next to your name And that's tied to trophies now People have figured out what the values of trophies are and how this contributes to the points So what people have figured out is that there's a point back end that's hidden and that bronze trophies are worth 15 points Silver trophies are worth 30 points gold trophies are worth 90 points and platinum trophies are with 180 points So in other words a silver is worth twice as much as the bronze a gold is worth three times as much as a silver a platinum's worth twice as Much as gold and so on these points are calculated in the back end to give you experience And that's what the level the number in the sorry is your level So at the beginning going from level one to level two only requires 200 points So you're gonna do that really quickly and even the 600 points for level three and 1200 points for level four But I have my page open I'm level 36 and at this point and I'm looking looking looking looking I think I need something like a hundred and seventy thousand points To get to the next level and so that's what you say on those levels for really long period time So basically it's just an experience RPG like experience system That just gives you a look like instead of showing the cumulative number like they do with achievements Which is fine they made a back end role playing game system based on the value of trophies Which are hidden but now you know the values of the trophies 15 30 90 180 there you go That's all you needed to know aren't you excited about them now? Okay, fair enough Chris the final inquiry comes from Dylan says hey baby boys as quite possibly your only listener using PlayStation for you I was pretty annoyed to find out in last week's episode that my service is going to end I just double check my email and I still haven't received any notice aside from that It's an interesting decision considering they bumped up prices just a couple of months ago to compensate for the cost They're citing best guess is a loss subs in response I've long thought it was odd a brand of PlayStation and not more TV ubiquitous Sony considering the service has absolutely nothing to do with Your games you think this is another example of Sony dropping the ball or is the Sony name Hoss we just not strong enough to market the service and profitability Well, you keep it again or whatever you do or whatever you and why Kylie nerds do thank you Dylan for your kind You're gonna be a Virginia soon soon I'll be in a in the words of the late 90s early 2000s rap duo clips I'm gonna be in Virginia where ain't shit to do but cook Wow. I'm so down a sound that you even have that yeah You know I was thinking of that's training is the opposite of what you're doing. It is stranding you're going you're going west Right exactly.

This is the reverse that stranding we're holding it Yeah, so we talked a little bit about this last week But I did want to bring up again because Dylan brought this point up that other people had brought up to me privately Which is that I kind of am wondering how if you would have done if they did market as Sony instead of as PlayStation because it does make it seem That and you do I guess need a PlayStation device But why not have it be a smart TV thing, you know, yeah, so yeah, I feel you I mean Is it really surprised that Sony is dropping the ball and has an email you that your service is ending yet? I can't believe that I love that you found out from us before you before they told you and you're paying like subscribe It's like it's amazing. You'll get that email after view is shut off probably. Yeah, so yeah, I think that is a Sony dropping the ball I don't know I like that Sony experiment in the space.

I'm not so sure That being in cable and traditional cable is a wise financial decision They've obviously deemed that not to be a wise financial decision But from my perspective, I was just excited about the possibilities of having that as part of a larger offering that we're never gonna see now So that's that's the bummer for me because again I've been hoping for a PlayStation Plus PlayStation now PlayStation view all in one kind of package that we're obviously not gonna get so yeah That's I guess it I do think it would have done better under Sony, but at the same time It's like I don't know there's so many there's so many platforms that offer this that at this point I feel like they were hoping that they could maybe market to people to a gaming audience Because they knew that like the more traditional audiences have probably already been swept up by the overwhelming majority of the competition I think that was their angle was that okay? Hey, you know, this is this is for people who you know are more into video games This is here some TV for you And I don't think it was as a resident a message or a pitch as they were hoping it was and that's where we're at Definitely. I mean definitely so I mean it's hard to compete with streaming It's hard to compete with sports piracy, which is really rampant because yeah because that's a lot of reason Only people would have cable and then they figured out I mean there are really easy ways to watch any NFL game you want For instance, I pay for the Sunday ticket package because I just like the quality and I like to rely on it I feel like it's a little dishonest, but you can go on Reddit and find any of these streams in 1080 or 4k You know, no problem So I think a lot of that has to do with you know when you nickel and dime someone enough I think that they don't they cease having a problem or I don't have a big of a problem with a nickel and dime you back And that might be what happened with PlayStation view so alright, but Dylan. Oh, let's go get that email I doubt you will go let us know Chris is all I have for this episode 72 of sacred symbols you have any closing comments I'm excited to play more Death's Landing honestly me too pumped and I'm I'm feeling sick too which sucks Hmm, I started noticing in the middle of the show like yeah, I got a thing in the back of my throat and hurts I'm sorry here that will go take some it's source go take some take will or something like that Yeah, I'm nice enough your liver does it.

Yeah. Oh, well, that makes sense. It's alcohol right so I guess that makes a lot of sense Oh, yeah, well, well don't I guess don't take the cold do something I'll figure it out go take a home meal pathic remedy I'll get the I'll I'll smear the oil of a snake on my face. There you go Yeah, you're gonna go get one of those you know like one of those indigenous I don't know what they're called They like squat like crunch like peppercorns in them or something or like basil leaves, you know Yeah, like a mortar.

I think it's cool You get you get some of the dried out roaches in your apartment and and all that and you just and you smear it under your nose like it's Like you want to inhale it, you know, it's a fix like it's a big favor. That's exactly right exactly right Chris Well, I'll see you next time for more sacred symbols. Thank you so much for your time. Of course appreciate all of you out there supporting us and giving us a love and kindness You don't have to literally give us love.

Yeah, please. I mean avoid the literal love right well It doesn't mean a little anymore anyway, so totally but we appreciate your support your kindness you're generosity Remember to support on patreon.com slash Collins last and that's how you get sacred symbols plus the ability to submit questions comments concerns Ideas early and free access to our show and more we couldn't do it without you. Thank you so much again. Love you.

Goodbye Sacred symbols a PlayStation podcast is a product of and a registered trademark of Collins last and LLC and is recorded right here in sunny Santa Monica, California, USA The show is conceived by is written by and is produced by me column Moriarty My co-host is Chris Ray gun You can find me on Twitter at no taxation and on Instagram at CLS Moriarty Chris is on Twitter at Chris R Gun and on Instagram at Chris underscore Ray underscore gun sacred symbols is edited by Dustin Furman any snail mail can be sent to the CLSPO box P.O box one two three three Santa Monica, California nine zero four zero six to message the show online Please use patreon's DM service as you know all Collins last and shows including sacred symbols are fan-funded on patreon at patreon.com slash Collins last And the following names are at the producer level or higher on patreon and we are eternally grateful for your kindness generosity and fandom Chris Adams Carlos Algret Morgan Ashley Saul Belch his art Taylor Barkley Martin Beck Tyler Bello Mark Bojio Barabazzuel Spencer Brand well Brewer Landon Brixie Eric R Brown Jason Budnick Josh Bouxing Austin Bullock Dylan Burns Chris Boston Nick C. Alex Cabrera Patrick Harper William O'Carol Brian Chan Sean Chandler David Chestnut Rodney Coleman Simon Conception Brad Cooley John Cordaro Geo Corsi Nicotro Phillip crone Daniel D. Amour Colin Davenport Night draft David Ellis Jerome Ferra Joe Finelli Eric Finkin Biner root on Fitzpatrick Chris Galvin Connor Gashan Alex Gates Michael Gates Salem Ghanum El-Gonam Tyler Goodwin Josh Gravelick Miranda Grubba Jonathan H Eric Hardin Tyler Harris Richard Heber the third Kyle Hegel Shane Hendricks in wide Henry Robbie Hensley Scott Hernandez a saha Johnny Humphreys Blake Israel is on ice al ricey Josh Yager Garrett Jagger Josh O'Jonison Paul Joyce Greg Jules N K Patrick Kelly Jeremy Key Andy Kennan James Kin's load the third Ryan Architridge Mason Cotalack Jackson Lassigua Jo Lawson Don Culee Matthew Len Patrick Leslie Dustin Lewis Keith Adrian Lewis Chad Lewis Lunare Loper Colin Love Scott Lovelace Josh M. Keke Mai Ryan T.

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