Hello, welcome to another episode of Retrospection, and this one we're going underground with a cult American TV series Beauty and the Beast, the original, that ran from 1987 to 1990. My name's Colin, and I've never regretted what I am, until now. Yeah, never was a true word spoken eh? And my name's Paul, and you should always know what's coming up behind.
Sometimes you don't care though right? Well it depends on the situation doesn't it? Yeah. I am DB, described the show as being about the adventures and romance of a sensitive and cultured Lion Man, and a crusading district attorney in Manhattan, New York City, just in case you confused with Manhattan the drink.
And there's nothing like giving away Vincent's whole persona is there, Lion Man. I never thought about that, but yeah, that's right, it does. Especially as they take great pains in the episode to hide it until a certain point. Yeah, that's something I'm going to mention about that, but I'll talk about what we get there.
Okay, the pilot episode is called Once Upon a Time in New York City. It's there as Ron Pullman as Vincent, Roy, though, treats as Jacob further wells, Linda Hamilton as assistant district attorney Catherine Chandler and Ray Wise as Tom. Although she's not the assistant district attorney at this point, I should point that out in the pilot. No, she's just a trainee or something like that, and she's a new recruit.
Well, yeah, let's talk about that. The episode is directed by Richard Franklin, who's better known for FX2 and Beastmaster, the TV series. Well, I think I know what I would put on top of my resume. Beastmaster?
I didn't even know that was a thing. Oh, yeah, Beastmaster, TV series. Yeah. Favorite?
No, I've stumbled across it many a late night, but never said. I was surprised to discover that George Martin actually was a writer and producer on the show. I mean, quite frankly, the lucky any episodes were finished. I think he was on book one or book two of his epic at this point.
A song of ice and fire. That'll be the one. Yeah, he was a staffer actor on all three seasons. Well, didn't know that.
Yeah, apparently he felt that the reason why he got cancelled was down to the fact that Linda Hamilton decided to leave in season three. Well, I mean, do we want to discuss that huge plot spoiler for this whole show and the fact that they didn't they kill her off and then it was just the beast? Well, she and the beast finally get it on. You got to cut the song in there.
And she has a baby and then the baby is stolen by an evil villain. Well, I thought he said stolen. No, he's stolen by an evil villain. And then she dies.
And then season three is basically him looking for his kid. So it basically changes the whole dynamic of the show. Yeah, that's always a bad idea. How many times have we seen that happen?
You know, all the phone is to abuse in the beast, though. They handle it quite well because you don't mind the change and you enjoyed it. I like it for lots of different reasons. I think that season three gives it new life in a lot of ways because it isn't about a relationship anymore between the two main characters.
It becomes wider. It opens it up more. And all bets are off in season three because characters die. And it's also a precursor to what we know modern TV to be like.
It's kind of long form storytelling where it isn't the first two seasons. The kind of very self contained episodic stories where season three is more of a long form narrative that stretches all the way through the season. And that was quite new at that point in 1990, I think. I think having you having said that, we should point out that back in 1987, you were pretty much obsessed with the show.
Well, it was probably my first dipping of the toe into fandom was Beauty and Beast. Star Trek was the other thing and massive Star Trek fans, as you know. But I got into the fandom of Beauty and Beast before I got into Star Trek fandom. And I was involved in the Helper's Network, which was the big fan organization in the UK at the time.
And I had, don't roll your eyes at me. I had stories published in fanzines at the time and I used to know quite a lot of people that were involved in it. And so yeah, everything up front, this show has quite a big sentimental value to me. Right.
Right. Because people, I mean, a lot of people don't know this, but back in 1987, you were a 13-year-old girl. But it's a scribbling, terrible poems in your jotter whilst drawing hats in the merging and big circles and the letter I. Because let's be honest, this is the audience this show was aimed at, right?
Not saying I necessarily agree with you. I disagree with you. I mean, men didn't really enjoy this. Oh, men?
Men used to pretend to like, it's like when men used to pretend to like, Morrissey, just the win over the affections of a girl. I mean, thank goodness we don't have to do that anymore. Turned out, I was right. He's not a bed.
Kinda like Morrissey. Yeah, not surprised. No, no, hang on. Let me elaborate.
I like old Morrissey. I don't like new Morrissey. I'm like new Morrissey. Let me just...
Well, he's old now. You mean you're like young Morrissey. Not old Morrissey. Isn't that what I said?
No, he said you like old Morrissey, meaning time-wise. Oh, now he's old. No, you're confusing me. I'm like, do you know why?
Because you like Morrissey. Oh, he's at it, right? Okay. Yeah, so this is like an important show for you then.
It is. Yes, it's got a lot of backstories for me this show. And I explain why you used to fast videos of it on me. Well, I think force is a strong word, Colin.
I don't think I forced them on. You do, though. Every week you bring one round. I toss them aside and say, yeah, watch it.
Never did. I don't believe you didn't watch them. In fact, we had conversations about the episode. Oh, was it?
Oh, it's probably lying. Just like that. I can't remember if I watched it or not. I'm sure I must have watched some.
Well, I'm sure we'll get to your opinion of this show. Maybe it's changed. Yeah, maybe I'm matured. Well, we can, but hope.
That's unlikely. Do you have any notes and information about the show? We pretty much covered everything, really, that I was going to say, other than the fact that the makeup that Ron Perlman was created by Rick Baker. Okay.
And it took apparently four hours to apply each episode. That must have been a pain in the ass. Yeah, you would have to turn up at five a.m. That's something.
The worst thing I can imagine. The worst thing I can imagine is sitting in a chair. In a chair? A four hour.
A four hour. Yeah. The thing is, though, I mean, I've never had that done, but I imagine it's very claustrophobic. I mean, they're all worse ones to have, like the guy in Red Dwarf, Creighton in Red Dwarf, like he has hours of makeup, but it must be so claustrophobic.
Yeah, because you're kind of locked into your own cell phone for those hours. You're normally locked into your own cell phone. It's all about you, Paul. I walked into that one, didn't I?
And before we get into what you actually think of the show, I just want to point out that the final episode won three Emmy Awards. All right. Now, if I know you were going to say that, I would have locked up things at other things that are won any awards, just to pre-that means not that. I know what you didn't.
So there you go. It won an award for outstanding direction, outstanding cinematography, and outstanding music composition. Oh, one of those I have an issue with. Could it be the music?
Two of those. Yeah, yeah. Two of those I'm fine with. The cinematography, the cinematography, fine.
I got a problem with the music. All right. This could be interesting then. All right.
So let's jump into the episode then. We're here birds, Twittering, and there's a shot of a tree. The words once upon a time, appear in a gothic font. We pull out to reveal that we're in New York.
The text on the screen confirms this. And the soft sound of the wildlife are replaced by the angry noises of a massive metropolis. We're on Perk Avenue. But I found these churches on the left and we're looking towards the MetLife building.
The title, Beauty and the Beast appears. A cab pulls up and Assistant District Attorney Catherine Chandler gets out. Ah, she's not Assistant District Attorney. Oh, that's right.
She's just a lawyer, right? She's just a lawyer. Yeah, I was just jumping ahead of yourself. I know, right.
I was just using what IMDB called her. That was a mistake. We, I should say as well that we don't get the usual credits from the series because it's a pilot. We normally get a voiceover from Ron Perlman and Linda Hamilton.
Oh, lovely. You know it. This is where the wealthy... Wait, wait, hold on.
You haven't written this down. You just know this. I do know this, yeah. I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm good.
It's, it's like, it's like sometimes I think my opinion of you can get any lower and then you pull something out of the bag. This is where the wealthy and the powerful rule. It is her world. I won't do it anymore.
No, if you know it, do it all. Go for it. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, because I'm, I'm just going to get it ridiculed for it. So I'm not going to do it.
I'm not going to give you the satisfaction college. I, I am sitting here in awe that you remember this. This is where the wealthy and the powerful is Catherine. So I actually captured my heart.
She would change my life. He comes from a secret place far below the city streets, hiding his face from strangers safe from hate and harm. He brought me there to save my life. And now wherever I go, he's with me in spirit, for we have a bond stronger than friendship or love.
And although we cannot be together, we will never ever ever be apart. She greets reception with her, morning, but her greeting is returned with her, not anymore. So it's after lunchtime. I see why you like a parl.
She has your work ethic. This is how work should be. You know, you roll out of bed mid afternoon, work for back three hours and then head back home. The perfect day is for his uncle's son.
And fear in our COVID times, they roll out of bed if I'm at work. You even put pants on Colin. Let's move on from that. Yeah.
Meanwhile, throughout this, the credits continue. They're a little distracting in the red and white Gothic style. No, I like the Gothic style. It's a fairytale kind of atmosphere.
And that's what they're going for, right? Yeah. As she makes her way to the office, we get a lot of lawyer office speak from, you know, from people, stuff like, don't forget the settlement conference at 3pm. She enters the office of an older guy who's on the phone.
Hi, dad, she says, ah, so she works here because her dad got her the job. And that's why she can roll in late, but she must be popular in the office. I think it's, I get what you say, and that is exactly what they're going for with the character, isn't it? Which is why she kind of gets, she looks for redemption later, I think, in the episode and in the series.
But do you think that people are nicer just because she is the daughter of the, yeah. Also, her character is a were of her position and she's not happy in her job, which makes the redemption not as strong. If she was like happy in a position and didn't curd her dad got her job and she really enjoyed where she was, wouldn't that make her redemption stronger? It would, but I don't necessarily agree with you on that.
I think what they're going for is that she's kind of in a rut. She's happy, she knows she's not happy, but she's happy to just let it continue the way it is. Right, I just realise I can't say anything about the show because you've just watched it so many times and love it so much, no matter what I say, you're going to like sit there and go, well. Well, this is the first time we've actually sat down and I can actually counterpoint what you're trying to do.
Yeah, because I have no, I have no knowledge of the show because I never watched it. I can only tell you from my perspective of what I think. Well, this is going to be interesting, isn't it? I know, I know.
You're going to get irritated very quickly, aren't you? Or anything, mate. To be honest though, I was there when you said hello. That's just a given, isn't it?
Yeah, yeah, it's just a verbal, standard operating procedure, isn't it? I know it works, yes. He tells that Al Showitz is coming up from Atlanta tonight and wants her to have dinner with them, but she has other plans. Tom is having a party for the architects of a new project.
I mean, apparently it's got no name, it's just a new project. That's all you need to know? Yeah, okay. Her dad complains that he used to be invited to all these functions.
He says she should have fought twice before handing her over to their best client. You make it sound like a horse trade, she replies. What about tomorrow night? Her dad asks.
She says she has to check her calendar. She's so busy that she doesn't know what she's doing tomorrow night. I kind of read it that she's just kind of brushing it off. Ah, she's avoiding it.
She doesn't really care really one way or the other, I don't think. Right, okay. The actor playing Tom is Ray Wise who pops up in a lot of other things from Robocops to Mad Men, but he's probably best known as the character of Leiland Palmer or Leiland Palmer, but a Laura Palmer in Twin Peaks. It generally plays and I can't say this any play to ourselves.
He does, he specializes in ourselves, yes. I wonder if that gets to you as an actor? I don't know. I suppose if you're a good actor, then you just brush it off, don't you?
I don't know. I've got this role. Is it an asshole? Yeah.
You mean maybe it gets you off with herself? Yeah, you want to get an asshole role. You never get nice guy roles or leading characters or positive people. It's just always assholes.
I suppose that's the definition of being stereotyped. It's just constantly fought to being an asshole. What's that like? Oh, is that what you're building up to?
It was. I just fought to that then. I'll let you know. Alright.
Alright. Her dad realizes that she's just coming into work and she says, oh, she had a late night and some errands to run in the morning. She didn't. She didn't.
She just come to Beaufort. She just got a bit about an hour before she had to go to work. Because she doesn't want to be there. Probably, yeah.
Alright. He asks her if she's not finding her work stimulating. I actually say stimulating is not the word she would use for corporate law. But you're a good corporate lawyer.
No, she says, and the daughter of a good corporate lawyer. So she understands her position and she understands what she is. Yes. Which kind of makes sense later, I think.
I think that maybe she's always wanted to change, but has never had the push to do it. And what happens to her in the episode gives her that push. I can see that. So we got to a party with a, let's be honest, a bunch of suited bars.
They're looking at an ice sculpture of what I guess this new building will look like. And Tom is describing it to them. She's listening to her friend Moana about her life. Catherine says she's sorry and hopes things will turn around for her.
But she has that same dead look behind her eyes that I have when Paul starts talking about Merval. You got to change that to be you in the basement, right? Yeah. About 10 minutes time.
Yeah. Tom comes over. It's revealed that Catherine hasn't seen Eve since college and they were just catching up. That's a hell of a coincidence isn't it?
You're a party and an old college friend that you haven't seen in ages turns up. I think it's a TV conceit isn't it? It happens a lot in TV shows. When you try to get a shortcut to something particularly in 80 shows.
Okay. I realise this is also the other thing we're going to be doing. We're going to be excusing things. Oh, no.
We're going to be excusing lazy script writing. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not.
I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not.
I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not.
I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not.
I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not.
She'll just assign herself to the episode. Yeah. Don't do that. All right.
Gloves are off. You don't, okay. You keep getting serious now? Some say he has to talk to Kathryn and takes her away.
He complains that Kathryn has been listening to Yves bl blavoring on all night. When Kathryn says Yves is going through a lot. Tom,One is less than sympathetic. He knows Eve.
She's a lush. a lot of shit. It doesn't say that, but that's what you get. He's got your tactics got your tactics and sympathy, but I'm very sympathetic.
Are you? I don't see any of it. Well, no, I'm sure a dick. Oh, it's just me.
All right. OK. Yeah, yeah, it's just you. Yeah.
What I do is I'm sympathetic and curring and gentle to the whole world. But there has to be a point where I just like unleash everything. And that's you. That's your role.
Well, I'm glad that you've spelled out from calling out because I often. Tom describes you as a complete loser. OK, Tom, hold back. Although, let's be honest, Eve sounds like a lot of more fun to be with than Tom.
Oh, definitely. Definitely. I mean, just the fact that she's a lush. Oh, yeah.
Yeah, you'd like that, right? Yeah. I don't know. I'd have been the she had a great personality.
I don't know what you were talking about. Oh, OK. Do you want me to explain it to you? No.
No. Apparently, Catherine agrees with me because Tom wants to introduce her to people and Catherine, she doesn't want to. Tom says he could count on her, but she points out that this isn't brain surgery. It's just a party.
Tom is getting annoyed. He says he doesn't have time for this. Yes, it's an independent woman making her own decisions. He's got a shot coming to me.
Back 20 years. Yeah. Yeah, Catherine says she doesn't like to be told who she can talk to. And Tom thinking that he's got an ace, a zinger, a right up his sleeve, says show better judgment then.
Fine, says Catherine. I'm calling it a night. She's a strong woman. Yep, she is.
Tom tells her, no, that's not an option. But she continues. She says goodbye to Eve, grabs a coat and she does leave. And in the street, she yells for a taxi, but they ignore her.
And a stranger says he can catch one for her. But a van pulls up, he grabs that and says, are you going home alone tonight, Carol? Actually, doesn't say like that. I was actually betting on you.
What were you going for, the Pirates of the Caribbean or something? Oh, I like, oh, you didn't like it. I didn't say it. I didn't say it.
Yeah, I just said it was interesting the choices that you made. Oh, OK. He grabs her and says, are you going home tonight, Carol? No, that's better.
And he says, are you going home? Hello, tonight. Right, my ears. Well, I don't like that at all.
I don't like it. Are you going home alone tonight, Carol? He pushes her into the van. He keeps calling her Carol.
And she tries to tell him that's not her name. When he tells her to shut up, he pulls a knife out every time you look into the mirror. Now, don't you think at this point I'm going to talk about the direction? Don't you think it's shot very cinematic for a TV partner?
Yeah, I think this is a show. Of course, I don't see later episodes, but this is a show that probably looked good on Blu ray and done properly. OK, I think it looks nice. Definitely the point that I was going to mention in a moment when we get to the underground stuff, the point that looks better than the rest of the series.
I'll tell you why in a minute. Oh, all right. It cuts her shot to the van, bathed and missed. And they throw her out of it and she's unconscious and rolls tough start in the moody, misty, magic light.
We see a figure approach. He or she don't know at this point picks up Catherine. And then we see an ornate massive spiral staircase leading down into the depths of the ground. Not really sure how there's a whole space on the ground, but OK.
Well, some of these shots, for example, I've got my knowledge out on that. Some of these shots, for example, have been walking on the spiral staircase and actually Matt paintings, but are actually real locations underground in New York City. That spiral staircase does exist in New York City. Does it really?
He does. That is a fact. And I didn't. Well, thanks.
Apparently, they're on the ground. I think the size has been exaggerated. Oh, yeah, I'm not saying it hasn't. I'm not saying it hasn't, but what I'm saying is that they they used a lot of actual locations, particularly in the pilot, not so much maybe in series, because a lot of these shots get reused in series.
Right. It's like the battle start, Galactica. It is. It is.
And the other thing I want you to say is I do like the colour part change from the world above to the world below, whereas, you know, it's very, it's very dry and stark. When she's, you know, it's very industrial looking. And I'm going to get to the world below. It's already deep.
It's very, it's very, it's very orange. Yes. Yeah. You know what I'm going to say?
It's it's a deep and parrot. Yes. Yes. They're obviously trying for something.
Yes. They're definitely trying for something. I'm trying to I'm trying for words. That's what I'm trying for.
Yes. It's pretty. You know, it's a podcast and those are kind of imparted. No, I don't.
I don't. Do what right now, say I might want to. Great. I won't read it.
I can't read it. Careful and wakes up. Faces bandaged her eyes are covered up. She starts the panic.
A voice tells her that she's safe. Is this a hospital she asks? No. Would you go to be all right?
That's not the answer you want to hear, is it? No, and I'm not sure that those bandages are sterile. I mean, they don't look the cleanest bandages you've ever seen in your life, is it? No, that's true.
Where they get that from. I mean, there's brown stains all over them. Oh. Is that?
Yeah, we use them for lagging the pipes. We just peel them off, put them on your face. You'd be all right. What do you think about Ron Perlman's voice?
In this. I mean, he's choice because he doesn't talk like that normally, Ron Perlman. He's seen lots of things. But it's a really interesting choice that he makes for the voice.
It's kind of gentle, but it's also got a something else underneath it, kind of an animal sort of power as well. They don't raid your eyebrow. I'm trying to be serious here. It's a good voice that he chooses.
Yeah, it's it. Oh, I don't care. I'll give it shit. Hey, what about I'm trying to bring something to this?
So I know you are. What are we doing here? No, I generally don't see any of this. I just I don't.
It's because you're dead inside. It's not it's not that I'm doing that. I just don't give a fuck about the show. I generally don't see any of that.
That's fine. I hear it. That's fine. Yeah.
But maybe it's also because I don't I don't actually know what other than hell by. I don't know what Ron Perlman sounds like. And I don't have any connection to the show. So it yeah, it just means nothing to me.
I completely get that. But he doesn't sound anything like Vincent at all. Right. He tells it to rest.
Two figures watch over her. One tells the other that he should be alerted if her temperature rises. We dissolve cut to her on the bed. She asks who is the man says his name is Vincent.
He reveals that they treated her injuries and that she has broken ribs and must remain still. She tells him her name and tells it to rest and that he will be close by. Don't be afraid. He says Vincent leaves the room and enters a library.
An older man known as Jacob or simply as father. Yeah, this library sets this library sets fantastic. Look at it. I think all the sets of the underground world are really well realized.
Yeah, the production design is nice. But where did they get these books from? They just find them. Find them.
Yeah, just laying around. Steel on you mean? No, no, no, it's still done. You find out in later episodes that they have helpers who give them things from the world above.
Right, right. So they have lights on the ground, right? Yeah. Who's paying for this electricity?
They're feeding off the city. Oh, they're leeching from the city. They are leeching from the city, technically. OK, what's going on?
Yeah. OK, OK, because those books are very flammable for a tunnel. Yes, I think that comes into play at some point in a future episode. Yes, it does.
Oh, OK. He almost writes himself, Colin, doesn't it? It does, yeah. Yeah.
So further asks if she is awake. But he's annoyed that Vincent has brought somebody down there. You've broken our most important rule. Always look before throwing an effluent down a spiral staircase.
But no, that's not the main rule. It should be one of the main rules. It's my main rule. Do you have a spiral staircase?
No, so I'm never throwing effluent down it. But escalators and normal stercases. Oh, doesn't matter. You might not have to walk behind you.
Well, it's front to make some throw in it. Not throwing it behind me, but I'm throwing it down the staircase. Yeah, if you're throwing it down the staircase, it'd be worse to be behind you. No, collect it first.
Then I'm going to start. OK. There's no there's no within any of this really, is there? I just don't think you're thinking it through correctly.
Probably best just not to be there. I think. Yeah, that would be the answer. Yes, I'll go with that one.
Yes, Rod de Tries was one of those fantastic British actors who always brought a class to everything that he was in. What else was he in? And do you know the only reason I asked that is because I don't I can't remember who he is or what he's been in. Well, he was in something that we covered a long, long time ago.
He was in space in 1999. Oh, he's the annoying, like political diplomat person official. Yeah, right. Oh, yeah, it's coming back now.
He's been in multiple TV shows and movies and his daughter is actually famous for being Frank Spencer's wife, Michelle de Tries. Oh, but he was. I do think that his performance in this is one of the three things that holds the whole thing together. You've got Linda Hamilton, Ron Perlman, and you've got Roger Tries.
They are the three constants that keep the whole thing together, I think. She'll be actors, isn't it? Well, there are you know, Adrian Paul from Highlander was in an episode of You and Beast. Oh, dear.
Vincent says there was no other way. Jacob goes on to remind them that what would happen if anybody above ground got hold of him. They'd kill him or worse, put him behind bars and you wish you were dead. Sounds like a Friday shift in a 1990s, Wig and Night Club behind those bars would make me wish I was dead.
Yeah, damn right. Yeah. I often wish I was dead being on the opposite of the bar to be honest with you. Did you?
I'm here. God knows why I'm here, but I'm here. That's what I used to think. Vincent says he couldn't leave her there.
Jacob hands over some pills, but he's still not happy. And he says, as soon as Catherine regains her strength, she must leave. But Jacob says to Vincent, you have the soul of a doctor in my day, medical school wouldn't even admit minorities. I wonder what they would have done with you.
At this point out, at this point, we haven't seen Vincent's face just his long, luscious locks. Yes. I'll say something about those locks in a moment, but it's a good build up, isn't it? Yes, they hide the character well.
You don't know what it's going to look like. I do remember it. I do remember at the time, though, when this was first aired on ITV in the UK, they cut to an advert. Do you remember in those days when they used to have cards on the screen to advertise whatever they were cutting to cut into?
They cut to the first advert before the big reveal and it cut to a big picture of Vincent's face. Yeah. I mean, I was going to say that this was before the Internet. So you could keep this thing secret.
Yeah. Clearly not, apparently. No, if you were watching ITV, or Grenada at the time, it was, yeah. Right.
Yeah. We cut to Vincent feeding Catherine soup. She asks where they are. She can hear an elevated train on one to six different queens, but Vincent says, no, not Queen's, nor Brooklyn.
She wants to know where the Ab of Vincent says he has to keep it a secret because a lot of good people depend on it. And she says, I'll keep your secret. And it's revealed that the constant tapping sound she can hear is people sending messages to each other. And as Catherine and Vincent are talking, the camera pounds across the ephemera and objects that the place appears to be filled with stolen.
Yes. Yes. It is a gorgeous design. Yeah.
And the shop. Don't know why did he need all this stuff, though? Well, you could say that Vincent's collecting stuff from the world above because he's never going to be a part of it. He wants to feel a part of it.
Well, he needs to get some organizational skills. Oh, I was playing with your OCD this, wasn't it? Yes, it's all over. It is.
Yeah. I mean, we've got old radios, books, the scattered model of the Statue of Liberty. It's a bit of a mess. You know what?
He needs to really marry Kondo of this place. Trust me, Paldi and people are getting. Vincent tells that they are below the city, that there's whole chambers and tunnels that most people don't now exist because they don't. I've forgotten place, but it's warm and safe and we have all the room we need.
It's our city. She asks him why he is down there because, remember, she's eyes are bandaged. So she's not seeing one at this point. And neither of us as a audience.
He reveals that he was abandoned as a baby left to die. A man found him and raised him and named him Vincent because he was found near sent Vincent's hospital. So now we cut to Catherine's fervor and and Tom and they're angry with the police because somebody has leaked Catherine's disappearance to the newspapers and the police have no leads, so they've been looking for apparently back underground. Catherine gets out of bed, but her eyes are still bandaged and she bangs around the room, but she senses Vincent.
You can come in. I'll read to you. We can finish great expectations. Oh, wonderful.
She says she doesn't. Why is it when you do Vincent's lines? It suddenly seems really sinister. Oh, is it?
Oh, hold on. Let's wait. Our e to you. That's worse.
I don't like that. Yeah. Yeah. This is it.
We can finish great expectations. Well, that would have been a choice if Ron Fomen has done it that way. Yeah, I don't know. I don't think it would have made three seasons, but, you know, it would have been interesting.
Our e to you. Our e to you. We could finish Mr. Messy.
My favourite, Mr. Men, because look at the shit that's surrounded by. I suppose this is as good a point as any to bring it up. What do you think about the makeup, Vincent's makeup?
Actually, no, this isn't the great place to bring it up. We'll see. We'll see in a minute. No, so it's in fact, it's the worst place to bring it up.
We'll do it in a minute. All right. All right. She says she's frightened and Vincent knows this.
He offers to get some tea. So so fair, he's like, oh, we'll finish his book and I'll get you some tea. Never mind that you're bandaged. You can't see.
He's very British, actually, really. Yeah, when you think about it. Yeah. Don't worry.
Countdown. Get you some tea. Now, during all these scenes between Vincent and Catherine, there's this soundtrack that is so twee and desperately screaming at you. Ah, this is romantic.
It's not a creepy guy keeping a warm, blinded in on the ground. It's romantic. And it's constant. It didn't really affect me in that way.
Oh, it never stops. In fact, at some point, all I can hear is the music and I'm like, what is just what is the orchestra please stop playing? Do you think it felt twee back in 1985? That's a genuine question.
That's not me being difficult. If you think about TV, you know, I can't really say. At the time. I mean, TV at the time in 1995, probably sign posted everything, didn't it?
I mean, we've covered enough of it at this point. Yeah, there was more use of music to create emotion than there is now. So do you think it was just them being doing more standard? Yeah, it could be.
Yeah. In which case, don't you think we need to cut it a little bit more slack for that? No, because it's fucking annoying. All right.
I tried. I tried everyone. Didn't work. You did.
You did. I could see where you go. I don't know what I accepted it. It's annoying.
We got to Vincent giving directions to a kid so he can go to Chinatown to get some of the tea that he mentioned. Not sure why he has to go to Chinatown. The local store probably sells equally. It's good tea.
I mean, I'll show where it's so specific, but all right. But we do find out in subsequent episodes that they have help with each other. Right. Just saying.
Yeah, yeah. I can't do this episode as other pockets mentioned. I agree. What are the pockets?
Oh, you're the other pockets. You've been like, oh, but I haven't seen those episodes. So we can't talk about that. But for some reason, for this one, it's perfectly acceptable.
I've had done that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
When it's been shows that I've known more about over episodes. Oh, so you've got to set about what was on the other foot now. Is that what we're saying? No, I'm saying that it's acceptable to talk about over episodes when it's you that knows about and not when it's me that knows about them.
I've never contributed. No, I can't strict it, but pointed out that there's all the stuff. Well, that's what we're here for, isn't it? Now you're just doing the same thing.
I'm playing you playing me. I think I've got the scripts mixed up. I think we might. Oh, well done.
Yeah. Work ethic. All right. I'm on.
I'm on now. I've got the right ones. OK. All right.
Meanwhile, Catherine has taken a bandages off and sees multiple scars across the face in the reflection of the bottom of a broken reflective ball. Then a hideous piece appears behind her. I know it's just Paul. You're in this.
That's a cheap. That's a cheap one. Horrible, right? Yeah.
That was me. But I must have thought it was not a lot of stuff I've written at this point. I need to throw something in that. Not many gags.