920: Understanding Food Forest Design with Joshua Thayer.

Today we’re joined by returning guest Joshua Thayer, permaculture designer, author, and founder of Native Sun Gardens in California. Joshua has helped communities across the U.S. and abroad design food forests that restore ecology and produce abundance. His new book, California Food Forests: Feeding the Future, distills decades of hands-on design into practical steps anyone can use—no matter where they live.Whether you're in a Mediterranean climate, drought-prone region, or temperate landscape, Joshua brings strategies to help you turn your yard, homestead, or urban lot into a resilient, stacked, biodiverse food forest.• What is Permaculture?Joshua breaks down permaculture as “applied ecology”—designing edible and ecological systems that match the local site, climate, and natural patterns. In this episode we learn why permaculture is adaptive, not formulaic.• What Exactly Is a Food Forest?A food forest is more than an orchard. Joshua explains how layers—from canopy to shrubs to vines to roots to mycelium—work together to create resilience, fertility, pollinator habitat, and year-round harvests.• Stacking Functions & Vertical LayeringJoshua details:How to place tall trees on the north side in the Northern HemisphereHow vertical stacking lets you grow way more in small spacesWhy “meadow-style” mid-height diversity beats densely planting tall trees• The 7 Layers of a Food ForestWe explore the classic permaculture layers:Canopy treesSub-canopy treesShrubs & bramblesHerbaceous plantsGroundcoversRoot cropsVines & climbers(+ the mycelium layer!)Joshua shares examples of plant combinations that thrive together and create symbiotic relationships.• Mediterranean & Drought-Wise DesignLearn why California’s Mediterranean climate is a perfect teacher for:Water-wise food productionSoils that need oxygen and drainageSelecting resilient varietiesPlanting drought-tolerant guildsJoshua also explains how these principles translated to a project in Virginia with soggy soil.• How to Start a Food Forest in 100 Square FeetJoshua’s favorite entry point:Start with a 10×10 ft “tile”One main tree (like apple, plum, avocado)Two supporting plants (berries + herbs)Add soil-building ground covers and root cropsMake it simple, modular, repeatable.• Top Mistakes New Growers MakeJoshua shares the big ones:Not starting because the project feels too bigPlanting too denselyCreating too much shade too earlyIgnoring soil healthDesigning tall trees before establishing the mid-layerHe explains how “thinking like a meadow” helps avoid over-shading and keeps the system diverse and manageable.Get Joshua’s New Book:California Food Forests: Feeding the Future — packed with design tips, plant guilds, AutoCAD templates, and practical maps to build your first 100-sq-ft food-forest module.Connect With Joshua:• Native Sun Gardens – Food forest design, consulting, and permaculture education -  NativeSunGardens.comVisit UrbanFarm.org/CaliforniaFoodForest for the show notes and links on this episode! Need a little bit of advice or just a feedback on your design for your yard or garden?The Urban Farm Team is offering consults over the phone or zoom. Get the benefits of a personalized garden and yard space analysis without the cost of trip charges. You can chat with Greg, Janis or Ray to get permaculture based feedback.Click HERE to learn more!Become an Urban Farm Patron and listen to more than 900 episodes of the Urban Farm Podcast without ads. Click HERE to learn more.*Disclosure: Some of the links in our podcast show notes and blog posts are affiliate links and if you go through them to make a purchase, we will earn a nominal commission at no cost to you. We offer links to items recommended by our podcast guests and guest writers as a service to our audience and these items are not selected because of the commission we receive from your purchases. We know the decision is yours, and whether you decide to buy something is completely up to you.