A Conversation With Prime Minister Justin Trudeau of Canada + An OpenAI Whistle-Blower Speaks Out

This week, we host a cultural exchange. Kevin and Casey show off their Canadian paraphernalia to Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, and he shows off what he’s doing to position Canada as a leader in A.I. Then, the OpenAI whistle-blower Daniel Kokotajlo speaks in one of his first public interviews about why he risked almost $2 million in equity to warn of what he calls the reckless culture inside that company. Guests:Justin Trudeau, Prime Minister of CanadaDaniel Kokotajlo, a former researcher in OpenAI’s governance division Additional Reading:Securing Canada’s A.I. AdvantageOpenAI Insiders Warn of a ‘Reckless’ Race for DominanceWhat Aren’t The OpenAI Whistle-Blowers Saying?The Opaque Investment Empire Making OpenAI’s Sam Altman Rich We want to hear from you. Email us at [email protected]. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.