Are we entering a new illiberal order?

The way authoritarian and illiberal states interact has changed. China, Russia, Iran and North Korea have gone from defending themselves against perceived liberal pressure to actively building the institutions of an alternative order. In this episode of Lowy Institute Conversations, Nick Bisley, the author of a new Lowy Institute paper analysing this cooperation, speaks with the Institute's Sam Roggeveen about the boot camps teaching authoritarian states how to control information, the improbable rise of BRICS, and why this messy, opportunistic coalition might be harder to counter than a formal alliance ever was.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.