Being Seen Is Power: Art, Community and the best kind of chaos

In this episode of the DKUK Podcast, Daniel sits down with Richard Phoenix, artist, writer and long-time collaborator with Heart and Soul, the Deptford-based organisation supporting learning disabled and autistic artists for over 40 years.Recorded inside the Heart and Soul exhibition at DKUK in Peckham, this conversation moves from DIY punk tours and publishing with Rough Trade Books to large-scale public art in Trafalgar Square. Richard talks about the young people’s project Do Your Own Thing, the radical importance of access, and what it means to create real visibility for artists who are too often overlooked.At the centre of the conversation is a simple idea that feels urgent: being seen is power. Not spectacle. Not tokenism. But being seen as you want to be seen.We explore how framing changes perception, how naming something art shifts its meaning, and how long-term cultural work can transform a space. From site visits and collaborative installs at DKUK to the creation of a six-metre puppet processing down Whitehall, this is a conversation about good chaos, deep relationships, and the craft of building creative communities that last.The DKUK Podcast is recorded live during real haircuts inside our mirrorless salon in Peckham, London, where art replaces mirrors and conversation unfolds naturally. Expect thoughtful dialogue, moments of humour, and the quiet rhythm of scissors in the background.Best enjoyed with headphones.