Beyond Attrition: Integrating Drone and Unmanned Systems into the Future of U.S. Warfare

After more than four years of conflict, the war in Ukraine has produced an unprecedented body of data on rapid innovation, emerging technology, and the evolving role of drone warfare and unmanned systems on the modern battlefield. The pressing question for U.S. defense planners is which of those lessons can be translated to the U.S. way of war, and which, if applied too directly, risk misdirecting future force development.In this episode, host Dr. Arun Seraphin is joined by Anna Kim, Associate Research Fellow at the Emerging Technologies Institute (ETI), and Matt Dooley, President and CEO of Fidelium and Chair of the NDIA Robotics Division, to discuss their ETI white paper, "Beyond Attrition: Interpreting the Limits of Lessons from Ukraine for Future US Force Development." The paper examines what full integration of drone technologies, autonomous systems, and emerging military technologies into the U.S. Joint Force would actually require.The conversation explores why Ukraine's battlefield innovation and drone-driven "iteration under fire" model cannot be copied wholesale into the U.S. statutory and industrial environment, the enduring importance of combined arms warfare, and why the future force depends on integrating attritable unmanned systems with legacy maneuver platforms rather than choosing between them. Kim and Dooley also discuss the Army's Transformation in Contact (TiC) and Human Machine Integrated Formation (HMIF) initiatives, Project Convergence, and the Pentagon's Drone Dominance program, along with the production, sustainment, and training challenges of fielding robotic, autonomous, and emerging technology-enabled warfare capabilities at the scale a future fight will demand.Read ETI’s White Paper "Beyond Attrition: Interpreting the Limits of Lessons from Ukraine for Future US Force Development": https://www.emergingtechnologiesinstitute.org/publications/brief-series/beyond-attritionLearn more about NDIA's Robotics Division: https://www.ndia.org/divisions/roboticsFor updates on our content, sign up for our weekly mailer: https://www.emergingtechnologiesinstitute.org/sign-upSAVE THE DATE:2026 NDIA Future Force Capabilities Conference & Exhibition, June 8–10, 2026, at Caesars Forum in Las Vegas, NV — where Anna and Matt will continue the conversation: https://ndiaffc.org2026 NDIA Emerging Technologies for Defense Conference and ExhibitionSeptember 9-10, 2026, at the Walter E. Washington DC Convention Center: ndiatechexpo.orgBe sure to follow us on social media for updates, early access to upcoming events, inside scoops, & more:LinkedIn: https://bit.ly/4htROo0Twitter: https://bit.ly/48LHAx3Facebook: https://bit.ly/47vlht8And for more podcasts, articles, & publications on emerging technology, check out our website at: ndiaeti.org