**Bonus: Madison Raisch**

Many times when we have folks on the show there is an immediate and fun conversation that happens before we even do the introductions. Well, this was one time where we caught our guest in all their marvelous candor, and join in. Well, Kirk joined in with the "back in my day" conversation about moving up the ranks in regards to stewardship of design roles. Kirk and Madison sit in their rocking chairs sipping tea and complaining while Andy cautiously interjects and adds a much fresher and inspired insight. This clip ends with the introduction of Madison's podcast, and if you haven't heard it, you can listen to the full podcast here. Send us Fan MailSupport the showAbout Kirk and Andy.Kirk Visola is the Creative Director and Founder of MIND THE FONT™. He brings over 20 years of CPG experience to the packaging and branding design space, and understands how shelf aesthetics can make an impact for established and emerging brands. Check out their work http://www.mindthefont.com.Andy Kurts is the Creative Director and Founder of Buttermilk Creative. He loves a good coffee in the morning and a good bourbon at night. When he’s not working on packaging design he’s running in the backyard with his family. Check out Buttermilk's work http://www.buttermilkcreative.com.Music for Kirk & Kurtts intro & outro: Better by Super FantasticsShow a little love. Share the podcast with those who may benefit. Or, send us a coffee:Support the show