Brie Larson

Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dax Randall Shepherd and I'm joined by Monica Lilly Padman. Hi there. How are you doing?

I'm doing good. It's still my birthday. It's well, now it's getting really confusing. It's my birthday week.

It's my birthday today and it was my birthday month. Six days ago. Yeah, but it's still your birthday. Now listen, Rilarsen, we love her.

Oh wow, this was really fun. Oh my gosh. I just loved her as a, for lack of a better word, a May Whitman type. Over the years, like Spunky Creative, Artistic, Fun.

She would pop up in all these great movies. And then I saw her in Room, which of course, she won the Academy Award for. She's incredible. And of course, she's Captain Marvel.

She's the first to have her own Marvel movie as a female and made a billion dollars. Wow. Yeah, that's incredible. Yeah, it's very impressive.

And also, as you learn, she's become a Jim rat, which is really fun. She has a new podcast out called Learning Lots with Rilarsen and Jesse Ennis. Also, little BTS, our friend Rob. Oh, we found out Rob is double crossing us in this episode, which is pretty fun.

Wobby Wobbs got his hands in a lot of honey pots. Yeah, he's dipping his beak in a lot of different little pots. And you know what? Good for Wobby Wobbs.

We do find out real time we work chumps, but that is OK. That is OK. Come to find out. Wobby Wobbs Newbury and produces her podcast.

And Rob's son Calvin is on an episode of Bree's podcast. And it's the cutest thing you could possibly imagine. So also check that out. Yes, the podcast called Learning Lots with Bree Larson and Jesse Ennis.

Please enjoy Bree Larson. He's in our church. Hi. Hi.

Hi. Bye. Bye. He was such a good combo.

You're in England? I'm in England. Yeah. I follow you on Instagram.

And I'm watching you work out. And it feels very much like a California garage. And I had it wrong. Yeah, the beauty of Instagram.

So you're in England working out in a garage. You're in a garage, right? Can we agree upon that? Not currently.

I'm not currently in a garage. The video you saw was old. I hate to ruin that for you. But yeah, that's an old video.

I'm much stronger. I'm much better than that video. You can't even imagine I was wrong now. I can't really show what I'm doing right now.

Yeah, you can't say what you're doing either, can you? Or can you? No, I can't. But I think in my omission, you know what it is.

You're on American Idol. Yeah, exactly. I'm not here. I couldn't fit in any longer.

You like London? I do. We're going in September. Kristin's shooting there for a couple months.

So we'll be there in September. So yes, we'll come to dinner at your place. Please. Oh, please come over.

Let's do this. I've got a cold plunge. We just did a cold plunge for the first time. Oh, hated it, loved it.

All of it. That's exactly how it works. I mean, you did it right. How long did you do it for?

One minute first and then two minutes. But we have people do 20 minutes in our group. That's ridiculous. I don't think that does anything.

That's just a flex. It was a major flex, but I was impressed. I just shout out to Cameron. He just sat there like he was dead.

And then he got out 20 minutes later. And it didn't make any sense to me. I do three and a half minutes. And my everywhere I have arthritis is just fucking killing.

Like my wrist hurt inside there. But you get that elated feeling afterwards. It's been the best thing for my moods. And it's like a crazy thing to talk about because I mean, it's not really super practical.

Having bags of ice and a bathtub or an ice or whatever it is you're doing, having a hotel. Like there's no version of it that feels like scalable in anyway. But when I'm doing it consistently, because I have a mind that tends to go a little to the depression, it like wants to go to a hopeless place. It likes it there.

So the cold plunge just like shocks my system. And then the rest of the day, I'm like, at least I'm not in the cold plunge. Yeah. That's my bright side.

One of my favorite quotes from Frank Sinatra. And it's almost made me drink over the last 16 years, which is he said, I feel bad for people who don't drink. Because when they wake up in the morning, that's the best they're going to feel all day. And that's largely true if you're sober.

Like that you wake up, that's about as good as it's going to feel physically. But you're inducing that with the cold plunge. So it's like the cold plunge makes you fucking miserable. And the rest of the day is just going to get better.

Oh, yeah. It's only going up from there. Let me tell you. Because I'll go from ice to sauna.

And I love the heat. So that for me is like, oh, it's really getting good. I've already accomplished something. I did something I didn't want to do, which is getting ice.

And one of my favorite parts of the day is this second or half second when I'm like, thrusting my body into ice when I know what I'm doing. But I haven't yet experienced the cold yet. And that anticipation feeling is so exciting. I really love it.

And then I love getting out of the ice stuff. That's another really great feeling. And how long do you do it? Three minutes?

It depends. I try to get to three minutes. It depends on how consistently I'm doing it. If I'm doing it every day, I can do three minutes, no problem.

But the second I get out of the cycle of it, then I got to start working my way back up again. Has your skin always been this impeccable? I wonder if you're cycling through the hot and cold. Because your skin looks insane.

And I'm not one that even notices skin. I know very. It's so funny. I'm doing this podcast with my best friend, Jessie.

And it's over Zoom. And every time she does the same thing, she's like, what is going on? No, maybe it is the ice in the heat. I have no idea.

I'm not doing anything crazy. I'm still a stress patient. Ooh, fresh London air, yeah. You don't have all this smog here?

Of course. That London fog. That'll really moisturize that London fog. But also, you could have a real good lens on your computer.

That's like softening. Am I iPad? Yeah, on your iPad. Very special iPad lens.

I love that I'm on my iPad because I couldn't figure out how to turn my computer on. You could have a lens on my iPad. An auxiliary lens. I don't know how to do that.

Wait, before we get super into anything, we have to shout out our mutual friend Troy. Oh, do you work with Troy? Yes. How about Detroit?

I do. I put him in the category of these agents that are suspiciously handsome. Like, Patrick, why? So it was one of these guys.

Like, he was more attractive than all of his clients, which included Ben and Matt. Troy is like, I don't know, 6, 3x lacrosse player, a row or some kind of athlete. Just brimming with confidence. Yeah, he's definitely an athlete.

Yeah, he's an nice nice guy. Everything's easy. Great at confrontation. Love someone who's good at confrontation.

Inspired. Well, what's your definition of good at confrontation? Because I love confrontation, but I don't know that you would label it good. Do you wait too long to access that?

What your confrontation is? You build up in this world. Oh, wow. Ding, ding, ding.

Really nice. And I'll add into it. What happens is I have this whole story about myself that I'm really easy going in nice. And so I don't say anything to anybody.

And then as I'm about to blow up, I'm resentful at them that they forced me to have to do this thing I don't want to do. God, it's so relatable. Yes, I've done the same exact thing. The last, like, I don't know, year and a half or two years, I feel like the universe has confronted me with the need to be able to confront.

And just confront sooner. I don't like that. Because I'll find it especially with smaller things. I'll just feel like it's not worth it.

And now I'm like, no, you know, it's not worth it, being uncomfortable, and then having resentment, and then being weird to somebody forever. Like, that's not it. Might not just get it over with. And just like, not my preference.

Yeah. The thing I have a hard time navigating is, there's this principle in AA. Well, there's two. One is we can't afford to have resentments because we'll use over it.

So that's like not an option for me to be carrying resentment. So I do have to clear stuff up constantly. But then there's this other principle, which is like acceptance is the answer to all my problems. So it's like, the quicker I can accept, this is life on life's terms.

And I stop fighting against it, I'll probably find peace. So some people's behavior, I'm trying to go like, is this a moment where I just need to accept? Like, hey, this is how this person is. I don't love this aspect.

But I can accept it and have that expectation. And then I won't be upset about it. But is that leading to a resentment? I find that a little bit hard to navigate, which is which always.

Oh, well, I think it's just whatever's true. That's what I've gotten to with it. Is like not forcing myself to accept something when I'm not ready to. There's the intellectual part of me that's like, yeah, of course, love everybody.

I get it. But then like, do I really feel that? Because I'll find myself skipping ahead of being like, well, I know I'm wrong. I know I shouldn't have this resentment or I know I shouldn't feel this way.

So I'm just gonna act like I don't. But it doesn't really work. That's just another way of us tricking ourselves into knocking around. It's just like we're like, I'm a nice person.

So I'm just gonna be okay with them. It's weird, because two things are true. People are really good at lying themselves. Like they're very unaware of the lies they tell themselves.

And also the bodies keep you in score. So it's like you may be able to in your mind, the voice in your head quiet it. But that's not to say that your heart rate isn't different or your anxiety level hasn't gone up and cortisol's not flushing through your body. Oh, of course.

Yeah. And sometimes there's like the cortisol, all those things then make it even harder to access what's true, what's living in us. Yeah. It's available.

And we make stories up. Like in broad terms, like one of the last times I had to confront somebody, I put it off for like a year or maybe two. And it's because I had all these stories, oh, they're going through this and they're going through that and like I should be more caring at you and this. And then I had this moment where I was like, if we got rid of the stories, then you just confront something and you don't have all of the charge around it.

Cause the story isn't there. So you can just say like, hey, this felt kind of shitty or my feelings were hurt or I might be wrong, but this is what I got from our last phone call and it made me feel this way. Instead of then like, and it's like all this stuff comes up that has nothing to do with just the simplicity of this is what I felt. And then being open to how they handle it, which sometimes isn't good.

I'd say I'm out of 50 50 track record at this point. 50 50, it goes well or does. That's great. I think 50 50 is totally something to be proud of.

Here's my question. Do you find that there's a consistent incentive for you to avoid conflict? Is your fear consistent? Like, oh no, this person will now not think I'm nice or they won't think I'm blank.

People pleasing. Like people pleasing motivated. Always people pleasing motivated. People pleasing mixed with I must be wrong.

I don't look like a fool for saying something when I'm obviously wrong. Oh. It's just my opinion that can't be right. Okay, so a story I have is I'm really suspicious of people who want homeschooled their kids.

I start by not understanding why they wouldn't want their kids with all the other kids, right? And then I get into like psychoanalyzing why I think they are too afraid of the public school system. And then I'm feeling in all these details. And then there's someone like you who's like really productive and smart and it seems like self-motivated to learn and homeschooled.

So I'm wondering like, what do you think of the stereotypes of homeschooling? Are they true? Are they not true? What was your experience doing that?

It's really hard for me to write my head around. Well, mine might be different than what you're talking about because I asked to be homeschooled. I did public school for some of elementary school. And then I did one year of junior high.

So I got like a little taste of the like, I have multiple teachers. I walk around. Ooh, the bell rings. Yes, it's real man sick honey.

I don't think I really fit in at my junior high. It was fine. I just felt like it was what I was supposed to do. And then high school I lasted a day and a half.

And then I called my mom and asked her to pick me up. And then I explained, it just wasn't for me. I was like, I really love learning. It's not that.

I like learning in the order that I want to learn it in. And she totally got it. So I ended up finishing and graduating much earlier than my classmates because I just kind of zoomed through it. But I really loved it and it worked for me.

But my sister was the exact opposite. She did all of school, then went to college, is now a teacher. So like she went to the same schools that I did and just had like a totally different relationship and experience to it. So my mom was really cool.

And she just let us kind of teach ourselves in a way. Like whatever we said we wanted to do, whatever we were interested in, she just supported us and loved us. That takes so much confidence. Because I think if I were the parent of you, I would be like, okay, I'm going to let her do this thing she wants, but then she won't be prepared for the real world.

Like she'll have to go out and she's going to go to a job and then she'll get to the job and go, I don't like this either. That would be my fear of like, I'm not raising a kid that's equipped to enter the real world. I love your mom's confidence because here you are thriving in the real world by all measures. So I would have been completely wrong to have been so fearful that you're not learning these things you need to like work with others.

Yeah, you know, I think even my mom and I, we talk about it, we look back on it and we're like, that was pretty wild that we did that. I mean, there's so many steps in my childhood that's like, wow, I can't believe we did that. I can't believe that I told my mom when I was something like five or six or something like that, that I knew what my Dharma was and I wanted to be an actor and my mom listened to it. And then at seven or eight, we packed up the car and went to LA for pilot season with like $3,000 in my mom's bank account that we got from doing a pamphlet for like the Shell gas stations.

It was like a how to do CPR pamphlet. We both modeled in it. Yes, we got about $3,000. It was a big gig.

It was very exciting. You know, pull up at a Shell gas station I'd be like, am I here? Am I in the pamphlet? It allowed us to go to pilot season and go out for a couple of months.

And I mean, just thinking where I am now and that it was the whim of a child that I was like, this is what I want to do. Am I more followed it? I want to be homeschooled. She followed it.

I mean, it's not normal, but that trust is how I've been able to be where I am. I feel like I got like a head start on getting to be myself. Yeah, being responsible, making decisions. I imagine too, if you make that decision comes with this great responsibility, which is like my mom's trusting me to do this and by God, I better actually do it.

Like she was very, very cool in letting me try it this way. I better deliver. I better actually learn everything and try. Oh no, we're having so many internet problems.

We are, this is making me mad. Monica's getting really sad and nervous. I'm sad too. I'm nervous.

Because I want to connect. I know, because we like her a lot. I know, I want to connect too. Do you think it's on my end?

Probably because we're on my house wifi, which is solid. Hold on, let me, I'll try and move somewhere. I haven't had a problem in this spot before, but. Be a little bit us.

It could be us, you're saying? Oh, and he's connected through the internet. Rob's really clever about the internet. We're going to do this great.

Well, this is going to go, we're going to get like a privilege. Well, she's got real shit Rob, of course, she has her own podcast. She's got the real mic. She's got the real little box.

Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my God. You produce her podcast?

Oh my God. I didn't know this. This is so much right now. Rob is such a traitor.

This is embarrassing. We've been caught with our slacks down that you guys have this independent relationship of us and no one's saying a word. I feel like a fucking. Rob's like, do you want Brie Larson?

Like they're not best friends. Right. Oh my God. We don't want text or anything.

You don't. You should. He's a good texture. And if you ever want to know something to eat anywhere on the planet, text Rob.

He knows the best place everywhere. That's his life. Is this better? This is a trillion times better Brie.

Okay, good. Yes. This house I'm seeing is like multiple floors. So I think I was just too high.

Okay. I'm going to update my assessment of your skin. It's even better with why. Really?

It's really glowing. Really? It got even better. It got even better.

Wow. This is exciting. I can't wait for your listeners to hear about how great my skin is. Oh, I came.

You didn't know. I was just for that. Oh, wow. Well, that brings up an interesting thing that we well I wouldn't say I guess I'm the only one wrestling with it is like Kate Beckinsale was here.

Monica and I both like completely awestruck by her beauty. And of course I don't want to bring that up. But at the same time I'm like that's a weird dynamic now that I can't acknowledge that. But that's fine.

I'm just thinking out loud. What do you think about that? I just want to understand. You can't tell someone that they're beautiful now?

Well, I think it's dicey. Like of course I would. Like you can't open the interview with like, oh my God, you're so beautiful. I mean, he could and he does.

I wish he would for mine. Oh, okay. Great. So I think that's the answer because like polar.

Are you friends with polar? I saw she was on your podcast. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Like I told her how hot she looked on this commercial the other day and she was like God bless you. I want to hear that. But now just everything you say can be positive about my looks.

So I guess it's just person to person. You know what it is? Here's what it all is. There's nothing you could say to me that would make me happier than your hot.

I want to be the things I'm not. You know what I'm saying? So if you would maybe broke onto the scene and like a Charlie's Angels type thing and I was like, you're so beautiful. You'd be like, get over it.

I'm a great actor. But you're already a fucking great actor. We know that you started it with you're a great actor. So now hearing just icing on the cake.

Yeah. It's gonna be hot. Yeah. Yeah.

Please. Let me be hot. Is that too much to ask to be hot? I'm hot.

I want a good actor. I want more. I want all the things mostly that I don't have. And then I'm not entitled.

Well, we all want the things we don't have. Yeah. Exactly. I deeply want to just be somebody else.

But here I am. So this is what the audience needs to hear that you want to be somebody else. They want to be you. 100%.

No, but this is something that I've been very interested in this because the big joke is that everybody wants to be somebody else, right? If everybody wants to be somebody else, then we're all chasing something and then there's no real thing. There's nothing. And that trips me out so much and until you can sort of really get that for yourself and understand that it is very, very probable that the person that you admire the most and want to be the most like really has a hard time with themselves.

It's so freeing. Can I tell you that's one of the best parts about doing the show is like the people that sit down like well, there's no way that this person doesn't know they're a 10. You're like, no, this person hates their fucking nose and their chin. It's crazy.

We're all fucking nuts. I don't know who looks in the mirror and they go like, there he is. I don't know anybody like that. I'm sure there are people like that.

But I also think we also have created like we praise being humble about your looks and so we don't know what's going on. And I'm like, I love it. I love it when my friends are like, don't I look good? What's the best?

I love it when my friends are like, give me a compliment. I think I look amazing today. It's so attractive to me. And yet I think we also create a culture where we're supposed to be like, oh, I don't know.

Like probably not. But what do you think? And I do it. I do it all the time.

I want to be at the top of your lowest expectations. I'm super seat those. But yeah, that seems harder than just like being like, I'm good at something. Whatever that is.

I look good. I am good. Whatever those things are. Like if you're hard for you to hear, you'd be like, you're a great actor.

I'm like, I need a joke out of it. I couldn't even accept that. I can't take it. I'm with you.

Well, ironically, all I want is praise and approval. And then when I receive it, I fucking can't stand it. It's so weird. Are you friends with me, women?

I know me. I'm from like when we were little kids acting. Like we went up against each other same jobs when we were like eight. Yeah.

Yeah. I assumed that when I was reading about you and then I thought, first of all, I would hate to be up against me. But one interesting thing. Oh, yeah.

I never got a job. Let's make this very clear. Let the record show may always got every job. This weird thing happened to all of us on the cast of parenthood, which was quickly, was revealed that she was by far the biggest powerhouse on the cast.

But from my point of view, I was, I guess, 37 or something. And she was 21. And I was like, why is this kid so fucking great? And then I come to find out, oh, she's been doing it.

And I said, she was three. So she's really been doing it like 10 years longer than I had at that point. I'm like, okay, that makes sense. And I have to imagine that same thing happened to people with you.

They're like, wait, why is this interesting? Does she know what she's doing? Yeah. She should not know.

I wouldn't say that it's usually a positive thing. Like it's strangely a learning curve sometimes on certain jobs. Like people are disarmed by the fact that I know so much about what's happening on set. Yeah.

And I'm like, oh, I guess I've been an actor for 20 years or longer now. How old am I? She was the youngest person ever admitted to the American Conservatory Theatre in San Francisco. Oh, I thought your saying that Monica was.

I was so impressed. No. Isn't that great? Yeah.

If you heard that about her, you'd be like, what? You'd be so blown away. I know. And then you said it about me.

And I was like, oh, okay. That was an accident. Something happened. There's a clerical error.

Well, I don't know if I still am the youngest, by the way. I'm convinced there must be some, like, really prolific four-year-old that got in. I have a six-year-old in the notion that she'd tell me she'd want to go do something and that I would take that series. Like, I got to really do it.

I got to take her series because what would happen? Because if Delta told me to marry her, she wants to go to Harvard right now. If she wanted to become the youngest member of anything, Chuck E. Cheese fucking big coin club.

I don't know anything. I would just be like, wow, you're going to try to be the youngest of this thing. Well, remember? So she did say she wanted to skip first grade.

Because she wants to catch her sister. And we all kind of dismissed it. She's in kindergarten. And then she started like reading all these books.

She took her sister's books from second grade and started like cramming at night. Oh my God, she, I think she's going to skip first grade. We all dismissed it. And maybe that makes it better.

Maybe because everyone's like, okay, maybe she's like really going to push herself. She's got an axe to grind. Yeah, I like this kid. Oh, you would love her.

She's so spunky and perfect. We call her Shirley Farley. She's a makes-between Shirley Temple and Chris Farley. What do you call both?

It's the best gumball I've ever seen. I just stare at her and think, boy, life's going to be so easy for you. I can't wait to watch. Okay, back to you guys.

So the thing that I really would get sympathetic for May on is that some of the people in the AD department, even some of the producers, they maybe didn't recognize that she had been doing it longer than them. And so the respect she was given was more appropriate of someone that was playing a 17-year-old. Not even forget the fact that she was actually 21, but she was almost being treated as the age of her character and given the same kind of respect, which it would have been maddening for me if I were May. Like, hey, no, I will pick my fucking hair.

I've been doing this for 20 years. I don't want to hear what this man thinks my hair should be. All that stuff. Like I could say, oh, I want my hair to be this and I was like, yeah, okay, whatever.

You know your character. That would have been maddening for me if I were her. Oh, yeah, of course. I mean, I still deal with it.

I'm not going to talk about it frequently because I worked so hard and I had this idea and I had like, oh, once I reached blah, blah, blah, then I'll finally be respected. And it never changed, really. The truth is it didn't change until I changed. It changed once I was unbothered by it, which seemed so bizarre to me because it was also external and I was like, I'll never get away from this thing, this oppressive feeling.

And then once I sort of diminished the effect that it had on me, it's funny. Like some of it's just absurd and some of it I have a lot of sympathy for because some people like director and producer, despite the fact that they can be older than me and they could have incredible credits, chances are I've had more time on set than them because I haven't had to do the pre-production stuff and I won't have to do the post stuff. So there's a higher probability assuming that I'm working and booking jobs that I have just more on set experience. It doesn't mean I have more pre-production experience, I have more post experience, but when I'm meeting these people in this arena and I'm also in a different place, I'm on my mark, which is at the epicenter of everybody.

I feel everybody's energy. I know what everybody's job is. It's part of my job, I think, to know what everybody's job is. So I see all this stuff and because of my job, I feel like people, they talk to me, like crew members will open up, will say things.

And so I sort of get this interesting view of all these different things that I don't know if producers always get the chance to see or hear. Maybe they have a different relationship because of their role, everything in their role, right? They invite you into their tribe more than they would. Like the camera department is going to invite you into their tribe because it's you two.

You two are going to make this thing work. We're dancing, yeah. Yeah. And the producers not going to ever share that with the camera department.

They're not going to be interdependent in that way where you can become grateful for one another. Because if you do your job, great man, and they're there and they did their thing, there's just this beautiful moment of like how all the things worked at once and it's really just you guys that are deciding that. 100%. Totally.

It's so special. And it's one of the things I actually love about doing these bigger movies is the level of craftsmanship, the specialty things. People crafting alien duttas and the costumes and all of that stuff and building the sets. I mean, it's just I'm in awe of it.

I'm a huge fan of Disney Land, so to me it's like, oh my gosh, I can't believe there's people that have dedicated their life to knowing how to make fake rocks or how to make fur costumes or whatever it is. I mean, there's just insane amount of details that go into these things. I'll get hit with just this profound sense of gratitude around. It's almost like everything slows down and I'm looking around going, I can't believe all of these people and all their own path in their life have brought us all here in this moment to do this strange fight sequence.

Like we're all here. I'm not going to do this for our past. I don't know. Whatever our future is, I don't know, but we're here together right now.

It's so special. It is. And as you climb the ladder of budget, yeah, things change. Like I remember the first few things I did where there were special effects.

There'd be like two people. They'd come with a van, blah, blah, blah. Then I did this movies, a thorough and like Stan Winston did the creatures. So to see like the Stan Winston, am I saying that's him, right?

Stan Winston created everything, the dinosaurs in Jurassic Park and I think E.T. Like the most legendary kind of creature maker, world-class legendary artists over the course of 200 years when they look back on film, he'll be one of the greats like Cecil B. DeMille. Yeah, here I'm watching this person do this.

It's pretty special. It is. And I get to see the people behind it. You know, a lot of people just see what we make, like what they made, but I like see the people and it's so special.

When you do a really small independent movie, like something with a budget of a million or less, a family forms on those type of movies, I think a little more than other ones, just because it's smaller, it's probably accelerated shooting schedule. People are working harder. They're more vulnerable. Like all these things come together to make it a real shared struggle when you do a little movie.

Have you found that as you've gotten into the huge ones, you can still have that experience? Oh, yeah, I make sure of that. It's very important to me that I know everyone's name or as many people's name as possible. The bigger the movies get, the harder it is.

It's hard with the mask for me too, because you don't have the facial recognition. It's just a little bit more difficult, I think, to have that shared connection, because we have to be far away from one another and constantly paying attention to the time or around one other and all that. But it is really important to me that it feels the same. And to me, it's like an independent film can feel like you can make it a movie in itself.

It's like a camping film. It's very intimate and ragtag. I don't even know what ragtag means. Is that offensive?

It's like that feeling of like, oh, we're all in this together and like, oh, what are we going to do? We want this dolly shop. We're going to put on the back of this truck and whatever. Yeah, someone got a wheelchair.

They saw a wheelchair from Vons. We're going to use that as a dolly. All of those things. And there's a fun and almost youthfulness, I think, or at least it's youthful for me because that was what I was doing in my youth.

And then the bigger movies feel more like an epic. They're six months long, huge, bigger than all of us. And there's something awe inspiring about it. And when I meet people that hadn't done it before and are honest that I'm on this, I'm like, listen, we have enough time together that we are going to love each other, hate each other, realize that we have more in common than we realized, and then potentially dislike each other again.

It's enough time for us to change our opinions at least four times. And that's just a different thing. I was much more used to on independent films. It's like, you start working everyone like each other.

You kind of figure out, maybe a couple of people I'm not going to, I'm not going to keep them again. I'm not going to continue on with them. And then it's over. Whereas the first longer film, I was like, oh my gosh, I have to figure out how to make this work.

I am going to have to keep seeing this person. It's not a one night stand. It's not a weekend fling. This is a relationship.

We're in this. And I have to figure out how to love this person. Yeah. And then we're going to have a lot of other, on our worst days.

For sure. Over the next six months, we're both going to have our shittiest days and we're going to be together. That's ahead for us. Yes.

On a somewhat public stage. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

That's the other thing. The actor is so front and center that your energy, whoever you have a problem with, aren't getting along with, or really get along with everybody sees. And I find it to be for the most part a really good feeling to know that I can set the tone. It was much harder for me when I was dependent on other people to set the tone.

I like being in charge of that aspect of it. Not 100% of my life. I want to do that. But when I choose to, I really like stepping into that.

Stay tuned for more armature expert. If you dare. Does it ever feel like there's so much pressure to be, I mean, obviously there is so much pressure as an actor to be good and to perform. But then when you're setting the tone, there's pressure to be, for lack of a better word, nice all the time to make it a happy set and stuff like that.

There's all these stories about this person on set, and not even like the huge stories, like the blow up stories, but like, oh, this person on set was like, not very friendly. And I'm like, well, so like maybe they don't want to be friendly that day. Like they're just a person. But because there's all eyes are on them, everything I think gets magnified.

That's like a lot of pressure. I don't feel that way anymore. And it's obviously that I don't have my periods of time where I fall into people pleasing and something I have to work on because I do fall into that trap. But I've had too many jobs.

There was one in particular where I tried so hard to be nice to never ask for anything, to do everything that everyone asked of me and to do it like first take, like I want the first take to be perfect. It was a real mental problem. I really wanted everybody to say free a plus from every angle. And people didn't like me.

There were people that didn't like me. And I had to come to terms with, yeah, people are just not going to like me. Even when I'm trying to be my best and be my nicest quote unquote. And so if that's just going to happen, if the end result is that some people are going to walk away being like, oh, what a bitch.

Then I might as well just get what I wanted in the first place. Yeah. Yeah. I agree.

You have no control over what they're bringing to it. How they're going to react to you. It's about them too. Yeah.

It's not about you. Like their perception of you is most likely about them. Yeah. There's too many narratives happening for me to get into it.

I'm curious. I like a very similar situation, but I took the role of I could see how incredibly hard this was for my mother to work full time and raise us. And the way I showed her, I loved her was like, I'm not going to be one of your problems. I'm not going to ask you for cool shoes.

I'm not going to ask you for cool jeans. I'm not going to do anything. I'm going to be not a problem for you. That's how I'm going to help.

Did you have any of that? I'm sure I did. I was pretty quiet and shy growing up. And my mom says that I was always like very reasonable.

Like even as like a little kid, I'd be like, can I have that? My mom's like, no, and I go, okay, maybe next time. I think it was like in my nature to just be like, oh, okay. I think to a point where it sometimes erodes my stomach lining that I'm always like, oh, there's another perspective, push myself to the side.

And so I do think in hindsight, this leap, it didn't happen right away. I think I was too young to understand like the sacrifice that my mom had made. I started to feel the stress and the pressure probably once I started to hit my teens, more like 14, 15, when peers I had in school were figuring out college, what they wanted to do, that sort of thing. I was still not really working.

I didn't really have that much going on. And yet I truly believed that I was supposed to be an actor and I didn't know how to not do it. I was telling you no, so it didn't make any sense. Then I started to feel the stress of what's my fallback, what do I do, how do I not become a burden to my family.

That was a very stressful period of time. I'd say like really like a lot of crisis probably from like 15 to gosh, early 20s, because I didn't have like consistent work. I was always on the verge of like my last dollar, at least half a dozen times. I was like at the grocery store and they're like, it's declined.

You have zero dollars, you know. What were you using to regulate at that time? Like how were you dealing with that? The stress?

Yeah. So for 15 to 18, I really just was creative. I'd write songs, I'd film myself, I was upset, I would like film myself crying and then like watch it back. Like I'd make my own self tapes of myself like a weirdo, like in my bedroom being like, what do I look like when I cry?

And I started, I just spent a lot of time alone. I was a super big loner. I didn't really have any friends. Did you have boyfriends?

I had a boyfriend. What did I get a boyfriend? I think I got my first serious boyfriend at maybe 17. Okay.

Was he a fellow actor? He was. Yes. Did you ever live at the Oakwood?

Yes, I did. That's a reason. What? No, but we love Oakwood.

We love the Hollywood. Can you guys have that documentary? Oh, I know. Oh God.

That stressed me out. I couldn't sit through it. It was too real for me. That documentary was too real.

Well, Josh Hutcherson, the same movie was Dan Winston creating the creatures he was in it and I used to go pick him up and take him to like big boys and stuff. He was in town from Kentucky doing this movie and I was kind of his de facto big brother and we'd go to big boys and go to the car show and stuff. This is iconic. This is of a time, by the way.

Like you saying anything to go to big boys? Like, whoa, that sense memory is so intense for me right now. I'm sure. Oh wow.