Buko Boys!

In the dead of night, as people sleep, that's when the spirits creep. As the bell tolls three, dark things take power. We like to call it the supernatural hour. Welcome to the Supernatural Hour.

We're going to do a special episode this week. Very special. Double special. I had some scheduling issues with Raven and Chad, aka Dawn.

They were out of town when we scheduled the recording, so they were unable to attend. So I actually got together with some of our other investigators that are on the team as well. They go by the buco boys. That's right.

So this week, they are also members of the Paranormal Team, members of WIPS and apps. One of the things we're trying to do with the show is we're going to be bringing on some of the investigators on our team so they can talk about their stories on how they got into the paranormal, what their life was like before they joined the team and how they became a part of the team. I thought one of the best people to bring on the show, I know we've already had Mike on and unfortunately Mike is no longer on the show. He's a still part of the team, but he just had some family obligations that he wanted to take care of, spend more time with his wife and kid and the show was kind of taken away from that.

So he's stepping back for a little bit, just to spend more time with family, kind of like Castle did. So this week, like I said, I've got the buco boys. So we'll start off with just kind of like, if you guys want to talk about some of the experiences because I know Dell, you guys are brothers obviously. Yes, they're.

Dell and Debo here. So you guys grew up with the paranormal, it's been around in your life, like your whole life, right? For me, yes. Me, I haven't, I've experienced a lot like my brother Dale did, but Dale definitely did.

So what were some of the experiences you had when you were growing up or like what's some of the first things that you kind of remember happening? So the first thing that I actually don't remember this was something my mom told me that happened. I was probably around six because this happened right around when one of my grandfathers passed away. She said I was using the bathroom and she had to go downstairs for something.

And while she was downstairs, she heard me calling for her. And when she came up, I asked her why she closed the door, either closed the door or opened the door. And she was like, I never did. What are you talking about?

I said, yeah, you did. And she said, oh, it must have been the wind. The handle turned and it freaked her out. But that was probably the first thing that I can think of that has happened that's actually has some kind of tracing back to, I guess.

But other than that, I was having a lot of stuff going on around the ages of like eight, nine, 10, 11, 12, until I was about 13. And then when I was 13, that's when I shut my third eye and kept it close till down near 30. See, everyone I've talked to, like they've had their throat open when they were a kid and they experienced this stuff with their kid. For me, I might have had it open and didn't realize it, but it's kind of like you, I didn't start doing anything with it until the last couple of years.

At art, when I was a kid, I mean, we had no outlets. There was no internet back then. There was no way of communicating worldwide with other people experiencing the same things. And there was no paranormal TV shows.

You thought you were broken. I was like, something's wrong. I'm crazy, but I know what I'm seeing. But I mean, there were some things out there like there was that show sightings.

There was some unsolved mysteries. There's an in search of, but there wasn't anything good. Nothing good outlets. There was no, I mean, Ed and Lorraine Warren existed, but I didn't know much about it.

Nothing at all. I mean, I heard hearing other people's ghost stories I was able to relate to, but didn't make me seem as crazy. But like with you and mom and dad, when I would tell you guys things, you guys kept either teasing me or telling me to shut up about it. And I'm just like, I'm not crazy.

I swear to God, you guys. That shit's happening. You know, whatever our house, our house would creak. Our house would creak in here.

Sorry, every footstep. Yeah, you could hear things and the settling. And so like I would hear that too. So we'd never deal with mention something I just was, I would think just the floor is creaking, man.

So let me tell you about the floor is creaking. This is probably my first memorable experience. That was scary enough to get me out of the house. I had other experiences growing up before this.

Like I would hear things walking around. I'd hear, you know, I'd hear things going on at night. I'd hear like above my room where nobody was at at night. I'd hear walking around or like the chair moving around up there.

But this thing happened that it just like probably 90% of the things that happened to me were all in the daytime. And like this event, like other events would happen when my mom would take my brother to either his dentist or the Donas appointments. My dad was still at work and I was just home doing homework by myself. So I'm in fourth grade because I'm doing a dinosaur report.

If you're with a dinosaur. I'm sure you should go on a Don. I'm sure you weren't like 16 and I'm high school there. You're like, you're suffering from your dinosaur report.

I was held back. I was kidding. But so I'm doing my dinosaur report and as I'm doing it, I'm working on it in our dining room, which is a tattooer kitchen. And from that room, you can see through, you know, past the kitchen and into the living room.

And as I'm doing my homework there, I can hear really loud footsteps coming from the living room hallway. And I can't see down the hallway. I can just see where the hallway starts. Well, my dog is sitting right next to me and he gets up.

He runs to the hallway and he's looking down that hallway. I can see my dog looking down the hallway. I can't see what he's looking at, but he is barking ferociously like his hair standing up and he is mad and he's like, he's like something's interacting with him. And he all of a sudden gets scared and hauls ass over to me and sits under my chair and he's now looking at the hallway and he's growling and crying at the same time.

And I was like, oh shit. Packed up my homework and went outside and finished my homework outside until my mom and brother came home. And I didn't tell them what happened because I didn't know what to say. I'm just like, this is, this is crazy.

He's like, I'm just chilling outside because it's nice weather. Yeah, it's nice out here. Here I am doing homework like a good boy. I don't believe you.

I don't think you ever did homework. I sure did. I should. And then, I mean, things would happen constantly with lights turning on for me only when I'm home alone.

Like anytime of the day, just when I'm home alone, I would get a sensation that would come over me and I knew something was going to happen. And it was like a dead silence almost and then I could hear whatever I don't know how else to explain up besides maybe the sound of electricity. Like, okay, but I would feel and hear electricity. And then it was just like, kind of encompass everything around me.

I'm like, hey, something's going to happen. I know something's going to happen. And then I, you know, like, come on or off or footsteps or something, but I would, or just see the materials coming on or off. But yeah, I would get that sensation and I would just be like, all right, here we go.

But yeah. And then I mean, I seen multiple spirits. I've seen full-bodied operations. I seen in your house.

I saw shadow people. How did that shit make you feel like it? How did you cope with that knowing that like, if you told your brother, hear your parents? So let me tell you about this story.

I think you're crazy. Yeah. So I'm getting out of the shower one day and my brother and my mom are home and they were waiting for me to get out of the shower and finish showering so we could go to the grocery store and you know, we're young. So we had to go with my mom.

Anyways, I'm out of the shower. I'm just in my towel. I'm in my bedroom now and I'm about to get dressed. As I'm turning, I'm turning and I'm looking into my mirror that's standing on my dresser and I can see my doorway through my mirror.

And as I'm turning and I'm looking in the mirror, there's an old lady with her hands in the door jam and there are chills in my door staring at me, just hands face and a little white afro. And I see that just plain as day as I'm turning and I'm like, what the hell is that? And I turn around. There's nothing there.

And I'm like, I have to go through that damn door. So I'm just in my towel. I grab a pair of shorts and a t-shirt out of my, off the hangers. I just rip them and bolt out my door up the stairs, still wet.

My hair, everything's still wet. I get dressed at the top of the stairs. My brother and my mom are outside waiting for me. I run outside and I'm like, hey, you guys ready to go to the store?

Let's get the hell out here. You guys ready? Because I didn't know what to say to him. I couldn't say anything.

I was freaked out. I just wanted to get the hell out of the house. And it was just like shit, that would happen a lot. But in times where I did tell them, everyone was home for this one.

I saw my grandpa and he was the one that passed away when I was younger when I was around 6. And this happened when I was probably like 11, 12-ish. My brother and I are sitting in the kitchen watching TV. We had a TV in the kitchen.

And as I'm sitting there watching him, my brother is off to the side of me sitting on the two steps that go down to the dining room. And I can see him in my peripherals the whole time I'm watching TV. He gets up, walks around me and goes downstairs to my parents' room and hangs out with them, which I see him do that whole thing. But as I'm watching TV, I forget and I can still see him sitting there.

In my peripheral. I can still see him sitting there. I forgot he had gone downstairs. So something funny happens and I'm laughing and I don't hear him laughing.

So I turn to see why he's not laughing. And it's a silhouette, a dark silhouette. Like see through transparent, but like the Channel 3, that's all snowy. And you can't, you know, there's no, yeah, it looks like that inside the silhouette.

It's all like, you know, looking like that. It's kind of like white noise basically. Yeah, but yeah, the snow on the TV is what it looked like, but transparent inside the black silhouette of my grandpa. Well, he turns his head and makes eye contact even though I can't see features on him.

Kind of make that eye contact. And I knew instantly who that was. And the moment that happened, he was gone. Like, it's not even a blink.

I don't think I even blink. It was just not even there anymore. But I know exactly what I saw and I ran my ass downstairs and I jumped on my parents bed. My brother was in there.

I'm like, I just saw my grandpa. And they're like, what? I was just sitting upstairs. He's just like, I mean, he's gone now.

And they're like, OK, crazy, get out of here. Like, you missy shit. Go on, get in the room. You weirdo.

But I mean, things like that would happen to what made me, I think, shut my third eye. That makes sense. But I mean, I also got scared. You don't have that support or like someone that you can provide in.

You're going to have that wanting this to just kind of shut it off because I mean, it's for people nowadays, like they have those shows where chip coffee goes in and they help the kids that are coping with this. They don't know how to deal with it. So they go in and help kids cope with it. I would love to have had something like that.

And I could have probably been like very far advanced in learning what the hell's going on with it. I mean, a lot of people are, they grew up with their gifts and not having anyone to turn to. And unfortunately, a lot of people kind of shut themselves off to it. That's what I did.

Because I had not just weird experiences. I had some scary ones too though. Like, I had, I felt like I was going to get attacked one time and then other times where I've had that sleep paralysis feeling that I was never asleep for. And that's all when you were a kid.

Yeah. But I don't know how I would have dealt with that. Especially when you don't have anyone that's sleep to you. Or, right.

So I mean, like, when this whole stuff was going on, like what was your thoughts? Like, how did you, like how did you take it? Did you think it was crazy or? So I didn't think he was crazy.

And it wasn't that I didn't want to believe him. I think part of it was just like I couldn't grasp because I wasn't experiencing it. I don't know how he could have. And so I never really, I never brushed off like he's crazy.

I definitely teased him. I mean, that's for sure. But it was just because it was just had a big brother love out of T's. I never, I never truly doubted him.

I just couldn't grasp it because I didn't experience it. And when he would tell those things, you know, to me and my parents, I just ragged them because he's my little brother. But part of it was like interesting. I wonder what, you know, the fact that I think I wonder what he really saw.

Like, I wish I would have seen that, you know, that's kind of what's going on through my head, actually. So one point in time, like, so obviously you believe them, that's how it sounds. Like, when was like your first experience with the paranormal? Like, what kind of got you to want to become an investigator?

I've always been fascinated with the supernatural. I'm fascinated with the spirits, bigfoot aliens, you know, any type of cryptozoology. Like, I've always just been fascinated by that. I guess, you know, the idea of what's really out there has always just kind of sparked my interest.

I would always watch any type of show around the supernatural and answers. I guess answers, you know, the answers to the unknown, what is really out there. And me and Dale would always watch paranormal type shows, you know, from ghost adventures, unsolved mysteries, that's as far as back as I can remember going back to anything like that. We just mean they were always just really into those shows.

And we finally were just like, we can do that. Like we can grab some of this equipment and just start doing it. And that's exactly what we did. We just would illegally go places.

I'm breaking up and I did a couple of friends that made him deal to it. We took into a couple of abandoned buildings, do cemeteries. We just we just built up our collection of his blind equipment and then it started opening back up again. And that's exactly right.

Okay. I don't know how deep we get here. But so as far as you want to go. So all right.

So I mean, deal with your phase of our life where we both had to move back to our parents house almost at the same time. And you know, we had already called the building. Yeah, we had built it our way back to our parents house. Whatever reason we ended up in the back at our parents house coincidentally within like two months of each other.

And we both lost our homes in the housing crash. And we started watching those shows and I think we just started having like, I don't know, like almost like epiphanies, right? Like we could do this. Like we do, we're so fascinated with it.

Like we've got the capability and means to do these things because we're adults. We have cars and money. Yeah. We should do it.

And that's what it was. I mean, I think it's stem from that don't you think like where we got the wild hair up our ass and just go start doing it. Yeah. We're talking about the 80s, baby.

So it was kind of like that. It was kind of like that. It was kind of like that. And then Dale started telling some of his coworkers that we just started dabbling at it and they said, you know what?

There's this big guy over here that you need to talk big beer to the guy you need to talk to. Big beer to the SOB. Don't talk to. It was like Tim, you should talk to him.

And then we found out we went to the same high school together but never knew each other. Yeah. So Dell and I used to work together for I want to say like three years before we met each other. Probably.

Yeah. Different shifts. Yeah, he worked in the morning shift. I worked on the swing shift.

So he was always leaving when I was getting there. But one of the dudes on the weekend shift working in the mornings started talking to Dell about it. And yeah, exactly that. And there's this big beer to do that's way in the paranormal.

You should meet him. You gave me your business card. So we got to talk and it wasn't too long after that. I brought both the buco boys here onto the team.

And I haven't regretted it since these guys are awesome on how they investigate. We actually did an investigation not that long ago. Two nights ago. Yeah.

And it's a good EDPs too. But we'll get to that because that's some of the newer stuff. Oh, awesome. I want to talk about, I know we've done a lot of investigations together.

We've done like meaningful things. Yeah. Family Tree. Family Tree.

Yeah. And the Crystal Shop. Yeah. So we've done a bunch.

But there's some stuff that you guys, I know that at least Dell's done that I haven't been able to attend. I don't know if you've been able to attend either. But I know that you've made a trip out to Waverly. Yes, sir.

And we actually did an episode on Waverly right about the same time. I wanted to get you on that episode to talk about it. But there was just some technical conflicts. That was so riddled with spirits.

So now that I finally have you on the show, I want to hear about some of your experiences that you had at Waverly. If that's not putting you on the spot. No, it's not putting me on the spot. And I did have some of those notes down.

So that, that place. So as you're staring down the halls, and it's all laid up by the moonlight because a lot of it's all kind of out-door-ish mostly. And you're staring down these long hallways. And as you're staring down them, you can, I, anyways, I'm seeing these shadow figures coming out from the sides and walking across from one side to the other.

And it's on coming back, some just kind of leering out and coming back in. And you think if I was there, I would have seen the same things too. Some people could see it, some people couldn't. And I'm just like, I'm watching it and seeing it all day.

I was like, I could just watch it all night and just I'm seeing them all. And I'm walking down the halls and I'm feeling them kind of watching me from certain things. Like, some rooms had some spirits, some didn't. But the ones I did, I definitely was feeling them in there watching.

And yeah, there was a lot of bad stuff in there. But there were some times where I was feeling like where this one spirit would be standing. And she would be talking about the guy would be talking about what goes on in there and everything. And then she would mention where things would be happening.

I'm like, oh shit, that's what she's talking about, right? Where is this? There it is. But some of the times, like, some of the ones that I'd take pictures of in some areas, and I did send those to Brandy Brandy, was able to tell me which spirits were there and everything, which was pretty cool.

But she was like peaches here. Oh yeah, peaches. But there was this, the bodyshoot. The bodyshoot that goes down to the, oh, you guys talked about the bodyshoot on the episode of the track.

But for people that haven't listened to that episode or don't know much about Wave With You Want to Explain What The Bodyshoot Is. So there were so many people dying there that they didn't want to keep having these ambulances or cars picking up all these bodies. So they created this bodyshoot that goes out the back where they were able to take bodies, nobody was seeing bodies leave, and they were stacking bodies and then what vans or whatever come around and load them all up and haul them out in masses. But yeah.

Because like, when you just see your friends and the people at your audience. You're discouraged. Just like dying and like daily people just being carried away. Yeah, it's exactly that.

It gets you discouraged. It's kind of disheartening and you feel like you've gotten a hope of surviving when you see all of these people dying. So that's like you said, why they created these death tunnels or bodyshoots. So a TV, right?

Yeah. Well, it started that way and then it kind of just turned into a bunch of crazies. Now it was a tuberculosis hospital originally and then when they kind of found the cure, it turned out a little bit and then I believe they wanted to open it up. They opened it up as an oaflex on.

And there was a lot of abuse in neglect with the patients. They actually got to the point where they would abuse them and they didn't care if the patients died. It became a place where if you had a quote unquote loved one that you didn't want to deal with anymore, you dropped them off from wavebabies and you basically were like that all over the country. There are places everywhere.

When you get there with everything you just said, I wonder if you could feel that energy. It's just like some. Well, when you walk up, oh, just the drive up there. It's like a drop on the little airy drive at night.

It's full trees on both sides. And at night you can't see through the trees. It's not that bad in the day, but at night it's pretty eerie. But yeah, you get there and you can feel it coming out of that building.

Anyway, so the body shoot. I'm staring down this body shoot and as I'm looking down there, I could see this shadowy figure kind of get up and then come back down, kind of get up, look, kind of lean forward, kind of looks like it kind of lurches forward and then drops. And I'm like, is anyone else seeing what I'm seeing? Yeah.

And I'm trying to explain that some other people actually as I'm explaining it, they're starting to see it now. And then this one time actually I almost turned and started running because this thing looked like it was coming out. It's like it got up, come big and it lurched forward. It almost looked like it launched.

I mean, it's way down there. Like humanoid shaped? No, no, almost like if a humanoid stood up, it had like a tarp over its body. So you're not seeing the actual shape, but you're kind of seeing the mass of it kind of come up.

Okay. So I guess if you were to, but you're seeing it shadowy, like it's shadow like, but, but this thing kind of got up and lunch forward pretty quick and I was like, ah, I kind of turn on the, you know, okay. But, but I was like, holy shit, I know what I saw someone else out too. Cause they kind of was like, oh my God.

But I think we actually talked about that spirit on our episode because there's the rumors or the sightings of a spirit that would basically, I don't know if it would like run across the ceiling or if it was something like that. Yeah, but I didn't see that. Like it would like charge you and like basically like run past you or something like that. But it sounds very similar to like what you're experiencing.

I don't know if it was the same spirit or not, but I'm sure something like that was probably something like that. But, um, experiencing that was probably not very comforting. No, but it was still a cool experience. And then some people decided to go down there and like kind of trying to light as I go down to see if they can see anything.

I didn't want to go down because you had to walk back up and I'm not about that. So I was like, them all do that. And just kind of watching from where they were from at the top. And there was nothing down in that area that could have looked like it was climbing up at the bottom of the very, the very bottom of the shoot was kind of like a fence.

And there was a like a clear plastic thing that was flapping. But you could see that flapping. It had nothing to do with the mask that I was seeing because I was trying to debunk whatever and I was trying to see what was down there. There was nothing down that middle area that could get up cause a shadow to kind of come up.

That was pretty nuts. Um, I did contact a spirit of a female that was actually on the, uh, ghost meter pro who I've never had a spirit stay with us this long. And I was talking to her. We were went across the whole bottom floor talking to the same spirit and I even asked her and she was very cooperative with the answers and very like she would repeat the same answers when we asked her if it's her and then I'd ask her a few things and it was always her.

Um, but it was, do the normal thing that ghost meter pros do where like it comes and goes or was it just tapped in the entire time? It was tapped in the entire time. Okay. So that's what I meant.

That's what I meant by, I wish I could have been there for that because in my experience where I've seen something tapped in for like one of the five minutes because I've had a full on conversation with the spirit. Well, they leave and come back. Yeah, they leave and come back. I've done this one steady on not turning off.

Yeah, I've experienced that a couple of times for like a good half an hour or it's just tapped in the entire time. Um, but in my experience, it wasn't a human. It was inhuman. I don't know if you pick up on that at all or if like I've never seen a human spirit, not saying that it wasn't humans because I wasn't there, but I've never in my experience with a ghost meter pro.

I've never experienced a human spirit that's had the energy to stay tapped in for more than a couple of minutes of time. I won't say that it wasn't or was because I didn't pick up on whether it was or wasn't. I just, it felt like the same spirit, but it didn't seem like anything bad, but it did stay with us throughout this whole bottom floor. And we asked it like, are you able to leave this floor?

And she would say no, she can't. And we were like, come on, you've been with us this whole time. Just we're gonna walk up these stairs. Just please come with us up these stairs.

And she would say no. Well, we ended up after going past these stairs even a couple of times. We went to the stairs. Okay, we're gonna come up.

We're just coming up with us up these stairs. As we went up the stairs, turned off. And it was stayed on throughout this whole time. But the moment we told it to come up the stairs and we went up the stairs, it was just like it said, you can't go upstairs.

You just didn't feel like it was too scary to or something. I think something is keeping it down there. Yeah, there was some bad stuff down there also. On that floor, we were in this room.

This room, I can't remember what the name of it was, but there was a throne in there because it's part of their Halloween get up and stuff. Well, in that room, it's known to have a lot of bad activity. I thought someone was happening in there and I was like, the hell? Almost felt like I was like, my boxers were riding up the side and I'm like, what the hell?

I'm talking on them down, but it was weird. Didn't think nothing of it. Just thought maybe doing a lot of walking. Such events.

Anyways, when we're done with- I've dealt with one of those before, sort of. Well, when we're done with that area and we're talking to the guys, they're cool hanging out chilling with us. She was talking about how in that same area, this older gentleman said he kept getting his nuts grabbed. Like someone was like, talking on his nuts.

I was like, what'd you say? She's like, yes, this one guy one time he was talking about this. I'm all in that room right there. She's like, yeah, someone bitch got me too.

You can mess it on this idea. You were there when I got my ass grabbed. It was so many. Everyone says it wasn't me.

He was in front of me. Even though he's got that long reach, he couldn't get to me. It was a good idea. No matter how hard I tried, he wouldn't do it.

There was like three or four feet between us. You got a kind of guy you butt pinched a little bit there. It was a one grab. It was a one two.

He got me with a one two. He did the one cheek and I was like, something just grabbed mine and then he got the second one in him and got me good. He did. He went there.

He went there. He went there. He's gonna. I might have that on audience.

I hope you do. That was awesome. But yeah, Waverly was pretty damn rad. I mean, there was a ton of experiences.

We had, we have a whole episode on that on our podcast. We'll plug that real quick. Booko Boys podcast. Check us out.

Where can we find the Booko Boys podcast? On every format there is known to man. Yeah. All right then.

Just but the Booko Boys or Booko Boys, you'll find us on Instagram, Facebook, Booko Boys. VUKO. All right. Selfless plug.

Thanks for that, though. You're welcome. It's a commercial break, folks. We don't have those here.

So obviously we just talked about Waverly with Dell. What was one of your first or one of your most favorite investigations or places that you've been that you really want to get back to? Me, gosh. I personally really like residential.

Part of me, I like to serve. I like to help people. So people that are struggling with their house, they feel whether they're just spooked out or they feel like something bad is in their house. I like doing that as a little bit more intimate environment because you have so many people.

You don't have so many rookies. People that are a little bit more experienced and you're just trying to help somebody. I've had some pretty interesting things happen during those recently. Okay, I'll tell you two stories on orbs.

I'm not a big fan of orbs. I used to love orbs. I'm like, oh my god, look at those orbs. Never loved orbs.

I would hate when I see shows and people say, I think this picture, there's these orbs. And there's faces on the face of the orb. There's not okay. The orbs can be real spirit energy.

They can. Usually it's not an actual spirit itself. It's just kind of like the energy that the spirits are meeting. Yeah.

I'll tell you what, you'll see the only orbs I really like are the ones that you can see either with your naked eye or they're moving in video. The way they're moving. Not just the stupid, oh, it took a picture. There's a million orbs in the cemetery at night.

Yeah, that's what I'm going to get to right now. It's moist outside. So we did an investigation. I can't remember this was at.

I can't remember the location. But we did an investigation and I went into the bedroom with Mark on the team. It's probably West Valley. Yeah, I really, I went to the West side of the Utah.

I can't remember exactly where. And we're in the room. It's dark in there. And, you know, I'm trying to take some pictures, some videos.

And I look and just a couple inches off the bed, I see this light. I tell we're in the bedroom with no lights on. I see this orb go across the bed and then up. And I was like, what the hell is that?

I got it. I got it on video. I said it on the peaches. So you saw it like without any instruments without any red.

You saw it just with your own two eyes. Luckily I did get it with my camera. Look. You got it with his camera and his bare ass eyes.

Bare ass eyes. That's awesome. I saw it. But it was, I had the, I actually don't use a camera.

I actually use an iPod touch. There's no steady red added to it. It doesn't set off anything. I can use it separate from my phone.

And so I was actually just kind of just, I had it out. I just kind of looked down at the bed. I probably saw something in my prayer. I just see this colorful light.

And it was really small. It was a, it was a part of the size of a nickel, maybe, or a quarter. It was really small light. And I just see it go across the bed, just a couple inches off the bed and then up into the corner of the room.

And luckily I just had my camera friend in a deep catcher. And I said to peaches and she goes, yep, you got something there. It's cool. And another time in Eureka, Eureka Utah, we were in, I can't remember used to be a grocery, a department store, I remember.

The Gattley Building. The Gattley Building. And I'm taking, I'm snapping pictures. And it's, again, this is, it's pitch black.

So as I'm trying to snap a picture, it kind of flashes a couple of times to create light so it can, you know, focus. And while I'm snapping a picture, I see this from the smartphone, okay, from the iPod touch. I can see this light, this orb rise up from the ground and dart at me. And I actually step back because I thought it was going to hit me in the face.

I saw it, I saw it. I saw it. I saw it. I saw it.

I saw it. Luckily, I caught it on camera. I thought it was a bat. Like, there was nothing, there was nothing going on, but the way he jumped back, because he did it right in front of me.

And I'm looking up and there's nothing. I'm like, what just happened? Who was with it? Someone else saw it with you.

No one saw it. I'm only going to saw it. Someone else saw it. But Lurch and Elisa were with us.

Yes. In that room. So I was like, well, crazy. So me and Lurch went kind of back to back trying to snap pictures if you catch anything.

I went to another area and it comes around again. And this time it comes right at me and I didn't catch it because I was snapping. I didn't focus on time to catch the orb flying. Yeah, the tail of it, all right.

What's that? Did you get it? No, you didn't get it. No, I didn't get it even on the second time.

But I did, I wasn't scared this time. And I just kind of, I remember I just wanted my senses to kick up because I wanted to get at my face. And I wanted to hear if I heard wings. Like I was trying to see if it was a bug.

Now granted, this was in November. There's no reason there should be flying bugs in Eureka because I actually snowed that night as well. They're not alive, all right. They're in November and in Utah.

And I try to hear if there was wings, nothing. So anyway, I showed it to Peaches and she was like, yeah, you got something there. And funny enough, probably a year later, ghost adventures went to Eureka. And in the exact same spot, they also caught an orb moving in that same spot though.

And it's the exact same spirit doing the exact same move. And you had a better picture of it than they did. Yeah. I remember when that episode aired and saying your post on Facebook, like, you're like, this is my picture.

Like I got it the exact same spot. Like I was there and then it happened to me. Yeah. Because you can see the stairs in the background.

So you can actually lined up and I was like, my events looks better though, just to say. But yeah, those two things were really, I found it really interesting because I actually always debunked orbs. I just was like, there's nothing. There's nothing.

Which I still believe 98% of it is nothing. When people show me pictures or anything of orbs. But these two times were, I was just blown away and just shocked me. Those ones were, yeah, those types of orbs are not orbs or anomalies.

Yeah, yeah. In an orb shape. Yeah, in an orb shape. But I mean, the tricky thing is with orbs, especially in video, even if it's like moving erratically, I've personally gotten video of so called orbs where the more I've watched it or showed it to people, they're just like, yeah, that's a bug.

Because when you're using like infrared, a lot of times the bugs, the wings are reflective enough that it just looks like a light bulb. Oh, yeah. So sometimes when you're doing the infrared, it's hard to distinguish between an actual spirit energy and dust or water molecules or bugs or whatever. So orbs are really, really difficult to prove that it's spirit energy.

To be honest with any evidence we use, it's hard to prove that it's real. Sure. I mean, I know when we put stuff out there and we post it on Facebook or wherever, we post our evidence, we only do that with stuff that we 100% believe that it's actual evidence and not something that was faked or whatnot. And if someone's able to prove us wrong, we're willing to admit like, hey, yeah, you're right.

I'm glad you pointed that out to me and we'll pull it down and not use this evidence anymore. But yeah, it's orbs are it's really hit or miss. I'll tell you the craziest looking orb. It wasn't an orb I saw.

This was a cloud. This was a damn cloud. It was weird. But this like, this wasn't anything that happened to me when I was a kid.

So during that time when things were happening to me a lot, this thing came out from the side of my bed and we had waterbed. So there was no underneath the bed. It just was solid to the ground. But from the base of the bed, anyways, this cloud came out and formed in front of me and I'm sitting on my bed staring at it as it as this thing manifested in front of me and formed this like a little, I guess, hurricane shaped like, like, slimmer, but white, transparent, and that snowy thing inside again.

And I'm like, I'm calling my brother to come in the room. He won't come in because he's talking to chicks on the phone. So he's like, telling me to shut up. And I'm like, kid in here, he won't come in.

I'm a young from my cousin who's home. He's upstairs. I'm telling him to come down and check this out. He's like, I'm meeting.

You come up here. I'm like, I'm calling you guys coming here to look at something. Me coming out there does nothing for anybody. So I finally, I'm like, okay, forget it.

I try to, I don't want to get off my bed and like run into the thing. So I slide down my bed to the base or the bottom of my bed. I get off it and I get off and I'm kind of staring at this thing. It's like rotating toward it.

There's no features on it. There's nothing to it besides this cloud shape. But I can notice that it's rotating as I'm walking around. It was freaking weird.

But I just go, I wasn't afraid of it either. There's nothing about it that seems scary. There was nothing but I go upstairs and I tell my cousin what I just saw. And now he's like, oh, yeah, I'm going to come down and check it out.

We go down there and it's gone. Yeah. And that was weird. That wasn't a light anomaly.

It wasn't an orb. It was a cloud. And I've never seen anything like that again. I want an only time I've ever seen that.

So fast forward 25 years later. Hindsai, what do you think all these things mean? What do you think they are? I think I just had these abilities that were giving off a beacon to these spirits that were trying to come to me for questions or answers or something or they wanted help crossing over or they could tell I could see them maybe in one day.

But I couldn't do anything for them. I was too damn scared. They don't have a little kid. What the hell do you want from me?

Well, I've heard that actually happens quite a bit with kids where they can see the spirits and the spirits know it. And they won't help when they get frustrated because they're not receiving the help they want. But you as a kid, you don't have the hell you're doing. You haven't had someone show you or guide you on how to handle these situations.

Well, also actually, let me tell you an outlet that I only found at that age, which was not a good outlet, was a Ouija board. Oh, OK. Yeah. So at that age, what do you have to like, ghost equipment?

What's out there to communicate with spirits? Honestly, like growing up in the 80s and I can't think of anything. A Ouija board? Flashlight in a voice recorder.

No, maybe. Back then there was no such thing as a voice recorder that we knew of and you know check. And then the flashlight was never existed. Just like a flashlight.

Yeah. But I mean, there's stuff that I know of now that people used to investigate with for years. But as a kid, you're not going to know. They said you don't have the internet.

There's a lot of TV shows. We're on. Yeah. So I mean, you wouldn't think to like, plot a compass.

And the only time you did see something of like, Ed and Lorraine Warren, they had a big old camera and like the big old double recorder thing, that was all the equipment they had. Yeah. And so it's like, you know. Well, you know, like the changeling that movie that came out in the 80s, how when they did their say-nots, saying they had a medium and they had the same thing.

Yeah. Yeah. The big recorder, the double wheel recorders. That's all you ever saw.

So there's no way a kid's going to get their hands on that. And the only thing a kid knows of that's out there is a Ouija board. So I start to use your eyes. Because you could get it out to his wrist.

And they'd call him Spiritboards. All this. So I was, I got obsessed with what Ouija boards are and everything. And I found out I had a friend who had a Ouija board.

So we go over to his house and meet a few buddies. We go to his house and they talk about how the Ouija board works just fine and all this. We're not too good at the friends with them. We're acquaintances with them, but we just want to use their Ouija board.

So he's like, yeah, you guys can use this. Just out here in the driveway. He goes inside and we're just out there messing with it. And it's working right off the bat.

It's working. And we're asking him like, hey, what's your name? He tells us his name. He spelled out the name V-E-Y-V.

And okay, that's a weird name. That's probably Judas saying ou-Vay. Well, that's a common last name. Vay's a common last name.

I didn't know that. I didn't know that now. I didn't know that. I know that because I've seen authors with that name.

I've seen other people with that last name. Well, anyways, the kid that lives there comes back out a little bit later. He's like, I was working for you guys. Yeah.

What his name is? Yeah, he's already say it was Vay. Like, for real? They're like, it's really weird because we were blaming each other.

You're moving it. No, you're moving it. And it was working. And I was asking it if, you know, how many spirits were in my house?

If it knew that, instead there was five spirits in my house. But I don't know if it knew that if it was just a top of shit. It was a significance of the name Vay though. Nothing.

Well, because it was his Ouija board, he knows the name of the spirit that he talks to. Oh, so he's got that name before too? Yeah, well, he's so that's the spirit that they talk to all the time. Interesting.

I heard some crazy stuff that happened from the kids older brother. He was played with it all the time in their house. Well, I guess he got in a fight with somebody and asked the spirit to do some kind of harm towards that kid that he got mad at. Well, the kid who owned the Ouija board that wanted the ill will towards someone else ended up having a heart attack in his sleep.

He lived in everything from it. But yeah, he ended up having a heart attack as a kid. Huh. Yeah, that's it's my opinion.

That's not something that I would never suggest for anybody to use Ouija boards at that age because that was the only thing I knew of was the only reason why I even considered it and was obsessed with it because I wanted an outlet to communicate. So why am I seeing spirits? Who's going to answer these questions for me but maybe a spirit can answer these questions for me? Which one?

I get that. I didn't know how bad they were at the time. I told him my dad told us the story of his body using it that he worked with and some of the stuff that happened to them that he was telling me not to use it anymore and so I was like, that's shit down scary. I personally witnessed people using Ouija board.

I was in the room watching him do it. I can remember vividly. They were they had it in the middle of the bed. I was standing behind my friend, Cammy, at the time.

And my friend Matt was on the other side of the bed. They were the ones using the board because they apparently talked up beforehand and I told him where there was some money hidden up in Jeremy Ranch. And I'm just like, I'm curious. I'm in trouble.

I'm in trouble. I'm in trouble. That's right. I'm in trouble.

Let's go. We couldn't find it. So we go back and we're like, let's ask again. And this is when I was there.