Burn It Down to Build It Better: A New Era for ESG and Business

In this episode of Less Talk, More Action, Joel and Owen are joined by Raz Godelnik, Associate Professor of Strategic Design and Management at Parsons School of Design and author of "Rethinking Corporate Sustainability in the Era of Climate Crisis." Raz discusses why current ESG and sustainability efforts are falling short. The conversation explores the need to move beyond incremental change and shareholder capitalism, the importance of holistic, systems-level thinking, and why sustainability must better connect with people’s real priorities. Key takeaways include the value of asking better questions, the role of education and design thinking in driving change, hope inspired by the next generation of leaders, and so much more. Highlights from this week’s conversation include:First Professor Guest & Course Creation Segment (1:13)Owen’s Course: Take Action and Get Out of Your Lane (2:53)Joel’s Course: Question Everything (4:44)Challenging Regulations & Real-World Example (7:11)Introducing Raz Godelnik (8:09)AI and Education/Sustainability (10:18)Rethinking Corporate Sustainability Book (12:15)Do We Need to Rethink Capitalism? (15:42)Sustainability’s Failure to Connect Value (17:17)Barriers to Political and Systemic Change (19:33)Holistic vs. Narrow Focus in Sustainability (22:36)Upstream vs. Downstream Solutions (24:03)Barriers Beyond Capital: Connecting to People’s Priorities (29:18)Advice for Students: Ask Better Questions (33:21)Incrementalism and Business Model Inertia (36:14)Who Should Lead Radical Change? (38:39)Hope for the Future (42:26)Connecting with Raz and Parting Thoughts (44:03)The nexus of business, policy, and sustainability is more divided than ever, but Less Talk, More Action is here to cut through the noise. Hosted by clean energy experts Joel Cesare and Owen Barrett, this podcast dives into the front lines of decarbonization, net-zero real estate, and entrepreneurship. Each episode features bold questions, real solutions, and stories from leaders in science, tech, and business who are taking action to make the world a better place. Join us as we move beyond talk and work toward a cleaner, net-zero future. Learn more and subscribe at lesstalkmoreaction.com. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.