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ACAST. ACAST.com. Hello, and welcome to Caged in, brought to you by the Breadcrumbs Collective and hosted by me, Petros Pat Silvus. I'm back once again with another Caged Wary Special.
This time I'm joined by Darryl Edge of the Caged Rage Podcast where we have a deep dive into the 2021 Nicholas Cages career and have a little look forward to 2022 and the kind of the ongoing future of where Cages career is going. I personally think it's not really anything, but we're living in exciting times. This is the year of Caged maybe upon us. We look at the ramifications of what happened with Pig, is that a good thing?
Are we yet to see that? Are we going to see Caged? Do you know? We're going to be thrusting more into the limelight.
We talk about the Hollywood report around table. We kind of look at the projects we liked last year and the projects we're looking forward to most coming up, and then after all of that, this one's a long one. It's going to be as quick as I can in this intro. We look in the 1993 film, Deadfall, which is a real doozy.
We went from one of Caged's best last week with Red Rock West. Well, Ron Tomatoes would have you believe his worst with a 0% rating. This is a real family affair as well as having Nicholas Cage in it. It also is directed by his brother Christopher Coppola and his brother Mark in there as well as his auntie, Tanya Shire.
So, yeah, this is a real family affair, and this episode was a lot of fun to record. I very much hope you enjoy it. So with all of that out of the way, all that's left to do is to get raging with Caged. The con is on once again as we take another look at the Christopher Coppola directed crime for a deadfall released in 1993 and written by Chris Coppola and future Oscar winner, Nick Velalonga starring Michael Beanbein.
I think it has been Sarah Trigger, Oscar winner James Coburn, Charlie Sheen, Peter Fonda, Tally Shire, the toolman himself, Angus Scrim and our boy, Nicholas Cage. Joining me for this film to see if it is a Kate Gworth hustling for or if we are the ones being conned is fellow Caged scholar by Northern counterpart, friend of the podcast, Kate Rages, very own, Darryl Edge. Darryl, have you been shaped by the con or do you shape the con? Life is a con, God damn it.
I mean, I think I just have to quickly touch on that. I have no idea how to say Michael Beanbein's name either. I have no clue how you pronounce his name. I was like, literally, I watched the film like last night in the point of recording and I was looking at Michael Beanbein, Beanbein, Beinbein, Beinbein, trying to find anything of just someone introducing him and it's all cut off before the intro.
There's no proof of how to say his name and it's tearing me apart. In preparation, I listened to somebody talking about Terminator and a lot of people have said Michael Bean and I think it has been and I listened back much to my chagrin at my old episode and I have the same thing back then of going like Michael Bein and there's probably people who are like big, like, cineast going like, you don't know what you're talking about. You don't even know, like Kyle Reese's real name, you charlatan. I think it's the same thing that I came to cover in this film.
I think there's literally a minute of me trying to sound it out and nothing sounded right. That was a term in the end. He's like B-I-E-I. It was like maybe just a quiet sound trying to keep it down when you step on a lego at two in the morning.
I don't know. I literally feel like a year and a half, this has tormented me. I feel like when we fight, if someone says like, oh, you know, I think in the same way it's going to be some kind of revelation when we all found out that it was actually Nick as an NIC cage and not the NIC, like, you know, we're supposed to be in 2021. On that matter, I actually got contacted by email by a writer, Zach Schonenfeld, I believe his name is.
I will correct it in the intro of the outro if I've got that wrong. But he's writing a book about Nick was caged and wanted to ask me about the validity of like that statement I'd made on Twitter. Like he said, are you correct in that? Like, and I had to screenshot the email from Nick Cages Manager and kind of prove it to him.
So I'm hoping, like, I don't know, like, sounds like someone's got some edits to do. It sounds like I may get, yeah, or I'll get like, hopefully I'll get like a mention in the book or like a fact like, I feel like Robert Gracemith, like really on like digging deep into the zodiac killer. I've really uncovered something. I'm a, I was this heartened at the time because I feel like, like, film magazines and stuff like that and like websites report on a lot less, do you know what I mean?
Like, in regards to, and that feels like a big, like, revelatory, at least some clickbaity article somewhere, do you know what I mean? I think of who would do it. Maybe who's a website like that? Collider.
Collider. Like screen round or something. Yeah, like 10,000 clicks, easy. First minute.
Yeah. Books. Oh, it would be just a short blurb and a script like an embed of my tweet. You know what I mean?
Staying like it is actually Nick Cage and like with a K. But alas, alas, this is your, that's your legacy on the film world, though, that you might get a writer's credit in a book about Nick Cage. What a legacy. Shaping the game, shaking at the status quo.
Definitely. Incredible. The character count has gone up considerably because a load of K's have had to have been added in all because of this guy right here. Like, yes, please.
I'll take that as my legacy any day of the week. So, but yeah, before I feel like I need to check in with you, Darrell, because the last time we talked was after a kind of a real real bonding event of attending the Prince Charles cinema Nicholas Cage all night, which would have been September time. So have you recovered? Have you recovered?
How are you feeling now? Yeah, I think just about recovered, just about recovered. Not as worse for where I mean, I've had COVID since, but that's all settled and done and then got through the the choice of Christmas at retail. So the last half of the year hasn't been without its stresses to see my 30th year.
So I started strong with it with a cage marathon, got COVID and then hopefully 2022 is sort of on the uptake. So I think at the point we've got about six days in five, six days into 2022. And so far, it's been all right. So far it's been all right.
But we said that about 2021. We said that about 2020. So feel free to edit this out in like two years when we all died from super on the crumb or something. There's a topical bit of info if you listen to this in like two, five years from now.
I feel like I've got like COVID like as much as we're like, the end is in sight. Again, we thought that in like March 2020, it's like I don't think it's going to be a speck on the horizon anytime soon. Well, it very much is a speck on the rise. It's not going to be like a speck in our past anytime soon.
I don't think unfortunately. Yeah. Yeah. I think.
Oh my god. We're going to get into this film. And so I was touching on the marathon as well. I think in a way, this is kind of why when you approach me about this, you go back to these earlier cage films, it's kind of why I wanted to talk about Deadpool because when we were all we talked about it on that last podcast episode, we did cover in the event.
But when we were talking about the mystery film and I think part of us most wanted to be wick a man or dead for I think since then there's been almost this unfinished business with dead for me. Like I wanted to this is over the second or third time I was telling you the other day, second or third time I've seen it. One of them might have been a terrible dream. This is a film.
This today is the day that we can finally stake this vampire. If this film was a disease, it would be COVID. But I think well, then maybe it wouldn't because everyone would have seen it and had it by now. Maybe it's not.
Maybe it's just like a stuff tote. I don't know. It's like structurally it's like COVID because like you think it's getting like really bad and like it's ramping up is ramping up and like you think you're coming to the end of it and then it carries on for like half hour longer. So I guess in that way, it kind of replicates the kind of the journey of COVID.
So before we get into talking about Deadpool, I kind of thought as somebody who is a cage scholar, I wanted to look back as we're at the beginning of the New Year, at the last year because Cages output kind of. I don't know, just have a little chat about how you thought his 2021 was and what films from 2021 of Cages did you see? I think on the whole, it's been a good year. 2021 I think was a good year for Cage because I've said this before, we kicked off with Willy's Wonderland start of the year.
And I enjoyed Willy's Wonderland. I know a lot of detractors, you know, weren't into it and you know, it's not perfect film. It's Nicolas Cage. And I suppose this is the thing, it's Nicolas Cage still doing different things as he's well I suppose we record this on the eve of Cage with itself, it's Cage with Eve recording this.
So by the time this goes out, he'll be 58 years old, happy birthday to the Golden Hog of Hollywood. But he's kicking it off with just a really weird film. It's got a lot of people talking, a lot of people are excited for it. And I'm not saying that me and you had a decent part in the Twitter social media following it for that, getting that film posted.
But we were retweeting and tweeting like nobody's business. I will admit to my shame, I still haven't seen Princess of the Ghostland. I think at this point I'm just going to save off on that until I get to record the episode on it. But I think maybe like 90% of other people in the, you know, look at this term, however, where you will roll your eyes, you want the film, Twitter, the internet, see it.
Love to pig. Didn't go by the street or for it, like some people, pet trust. Have to travel to another city to support a local cinema. But a Dored pig, absolutely love it.
I don't consider myself to be the most emotive or emotional of people, but that's one that almost got some tears rolling in the cinema. I'm not afraid to say. So we would call this now after we don't know if the awards are going to get pushed back because I'm on the chron and all that at this point. But I hope it does get some, again, I quite see a big award recognition.
It's looking like it might just be snuffed. It's doing more critically and on the independent awards circuit, which is good. I don't know if we can see Cage on that ballot. Yeah, I don't know if it is an awards.
I mean, two minds. It kind of does feel awards because it's like a later stage of an actor's career and they're kind of doing something that is different from what they've been doing for a return to form film. So you've got that aspect to it. But I don't think it's as showy as the stuff that the Oscars or anything go for a lot of the time.
Like, you know what I mean? It's normally, I don't know, we're probably more likely to see, you know, the, you know, I mean, it's normally, I don't know, we're probably more likely to see Jared Leto, like nominated for Best Supporting in the House of Gucci because he's lavoured up in prosthetics and he's doing a voice where he's like, Cage is almost doing a level of anti-actic. I mean, he's quiet and he's kind of, he's lived in. He's not going like, Hey, Academy, look at me.
He's kind of like, if he is, he's like, look at yourselves. What if he don't? Gives me an Oscar. I need that.
Oscar. I mean, you know, it's still not over the Joe Snub from like nearly 10 years ago now. I think we'll get like more of a Soviet speaking of Jared Leto before Cage gets a nomination for those fucking awards. But it's like, it's got a lot of people talking.
It's like, I always hate using the term. It's the, it's your annual reminder that Cage is fucking brilliant film. And that he's still, and that he's still there. And then I think as we get into the season and we've just had the whole report around table that he's in as well, you know, people are talking about Cage again for like good reasons.
Yeah. You know, I think for, for dare I say, stalwarts like us. It, this is like a good thing. This is like good people are talking about Cage.
And I think it's not like for me reasons, there's a seriousness to the conversation which I think we've been gagging for for a while. I think even if there is that Oscar Snub, like I'm hoping like the Independent Spirit Awards or something like that will recognize him at least like with a nomination and we might get, yeah, we might get that. Whether those awards go on, but like I always remember that amazing Adam Sandler speech he did like when he won the Independent Spirit Award for Uncut Gems and kind of did it all in like a Bobby Boucher voice and stuff like that. And I don't know like, I'm, yeah, I think Cage will be recognized.
If anything like Pig got him to that round table discussion, which was fantastic, like it's 53 minutes that just flew by and it was great to see Cage is like the elder statesman around that table. I mean kind of like just age wise and just having those years in the game and you could see, especially there's tiny moments between Andrew Garfield and him where you see like this admiration for not just Cage as an actor, but Cage as a human being and like, yeah, just kind of him imparting some of these weird nuggets and seeing that connection with Jonathan Majors as well. When Cage says like one of the things you need to embrace to be an actor is dreams and Jonathan Majors is like, yeah, that's like, that's a real decent, but you've got like, you've got an almost tap into the, the ethereal to be a decent actor. And I think like having, I don't know, having Cage like amongst those people was kind of like bizarre, but like amazing, gentlemen, like if you, if you'd said five years ago, well, not even like maybe not two years ago, even if you'd said like, Oh, there's going to be a Hollywood report around table, it's going to be Jonathan Majors, Peter Dinklage, Nicholas Cage, Andrew Garfield and Simon Rex, I would have gotten your fucking joking.
You're absolutely like yank you my chain here. Yeah, absolutely. Like it's like it's encouraging, but bizarre to see and I watched it this morning. Like you said, it's just under an hour, it flies by and it's fascinating discussion and Cage being the other statesman.
And I think it reinforces a lot of the positives that I like to tell people about Cage as well, because obviously we get the eccentricity is a cage in there of Andrew Garfield just being hysterical about his story about Rain Man the Horse. Two Spider Man having a good time chatting it up, loving life. But then we also got, I think they opened with that question towards the start. It's like, oh, if you were taking like a leading acting school class, like how would you do it?
And he's like, I think it's all about collaboration. And as he says, like, I think I'm a student of the game and it, it gave reinforces the thing as like, he's got over 40 plus years in the game, but he doesn't seem selfless to finish an article he's still learning, he still wants to learn. And he won't make some so fascinating that I think there was that if you recently, which I think, you know, people in the know about Cage, it's not a surprise, but there was that sort of clickbait the article with like, oh, Nicholas Cage referred to himself as a Thespian says, pretentious actor, obviously they're taking his quotes, like, and drum with them to make it a bit clickbait. But he's somebody who said before that he doesn't mean like the term acting because it conveys lies.
So he's like, I guess the next thing is the Thespian. I was like, you know what, at this point, you've earned the title of Thespian. I'm good with that. Yeah, I like that.
That's a lot of cool. And there's a point that he makes in that Hollywood report around table where he talks about like, not being afraid to kind of pick and choose from these different methods of acting as well. And sometimes like, yeah, you can live it, you can do that, but it doesn't have to be, you don't just have to be a method guy. I mean, don't have to just, I am this character.
I'm going to live in a shack for a year. I'm going to learn how to cobble shoes or do you don't have to always go for Daniel Day Lewis. It's, I don't know if you like, if you look at that New Yorker report on Jeremy Strong, it's like that thing of like, he's possibly drunk for the Daniel Day Lewis, who laid a bit too much in regards to fantastic actor, but like, he's very serious and po-faced about it. Whereas Cage knows that like, in essence, like there is still that element that you are children playing with playing dress up, in a sense, do you mean?
And you can like, if a film warrants it, you can go to group bananas and you can kind of like use that new, volstramatic way of acting or like total acting, you can act, you can almost, it can be Kabuki theatre in the way you act. You can don't be afraid to like, emphasise and be big and brash. It doesn't all have to be Robert De Niro kind of in his heyday, very like stern and filing your teeth down, like you didn't keep fear and stuff. It doesn't have to be that.
I think that's like, I'm glad to see that like people on a massive scale kind of got to see that. And I think that's the way that people can put around table would have been seen by millions, millions of people already and kind of more as it kind of gets clipped up. And I don't know, I'm also fearful that it's just going to be remembered for Cage talking about being thrown off a horse. But that is a beautiful thing.
There's a beautiful thing about it. Like, I'm glad that that got talked about. It was such like, you know, I guess like almost classic Cage that there's the sort of eccentricity. He was like, I've got PTSD from this horse.
And Andrew Garver's like, please don't ever stop talking about this horse. Oh my God. And then I just love how Jonathan Majus is just trying to be really nice. He's like, oh, maybe the horse is like a little bit older or something.
Just trying to like downplay the fact that the horse was fine for him. But Cage was like, I wrapped up butchered crossing three weeks ago. So, you know, that's obviously the part that's going to get clipped as well. But just just a really fun interview.
And I kind of liked as well that they're all just being like, just really supportive of each other because Peter Dinkley just talking about is it Cicero that the movie is in? Serana. Serana, I was close. I was close.
And Peter Dinkley just talking and saying like, oh, this is singing. I'm not very good singer. Everyone's like, oh, no, you're fantastic. And everyone's being so supportive.
And what I liked on a Cage point as well is when they wrapped up the interview at the very, very end, Cage was like, thank you for moderating this wonderful discussion. I was like, God bless you. I'm not a boy. Well, that kind of perfect pivot point kind of obviously this has come fresh at the beginning of the year.
And Cage talks about a project that I guess, see the light of day this year, old, I would imagine. I'm not sure how long the post production will take on pictures crossing. But what like is there stuff that you're looking forward to in 2022 on Cage's docket? What's the kind of stuff you're most excited for, Daryl?
I mean, obvious answer out of the way first. Elephant or Golden Dog in the Room, if you will. Unbearable weight of massive talent. I think obviously, you know, I think we discussed this very briefly a few weeks ago, but I saw the trailer for it.
And I get a film like this is probably targeted for people like us as well. But I laughed at the trailer. I enjoyed it. I got a head drive a scale in there as well.
And he's got a big thirsty fan base. I'm going to drag those people in there. So I mean, it seems like it's going to get a big cinema release. I'm hoping it does.
Obviously, we'll see how things play out. But it's almost nervous in a way for it to get the big cinematic release. There's more eyes on it. There's more therefore reception from critics and just, you know, Tom DeConherries and Fokker like.
So you just think like, I think like, so much in his child go on stage, just like, are they going to do well? Like, are they going to get it? Or am I going to keep like searching on bearable weight and hashtag massive talent and tweet and be like, yo, yo, you don't get it. You don't get it.
It's in for you. You don't know the deep cuts. You don't know what that's referencing. When he shouts, fuck, you know, you've not sinned dead for man.
You weren't there. When you become precious of like a band, like, oh, I was there with no playing shitty venues, man. I was there with 10 other people. Yeah, you're seeing him at Alexandra Palais.
So you're seeing him at like the Leeds Academy. Fuck you, man. I was there. I was there with the pubs.
This is it. And this is going to be the bridge that we have to cross at the time. But I can see us both turning into, you know, the mean as Land the Lion, like I was there when the magic was written. Yes, I can't get it.
But I want to tell myself like that. It's not going to be bad. But I know for a fact that if nothing more than just a gay attraction on social media because numbers and I'm a loser, I'll start pissing people off just for a joke. I think what's exciting about that film is it's one that like we saw with pig, I very much took it upon myself to to tweet out every single place in the UK.
You could watch it in the cinema. And it feels like I'm very well, massive talent. Isn't going to be me kind of chasing up every like major cinema chain. But hey, do you have any intention to to screen this?
Because it feels like it's kind of the rollout for it. I mean, the fact that just for the trailer announcement, Lionsgate sent out Christmas sweaters to journalists and filming influences and stuff like that. And like it feels like it's going to get a big push and a big release and Cage is going to be out there in full force on the press tour and stuff like that. I mean, fair play to the journalists, but fuck off.
Where's my where's my fucking jumper? I've put in the hours. I'm not bitter. I've got PTSD.
This is my Raymond PTSD. Like I'm keeping quiet on that because I say it's just the right word. But just by a twist of fate, one of my followers, Tom Butler, big, big up yourself, Tom, contacted me and said, hey, I got one of those Cage jumpers and my girlfriend did a massive eye roll when I took it out of the box. It's a size medium.
Would you like it? And this was just before Christmas. And I was like, yes, please, it sent me like the Christmas like Cage Christmas card and stuff like that. And the jumper.
It was a lovely little gift. Yeah, I think Lionsgate didn't contact me at all because I have a thousand Twitter followers. I don't have a blue tick. So I'm not going to, and I guess people like me and you are, we're singing to the converted, right?
We're not going to get more eyes on the film. We're not a big name who's going to go, hey, you like this other stuff? Check out this. Yeah, I'm viciously trying to slip into Lionsgate DMs, but as you can imagine tumbleweed, I might keep trying to tweet them on today and say some poor fucking intern just relent and sends me some fucking scraps.
But we will see. So let's look at just quickly before we get into Deadpool, a couple of other projects that we definitely know are coming out in 2022. And I'm looking here, butchers crossing doesn't have a year next to it. So that could potentially be depending on what kind of film it is.
It might get like a very late 2022 if it is like another Oscar. If it's an awards movie, it might be held off to like a November, December release when all those films start to come out. We have the retirement plan and the old way. Do you know anything about either of these two, Darren?
Well, when I'm butchers crossing them the old way, we're getting some Westerns from Cage, which is, again, as we're saying earlier, Cage doing different things 40 plus years into his career, 58 years old. And now he's doing some Westerns, he's still doing new things, still pushing out there with the genres. So I am excited to putches crossing the old way. The retirement plan, this is the thing about the retirement plan.
Something in my gut tells me, I'm happy to be proven wrong. I'm happy to see a trainer think, you know, what this could be something. Something in my gut right now, as we recall this on this day, tells me it's going to be fart. It's going to be garbage.
I've just not got something about it. I don't have a good feeling about it. I think that's what we've heard the least about. So I'm dare I say to try and turn it to a sort of cautiously optimistic about the retirement plan.
But we will see. I've got my faith in the goat. I'm not. I like the idea that the retirement plan is Cage plays like a retired cop or like, yeah, it doesn't even say cop here.
It just says the synopsis for the film is Ashley and young daughter Sarah get caught up in a criminal enterprise that puts their lives at risk. She turns to the only person who can help her estranged father Matt Douglas Cage, currently living the life of a retired beach bum in the Cayman Islands. Their reunion is fleeting as they are soon to track down on the island by the crime boss, Donnie Jackie O'Haley. So who's that's a raw shack himself or Freddy Krueger from the dismal remake of Nightmare on Street and his lieutenant Bobo Ron Pelman.
So if anything, this is a reunion of Nick Cage and Ron Pelman after season of which. So we can we can have that at least. We'll take any ten years link. We could get at this point.
But I mean, this one I doubt we'll get it to next year, but there's the recently announced Ryan Feld as well. Nick does Cage playing actual Dracula. Yes. And he says he's taking inspiration from malignant as well.
So I am I am excited for that with Nicholas Holt as well. We're teaming them up since the weatherman. So yes. I am very I am excited to Ryan Feld.
I will. That feels that feels like we're going to get a widespread cinema release for that. I'm name value alone. Yeah.
I reckon that will like again, I always like to think it's a phrase of Nick from Empire is every every film it's Christmas Eve, right? Every Nicholas Cage film is christmas. You're excited either way. Do you know what I mean?
Like he's going to do something like just seeing the pictures of him on the retirement plan or seeing him. I think it might be the old way or just crossing where he's got the bald head. I'm like, I'm in. I'm in whatever he's like, whatever he's doing.
I'm into it. It's like, which makes me think when did he shave his head because that round table, he's got a lot of hair. He got a lot of hair. Yeah.
There's some timings are off there. There's some, you know, on my, my cork board of like Polaroids and newspaper clippings, some of the red string doesn't quite add up on the hair line. Nicholas Cage. So I've got, you know, throw me his manager's email address.
I'll find some questions. I've got no shame. Perfect. Never back down.
Double down. Well, do you think that like this move to the West and like these, I don't know, they seem, I don't know, because I know, but just crossing is a first time director and the old way, maybe a director I've not heard of, again, might be another first time director. Yeah, Brett Donahue. It's hard to see if this is like a ramification of the success of pig, right?
Like, are we still to see that ramification of like kind of him being offered? No, Renfield might be that in some regards, right? Because it's kind of, it's a sign of his star is on the rise and it's a big studio picture and it's kind of looks like it's got a lot of money behind it. Well, this is the thing and it's a good point to raise.
Obviously with the traction that Pigg is going since release and Cage doing these interviews, again, we bring up the high woods before a round table. It seems to me from the outside looking in that there is some cage traction. It seems like the studios are interested to get off. So you've got Lionsgate putting out a variable weight of massive talent.
We've got the Ryan Feld that's coming out. I nearly said signed. Maybe it's a slap some baseball like the vampire filled next year, but obviously we're speculating just out loud here. It feels like that's going to get a cinematic release.
It seems like we've got this we're in the post-Pigg era. If I make their coins such a term where Cage is getting these offers, he's getting these scripts through again. I know at this point in his life, he can be a thought to be a bit selective and go for the roles and the scripts that sing to him and his life at this point in his career. The Westerns could be good, which is crossing the old way.
We've got two Westerns, two different takes here. And maybe some Western films and Western-era films are in the lexicon again. Obviously, the dark with Betty the Cumberbatch, that's in the award conversations right now. So people are talking about it.
People are interested. Even the harder they fall that Jonathan Majors was there off the back of the round table. Doing radical new things with Westerns. I'm yet to see that film, but hearing Simon Rex touch upon the fact that he's a...
Well, for one, the film itself is an all-black Western, something that historically we've never really seen and talking about these stories of tying in all these myths and legends of black characters in that time period and set to a reggae soundtrack. So sounds like something that, again, is a new idea with a new take on it. Yeah, that's exciting. And I guess, as I said, every film is Christmassy for me when it comes to Nick Liskage.
I think I'm excited. It's good to see that with these two Westerns, he's working with two first-time directors again. If Pig is anything to go by, like a truffle pig, he can sniff out that truffle of a script from those directors who are worth working with, even though they don't have a proven track record of the illness before. So let's hope we're living in the reconnaissance right now.
We're going to look back at this time as a platinum age of cage, maybe. It's the Nickonomy baby and I'm cashing it. Yeah, getting that Nick coin. Don't Nick coin, baby.
Amazing. Well, yeah, hopefully, if listeners have not heard about those, we've made you hip to some of the stuff that's coming out this year involving Nicholas K. I don't know. It's exciting.
It feels like, yeah, it really feels like we're going to, I don't know, we're on the precipice of some exciting stuff. Let's hope. I think it's early February, we find out the Oscar nominations that cages their baby. I'd love to see him dolled up and kind of be on that stage or at least at that award ceremony and see what...
Very longs. Yeah, so that clip real they use when they talk about it. See if it's just Nicholas K. loses his shit.
Like, Academy, here you go. Here's what we're presenting to you this evening. Oh, God, I hope so. I hope so.
I said, it feels like, you know, I don't want to jinx it at all. Like I say, it's an exciting time to be a cage fan. I think it's fair to say. I think the 2010s, that was the decade that it was for Better All for Worse.
It's been a long time coming to have this kind of energy and excitement about all the upcoming cage projects because everything looks good. I've got my own scaty-sivons about the retirement plan for now, but everything, there's something to talk about with everything, which we haven't been able to say that for a while. Yeah, I'm excited. I'm excited.
Amazing. Well, we've looked at the future of Nicholas Kage. Let's look back to 1993 and talk about Deadpool. The night's hall, John.
There's two million dollars. I like the sound of that. Who's telling the truth? I want you to take me away right now.
Let's go. Who can you trust? It's a hard car. I'll tell you who I am.
I'll tell you who I am. I'll tell you who I do. I'll tell you who you are. I do.
I do. I do. I call me. I've been telling you once before.
Backfire. He's waiting to stop. Who can you believe? Lenter Carret.
And honest. It's nine million dollars away from the crisis. You're seduced to me. Jay.
Nicholas Kage. Sara Trena. Breaking all girls hard. What do you want?
You don't know me. I don't have anyone. James Colbert. Not too good.
Perfect. Perfect. That's my friend. Charlie Sheen.
The fucking paradise isn't you. Anything goes wrong. Killing them all. Place the train.
They'll tell me this is a dream I'm gonna wake up from. Who's okay. Who takes the bomb? Dead for?
Before we get into talking about this film, Daryl, I'd like to ask my guests to provide a plot synopsis for the film. Do you mind telling us what Dead for is all about, please? I honestly wish I knew what this film is about. I've said it like three times now.
So it's ... hmm. Oh, it's the slasher music. So there's a con artist called Joe Dolan, who's played by Michael Beanbong, Bingbong, Bang, Shamalar Dingo.
And they start with a sting, but it's a double-double cross where it looks like something's gone awry and he's done a bad and shot. He's old man. And now he's been left with the hoarding words, find the cake which sets him on a journey of not self-discovery, but quite possibly illness that leads him to the path of his father's twin brother. And of course, Eddie, who we'll get all into an all the manuscripts into use on the journey to the maybe delicious or maybe not cake.
But you will feel damaged by this film. That's my signopsis. That is, I can say about myself, Daryl, this is a very confusing film. Like, I'm not sure like one.
Can you remember your first watch of this film? What were your first reactions or when you first watched it? Or you said that maybe that first one was a fever dream somewhat? I still think it might be.
I watched it last night and I watched it last year for my podcast. But the way I discovered this film, as I think many may have, was with the seminal work Nick Cage Losing Is shit on YouTube, which 90% of those clips are taken from Vampire's Kiss and Deadpool because every line Nick has in this film is just ridiculously quotable. If it was made in this day and age, I think Eddie's character would probably be played by Will Ferrell because it's that kind of ridiculous outlandish role. I feel like it may have been 2008, 2009, me and friends who were Cage adjacent shall we say, it's Nick this Cage Losing Is shit.
And somehow, someway, coming to possession of Vampire's Kiss and Deadpool and somehow, someway, we had a Vampire's Kiss, Deadpool, Double Bill. And that was something it was so such an event that I just buried it to the darkest recesses of my mind for a very long time, then suddenly kind of drenched up and I was like, no, hang on a minute. I've seen this before. And then all these memories of like 10, 15 years ago suddenly come flooding back.
I was like, Oh God, Oh God, this isn't Deja Vu, this is happening. We're not in the Matrix, baby. We're in the real world right now. So I'd seen it before.
And there was a point in my life where I've watched Nick Losing Is shit on YouTube at more times than is healthy for anyone. And you can, you can YouTube like Nick Losing is dead for and you will get all the compilations you need to tell your friends about his character in this film. And there was a point in time where I could quote everything he said in this film, word for word with the same inflection. And on that line of thought, even today, 2022, the year of our Lord, as a 30 year old man, that point of recording, this is, this is a film I still quote to myself in real life.
Like if I'm putting a Coke up back and haggos, you know, there's been, there's been periods of four where I've like gone to cross the road. And then, you know, a car's coming like, drive back and kill me man. And I've just, I've never thought of nothing like me and friends would just say it to each other like, what a fuck, fuck. And of course, who could forget?
I fucking yeah. Yeah. I'm not. Propos of nothing.
This is the kind of film it is. Well, like, this is one like, I tried to look at the production history of this film. It seems to be that nobody has really talked about in any meaningful way, at least I know that I spoke to somebody at one point about they interviewed Christopher Coppola and they like, I said, Oh, I'd always love to talk to him so he doesn't talk about Deadpool, which like, like, make like almost feels like we should end the podcast there, even the director kind of doesn't want to talk about it. And like, I guess, I don't know, like the numbers could tell you a lot about this film.
It costs 10 million to make and made a paltry 18, 18,369 dollars like in total. And I think the US gross was 9.2,000. So that is that's bad, right? That's a bad take it.
That's a, you do check some balances. That's a things aren't adding up. Do you know what you're not recouping a single dive on that return? This is the thing.
I mean, I sort of slinkily put like a box review for this film on my letterbox last night, where it was where we simply this is both a one and five star film and I will not be elaborating on that. Because it's, it's, obviously some people take this the wrong way. This is a Nicolas Cage movie of the highest accord. When we talk about, I guess, the podium finish of the cages to the cage films, I think we're talking about I think we're talking vampire's kiss.
I think we're talking deadfall. It can be interchangeable who gets gold, silver and bronze, but they're all like, sort that. This is a ridiculous movie. This is why was it made?
How did it get so many names involved with this? I think there's Kage Charlie Sheen, Peter Fonder, amongst others as well, James Coburn. This is, you know, this is a decent cast here by all accounts. And it's absurd.
It's absolutely absurd garbage, in a weird way. And I admit this now. I've purchased this on Amazon Prime for six, seven pounds. I now own this movie because I remember I watched it, I rented it last year when I watched it and when this opportunity came up, I was like, well, if I'm going to watch it for the third time, I might as well own it.
So this is a movie that I'm like, you've possibly seen Kage and clips of him screaming like, well, this song's all about Nicolas Cage, but you've never heard of the title of the film. You've never seen the movie. This is, you may have some kind of weird subconscious reckoning about this film, but no one's seen it. I think only the most ardent Kage completionists have seen this.
And I was almost kind of thinking it's kind of like with the box office figures as well. There's almost, I don't know, maybe I'm reaching here, but like, you could argue to make some comparisons to the room here. I've like, they were probably making this thinking that, you know, this is something we got something here. And then it bombed.
Obviously the room has gone on to have the disaster artists made about it. And it's setting up cinemas all over the world with like re-screenings and Greg Sestero and Tommy Bazzawa going around at the screenings as well. I'm not saying that Deadfall is going to get that kind of reconnaissance and come back, but it should. It deserves it.
It's absurd. Well, yeah, it kind of feels like there's a lot of favours involved in this film. To some regard, because I would imagine someone like Charlie Sheen, like being a part of like a Hollywood family and having that like, it feels like Christopher Coppler and I might be speaking up line here. It's definitely like, like, cashed in his name, chips.
Do you know what I mean? Using that Coppler name to be like, Hey, I'm a Coppler. Do you know what I mean? Like, like, come and get involved in this movie I'm making.
And on paper, you can kind of see what he's going for. Like, it has an element of trying to be this, like, noir film about this guy who kind of gets in over his head and who's being conned throughout the whole film. And I guess, I guess one of the things that really leans into the fact that it's a noir is the voiceover we get throughout the film. Most people like to think they have some degree of control over their lives.
The truth is we're all subject to the influence of others. Those who appreciate this can make a lot of money from those who don't let any small time grifter who ever dealt with the bottom of the deck and tell you that. What I can tell you about is the price went pace for penalty confidence. How every mark you flee speaks away in another piece of your soul.
And what happens when you try to pick up the pieces? I'm 50 grand here. What do you make of this voiceover we get throughout the film? Listen, this is the thing because as soon as you started playing that, I just audibly went fucking me.
And I found a clip of this on YouTube. Someone had edited all the voiceover together and it's like nearly four minutes. It's a lot. And it's like you said, on paper, you can kind of sort of if you squint really hard and look at it from a certain angle in a certain light at a certain point of date, a certain area of the year on a certain mountain top in a certain hemisphere, you can sort of kind of maybe see what they were going for.
But it was like, okay, here's the 10 rules of how to do in a war film. And it's like they said, nope. So like you can see like the seeds of what they were trying to go for. They're trying to have like, as Joe Dolan calls himself in one of the first monologues, he's the All American Boy, he's con never fails.
Like he's supposed to be this likable character going deeper into this mysterious, weird, fantastical world of the con. But the issue is, and I think this goes into, you know, maybe the form of Michael Beanbane is I have nothing against Michael Bean. I think he's a good actor. I would account things like a nice guy.
I actually, the Terminator and aliens had a lot of like big 80s rules to his name. So I'm not trying to tarnish that. But when it comes to this, it feels like a sense of, I guess all the monologues of the voiceovers and a lot of the things that the characters say, and I'm going to put all the characters on one side, I'm going to put Eddie on the whole other side of the equate with that conversation there. I think all the dialogue feels like it's a lot more intelligent than what it is.
But my issue with Joe, you know, he's the main character, but he's got the charisma of a weight like it's an adjustment. It's so fucking boring. Well, that voice over reminds me of I'm not sure if you've ever seen the original cut Blade Runner when they got Harrison Ford to like kind of come in and do a voice over boy. And it feels like somebody is like writing it in the next room and going on the ADR session like, oh, Michael, yeah, here's the next page.
Just read this. And it's kind of like, happily bullshit. They're like, there are long periods of the film where it's not in there. And then like it comes back and you go, Oh, yeah, there is voice over in this film.
And it's like, you could tell it's all recorded, like, we should say four minutes. So what that's maybe half a day in a booth, if that is a couple of hours because it doesn't sound like they did multiple takes in anyway. It was kind of like, first one's done. It may be even like a kind of production note where they're like, we haven't quite got this film.
Let's stick a bit of voice over on top to try and make it make more sense. It feels like I think like say, maybe they just had half an hour in the, well, half a day in the booth and they're writing the lines on the day. And then Michael Bean's got him. And he's just like read through it.
It's like, okay, you're scraping barnacles and we're all stuck in the car and we're all having our strings pulled. And then he's looked at it said like, okay, yes, maybe you're ready? I'll go for the line. And then somebody beside the booth just went, that's a wrap, Michael.
Well done, everybody. I got it. I was like, are you sure? Yeah, you sure?
Is like, yeah, yeah, yeah, like he's been like a toast of London clairm fan dango. He's just been ribbed. This whole movie is just like a brilliant joke at Michael Bean's expense. And you can't even feel sorry for him because he's meant to be the lead.
But he can't, I saw a review, I think, really something of the dynamic. I'm sort of paraphrasing here. I forget the person who's sort of like scribed the review. It's on Rotten Tomatoes, I think.
But they said, if Nick has cages completely over the top, then Michael Bean is completely under the bottom. I think that's a really perfect sign up to have the their contrasting characters and styles in there. Well, like, he's surrounded by a lot of people who seem to not be doing that much or kind of overacting because we get that, we get that guy getting Frank, who is supposed to be the mark in the con they're doing who has come to pay for the coke, yeah, come to pay for the cocaine. And then like the police or busting all the part of the con, they're all in on it.
And Joe accidentally shoots his dad or does he? But like that guy's kind of going in with gusto. So you've got Michael Bean kind of there going, yeah, so we're going to go in this warehouse now. You got this guy going, show me the cocaine, I want to taste the cocaine.
And it's like, well, this guy's got a bit of Hutt's meringue, then you've got James Coburner, at least he's like, he's got a bit of old school Hollywood razzamataz and gravitas, gravitas doing, like he's playing it, at least he's kind of got a little bit of Hutt's meringue, what he's doing, like in regard to that, then like Michael Bean's there going like, oh, dad, I shot you. Do you know what I mean? It feels very GCSE drama, a lot of what's going on. Yeah, yeah.
I see you've got you've got Frank and every time he did it, it's actually through my spine, because he's, as you said, he isn't either Mark. And then one of his first bits of dialogue is just a massive snorkel. Oh, God fucking pigman. And then James Coburn, I mean to James Coburn's credit, he's playing like two roles in this, he's playing both the brothers and they're different enough.
They're different enough. Would you like, okay, fair. And then Michael Bean's just there. And it makes me laugh like every time I've seen it, because obviously the con, the double bluff con goes down and he quote unquote shoots his dad.
And then it's just that really, like he shouts the line, but there's no emotion like, he's one, it's just so, no. Oh man, you've got to stress at this point, we're like four minutes into the film, maybe three. And at this point, my fuck off scale, where I've shouted the word fuck off to the screen, we're at like three at this point. I'm like, we've got 87 minutes left, baby.
Let's do this thing. But he's the acting just doesn't get better. And then I will say as well, when James Coburn gets shot, and again, I will say he's probably the person that I had the least issue with in terms of acting here, he's getting shot acting fucking diabolical. This is a lot of Westerns.
If you recall, there's a sound he makes when he gets shot, he goes like, I imagine though, being a Western star, he was kind of pillaging a lot of native folk and like killing a lot of like black hats, I mean, as opposed to he was with the white hat cowboy going in and stirring up shit. He probably hasn't had his fair share of deaths. And I'm not I'm not I say with James Coburn's work. Listen, the sound he made and you know, I'm harkening back to a simpler time of YouTube here before viral was viral.
And look, this video, it's still fucking fantastic. It's in like 240p, but it holds up. If you type in a grape lady on YouTube, there's a classic clip of like this American sort of local new show, this like a roving report who's gone to this wine vineyard, and she's like in the big tub like stamping on the grapes. And then hilariously, she falls out and wins herself and the noise she makes sounds exactly the way that James Coburn does when he gets shot.
And when you listen to that reference, I'm watching that dear listener, come find me and tell me how fucking smart I mean, I will wait. Perfect. I'll maybe clip that in right here. So one person speaking like we're kind of saying everyone around Michael Beam is electric, but that is not the case.
And one person who is Peter Fonda, who I pulled a clip of like the moment he basically you see him drive off set with his paycheck and like how like a lackluster he is. Pete, Pete, did you see the one that I made? What was that? I almost forgot.
This is all your father had on him. See you. This is what I mean because from what I remember about, the only thing I remember about Peter Fonda is that he's characterized hair tied back at any time a white male in the 80s or 90s at their hair tied back, they were bad news. So you know he's a bad guy.
But this this harkens back to like, you know, obviously must be, as you said, Christopher Coburn, like Caschenian, his chips to get some names. But it's like again, the room level of acting, it's like make me think when Tommy was in the flower shop is like, hey, doggy, you're my favorite customer. Bye. That's what that level of acting is.
And it's not even like, we can't even look back down and laugh at it for one is it just like, yeah, see, yeah, like that's a wrap on Peter Fonda everyone. Yeah, and put a fonda. It's bizarre because obviously there's no real sense of passage of time in this film as well because we kind of get that like opening gambit of the con gone wrong. And then we cut to like Joe looking to shovel this apartment and like Peter Fonda talking to him, then we cut to the funeral.
And we see like, so Joe has this recurring thing where he keeps seeing an image of his dead man, right? Right? The film which yeah, so that is what he's responding to there. Because he's like, did you see that woman?
Like, that's again, Michael Bean in that scene, like, it's kind of like he's getting like, that's what that's what is kind of jarring about this film is no two actors seem like they're in the same film at the same time. I mean, when Michael Bean there is kind of giving it is all then you like get to get to Peter Fonda is like, hey, buddy, what was that you were going on about? Like, it's like, oh, I'm like, can't you both get like, feel safe on this film separately? Jeremy, it's bizarre.
Yeah, it's it's actually a perfect point because there's no there's no correlation of that work in towards a goal here and that we're on the same wavelength. And I think, you know, we're up to the Peter Fonda point here and I can't stress enough. We're 15 minutes into the film at this point. And already like, no one knocks like that bothered.
I mean, you know, Michael Bean blessing. I don't know if he's trying. I don't know if he's trying. It's baffling.
And then he's got the recurring woman at the grave thing. And then he got the other recurring thing, which is the most baffling thing or dare I say most, one of many baffling things in this film is people being followed by a bearded man. Yes. Yeah, who who even when he like, when we get to it, like even when the arc is resolved, it's you're left with questions.
It's not resolved. The character just isn't in the film anymore. That's what this film does. It's like, a character is in it.
And then they're not it's not like the arc is somewhat resolved. Like, it's kind of like, oh, we need a character. We need some suspense. Because yeah, we get that scene of Michael Bean on the bus right heading out west to see his to his uncle Lou in New Orleans.
I think it is potentially it's going to has that that vibe to somewhere around there. It could be no Orleans. It could be California. We have no idea.
Probably say it, but ultimately not important. Well, it's however, let's let's get another bit of that voiceover when he finds the letter from his dad. So it was a surprise to me when I found the letter he wrote to his brother Lou, the brother I never even knew he had. Most of it was about how much pop hated him.
Something had gone down between the two brothers like a woman was the cause of it. But the real shock was that he said he was proud of me and that he loved me. Now that's not the pop that I remembered. Maybe it was the way it used to be before all I cared about was turning a buck.
What what kind of battles me about the the voiceover for what is the fact that this we're supposed to believe that this is somewhat him telling us the story of what is happening. So he has some kind of, you know what I mean? He's talking like past tense. He's like, that's when I found it's not like it's not in the moment.
It's not like him and narrating what is kind of German. It's not him there. And then it's him kind of looking back on the event of it. And it's very bizarre for somebody who has lived this life of double bluffing and conning people that he can't read his own dad in regards to like the stuff in his letter and can't put two and two together about his dad and his brother were fighting and a woman was involved.
And it's like, you're fucking mum. Do you mean? It's like that's the woman that talks like, who else is it going to be you better? Do you know what I mean?
Like, you can't, you can, you can convince these people into these these big like cons but you can't put two and two together about they had a beef about your mum. Like, come on. You just slop it. Yeah, I mean, you know, you're supposed to be the all American boy and the all American boys not meant to have troubles like this.
It is baffling though when you say it because, you know, he is supposed to be clued up about this. But when he can't even like read you dad and then he's doing the narration as well. It kind of sounds like he's narrating something that happened five minutes ago. Like he's just grabbed something off the street as like, oh, I got a story for you there sunshine.
And then the whole he's he turns out he's drawn into the conflict of his father and his uncle because his uncle wanted to rob his mum. And now he's basically suffering this. I can't even record generational trauma just the pettiness of the male ego between two siblings. And off this quest to find the cake and I wish I wish it was a literal actual cake.
And like in almost a portal sense, we will get to we will get to talk of cake in this conversation. Don't you worry about that, Daryl? But before we do, when Joe heads out West and scopes out the operation that his uncle is running, he's kind of running this like bookie thing at the local market and all the kind of like old men, it seems to be there's all these old men who are in on it and all the vendors in this kind of market are in on it. And there's like a there's Mickey Dolan's from the monkeys is one of them is one of the guys.
Look at these like ragtag budgie, like, I don't know guy looks like he's an extra in good fellas who runs a pizza stand. Of course he does. And Joe has this like, I don't know, conversation with this like simple face kid about like, Hey, do you know, little Dolan? I'm just nephew.
I'm looking for him. And then and then we get that introduction of our boy, our beautiful boy, Nicholas Ketch. You got a card? I don't think so.
You don't think so. That's not very such a ball behavior going through the car. Look, I'm on the business right now. Why don't you take a game somewhere else?
It's the market. I'll tell you what, it's a high card. I'll tell you who I am. Hello card.
I'll tell you who you are. Is that a deal? Sure. Joker.
Joker. There you are. Praise the Lord. To help a card trick.
Why don't you get lost? So what are your impressions? Like, can you remember back to your first impressions of Cage in this film? No.
It's like, I mean, at this point, I think we're about, maybe 17, 18 minutes in, and then we get, you know, the first confirmed cage sighting. And it's just like, it's like a live Bigfoot sighting. Like, fuck it. Hell, it's like taking like a football to the face on a cold winter's day.
It's just like waking up like, what the hell is this? Because the characterisation, the energy is just again going back to what he said, everyone's in a different film. And he's in a very, very different film to everyone else. So it's like this, the hair, the sunglasses, the screen jacket, just this weird inflection, like it's kind of like, like he's got a cold, but he's also smug as well.
And it doesn't match up with any of the energy you've seen from any character so far. Because everyone's been very like, as a member of a little bit of, but now it's something like that. And you're like, this is, this is a lot. And I think, you know, it's an interesting introduction to this guy, this guy's quirky, this guy's eccentric, this guy's different.