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It contains subject matters that many may find disturbing. Listener discretion is advised. In a world where justice hides behind any rocket you find, only one podcast seeks to expose, or an eye. What's up y'all?
Welcome back. Hey everybody. Season two, we're back. Is your boy Matty Ice checking in with my lovely co-host Lisa?
Why not everybody? What up everybody? It's season two. We got here.
We did it. We got here. All because y'all. We made it.
We're happy to be here with you. We're happy to talk about some of these. Punishment's at the crime. Yeah.
Despicable people and despicable acts, but figuring out what's really and what's facts. So let's kick off season two. I want to, first of all, issue a quick remembrance to those that were lost at the Tree of Life shooting, and those that were lost in the Thousand Oaks shooting just recently. I want to just give a moment of silence in their memory.
But I also want to say there has been a lot of great feedback and a lot of great communal growth from this, and as awful as this situation has been, and as awful as it continues to be in America, I do think we see some unity from tragedy. If that's one thing that we can take from it, which is, yeah, yeah, we're cream on top of shit, basically. But anyways, I do want to point that out. I've seen a lot of great people come together as a result of this.
I just want to say that as well. But I want to talk about this case now, at least, honestly, let's dive in. I read it. In Broomfield tonight as well, where the search is on for a murderer, law enforcement responded to reports of a body on the side of Riverdale Road.
Our Dylan Thomas has been following the case for us today. Dylan law enforcement are not releasing details about this body. But I understand you spoke to a family member tonight, who claims to know the victim. Brittany was Ted Bollinger.
That's the father of Natalie, who has been missing for several days now. While police remain on scene right behind me, they're not identifying the body that was located here just yesterday. But the father tells us, unfortunately, the body belongs to his daughter. This is a case that we kind of watched unfold as it was happening.
Yeah. And it's kind of interesting because we watched unfold, but there wasn't really a good sense of a resolution that I found up until like really, really broke. So when it was like unfolding, we saw how social media really, really plays the part in cases nowadays. And I thought that this was a really interesting case to cover because of what ended up happening.
So today everybody, we are talking about the case of Natalie Bollinger. Yes. So let's get into it. On December 28th, Natalie was reported missing by her boyfriend, Joseph Marino.
Her cell phone had been left behind, and Marino told detectives at his Glock 9 millimeter pistol was missing. What did I ask? I guess. OK, yeah.
So I don't know guns. This is a case, Matt, that we, like I said, on the iPhone, I face a page shout out, come follow us, come hang out with us and on the groups. This was a case that I followed from the second at first broke. Yeah, you were posting it on the Facebook group saying, what did you say?
We're on the media. It was so this is what we wrote. So on December 30th, 2017, which was only two days after Natalie was originally reported missing, I wrote. So if you're already on our Facebook page and if you're new to our Facebook page, I like to post literally any and every article I see regarding true crime.
And I love having discussions about it. So I saw this. And I also report a lot of missing people's cases because I think the awareness and spreading that is important as well. Absolutely.
If someone I loved was missing, I would hope strangers all over would retweet and repost. How many times have you seen something say Twitter do you think? And it works. Yeah, right.
So it's really powerful. So every time I see something like that, so I did see a post regarding Natalie Belinjor's disappearance. And it came up on my time on like a seven, summer 30th and we wrote an hour post on Facebook on December 30th. Quote, praying she has found unharmed.
Her last public Facebook post is chilling, but hopefully where's the case scenario could help find her. You guys, I fell down a rabbit hole in the comments. I'm going to post it. What I found in the comments here.
So the rabbit hole I was speaking of when I was talking about on our Facebook post that I kind of fell down a rabbit hole in the comments on her post about her missing is Natalie had made a very concerning Facebook post a couple of weeks or days, I think it was probably, oh, no, it was a couple like a week prior. So in the missing post by Natalie's family that was made, her Facebook was tagged. So it's fellow millennials now and Gen X and Gen Y. It only takes one post to spiral into the black hole of the internet.
And that's exactly what I did when this broke. And like I said, I was posting this on iPhone. I can still see our posts about it. It's all up there.
Please take a look. Yeah. So the last post on Natalie Belinjor's Facebook page drew concern from almost every single commenter that was on the missing person's post. The last post on Natalie Belinjor's Facebook page was on December 13, 2017.
And what it said concerned a lot of people. It said, quote, hey, all, I have a public announcement. There's a man, Sean Schwartz. I met this man when I was young.
I ran into him about two years ago. Long story short, I became friends with him. I helped him out with rides and stuff. I moved to Virginia.
He drove across the country to see me. I slept behind my work for weeks. When I told him I didn't want to see him anymore, he sent me hundreds of texts and calls. He parked his car in front of my house, blocking military highway for hours, laying on his horn.
He was arrested. Since then, I've asked him to leave me alone, and he won't. He sent emails for over a year, close to every day, harassing me, making numerous accounts until I block him again, threatening my family, telling me he'd kill himself in front of me, and sending my friends and family harassing messages as well. I'm sharing because he's posting slander about me all over Facebook.
So if you receive a message, I'm sincerely sorry. Please ignore him. It only encourages him when he gets respond, much like a child. He's mentally ill, and I'm trying to fix this.
So of course Matt is very concerning because a girl goes missing and the last post she makes is in regards to a mentally ill, homeless man who has been stalking her. So this was a recipe for people to jump on and of course accusations started flying everywhere. Well the question is, I first ask, who is this Sean Schwartz? And if he's homeless, where's he getting access to all this stuff?
That's just like, I mean, that was my first thought, but like that's creepy as hell that he's, I'm saying the thought that this guy is like some vagrant and he's not connected to anyone or anything. You never know. I mean, but that's what everyone thought. They thought, okay, the recipe for disaster.
She goes missing reports that this man is stalking her and her assing her and his threatens, you know, her family, her himself in front of her. That's just all science point to he has something to do with this. That's exactly what I thought. I was reading through the comments, which are still up on all of these posts.
You can see people directly accuse Sean of everything. Just say, I know he has something to do with these, you know, pervert, whatever, blah, blah, blah. So at least three Facebook groups, some of thousands of members have formed to discuss this case and they're still active, a lot of them because people wanted to know what happened to Natalie. And of course, again, her last post was concerning.
So people, I guess that they had all the tools and all of the information to solve this case. They thought, hey, clearly she has a stalker. She goes missing two and two equals four. So I think a lot of these people were like kind of hyper, to fix the case.
We'll talk about that a lot throughout this episode, but especially at the end. So a lot of people were being aren't your detectives. They thought they knew the case. They thought they knew what was going on.
And I thought they could help solve it and get Natalie home safe or help find her. So members of these forums did stay up late browsing public records and swapping theories about what they thought had happened to Natalie. And it appeared that public opinion was pretty divided. In the comments, I saw though a lot of them were pointing at Sean Schwartz, but some commenters appeared to believe that Schwartz was being unfairly targeted for Natalie's murder due to his mental illness, while others were annoyed at the focus on Schwartz seemed to have diverted media attention away from the hunt for Natalie's real killer.
So it was split. Some people thought, hey, clearly, like I said, two plus two equals four. This guy has done something. He knows something.
And some people were like, you guys are targeting him and you have no real evidence about other than one post and that's hurting the investigators who are trying to do this investigation. So that's what some people thought. And I can't say I disagree with all of this. It's just very interesting.
And you're going to be very confused soon. So going into Sean Schwartz a little bit. We want to talk about him because that's where a lot of the focus was targeted. Understandably so.
And I have questions for you about that as well at the end of this. But one click into Sean's Facebook page, which is still up to this day, would lead any inquiring sleuth that dark, dark, dark, dark path into the mind of Schwartz. He sports along untamed beard. He has hair just round the sides of his head, but his bottom top.
And looking at his Facebook, you will see statuses that are paragraphs on kind of like my own ranting and raving. His most recent public post from August 15 states, which I was just looking at, quote, people don't change bullshit. Two years ago, I would have died for every one of you. Two years of two years of you ignoring you ice cream for help.
Two years of being assaulted, threatened, harassed, and not one goddamn cop gave a fuck. These people got away with it by calling you mentally ill or sending others after me. When I made a difference and you gave a fuck, today I'm done. I will kill you for touching me.
End quote. Let me. I'm going to go get mad just so you can kind of see what we're talking about here. Because it's like a sense still of that's just less public post.
Obviously I'm not friends with my Facebook. I did kind of go back and forth with reaching out to him, but I really didn't want to open that can of worms. Getting back into the case, you can see by looking at his Facebook, he's just kind of off and you can still see his post to this day regarding Natalie, like in the case and everything. So in August 14th, he wrote, quote, come forward, be honest, stop behind it.
Oh, August 14th, he writes, quote, come forward, be honest, stop hiding behind internet trolls, stop hiding behind the words justice. If you don't care about justice, don't pretend to care about Natalie. I know better. Your blind hatred ain't my choice no matter how much you want to blame your hate, bias, sexism and drama on me.
And the video after a video of him attempting to offend himself is a suspect in the case and complain about being harassed, usually sitting in what appears to be a shed or a workspace with various work tools around or littered throughout his Facebook timeline. So there's a lot of videos of him really trying to defend himself and really saying, you know, you are wrong, you're wrong for accusing me of this, you know, you're only accusing me because I have mental illness. We'll talk about that. So you can see him also comment on some of his own videos and many times with links to some of the same few sets of TED Talks and the documentary interviews of children in foster homes and a TED talk on autism.
Short talks about being victimized, having quote, no one in his corner end quote and vocalizes how he's feeling unsafe and insecure and targeted. Of course, when you watch his videos, you have a sense of his unnerving rage, fear of frustration and paranoia as they're present through almost every single one of the videos you send. Ten minutes on his profile will make you feel greatly uneasy and make it clear to see why a 19 year old Natalie would have been afraid of such a character. The night before Christmassy, if you made a video entitled, quote, I'm not asking you to love me anymore.
I'm asking you for help getting the pills I need to kill myself, end quote. And this could have been one of the suicide mentions that Natalie had talked about in her final update on her Facebook page. Now here's another update on his profile that mentioned Natalie and it was on September set 10th and it said, Natalie, I wanted only the best for you. Now all I want is for you to go through the hell I have lived.
I want to blow my head off in front of you so close that you can feel the warm spatter of my blood on your face. I want you to feel every bit of my pain because you gave it to me and didn't care. You should not have pretended to care. Tom B said it's a piece of shit, but you talk to him and I choose not to be a piece of shit.
I'm not worth it. I'm not worth shit to you. Fucking kill me, you fake fucking cunt. End quote.
It's very clear that he had some issues with Natalie and these are deserving when you're reading through them and it makes sense why some web sleuths and internet armchair detectives really thought this guy who had a lot of rage deep down inside and you know some issues with mental health, why they would think he had something to do with it. So it's hard not to empathize with him though when you watch these videos because it does feel like he is suffering from a mental breakdown and not something that's based in reality. It's one of those things you almost can't help but feel like man this man needs help. It's not like why are we attacking him?
He still don't know if he did anything to Natalie and everyone decided he did and he's being attacked by all kinds of people are saying Real me shit on these comments Matt like me mean crazy things and like it's rude I mean like can you imagine if you didn't have anything to do with a crime or if people believe you thought you had something to do with a crime So heavily that they just attacked you well I think judging from his Facebook posts I understand why people might have assumed that he had some but still let the police do their jobs. I agree Yeah, I'm the type of person where until you've actually been Indicted and I've read the evidence. I need to do my research like I told we talked about Jerry said in does case the last case We did the conclusion of season one and John Ryan and I both kind of had this discussion and said like we didn't know for sure until You really did the research and read the grand jury report read the free report I didn't read the whole free report But most of it and the summaries and all of that and read the newspaper articles and sat there and court the one day I mean I didn't decide until that day in court I told you guys like I you know so like you don't you don't know until you know even though despite what this Facebook might indicate I would have thought John Schwartz was guilty. I would have looked there and been like well There's a motherfucker that did it.
Yeah, you don't need to look too far I mean, you know the detectives curses the solutions right under your nose and you're looking past it the whole time But do you think just to go off of that before we get into more of this case? Do you think the internet helps or hurts? Yes, which one yes, yes Yes, no, I really do I think I full-unbelieve that the internet has great capability But can also be one used recklessly a huge danger because so many people use it to the opportunity of making money or connecting or promoting Or a lot of great things but so many people also use it to share false information or to steal or to create just fake Total bullshit things like identities or news stories things of that nature So I also believe there can be used like anything else for either one I think primarily though It's been good because it allows us to access research and knowledge at the drop of a hat. Yeah, which to me is important I think that's been the bigger benefit to the internet's growth than it has been the drawback Yeah, I agree and so Matt two weeks before Natalie about missing she's granted a permanent restraining order against a stalker Who was later found out to be Sean Schwartz?
So she didn't have enough evidence together restraining order against him And I know that's not an easy feat because I know a lot of stocking victims have trouble because they don't have enough evidence to prove They're stalking them right so it's not an easy feat. It's not something that they take lately I don't think and it was against Sean Schwartz and she did a ledge that he had driven across country to see her and slept behind her work for weeks So in a Like even if you didn't have anything to do with this case, it's one of those things where it's like with her disappearance It's like he's still like out a lot. You know what? I mean like that doesn't take away from the fact that he was a little much That's very yeah, so reporter for CBS Denver commented at Sean Schwartz clean to have given investigators his computer and DNA samples in order to clear himself Is a possible suspect and other than the street restraining order his criminal record was almost clean besides one rest for theft So he had no actual criminal record besides a minor thing on his record for theft And he was willing more than willing to help investigators with the N.A.
and give himself, you know Is in everything that he could give to provide? Detectives with things that they would need to clear proof of his innocence so Sean's records may have been fairly clean But that didn't stop us. I'm sure detectives are believing he was responsible for Natalie's disappearance and honestly like I said I was one of those people now of course I wasn't in there commenting about it Like I wasn't like y'all know how we get though. I mean it's the internet But I'd be yeah, but I was not worried like accusing him But I did believe through these comments through the research through it I was looking at he was a hundred percent responsible so almost immediately Natalie's post about Sean was filled with thousands of comments How they were sure Sean had something to do with her disappearance now?
One of them that I read said quote why couldn't he have just left her alone? It's heartbreaking and why on earth was there not someone an authority to get him help? But more importantly away from Natalie now she's gone forever I praise someone has found in charge so she can be in peace rest in paradise Natalie beautiful young lady taken away too soon end quote And this is before anything broke about her kids There's people commenting on the missing thing so quote poor Natalie I feel horrible for her family I was up on I inquiring about her soccer and there's no doubt in my mind that he is responsible the guy is unhinged He should be he should beg Ellie to take him to jail because if this were my daughter he'd be gone by now I've seen these guys firsthand when I was nice to them out of pity and the next thing I know I have to fear for my life It's not that the system cannot protect us from them end quote and that I just want to point out is far too close to the truth Commenter yep, and another one said I can tell he's mentally ill I just feel like he's trying way too hard to act Like he isn't involved and he's more concerned therefore his hopes look look his key Therefore in his hopes looking less suspicious which makes me more concerned I don't know Natalie personally just mutual friends just keeping you guys my thoughts I can't imagine how her parents go right now another comment or said I think he deleted his page and I'm so sorry I would get the damn feds involved seriously call every police agency and speak to supervisor I believe with everything in me he has something to do with this crap Oh my god prayers and reposting now another person who did end up catching the attention of the web salute and arm chair a detective community was Natalie's own Dad so Natalie was first reported missing at around 3 30 p.m. On December 20 2017 I can buy her boyfriend who noticed that she and his gun were missing according to Adams County Sheriff's Office The next day police got a tip that a body had been found in a ha How would you read that?
Number in like terms of the eleven six hundred eleven thousand six hundred Okay, I was gonna say you're talking about McIntosh or eleven Because it's an address so I don't know how like read does how the address would be The eleven thousand six hundred block of Riverdale road and the land belonging to the McIntosh dairy farm beautiful So the next day police got a tip that a body had been found in the eleven thousand six hundred block of Riverdale road on the land belonging to the McIntosh dairy farm Before police officially confirmed the idea of the deceased females female not females okay before police officially confirmed The identity of the deceased female not at least dad Ted Bollinger posted in a comment on a TV news stations Facebook page that he Quote just left the sheriff. My daughter was murdered end quote before it was announced Now Ted was no stranger to the police He had a criminal record that included arrests for burglary card theft drug charges felony assault domestic violence and violating protection orders According to the Colorado Bureau of Investigation court records her uncle has a criminal pass as well that includes multiple drug charges And of course it didn't take long for Facebook comments to start turning their attention to Ted as a suspect as well Another thing that got people's attention was he did start a go-fund me page for Natalie's funeral costs again before it was announced that she was dead Besides by him however, many found it strange that the page was up before Natalie was confirmed and the goal amount dollar amount the gold dollar Now the go-fund me page kept getting higher and higher So I believe it started at like five thousand dollars then it changed to seven thousand dollars and it changed ten thousand dollars And on January 8th Ted announced that funeral services for Natalie would be held the following day But later announced that the services have been canceled due to issues with funding A comment on the go-fund me page that I found read quote You are vile and a filthy pig dead bulling dirt let it be known that a sent from his campaign went to any service or to bury his daughter He also had to be escorted from the church after flipping out and using vulgar league which to the priest report this campaign He will be looking at fraud charges now and not comment or posted that like 13 times on the page to kind of experiment And on January 11th, Natalie's mother Rose Kelly and her side of the family announced that memorial services would be held in Virginia On January 13th a funeral is helpful Natalie at the church because it was confirmed to be Natalie by the way I was gonna say yeah, we have to confirm that was Natalie On January 13th a funeral was held for Natalie the church of Saint Teresa and January 13th If you know how for Natalie at the church of Saint Teresa and Chesapeake Share it Macintosh specifically addressed the double-edged role We were just talking about that social media played in the investigation saying that there's police that saying that police is priority Was making sure they conducted the investigation quote by the numbers and quote and said Facebook has to put out that information Before we can go through all of our official steps to make sure that we get it right today's day and age It's kind of fascinating how much information we can gain from that on the other hand There's a lot of information that's absolutely untrue false accusations our goal is to make it sure we're not Had it down a rabbit trail that we don't need to go down right and that's kind of my thoughts as well as you know There are the there are the people that are out there trying to do their best help out Maybe get some information exposed shed light on things, but there are some shitty people out there who see a conspiracy theory and say yeah I think a bomb at something to do with that too, you know, or yeah I think Trump was part of that and it does it goes off on a tangent I mean honestly people don't understand what their ideas can suggest and indicate in some people yeah And it's just it's weird that Ted Billy joint now it's not his daughter was to see yeah That is sketchy like he he also was like clearly trying to benefit from her death I mean it becomes obvious after a while when the money keeps going up But then there's no funeral and then there's too much money to be accounted for and over where all the money go and Ted Bollinger's already obviously not somebody who's had the cleanest right so it's interesting and you know people pointed their Their beliefs as well and a lot of the comments on the On the go from you to those are you through all of them some of them are like in response to the girl Who looks at your file whatever it's not going towards anything They said, you know This is Ted's friend who started this campaign the cost are high and you know their high cost to have your own So, yeah, but well while the online community was hard at work accusing Ted Bollinger and Sean Schwartz Both these guys obviously the internet warriors were well investigating into Investigators were actually finalizing their own work on to Not at least death because they had to be doing more than online research and looking at Correct so an autopsy report from the Adams and Bloom and sorry I'm sorry broom field County Corner released February 1st showed that Bollinger died from a single gunshot wound to the head The coroner's report signed by dr. Steven Cina also noted a potentially lethal level of heroin in the blood at the time of death as well As Neil tracks on her body consistent with heroin use real Canadian Superstore has everything you need this back to school season Save our lunchbox savers like Ziggy slice deli me products for always 375 and get like brand pure Vita shampoo or condition for eight dollars each At real Canadian Superstore when you're ready We're ready with the whole world and more so the autopsy report stated that Bollinger had a history of heroin and methamphetamine use But according to the arrest affidavit to this point in the investigation there have been no suicide notes messages either text or otherwise Or any communication with anyone that she planned on taking her life in fact family members including her grandmother Mary Well, and sure indicated she was a very happy individual looking forward to her recent acceptance to school I mean, you know, she wasn't nobody indicated that so it wasn't like there was any thought that other than sure Like, you know Sean Schwartz was out here basically blowing up his thoughts on the internet, you know nowadays everybody is It seems like I mean I am too. Absolutely.
I'll say that I do that too, but it's you know It seems like you don't want to know what I think it off my face book. Don't follow me But going off on that information detectives turned Natalie's cell phone records out and in order to find more clues On what she had been doing prior to her death who she'd been contacting Absolutely they pull your lads they pull yourself on records. They pull your text messages who did you call who did you text? Who were you working with?
Yep? Who was the last person I spoke to correct and I think that's key because honestly this day age that's what exactly I was gonna say I was just gonna follow that up within this day and age so on December 28th according to paperwork Natalie Bollinger either sent or received approximately 111 texts To or from an unknown phone number Which is very odd Why that day of all others are she sending so many texts? I mean I guess 111 depending on how often you guys text I text a lot I send definitely more than a hundred text messages in a day Yeah, no question You guys know Matt and I got this information from a few different social lists But one of the main ones was the actual police affidavit I read through five pages and we will post them online at some point on our on our website I for iPod dot com I for I bought what is really interesting because like I've never really like I've read through police reports But never like the official affidavit. Oh, yeah, they're cool to read I had to read a bunch from that in college and honestly when you really do break down a case and how thoroughly they go through some Aspects of it and that's about to find out what did we find out?
Cal miss something good. Oh, okay, okay So the last number that she had contact with on herself on before she went missing as we said was an unknown random number that she sent over a hundred text messages to That's fairly more than usual if you're not talking to somebody regularly, you know, right Investigators spoke with family and friends of Natalie and no one recognized her can identify the number which they let them know was not a usual number So investigators were able to identify the phone number through Facebook and confirmed by the DMV as it belonging to 22 year old Joseph Lopez Detectives confirmed Joseph had called off work on 1229 and on the 30th did not show up for work with no call into account for why Though when his employer got ahold of him his family said he was again sick and had been sleeping all day So that next Thursday he was approached at the Domino's Pizza. He worked at and police asked him if he was willing to answer some questions Joseph told detectives that he was pretty sure he knew what they were there for If you wanted to be tend you were innocent of a crime you don't want to implicate yourself. Yeah, hey buddy First thing you should say is no, I don't know what you mean if you don't want to get arrested So Joseph told detectives he was pretty sure he knew what they were there for and that he was sure it had to do with the girl He talked to on Craigslist So we're gonna take a turn this is this case takes a turn.
Yeah, quick 180 for your ass Lopez claimed that he had come across a bizarre post on the classified ads website while he was coming through the women seeking men's Section that was titled I want to put a hit on myself He confirmed that he got in contact with Natalie via email sometime between 0200 and 0300 hours of 2 a.m. And 3 a.m. On December 3rd or I'm sorry December 28th and According to Lopez that morning later on that day they exchanged cell phone numbers and began texting Natalie Bollinger allegedly asked Lopez how much it would cost for him to kill her and he said Just basically from hundreds to thousands. It just depends According to the affidavit So my man wasn't very good at math Because hundreds to thousands is a jump number one number two if you gonna ask Somebody to shoot you You only gonna ask for a couple hundred bucks You're looking at life my man.
He's like you know I get like 600 bucks and like gas money and I guess we're cool like what are you doing? Let me get 10 grand show me the cash pay for my fucking tuition next year. You know, I want something real Joseph my man you messed up here a few times So he said that he was only talking to her about it until he gained her trust and Then he would try to convince her that it was a bad idea and that she shouldn't do it. You think Joseph He told detectives that he struggled personally with depression and suicide attempts in the past and because of this was using a fake persona Of a hitman he had created for himself So Yeah, what okay what man?
Right, I just I need to take a step back I mean Joseph and he went into detail about an app on his cell phone called Amino that allows him to create I've never heard about a deal and that allows him to create these fantasy personas and then use them in gaming exchanges on the back Story for his like high personality and he's very charismatic and can learn people in but then turns quote psycho and he strikes According to the affidavit. Yeah, I need to take a sip of water that I mean what and he also told detectives that during his senior year at Adams County High School, he was going through a rough time and at one day He accidentally left his journal in the classroom teacher found that journal and ended up having to talk to the school counselor about it as it contains stories about kidnapping people Torturing them and then executing them. This was found in his school What the hell yeah, so Lopez said on the date that Belling jar was killed she gave him her address and had him come pick her up He said sometime between 11 and 12 Lopez stated that she quote wanted to get on her knees and be executed from behind because she did not want to see the gun End quote at first He told detectives that they stopped at a few places where he would help recommend suicide But said that she didn't like those places so we eventually drove her back to her house and dropped off at a gas station But detectives were thinking something was wrong with that story because they had the cell phone records They gave Lopez a smoke break and after he ate some cookies and drank a can of Mountain Dew Detectives revealed to him that they had attained obtained the cell phone records and at the GPS and tower locations put him on the scene of where her body was found At that point Lopez quickly changed the story and claimed that he had been in the area because he had made a wrong turn However later later Lopez told the detectives that he had driven down the dirt road to the cul-de-sac where Natalie was found and parked the car He said he was still quote trying to talk Natalie bullying draw out of killing herself But she was set on doing it and quote he said that Natalie told him that quote She needed to get away from her boyfriend because he was bad for her But also kept saying that she loved her boyfriend and did not want to leave her him or hurt him He said that Natalie shot herself in the head Detectives told Lopez that they knew from the autopsy that the gun was somewhere between one and three feet away from Natalie And she had been shot and killed and how they determined that for those of you guys who are forensic pathologists Just so you know whether you are not gun shot residue is the biggest thing to tell me But there are also what are called pock marks that are left over from when a gun goes off They're called what's it called stripling that forms from when a gun fires and it all can burn skin clothing It just basically latches on whatever it's like a mini explosion that goes off basically when a gun fires So it leaves a small residue on everything and that's what they determined to how far away somebody is based on the level of residue That they have within that range, which I always found so interesting because that is a really you know That's an important facet of determining how someone died is like, you know, where they shot from close range where they shot themselves Especially in this case obviously where he's alleging that he didn't really do it. Yeah, he said she shot herself in the head and So yeah, so they knew by that that he had someone else had to pull the trigger because she by some of the residue She could not have been the one to pull the trigger and that's when he told please yet another story Except this time he was saying that he and Natalie quote said a prayer together and then he shot her in the head He said he did panic and he grabbed her purse off the ground which he put in his white knee sun along with a gun When asked if he checked on Natalie after he shot her Joseph said no because he was sure she was dead He said he did not tell his fiance or anyone else what had occurred that day But did consider calling the police and turning himself in because it was eating away at him Joseph Lopez was transported to Adams County detention facility And booked on new charges of first degree murder and his next court date is this February 14th Valentine's Day Now if I'm being completely honest Matt when I was following this case solely on social media I too did believe that Sean Schwartz had something to do with her murder.
I I think it's honestly It's hard to believe that people wouldn't think it was him just because of all the time. Yeah. Oh people are still convinced They're saying what happened is awful, but I fall on believe that like you have to be accountable for the things you say on the internet I also believe that people can't strictly judge a person based on what they say on the internet Exactly. So that needs to be said the internet is a dark hole like Lisa said you can take good things from there You can find great knowledge.
You can be you know a voice it gives people a voice But at the same time you cannot use it for the dark things and expect it not to come back to bite you Absolutely just saying and so I know people are gonna wonder why we covered this case if there's no conclusion yet So there's no I for I have been has been met and will definitely cover Joseph's punishment But I wanted to talk more about Sean So as we said he was pretty much accused and convicted in the eyes of the website and the web flutes and armchair detector communities in the corner law of public opinion So yeah, I'm not get this it was reported that after Joseph was brought up on the charges people still had it out for Sean a mob Hunted him down found Sean and threw him off of a bridge. No, I mean he survived But understandably so has now been keeping a low profile my god So what I want to talk about as far as I for now in this case is You know Sean was a convicted stalker of Natalie What did he get what he deserved and people treated him fairly and that they believe that he had something and they convicted And they still think he did it. They still believe he has something to do with it Do you think it's fair to hunt someone down and you know? Obviously not I think it's scary as hell that this could happen to a guy I mean like the world believed he did it like I said be accountable for what you say but also people hold yourselves accountable for your actions I mean like Guilty until proven innocent is never the way we should be operating because it's so often we find out now that people didn't do things that They were accused of or that looked so obvious But I mean wow that's just frightening, you know, and I'm glad that even how it was phrased of like, you know With everybody doing their online work investigators were doing the real work.
Yeah figuring out what's going on the police are actually out there doing their job Finding things you want to be a detective go to the police Academy do your time as a beat cop do your time at a desk and then apply for the detective You know like honestly that boy understand people are trying to help but they don't without any basis And the thing is they don't have all the facts. That's the other thing It's like what you get on the internet guys and I tell people this all the time people say Oh, yeah, how do you know what you're reading is true? And I say because I read it seven different times before I say because I've read it on seven different fucking websites I didn't just see it once and turn around and retweet it. I see something now occasionally I'll do that but if it's something that's obvious But I say all the time if you don't know something don't don't laugh don't open your mouth up until you're certain And I've been guilty of it before and I've learned it the hard way And I know that it's happened to me before and I'm like that's why I tell people now is because I've learned my lesson is It's better to just see me during fame ignorance and then figure out what you need to know and know do you think that?
Sure, obviously he was a judge. We're confused here. Do you think that Sean? I don't even know what I was gonna say But like I remember you think people genuinely thought that they were like seeking justice or do you think that they're a few still Listen to fact and clearly free of useless enough act has it's been known that Joseph has been convicted and charged Well, I think it's obvious that people want to have their own particular But they believe that they tell them exactly, you know your opinions right because you've done all the research and you know for sure yeah But I also don't believe that there's so much to be said for You know everybody wants to have their own Way is what I'm getting it.
Yeah, but I'm trying to think out of phrases. That's something I could dick Not everyone's opinion matters the same. Okay, that's just facts exactly so just because you're on the internet and have the ability to Say something it doesn't mean you have to or that you should and I get it You know it can be difficult and there are people out there that can be challenging and annoying to deal with and to see And it makes you want to say something to them But honestly or do something to them, but honestly until you know or you're really sure like what are you doing but making it worse? Exactly and they made it harder for detectives because they were constantly calling in about Sean They believed he had something to do with it which did hinder their real investigation It did make things go a little bit slower because they spent time looking to shine It wasn't necessary because he had nothing to do with it And it is kind of sad because he's a little erratic and does have mental illnesses and he doesn't have a filter it It does make it hard because he in the eyes of a lot of the people in the comments It's like he convicted himself almost right and it was only because he was you know not completely there mentally and I'll say it again And although yeah, he was unstable and we have to account for that But account for what you say on the internet Because if you say some craziness on the internet You don't expect to come back to you No, the fuckers out there they're looking at you and thinking well this guy did it So I'm going to find him his address is right there.
Come on if you're willing to say it someone's willing to do it Right so that is Natalie Blender's case it We will catch up on like actually what happened to Joseph But I wanted to bring it to like just to kind of keep you know A punishment did not fit the crime. He didn't even create he didn't even get a pun it like um Sean wasn't even guilty of anything and he got punished and I think that's an important fact It's like yeah, he stopped her and that he got the punishment for that that was fair was training or that is fair He stayed away from her as far as we all know My question is though Do you think? Natalie planned that post beforehand Like yes, he was genuinely a soccer he is genuinely doing a soccer But do you think she kind of planted that post at the time knowing she was gonna try to hire someone to kill her Or whatever happened there to keep the investigation off of her do you think she did that on purpose? I was thinking about that the other day I don't know Like do you think she knew that if she posted about Sean Schwartz more people would think it was him definitely Did we ever find out this was my question did we ever find the communications between Natalie and and Lopez and Joseph Lopez?
Okay, I want to know what they said to one another if what he said is true and she was on there soliciting him But you're human being you know that murder is not right well Yeah, I'm not saying he's not called but well just cuz he did it like yeah, but I'm saying that would at least indicate What your question is is did she do that on purpose? I would say yeah I would hope not that's really interesting. It's not interesting that everyone had it set in their mind You did this and not one person got it right? I know not a single person got it right.
It's crazy Isn't that loud and like I said I was guilty to it just shows me you can't just jump to conclusions out of nowhere I guess it wasn't completely out of nowhere, but you know what I mean Just be careful what you guys say online with that this is episode one of season two Thank you for stopping by and we'll definitely update you guys on what happens to Joseph I hope Sean Schwartz is being left alone. He is not convicted in any way of this crime He was completely he was never even brought in he like you gave up everything He was very agreeable to please he did get into a little bit of an altercation with the policeman But it's just he's a man that's struggling You know, I mean he's a man that's having his own struggles and it's unfortunate that he kind of fell into the middle of this giant Web of swag mar of shit as we would call it. Yeah, so go rate review subscribe hang out with us on ifragpod.com all our social media sites Thank you. We love you.
All right. Bye everyone Bye. Yay You can imagine a 19 year old social media or phone there's a lot of data there the affidavit states Lopez says he contacted Natalie after seeing a Craigslist ad titled something to the effective I want to put a hit on myself It states he used a fake hitman persona and agreed to meet her and kill her with her own gun Execution style while some of Natalie's friends and family had told investigators She had a history of suicidal thoughts others said she's happy and looking forward to attending school The sheriff says it's too soon to know what really drove the crime and autopsy shows Natalie also had a history of heroin and met them Use and revealed she died from a gunshot wound to the head with a potentially lethal level of heroin in her blood It's very very difficult in these cases Even if there's a stated motive To really determine long term what that what that motive truly is in court It may not matter whether Natalie asked for a hit or not even if she asked for assistance If he's the one who pulled the trigger It's still murder the sheriff named Lopez is the sole suspect and says the man previously named a person of interest Sean Schwartz wasn't involved Since the arrest he's been posting on Facebook live without his innocence Those of you who helped me. Thank you.
Thank you so much. All right Now I spoke to Natalie's family about the story tonight her father tells me it's the first time they've heard these details They're not ready to comment until the case moves a bit further along the legal process reporting line Jacqueline Allen did for seven