It's time for confessions of a serial salesman. Author, expert sales trainer, and serial entrepreneur Steve Noodleburg wants to help you change your life and your business using his 27 roles for influencers and leaders. This is the Confections of a Serial Salesman Podcast. With Steve Noodleburg, here's Josh Cohen.
And welcome to another edition of the Confessions of a Salesman podcast based on the book and hardcover in paperback in an audio form. Steve, the last two weeks, I was a guest, you were a guest, now we are once again in our normal perch as co-hosts thereof. Back to normal. Back to life, back to reality.
And we got a great guest today. Yes, we do. Andrew Susson. We were just reminiscing over lunch.
We met 20 plus years ago. Is that right? We were both very different human beings. Is that right?
But he is the ultimate entrepreneur. He is a fabulous story about what he was able to accomplish, a life situation that presented him an opportunity to solve something. And he did. He followed his passion for his family.
And I'm thrilled that you're here. Very happy to be here. And, you know, let's officially welcome you then. Thank you very much.
Andrew Susson, the co-founder of Recovery. I'm Plowed. I'm a well aware of here at ESPN West Palm as well. So you guys go back 20 plus years.
Steve said you were living very different lives than. What is he doing about that? So when I met Steve, I was a college University of Florida. Bill Gator is a great game this week.
Well, kind of a game, but great win this week. I'm a game good outcome. Yes, it was. And I was a college agent.
I was just joking how, you know, when I met Steve 20 years ago, the people I met him with, I saw just this weekend. A couple of the games. Life has a way of doing that. And at the time, you know, I was in college trying to figure out what to do.
And part of what I did back then is I helped athletes entertainers with their insurance needs. And I was living a very fast, fun life. You pioneered that space because it really wasn't anybody else because I was in sports. And I was dealing with a lot of guys that became either friends of yours or we would run into each other.
There wasn't anybody who took that lane. Most people were just doing the trying to manage money. And I believe the insurance. I still do.
And so that's the angle I looked at was most of these guys didn't have insurance and I'd be looking at that for the back. And, you know, even looking fast forward to today, you know, if you look at what happened to special football players, you know, they have a short career and they have no guarantees and what they do. So that's what I try to do is help them. Steve, you said the ultimate entrepreneur.
Explain how? So, you know, when I think of an entrepreneur, I understand that, you know, they're willing to take monster risks in order to follow their heart and their passion. And Andrew's story is he's sailing along doing this thing and then a life event happened which I want you to share. Sure.
And even before that, I mean, when I was at University of Florida, I had a record label. I helped start. I had a long business company. I helped start.
Really? Oh, yeah. I mean, it was to me, you know, I give credit to my good friend who became my wife because I was not into school. I was working.
I had people working for me since I was, you know, 16 years old because I just enjoyed business. And so, you know, as life went along, you know, I was doing the insurance thing and, you know, unfortunately, there were several people in our family had addiction issues. And it came to a point where, as I was telling Steve, I mean, I just was waiting for them to die because that's what it's like. Bad issues.
I mean, they were not. All substance issues. You know, my wife and I were dealing with this on a daily basis with several people and it culminated with some people in our family being arrested, ironically by a good friend of mine who worked for the E.A. And, you know, that led to me being introduced to Paul Pelinger through my good friend, Marshall Geyser.
And Paul had this idea of using music as a catalyst for therapy and after spending, you know, six figures trying to help our family at different places that wasn't working. And when you say therapy, we have to clarify. This isn't a school kids. This isn't elderly folks that are recovering from strokes.
When you say therapy, you're talking about rehabilitation. Correct. We have to call rehabilitation. No, no, no, no.
Not therapy is a music therapy like you have in school or after school programs. You're talking about going to rehabilitation to get the life saved. So you can put the power of using music to do that, which is revolutionary. That is correct.
And I had seen so many different types of places that all met well. They just weren't working. And whether it was family members of ours that were 25 or family members of ours that were 60, nothing was working. And so when I met Paul, you know, he had this idea and I said, you know, let's put it together.
And we started off with trying to do a small place in Fort Lauderdale back in 2013, which has now grown into facilities in Fort Lauderdale, like where Austin, Texas, Washington, D.C. and October 1st will be Nashville, Tennessee. Wow. And, you know, I was telling Steve during lunch that, you know, we're at a point now where we've had over 4000 people whose lives we've been able to save.
And that's what I'm most proud of. I would imagine. Yeah. I mean, just one makes a difference.
Fact-based. Yeah. That was the challenge originally. I mean, I had people call me, you know, five years ago saying, hey, I got a family member, you know, shoot heroin.
What are they going to do? Play the guitar? I don't get it. And explain that, please.
It's correct. Because they say, okay, well, how does music, I mean, I understand it's a busy time or something to refocus upon or, you know, a distraction even possibly someone. But it's much more than that. It actually has to do with the brain, doesn't it?
That is a hammer, ironing and sepsis and dopamine and release a chemical on such a... Oh, yeah. I know if you're there. You're right.
Please. I am not a doctor. And by engaging them, breaking down defenses and building rapport, that makes the difference, because now the therapists can actually do their job. The biggest challenge of people coming to rehab is they don't want to be there.
And if you look across America, the number one reason why people fail at rehab is because they don't stay. They leave against medical advice. So one thing we're very proud of is that people don't leave. When we first started this, the first challenge we had was nobody wanted to leave.
I had family members that came and came to me bad. Now we don't want to leave. And that's how we ended up growing because we had something that worked, that people were engaging and by engaging, then you could actually have a job. So it didn't hurt that you have an authentic partner, Richie?
Oh yeah, so right after literally two months into being open, and Steve was around for this, we had Richie Subba, who was in a warm reading singer-songwriter, and played with some of the greats in the world, and tore up with Aerosmith for years. He came by for an afternoon just to see what we were doing. And by the end of the day, he said, this is what I am, this is what you are. So we are together.
And Richie's been on board with us, and changed how we are seen by the world, which has been just incredible. There needs to be a passion beyond just making money. There better be in this industry. A lot of people got into this world in South Florida.
There was a lot of treatment centers down there all gone. People that want to do this to help are still here. Yeah, one that we knew the name of, I'm saying, 40 years in the business gone. I mean, so the landscape has changed dramatically.
So it's not an easy business to be. And that's one of the things we talked about at lunch. Like, how committed are you to this? Like, you don't jump into this and go, okay, I'm, this is the money I'm making.
You gotta be really long-term committed to. And that's what I love about, you know, entrepreneurism, if you will. It's like, the passion is what keeps you from happening. There has to be more than just the money where you're never gonna succeed.
That is correct. When we started this, I walked into my house, I said to my wife, do you believe in what we're doing? She said, yes, I said, okay, sign this. What's that?
That's our house. She said, it doesn't get anymore. I said, that's it. You're betting on yourselves.
We are all in because we believe, and I believe this is gonna actually change the game, not just for our family, but for other people. And if you look forward to day, the people in our family are speakers now, that have five years clean, that we're OD'd and dead and had to be revived. Really? So we are grateful for that.
And for everybody who's helping. And the challenge is, even though, if you look at the statistics nationally, 90% of people relapse and our statistics are 40%. Now that the overall averages is for the nation, for the world. Nation.
The relapse rate is what? 90%. And then through your program, it's 40%. Yes.
I mean, that is a remarkable difference. That's not... It's not 90 versus 87. No, no, it is absolutely incredible.
And one of the great things we've done since we started is we've been able to track everybody from the time they call to when they leave our program. We have an alumni team that follows up with these people through Facebook, Snapchat, Instagram, on a daily basis. So that if they are struggling, we are there to help them. And a lot of times, they're back around the country, they can't come back to us, we find a place to help them.
And that's what we're very proud of. We're very proud of the fact that no matter, you know, if you call us and we can help people find a place that can't. And so, you know, we've been all in since they went on making an actual difference. It is remarkable, the numbers, because we can talk about, well, this is better, and then this is better, and then that's worse, but the numbers when you can quantify things in life is proof.
You know, the best movie isn't the highest grossing movie. The best flavor of ice cream is necessarily the best selling flavor of ice cream, right? So when you talk about a success rate where just 40% have relapsed, there's something to what you're doing that's beyond happy, fun, joy, passion, there's something to it that says, this is the answer. This is the solution.
This is a placebo effect. Correct. This is beyond that. Steve.
So the interesting thing is yesterday, the case in Oklahoma that Johnson and Johnson had to pay a billion, half a billion dollars, I think it was. Pocket chain, I'm fine, because of opioid, you know, their responsibility and the opioid problem. And that was like, they were happy. They were like, throwing a party, they expected to spend 15 billion, so the problem's not going away.
You know, there are more and more addicts and people having course challenges and problems. And so, you know, everybody I know or everybody we know knows somebody who is suffering or has a problem or could use the help. And the rules on how the businesses manifested are anti-business, really. Completely anti-business.
Some people did things they shouldn't have, but you know, when you're doing the right thing and trying to help people, you know, some of the regulation is just absolutely. Doesn't make any sense. It doesn't make sense. So what's the point of that?
What's the motivation behind that regulation? Because it's a profit, it's a politics. Well, when three bad eggs do something, the other 97 get punished. Like, I mean, that's just how it goes.
Correct. And so, you know, that apple spoils the whole bunch. Correct. That being said, you know, we still work through it.
You know, our goal is that 40% number, as great as it is, and it's really great. It's not good enough for us. No. You know, that still means that six people are going to be struggling.
We are spending every hour, every day, literally trying to get those numbers better through metrics, through working with, you know, different data, you know, today with data and AI, you can predict things. So we're now trying to create protocols to where we know, potentially in the future, if somebody's going to be struggling, how we can help them before they fall off. And it's so counterintuitive, sort of, because the destruction that this causes is so much more expensive than if you were able to help people to become more productive. You know, my family has experienced it.
It's very, very difficult, very devastating. But there is some upside to it. There are people that are paying attention. You willing to share what happened in Philly?
You're researching at the Philly when you were able to meet some certain books? We are. We are. Yes.
So a couple of weeks ago, after climbing a mountain for my 40th birthday, congratulations, a goal I set. I somehow gave myself a hernia. But before I had surgery, we were able to fly up and spend an afternoon over with the rolling cells. Got to meet Mick Keith, Rony Woods in recovery right now.
Yeah. So he loved our book that we brought him, because our medicine, as well as one of our shirts, no, we ever died from a music overdose. True. You know, so we were able to go and meet them and enjoy the concert.
And, you know, just being around people of that legendary status, that appreciate what we're doing. You know, that's, that's been amazing. And so, you know, in the world we live in today, you know, just because your celebrity doesn't mean you're better or worse than anybody else. But people listen to them.
So we've been very grateful and fortunate that over the years, we've had Steven Tyler come by. It's just a slow ride. Come by. You know, art from Everclear just performing our, you know, our center.
And to have those people come by because of the work that we're doing, you know, just to show that a music does make a difference. And, you know, we're out there trying to do that. I mean, when you talk about being an entrepreneur, here's somebody he knows presented the idea and probably could have never executed it on its own, on his own. He has, he was the heart behind this.
He knew something could be done, but you need visionaries. You need passion. You need all the things that make up being an entrepreneur to bring it to the market and make it real. And you and I have talked about there's, you know, people who can solve real problems are the ones who are the real entrepreneurs.
Yeah. The dreamers and doers and dreamers who do see that successful. That's it. We had a dream and we started this and we're executing it and we're trying, I believe in content and never any improvement.
So we're always working on getting a better and like I was saying at lunch, you know, if you would have said the me six years ago, this is what I'd be doing. I would have lost that bet. I would have bet the other way. Yeah.
We have just under 400 employees at this moment that came their lives to saving other people's lives and we haven't even opened National Dallas yet, which we're getting to. And so it is a daily struggle. And there are days, you know, when we're fighting, you know, we treat somebody and then different insurance companies decide that they didn't need to get treatment and don't want to pay it. It's frustrating.
It's frustrating. But we will keep fighting every day and we've dedicated ourselves to this mission of making the world a better place. And sure, companies aren't always necessarily looking out for our best interests, are they? It's a bottom line business.
It is. It is. And you know, the idea going forward, though, is that what we've been able to do and we're doing even more every day is showing insurance companies, regular companies that there are people out there, not just us, but others as well, that are changing the paradigm on addiction that are actually getting results, right? Because the biggest challenge with, you know, the industry is they were doing the same thing for the last 100 years, which is why not.
I think that same results, correct. Because I think the rate is three times to return or more three or four times five to go in, go out, go in, go out. And it's not, you know, I mean, that's that's disrupting of lives. I mean, it's also, you know, a lot of the focus the last several years have been on the opioid crisis, of course, but there's just as many people that are taking the value of his index and, you know, taking two shots and dying at night.
And that's been overlooked. There's a unfortunate resurgence in meth all across this country. That's been overlooked. And so, you know, we're living in a time where there is addiction, addicted personalities, everybody's addicted to their phones.
Yes. Right. There's the first ever, you know, video game treatments that are just open. Real.
Yeah. I want to know that. Wow. For the addiction.
Yeah, which is very real. Right. And so, but all of that's a lot of that stems from Bay, you know, what are people doing? People are having trouble just being happy.
People need to be distracted. We convince ourselves that we're afraid of silence, right? We're afraid of having conversations. And so people turn to drug alcohol video, whatever it is.
So the problems aren't getting any better. What we are trying to do is being part of a solution. All right. All these stories, everything that's out there is all about the problem, problem, the opioid crisis, the people that made it.
But what about the solution? And that's what we're trying to get to is be part of the solution. Steve in the book chapter, Rule number nine, rather, is listen to music. So that means what to you.
So we talked about it, you know, music to me is a mood changer. You know, I think a lot of people get up in the morning and they sort of, you know, they're not at operating at optimum level and then skate. Oh, I don't feel good. I'm just going to get through today.
And so for me, early on, one of the things I did was use music to get me back to high operating level. You see athletes with headphones on before the game, you know, getting in a groove, getting that music going. It's motivated. Whatever kind of music you're using, music is powerful in terms of moving emotion.
Well, Andrew just told you that there's a scientific kind of a reason, which is what we were, you know, we were having so much fun about it. Is that for me, I knew what it did for my brain. I had no idea at any kind of scientific backup. There are movie scenes that bring us to emotional places in which we get goose palms or eyes well with tears.
We start to feel heartbroken. When you watch those scenes with the score removed, you don't feel any better. Yeah, it's really wild because that's the effect that the music has upon the brain, which has the effect upon the emotions that dopamine and the others were speaking of. And that's also innate.
But people don't realize, as Richie first brought up to me years ago, that the first time we heard music was in the mother's room, it was the heartbeats. So we are wired out. And it doesn't matter what religion you are, whether Jewish Christian Muslim Buddhist music is using every religion for thousands of years. Music is using healing for thousands of years.
We are not that smart. No, you know, we just are now harnessing that to help people that are in dire need, that are days away from potentially dying. And we know that by using that music to engage them, we can turn it around. And we have.
And beyond that, you know, I was reading a book about olfactory, the power of scent. Because there's so much about our preferences in life we think we choose. But it turns out genetically, biologically, there's a reason why you like the color black is a reason why you prefer red cars, there's a reason why music while in the womb subjected to that same music or the beats per minute in the melodies, you find subconsciously comforting. You don't realize why, but if your mother was a big Beatles fan and she would play here comes a son over and over again, you may not realize it 35 years later, but that will be comforting to you, your stress rates will hurt with them.
Because in your genetic birthing through your development, that was the soundtrack of comfort, security in that room. Yeah. But before we even had to come and plug or knew about this, my wife listened to music. You know, honor belly with our first two kids.
I just thought that's what you should do. Right. And it sounds right. And fast forward to what we're doing now, which is, you know, kind of amazing that that's what we're using.
I know we got involved in the in the business early on. We were fortunate enough to sort of be part of that growth. Hey, we got an idea of what we're doing. And what's that seat of doubt in my mind as we were thinking through it, which has to be for everybody's like, all right, what kind of bullshit is this?
Like, of course, this is another one of those. You should be scared to go in there. We'll sing goodbye on everybody's going to be right and having been through it before I couldn't see through it. But once we did a lot of the research and you feel the passion of the people who are on Facebook, you're covering unplugged.
It's recovering unplugged and it's a good topic. It's a shame for good topic. And all of their all of the brands are the sharpest. And so, you know, it's a way to stand out.
So it's really fun for us to be involved in the beginning and then to see it get to where it is six years later, you know, and then you go to Nashville. That's to me is the shrine. I mean, that matches music. Music city.
Right. That was the first, you know, we went to Austin and we opened in Austin. It was the same thing. It's a live music capital world and national music capital world.
And so, you know, they've embraced us. So they've all since the brace us. We're looking forward to Nashville. And so, you know, from back when you first came, we started the thing several years ago called Field Good Friday and it's just for our clients and it's to come and feel good.
And it's an hour and a half concert. Richie puts it on in Florida. We have different people in Austin and in Virginia and soon to be in Nashville. And so we just started live streaming it just a month ago.
It's just powerful. And now we have people all over the world that are former clients, families, friends that could see the power of music. One of the things that Richie did was he wrote a body of music about recovery and all of those songs he uses along with songs he's made hits over the last 50 years, but the feeling and the inspiration that people get from that, you could just see it with your own two eyes is amazing. When you say Richie, Claire Fly once again, right?
Right. Which was a touring musician for decades. He's been in a song right here with Aris. Now, I don't want to forget to tell everybody that there was just a special on A&E.
Yeah. Correct. So, yeah, one of the things we got approached a great gentleman named Stu Goffman created a TV show called Addiction Unplugged and became and it's about different stories of addiction addiction that affects business, that affects the military, that affects families, the stories that they did was about recovery on plug and it just aired on A&E this weekend. Oh, it was absolutely incredible.
And it's on A&E on demand. It's the episode three about music and recovery. And it talks about the scientific basis on how music affects the brain and what we are doing at Recovery Unplugged with that knowledge. And one of the cool things is that if you share this knowledge with people, like that show is going to do, you said there was instant people just calling people right away.
We need help. People do need help. People are unfortunately dying for help. Yes.
And there are places out there that are trying to help them and we're one of them. And one of the things that we've been able to do is, you know, once you leave treatment, you can't stay with us forever. Right. You have to move on.
So, how long typically is treatment? Twenty days? No, but it's a typical stay with Recovery Unplugged. A hundred days?
Really? Yeah, because you have different levels of care, detox, residential, intensive outpatient, outpatient, and then the rest of your life. That's probably one of the fallacies is that you could get better in 20 years. Well, no, that's the interesting concept.
I'd like you to. Unfortunately, that's a lot of them only. Because they're a bottom line as we discussed. It didn't power that.
But the reason why people relapse so much is because you're not going to change, you know, a 30-year habit in a few weeks. It is a lifelong thing. And that's why, you know, we believe in what we do and how we do it. You know, when one of the people came to talk to us, you know, they talked about mat, medical assisted treatment, which is the big thing today.
And we said, yes, we have mat musically assisted treatment. And, you know, that's, that's the power of what we do. And we also believe in mat as well. The medically assisted treatment, we believe in, you know, whatever we meet people where they're at.
And for some people that have been to rehab 10 times, they may need certain medications that are going to help them stay clean. And for other people that have never been to treatment, why put them on something right now, they're going to have to take the rest of their life. And that other extension that you talked about, Karma, which is kind of, you know, interesting that we're at good karma brands is a logical extension to somewhat a doctor, a medical professional, understanding what, you know, addiction and recovery. One of the things that we saw was, you know, when people eventually, unfortunately, fall off at 60%, it's normally, you know, within the first year after they come to treatment.
And a lot of time it's because they don't have the proper mental health and they don't have the proper doctors that understand addiction. So we partnered with a group out of Texas that we became part of and it's called Karma, a collaborative addiction, medical, medical assistance, Karma health and C-A-R-M-A. And so what is it? Doctors offices that also has mental health.
So you have a doctor that actually understands addiction and a mental health component where you could go see a therapist on your iPhone or Android and not have to have that four month wait that most people do, which is where they fall off. And so we're proud to be part of that as well going forward. What is the I-Party-Sober movement? So part of the sober conscious.
Yes. So, you know, if you were going on today, you have people in recovery and you have people that just want to go out and have fun being sober. You know, you don't have to drink or do drugs to have a good time, especially at concerts. We do a lot of stuff.
So, you know, our team thought of this idea of I-Party-Sober and we rolled it out with side last year when we were there and it's really taken off to where there are people that just want to go out, go to concerts, go to venues, have fun and they party sober. And so it's growing. It's, you know, you know, people throw up on you and you're like, yeah, but it's funny because we're getting messages from people all over the country, actually there's a lot of other parts of the world that are saying, hey, I've been looking for something like this. Right?
I mean, recovery, I'm not in recovery. I just want to go out and have a good time without having to drink. And that's what we're doing, we're creating, you know, that fun environment where just this past Sunday, we had the I-Party-Sober games where we had, you know, different athletic games for people to go out and have fun, you know, and compete against each other. And at the end, instead of everybody, you know, we had, you know, different drinks or mock, mock, mock, mocktails.
What would you make of this CBD explosion? What do you make of this new industry? So bring this up now because I saw an ad yesterday on Instagram of a beverage that was CBD-based saying, uh, alter your consciousness, have a great time to feel at ease and stress free, but no hangover. Right.
So that's it. I, I am not a doctor like I said, I don't know the claims behind it. So I will say this CBD is different than THC, right? So THC gets high CBD is like, you know, anything else that can potentially help heal you.
So I'm a proponent of anything that can heal you. That's not going to alter your consciousness and not addictive. So if you're able to take something, right, CBD supposedly, again, is safe as time went off, right? So if you're able to take something that's not going to hurt your liver, that's going to make you feel better.
That's not going to alter your state of consciousness. I'm all for it. If you get to the other side of it where, you know, you're going to have, um, you know, THC on every corner, I think you're going to have challenges with that. Understood and believe you completely understood.
Yeah. I think there's a whole big, uh, that's where we're at. It's behind that door. That's going to be the biggest.
Well, when you follow the money, yeah. And when it takes you there, Andrew, Salsen, co-founder, recovery on blog to congratulations on a saving lives, changing the fortunes of families and individuals forever and also being successful in business, but in that order. Yes. And I'm going to come back to it in that order because there's a greater purpose in mission to our missions as they want has been our clients come first, our clients come second, our clients come third and God willing, we get profit too.
Amen. Good on you. Thank you. Andrew, appreciate your being here.
We're covering our plug. The website is www.recoveryumplug.com Oh, really? Great job. So happy you're here.
Incredible. Davey as we wrap up another episode. We always ask to ask you to tell us to tell us some goods. What do we do that?
Because we wrap up number seven. A couple of good things first. I was great to catch up with you, man. That was really great to hear.
What's good? I had spent Saturday with four generations. I had all of the Noodleburgs at the camping world. Stand down to Grandson.
Stand down to Grandson, which if that don't tingle your toes, nothing does. I don't know on the Miami side, but it was a big Gator W, so we're happy. And that is certainly something good. Congratulations on that.
That's the work that Andrew does is to see two with it. There could be four generations there. That's exactly right. That's the difference.
Exactly correct. That's something held all the ties together. Why don't we try for 78? Just do another one of those.
Let's do another one of those. Steve Noodleburg, Josh, go and say thank you for listening. We will catch you next time on the Confessions of a Serial Salesman, the podcast. Hold on everybody.