Please and gentlemen boys and girls of all ages. It's redgate DBA. Oh yay with me the incomparable Chris and me the very very comparable Chris that's right and welcome back to redgates podcast DBL the podcast is Mr. Trick Bay You should have done boys and girls Chris's of all ages or something like that That would have been clever, but fortunately I am not so if only we were only like 30 seconds in and could restart Yes, well, you know the wonders of technology and all that in any case That's right everyone welcome back to reggate DBA.
Oh the podcast that is all about our favorite things don't say it That's right beer and database development and press we're not doing this again now This month we actually have a special event for you. Oh The most excited I've ever seen you like surprises well, it seems like a while since we've versus we've actually been back on air is it? Well, yeah, it's been a while I think the month was Miss June but we kind of combined June and July into what we're calling to be fair I think we don't need multiple months in a year that begin with Jay then you and then have two other letters Yes, it is rather self-serving, isn't it? I mean, let's just combine them together and call it June lie.
Yeah, perfect Well, we're calling this episode the bang bust in super summer Sun special anniversary Chris edition There was literally one day of Sunday in the UK and now it's summer. Yes, but that was Friday And that's when we had our company day out and it was glorious. It was glorious Yeah, it's quite nice to spend some time with people other than you And also you and your wonderful lovely wife now Actually, the title for this one is fully stacked and the reason for that is because we're going to be talking about a full stack development So as always we'll be talking about the beer that we have we'll be talking about what we've achieved in the last kind of years worth of Congratulations, congratulations, you've been listening to DBL for a year. What are you even doing?
And then we'll be talking about our theme which of course is full stack development and then of course we'll be moving on to the new Beautiful so Chris you were going to be in charge of getting us the beer this time, weren't you? Yeah, and like all good Entrepreneurs, I outsourced that to someone else you outsourced it to whom I believe it was our lovely lovely Producer Louise there is no one love. Yeah, there is no one lovely and you haven't even had a drink yet I haven't even had a drink yet. This is just how I am on a date of the week any day of the week all the days of the week and the Weeknd okay fantastic Well, obviously lovely lovely producer Louise has actually away for a little bit She went to data grilling in Germany if you haven't heard about data grilling then definitely Google it because it is one of the best events in the LDR dl dg Go on then I was asking for one.
Oh, it's basically a conference for people to get together and drink beer and Do barbecuing and talk about data. I like all those things. Yes, and it's in Germany and we all very much like that place Yes, especially red gate. Yeah, absolutely And the good thing is is that she came back and she brought one of my absolute favorite beers And that's what we've got here it is the one we've got here So I'm going to remove the sticker I put on it so that the thirsty developers here at red gate didn't drink it that says for DBA no touchy And record none of our developers have ever stolen one of our beers.
No, but that's because I always put a label on it saying no touchy Always always I'm pretty sure they wouldn't just take random beers from the fridge. That's also true We do employ some wonderful people so also not everyone else in the office has a pension for drinking beer 11 a.m. On a Tuesday Okay, if you say so it's actually three o'clock on Wednesday. Yeah, it's five o'clock in South Africa Romania Yeah, just a two hours ahead one hour Well, it's all right then it's five o'clock in Romania, so drinking time.
I find it really suspicious that you pick Romania Why because you always pick Romania? Yes, of course. I'll always pick Romania the only other language I know in any kind of proficiency other than German and English well debateable anyway, we're getting off topic as we always do and actually the beer that we're gonna be drinking today is called Cush it's it's gaffle cush and cush for anyone who doesn't know is a beer that is brewed in beautiful cologne in Germany And it's their very own special beer normally It's served in very very tiny measures tiny little glasses and the reason for that is so that it doesn't get too warm too quickly So you get it it's nice and cold you take a take a drink You get through it quite quickly wait it comes over replaces your glass with a new glass and then just keeps score on your beer Matt the idea is that you can do a hundred of them in a hundred minutes a Centurion is that supposed to be shots of beer? Yes, okay very big shots I want to do a hundred couches in a hundred minutes.
So we don't have a small glass We've got a very big can and a very big glass. Yes, so it's a big five Yeah, five hundred millilitre or 17.5 fluid ounces UK or 16.9 fluid ounces US and it's very Centrelita's Chris 50 what's that in millilitre's Chris 5000? What's that in? Leated what wait no, yes, where did you learn that anyway?
Okay? Oh, no, it's five hundred minutes No, I'll consume as at this point in time dear anyway What we're gonna be doing is having some of the course now interesting tidbit of information You can't call it cool really unless it comes from Cologne or cool and it's like champagne thing Yeah, so that just up the road from cologne is Bon and Bon have their own style of cools as well called bullsh No, it's called bunch. Yeah, yeah, I've had some it's not as good as coach Tell me if I'm wrong tweet me at Reggie underscore Chris tell me which you prefer But I am a big fan of course whether it's gaffle coach whether it's fruit coach I really don't mind as long as it's beer. I mean coach and really do tell Chris when he's wrong It's my favorite thing to do I mean I don't get time for anything else in the day because it's normally just you Hoping on about where I'm wrong, but let's go ahead and open these up and get them poured so ready ready Yeah, you're not gonna close the microphone.
Oh, there we go Amazing hope everyone's ears drums just shattered as well. I'm a poor mind just on the end of smells so good Yes Beautiful it smells just like the couple of nights I spent in cologne this year, which I cannot remember Fantastic just such a good longer just fantastic cheers. I may have Don't strain now fantastic. Yeah, can't go wrong with a good cush I'm gonna put way too much in there.
We have I don't mind if it goes warm. It's very cold in here. Yeah I mean we're in the UK it's Yes, certainly to any North Americans listening, you know, they'll be going well. There's nothing wrong The Brits like a nice warm beer anyway, so but no it's not gonna be around long enough if I'm honest It's very nice fantastic.
Hello that one. So Chris obviously it has been Just over a year since we started doing DBA also. Thank you all to everyone who has been listening Thank you to any new listeners urge you to go back and have a listen excuse the audio quality in the first episode I blame Chris. I also blame Chris But it's been it's been an interesting year Certainly we've talked about well, we've talked about pseudonymization and anonymization deidentification We've talked about source control how and why?
Database unit testing and test driven development. What else we talked about power shelling power shelling we had some wonderful insight from Messers fricki Ozar Jones a few other people Yes, little definitely Kendra has had a big impact on what we've been talking about as well Yeah, the infamous back-ed or begged is now no longer backed or back-ed No, that's true. Yes, indeed The lovely Rebecca here at regator has now changed her last name So we won't reveal it until she until she deems us worthy of doing so for now. Just know that we'll call her Beck Beck Even better.
So yes, we talked about quite a lot. We even have our own stickers. We've had some beer mats Beer mats is the best. Yeah, absolutely some nice DBL beer mats If you want a DBL beer mat, let us know again tweet us at redg underscore Chris or at Kurzwell Chris.
I'm gonna be honest. I don't use mine So tweet me and I'll pick out a few lucky people and no matter where you live. I will send you a DBL beer mat I'm gonna pretend to be Santa Claus and try and get one off you. I mean you've already got one What do you mean?
He's already got one. I already have one. That's true. Oh I'm all just meant I want to get you to post things to Father Christmas.
Oh like letters to me. Yeah, okay, that makes sense Um, but of course there were also some there were some lows of course, you know occasionally Tommy had to sit and listen to you go through an entire song about the Big Bang deployment before Christmas That was actually a poem and it was very well received. I'll have you know or our scary special or the one where I bought cider instead of beer Yeah, that's true. That was rather harrowing.
That's a good point actually. What's been your favorite beer we had? I don't I really liked the einstock. Yeah I was a big big fan of the einstock.
That was a really good one the froth as well that we had Thank you again to Robert good friend of the show the trooper that we didn't have the trooper that we never had the Sierra As well on Doug's recommendation that was fantastic. Thank you again, Doug So yeah, it's been it's been a really good year and you know here's to a continuing year now Obviously we did pull some statistics as well We don't want to kind of big ourselves up too much, but our podcast did chart briefly in a couple of a couple of places You may have heard us so for a time where were we Chris? For a time where were we? Well originally or now?
Well, I mean the first time we should be Something low in Bolivia. Yes, we were podcast number 140 50ish in Bolivia for a while, which yeah, sorry Technology podcast in Bolivia. Yeah, we also are currently a hundred and twenty 125 and Mauritius 125 out of technology podcast pretty consistent in Mauritius as well actually over the last few months or so So whoever is listening out there in Mauritius. Thank you.
I assume it's only one person No, not at all. I mean that is quite a few technology podcasts to get through So if you are listening then please do give us a shout out on Twitter or send us an email or you know anything at all It's an absolute pleasure to have everyone listening. We have dropped a place sadly in Mauritius and we're no longer in the charts for Bolivia But you never know there's always time I blame you. I blame me too.
Yeah, or maybe it was my poem. Maybe you're right there It was the poem that dropped us off the charts. So yeah, it's been a bumpy year. It's been fun and long may continue Yeah, absolutely and very informative as well actually doing some of the the research behind it and hopefully it's been interesting for you guys as well Again, I'm gonna harp on about this is the last time I'm gonna say this I promise but tweet us your favorite moment from the past year of dba I think you're trying to have four calls to action a crass Which is all of them record all of them are the same calls to action just in the same tweet just tweet doesn't say Oh, this was my favorite part of dbl and um hello.
I'm listening from this place join us in a year's time We'll just be an hour of Chris repeating over and over again tweet me tweet me tweet me tweet me tweet me tweet me Oh dear. He just likes the attention me more attention never always always So I think it's probably time then that we moved on to the fee. No, that doesn't really work So today's theme is is going to be the rise of the full stack developer people who cover uh front end back end everything in between the whole shebang as it were how do you define a full stack dev? I don't know if you can define a full stack dev but certainly I would argue that there's someone with fingers in every pie I don't know.
So I've read a definition. Okay. The full stack dev is simply someone who has fingers in two pies Not necessarily all the pies. I suppose if you have fingers in every pie it makes you more of an architect doesn't it?
Yeah Hmm or just someone who knows a little bit about everything and not a lot about anything about me. Yeah, oh Anyway, Chris how how then would you actually define? How would you fully fully define a full stack developer? How far through the beer is Chris?
Oh, come on Two thirds Third of the way through I have two thirds remaining to me a full stack dev is someone who operates in multiple spheres I want to say say every sphere So for example if you are coding in two different languages that doesn't make you a full stack dev because they are the same sphere if you are operating in say a front-end language and then Infrastructure as code playing with that a bit then I say you're more of a full stack of code is working more full spheres And of course frequently the spheres that you're going to be operating in or one of them is going to be the day base Hence why we're talking about it. This is absolutely true Yeah, I mean we always talk about databases. That's the that's the point right is that we are in databases podcast supposedly Um, yeah is in the name. So I really certainly from my perspective.
It's been something that uh has only really kind of taken off I really only you know people have been describing themselves as full stack developers more recently than than a while back So when I kind of was at university say 2010 2011, uh, I didn't really ever hear the term full stack developer Kind of that often. I don't know if it's kind of been different for you. No, I think I agree Yeah, it was it's a fairly recent trend I'd say and maybe it has been around a little bit longer But definitely exploding popularity recently. Yeah, absolutely And the interesting thing about full stack development is having to try and I think back in the day they just called them developers Yeah, this is a fair point.
It's more of a fragmentation of the rest of the the market than it is a growing Personality type, but then maybe that's just me a bit with my old man hat You're really you're like two years older than me old man chris What does that make me on the verge of retirement? Okay, um Goring up pension back in back in my day We had sliced bread of multiple types What's your favorite type of sliced bread chris? That's a good question. I don't know quite like I can go to a bakery and get basically any type of bread sliced with that machine That's quite nice.
Always quite satisfying anyway false stack development So I really feel like um there was definitely a segregation between kind of the database team and for those who can't see me because none of you listening can see me because This is a podcast and not television. Thank goodness for that. Yeah, I am making air quotes and Fair's probably better than they can't see making air quotes because they're like little bunnies. Yeah, that is It's weird.
It's really weird Enough The thing is that people have kind of identified themselves and you know, it's always been a big thing You know, don't label yourself Don't put yourself in a category, but developers are quite keen to do that, right? And it's not just developers but also management. We are a insert technology here shop. We are a microsoft shop, right things like that And that manager is a seagull manager back on the thing Are you gonna eat?
No, don't use animals again, please So yeah, the funny thing is that you've had this kind of Separation almost between the DB the database Deployment development, etc, and the actual application development and deployment. Certainly until recently there was a certainly a good portion of people out there who were saying The database development is slowing us down. We you know, we have all these rigorous processes in place for the application without our app There's no here's a ticket to do x You know on I don't know we've suddenly added an extra form we need someone to store data Functionality and then oh, we've got to make a corresponding back-end change So what we do is we pass that over to the database team They make the corresponding change and then it all goes out the door together But the problem is is that actually waiting on that database change and actually getting it through the pipeline deployed to production and then Potentially rolled back as well rolling back a feature in an application is as easy as part. You just rescind the code Roll it back, but when it comes to database changes, it's not quite so simple So there was certainly a lot of disconnect a lot of fragmentation there Between the two different teams.
Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense I think that a lot of the guys who you'd label as full stack devs can get quite frustrated with the lack of options available especially You know, just if you're seeing what's out there for free Then It can be a challenge to incorporate the methodologies you're used to working with When it comes to the database as well. Yeah, I suppose if you are a C sharp or a Java developer or something like that And you come along and suddenly someone says block here's a database. You're going to be responsible for this as well Then you kind of go well brilliant. So I'm used to using things like Oh, I don't know resharp her and I've got everything set up.
You know being pushed into GitHub we're following a full get flow methodology. We've got a bunch of testing environments automated unit testing We've got all of these good practices continuous integration documentation building deployments, etc And then it comes with a database and they're like well You have to get the DBAs to write your scripts and it's like what this is true And then where's the script gets stored? It doesn't get stored. There's a folder No, we all write it on the stone tablet and and we all store it in the cellar underneath the building Yeah, all the ghosts are another I was going to quite a few people out there who Have worked in better environments where there is tool sets that more widely support them They then go to say a new company a new job get a nice new pay rise and then immediately they're like what what no I can't do my job because I have nothing Yes, it's like taking giving a builder the best tools in the world and saying build me a house And then you say I tell you what you did such a good job with that house What I'm going to do is now I want you to build me a two-story house and a basement But you're not allowed to use hammers or screwdrivers Yes, I totally know what you're talking about there.
Well because you know, we always bang on about Hey Hun definitely not intended but appreciate it But the funny thing is is that we always bang on about devops and we talk about it being this harmony of people and process and tooling Yep, and regardless of what kind of tooling you're using, you know, we've spoken about things like dba tools power shell obviously a fantastic tool for any dba or developer really to have To hand especially if they're doing things like migrations But even if it just comes down to you know writing queries when it actually comes to writing things like t-sequel It can be really long. There's a lot of stuff that goes into it And yes, you know that the builder is still going to build you a house and a seller and all these sorts of things and brilliant But actually are they going to do it as fast as they could If they had the right process and tools in place as well to help them Yeah, and then you finally get your changes out of the development environment. You're ready to push them down to your production environment and how do you do it? Well dba's take the script and run the script Yeah, and the thing is it's a drain on dba time as well Yeah, because they're actually then effectively responsible for this entire process now Just to kind of pull it back a bit Again, you've got to kind of get yourself into the mindset full stack developers And there are some who potentially starting a brand new project from scratch and one of the big things about putting stuff in place for projects is that you kind of It's not following the waterfall model, but it is definitely getting together and saying right What are we going to need for this project?
And everyone always says to say well, we're going to need to reach out the licenses. We're going to need some Licenses for whatever ID we're using maybe we need visual studio enterprise and we're going to use this and this and you go spec it out and you say fantastic But the problem is is that if you don't have the right process in place for both things You know the point of having a false act developer is that you have developers who are able to enforce change on Everything within that project and deliver value quickly because they're knowledgeable about you know the general stack that you're using You know, I might make a change to my application code and then just hop across make the corresponding change to the database That's good. That's good process keeps us fast But then if we don't have the right process and tools to be able to speed up the process of getting changes from dev to production Then it becomes misaligned and you end up with this huge gap between application and database. Yeah, modern development in General, I think is all about being reactive It's how fast can you react how quick can you respond to requirements whether coming from your customers from support teams from Maybe just from the businesses a whole.
This is where we want to go how fast can you pivot around certain areas and The old waterfall model Interesting you brought that up Definitely the old way of working interesting anecdote there actually one of the companies I used to work on as a big project called glacier They called it that because it was it came from at least Guys who are used to working with waterfall trying to implement agile and ending up with glacier Something that's slowly crept backwards Oh dear. Yeah, so we've kind of moved from the the old waterfall model to this agile model But the database doesn't really work like that No, this is true and actually applying things like agile development practices to the databases again, I'm just not gonna work Yeah, exactly. It's another thing that's completely misaligned So something I say so many times is that databases are just fundamentally not agile objects They take a long time to spin up You have to handle them very clearly when you do and it's very hard to take or incorporate them into new processes And so that as a result means that you can't really be hugely reactive with the database Like if I was to say to you, oh quick Chris make this database change and everything's like Okay, give me a week to get the database environment ready Then I'll make my changes and I don't really know that bases that well So I'll take maybe a couple weeks to do that And they'll do me about a week to actually get that change out into my testing environment They're like the production environment is plus I've got to wait two three weeks to make sure that my testing environment gets refreshed Because I need to make sure it looks like production But you know, I've got a lot of functional testing to do and I want to hook it up to a test copy of the application and Also, we've got these old masking scripts that take a week to run because we're dealing with a monolithic 20 terabyte database Show of hands who's dealing with ridiculously large and super old database Just like 500 hands in the air right now right now in this tiny room exactly so days I definitely remember I gave a talk at ipx bow last year humble back. I mean, yeah, there's like 30 people in the room So it's pretty cool 13 It was definitely 30 I remember because the previous day I'd given a talk and there was 45 and then clearly people had kind of cottoned on and was I'm not gonna say the second one because this guy has no idea what he's on about.
Yes, so regardless never mind Yes, I give a talk and I asked you know who here has ever had to stay up late overnight either to troubleshoot a problematic database deployment Or to have to roll back a database deployment and you know probably 90 percent of the audience Hands straight in the air. So hopefully you listening wherever you're listening Maybe in the car maybe on the bus on the train wherever you listen to DBA Good for you first off, but second of all, hopefully you just raised your arm in the air But fortunately it doesn't have to be like that and we've been seeing this kind of these agile methodologies creep in the adoption of Better mindsets better processes better tooling both on the free and paid side So regardless of what tooling stack you're using actually just having the right process in place as well means that we're seeing a lot more alignment between At dev and database development as well Yeah, absolutely and there's some really cool stuff that you can do these days to try and make database more agile So for example, we do something very cool with virtualization But I think it's amazing and everyone in the world should check out whether or not they develop on databases Or if they develop at all or if they even know what day spaces yes, if they don't know what day spaces they definitely try this out So I actually I have shown it to my wife before But yeah, no she was like oh, you know, I kind of get databases, but actually this is really cool I can see how it would say people a lot of time effort. Anyway, sorry the thing we're alluding to in any case is called SQL provision Which is definitely worth a look at in any case There are a lot of ways that we can unblock not weep but in general full stack developers can unblock database Problems effectively creeping into that pipeline because the ideal the thing that people want to achieve is quite rightly as you said It's our business objectives right our busy top level business objectives something that is being set by the board that's being communicated down through An enterprise architecture team by the IT director IT manager development manager all these sorts of people who are involved in these decisions They're saying categorically we have to move faster. We have to retain our competitive edge We have to make sure that we're spending less time down that we're meeting customer requirements that we're Iterating fast all these things are lying without our methodologies be more reactive get your stuff out there quickly reduce the feedback cycle wherever you find a feedback cycle Oh absolutely and feedback loops are so important actually being able to just get feedback from users internally through testing colleagues colleagues exactly all of these sorts of things So so important and that's how you can really kind of bring the harmony because even if you start getting down to a very kind of technical Domain level and you start saying well the ideal for me is that I make a change to my application And then make the corresponding change to my database and then what I do is I have them both linked to a particular branch a bug fix or Like a feature branch for instance And then depending on obviously what methodology you're using you know merging that back in making sure that those branches are Yeah, what no more than a couple of days old actually sticking to best practice branches are very very short-lived and constantly merged back in So that there's fewer chances of merge conflicts making sure that the master branch is always buildable and always deployable For both sides of the coin both app and database carrying out that build and then constant deployment constant feedback testing building documenting And then it just means that everything stays super small everything stays super iterative and we just move things up through the pipeline quite nicely Sounds good keep it small keep it like keep it easy and You've just started a wrap career keep it like keep it easy Oh cool and my rapper name is backpack pain Backpack pain backpack.
Oh, well, I mean either's applicable because both the fun to work with Um, what was I gonna say? I was gonna say something you clicked your finger as if you were gonna say something. Oh, yeah, daddy old Cool. Uh, I can't remember Chris.
Have I just taken the thought from your brain? Yeah, I would be such a good rapper Anyway, anyway, I did do a I did do a version of gangsters paradise, but I did it about uh compliance I'm not gonna do it now but maybe we should say that every time we get to kind of uh christmas or you know, whatever you're celebrating in in December, maybe we could do the the addition of dbl where I You know, I wrap along to a song so you're allowed to look forward to I distinctly think that this is one of those ideas that I would have shot down if it had happened About half an hour ago, but now kind of car for beer in kind of good with it But that doesn't lead us on actually to talking Talking about something else that people have to worry about kind of on the the database development side when you're not just an application developer When you're kind of you have that mindset of everything Something you've got to worry about you didn't have to worry about before is of course compliance Your favorite topic. Yes, okay I do talk about compliance a lot and actually spoilers this was gonna be in the news But I'm very very pleased to uh to announce it at this point as well Go on you look like you're in anticipation there. Yeah, but fortunately, uh, I did submit a session to pass summit in seattle for 2019 On how to get started with data masking are you what steps you need to take before actually doing the masking stuff And it was accepted.
So I will be presenting at past summit 2019 in november, so yes, I do care a lot about compliance and in fact I will be banging on about it So much in the next couple of months hashtag on the break hashtag Humblebrack boom anyway. Yes. So mic drop moment. Hang on.
Oh, oh This is a good point. It's not even ours. Um in that case. Yes, so compliance is another one And whilst it feels like it gets shoehorned into every conversation by you By everyone talking about everything mainly you But you still have things like um, you know gpr and nist and hipper and Poppy and piper and piper.
Um, the new regulations in brazil and india and china No, no, no, so again, we're coming back to this idea that the database is not an agile object and compliance is one of those reasons Yes, you know, you can't just spin up copy the database if that copy the database has a load of personal information Yes, exactly a really bad idea. In fact, it was one of the criticisms Yep, maybe bits of feedback. We got would be the better way putting it when we made the the cloning technology Oh, you can spin up databases really quick, but that's actually really irresponsible because you basically just given everyone the ability to go You get a production database and you get a production database take all this sensitive information and create more silos of it really quickly and easily And then we were like, oh, yeah, so that's not great. That's that's that's something to think about So that's why we we kind of approached this whole data masking angle, right?
Yes indeed and why my career ended up taking a turn into Data masking hashtag humble brag It's all he talks about it is all the time. Hey christmas for like half an hour like 24 seven I really wish we like didn't sleep in the same bed because it would make it so much Hang on. Sorry, I'll track anyway Yeah, so the thing is when you start thinking about the processes that you want to combine these all together It's very easy to go. Well, okay, I'm gonna set this all up so that I have a For argument's sake.
We always talk about the the Microsoft stack So let's actually stick with the Microsoft stack. So say for instance, we're using as your devops, okay? Now it's kind of very straightforward regardless of what technology you're using to get your database objects into source control And you you can be using the state based all the migrations based way of doing that is entirely up to you I don't really mind we've covered that we have covered that exactly the bumper busting super-summer special christ edition. Yeah Um and effectively regardless of how you're doing that it goes into the repo.
Yeah, then again with the geodemops We have a pipeline that carries out sorry. Sorry blue ice the cult don't fear Don't fear the repo So we have a build and we do the deployment and what we want is for those to be triggered at the same time and obviously deployed through further environments So top tip really is actually make sure that you're creating this harmony between the various different parts of your process Actually build it into the scope from the beginning What are we going to need to move fast to meet our business objectives for all of the technologies that we're using? Don't leave the database out remember we're full stack. So what does it mean to be agile across that full stack?
You're gonna say it aren't you? I know you want to know you can say it no It's your catchphrase that you use all the time What by designer by default? That's the one Yeah, build it build it build the process in by designer by default whether it's compliance whether it's source control whether it's standardized coding whether it's Building documenting testing Repeatable reliable deployments build it in from the beginning and see the benefit keep things small and incremental don't let compliance be a blocker Don't know compliance be a blocker. Yes.
Exactly. Anyway, any who any who I think that's enough about Any when any why oh Full stack devs something that is interesting to talk about and that's why yes, exactly We had a bunch of different topics for this session and we just kind of set along this one because I just enjoy kind of talking about it Yep, so sorry for the last half hour of babble, but there you go Babblefish one next Oh, come on Chris surely you have all people know what's next the new Do I try that again without like a frog in your throat? I have a frog in my throat Chris has drunk a lot of beer. I have yep It's not that strong It is quite strong.
It's it's only 4.8 percent. That's pretty strong strong Okay, so the news what we've got in the news today Well, this week has been a very interesting week for the iCO Really? Oh, well Chris to regalus. Well frequent listeners Actually, this is really nice that this came up this week because we're doing that whole like one year anniversary thing You mean the bang busting super some special anniversary Two things that we talked about quite a lot in terms of date breaches two big stories one was the ba day day breach which is pretty big Pretty sure we covered that some point.
We must have done Yeah, pretty sure because it was website skimming was yeah, exactly and then the one that we've also covered quite a lot has been the Sheraton data breach the Marriott breach. Yeah, yep, exactly or starwood hotels. Yes as I believe I know So those two data breaches have now been issued while the breaches haven't been issued fines The companies involved have been issued fines by the iCO this week, which yeah was a very good timing I mean, they're still contesting them so it's not they have to actually pay them just yet But we're probably going to see whether the GD power is going to have a you know The good approach is going to have teeth based on the final rulings on these two on these two big cases So very interesting for those who have been following and who have seen those stories either from us or anyone else around but ba charged Once I can let me share my notes 183 million pounds by the iCl and uk seamless gosh and starwood charged 99 Only Right, but still yeah, that's just 300 million pounds in one week. That's uh, that's a that's quite a lot Yeah, it's a bit a bit much isn't it?
So yeah, that's that's this week for data breaches I mean, it's not even like the data breach happened recently, but the fact that we're now starting to see some fangs That's the interesting thing. Yep. Yep. We'll see of course what the final settlement is.
Yeah I'm not gonna try and protect it. I'm gonna be interested to see i'm really interested in kind of how This is all dealt with because that's just the iCO, right? Yeah, the iCO is the British Yes, so the GDPR right there. Yeah, just a British commission the British representative question I don't know if there'll be other funds leveraged in other European countries.
That's what i'm thinking also you Something that we have spoken about before is um, of course the you have the the the fines that come come down and That is one financial impact another financial impact is going to be the loss of face How tangible that is, you know, I'd never really like that a bit to wish you'd already put a figure on but some people will I mean, they they did put a figure on it with false wagon had the emissions scandal. Oh, yeah That means they were there to find which barely touched the bottom line, but the sales the actual sales fell by what? 55% generally though with the the kind of base breach fines I don't think you're gonna see much long-term impact when it comes to things like share price But importantly when you have say class action lawsuits For example, starwood. I know has one class action lawsuit against it based on this at least one And those costs can often match if not dwarf the initial fine as well Just in paying private individuals.
So yeah, as much as bigger number as the 300 million is I suspect that that won't be the final sum Even if it is actually agreed out as Agreed. Um, what else we got on the newscraps? So sequel server 2008 one of the most reliable most widely used most well persevered with Types of sequel server. Yeah, the Chris is mum equivalent of sequel server.
Exactly. It makes an appearance everywhere. Yeah waving and happy and everybody loves it But the problem is in end of life Yesterday yesterday. Yeah, wow Yes, today is the 10th of July and yesterday sequel server 2008 2008 auto went end of life So times yeah, so that happens.
That was the end of extended support. I believe I think you can still get some extra weird Grandfathering support deals if you agree with Microsoft to let them run as a management since is your Oh, that's interesting. That's a thing So that's something some people are doing to kind of get around that. That's very interesting I mean the thing is it's just the funny thing about 2008 or two is that it finds itself in lots of places.
Yeah, and a lot of people don't know That they have 2008 or two until they put together some kind of You know like a dash of all of the information. So this is something that was was pulled out in our State of sequel server monitoring reports every every year red gate runs the state of sequel server monitoring report just like our state of database dev ops report And that has just literally very recently come out so That should have been its own news item I mean, I think it is kind of its own news item Um in that if you want to obviously go and download that then you can go to the red gate website or just google state of sequel server monitoring report 2019 And hopefully the red gate link will or use whatever search engine of preference you'd like to use wait What did I say you said google? I mean any plenty of other search engines of choice any search engine that you prefer you can use I love it in Microsoft conferences when they say that phrase Use the search engine of your choice to find this bit of information what they mean is big The search engine of your choice press yes, it could be any of the The ones of search engines you use on a daily basis. Well, yeah, who yeah I like that go seriously that goes great But in that sense don't bring the state of sequel server monitoring report 2019 because there's some really interesting facts In there about how estates are growing how estates are changing how people are challenging kind of migrations to the cloud Certainly I know there's a few people out there who are you know migrating heavily to the cloud at the moment So it's one of the key challenges that people are facing at the moment.
I'll talk about it right now fantastic But obviously with sequel server 2008 end of life It's one of those things that people have to be prepared for and you know people have kind of gotten to this point where they've gone Oh, oopsie. We've found some old instances best figure out how they are used around the business Oh, look, they've got all of these wonderful dependencies over here This is going to be a bigger job than we thought it was going to be. Can we get this vendor to get them a day based upgrade in place? What do you mean they've got our business?
Oh, what do you mean? We really need this app? Ooh Yeah, so lots of questions that need to be asked but in case you didn't know that happened. So that's quite big news Um, ask Jeeves it if you need to know more Ask Jeeves.
Yeah, isn't that is ask.com still a thing? I'm looking. I'm definitely looking anyway. I think that's about all your time I'm looking but can you type ask ask in ask.com?
Yes, okay Anyway, there is one final news article before we leave you and that another one yes I know and that is the fact that the list of extraordinary redgate podcasts now no longer only contains the pure gold of dba Actually redgate started offering another podcast as well all about the life of product designers and developers here at redgate software It's called the ingeniously simple podcast. You're ingeniously simple. Thank you And it's available on Spotify and iTunes exactly all the sorts of places that you're listening to us for instance You can go and have a listen to the ingeniously simple podcast. They've had two episodes out so far Certainly go and have a listen because there is the most fantastic voice that you will that you'll ever hear in your life on one of those podcasts gentlemen by the name of Jamie Davidson got fantastic voice So go ahead and are you are you googling different search engines?
No? Yeah, did twitter just come up as a search. Yeah, I don't know what website I used sure Chris. I'll be sure to CC search it right now Fantastic.
So go ahead and listen to the ingeniously simple podcast Certainly the episode breaking into the industry and certainly as far as software development's concerned I think is a real page turner but in podcasts speak and I don't really know what the equivalent is in any case I think it's really relevant as well to talking about things like full stack developers So definitely go and have a listen. I think it's a really good a really good thing to keep you occupied Obviously listen to dbl first. That's how it works Yeah, but yeah, check out the ingeniously simple podcast make sure to tweet us as well some of your favorite moments from dba on the past year That's at red G underscore Chris number we are five six plus count and of course Be sure to check out that state of SQL Server monitoring report 2019 on the redgate website You can find it just by putting into yandex and searching through that. What the heck it anyway in any case Thank you so much for your time.
Thank you so much for a wonderful year. Hopefully we continue to You know provide you with some kind of entertaining christmas and we look forward to another year of dba else. So Chris. Cheers