DZ-121: Escalating Antagonism in SINNERS

Listen to strengthen your story by focusing on the antagonistic forces in your script. We often struggle to develop the middle stages of a story. Could this be because we focus on our protagonists’ journeys and plot structure more than on how the antagonistic powers are awakened, wronged, discovered, gathering strength and revealing themselves? In this episode, Chas and Stu are joined by professional screenwriter and playwright Kim Ho to explore how a generative story cycle (from tabletop role-playing game MOTHERSHIP) can be used to develop stories, not just write them better. This cycle is TOMBS: Transgression – Omens – Manifestation – Banishment – Slumber. Kim also contrasts this cycle with the Onset, Discovery, Confirmation, Confrontation cycle identified by horror philosopher Noel Carroll, as well as the philosophy of the FINAL DESTINATION franchise as analysed by The Morbid Zoo. By applying the TOMBS cycle to Ryan Coogler’s amazing 2025 original feature SINNERS, we discover how focusing on the rising power of the various sources of antagonism can generate narrative fuel (and make your second Act sing); force your protagonists to Survive, Solve or Save (pick one); and how this escalation in antagonism can be mapped quite separately from your protagonists’ character arcs. To prove that TOMBS does not just work for horror stories, we polled our patreons for which other genres to explore. Stay turned for the next episode (DZ-122) where we apply the TOMBS cycle to thriller REBEL RIDGE and comedy classic MEET THE PARENTS. As always: SPOILERS ABOUND and all copyright material used under fair use for educational purposes. LIKE THIS EPISODE? Discuss with our Patrons on Patreon. Watch and comment on YouTube. Send us feedback. Thanks to our Patrons, especially Lily, Paulo, Alexandre, Malay, Jennifer, Thomas, Randy, Jesse, Sandra, Theis and Khrob. → Read the transcript for this episode. ——— "when you use those structures that are out there, they tend to be around plot and they tend to think primarily from the protagonist's point of view. And using this system, we can actually look at the forces of antagonism in a story." — Chas Fisher @ 00:06:31 ——— CHAPTERS 00:00:00 – Cold open 00:00:18 – What is T.O.M.B.S? 00:06:31 – › How TOMBS shifts focus to antagonistic forces 00:15:22 – › Reading the five stages of the TOMBS cycle 00:24:12 – › Transgression as thematic and social boundary violation 00:31:04 – SINNERS 00:36:01 – › Delayed horror manifestation and the TOMBS framework 00:45:31 – › Mapping transgression and omens across dual antagonists 00:57:48 – › Confirmation, confrontation, and the stages of horror 01:08:09 – › Survive, solve, save as competing character objectives 01:17:51 – Key Learnings & Wrap Up 01:23:51 – Thank you patreons! FILMS SINNERS (2025) — (w) Ryan Coogler SCRIPTS Study the script: SINNERS (2025) — Ryan Coogler LINKS IMDB: Kim Ho Explore: Mothership YouTube: The Philosophy of Final Destination by the Morbid Zoo Read: The Philosophy of Horror by Noel Carroll EPISODES IN THE ESCALATING ANTAGONISM SERIES DZ-121: Escalating Antagonism in SINNERS DZ-122: Escalating Antagonism Across Genres RELATED EPISODES DZ-49: Antagonists! 1 - vs Humans ——— More Draft Zero is brought to you by our awesome Patreons. If you enjoy the show, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts, a rating on Spotify, or a review on Podchaser. We are @stuwillis, @mehlsbells and @chasffisher on Twitter. You can find @draft_zero and @_shotzero on Instagram and Twitter. Full show notes at: https://draft-zero.com/2025/dz-121/