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Alright, let's get on with the show now. Waiting down upon the underworld to smash gang men, come a friend of the unfortunate enemy of criminal. In a serious, powerful character, a problem to the police, but a crusade of a law. Hello everybody and welcome to the L-Swirls Exchange, I'm Sal.
And I'm Joel. Welcome to the comic show where we talk about books or stories or arcs. We just take a topic for about an hour, hash it out, chat about it, and share our thoughts and feelings and opinions and insights with you guys out there. Before we jump into the topic, which is the most OP comic characters out there, those characters are so overpowered that it's almost impossible to tell stories about them.
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If Walmart can do it, we can do it. Then go. So before we jump into our list of some of our characters we want to talk about, yes, the one above all, the living tribunal eternity, like characters that are enduring everlasting or God himself, they're the most OP characters. With good reason, by the way, they're either God or they're made or imbued with the power of God, the specter, for example, an agent to God.
We get the fan of stranger. We don't even know why he's OP. We just know that he is. That's several origins trying to explain what the fuck his deal is.
Lucifer, Mephisto, more or less, even though it ranges from character to character, version to version of Mephisto. We're going to talk about some characters, some fun characters, characters that are OP. We were like, why did they do that with that character? What is the deal?
How do you defeat that character? I'm not going to talk about God. We're not going to be like, okay, you know, it's OP, Jesus Christ. We're not going to get into that.
Jesus is way OP man. They need to nerf from in the next update. Although that could be an episode in and of itself talking about the pantheon of comic gods. Right, yes, yes.
That we would call it chariot of the gods, something like that. Will I am going to be jumping into the same thing as OP? Is that that one punch man guy? I assume.
I don't know. I don't know. Yeah, anime is either. But if it is, yeah, it's in the name.
One punch man. If you can beat one punch, that's it. Alejandro Madrid saying Tom King's Catwoman is OP as well. I don't want to spoil the books for you guys.
So this book just dropped to what was the last week actually was the mystery. It was when Catwoman and the Joker battled and the result of which you can find out for yourself. Punching out flashes beating Taliawagul and sword fights. Yeah, that's right.
Selena now suddenly is a master swordsman and can defeat the daughter of the demons head. And I kept waiting for her to cheat and that. But you know, it's okay if she wins as long as she cheats. If she punches her in the kidney or throws sand in her eyes or does something.
Oh, no, she wins just straight up. Okay. So Catwoman is a low P. She never used to be.
She was just kind of skate by. She would just get away. She was clever. Her clever is what was her power.
But now, yeah, no, she just straight up. Her skills can pay the bills skills that she has no business having. No, silver click crickets saying do care just count if they are all too dumb to use their powers properly. Because electro if he was smarter than he would be a god.
It's true. Yeah. Same with absorbing man. Here's a dude who is too dumb to remember what things feel like so he can absorb them so he has to touch them every time.
If he could do all of that at once, he would be unto a god. It's true. But no, he's because he's so stupid. His weakness is his intelligence or his lack of imagination.
So he's he has an OP power. It's actually he's not OP because he doesn't use that power to defeat everybody every time. He's not like defeatable. He's actually quite defeatable.
Yes. Marvel Knight saying Hulk is an OP character. He certainly became one, didn't he? Like, yeah.
Because I think when people started jumping on the idea that the matter Hulk gets, the stronger Hulk gets, the fact that Hulk's strength is a seemingly bottomless pit of potential. He can lift mountains. He can defeat the entire Illuminati if he's mad enough. Yeah, he can withstand nuclear blasts.
And now he can't even die. Yes. And now he is the immortal Hulk fully completely. Yeah.
I think Hulk has gone. I think I think Hulk went OP a lot longer ago than we can possibly say. Which is like I don't have a problem with it near as much if the writers are willing to spend the extra time writing about how Banner feels about this because Hulk and Banner are a double act. It's true.
Another character that I think is OP because it makes the writer not be able to tell a story about them is Galactus. Yeah. Galactus is so OP in terms of okay. So it's planets, right?
That's that should be a problem into like onto itself. But there's also more to that. The dude also has the power cosmic. He's the one being in the universe.
He has this other sense of like, oh, you can do pretty much anything you need to be able to do. So you kind of need to cheat in order to defeat him. You need to either strike a deal with him or threaten to annihilate all the reality. Use the ultimate nullifier.
Exactly. So, but I like the way in which they have used him. He's one of the few characters that's OP where they didn't like write themselves in a corner immediately. Yeah.
And they're careful enough to not overuse him so that he becomes like stupid. Absolutely. I think Galactus works because his morality is so alien and so occasionally gray. It's like, yeah, I'm going to destroy your planet.
Not because I hate you or anything, but because I'm hungry is my deal. Right. I can't stop. Listen, more sympathetic.
I could not be. That's why I have a herald. He looks for these kinds of places. It's just that the places that have more life on them are tastier than the elemental force, the universe.
So like, you know, listen, I feel bad for you. And maybe, and if you're clever enough, I might let you go. Or if you like promise to be my herald or something, I'll also spare you. Like he does have a morality that allows him to be interesting while also being overpowered.
Absolutely. And I'm glad you mentioned his herald too. Silver Surfer, another instance of a character who has spent a ton of his career being incredibly overpowered mainly because the power cosmic is so wonderfully vague that it can do whatever the story needs to do. One of my favorite examples was when Hulk died at the end of Civil War II and Silver Surfer shows up at his funeral and there's an angry crowd and Silver Surfer is like, I calm you with the power cause.
Like, it can do that too. What? If that's the case, we're going to use you in maximum carnage when the York is bringing itself apart. Yeah, I've never seen him do that power.
But all right. You know, actually, that would be really handy for a person who has a herald of Galactus. Be like, everyone's freaking out. Show it out and allow yourselves to die.
Commvine tits. I am Silver. Lucky in saying all Scott and Jean's children are overpowered. Yeah, they are.
Completely clones and otherwise. Yeah. Will I am golden Dazzler team up with Black Bolt as OP? Oh, they'd be on unstoppable tag team.
Okay. So I've heard this this matchup before. Have we ever actually seen it in the comics? Yes, in X-Men versus in humans.
That's how the X-Men take out Black Bolt. They send Dazzler to his club and Black Bolt was just not ready for her to turn the sound of his boys against him. There you go. Okay.
It's the coolest thing she's ever done. Yeah. I mean, listen, like Dazzler could be a cool character. Anybody could be a cool character as long as you put a good creative team behind them.
But yeah, Dazzler and Black Bolt together. I agree. Gorgonfish, Starro and Parasite should be OP, but never really live up to the hype and stories. The Conqueror of Mine Galaxy is felt so weak and no justice.
I completely agree. There you go. Well, because again, to use a wrestling term, they needed to put over the Omega Titan, so they needed to kill him. They needed to get that win to really put him over.
Yeah, which really sucks by the way, because it's so artificial. Because like, no, we could, if you wanted to do a story where Starro gets new cosmic purpose. And they have to like appease him using cosmic trees or some kind of like, you know, elemental force the universe. And that's what gets, because Starro is overpowered.
Starro can make multiples of himself drop it on. He's defeated just like any Avengers. One of the few villains ever have actually done that. And he comes from one place not created by both companies to be OP.
But Starro, like you could have done that with Starro and just made him actually like an actual way to use him in the future. But now we need to artificially create our own celestials into these universes. Yeah. Then kill one but not the others.
I don't know if he's OP as much as he has the potential. He's like a lecturer. Like if Parasite grabs onto like, I don't know, Dark Side or Superman or something really, really powerful, then he becomes powerful by proxy. But that's more by proxy.
It's more like he needs to be by an OP person or to grab his own. His power is also fleeting too, is the thing. He can have it, but he'll eventually lose it. Yeah.
Silver Cricket, Silver Surfer with Sophie. His book had to become a romantic comedy for a writer to tell a story about him. That's also very true. And that's the other thing.
You can write about overpowered characters as much as you want, but you gotta do something clever with them. And that's the thing. As long as you have a really, really strong creative team behind the character, you can do pretty much anything with them as long as they have a cleverness about them. As long as they do something cool with them.
Somebody's OP characters, they created and they went, he was awesome and he can do anything. I was thinking of Exodus from X-Men. The freaking character who could defeat an Eternal who didn't have themselves or OP. There are so many X-Men characters who fall into that realm.
We invent them because we need to move the stick for power in this universe and what beyond Omega level mutants. I'm like, oh God, when Bendis was ending up there. He's like, okay, but there was also this super secret mutant you didn't know who so powerfully could end the world and like, Xavier erased everyone's memories of this guy, but now that he's dead, he's back and like Cyclops has to stop him and then you don't want to turn him and then we never see him again. Yeah, and as long as, but as long as it's executed properly and as long as you can defeat him, you have to create that character and come up with how to defeat them in basically the same pitch session.
Otherwise, you don't, otherwise you have Judas Traveler from the phone saugas who's just like, oh, I could fly and I'm intangible and I can reach your mind. Can I magic? Can I magic? Like he can do anything and then it turns out he's just full of shit the entire time.
Really? You know there weren't think of that. Ethan Miller saying the Joker and this is a character I wanted to put on my list as well. The Joker is pretty OP just by virtue of his popularity.
The Joker's OP based on his nature. The fact is you can't kill the Joker. He's the best Batman villain. The proof that popularity is the greatest superpower of all time and will forever allow you to cheat death.
Re Wolverine. Oh, yes, super. I mean, Wolverine, even without the popularity, you could argue, has become super overpowered. What would be, you know, near unstoppable healing factor.
Oh, the unstoppable healing factor that allowed him to regrow from a cell. If I go to hell and negotiate terms about what his healing factor can do. The fact that even when he dies, he's like hydrant himself, like four more will take his place. Alan Walker reminding us that Batman will always win as long as he has prep time.
I don't think that's a joke. It's a great trope. I don't think that's true. And I think that's because ultimately Batman is a person.
And so here's the thing. Batman met Bane before Nightfall. And he still had plenty of opportunity to come up with a way. Like, okay, remember when, okay, so Bane breaks Batman's back and Nightfall spoilers for both of those 25 minutes.
But Bane breaks Batman's back. You're like, okay, yeah, he's exhausted. He's tired. He's worked the bone.
I get it. Like that makes sense. Then, like very shortly thereafter, they bring Bane back in the cartoon show. Yes.
And it's his first time meeting him and he's just, and you know, they're not going to have like a back cracking parlouric paralysis move in a church cartoon. So Bane brings up the knee. He's ready to knock out Batman. And Batman just bust out one of his previously established gauntlet loading batarangs and cuts one of the many dangling tubes full of magic muscle juice.
I think you work on that. Right. Like, yeah, just cut the tube. I guess that's perfect.
Every time. So yeah, like Batman should have been able to defeat Bane and he had plenty of time to come up with a, to come up with a desperate move like, oh, I guess I'll just cut the tube. Even though he was exhausted, dude's brain still works. He still has these plans and thoughts.
Batman is OP. He's become OP over time. But I don't think he is an OP character. It's more than one of the players.
He shouldn't be even though lots of writers make him that way. Writers make him that way. But I think as long as we have enough times where Batman is defeated or loses or admits defeat or at least admits these fallible or human, we can kind of like turn the dial back on Batman. Which are often some of my favorite Batman stories when he does realize, oh damn, I'm in over my head on this one everybody.
I really talked to this one up. Oh, some of my favorite Batman stories like you are about Batman being a man. I was just thinking about that episode of Batman and Venom. Batman can't lift a rock.
And so this little girl dies and he turns to drugs because he's so beaten up about it. Kevin little. I've never really read any of her stories, but I keep hearing that Squirrel Girl is OP. Is that true?
Yes. But more for comedic effects. Yeah, it's more like a Doctor Who kind of joke. Like Squirrel Girl, just the name alone is so like objectively lame.
Like it's a silly idea. You know, it's like an admission that you're out of ideas. It's meant to make you laugh. It's a ha ha ha.
Right. Batman Spiderman Wonder Woman Squirrel Girl. Like there's a lot of squirrels because the idea is of course she has like the I think she has the strength of a squirrel. Like I know she has lots of different powers.
She can communicate with squirrels. She has sometimes she has big teeth that can cut through like really strong things. Other times not so much. But she has because she's such a joke.
Like such a like fourth wall breaking trope. They have made her OP in kind of a tongue in cheek kind of way. And I remember I was thinking about that dance lot book where she defeats I think it's Thanos and then the watcher shows up and he says like I can see with my watcher senses that this is no clone construct alternate reality version of Thanos. Squirrel Girl has defeated the ego the living planet has the highest level of intelligence and dexterity even though he's a freaking planet.
It's just a joke at your expense readers. She's also defeated like Galactus by saying hey man if you're hungry just eat nuts. The great protein. Right.
I don't think that I can imagine they're being a book and I'm surprised it happened in no surrender but I would imagine they're being a hilarious. soduel breaking moment and it's only if they wrote themselves on a corner where it's like a secret or it's just a joke. She's also defeated like Galactus by saying hey man if you're hungry just eat not the great protein. Right.
there being a book and I'm surprised it didn't happen to know surrender but like I would imagine there being a hilarious fourth wall breaking moment and it's only if they wrote themselves in a corner where it's like a secret wars level thing where you know Annihilus brought the Nylation Wave to Earth and it's gonna ruin everything oh no and then Spider-Man goes hey has the squirrel girl beaten everybody like over in front and then go like work your magic squirrel girl and you got it and then the Nylation Wave just tears her apart like that dude in the matrix. Oh no! Oh! Maker like Kenny you killed squirrel girl you bastard.
That's right future for squirrel girl by the way just keep killer now like she's like I can't die she thinks she's Gwenpool. Yeah but then she'll always come back and then you can have squirrel girl in hell. Oh my god yeah. Where she beats the devil.
It would actually be kind of like a Patsy Walker comic where it's just like yeah where's a squirrel girl like well she went to hell and she worked her way through it and then she's now she's here and you can literally just do a book or everyone's about you peeking on what squirrel girl's doing other books we're just telling you what's up with squirrel girl and it's just this if you collect it all together it's just this insane cosmic trip. She's in the microverse she's been everywhere. Exactly! South Sun reminding us of course the flash is pretty OP when you think about it yeah dude can move at Atos seconds.
Especially when Jeff Johns writes him and especially the Barry Burden who's so fast he basically becomes energy the other flashes they've tried to put like some blockers in there and some parameters to be like well you're good but you're not as good as this. Right let's screw over the Damien character by making him Nerf Wall-E and giving him a heart murmur. Right let's just just to say no he can't run nearly as fast as we said. Yep.
The Atos section by the way because I read one time he's like I can see things in Atos seconds. The time it takes for light to travel length of two hydrogen atoms. That's not even like physically his cells wouldn't be able to move fast enough for him to catch up to that kind of speed. But that being said yeah the flash is OP.
You can go back in time you can move solid objects you can manipulate the universe itself. Don't forget to he can become an expert in any field by reading up on it absorbing the information it will eventually leave him but he could do like brain surgery rocket surgery if he just read the book quick enough. Again like the Matrix he can basically just upload whatever he needs to do and the amount of time would take to transfer that information. I need to know how to hijack a helicopter like okay here we go done how many times are I going to need to remember that so I'll just keep it in return memory banks.
Just move that out of the way. I'm going to talk about the character of Death Franklin Richards and Gabriel Summers aka Volcker. The two most powerful mutants in Marvel Comics one can warp reality the other kind of absorb and manipulate universal energy. Yeah Franklin Richards is again kind of like a saint elsewhere is kind of a joke where he can do anything and so maybe the universe itself is a construct of Franklin Richards imagination.
Thanks Tommy Westfall. Yeah fine idea by the way I'm okay with that I like that concept because it does it's cute and it's tongue in cheek that's kind of Marvel to do that very much though. You know I'm actually kind of amazed at what Hickman managed to do with him and make him interesting and do something yes and I think that over time they have become a little more overpowered originally they just make you small. Yeah but now they can do whatever with the story requires them to do.
Right and so in that regard yeah that's not a bad suggestion. Theodore Kemna Swamp interesting enough or at least as long as you're not using him as a plot device it could be interesting and cool. Red Tro saying what do you think of Ghost Rider I think he's a cool looking drawing but I don't think he's okay because they've established that like the pen and stairs work on everybody like free and he gets defeated a lot. Yeah and he gets defeated a lot.
If you ever read the Howard Mackie run Danny Catch Ghost Rider loses every other page. And as we found out with Cosmic Ghost Rider Ghost Rider is really only as strong as the person he's currently inhabiting so you can have a guy who makes deals with Galactus and Thanos and everything else and just completely blows off his responsibility as the Spirit of Vengeance and just goes to do other shit. It's true and Silver Cricket we're telling you that Lockjaw has no limits to distance or reality. Yeah he's a dog occasionally a man.
He should be totally yeah he should be undefeatable. The other thing is he's a dog though or a man that became a dog either way he is like kind of like he tells me. It's lots of things. I was going to say I'm a character we haven't talked about yet that I've met them immediately to talk about is doomsday is no piece.
Yes please. Doomsday was a plot device created to beat Superman that's all it was and that's why he dies. In the first story he appears in he shows up to kill Superman and then he dies. Of course comic book editors who can't just leave well enough alone sometimes not only can he not die but he dies and then he becomes resurrected and is immune to the thing that killed him last.
That's the worst power in terms of writing. It really is. You can't do anything with that character. Doomsday is the comic character equivalent of that kid on the schoolyard.
I've got special wizard armor that protects me from your thing and I can never be defeated because I'm the best and I'm doomsday. Then why are we playing? Exactly. Doomsday when ever he shows up that's the thing why are we even playing.
But that being said doomsday also gets defeated quite a lot despite being the biggest best is guy ever. Every story ends with him getting defeated or drop at the end of the time. I mean do you remember that Batman Superman story when Dark Side made a whole mess of doomsday's and threw them at Amazon? They got mowed down by laser vision.
Cool visuals but you kind of really just ruined doomsday. It says like oh no I'm also super dense and I'm also super intelligent and also friends with death and I also even if I didn't have any of that I could probably still take over the galaxy like. Yeah his power is all amazing. And we know he is a comic character because it's a period of number of books.
Yes he has both as himself and as stand ins for himself. Exactly. Ethan Miller pre obvious but Thanos I mean you talk about Thanos for a while. Thanos I think is more of the equivalent of the.
Over the place to where again even to bring back that Donnie Cates Run where it's like at the end of the universe there will only be Thanos. Cool. And Thanos is so tough the only person who can challenge him is a younger Thanos that he takes from time so they can buy it. Right by the way I dig the idea behind the Donnie Cates concept.
Me too. I've never been a fan of Jim Starlin's Thanos because he's just such an unrelatable boring character. He can't be defeated unless he uses hubris against him. But then once you do that he remembers that you did that and then he can't be defeated after that.
Like right Thanos when they dropped him at the end of the Avengers I was like no not Thanos why don't we defeat Ultron who by the way should have been way more OP because he can. Once the robot connects to the internet they can't die because they hide themselves in files they could go anywhere they could do anything you've ruined it. We need to destroy every single Ultron robot otherwise he'll be back somewhere. No he's digital he's not really a robot he's a sentient program you establish that in the movie itself.
He's in the cloud man. Right you can't beat the cloud. That's why my pitch for Ant-Man 2 should have been no. Pim should find Ultron in the cloud and that should be the thing and that way you can kind of bring the Ultron family and the Ant-Man family back together in the movies they didn't do it but I think that's something they should consider for maybe Ant-Man 3.
Like make Ultron just kind of like a cool bad guy that somebody else can deal with. It doesn't have to be an Avengers level of Avengers because he was fighting the Avengers. Everyone agrees that Ultron isn't their favorite Avengers movie so it's fine if you pick him like a Batman villain or something. Yeah put him anywhere else and I think he would be better served.
Have him fight anyone else. Or you just make it so that yeah he is scary and yes if he constitutes himself we are in to a shitstorm like he was in the Bendis run of Avengers where it's like no if Ultron gets his hands on XYZ that's it for reality like a Ultron the game or the comic. Yeah but yeah that'd be a cool way to do it because that's you're racing against the clock you know because you know there's no Avengers that are gonna show up to save the day. Yeah in particular like Superman when you're writing in like pre-crisis Superman's pretty OP.
Superman 1 million is aggressively OP to the point where he can't be defeated to the point where he's basically all star Superman who also basically can't be defeated except for my death. And that's again that's where I think the challenge for a writer is coming in why so many people often say oh you know Superman so boring because you can just do it every one. You super powerful. They've always tried to adjust the power levels.
Oh well we'll take this away. Well we'll make it so he can't do this anymore etc. I think and again that's where the challenge for a writer. Okay how do you write a character who is basically God levels of power.
Right I've seen this on a couple of lists and I wanted to mention this character too because like not really character but the Phoenix. Yeah I was gonna bring this up next actually where do we stand on the Phoenix. Right because I don't think the Phoenix is OP because in order for it to be effective it needs to basically attach itself to a person. Which is already a huge downside to it because people are squishy and tend to die and many of the Phoenix's hosts end up dying.
Right and sometimes they feel bad about being the Phoenix and they allow themselves to be killed or kill themselves so you got a lot of opportunity for failure. And the Phoenix Force also two falls into that thing. Like well you're more like a primordial force of nature and everything. I mean you certainly don't view yourself as evil.
You are the fires of creation and everything and destruction and yada yada. Yeah so yeah I don't think the Phoenix forces OP although I do think that they kind of like weirdly nerfed her in Avengers vs. X-Men where they were like shoot her with a laser beam. Or wish her away.
Wish her away. I propose that Scarlet Witch got a little OP. She did one super amazing OP thing and even even no surrender she was doing stuff. Okay now I'll just remove the limiters from everyone so you can all be as powerful as you want to be.
Oh can you do that to yourself every time you have a problem? I know that's the thing where it's like ooh you do that once and now everyone's going to be coming to you and being like hey Galactus is attacking, Annihilus is attacking. Can you do something about this? Remove my limiters please.
Getting Arts with a Lobster just make it so where Ultra no longer gets vibranium and then most of the MCU characters will be able to take them on. Yeah well and the other thing is you need to make sure he doesn't connect to the internet because otherwise like I said he can hide his personality places. And George J what about Frank LeRichertz? We talked about him already.
Yes we did. We just rolled back but yeah we did talk about him so don't worry. Another character that I find a little OP because I've never heard more than like two characters. I've never heard more than two or three solid stories about them and even then it's not really about them.
Apocalypse. First of all apocalypse little to OP got really really OP like really really fast. Yep. To the point where basically has there ever been a Thanos versus apocalypse story because we talked about this before on like villainous team ups and shake ups that we'd like to see.
I don't think there has it's crazy there hasn't been. It's crazy because like that I mean like that practically you get Jim Starlin and Chris Claremont together and just go that's your story. It's just it's the end of the universe everything's dead and the only two who are left are apocalypse and Thanos because apocalypse is enduring and eternal and forever and he can't be defeated and he always resurrects himself and blah blah blah. I've never really even like okay so everyone's favorite apocalypse story, Age of Apocalypse barely about apocalypse.
Nope. It's about how crappy how crappy a leader apocalypse is. Yes. So you know he can he is basically as OP as like molecule man who wouldn't have itself as OP enough to the point where if you get enough of him together he can reshape the universe itself.
Yes again you know you know a new apropos of molecule man the beyonder and the beyonders. The beyonder and beyond well anything Marvel cosmic yes but we didn't we should have mentioned the beyonder and beyonders because those guys I mean come on they can make they can make planets they can create life they can manipulate reality they can go back in time they can make amazing Jerry curls at stained place. They can chop your vegetables like Ginsunai. Yes beyonders and they're lemon scented.
Yeah the other character I never really heard any more stories about them that are really cool that's also incredibly OP. Dormamu. Yeah I mean like he's one of their many stand ins for the devil so you figure that you know that would be a god level type of villain but yeah he never he never has that thing where he screws with the entire world like he should like there was never like a big dormamu event. No and it's why I was worried that dormamu was going to be the villain in the Doctor Strange movie.
No no no no set up do you basically end the Doctor Strange movie the same way you end the Avengers where it's like Dormamu's like oh and you're like oh one day Doctor Strange will be as powerful enough to be able to maybe face Dormamu but no he fights Dormamu and he fights him using a friggin time yeah which is like cool by the way most Doctor Strange moment in the movie but like also now what do you do with Dormamu you can never use him again. Yeah it's very weird because he can do anything I don't even know what his friggin powers are that's how we got so many things he can do. He's a big face with his own dimension. Rainmaker saying how about Marvel Superman's Century and the void.
You have a brand new book that came out today actually I haven't had a chance to read it but I did get it. Yes me too written by Jeff Lemire I gotta see how this goes. Oh Belok and Adion. Oh oh but yeah Century OP deliberately such they create that's the thing is that the they as long as you put in some kind of limiters or some kind of rules with the universe for your character they don't have to be to OP the century works because he's fucked up.
Yes he is he is clinically insane and that's a pretty good limiting weakness to put on your critique of Superman and he doesn't want to destroy everything so that when the void comes out he has an internal struggle it's not just like he's dick and he has the powers of the century but he can also be evil like that is too much then he then he's there's no internal struggle he's like I screw it it'd be like the Hulk or evil yeah oh well then he would be everything or if the Punisher had cosmic powers like oh yeah everybody all the time without stopping. In fact he has a war machine suit down the superhero community is already like whoa whoa whoa that's too much right or you got the cosmic punishment goes right a situation which is like whoa whoa too much bring it down and I yeah but yeah the century can be OP but every time that they've threatened to use and remember we were whole but they're like they had to like plead with him and beg him to do anything and then he does and he still gets beaten so he's not he does no not really he's just OP enough yeah he's just OP enough to be interesting so you got that redro what about Dormandler versus Thanos that's the story I would pay to see are you kidding me yeah I also feels like how they not done it yeah I would want to case to write more than Jim Starano. Yeah same here it would be but hey apparently Kate's is coming back with another run of Thanos stories Thanos legacy or lineage or something as part of Infinity Wars yes that's cool that is cool. Have we talked about Dr.
Manhattan yet? No but we should a guy so powerful he breaks all the rules to where DC's new idea that they're running with is like what if he was God what if he just created our universe. I mean like I don't even know if that's the case anymore I don't even know what the other do with do-and-say clock but I it does seem like they've pivoted from before it's like oh yeah it's totally Dr. Manhattan's blue hand at the beginning of our creation myth but maybe it isn't also right that way I was so on board for that idea because why the hell not at this point like why not who cares and yet but yeah dr.
Doctor Manhattan can create life he can transmute a he can tell for anywhere he can breathe in space like he is OP but that's by nature who he is he's so OP that he loses his humanity and that's the exploration of the character so he's not technically OP in terms of like he can be defeated like he can't be defeated like if you fight him he'll kill you he can do anything but why would he want to right you either you have to appeal to his apathy or the like thinnest shred of humanity that might be left he's also super neurotic in the movies too yes that's true and I don't I don't I it's been a long time since I read the the J. Lee before watchman document the only one I have to go on is the one referenced in Tuesday clock and the one from the book man had is ultimately defeated when we stop and think about it by by at least so much in the way that he gets one over on him because being God and being so amazing he never considered a universe where someone gets one over on him exactly and then therein lies the the true like nature of the character and makes document interesting part of the whole like reason I'm reading doomsday clock is to see what his role is in this because I want to know what his motivations are and that's more than I can say for dormamoo who just like yeah he's evil because he looks like a flaming pumpkin you know these are these are characters who are who are overpowered but also like they didn't think about things like yeah here's a character who can't be defeated ever but they also need to feed him every time so it's hard to really find a weakness the juggernaut oh another excellent one man and his power goes up and down all the time from I'm the unstoppable force the champion of sitarach to just I am a strong guy in a helmet who deadpool defeats is a joke in one page right the juggernaut can be slowed down but not defeated he's a mess it gets a massive character but they didn't need idea with him by introducing the concept like the helmet protection from psychic tax and the armor is not impenetrable yeah but as long as he's in the armor he can't be hurt yeah I remember distinctly like the shatter star drove a sword in his eye and then it grew back because of the helmet and I'm like okay because it's magic so that makes sense I'm down for that magic and mutant at the same time I'm a little bit of a mutant but when I have the magic really brings out my mutininess Cyrus Hill marquee of death not familiar no if you're referring to death from vertigo then I you know I kind of put I kind of installed my own limitations around like cosmic characters no he's talking about like Clyde winch him from a from a Marvel book right it's a it's a character popularized by Rob of course and they can do anything they can teleport they can transmogrify they can they can read your mind they can turn into whatever they want they can't die so like mad Jim Jasper's or scribbly jibbit or any of these other weird four years characters find me a cool story he was in more than twice and I will talk about oh mr. Mixle Black another character oh he's he's OP I mean by nature of his character although he has a great weakness weakness and I remember when a man I feel so bad for all the things that Tamasi Gleason and Jurgen set up in the trash now I know because they were really setting up like no mixtures bit like it's now a villain they made him tragic like a tragic villain do yeah but no they're not gonna do that like we'll never go back to that now go back to something at whatever benders wanted to do with him when he was a kid that's what we'll say that's what we'll say we'll never we'll never get answers to the whole you know well Superman saves everyone but he didn't save me and you know mr. Oz and dr.
Manhattan have to be super powerful in their own right to keep a fourth dimensional being prisoner into fuck with him by the way nice to see that mr. Oz is feeling better after being kidnapped and transported by just a fucking peer yeah good to see that that didn't take no and that they didn't bother to read that book no and that also that Superman is not shocked to see his father return despite the fact that he was so devastated by seeing his father return turned evil then disappeared from reality that he broke the rules to go back in time to see the destruction of Krypton just because he couldn't bring himself to believe it comics Chris Quever helping us out tell me saying superior spidermen because won't die or go away I guess I mean you know he's been defeated multiple times he's not okay yes he's very fallible in fact his greatest weakness was love in the end was what it was love made him a better person and ultimately made him relinquish Peter Parker's body because he knew he wasn't the right man to save the woman he loved it truly the chinken all of our armors was beauty that killed the beast he's the miller saying what about taskmaster I would normally say yes but apparently they built in a thing where taskmaster can't copy Deadpool's moves because he's so crazy and erratic he can be defeated by Deadpool he is OP in terms of he can copy your fighting style and use it against you which is really cool I've never seen the taskmaster's powers actually like I've never seen it cleverly defeated I don't want to see him know they find a little harder or they believe more or you know or they do some unpredictable and he's defeated and if that's the case then he's not really that OP because apparently all you need to do is close your eyes and punch and then you get defeated if I don't know what I'm doing I'm just gonna kick the air if you get hit taskmaster it's your own fault so I mean like I do hear you he can be OP I think it's one of the situations where like if he were smarter he might be more OP but he keeps taking mercenary gigs he never tries to take over the world he's only motivated by money yes and of course we also didn't talk about dark side oh yes dark side much like Thanos right much like Thanos only like he's a new god whatever the hell that means you know also vague because I remember like people saw I remember people referring to the new gods like oh they're the new gods there's a new but no they can die they're people they have lives they have like hardships and problems that no two are created equal it seems there is no baseline for what any of them can do there's guys who can shoot white there's ladies who are big strong barber in precisely so yeah it's kind of unclear the dark side kind of like the devil of the new gods universe but he also has those omega beans was camped feed it unless you need them to be and then they are but he was also born he has parents and everything he has kids can also die because he was killed by like the anti-monitor who in and of himself is also OP but not as OP as like the monitor although the man to monitor so yeah the monitor's what's more comic books than hierarchies to power is right I don't know I think that's it we've got a couple of valiant fans tear of death divinity from valiant yes divinity is pre-op godlike power some Russian cosmonaut from this amazing series by Matt Kent if you've never read divinity or more importantly divinity to you should it's pretty cool I'll add it to the list and I will take your word for it again based on like reality or based on character like he was he's supposed to be OP getting our to lobster I'd like to throw in the orb as a joke because as long as the air is always hanging out somewhere lurking around he's the most I keep counting down it's like okay is he gonna show up in the new Thor's he gonna show up in the new Avengers come on orb yep he is coming you know it because Jason Aaron's become the new Bendis like he's gonna be the Marvel architect from here on out like yeah we're gonna get some orb unless like somebody editorial was like stop no more and you would have been with him and no one cared here's one surprise we almost forgot March and man hunter March and it's pretty OP it's always Superman but with extra powers yeah that's the thing he can mess with your mind he's a strong and durable a Superman he can you know change his shape and everything but a match will freak him out yes or if you get him anywhere in your Oreos he will also be oh I'm weak I'm sorry I'm sorry oh that's another thing to they keep trying to like justify the fire thing where it's like well you know I remember Jeff John's like three retcons ago was like well you see the fire thing is really more of like an emotional PTSD thing because the fellow lanterns burned his people alive so you know because they share a psychic hive mind so whenever he sees fire it like reminds him of the death of his planet and all their psychic screams okay fine you can you can rebirth March and man hunter but the fact is like just make it fire yeah it didn't take because it's really bad it's really bad on the skin and you know what we're all weak to fire yeah I know right oh speaking of Jeff John's and overpowering characters occasionally and I think I might get some shit for this but I'm gonna come out and say it one of the reasons I've had a hard time keeping up with Green Lantern passed a certain point into the new 52 and beyond how Jordan is too overpowered but only in his own book to where it's like well I'm the head of the lanterns and I'm powering everyone else and I created my own lantern out of pure will because I'm so great and I've cheated death several times because I'm Hal Jordan I'm the best that's ever been yeah it's almost like there's somebody there was somebody at the editorial level who liked Hal Jordan a lot a lot wanted Hal Jordan to succeed where no one else can yeah they did I think that's fair to say that like lanterns in general but in particular Hal have definitely gotten OP over the years it was only in their own books because like Green Lantern would show up in other books and injustice like and be like ah he's got me ah I can't do it but in my book but in your own book you're unto a god like what are you doing man why why are the dark Batman giving you such a hard time I think I think he's phoning it in that one it's like I'm not busting out the A material for Justice League duty these are Batman yeah we right at some level yes I guess why don't you take the doomsday one dickhead yeah really and beat him up but yeah you got you got Hal Jordan crap let me let me cover the other things Peter Stan check and Toyo Horace from an XO man award from Chris Quarva big ass valium fan man you and three other people I'm sorry to hear that the company's going in the shitter yeah but yeah Toyo Horace is definitely OP an XO man award not so much yeah you can do anything but then you have to say Iron Man is is purple man OP is he overpowered some stories he is he can be but like doom can just say no you're not yeah and then all of a sudden he isn't and he's still a dude at the end of the day he can still I get shot in the head and that would be the end of purple man yeah exactly he's still a regular guy but if you watch as a John season one like dude like he seems pretty unstoppable he really does let's see Abraham Park what about cyborg Superman seems Joel is winning the beard game today yes he is it's so long now I'm at the point where I'm worried about getting food in it I have to actually check before I get out and we lost a hundred people because of that that comment oh no see I knew people were gonna hate it how Jordan fans they are a militant bunch I think we just I think it just right itself but yeah like it just got really empty and here I would love to know that was the reason that there's just a hundred very hardcore how Jordan fans know Joel I draw the line I want to see him be everybody it's not OP if it's my character he killed the entire green lantern core before when he was angry enough yeah I mean you're not wrong about that the other thing the other character I wanted to mention before we kind of like wrapped up was a character that is oh did we yeah we talked about cyber Superman I'm sorry he's not Superman is has the Ultron problem he can't yeah you know he can jump into your computer and then he can't die so like yeah he got way to OP it started out kind of neat and then it just went away and then like Jurgens another thing they seem to throw away but he threw it away is like oh super and gonna try and like you know like turn him into a good guy again he's gonna try and rehab him or he could go be a villain in my new green lanterns book I'm writing yes and he and that's what we're gonna do yeah or I could just have him fight these guys in this new book I'll do that yeah I'll just do that I mean maybe that's Jurgens little protest for the Bendis thing it's okay fine you're not gonna honor what I did well I'm taking my guy back that'd be fine I don't think that is what I want to do anyway no although maybe they'll explain that maybe it's like where yeah when Rogals are broke up the fortress of solitude cyborg Superman's cage got broken and he just left right exactly there's a lot of unexplored potential with that with that sports and solitude destruction thing I guarantee you they're not gonna no one else is gonna touch would would would Rogals are want to kill cyborg Superman too he is impersonating a Kryptonian sometimes he has the genetic like skin outside of a Kryptonian would you have a bone to pick with him probably should but then again Rogals are a little OP if you ask me he they're at that point now in that newest issue where like I was kind of getting on board with him what's like okay you know he's like he's a proud warrior race guy he's basically a cling on but he's the middleman for the circle which is this bigger force and he's kind of a work a day like conquer all right this is fine but then in that last issue I'm also super fast and I also have solar powered weapons and I can also do I'm like oh don't don't keep inventing powers now I can also dig into the certain under into the core of the planet of earth like get out of here I my powers I have many powers I'm real cause everybody because then it's really likes you you lame character never have I almost been on board where it's like okay he's just he's just the front man of a bigger threat that is the circle now to be like now did we say that yeah no no I just want to introduce that idea to but the reality is robo Zars where it's out he really did destroy Krypton yeah I haven't read the newest issue I feel you have and I have it don't buy man of steel anyway a realty annihilation Nova he was pretty powerful I would not say OP Mmm Brevin Campbell 12 will John Stewart own the justice league no but it'll be a cool fight and he's an ultraviolet lantern that's pretty cool yeah yeah whatever that means whatever that is like I get it's like such a little thing where sineasters like hey I got my old costume again I'm the new lantern of the ghost quadrant that we just like oh you can just do that you can just go to a new part of space and be like I am the lantern now right yeah oh no we got a whole new thing which is somewhat hilariously brought up in my comment section if ultraviolet lanterns are a thing then info red lanterns have to also be a thing I hope they wait at least a little while for that but yeah before we go I want to mention this character because he was basically invented to be OP and that was onslaught oh god yes onslaught is the definition of a totally lame stupid character but man what a design yeah I really like the design of him mostly because he looks like a cooler magneto yeah which is cool but also stupid like he's too powerful and then of course like they punch like he's super powerful right okay fine so then they throw the Hulk at him and he cracks him and then it's like oh no now you've seen my final form which is bought and you're like oh my 100% final form and I don't know what it was with with comics at that time and doing like taking a character who's new and edgy and awesome and cool and then like I don't know changing their forms like this is like a Pokemon it's very anime yeah like where was it as real shows up he's like I'm as real then it's like okay you're Batman I'm at me I'm Batman then it's like I got Batman with cool gauntlets and it's like I got Batman with gauntlets political suit then my suits gets a little bigger and then it gets red and then it gets really really really stupid and then I got an Israel onslaught same deal I'm on so I look awesome okay stop drilling you hit gold you look like magneto but cooler yeah but what if I grew a face no that looks really dumb but what if I got bigger and had more muscles make any sense you have armor why would I see muscles armor yeah but what if I also like became thought itself like to stop cool yeah would extend showed up or what the hell's the monarch oh yeah we shows up in zero hour it's like you look cool stop there nope got to keep going nope got to keep drilling man monarch I'm surprised they never dusted monarch off for anything in the new 52 era because again it's like that's a cool-looking costume and like captain anime doing shit right no please knock yourselves out I'm surprised for doomsday clock captain Adam isn't there at all because like what captain Adam you're technically like an ex be of dr. Manhattan so it would be something for the two of you to meet and for like dr. Manhattan to be like you you poor little man you don't even know the depths of your power you don't even know half of what you could be capable of the fact that like they invented captain Adam allegory villains for it says we want to do something about this freaking character very very there have been a lot of other ones we've talked about I mean like honorable mentions go to lobo mongol oh yes you know brainiac to some extent I mean like basically any villain dr.
Doom to an extent is also very OP a lot of different characters of course we'll have to do a sequel series at some point oh yeah again somebody is it really got to make a freaking list of these book or these parts who need to do we'll just hatch we should we should also do the opposite we should do a horror the weakest character comic lore right just a stiff a mild rain would take them out yes breeze kite man yeah squirrel girl well squirrel girl can kind of be on both I know which is amazing about her yeah exactly but we want to thank you all for hanging out with us and joining us here on this episode the else we'll see you guys next week with other episode thank you so much for joining me Joel welcome back yes thank you back thank you very much by the way for hanging in there for us I went out to wherever the hell Denver Colorado for a couple of days and it really like not the crap out of me there's a couple of videos on comic story you can go check out that I'm on that was the net result of me being out there which was super fun and great I want to thank those guys for having me and of course we'll see you guys the later on more stuff happening that we'll check in on later you know we got conventions that were coming up and but they're not for you know what I'm talking about you but we'll see you guys next time another episode of Sal I'm Joel thanks for watching