Levitate the Pentagon. The seventh release from the Minneapolis group Deleader is a concept album based loosely on generations of comic book lore interweaved with social political commentary on the history of western cultures role in the world today. With nods to Alan Moore's Watchmen, the world's greatest detective, Marvel's cosmic universe, the atomic age of comics and more. Deleader weaves narratives, meanings and connections between a fantasy world and the reality of today.
Whether it's themes set to spooky, reverb, laden pulses or to fiery post-punk blasts, Levitate the Pentagon is a refreshing take on as well as a dour view of the state of the world seen through a comic book landscape. Fans of forward-thinking punk music and forward-thinking comics can pick up Levitate the Pentagon from Deleader. August 24th 2018 through their bandcamp. Deleader.bandcamp.com or 25diamonds.com.
Alright, let's get on with the show now. Waiting down upon the underworld to smash gangland comes a friend of the unfortunate enemy of criminal. In a serious, powerful character, a problem to the police, but a crusade of a law. Hello everybody, welcome to the Elseworld Exchange, I'm Sal.
And I'm Joel. The pop culture podcast, or we chat for about an hour about any given topic, particularly pertains to comics. Today, we're going to be talking about something totally unrelated to comics, that being the San Diego comic comic comic. Yeah, more and more, it seems like they're moving further and further away from the printed page and to be about everything else.
That's true. I am, of course, kidding. We are actually going to be talking about quite a bit of comics news that came out of San Diego. That's just we didn't get a chance to talk about and we missed it because we weren't able to go.
Joel was kind of to curate a little list of things that we should probably chat about. These are just these, all the news that's fit to print that came out of San Diego comic comic on this past weekend. That some of you might care about our opinions about. Yeah.
So this is actually, I want to jump in on one really quick because I think it would be remiss if we didn't, based on my relationship with these guys. Please. But they announced officially that like Vin Diesel has signed on to be bloodshot in the yes, the Valiant Bloodshot movie. It got buried under everything else.
As well it should because our friends over at Valiant no longer work there. And the folks who do run it are not interested in making comics and not interested in putting out like good work. And so they're just going to try and do whatever it was that the good people that we knew at Valiant were working on when they were all canned. And then hoping that people won't notice that they don't actually have a plan.
So, you know, we're actually- That they've been bought out by a soulless Chinese investment firm. We'll do that to you. Exactly. And you know that originally I remember there were still a lot of trades talking about the fact that like the Valiant Interactive Universe was going to start with bloodshot and then it was going to go to like a Harbinger.
And- And Faith and a bunch of other stuff. Yeah. And I know that apparently they also announced incidentally that Faith has a screenwriter. Yes.
Because that's also apparently in the works. That's what they want to do. They want to go from bloodshot to faith. Which I guess makes sense because you're kind of covering, you know, two very different markets with two very different types of heroes.
Like here's your Grim and Gritty Super Soldier. And here's a cool plus sized lady with wind powers. Right. Exactly.
The funny thing is that like they've had that script for a while. And in fact, somebody that owns Valiant had nothing to do with the procurement of said script or this faith movie. They wanted to move on bloodshot. And so they did.
You know Vin Diesel being bloodshot like good luck. That's all I had to say about that. I just love superheroes. I just really like to be a superhero thing.
So. Yeah, listen, I like Vin Diesel. I did most of the Riddick movies. I enjoy, I didn't like Babylon A.D.
but I like the cut of his jib. I like the fact that he's a nerd. He's got to be in D under his belt. Yeah, he does.
And the dude just seems like a genuinely pleasant person. Like he's really excited. I hated Chronicles of Riddick. But if you watch like the behind the scenes footage of it, like he's so passionate.
And it's just these pointing out all the cool set design and all the stuff. And it's really, really cool. I was like, that's good for you Vin Diesel. So like he loves it.
Part of me wants him to be successful at Valiant because, or with the Valiant universe because I want him to be successful outside of the Fast and Furious franchise. I know, right. Which has got to be such a blessing and a curse. It's funny.
Again, you mentioned our old friends who used to work at Valiant but don't you more to think. If they did, we would have been this close to probably getting to meet Vin Diesel at one point if we asked nicely. Oh yes. No, I would have absolutely been able to meet Vin Diesel.
There's no question that would have been a thing. And that would have been a real like bucket list for at least two of you have not made. Oh, yeah. Oh, I mean he's a bigger Vin Diesel fan than I am.
I became a fan of his B because of his D&D work. I'd be like, hey Vin, can we can we roll some D20s with you? Maybe later and then did you? Yeah.
Maybe later. You made me cry when you were the Iron Giant. That's right. So, you know, I mean, like the fact that they made that announcement is like good for them.
I guess they're still doing it. But like who knows where Valiant will be in the next like two years. They could literally the investment firms like, all right, this isn't shaking out. We're going to sell off all the assets now.
Yeah. And it could go back to like the people that we liked. Who knows? It could.
It could go back to them. It would be hilarious if DC or Marvel swooped on in their like way. We could buy our like we could buy this company now. Right.
That would I don't think they would. I think no. I think those days are over. I think that like, you know, DC made their attempt.
They purchased the Wildstorm universe, Marvel picked up the ultraverse universe. And did nothing with it. And neither one is interested in doing anything with those universes with the exception of course of like more analysis, the Wildstorm book. Which is like one fun pet project he gets to do.
So they keep him happy and sweet for the next actionable project. Precisely. But yeah, Valiant working on anything is like, okay, I mean, like good for you, I guess. I will say this, the guys who used to work there like they love those characters.
Like they really did genuinely excited about the Valiant universe. They were so nice. And they're really cool and they believe in what they're doing and they were interested in making comics. And at the end of the day, even if you weren't a huge Valiant fan, like you got to respect what they were doing.
They put a lot of work in and I think they understood the changing markets for comic books and the importance of YouTube and content creators more than DC and Marvel ever did. Because they were guys like our age. They were closer to our age. It's true.
Mr. Giggles and Super Chat saying, Hey guys, nice to see Joel on the Discord. Yes. Yeah, because the Discord nice.
I was in the Discord because Skype has gone to shit now with version 8.0. And I figured, well, fuck if I don't want to keep my own podcast held together with Duck Tape and Chewing Gum looks like I might need to find new episodes. By the way, if you would like to join the comic, you can click the description box below the video and find the invitation link to our Discord right there below. So yeah, moving on to bigger and better things.
I noticed that, what was it? I guess we could talk about the Luke Cage Iron Fist, Daughters of the Dragon Digital Series? Yeah, I feel very passionately about this. And I know I've mentioned it before that I think digital comics are the future, but I think the problem is both Marvel and DC are afraid to pull the trigger on characters that are too big.
They don't want to keep them out of print. I think it's perfect to take the Netflix centric heroes who don't have books right now and make them dig into it. I agree. I don't know much about this plan.
I do know that Marvel has been really pushing a digital arm, not very aggressively, which is smart. Like, do it, test the waters, make sure it works for you and for your publishing initiative. And then really aggressively attack it. So what was it?
When the Cloak and Dagger show came out, it was a Cloak and Dagger mini series made by Gethys Hopeless? Stealth release, also too. Hey, Jessica Jones out of the blue. Kelly Thompson's writing one of those now digitally that you can read, and that's also out.
Right, and I've heard it's incredible. I would never read Cloak and Dagger book after what we did here on this channel. I'll tell you this. I'd also never read a dentist Hopeless book after what we did with Doctor Strange.
But I will be reading that Jessica Jones series because holy damn. And they're all going to get collected in physical trade, or at least the Luke Cage one in the Jessica Jones one in October we found out by reading the new solicitations. Right, and it makes a lot of sense. It makes sense publishing-wise.
You know how to print books, you do it normally, put out the digital, keep the data, look up the metrics, see how it's working, see where you can push your digital arm, and then put it out for everybody else. If there's still a few staunch holdouts, they're like, no, whatever, they're still going to pick up this book and maybe when they like it, if they like it, they'll give it a try. Again, there's some particulars I'm not quite sure on yet, what the price point is and how frequently it comes out. I've said before, I think the injustice model was the future.
It comes out once a week, very cheap, slightly short, but that's okay because it comes out frequently. Yeah, agreed. No, the injustice model was a good move to try. I don't really know much more about it.
I know that you've been tweeting at the creator of the Blue Cage series for a little while. I've seen you're active on Twitter. He's not writing the new one, though. I wish he was, because he's probably going to DC with his friend Bendis to go right in the Wally West book.
Okay, well, good luck. Yeah, good luck with that. More power to you. Especially if all the rumors about Wally turn out to be true.
Right? Kind of knows. Supercomic fanboy16 saying Morrison on the Green Lantern sounds like a lot of fun. A police procedural sounds awfully tame, but it's good to have him on a monthly.
He was a blast. Yeah. Yeah, we talked a lot about this on another show, but Morrison on a monthly is a good sign that maybe he'll start doing more. It's great to see Morrison getting kind of back into comics.
The only problem is what influence will he have on the Great DC Universe? Because as we know, he doesn't have an editor. No. No.
And he doesn't answer to one. And this isn't conjecture here, say, or slander. It's literally just like, he has worked in a contract like, don't edit myself. I make what I want.
If you want, you're going to take whatever I give you. Also, the fact that it's only 12, 2 means, okay, so he didn't commit to being the new one going right or for long. Do they have something in the tank for when he leaves? Or are they hoping that it's such a big success they can offer him more to come back and keep writing Green Lantern?
Right. I feel like that makes sense. The latter. That being said, it would also be smart to maybe, it could also be, this is more sinister, but maybe Morrison had an All-Star Green Lantern pitch.
They weren't working on the other one by the time they brought in the pages. They were like, well, we'll make it into part of the continuity. It's not that much different. Feel free.
Because that happens a lot, of course. Greg Rucka famously had a major falling out over the All-Star Earth One Wonder Woman. Yeah, exactly. But yeah, so I'm excited to see it.
You'll be the first Green Lantern book in the main series I picked up in a long time. This is true. I don't really care for Green Lantern. The last Great Green Lantern book that I enjoyed was that Earth One book, which was incredible.
And we incidentally did on this channel. Do you want to check out that? I never read that one, nor did I watch the episode. I think I should know.
It's such a good book. And it reads fast. That's good. And also, by the way, it takes a box.
We were going to talk about that. We did already. Nice. You want to talk about Kelly's Unitconic Soccer Man?
Because I don't know what that is about besides Kelly's Unitconic Soccer Man. Yeah, which in and of itself is pretty cool. This also came from the series of leaks that said Grant Morrison was going to write Green Lantern. And Brian Azarello was going to write Suicide Squad.
And David Walker was going to write a Wally West Flash book. What's cool about this is the way they were talking about. They said when the DC writers have their retreats and everything, apparently everyone does five minute pitches. Everyone had a five minute pitch for Aquaman except for Kelly's Unitconic who by all account had a 40 minute Aquaman pitch.
They just had the whole room in Rapture with what she was doing. Cool. Okay. I'll hear that.
I mean, I will definitely agree like that. Yeah, the pitch seems to be that Mira, due to certain chicanery that I think will be explained in the drowned Earth kind of crossover. They're doing with Justice League in October. She kind of becomes the impromptu put upon leader of Atlantis.
Like she doesn't want to be, but she ends up being made Soul Queen of Atlantis. Aquaman kind of has a falling out. He sort of positions himself as like this Robin Hood, Ner'Duel vigilante in Atlantis and him and Mira have this sort of doomed romance where they want to be together, but politics and everything is keeping them apart. Okay, I guess that makes sense.
I mean, you got some more Aquaman books you got to create. You can't have them end up together forever. No, sounds very Shakespearean. Agreed.
No, that sounds cool. I mean Shakespeare lends itself to some like crazy outlandish settings and why not Atlantis. It also sounds very modern day DC where it's like a happy couple pricked in the fuck up. Oh, no, you don't.
This is comics everybody. I'm so scared for green arrow under the fences. I'm like, please don't split all the American area. Please.
I will cry. Mr. Roboto asking, was the 90s the best era for indie comics? I think yeah, I think the 80s really ushered it in, but I think like the 90s certainly saw the Renaissance of indie comics.
It was the most profitable time, I think. Yeah, this is true. I don't know about now. I feel like now there are real, there's the standards have gone up.
You know, it was the 90s was great democratizer for indie comics because like of the speculars market. There were just so many eyes and so many dollars being thrown just waiting for the next big thing. Like everything was greenlit. And even the concept of what an indie comic is anymore has changed.
It's like is Walking Dead? An indie comic? It was black and white. It only had like a couple thousand for the first issue, but it's made by Image, which is a huge company.
Yeah, but they are still they still do indie books. I mean like there, that's who they are. So I guess that makes sense. But yeah, I still say the 90s, probably.
Comic Goblin saying, good morning from Japan, you tightens of comics. Oh, good morning to you, sir. As a big Captain Marvel slash Shazam fan, I was disappointed by the trailer. Jeff John's a great writer, but his new 52 Shazam felt like a completely different character.
I was feeling and here's the fun thing. I was going to do a video on New 52, Jeff John Shazam and I was reading the first couple pages and I'm like, holy fuck does this reek of New 52 isms. Yeah, that being said, I don't really care for Shazam. So anything that makes him more interesting, more relatable, more appealing, more introductory, I'm all for.
Like make Shazam cool for me and I'll enjoy Shazam. Which I'm guessing is the exact way a lot of people feel about Aquaman. The Aquaman trailer in general. I feel the same way about Aquaman.
It's not great. I dug both those trailers, but you know, I can see the criticism that Aquaman poster was more terrible than the trailer. The trailer, the trailer. So it's fun.
You know, I'm not a marine biologist or a proponent of Atlantis. The idea of sharks versus giant sea horses doesn't appeal to me as much as a big space battle or aliens or a cool superhero fight. But at the same time, I appreciate that it's being done. I've never seen it before.
I'm sure it'll be cool. Yeah. Apropos of those trailers, I guess we could talk a little bit about the Young Justice Season 3 trailer. Yeah.
Was that the one that had a big clip that explained the last season, basically? Yes, which was a little awkward to be like, hey, here's our big long-awaited season 3 trailer. But first, let's catch you up on everything you missed in season 2 because we've been off TV for a very long time. And there's a chance most of you forgot what was actually going on.
Yeah. And when you got it, it wasn't even really so much a trailer as it was like a clip package of like, all right, everyone's older now. Also, we're bringing in the Outsiders. Here's Geoforce.
We promise you'll be cool. I got so much shit for making fun of Geoforce. I'm like, yeah, I'm like, Geoforce and Halo. You know, they're the two worst members of the Outsiders because they didn't do dick outside Outsiders books.
And someone's like, they're awesome. Fuck you Joel. And like, they weren't being ironic. They were like very serious.
I'm like, wow, I'm at the one super serious Geoforce man. Oh, yeah. It's like meeting a unicorn. And the fact is you'll find them.
Oh, yeah. You're more likely to find a unicorn than a Geoforce man. So I guess that's a good point. Man, he not liked, what was that?
Superman Batman Public Enemy's movie. Oh, God, yeah, that one was unfortunate for him. Yeah. That people leave the Outsiders are getting important again, like even in Detective Comics right now.
They seem to be hinting at a reunion for those characters. Right. That's cool. I guess because Black Lightning's popular on TV and like, where are you?
We're obviously going to use God set up as team. That's absolutely exactly what's going on. No, I'm down with that. I mean, feel free.
Like, struggle that iron is hot. If anybody's caring about Black Lightning, do something with him. Plus, plus they're a different team. They got a cool makeup.
They got Katana. They got Metamorpho. They got all these, you know, very different sorts of heroes. They can't always be the Justice League every time.
Yeah. That's true. Let's see. You want to grab one?
From the list or from the Super Chat? No, no, let's say hi to everybody. Chase Eichler saying, say your favorite Spiderman villains coming back in a big bad way. Yes, he is from the solicitations.
It's Morlin everybody. Yeah, Morlin and his wacky family. Also, the Shazam trailer looks good. I agree.
I agree. Yeah, the inheritors are coming back. People are actually confused about what the hell happened in that comic. I know, right?
What was it? It looks really bad. But Christo's Gauge is writing it, so. Yeah, I have higher hopes for it than I did for Spider-Verse.
Yeah. But I am not interested in Morlin's inheritors. But he looks so old and jacked up, Sal. Maybe something has changed.
I don't care. Like, for me, that's not appealing. I understand a lot of people were saying, you know, I took this to Twitter the other day yesterday. I was like, remember when Spider-Man's greatest nemesis wasn't an energy vampire?
Yeah. And people were like, oh man, like, remember when Spider-Man's arch nemesis wore a man purse? Or like, remember when Spider-Man's arch nemesis were like, goop monsters from space? I'm like, yes, that's true.
Spider-Man has had wacky villains, and Spider-Man has retained his Spider-Manness. Like, his villains are guard. I mean, like, he fought a sand man in one of the first four issues of his comics. It just seems weird, though, that the energy vampire is the modern-day equivalent when he seemingly has no real connection to him.
That's the thing, is that like, the inheritors represent a fundamental problem and a misunderstanding of the character. And it's like, okay, so sand man existing doesn't fundamentally alter the understanding or the interpretation of the Spider-Man character. The inheritors exist because Spider-Man is a magical being that is part of a systemic web of life that's the entire multiverse. That's connected to the whole multiverse.
Yeah, that's connected to the whole multiverse. Like, it used to be that Spider-Man was a science-based guy. In fact, when Stravinsky created more one, he was like, you know, maybe it's science, maybe it's magic, maybe it's both, who knows? And it's like, with the inheritors, like, what has to be magic, it has to be this.
It's also like, hey, Peter Parker, are you just a regular normal everyday guy from New York, you know, by a chance and happenstance or destiny becomes, you know, a super powered Spider-Person? No, no, it's actually bigger. It's all part of a secret web all tied together through the multiverse. Right.
Which like, I loved its connection to Secret Wars at the end, but at the same time that wasn't enough. And doing it again, like, oh, but my point earlier was just like, a lot of people confused by the ending where they were like, are they dead? Yeah, didn't they locked away in a Spider-Demention to never be seen again? That is exactly right.
They did that. And maybe whoever broke them out is the true villain. Yeah, they hung them on a hook and maybe we'll use them again later and then they did. So they never really died, but they were like kind of left to be ignored.
But it looks like they're gonna come back. So, you know, maybe, maybe Gage has a pitch. I trust Gage, as we've said before, the dude knows his Marvel continuity, the man knows story structure, and maybe this is his way to be like, no, we're finally gonna put a nail in these energy vampires coffin. Yeah, exactly.
What was it? And slots, we're co-writing it though, which is really a problem. Oh, is he really? I thought it was all Gage all the time.
No, it's, it's lot two. Yeah, get rid of slot, baby. Yeah. You thought I was gone, but I wasn't.
Well, I have one more thing to tell you and wouldn't you know it. It's something that's really divisive that annoys like hardcore Spider-Man fans. It's almost like he's going out of his way to just piss off everybody before he leaves. And poor Nick Spencer and Chip Zadarski are in the corner, but, but, but, but.
Yeah. And apparently the, everybody wants to see, well, everybody wants to see a lot of Spider-Man's apparently. You know what's really funny though? Spencer's book doesn't have to do any tie-ins to Spider-Geddon, but Zadarski's book does.
Right. So there's a peck in order for you right there. I mean, if your book isn't called Amazing Spider-Man, you are on the chopping block. But yeah, that wasn't really on the topic, but I do want to, I'm glad we addressed it because like, it sucks.
Yeah. Cam had a good super chat. Yeah, Cam said, Rest in Peace, John, Snap the Man did a lot for a small community. We call the internet comic fandom.
Please check out his GoFundMe to help his family pay for his outrageous medical bills. Yeah, he was a really nice guy. He actually chatted with me on Twitter multiple times when he was developing and pitching that death of Return of Superman movie. Didn't have to.
Real sweet dude. Right. He made a lot of friends that we know. I'm in a handful of times and, but not nearly, I didn't know him nearly as well as a couple of our colleagues, particularly Jason.
Yeah. And people like knew him intimately and personally. And he left a lot of joy and a lot of sorrow in his work. He's one of those creators where it's like, you know, I never met you personally, but I feel like I know you through your work and that's a rare thing to get across.
Yeah. It sucks that he's died, is really, really sudden. And I don't envy anyone in his circle because like, they lost someone really special to them. Yeah.
Most definitely. But, you know, we'll do our best to honor his memory and, you know, for those who, you know, who care. Keep it sweaty, keep it nerdy. Right.
Exactly. And he's a dude who was a titan in our industry. And Taylor Pecher. So with Morrison taking over Green Lantern, the over under 30%, he will mention the Ultraviolet Spectrum.
Yeah. He's just a Snyder thing since he hasn't affected the other Lantern books a big time. Yeah. Interestingly, Snyder mentions the still force that was brought up in the Flashbook and created by William Sudden.
Yeah. Cause Snyder's a ball player who makes friends and influences people. He knows how to play the game and use the tools that are available. Morrison only knows how to play by himself and will behave thusly.
Tails, no, not more, not more, lawn, less, lawn, please. That's his cousin. And Mr. Roboto, Spider-Man vs.
Vampire, the time has come. Listen, I would rather it be like if Morbius was leading a team of vampires rather than like silly ass energy vampires? I don't know. That would also be cool.
When's Morbius going to be important again? I mean, they keep trying, but like, I think around the 12th of never. Or at least when Sony finally gets off the ground with horrible spinoff movies. It's so funny to see Morbius drift further and further into the background.
I'm a Spider-Man villain. I'm kind of an anti-hero to, oh, I'm the science rep for the Monster Matropolis. Right. It's weak.
I heard that renew your vows just cancelled, but that's totally unrelated to what we're talking about. So I'll just say like, if it is, you'll only yourself to blame you in my book. Spider-Girls, Joey Houser. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
You get all the Spider-Girls in one book. Great. Yep. It will turn into a miniseries.
It'll make some people very happy, and I appreciate that. That's right. Talk more about the Black, the X-Men Black series, because I know very little about it except that like, there's going to be some Magneto in it. Right.
Okay. So here's the thing. When it first got announced, X-Men Black, I'm like, oh, cool. A brand new team led by Magneto in the vein of X-Men, Blue X-Men Gold.
It's not though. It's actually a six-part miniseries, where in every issue focuses on a different famous X-Men foe, written by a different X-Men writer. Claremont's actually writing the first one. He's writing Magneto.
Okay. Then we've got Emma Frost, Juggernaut. I forget all the guys, but basically all the famous X-Men foes are kidding. So let's just do your apocalypse, probably.
Yeah. Okay. Here's the thing about apocalypse. The backups of all of these X-Men Black books will have a story about apocalypse, and the apocalypse story apparently builds up to what's going on in the brand new To Be Launched Uncanny X-Men series.
That sounds about right. That's kind of smart. Yeah. That's cool.
That's a really good idea. It is. It is. It plays with the color thing while also being something totally new.
It's not just like, it's X-Men Gold, X-Men Blue. Originally, you were like, oh, okay, well, Blue's gonna be about the time travel guys, and Gold's gonna be about the non-time travel guys. Then they were like, no, it's about whatever. Screw it.
Do whatever you want. Yeah. And also those books aren't long for this world anyway, about the time extermination is over. Which is fine by me.
Same. I'm gonna mix a couple of these just to save us some time, but we should talk about it again. Go for it again. Pick and choose whatever you want.
Yeah. We should talk about Doug Mankey and Peter Temasi taking over for a couple of years. Hell yeah. That book has been in such a weird little limbo zone ever since Tyne had finished up his running.
You guys aren't you gonna capitalize on this momentum? You're not gonna get a new full-time writer? You're just gonna, okay, little mini arcs, but yes, Temasi's back and thank God. Yeah.
Now that's interesting, by the way, that Menki and Temasi are gonna be working on Detective Comics. They're gonna start at 994. That means they're gonna get a six-issue arc, and then the book is gonna hit a thousand. Yep.
And you are gonna see a shitstorm unlike, not unlike the action comics, one thousand only. Oh yeah. You ratcheted it up to thirteen because they love Batman. They love their batmans.
I mean, Detective Comics is literally the name of DC Comics. You figure if they were ever going to pull out all the stops. It's gonna be then, and it's gonna blow the doors off of the entire damn book. I assume that it's Trunksley back shortly before then, but we had always said on this show at least that the Trunks will definitely come back by the time it hit one thousand.
Yes, it comes back in September actually, because on the cover of the, what is it, the Tonking Batman book? He has them in the new Batman Secret Files. He has them, so yeah, he's gonna have them by September. Yes.
Although we've also heard that since Doomsday Clock takes place after all of this, he will be losing them again. So everybody who's talking about how superhero trunks on the two biggest superheroes in the universe are somehow causing the death of comic books itself will only have a few months to complain. I do not get that people still complain in my Superman videos that the Trunks are back, and I'm like, what planet are you from? When did you start reading comics?
You're really betraying your age right now. Right? Like, get out of here. It's weird for them not to have them.
They've had them for seventy-five years. They set the tone for every other hero. It's true. Not only that, but like, I don't know.
I grew up with those. Like, I know what they look like. When I was a kid, I thought, yeah, ditch the Trunks. And then like, I had a couple of friends who drew, and they drew them without them, and I'm like, it, and as I've maintained for a couple of years now, you need some kind of color barrier to break up all that one solid color.
It looks disconcerting and wrong without them. You've got to be too bad, man, suit. It looked like a weird like, like, sleeper jumper with a big belt. It looks really weird.
Boy, boy, did it. And again, it's funny, too, to bring back to the Superman thing. Like, I'm talking about like, man, I really don't like what Bendis is doing here. I'm worried about the future of this book.
Yeah, but Trunks, Joel, talk about the Trunks. I'm like, no, I'm talking about the story and the character. The Trunks are the last thing from my mind. Right?
No. I want to address the superchatterly quick to say hi to Jonathan Chu who said, please read my regular message as part of the Super Chat. I messed up the Super Chat. Unfortunately, I don't know what the original message was.
So I'll have to scroll back and look for it. It looks like it might be back here. Here we go. This is my first time sending you guys some money, so I'm very happy to do so.
I've been watching Joel since the dark days. It's sound tips since I got into comics. You two are better than R&B. Keep up the ground.
Thanks, John. I really appreciate that. I like being on it, too. It's one of the things I like the most.
I haven't been invited to drop. Well, you're in Canada. Apparently I'm too expensive again. What was it?
Taylor Pester. The question is, will Tomasi continue off to 1000? That's a good question. I hope so, too.
I feel like he probably will. The reason for that is because he was on Superman for a couple of years. Yes, he was. He was only kicked off Superman because of an Extenuating Circumstance being Ben.
If it wasn't for the Ben Disgat, I'm sure he would still be writing it. Unless Jason Aaron bitditches Marvel and goes to write Batman, I think you can count on Tomasi until he doesn't want to be there anymore. It's nice to see him writing a Batman book again, because he had a very sizable Batman and Robin Ron in the beginning of the New 52, where he put a ton of work in. He did.
He actually makes Damien more likeable than anyone had before him, so I'd like to see him go back to that well and probably bring back some of those characters. The leaked rumors were his detective comics is going to be more of a globe-hopping Batman, battling the League of Assassins across the world. Yes, I've heard that. It's an overarching theme about him trying to take down the League of Assassins.
That's fine, I guess. I would rather read about, I'm still waiting for my Batman book, which is about Batman being a detective and fighting bad guys, killers and rapists and stuff. I think that'd be cool to see. Just a sort of Batman being a detective and fighting crime.
That used to be what detectives was for. Batman was the more superhero book. Detective Comics was the crime noir book. When all this 90s nostalgia, they could also bring back Shadow of the Bat and try and just satiate some of us out there who are looking to spend some money on Batman, but don't care about anything that's happening in Batman right now.
You might like Batman's secret vials then because they're going to get a bunch of different writers on there to write different stories, and apparently Tom Taylor is going to be writing one. Yeah, that's fair. Okay, cool. I'll check that out.
Yeah, looks like they got a bunch of interesting people for that one. Speaking of interesting people for books that people really enjoy, can you talk a little bit about Mr. Miracle? Yeah, so, Game Man's finally doing a brand new, or not Mr.
Miracle Man, I think I'm a pretty good one. I'm sorry, thank you. For a minute, I was like, Mr. Miracle, what?
You know, it's not your fault. I did the same story with Matt a couple days ago and he made the exact same mistake. It's like our brains are just like Miracle Man, that's nobody. Mr.
Miracle's the guy. Yes. The fact is like Miracle Man has been in limbo forever. Yep, legal limbo.
And in fact Marvel purchased the rights of the character and bought Angela from Game Man. Yep. So that Game Man would finish Mr. Miracle Man.
Yep. That never happened. Yep. And there was a lot of speculation when they released a like, release of like, Cassata Art of Miracle Man, how like, maybe they're going to integrate him into the Greater Marvel Universe, or at the very least they're going to republish them Alan Moore stuff, because that was a big thing.
That was a big thing, yeah. Almost pen to deal with Alan Moore, but all he had to do was like reprint the book with special credits, like some colors or something, or the creators I don't recall with the, what the stipulation was, you go to Google it. But they screwed up the printing and some Alan Moore and excuse not to honor his deal. There's a whole tangled web nightmare that's been going on for years now.
But at the very least, Money Exchange hands, and they made a deal with Game Man to do a Miracle Man book, or continuation of the book never got completed. Looks like they're finally going to get that. Yeah, I wonder what this book is going to look like in 2018, because people love Miracle Man so much, because it was one of those first comics that really tried to deconstruct the superhero as a genre, and comic books and everything. It was like, watch me before, watch me, you know, on the way.
And it seems by the way, it really captured the superhero genre and sent it up, but it was a non, like, it didn't feel like it was angry about superheroes. So we like, yeah, it wasn't hateful in any way, like it was an actual like, positive deconstruction. Yeah, it was almost like a smarter, more mature, the boys. Yeah, it was also kind of injustice before injustice too, because that was a big thing.
It was like, hey, Miracle Man, you're basically Superman. What if you tried to take over the world? Yeah, read it because it looks kind of like an old school comic, and you're like, oh, this is kind of like, push the envelope. Oh, yeah, we'll see.
And then you're like, turn a page like, oh my God. So definitely check it out. I mean, it's Alan Moore's though. It's cool shit again too.
It's nice to track Alan Moore's progression as a writer and a creator. Right, exactly. Lots of really interesting British creators cut their teeth on that book. Yeah, so definitely, I'm excited to see that it's finally going to come out.
If it does, I, you know, we'll see. I believe we want to see it. It still might not also do. It's fun to have it come out now, because it's a wonderful time to money the waters even further when it comes to the Shazam Captain Marvel miracle man, like Line and Evolution.
Totally. No, you're absolutely right. Because Shazam Comics, which at the time are called Captain Marvel Comics in Britain, were called Miracle Man. Yeah.
You can, you can fuse yet. It only gets worse. Will I Am Golden? Batman hasn't ever trunks since Batman Incorporated.
Yeah, but like, it was just a costume change. It wasn't a like, line wide costume slash. This is the thing now, yeah. Taylor Pector, it seems that this year and next year's are the years Marvel loves finishing Long Delayed series.
Mmm. And now with Miracle Man, I sure hope so, man. Yeah, that would be really nice. Do you believe the rumors shooting around that Hickman might be the guy to do Uncanny X-Men, and that finishing shield was their way to butter him up and get him back in?
That would be great. If that were the case, I will buy Uncanny X-Men number one or number nine hundred and five, or whatever many it comes out with. But like, I'm just checking it out. If Claremont picks it up, like I theorize, like, maybe.
I hope it doesn't. I hope it is just Hickman just going ham on that book, because I mean, I think. Yeah. They have a writer, they have four scripts done apparently according to the editors, but they don't want to announce it yet, which makes me think, well, when are you waiting to?
And it's probably by the end of extermination, because they don't want to tell you, hey, here's an awesome new book that's coming out later. Now you've got to re-extermination. No, I think it's going to be New York Comic-Con. Oh, well, hey, we'll be there, so we'll find out.
Exactly. Because D23, no one's going to freak a care. No. Uncanny X-Men, all the Disney files are like, I don't know who that is.
I don't know what that is. I don't know what it is. And when I say Sal and I will find out when we're at the hotel later looking through Twitter, oh man, can you believe they announced this while we were on the floor? Yeah, we missed all the big stuff, because we're just like too busy being at the con and enjoying a lot of it.
I still remember they announced Super Suns. Like later that night when I was sitting on your hotel room floor, hey, Super Suns is going to be a thing. Yeah, oh cool. We don't know who the creator is going to be.
Oh, and Wedge is going to be an episode of Rebels. Awesome. You want to talk a little bit about the Batman and Joker miniseries? Because I don't know much about it.
There's very little to know about it. There's going to be a six-issue Batman and Joker miniseries. What does it take to get the creative team on that one? No, I don't think I got the creative team on that one, but they're doing it.
I'm going to assume this is probably after three Joker, so maybe we'll finally have one now and know what's going on there. It could also be like it's not a black label book. Is it? It's just amazing.
No. So I don't know. I think it'll be probably more like Batman and Joker, which I loved your rope up. I know.
So it didn't really take place in continuity, but it kind of could have. Here I actually have the article in front of me, but that was a... While reading Comic Goblin saying this in Super Chat, I didn't know about the Miracle Man news until now. So thank you for making my day.
I've been dying for the series to wrap up. I will cry manly tears of joy. Dude, yeah, you won't be alone. It's going to be fantastic.
That way the game didn't know what I was going to end. So it'll be hopefully the ending that was preserved from the beginning. Oh, again, I agree, and that's why this is the news you missed episode. Here's the answer.
Sylvester is going to be writing and drawing it, and it's going to be in black label, yes. Okay, cool. There you go. The DC black label line we should talk about for a minute because the three Joker's is going to be in a black label.
Yes, even though it's also apparently very important continuity, which changes everything we thought we knew about black label. This could be because... Okay, so we could be learning two... one of two things about the black label.
One, the black label, because it originally... I'd heard that the black label is going to be just like graphic novels being printed. But I feel like it was more just like it's an unrated, high quality bookstore kind of themed publishing line for DC to put out... Like, are rated or harder edged graphic novel stories, and at some point we'd already speculated, like it wouldn't be great if they would also go back and reprint older books.
Which they totally did. With some of the original art and some of the more hard-nosed stuff that you wouldn't have seen in earlier versions. Yeah, they're doing that too. I had really only heard that the black label is going to be out of continuity from the speculation.
From other people, not from the press release. The press release is just like, here's the books that are coming out. And they mentioned that most of the books will be out of continuity. Well, so many of the pitches that we heard couldn't possibly have been in continuity.
Right, so it makes sense that most of the black label books would be out of continuity. I think it's just that... I think John has such a fun time working on Doomsday Clock, which has no rating, which absolutely would be a black label book. And you can tell from reading The Last Issue, heads blow up, there is very vivid depictions of sex.
Yeah, so there's no way that John's wouldn't want to just like go ham on this book, and I've been saying that a lot, but go crazy doing as much envelope pushing... True storytelling that he wants to do with The Three Joker, so there's no way he wouldn't want to do it that way. So it makes sense that it would be a black label book. I get the distinct feeling though, you and I in the next coming months and years are going to have to explain a lot.
Yes, those other black label books aren't continuity, but this one is... No, I don't know why they did it, they just did it. Exactly. I think it's just because they're like, no, I want to print R-rated books.
Most original graphic novels aren't going to be R-rated, so they don't fall into the black label line. It's like just recently I've had to explain, yes, that's black widow, but no, she's technically a clone. Yeah, she did die in secret. I don't know, go read Matthew Rosenberg's book where he explains it.
The black label line is encouraging, it's exciting, and I'm really looking forward in the Marvel equivalent to Johnny Kate's Marvel Night's line. Yeah, which man, I was so excited to hear that. Marvel Nights, I didn't get a chance to talk about this on other shows, but it's such an important part of my Marvel nerd-dumb. It was the thing that took me, I think, from a casual fan to, okay, now I want this to be my job, now I want to get serious about this and know everything about this.
You've heard a couple of folk talk kind of like dismissively or saying this rose into glasses for the Marvel Night's line. Oh yeah. Just this is the flash in the pan that other things were more important. I tell you why Marvel Nights was so important and why it's exciting that Marvel Nights is coming back.
Marvel Nights practically saved Marvel. Yes, it did. Marvel Nights made Marvel into a brand that people talked about before Marvel started influencing press releases and just doing stunt bullshit for newspapers. Marvel Nights brought in independent creators who were hungry, who had solid pitches, and who would later on influence Marvel to be the Marvel you recognize today.
And the run still hold up, Bendis's Daredevil, and is his Punisher, Priest Black Panther. Also Paul Jenkins's Century came out of Marvel Nights. Mark Miller, Spider-Man, Marvel Nights is one of the most popular selling Spider-Man graphic novels down among the dead men. There's a crapload of different, amazing, very, very well creatively accepted runs from Marvel Nights that you wouldn't have gotten the Marvel.
Daredevil wouldn't be cool without Marvel Nights. It's true. It completely reinvented the character and established and continued to establish the amazing history and legacy of Daredevil writers and creative teams. So the idea that Donnie Cates occupying the old, Bendis-Kissata role is going to be curating a Marvel Nights line.
Which seems his reward for making Venom a major seller and critical darling again. I think Thanos. People love Thanos. Oh yeah, that Thanos run is great.