EP 165 | God Behind Bars | Isaac Holt Interview

Inspiration, now in session. Michigan getting hot. Hot. Hot.

That's the thing about Michigan too. Like we don't, we don't like slowly progressing and nothing. We just go from summer to winter to summer. Fall to spring.

Fall to winter. All them things. We go everywhere. How y'all feeling today, man?

Everybody good? I'm good. I'm good. The new job.

I'm like, you know how when you knew like super new and you just don't know anything every week not every day. I'm getting better, you know? So that's cool. And I'm again, y'all know, man, I'm learning a new in a new area I never worked in.

I say that I say that every week. I'm going to stop saying it, but it's just a prior process and I'm making progress. Today's show is going to be cool. I got Isaac Holt, the director of innovation from Guy Behind Bars coming on today's show.

He's going to share a little bit about himself and he's also going to talk about Guy Behind Bars, the ministry, the organization. Talk a little bit about the founder and CEO. I think y'all really going to enjoy this conversation. Before we jump into that, man, what's going on in the world?

You know what? I'm probably going to do something that I don't typically do, which is like, you know, I just try to stay away from current events and politics and things like that for the most part. It's just so decisive, divisive and the goal of this show is to be united by faith and to really bring the people of God together. But I'm just sharing this before we jump in today's show because I'm not going to talk about it today because I want today to be about Guy Behind Bars and that interview when y'all are going to enjoy it.

I'm just letting you know it's coming. We're going to talk about things obviously that's been going on with the school shootings and gun control and all of that. And y'all know my approach as a Bible. I don't really, I understand the power of media marketing and how the airwaves are controlled with political agendas.

Man, we live in a cold, cold world. It's really tricky and it's almost unbelievable to some people, which is why a lot of times people just blindly follow whatever the popular trends or sayings are. I would like to dig into it in a deeper way, in a different way, not to argue, not even to debate, but really to make a case for a biblical point of view. How do we critically think through these things without being extremist?

And I think sometimes we just want to jump to conclusions. Like, hey, this is wrong. So we should do this and just jump to the conclusion. We're going to take a step back.

So I might do that next week. I might wait for this stuff to pass by and then do it. I'm not sure yet, but just know that that's coming. Also, hey, I did my first live, my YouTube live last week.

So we're definitely going to start getting into video interviews. I was telling Isaac before we were on the line and recording. Like I just, I want to do a few shows before I just jump into my guest with video, like with LaVille, with Toya, some of the co-hosts, and just let it develop. You know, let the process begin and grow and we'll make tweaks and I'm sure things have changed from the first episode, just like from the first episode of this podcast.

So everybody out there who is a new listener, I always encourage, first of all, thank you, but I always encourage everyone to go and start the episode one and check it out. Like what we do here in Aspire Guys, people, it's about self-development, it's about guiding you to your purpose. And, you know, there's a lot of foundation that was laid in the earlier episodes so that we can talk freely now. And especially when I get into something that, again, such a divisive topic, it doesn't have to be just because of how the world operates today.

Division is everything. That's how people really create movements through division. You know, I stay away from some of those topics, but if you rock with us in the earlier foundational episodes, you'll kind of know that we always come from a biblical point of view. So I'm subscribed to Aspire Guys, people on YouTube.

The links are in the description of today's show. I advise everybody, like, look, read through the description of the show. Typically a short description with a lot of links, links to my music, links to the guest Instagram and their YouTube and Aspire Guys, people YouTube, but subscribe, share our YouTube with somebody. And we can see if it grows.

You know what I mean? Again, it's a process right now. I think I got 135 subscribers. Thank you, mama, grandma, all my family, my brothers and sisters, mother of all that.

I know that's 135 people, probably just my family. Because you won't do it. You know, let me convict the people. You know, let me, let me make you feel bad if you want to subscribe to our YouTube.

Now I'm just joking. Check out the YouTube, there's going to be some content coming. Hopefully, it helps you. We're going to get into some Bible studies throughout the week and different things like that.

I think I've talked enough in this intro. So, uh... Let me in a few few. It's what we don't do.

You go talk to me and I'm going talk to you. Maybe on the phone book. I'm just leaking person. You go where you go to.

Don't be talking purpose. All right, guys, people. Hopefully, you're feeling good out there today, man. I'm feeling great.

Got somebody great on the line. Everybody that comes on this show is great. You know, I never had an interview that wasn't great and the person that wasn't special. But today we have the director of innovation for the Pando app, Gaby Han Bars, Mr.

Isaac Holt. How are you doing today? Good. How are you?

Thanks for having me on. Isaac, man, I'm so excited to talk to you today. I've been following Gaby Han Bars on Instagram probably maybe a year now, maybe a year or so now, and being kind of like just eyeing all the great things you guys do and what you stand for. And I'm like, I've got to get them on the podcast.

So, I'm excited to talk to you, you learn a bit about you, and also learn a little bit about Gaby Han Bars. So, you know, with that said, if we can maybe just jump in, if you could share with the people just a little bit about yourself and, you know, what is the director of innovation? That sounds exciting. Exciting.

I know I love that title. I'm so glad somebody else picked it for me because I would never have thought about that. But yeah, I basically get to push the boundaries of what's possible in prison. That's my job every single day.

I think about how can I do something that's never been done inside of a prison, which, you know, sometimes it's super easy for most people to do what we do. But honestly, like even just the video we get, the social media that we get to show, like those things are not easy. It takes months of work to make that possible. So, every single day I get to work on how can I create technology, create stories that really impact people.

But I grew up in Colorado as a pastor's kid. I played baseball at the University of Nebraska at Omaha. And then, yeah, so a little bit of baseball in me. I was on 5'6", and I played third base.

So, I don't know how that worked. I don't know how that worked. Hey, I think it's possible. That's what it is.

I'm sure you're a hard-working motivated person. Amen. Yeah, I was. And then moved to Vegas for two years and became a marketing director of a church there.

And it was about a 40,000 member church there. And just randomly, honestly, by God's favor, I was a market director there for two years. And that's where I met God Behind Bars. Our offices are in Las Vegas.

And I met the CEO, and he said, hey, would you help us with marketing stuff and to create this app inside of prison? He's like, I just need help figuring this out. So, about three years ago, I just started with God Behind Bars to figure out marketing. How do we tell our story?

How do we grow our social media? But also, how do we just tell the story of what God's doing behind bars? And how do we build it? How do we present?

So, that's how I got here. And the title is fitting. Like, Director of Innovation. That's definitely some pretty innovative stuff.

You know what I'm curious about? Isaac is so, obviously, you know, Pastor's Kid, go get another kind of start your career and marketing at a church. Like, what was your perception of what God Behind Bars was about? Or even like the idea of prison ministry prior to coming to God Behind Bars versus now?

I would imagine there have to be some change, right? Some new perspective. Yeah, no, that's so funny because I tell everyone that I don't know how I got involved with prison ministry. Like, I never thought about it.

Never really like, honestly, like so many people have so many stories of having, you know, some connection to prison and I honestly don't. But I started going into prisons to start film. I remember the very first prison I was in. It was a maximum security prison in Colorado.

We were doing a big event and I'm there with a camera shaking. Like, I'm like, I'm so scared. Like, these guys are, I get on five, six, one, 50 and these guys are freaking six foot, uh, two, like, and they're working out every day. So I'm like, Hey, I need to get a, I remember saying like, Hey, I need to get a story of an inmate.

And they're like, Oh yeah. And they call this guy over who's six, five, two, 50 and they say, Hey, go, go film. And they, they throw me in a room alone with him. And I start, yeah, completely alone.

And they're like, they were just so trusting on this guy. And no, I like look around. I'm like, no cameras, nothing. I'm in this gym filming this guy.

And he told me his story about he killed six people and burned a, a bar down and I, but then he, yeah, so he was a life sentence double life. He got, I mean, he was, he's in prison for life. And, but then he talked about how he met Jesus inside of his jail cell. And now that guy has started CrossFit gyms.

He started across at gym in Colorado. He, um, he, and what he does is he uses CrossFit to share the gospel and bring different gangs, different races together, because it's an activity that they can do together and he's sharing the gospel reaching so many men for Christ. He actually got so big that other CrossFit gyms would compete against the prison. Um, so anyway, so it was just this powerful moment of, and it's just, it's just, it's just moment like that after moment like that.

Cause I get to talk with these guys. I get to ask the questions and interview them and, um, they have just, there's so many guys who have, um, come to know Jesus and it has really like, it is just, it is honestly the greatest job that I've ever had in my life. And I can't, and, um, I just fell in love with getting to see guys that truly have nothing and no reason to want to know Jesus, but, but are so, they're so captivated and motivated to know Christ because it's their one hope and they, and it's just, it's just the most, it's so powerful and I, it's so hard to explain what God is doing inside of prison. That's why we try to capture it as best we can, but these guys know scripture, they know, um, they're just on fire for the Lord.

Yeah. You know, it's, it's funny, like, first of all, like the visual of you and this gym with this guy and I'm just going to give him a nickname, Bruiser. Uh, they got you here with Bruiser and, uh, but isn't it amazing though, right? How you can go from like seeing someone and thinking something and even hearing some bad things about them, right?

And then seeing how God like literally saved them. Yes. That is just an amazing dynamic when you think about it. Cause I would imagine, right?

Like these are, like you said, these are people that like Jesus is literally their one hope, like you're behind bars. So, um, that's, that's really deep. That's super deep and deep and I would imagine you probably have hundreds of stories like that. That's just kind of the first one.

So for you through that process, right? Like, was your, like, your friends, family, were they nervous when you took this job? Um, I think they were, I mean, I think coming from a ministry family, like they were very supportive and said, go for it and do it. And so I've kind of just, I've kind of just gone for it.

I'm somebody who just goes for things like I moved to Vegas, kind of out of nowhere. I'm here in Atlanta now out of nowhere. Uh, and I just am so passionate about, um, I think for me showing what's so cool about this ministry. And I think this is something I also wanted to say is like, honestly, a lot of the prisons I go to are maximum security prisons, like most of these guys are in prison for life for 20 years and they are so on fire for the Lord.

It's one of the, it feels like sometimes when it feels more safe than sometimes outside of prison, like in a, in a spot in Atlanta that I probably shouldn't be in like prison feels way more safe because these guys like they want to be there and they honestly keep each other in line because they know if someone acts out or someone does something like it's not going to be good, you know, they're going to lose their programming. They're going to lose things. And, um, so it's really, it's a really honestly like it's probably one of the most encouraging places that ever been. I would rather go to a prison church service than a regular church service if I'm being completely honest.

I love that. I love that. And it's a little bit like, like, I'm sure it's a build on what you just said. Like they're passionate and you know, they're, they're dedication, but like what is it about it in that experience that, you know, maybe some, some people who've never experienced that maybe can't even imagine how that's the case but why?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, these guys are, I mean, I was just inside of prison in Miami and they were jumping. They were singing a Maverick City song called, I think God, and it says the devil lost another one.

I am free. And they started a chain, a dancing chain and they're dancing singing that song. Like the devil lost another one. I am free.

The devil lost another one. I am free. I've got all different races, all different backgrounds, jumping up and down, singing the devil lost another one, and then a guy gets up and preaches the gospel, and they're jumping and they're screaming and they're praising the Lord. And then when they're saying, hey, let's pray for you guys.

Like the listeners pray for you. Like they even pray for our people who follow us on social media. They say we are praying for you because we know that you guys are out there sharing the gospel. So we're praying for you.

And it's so powerful because they're so passionate. Like another place, this is a, we were in a prison and it's hardy, it's hardy correctional institute in near Tampa. It's the prison that we've been in the longest. We've been there for about eight years.

And they, it got, so we helped start like a seminary program and a lot of different things. And the state of Florida, these guys are getting their seminary degrees. And then the state of Florida is now extending these new graduates from seminary to different prisons to preach the gospel because it's the piece that has created in that prison. It's a maximum security prison.

So most of these guys are life sentences. They barely have any fight. It used to be one of the worst prisons. Now it's one of the best prisons in the state.

And now they're sending, they're using it as a mission. Like the state of Florida is using it as a mission field to send people to other prisons so that they can start the same kinds of programs and mentor people and share the gospel. Like they're using the gospel. Like it's just wild.

You know what's crazy about that? Like it makes me feel like you can take God anywhere. And like so many times in the world today, right? We're trying to have less God take God out of every day because we have to be so politically correct.

But there is so much power. And when you need it, most like what I really like about God behind bars is, you know, Christianity and following Christ, a lot of it in our reality is about, you know, I think about Paul on Damascus Road, it's really about finding Jesus, not that you want to be at rock bottom, right? But it's the availability in the reality of Jesus when you are at rock bottom. So when you talk about these prisons and the sincerity, like it's not a gimmick.

They don't just want a card. They don't just, you know, want money or something like that. It's like, it's so much deeper. And that's what I hear when I hear that.

But just the power and the fact of like taking Jesus somewhere. And I think sometimes we don't realize it in our freedom of like, hey, taking God to a prison can bring peace to a prison. That is like, that's to me, like that's just like almost a real. Yeah.

And what could I do for what could I do for other communities? You know, like I think that's such a great example. If you think of the darkest place in the earth, honestly, on the earth, darkest places is honestly a prison. I mean, you've got all types of stuff happening there.

Like I really do believe like there's darkness, such darkness in prison. I've been to prisons that have, you know, we're just starting out and I'm like, this is deep, you know, and we're just bringing the light and it's a fight and it's hard. And like, but to see that what God does, is he just starts breaking through and he starts softening heart. And I just, I mean, just for the listeners to think about this, like I was just talking to a guy who's one of those same guys who was sent to another prison, he graduated seminary.

There are times where there's a threat, there's also a threat of death for these guys. And they, I mean, they're stabbing, there are, you know, things are happening inside of prisons that you don't hear about every day. Like there's killings guys die, like it is real life for them. So it has to be real.

It is easier for an inmate to just continue to do drugs, continue to stay in your day, but to step out and to live with Christ and to live for Christ, that takes you having to get out of your gang. It takes the threat of death. Like it is real decisions here, especially for life sentence guys, like honestly think about it, if you're there for your entire life, wouldn't it be easier to do the do your thing, live your same lifestyle, but these guys are stepping out and they're saying, I'm gonna follow Christ, I'm gonna join a different community, even in the threat of death, you know? Yeah, that's powerful.

Even to your point, right? It would be easier, even just to be like a closet Christian and just like, all right, I'm gonna get my life to Christ, but I'm not gonna go around like going to these events and like, you know, you gave the visual of like, you got these inmates in a worship service, you know, with different races and stuff. And you know, we've had other, we've had folks on the show who've done, you know, 25 years in prison, who've been to jail and you know, people give those stories and like, you know how dangerous it is and how, you know, so much stuff is about, you know, hey, the white gang over here, the black gang, the blurs, the crip, whatever, how it seems like in prison, it's like so many different ways of slice that pie. So picture the interracial aspect of worship, that seems, and I don't know if you would add anything on that, that seems like that would be powerful to experience live in a place like that, when so many times, even in just like in the free world, that's not even the case.

Totally, absolutely. Yeah, it's, I mean, I think even if you just, if anyone wants to go to our social media, just like looking at it, and I don't think most people see this, but I see it when I get to post stuff and our team gets to make stuff, but you see all colors, all races in the same place, worshiping Christ, that's a miracle. Like that is a true miracle that you get to see and you get to, it's something that I see that's a miracle. And I know most people, they don't understand it like, truly, when you hear these guys, and I honestly don't truly understand it either.

I'm not on the grounds 24 hours a day. Like I don't live there, but they live there. And they tell me so much of, you know, here's the classes, here's the different games, here's the different races that you need to hang out with and for them the church inside of prison. And I think this plays out to the larger church too, being a multi-ethnic, multi-racial place where people are loving Jesus and truly loving each other, is like, it's the coolest and most amazing thing.

Yeah, and you talk about social media, it's all that stuff for the listeners out there. Y'all know it's linked in the description of the show, but at God Behind Bars, just altogether. Like I said, I check out the page. I saw that, I don't know y'all were doing something with like Kirk Franklin in Maverick City or something recently.

Can you talk a little bit about this aspect of like, I know some of it is virtual, I was trying to piece it together, like where the worship part of like the artists or different folks that come in. Can you tell us about those experiences and even how that came about? Yeah, so being the director of innovation, I just figure out ways to make, I wanna create powerful events inside of prisons. Something that we're working on currently is, I wanna create a daddy daughter dance for inmates, where they can be reconnected with their daughter and get to spend time with them.

And farther than just, you know, just an hour conversation when they get to visit. But yeah, so Maverick City reached out and we just had some conversations and they wanted to record their next album inside of prisons, which has honestly really not been done for a very, very long time. So our team worked hard and we made it happen. And the other cool thing that happened there is, so Kirk Franklin was involved.

So they recorded their first album inside of prison. And the other thing that we did was, we had the largest event ever inside of a Florida prison. We were out of prison in Miami. It was had 1400 inmates there and 1300 inmates came to worship on the grounds.

It was the large, it was, the warden was shocked. He couldn't believe that it was even possible. He said, he came up to me and he said, the only time I've ever seen something like this is when there's a riot. And this is a prison, and this is worship.

So yeah, go ahead, sorry, go ahead, you just gotta be here, go ahead. Yeah, and so we did that, but I'm gonna throw this out there. So 1400 inmates, 1300 came and 100 were out of work camp. So every single inmate in the entire prison facility, heard the name of Jesus and came to a worship event.

And that has never happened in my entire life, nor have I ever heard of that happening, that happened. Listen, Isaac, and I know I'm sure it just, like I said, about you being a five, six guy on third base, like just the possibilities when we have God and like have those out of the box, innovative mindsets. And I'm sure there's so many people on you guys team that is involved and like, again, the visuals, I advise anybody check out God behind bars on Instagram or go to God behind bars.com. When I see, like I said, I've been following y'all, so I see the stories and the different inmates that talk.

And I'm like, when I first saw them, like how are they doing this? Like, is this, honestly, at first when I saw it, I was like trying to make sure it was real. Because that's how unique it is, right? You're just not used to seeing it that raw.

So kudos to y'all as it relates to that. So I do wanna talk about a couple of things as far as like statistics, right? So I know I've seen you guys founder and CEO, Jake, as a Jake Bodine, is that how you say it? Yeah, Jake, Jake Bodine.

Bodine. I've seen him talk about some things just on your website and stuff. And one of the things that's intriguing to me and has been for years is like, this idea of what is it, 92% of inmates will be released, but recidivism, 75% of them will end up back there. And one of the things I think y'all had listed on your website or either Jake might have mentioned is you guys address this by a three step process of what is a spiritual, physical, spiritual, and relational.

Can you just touch a little bit, like you don't have to go in depth about the processes, but just a little bit about what each of those mean and the importance of like giving these inmates that get released, something to hold on to, so they don't end up coming back, like 75% of them do. Yeah, yeah, no, it's a very staggering statistic. It's very frustrating at times, honestly. It's a frustrating statistic.

And honestly, our mission that we just talk about a lot is to introduce inmates to Jesus and connect them to the local church. And how we do that is kind of the first thing that we ever started was basically coming alongside a local church that wants to partner with us, and then we plant a satellite campus inside of prisons where their volunteers come in, acting as a church. So it looks at the living, breathing church and the inmates get introduced to these volunteers. They get prayed for on a weekly basis.

It's a weekly event. We set up an IMAX theater. So we actually work with the DOC and we create an IMAX theater experience. We go into gyms.

A lot of inmates won't, we're very strategic. A lot of inmates won't go to a chapel because of what a chapel means. Maybe they don't believe in God, maybe they're frustrated at the God, but when we set up in a gym, so the gym usually has more space for inmates to come. So we set up in a gym because they're more willing to come and we create a whole IMAX experience and honestly our services, we have 54 campuses now across the U.S.

and we have an average of 92, sometimes 300 inmates showing up, which is massive, massive amount. It's like packed out. And then what we try to do from there is we, our goal is when these guys get out, the problem in my opinion, and I think this is what our organizations are, there's a lot of problems. I'm not just saying.

You can't get it, right. The community, like they get, guys get released and they get sent out with, honestly with nothing and they get dropped off back in the same community that they were arrested in. And they're back with the same people, the same environment and it's crushing them. They can't, they've been taken out of it and maybe they're thriving and then they get put back in it and they've never been able to adjust.

So our big thing is basically the people who are outside the prison walls and they get out is the church and the church, it biked them into their community, into their church. They get them plugged in, they get to help them. We have Fresh Start, Fresh Start kits to kind of help them get back into the community. Some of them, I think some of them even have like a cell phone and they have different gift cards to kind of get them back on their feet because a lot of inmates get out with zero dollars.

They have nothing. And they've got to go and try and figure it out or no one's getting them a job. So it's very hard for them to get back into the world. But if we can connect them to the local church, there are business people on the church who can connect them to their, to a job.

Like there's a lot that a church can do for them. So our biggest thing is connecting them to the local church, getting them back on their feet. What's cool too is families are going, we take a church that's close to, you know, where their families are and their families are connecting with the church and getting them plugged in because also a family aspect is so important for these men and women because, you know, sometimes their families are the biggest advocates to get back into it or sometimes they're in, you know, they're into all this, the crime and the drugs and everything. So during, and also in prison, we do celebrate recovery, we do small groups.

And then now we have the PANDO app, which is the first Christian app ever inside of prison that streams 24-7 content, Christian content inside of prison. We have the chosen, we have every, honestly, about 50 churches that are streaming that put content in there. 24-7, we're reaching 350,000 inmates and 60,000 inmates that accepted Christ as of Monday on the app. So.

Wow, that's, I love that. So when you think about like, okay, you're the director of innovation, you've got this app that's streaming into a prison, you know, what are like, where do you go? Like, I'm just curious now, like, I know I might be a little all over the place because we're talking about the organization itself and I'm back to maybe tapping in a little bit into Isaac and the reason I'm saying this is because there's so much, for me, like the show is like, when I do these interviews, there's so much an opportunity for me to learn about leaders, innovative thinkers and so for yourself, how are you thinking through where you go next? Like, what can you tell us about, hey, this is where you all are now and this is pretty out of the box and innovative.

How far does your mind go into the future or do you just stay in the presence or how do you balance that up? Yeah, someone once told me that pace of the leader is pace of the team and I really focus on my pace because if I go too far out, you know, I lose people along the way, I have a team, I have three people. We're honestly a really lean and mean team. We have 12 people, I got behind bars.

So it's not this massive, you know, huge thing. It's a small, I have three people on my team that help me do what I do and I think the biggest thing that I take as a leader, one, I'm one of those guys, I have all the ideas all the time, but what is just the best next step? And honestly, a lot of that is waiting on the Lord, asking him for what you want me to do. And then, but also like my team have great ideas, honestly, sometimes better ideas.

And I think the biggest thing that I've learned along the way is find people that obviously are, that compliment your weaknesses, who they have strengths, but also who are just better than you. And honestly, I have a team that's better than me. And my job that I take very seriously is letting them go. I want my team to be entrepreneurs.

Like my, I'm an entrepreneur at heart and I want to instill in my team, you guys go take new territory, go trail new grounds. Like they're all innovators too. Like I want you to go do the impossible. And my job is to steer them and to say, hey, you know, we're a little off course here.

This is the direction we need to stay on, you know, keeping people, meeting people to Jesus and helping them follow him. You know, like we want to stay on that route. Or if they're slacking, like it's for me to push. Hey, you need to push here.

I see you flacking. What can we talk about? How can I help you? Is there something that's confusing?

And I feel like my, a lot of my job is direction, but also destination. So I'm saying, hey, we're going here and I can talk about the destination is kind of more of your question. But, and I think the biggest, how I pick the destination is how do I, how do I, what is the potential reach for the potential cost and how, and or it's a hard question, honestly, because there's so many aspects to it because there is cost to it, but there's also faith involved. So honestly, I think it's, like cause I like that, like the layers of that question, right?

Like you said, it's like there's cost involved, there's faith involved. It makes me think like, cause what I'm trying to figure out like, even with you and the type of leader you are, is like you said earlier, you're the type of person that likes to jump and just go. And now there's so many entrepreneurs and people who are either leaders or aspiring leaders to listen to this show. That's where the heart of the question is, is because these are the type of things that people want to know is like, man, we see this amazing brand.

We can go to the Instagram and see the work that guys behind bars is doing. And then we can go and you know, we hear your stories right and hear the impact. And then there's like you leading this with a team of three people. And it's like, man, how does Isaac balance, right?

The cost with the faith. Like how do you balance all of those things? Yeah, man, I think, yeah. I think the best way I can describe it is make, I think all of us have to know the mission.

I think, and I used to not think, like I used to be kind of bored when people are like, you know, make a really cool mission statement, very big slogan or whatever. And like, I won, you've got to have a mission. You've got to know what you're doing. You've got to know where you're going.

And I'm very clear with what I want to do because an the mission is to, I want to share, I want to reach as many inmates for Christ before I die. And I want to connect them with a local church, but I also want to tell their story. And if those things don't align, if there's like some event that we want to do that, I get asked by everybody to do events. Like, hey, let's do this.

Or hey, let's do that. And I say no to a lot of them because it's not really what we're about. Like, I don't want it. Like I got asked by a pretty big business person saying, hey, I would like to, I'd like to go into prison and speak about business classes.

That's a really, it was a very like, you know, I was like, gang, let's do it. Like, let's do it. My first reaction was let's do it. And then I was like, let me pause.

And I'm like, okay, it's gonna cost 10 grand, you know, to make this thing happen. That we honestly like doesn't, but it doesn't really fit with what we're doing. And I had to say no to that because I just, it wasn't our mission and it wasn't like where we're at. And yeah, so I think it's being clear on your, clear on what your mission is because also too, like a lot of our event, I don't do a bit, we have a lot of events going on, but especially the ones that we film and the one we invest a lot in, like I have to choose those.

And it has to have the best outcome. Like we're actually going to, this is a sneak peek, but this is one that was kind of, not outside our scope, but it's on the line. There's an Instagram called Ball Is Life, it's a basketball team. Yeah, I'll follow that.

Yeah, yeah, we're gonna bring, we're working on bringing them and their team to go play the prison team inside of prison. We're gonna share the gospel after and do some stuff with that and maybe some worship too. So that one's like, that one's unique. And now I like that, I want to be unique, but I also want to make sure that it stays on.

There's a mission. That's funny, there's a, I can't think, I wish I could think of the name of it. And I know y'all don't have a campus here in Michigan, but there's just something to think about. There is a prison ministry here, I'm trying to get them on the show, that's why I know this.

And that's what they do. Their prison ministry is about going to play basketball in the prison. So I got to think of the name of it, but it was, it's pretty cool. I've reached out to them to try to get them on the show.

So I just love like, you know, my degree is in marketing, my background is in marketing and sales. So I love hearing how people innovate and also like, you know, getting granular with like how, but I want to make sure people didn't miss. And look, Isaac, you just said some stuff. I don't even know if you realize how powerful it was.

So I want to just kind of add some color here a little bit. Because you said some amazing things. You talked about, first thing you said earlier was like, hey, you're this person that just goes, you like to jump, right? But then as a director, you also said someone gave you that title, but as director of innovation, when I asked you the question, what was crazy to me is like, you weren't even thinking about your title, but you were talking about your job is to direct people, right?

And to the destination. And what I like about everything that you said is that there's a lot of balance between having faith, the faith to jump, but being very clear on your mission. So even I think people think of faith sometimes as being absolutely blind to the direction that you're going in. And that's what the case, like you're like, I have faith, I'm willing to jump, but I don't know exactly where I'm laying, but I know I'm landing in the direction that I'm pointed to because I'm very clear about the mission.

And I'm willing not to do things. So Isaac, like that was why, like I can't tell you how excited I get being able to be blessed to talk to people like you because there's so much, like sometimes you're probably just working in your U, right? So it's like, I don't know, like this is kind of, I mean, I think like this, like I'm just me. Like so some of this stuff is not really a big deal.

It's like I'm just doing it. I'm grateful and all of that. But you don't realize like how much someone else might be struggling just for that clarity of like, hey, you got to be clear about your mission. And then that frees you up to have faith.

Some of us are just jumping in every direction and like calling it faith. And it's like, no, that's not faith. So thank you so much for sharing that aspect. And I love the ball this life thing as well.

Well, even just to add a couple of things one, that's you just accepted it so good. I think that's so good. But also I think I really do want to honor our CEO, like, Jake who he has, he honestly has more. He's the guy who's jumping.

Like, honestly, sometimes I feel like I'm like, trying to catch up to him because he just thinks, I mean, the fact that he did this, I really do want to honor him. And I think honor is so important in general because he has really pushed the bounds of what's possible. He's 35 years old and doing all of this and has figured out a way to make this possible. And he really inspires me to be, to think innovative.

But he also gives me the freedom to think innovative too and to go for things. And I think that's so important. And I know not everyone has this kind of CEO, but I think if you are a CEO listening, or if you're in a place like that, I think just caring and loving your team really well is a really important thing. Because you really can't do it.

If you're a totalitarian leader, I'm never been a fan of that. And I also think hiring the right people is important. Like, if you don't hire the right people, you've got to get the right people on the bus in the right seat. I love the book, good to great.

It's my favorite book. And he talks about putting the right people on the bus. You can have the right people on the bus in the wrong seat. So find the right seat for them too.

And then the other thing, this is kind of marketing-wise, I was just thinking about this. I don't know if I can throw this in there, but funny thing. And this I think has to do with some messaging stuff as far as if someone is in the business world. But one thing that changed for our Instagram, when I took it on, we were at $13,000 and getting like 100 likes or whatever.

And I was kind of just posting about, I kept saying like, God behind bars, look what we're doing. God behind bars, look what we're doing. And I just, I started to change my messaging to like, how do I stop talking about what we're doing and just talk, start talking about what's God's doing with people? And I know that doesn't have, not everyone's in the Christian world, but I think it changed my life to start talking, basically being the second character.

And I think story brands talks about this being the guide, being the guide, on the guide and these are the heroes. And that's what our social media is about. And we went from $13,000 to $50,000. And then when Reels came out and TikTok started getting big, I really tried to figure out the algorithm and I tried my best and we went from $50,000 to now $257,000.

And it was over about two years that happened. So I just think, yeah. I love that. Like you talk about Don Miller's story brand, like that book is, I mean, I've talked about that on the show and being a guy, right?

Like, you know, inspire guys, people, balancing faith and business to guide you to your purpose. I think the power of being a guy is so important. And like you said, like kind of being able to take your stuff out of it. And it is, it's important for our show, because this is a Christian show and it's about faith and business.

And so many folks that we've had on the show and that are listening, I know a lot, I don't know all of them are listening, but I know a lot of the faithful listeners, you know, just through Instagram and Facebook stuff. And so a lot of folks are at various levels in business. And that's one of the things that's challenging for people to figure out is messaging. So I do know that that is really impactful.

And even along those lines, right? How did you start making the message in the visual line? What was your thought process around that? Because I think you all do a great job visually.

Like when I go to Guy Behind Bars, I don't just hear it or read it. I see it in the content that's produced. Yeah, I mean, telling a great story is so important. And I'm not very good at probably telling stories actually like in verbally.

I'm actually not very good at it. But I love writing a caption that is honestly like, people can feel the passion, they can feel it. And I want to, I think just having all of these connect is one investing, I feel like I've invested a lot of time trying to understand what people like to see, but also staying true to who I am. Like there's nothing where somebody once told me a big YouTuber that I was talking to, they had a video go viral that they didn't want to go viral and they've had to do like pranking.

And they're like, we don't even like doing this, but it went viral and people expect to see that. So one, make sure you don't do that. And stay on, stay on like what you're good at, not what you think, but you have to like build on it. Like it's not an overnight success.

It's not a big like, most people are not an overnight success, but like I think it's a balance of, I go back and forth on this because I believe in organic is making that raw real feeling. I want the real person. Like I want, I don't want fake. I think people in our society don't want fake.

Like they want, I think even after COVID people are like, I've seen all the content. I've seen all the policy stuff. I've seen it all. I want something real and authentic.

And I think showing that is the most important thing. Even showing who you are as a raw and authentic person is a really important thing. And I think that's what I really try to connect with is to show like, this is actually truly who they are. Like honestly, I ask them a lot of questions, a lot of inmates questions to get them warmed up.

So it's not fake. And then I go for the punch later. I'm like, so tell me like, when you like, tell me, I literally ask sometimes like, you know, what did you do? And they tell me.

And sometimes I can't share it all like, and I can't do it. But they tell me, man, they shot somebody in the head. Like we get to that part and they start. But it's like getting down to the, to who they act like to the Ronis takes, it takes time.

And I really tried to know the right questions. But also like, I want, I think it's Ronis and authenticity and storytelling all mixed together to something powerful. No, I love it. That's amazing.

I want to actually one last thing for I get you out of here. You know, you talk about being able to hear all those stories and things is, and those experiences in the present. Is there any one experience conversation in mate, whatever it might be that you've experienced in your three years at God behind bars that changed you in your personal life? Yeah.

Yeah, honestly, I think one of the, I did an event with vertical worship about, it must have been two years, about a year and a half ago. This is when I really started trying to do events a lot more inside of prison than they did a worship thing. And we were in a maximum security prison and they started seeing a way maker. And I really don't like when I go into prison, like anxiety is a little high.

Like there's a lot of adrenaline running just because there's a lot of things to figure out. I'm not scared. Sometimes I'm in an uncomfortable position, but not really that many times. But I, but it's a lot, there's a lot, there's guards, there's guns, there's just a lot happening.

And yeah, so I usually like, I'm on high alert the entire time and then I get done and I cool off and then I kind of recap what's happening. But during this worship event, and you can see this, actually you can see the full song on YouTube on top of my bars, it's called Waymaker. I'm gonna check it out. And all these guys, they started singing.

And the guy starts, I could cry right now, but he's like, you are here. And then that was it. That's all I said, and the entire, every man sang over them. He sang over him.

And like, chills came down my body. And when they started singing Waymaker, Miracle Worker, Promise Keeper, Light and the Darkness, I just started weeping. And I saw guys dropping on their knees weeping. And guys just just balling, inmates balling singing this song.

And I think that was the moment. I think that's one of the biggest moments because it was the first time it hit me that this song is different in prison. These guys are singing that God is Promise Keeper when they're never getting out. And that God is a Waymaker when they're never getting out.

And that really changed my life because I was like, I need to do this more. And I gotta go harder. Honestly, I was like, I don't wanna stop doing this until every inmate that I know how I can reach can be reached. Wow, that's powerful, man.

Now, look, Isaac, this was really powerful stuff. You are full of, your experiences give you a lot of wisdom. And I could tell, it just kinda comes out. You probably don't even always realize it.

So I appreciate you sharing everything that you share today. Look, God Behind Bars.com, at God Behind Bars. It's all gonna be in the description and links for today's show. Definitely shout out to the founder, Jake, because to your point and honor him earlier.

And I could tell just from watching the videos and stuff, right, in order to birth something like this and even have an innovative leader. Like, and you talked about it, but leaders, there's this book by Liz Weisman, multipliers. And she talks about in leadership, you're either a multiplier or a diminisher. And people like Jake who have folks like you on this team, they're definitely multipliers.

And you talk like a multiplier for your team. And so, like for anybody out there listening, that's the importance of great leadership, both being a good leader and also following good leadership. I like you, do not like folks who are just like, authoritarians and like, it's not my style. I think they diminish people's ability.

So leaders out there, your job is the first. And you don't let a legacy, don't let a legacy wanna happen. And you don't have to do that because God gave us all so many gifts and talents. So Isaac, this was amazing.

Appreciate you. And look, man, when we go video, maybe I'll reach out to you again. Definitely stay in touch. If you ever need anything from me, don't hesitate to reach out.

You got my information. And I look forward to staying in touch and seeing what God behind bars does moving forward. And then, thank you so much for having me on. This is awesome.

Peace, bye. I can see beyond the tears you cry. I saw every hill you had to climb. When you say you ain't afraid to die.

Is it safe to say you lie? When you blame the haters, I made you. You're the reason you ain't made it. Take your focus off the plane.

The purpose they gave you. Create some of this name. Jesus, that's how we go from town enough to made new. I can see the new of you that saved soul.

It's deep within the dollars and the pesos. The devil is still on attack. You gotta be quicker than that. Store the church in heaven.

You can't be richer than that. Are you gonna be richer than that? It's not saying what you're gonna do till you do it. Guys, people, you know what I meant?

I really don't take the opportunity for granted. Like, I was thinking, like, this show, it's so crazy. Just the opportunities to present and being able to connect with people all across the world who are doing amazing things as believers. And, you know, a huge part of my goal and why I bring people on today, like in Isaac and, you know, so many of the guests we've had through the last couple years is so that you can see, like, what's possible.

You know what I mean? Like, like, we're just regular people and I'm saying this because it is. It's very easy. Like, our fleshly desire is to idolize celebrities.

So what we do is we, like, hand-pick these, you know, few people, when you really think about celebrities, only a few of them, like, in a grand scheme of things. Like, it's not a lot of them. They really are a minority of people in number. But, like, we idolize them and we make it seem as if life is all about them.

You know what I mean? Like, how many, your entertainment cycle, your timeline, like, I mean, man, you know, I can't even check my email. I'm not lying to you. One of the most toxic places on Earth is, like, the news from your phone or your email service, before you can even log in.

All of the things, all of the negativity and just, maybe it's not negative. It's just pointless. Like, oh, somebody wore a bathing suit today where they're like, man, I'm telling you, like, the enemy be everywhere. You can't click that stuff, right?

You gotta fight it. I know, like, some of us, you know, we want to gravitate to those things, but it's so pointless. And I see the impact that it has on people in real life. And so, again, I'm not here judging what content you listen to or watch or read.

But I'm telling you, man, you got to guard yourself in the same way that I've seen. Seeds be planted. Like, you know, all of these celebrity, I don't want to use names for real and call them by y'all. But like, a lot of these celebrities, like, the superficial nature that they take on.

And then I watch people try to be that and emulate that. And that's what we do as human beings. You got to recognize that. That's just who we are.

So for me, because I recognize that the goal is to try to put people in front of myself who are worth emulating or who have characteristics and things about them that are worth emulating. Because we really should be focused on Christ overall. We shouldn't be idolizing people. So that's not to go to make you idolize people.

But my point is, you know, hopefully what you get from these interviews and as we continue to grow this show is that, look, anything is possible. I said it during the interview, anything is possible, man. And I meet so many amazing people that, you know, we would never even do exist and they doing great things. And then I watch people who think that they got to try to be a celebrity to have, you know, some type of purpose in life.

And this show is about showing you another way. The biblical model that God used regular people and he didn't have to make them famous for them to have purpose. I think that's one of the things that people just fail to see is like, you don't have to become the most famous person in the world to be successful and to have purpose. You could do it like you.

Now think about me as I believe that. I wouldn't say it on the show all the time if I didn't believe it. You literally have the power that gives the ability to skill set to become something that you've never seen before. And it doesn't mean fame or attention or you got to walk the rear carpet.

There's so many ways to become successful, man. And so that's, you know, what we do here in Aspire Guys, people just try to expand our horizons and mentally, physically, spiritually, our environment, our network. And hopefully you get that. Hopefully you can feel that from this show.

Hit me up, man. Email me, germanywilsomeusicagmail.com. Let me know what you think of the show. And look, man, subscribe to my YouTube channel.

I should at least have 136 subscribers by next week. Y'all won't subscribe either because I got, I mean, it don't even matter. You know what? Just subscribe.

I love y'all, man. Thanks for listening to the Marvel Critters, too. You were real one for that.