Ep. 196: Jews vs. Rome: Jewish disunity is fatal episode artwork

EPISODE · Nov 13, 2025 · 53 MIN

Ep. 196: Jews vs. Rome: Jewish disunity is fatal

from Think Twice with Jonathan Tobin · host JNS Podcasts

Though the study of history is being slighted by contemporary educators, according to JNS editor-in-chief Jonathan S. Tobin, knowledge of the past, including that of the ancient world, is more important than ever if we are to understand current dilemmas. And that’s especially true in the Middle East.   He’s joined in this week’s episode of Think Twice by Hoover Institution scholar Barry Strauss, one of the leading experts on the ancient world and the author of the new book, Jews vs. Rome: Two Centuries of Rebellion Against the World’s Mightiest Empire.   Strauss’s book tells the story of the three rebellions fought by Jews against the Roman Empire over the course of a 70-year period stretching from 66 C.E. to 136 C.E. that included the Great Revolt, the destruction of Jerusalem and the Holy Temple, a little-known Diaspora revolt and the Bar Kochba rebellion. The history of these struggles is integral to the story of the Jews. But some historians call the Jews of the ancient world Judeans rather than Jews. Strauss disagrees with this since, as he says, “this is to write Jews out of Jewish history.”   The historian says there are some important lessons for Jews and Israelis to draw from these tragic episodes.   One is the danger of disunity. The divisions between the Jews fighting the Romans and each other inside besieged Jerusalem were, he says, “absolutely fatal.” He notes that, there should be a lesson that you can only take political disputes during a time of war or in a dangerous period “only so far.” That’s something that Israelis learned from the Oct. 7, 2023 attack, since the Palestinians believed they were too divided to unite and defend their county.   Strauss says another issue is the relationship between faith and politics. Jewish extremists believed that God would save them if they fought Rome no matter how steep the odds. “Faith is essential for Jews and for everyone in their own particular way. But when you are letting it lead you to politically dangerous, unintelligent decisions, then you have to really think things through and you have to be careful of what you're doing.”   Yet another lesson Strauss says that can be drawn from the revolts is that “small states never are fully independent.” In fact, he added, “Even large states are never fully independent. Everyone needs allies, but small states above all need allies. And so, I think Israel today must learn from the lesson of the failure of the rebels in the great revolts.” Speaking of the Jewish rebels, he says, “They had a plan that was an intelligent plan, which involved getting help from Parthia [an independent kingdom located in modern-day Iraq and Iran that successfully resisted Rome]. But they should have been able to do a cost-benefit analysis and say, it's not likely and maybe back down then.”   The author says the failure of America’s education system to teach history is “terrible” and largely the fault of progressives. “The so-called woke people are selling narratives that give a completely different view of American history and of the world, and that makes it easier for people to push the button of the oldest hatred and to cast the Jews as the villains,” Strauss says. “It’s absolutely essential for the next generation, for good people to get control of the educational system and to bring us back to a sensible educational system in which people can study history without fear or favor in an unbiased way. We know as citizens, whether we're Jewish or not, that education is absolutely essential. So, this is something that we have to prioritize.”   Listen/Subscribe to weekly episodes on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube Music, iHeart Radio or wherever you listen to your podcasts.   Watch new episodes every week by subscribing to the JNS YouTube Channel.

Though the study of history is being slighted by contemporary educators, according to JNS editor-in-chief Jonathan S. Tobin, knowledge of the past, including that of the ancient world, is more important than ever if we are to understand current dilemmas. And that’s especially true in the Middle East.   He’s joined in this week’s episode of Think Twice by Hoover Institution scholar Barry Strauss, one of the leading experts on the ancient world and the author of the new book, Jews vs. Rome: Two Centuries of Rebellion Against the World’s Mightiest Empire.   Strauss’s book tells the story of the three rebellions fought by Jews against the Roman Empire over the course of a 70-year period stretching from 66 C.E. to 136 C.E. that included the Great Revolt, the destruction of Jerusalem and the Holy Temple, a little-known Diaspora revolt and the Bar Kochba rebellion. The history of these struggles is integral to the story of the Jews. But some historians call the Jews of the ancient world Judeans rather than Jews. Strauss disagrees with this since, as he says, “this is to write Jews out of Jewish history.”   The historian says there are some important lessons for Jews and Israelis to draw from these tragic episodes.   One is the danger of disunity. The divisions between the Jews fighting the Romans and each other inside besieged Jerusalem were, he says, “absolutely fatal.” He notes that, there should be a lesson that you can only take political disputes during a time of war or in a dangerous period “only so far.” That’s something that Israelis learned from the Oct. 7, 2023 attack, since the Palestinians believed they were too divided to unite and defend their county.   Strauss says another issue is the relationship between faith and politics. Jewish extremists believed that God would save them if they fought Rome no matter how steep the odds. “Faith is essential for Jews and for everyone in their own particular way. But when you are letting it lead you to politically dangerous, unintelligent decisions, then you have to really think things through and you have to be careful of what you're doing.”   Yet another lesson Strauss says that can be drawn from the revolts is that “small states never are fully independent.” In fact, he added, “Even large states are never fully independent. Everyone needs allies, but small states above all need allies. And so, I think Israel today must learn from the lesson of the failure of the rebels in the great revolts.” Speaking of the Jewish rebels, he says, “They had a plan that was an intelligent plan, which involved getting help from Parthia [an independent kingdom located in modern-day Iraq and Iran that successfully resisted Rome]. But they should have been able to do a cost-benefit analysis and say, it's not likely and maybe back down then.”   The author says the failure of America’s education system to teach history is “terrible” and largely the fault of progressives. “The so-called woke people are selling narratives that give a completely different view of American history and of the world, and that makes it easier for people to push the button of the oldest hatred and to cast the Jews as the villains,” Strauss says. “It’s absolutely essential for the next generation, for good people to get control of the educational system and to bring us back to a sensible educational system in which people can study history without fear or favor in an unbiased way. We know as citizens, whether we're Jewish or not, that education is absolutely essential. So, this is something that we have to prioritize.”   Listen/Subscribe to weekly episodes on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube Music, iHeart Radio or wherever you listen to your podcasts.   Watch new episodes every week by subscribing to the JNS YouTube Channel.

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This episode was published on November 13, 2025.

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Though the study of history is being slighted by contemporary educators, according to JNS editor-in-chief Jonathan S. Tobin, knowledge of the past, including that of the ancient world, is more important than ever if we are to understand current...

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