Welcome to Talking Nonsense, I'm Christopher, I'm here with my cousin Kyle. And today's topic we are talking about shows. First and foremost, everything on this podcast is our own opinion, they don't necessarily reflect opinions of the shows, or essentially are pushing any sort of agenda or anything like that. Basically just don't get buttered.
We're literally just talking nonsense and sitting with the show. And if you aren't gonna get buttered, you're probably like 14 and you don't deserve an opinion. Or you're 39 and don't deserve an opinion. Either way, don't get buttered.
Just be a grown up and just listen to us rant. I was thinking earlier too, like that for the name of our show or whatever, my friend about it that we started to podcast, whatever and I told her like, we're basically just gassing, like what's it gonna be about? I told her like every week's gonna be a different show, like this week or whatever is about TV shows and in general or whatever. I basically said like we're basically just ranting.
And then when I said that I was like, just ranting, like we could have just been just ranting. Cause then we could have called all our listeners, juniors. But I mean, it's why talking nonsense is funny too. That's exactly what it is, it's nonsense.
Like we said in the beginning as a disclaimer, it's all our own opinions, you know, just don't get buttered. Oh and huge spoilers ahead for since this topic is about shows and possibly movies. We're probably gonna spoil a lot you guys. Cause I mean.
Yeah, spoilers ahead. If you don't want to know anything, just don't listen. Or listen and fuck it. Do you have any shows that you specifically wanted to talk about?
I have a few that I did want to talk about, but like I mean, have you watched any new shows recently? I did just finish the second season 13 recently. Oh perfect, I was gonna ask you that. But I wanna say that to the end.
It's the end of every single show. I've got a lot to say about that show. Like any other shows? You've watched recently?
No, that's about it. Which I kind of want to get into though is because like, after watching 13 Reasons Why, there is like, I ended up thinking about like, what makes a show get or bad? And so what parameters are like, what, since you are kind of in that field, so to speak, what do you think would be a, or what are some guidelines that makes a good show, a show good for you or a show bad in your opinion? Well, I think for sure it has to deal a lot with like the characters.
Like for one, like a lot of times people say you have to make the characters relatable. Like people have to have a reason to like, either root for the protagonists or, you know, hate the antagonists and show or whatever, right? And like I think when it comes, it's not just that like you could have great characters, but then it's also the writing. Like if you have good characters, but shitty ass dialogue, like basic like, I'm so and so, who are you?
Oh, I am this guy. You know, like it's bull crap. And also like actors too, like you need people who could portray those characters well. Like there's this one show, I forgot what it was called, but the dialogue was great.
The acting was just terrible. And it's just like, I could never like, get into it because of that reason. It's just like, oh, I can't take any of these people seriously. Like what they're saying in the show is like, oh, like it's so deep and like I wanna get into it.
But because of how the actors are doing it, it's just like, come on. Like that and then directors too, like if they can't specifically tell their actors how to act this way, the whole point of the directors, you know, is to direct how the show should go. Right. Or whatever.
If they can't do that with their actors, like they can have bad actors or whatever, but you can have a good director guiding them, or you can have great actors, but a bad director guiding them. Like a director's like, oh, do what you want or whatever. But it's just like, no, you guys gotta work together. I think that's, most of the reasons what makes a good show and a bad show.
Like if you don't have those, bad show, you have those great show. Yeah, for sure. But as far as like, because I mean, there's, right now I'm like, I'm watching like a whole bunch of shows, like on TV and on Netflix. And like that's the other thing I wanted to ask you, like are you mainly watching like Netflix shows?
Are you watching like, you know, actual on the network television shows? I mean, I've definitely strayed away from network shows on the TV, just because I feel like they're very cookie cutter. In the sense that it's very, let's just get script out, let's get this episode out, push it out and then on to the next one. And that might not necessarily be true, but I've definitely gravitated more towards like Netflix or product.
Netflix, honestly right now, it's killing it with all their original stuff. Yeah. Yeah. And their movies and their shows, like they're killing it, sorry, good.
No, no, no, no, no, like one show that I really did, like I'm kind of sad that never got to go on was a Marco Polo on Netflix. Netflix original? Yeah. I've never watched that.
I've seen it. I mean, I've seen it on there, but I've never watched it. It's honestly pretty good. I'm not sure on like how accurate it is historically.
And if you're one of those people who is like, oh, it's not historically accurate. I mean, you kind of go F yourself, but. I mean, it's a show. Yeah, right.
It's not entertaining, you know? And if it's like historically accurate, Marco Polo is boring, and obviously it's not gonna be a good show. Yeah. But don't go too crazy as Marco Polo is a disco guy.
It's like, don't make it fake. Too fake. So it's like, it only got two seasons because apparently from what I've read is that it got to like the production cost and it got to like game at their own level. And the actors wanted more money.
So I mean, I can understand why. I think with Marco Polo, I think, because that came out like long time ago. That was like before Netflix started pushing out all their original shows. And I think maybe then they didn't have the money to do that.
But then once all their original shows started picking up and people were like, oh, chef is hella good. They started getting more money for it. So they probably pushed that off to the side. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if they ever brought that back eventually, or maybe even made it into a movie or whatever for themselves.
I think that would be cool for them to do. Because now they got the money for sure. Because like I said, Netflix shows are killing it right now. But I mean, I still watch a few network shows.
They are kind of cookie cutter, but there are a few good ones out there, like how to get away with murder. I love that show. But you don't watch that. No, I mean, you got to watch it though.
It's just, it's so, like that show has the actors, like the good actors, the great dialogue. You know what I mean? And directing of it is like perfect. You could like feel exactly what the characters are feeling in that show, like when they're going through with their intense moments.
It's just like, oh, oh, shit, oh shit. Like what's gonna happen? Like it just pulls you in. And like just the way of storytelling is with that show because every season starts out with kind of, well at least the first season started out with first episode with show end of the season, kind of, or whatever.
And like every episode from that would just build up to how it got to that point. And even though they show you like what happens, just seeing how everything builds up to that, she's like, oh, so that, oh, so he's, whoa. You know what I'm saying? It's good.
And then another show that I watch right now, actually it's new, it's Deception. It's ABC, I think it's yeah, ABC show. I think you would like the show too. It's actually really cool.
It's basically about this magician who kind of got framed or whatever. I think I saw like a commercial for this. Yeah, and like now he's working for the FBI trying, because so basically like the magician or whatever, he has a twin brother that no one ever knew about and that's how he did most of his tricks. And then his twin brother got framed for a murder.
So his twin brother's in jail or whatever. So he's trying to prove his innocence by working with the FBI, solved with the crimes and then also solving his brother's crime or whatever or his alleged crime. And that's pretty good actually. Yeah, it's actually really dope.
Cause like it shows, like when they do solve a crime, it shows like how they solved it or whatever and stuff. It's using like the magician's like stuff to do it. Like there's this one episode where they had to like save this girl. She was like trapped in this museum or whatever with the door down and there's explosives.
So they had to like, and there was cameras in that certain area that the bad guy was using to watch. They're like the every move, just in that one room. So they used mirrors to trick him to get in and like get her out or whatever. And it was like really cool seeing like how that's done.
Cause it's like, oh, so that's how magicians do like the whole trick thing. The writing of that one's kind of, I mean, it might seem a little corny to you, but I still think it, I think the actors for that show, like I think they do it, they pull it off. Like they're good enough to like be passed off of that corny stuff or corny stuff. Yeah.
I'm really glad you rough that up. Cause I was just thinking the dialogue in like Marvel movies, especially like the way the actors pull it off. And they kind of have like mesh with the dialogue really, really well as opposed to like, I guess DC movies. I do like the characters like obviously Superman Batman, like they have pretty cool perspectives to them, but it's so very like just the one lineers where they try to be funny.
It's like, yeah, well, I mean, if you're talking specifically just just as League, I think the problem with that one was just cause bad result of Batman be Superman. Everyone said that was too dark and they, Oh, is that funny or route? Okay. I think they just tried a little too hard.
I guess what it was. I mean, like DC DC's DC Marvel's Marvel, whatever. But like in terms of like movies or whatever, Marvel's definitely got it down just cause they've been in the game longer. Like they started off perfect by doing each individual characters own single movie, then building them up altogether instead of like how DC they're like late in the game.
They're trying to shove everything into one movie just and then all of a sudden individual movies is just like, well, I mean, I don't like how they're doing them all. But that I feel like that's like another topic. That's all movies. But another show also that I'm watching right now is Quantico.
Oh, yeah. Have you ever watched that? I watched a few episodes. It's not a bad show.
Definitely. I just feel like it's one of those hit or miss kind of things. Yeah, well, because right now, the first two seasons for Quantico were great. Because the first season, the way they built it up was like, it's kind of the same thing with how to get away with murder.
They show what happens at the end. And then each episode builds up to how it got to there. And then it's all about a mystery thing. Because you're trying to figure out who did it each episode.
You learn a little bit more about the other characters. You're like, oh, it might have been him or it might have been him. And that's how it was for the first two seasons. This third season right now, they totally changed the whole thing.
It's not even about that anymore. It's like the thing with Quantico, I started out with the main character of the girl. I don't know her name. I don't know what her name.
I don't watch the show. But anyway, I started out with her becoming an FBI agent at Quantico. That was the whole, that was really loud, huh? Yeah, that was like the whole, you could see it on the left.
I don't have to edit that. But that was the whole season of her at the school in Quantico or whatever. And then season two was like, she joins the CIA. So now she's at the school for the CIA.
And in my mind, I'm thinking like, oh, this is a great show, whatever you know, it was good. But I'm thinking at the same time, like the third season, I'm wondering if you're going to do it, she's going to join the NSA now and start the school over there. You know what I mean? It's the third season, they'll change it all.
It's no school, nothing doesn't show you anything about the future, whatever, it's literally her and her old-class name, now FBI agents or whatever. And it's just following their team and them solving cases. Yeah. Is that a bad thing in your present?
I mean, it's just, see, that's the thing too. There's another show that kind of did that, which I hate that more compared to Quantico. Because right now, I guess both. Both.
Yeah, because with Quantico, it's just, when you have those first two seasons like that, and then all of a sudden, the third season, it makes sense. Because we're going to go from season two. They had to do it for this, which was fine. It's fine for me right now.
I mean, there's only a few episodes out right now. Yeah. And I've watched them. And they're good, or whatever.
But I'm going to miss how the first two seasons were. For the other show, though, that did the same thing, where the first two seasons were a specific way. And then now, it's just totally like different is an empire. That's the, with Terence Howard, President.
Yeah. And Tourage, whatever. Yeah, her. The first season was great.
And the reason why I hate it now is because I think with the first season, the way they played it off as, is like this show is going to be about a family who's in the music business and going to be about their music and them fighting amongst each other, kind of like trying to claim the throne, going to be the next big owner or whatever. Like, that's how it was for the first season. And season two was still kind of like that. But then as season two progressed, it started becoming more of a freaking soap opera.
Yeah. Straight up soap opera drama. Like freaking, Terence Howard's mother comes into the picture where this whole time they're saying she's dead, but then she's not. And it's this crazy old woman who's trying to protect her son and kill everyone in some shit mid way of that season or like into the third season.
Terence Howard loses his memory. And now it's about him trying to reclaim his memory and like this crazy psycho doctor that's trying to help him. The fourth season now is about the crazy psycho doctor who kidnapped him or whatever. And it's just too, it's just too crazy.
It's just like, okay, you guys are totally straying away from what you had in the beginning. I was talking to my friend about this, Sue who watched that show. And he was like, I swear, I feel like they're firing the writers for the first season. They had great writers and some for whatever reason, they're firing them.
And like these next writers are just writing bullshit now. They're just like, I don't know. Let's throw this in there. They had so many different plots in like each episode and like they would never solve those plots in the next episode.
It'd be a new plot. That's just like what? That's one of those things about like what makes a break a show for me. Like I don't mind having some plots, but if you have some plots within some plots.
Yeah. And that's what it was. It's just like too many like plots like some plots. It's like, can I just get one narrative?
It's terrible. And I think like we're looking at our notes right now for our listeners. Yeah, I know. That's all I had to say actually.
I wanted to ask you though, this is kind of a good segue into that. Do you think, what shows now like shows like 13 Reasons Why? Do you think because they are pushing a certain narrative that like a lot of it's just becoming too political or is it just like they're doing it to kind of cash in on the controversy? And if they are, do you think shows are considered more or less bad depending on how much controversy there is in a show?
Man, that's a lie just through me. Sorry. Okay, here. A little bit of context, the reason why I asked is because I had a couple of friends who liked American Horror Story.
And I guess in one of the episodes or one of the seasons they did like a mass shooting episode, but they never aired it because it happened right when the whole Las Vegas mass shooting happened and they were like, oh, they should have aired it. You know, it's like art, it's created, whatever. And I was like, and I ended up thinking like, I mean, that's a little too controversial. Personally, for me, I think it would have been a jerk thing to do just to like immediately like throw that into a show after such tragedy just happened in real life.
Yeah. So you have these shows like 13 reasons why that like start at the beginning as this is what the show's going to be about. It's going to be about this controversy like subject, whatever suicide, whatever, like that's what it's going to be about. That's what there's shows going to be about.
I feel like that's fine. The shows do that in the beginning and it's good. That's fine. I feel like having those political things in the show from the beginning is okay to do.
But if you're going to be like a show like, for example, like with like Glee when the whole mass shooting thing started or whatever, they literally threw an episode in Glee on a mass shooting, like their school started to get shot up or whatever. And it's just like, that's not what Glee was about from the start. You know what I mean? But like I mean, peopleThe Blee Club singing songs and stuff like that.
I used to watch the show and that was great. Not a bad thing because it's sort of like they're just trying to shed light on their viewers on how serious this issue is. Right? Right?
And like that's that's fine. But then like at the same time, it's like the same thing with all these YouTubers or whatever who like just cash in on like the... The next big thing. Yeah, the next big thing.
Or whatever you know what I mean. But like I think with TV shows I think it's just like when they throw in stuff like that like for Glee, I think it's just their way of just you know kind of. Because like TV shows it's supposed to be a way for people to escape reality, right? Yeah.
need to be reminded like okay no this is our reality you guys need to realize like this is a big topic but then like when you have shows like I've never watched it you've watched a little bit of designated survivor or whatever right that's the one with um what's the name the different before we had Jack Bauer yeah sure yeah you've watched that show right yeah you watch like a whole season of it no you just you know so it's literally the first deficit oh yeah like that's the thing like I don't know how political or how politically accurate that show I'm pretty sure it's not that because it's about this like the president dying and like he's the last one to be president right basically right everyone dies who's next in line and it's like oh shit it's me yeah but I mean I have nothing to show because I never watched I'm sure it's a good show I mean it's still running so it's got to be good show but I think like with the whole like just adding controversy to the show if it does in the beginning and that's what it's meant to be that's fine but if they throw it in like every so often I think that's fine too as long as they just go back to their original content yeah just stick with it the rest of the way and it's just like okay now you guys are just trying to cash grab on the big topic yeah whatever's going on whatever like when Glee did it like it brought me like oh shit like it was it was a powerful episode me I was like oh damn like this is crazy or whatever Glee's not a bad show it's not I mean I hate it to the my very core I absolutely detest that show going back on like what makes or not what makes a show but basically like I had a reason to talk about Glee actually that's why I threw it in there cuz I think I think with Glee when you have a show like Glee like the first couple seasons were great but then I felt like at that because they knew they were so successful at that point they just wanted to keep going yeah and that's what made it like so much worse because they just like no like because they they try to do whatever they can't keep it going it's just like oh yeah just let it die I mean like really like first season was great because it was about you know these kids who were still kind of freshman in high school whatever trying to you know survive high school and they use Glee or whatever they do that and it's like it was ugly they use Glee club to do that or whatever it was cool and like seeing them sing the songs like it was great like I liked it yeah but then like after that like once they graduated and it kept going from there it's just like okay what are you guys doing no like so like literally a couple episodes like one of the seasons was like the main character who already graduated comes back to the high school to teach the new Glee club alongside of her old like Glee club teacher and just like what are you doing yeah like you graduate like if I was that girl and I graduated high school I'd be like deuces I'm out fuck y'all you know I want to come back like how you do it I mean it's just like I feel like a problem with Glee T what one of the issues that I thought was like one of the issues that I had was um like a lot of characters that had like moved on both in in real life like outside of the show but I guess in the narrative of the show kept coming back and it's like I mean come on who wants to go back to high school that many times like wait say that man like the main character like that you mentioned who goes back to school to teach Glee Club along with her old Glee club teacher it's just like it's just like we said it's like I I feel like a lot of it was to was like that's it Glee club is their life that's the embodiment of them that's it and it stops there which is like I mean not bad because a lot of them did want to achieve other things and everything like that and granted I haven't watched a lot of the show but it's just it seems so very superficial to me I guess like that characters would keep doing that like I mean yeah it's fictional and you know like that is their choice as a character but at the same time it's just like it just it seems so they needed to end it yeah that's the other thing they just but they wanted to keep it going yeah which is like not a good thing that's why kind of the same thing with how much of mother only like that one like I was fine with that running for that long like how much mother because like it made like it wasn't super official it wasn't like okay they moved on like why you bring him back yeah didn't move on just yet but I think like just how much of a like just the way I just didn't like the way it ended just because like they built he haven't seen it no I think it made me sad like that's why it made me sad it also made me pissed off because it's just like you built up this whole like concept of the mother of like Ted telling his kids how great his mother was like how all these girls showed him like okay the woman that I married now is the woman of my life yeah reason why I'm with her now is all these like trash girls that I dated yes whatever but then you go and fucking kill the mother and then like he goes back with Robin I mean like from the beginning like everyone loved Robin everyone wanted Ted Robin to like be together yeah but then like as a show progressed and like Robin's hurt Ted so many times I was one of those people like like Robin dude like move on like screw she's gone like when it when they had him get back and Robin I was like are you kidding me like dude no the also the other problem of that too she's the last season I think it's the same thing like they knew they need they wanted or they knew that the show was doing so well that they wanted to do one more season and that whole season 9 having it be about Barney and Robin's wedding like the entire season is just that one weekend dragging episodes episodes and then we finally meet the mother it's just like you build her up so like like eight seasons yeah well no just those last few episodes of when we finally see the mother and Ted together it's like you build her up so well they seem like the perfect couple like I like I want to marry that girl yeah I want her to be the mother my kids and then you gonna go kill her off I mean I saw that coming like everyone saw like the reason why like for the very first season everyone say like oh the mother's dead like Ted's telling his kids to sorry of their dead mother yeah that's why it's such a significant like or that's why the show so like good or yeah or whatever like everyone knew that the mother was probably gonna be dead but it's just like it's it sucks when you have all those episodes of the mother showing how perfect she is or 10 and then like he's just gonna especially with the way he like told his kids legs like and that's how much mother and his kids are like that's not the reason why he told his is you love and Rob and Rob and go ahead go with her dad it's fine mom's dad it's cool it's just like no dude like that's what the like do you think it would have been better if that like Ted's wife as a character was never like dead but it was Robin instead like this whole time like in the sense like obviously something's would have to change throughout that story but what if it was just like you know he was talking about Robin the whole time well like that's like if the show pushed it to be that way you think it would have been better I mean I guess I mean like they would have to change so many things yeah because they kept calling her and Robin I don't see Ted future Ted telling his kids like oh that's just your and Robin and that and like psych that was your mom you know I mean no I mean like yeah but yeah like do you think certain shows would have done better if they changed certain aspects in their story oh yeah of course I mean a show I think would do better if they just changed I can't think of anything I mean how much mother the mom didn't die yeah that would be great or whatever if they just ended it with like that's how much mother and like yay fine yeah or whatever any other I mean I feel like any show if you change one thing it'd probably be for the better or for the worse it doesn't really matter I don't can't think of anything specifically yeah beside how much mother should I had it I wanted to ask you something because you're talking about all that stuff but I just want to throw in I would watch the opposite of how much or mother like of how I met your father they were trying to do a show like that yeah I was it got like it even get a pilot episode oh like the pilot episode was a panic up cancel yeah like it even released the pilot episode like because it was just terrible they tried to do a how much of other or whatever but it wasn't gonna be it was totally new characters it's a different story oh just yeah it's not of Ted and like the mother yeah it's just a totally different set of people but it was gonna call how much a father but like it did so terrible if they never released it do you think it would have been better if they included some of the characters from how I met your mother in how I don't know how that thing was supposed to be because I mean like you're you're a writer and you know you have creative ideas like I mean at that at that point with how much of mother being nine seasons like if they're gonna do a spin-off like okay that's the other thing when they do spin-offs like full house oh in floor house yeah it's cool seeing the old characters come into that show like every so often but like having them in there completely I don't know I mean I think it would have been cool like see that's the thing to like when we were talking in the beginning like what makes a good show you could have great actors but terrible writing I think that's the thing with floor house the actors aren't terrible but they're writing it's just so corny they're jokes like full house is just a timeless show like it's yeah it's so good it has so many good teachings in it lessons or whatever and so that and it's funny but like now like I think it's just with this generation or whatever like the jokes that they throw in there just way too corny and then actually some of the actors like the kids I feel like they're not too great oh like the in floor house I don't think they're that good so like when they say their lines I'm just like I can't I was gonna comment I do agree with you in that sense like if you like the kid actors in floor house I'm not sure if it's their acting ability or if it's the dialogue but it does it probably it's probably both I mean like if you have like if I were to tell you like if you were a great actor and I were to tell you to say I love hot dogs in a very like meaningful way I'm sure the great actor probably would have done it fine but then at the same time people would be like why did he say that line yeah I mean like or if you were a bad actor and I told you to say like this big-ass speech like that's very powerful whatever but you can't you're bad you can't deliver it they wasted that line you know with floor house it's just the OGs are great but like the newcomers are just like I think a problem with full house and shows kind of like along that spectrum is that they try to do too many callbacks to the original show walls but those callbacks or trying to like they're trying to use like I guess modern like yeah just like you can't you know so that's the other like you said you watched like a lot of Netflix like their specials do you think well I mean because I watch a lot of network though to be what do you think is better or like what or like if one is better like why do you think it's better that's a very good question I mean I'm gonna tell you right now I think Netflix is better because they don't have commercials and they do they do the whole season like released already I don't have to wait but at the same time it's like fuck I got away a whole year for the next season I like Netflix more because they have a skip intro the reason why I prefer Netflix I think is I'm not sure if the rules are the same because there's obviously like yeah well I think the for Netflix it's because it's an online thing they could do a lot more work yeah I'm sure more and whatever but that's an unfair qualifier against like network shows is because they are on a network and they are I think when network shows they probably have the bigger budget to do more but Netflix has more freedom to say more yeah exactly they just don't have that budget yeah I mean they probably do they have hell shows lined up now or whatever they'll have a lot of enemies like Netflix original enemies yeah like foreign shows I'm just like wow like Netflix is really getting out there I do but that's one of the other thing I like about Netflix is the broadness of what shows they bring like the show that I introduced you to my unfinished was dark yeah you need a finish that show dude yeah it's great like all you are listening and like have Netflix account watch dark dark is really good it's a German term yeah it's a German Germany well yeah yeah yeah yeah or whatever don't watch it dubbed please watch it sub thank you if you don't know what dub is don't just don't watch it anymore just don't basically watch it with subtitles don't watch it with like English actors trying to talk to their voices it's it's terrible yeah it's terrible I first are watching it see what I was watching it in English was like why I think it sets it first in English because they know we're in the US because that's what happened me too and when I was watching it's a German show right yeah it's not a totally off I'm like there's something like right like and I started noticing they were like indeterminate in saying German words let me turn this into German see that sounds better but I do like the broadness of Netflix I'm not sure if this particular show that I want to see is on Netflix or any other platform other than that television but brush off the boat I want to watch yeah I've seen a couple episodes I haven't watched the full thing but I've seen it's pretty funny yeah the reason I want to watch that though is because I feel like there aren't any all like situational comedies don't represent Asian families well yeah yeah and I feel like fresh off the boat does like I feel like it's they do actually you know so speaking of that let's just dive into 13 reasons why because there's an episode you've watched the whole season yeah yeah okay and for those you who haven't like turn my arms ahead yeah because we're gonna straight up talk about the whole season because I got a lot to say about that oh so you finished it yeah what you think better than the first season where it's different what oh definitely like the character development yeah because they go yeah real deep yeah that's what I like about super deep I love that but as a show itself like there are things I kind of disagree with it's pushing into gender I should say like it's very liberal in the sense that and again this man is gonna cause a lot of fun more comments but like it takes a very liberal point of view like granted they kind of did set up in the first season where Bryce was the rapist but if you want me to say is if you are a white male and a like blonde hair blue light athlete like I feel like that's very I want to say cookie cutter because that's really really offensive to say in this kind of context but I feel like that's very it was an easy pick you know I mean like let you know the way things are going if you are white male who blonde hair you're more like likely to be the bully I guess which is like very so would you rather have it if they had a black bully or something no the bad guy was the black guy no I would rather have it be I see that this is thing I can't really I don't know how to answer that question because like if you look at I guess a lot of like feminism or like really extreme feminism it's easy to pick out a white guy to be like a rapist you know I mean and obviously pick a black guy that's just kind of speaking on its own so I mean I don't know how to approach that question but I feel like it takes a very liberal stance and there is one particular part I don't know if you remember where it was Sherry Clay and I think Justin and they're all looking at polar the polar rides and Clay does mention like oh I can't believe you know these girls would get themselves into that situation and then she'll be responds with really clay you're gonna blame the girls like no one's being that situation blah blah blah which is very you know sure he's right no one does want to be in that kind of situation but so you felt that they were pushing their agenda way too hard in this yeah like it's very like oh yeah or it's like oh white jock has to be the bully yeah or whatever and it's like that whole like it's never the girls fault like I get it you know obviously I'm not trying to victim blame but my biggest problem with shows nowadays especially shows like 13 reasons why and kind of like the younger generation if we're gonna kind of delve into that is that you do need to take responsibility for your actions obviously if you go to a house party without adults and they're drinking and you're underage clearly you know some shit's gonna go down yeah you have to go ahead so see here's my problem with 13 reasons why like the first season okay like first of all I'm gonna say like suicide is nothing to joke about like there's nothing like it's a serious situation people do need to talk about it or whatever it's it's nothing to make fun of and what I'm about to say is like I'm not trying to say that 13 reasons why it was a stupid show or whatever problems I had with 13 reasons why first season was some of the tapes that she had for like blaming people for her suicide or whatever honestly to me we're stupid like trivial yeah like we're really dumb for example with the Asian girl like how she was one of the tapes because she didn't want to come out that she was lesbian like first of all they set this in our year our generation where being lesbian and gay no one gets a fuck yeah like you know one cares right now like honestly I mean yes there's some people that do still care again like everything that we're saying is our opinion like there are those are big issues I just felt like you have two eight ads first of all right yeah and you're scared that people are gonna be like oh she's lesbian and I get like this high school to try to say high school is like this bad place or whatever you know where people are like really old all the time just all the time which is true in a sense kind of I mean I feel that way I know but I mean just that whole thing of her like I blamed it on or like how the Asian girl was like yeah so I made up the whole thing that she took like she said that Hannah kissed her yeah I thought I forgot the girls named them yeah the Hannah was the one that did the whole thing yeah that Hannah was a lesbian just because she didn't want to come out and just like come on really for Hannah to be like yeah so you're one of the reasons like you're well that's why you're on this tape because of that come on yeah like for real that was like my main issue was season one and then like another issue I just didn't like how they kind of portrayed high schoolers as like all these at least that high school and those characters they were also fucking privileged way too privileged yeah like way way too privileged like the fact that they could all do this underage drinking smoke all this weed and have all these fucking parties and shit it's just like all right if you're yeah like you said if you're doing all that shit come on like how are you not gonna like know that shit's gonna go down yeah right really and that was the other thing that I hated about season two like when they're all on trial they're being interrogated or you know they're being uh pross or not pro they're doing the cross examination across the nation and I'm saying like so you're at this party and you were drinking yes and you were smoking weed yes it's just like no one was like all right hold on first of all aren't you underage yeah you know she's like really like they're gonna let all these kids do all this shit and then like let them get away with that I mean I know like the whole season's about this suicide and about him being a rapist yet that motherfucker yeah for me for again like what makes a good show in a bad show I feel like like yes it's a TV show yes it's fiction or whatever but please at least don't like I said don't be too fake stick a little bit to the realism and I mean just come on a lot of certain exemptions that have to approach that but what I did like about season two was because with season one they actually had like clay was like the main character yeah right they had to follow him and like his whole thing I do have a few comments about clay yeah which like which was fine because that's what they wanted to do but the reason why I loved season two way more season one was because he wasn't the main character this time and they delved into each character more and like they like spread it out more yeah and I love that because I love learning about all the other characters and stuff and like um the thing with how you said Asian representation in shows like how they don't do a good job with the connies I felt like with Zack his character they did really good with the whole Asian thing like how he was saying like when he was having a conversation with his mom saying like my like do you have these feelings and his mom's like no you don't we talk about you're fine I was just like when I was talking to her like about this like dude it's so true Asians Asian bomb yeah Asian barely that shit deeply and it's just like I was having a career it's like if I were just on my mom like mom I don't feel good I think you need to go to the doctor she'd be like no you're fine you're fine you don't need to go to the doctor but she's like no don't bring up like I'm feeling depressed like yeah that's just like no yeah whatever and like when like they did that in that show I was just like it's so true yeah um it's me about Zack as a character I do like that they one thing I really was happy with too is they took an Asian male and made an actual love interest for a white female but like it doesn't have to be a white female but beyond that what I wanted to say is it's always a male and an Asian female generally speaking if there is an Asian interest especially a love interest it's always an Asian female and I'm so glad they went the other way yeah um just because like growing up I can't really recall any male any Asian male love interest you know and so I think 13 reasons why when they showed Zack and Hannah like banging it out that was really like I was a cool finally like they finally went the other way it's not this um any male gets this Asian female and um because usually in that case too it's the Asian female is always kind of timid or me or shy and it's always it was cool seeing it go the other way um but one thing I did love about season 2 2 was uh Mr. Porter's testimony yeah oh it was good like that made me cry when he was like I could have done better yeah like you know I as not not as a counselor not as a teacher or some sort of institution employee or anything like that but I as a person it was like that made me really I really connected with that because um there's I feel like a lot of people nowadays are just so categorized into things and when it's just nice seeing like I as a person you know yeah I think too like with season 2 what they did like with season 1 like obviously it was all about suicide with season I mean I guess they didn't really know I mean they kind of pushed it a little hard like their agenda about suicide in season 1 I felt like season 2 was more of a story like it had an actual like plot to it yeah we're trying to build up to like oh are they gonna are they gonna win are they gonna lose and I liked that I like that but they still had their agendas in there but it was more subtle I felt yeah like what they were trying to say um I want I want to ask you when Monte like met uh what's his name Tyler in the bathroom after Tyler yeah I can messes up messes up all right I had a little host throw when he shoved the broom up oh yeah yeah I was like oh god that's a great way to end this podcast so we'll see it no I'm scared no but um with the end of season 1 how they show Tyler had all those guns already I was like oh really season 2 is gonna be about school shootings now like that's what I was worried about I was worried about that the whole season 2 was just gonna be about school shootings the effect of that now just like okay no no they're like I mean I get it it's issues we need to talk about like I said TV shows are supposed to be away for people to escape reality or whatever but as with their teamies is why I mean their reality is suicide and whatever but like at the same time just felt like come on like you guys are just like cashing in yeah cashing in on this thing and I'm glad that they didn't do that yeah like they were like it felt like they were building it up like you could hell tell that they were building it up to like it was the next thing gonna be in season 1 they were going to season 2 I mean in season 2 though oh yeah you could hell of tell they were building Tyler's character up to be the next school shooter yeah but I kind of felt like they had the ending different I felt like maybe they did have Tyler's shoot up to school but because of the whole recent players of school shootings I felt like they changed it last minute they had him not do that yeah which I actually really liked same here but like at the same time I'm just like okay now what they can what are they gonna do for season 3 is it gonna be about playing all his friends trying to keep Tyler safe away from the cops I don't think I mean like yeah I hope not right I mean that's really like you're holding you're holding a criminal yeah I was like that dude was about to kill y'all I'm gonna bug her is like um I do hope Monty dies down oh my god I hate Monty I'm kidding no one I'm kidding he's a piece of garbage yeah but I mean he's a dick yeah and that's why we're gonna end today's podcast all right cool off of that dick no no I'm probably gonna cut that out but thank you for listening I'm Christopher and I'm Kyle and that was talking nonsense