Episode 252: Nolan Lawson of PouchDB on what it feels like to be a maintainer

Guest Nolan Lawson Panelist Richard Littauer | Eric Berry | Justin Dorfman Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, Richard, Justin, and Eric revisit an unreleased interview with Nolan Lawson from 2020. They discuss Nolan's experience as a former maintainer of PouchDB, the emotional labor of being an open source maintainer, and the challenges that led him to step away from such high-profile projects. Nolan also shares his thoughts on the impact of reputation-driven development, open source community dynamics, and his journey towards a healthier relationship with open source. The conversation delves into the candid realities of burnout and the personal sacrifices often made by unpaid open source contributors. Nolan highlights his transition to more sustainable open source practices and his new interests including his work on a Mastodon client called Pinafore. Download now to hear more! [00:01:43] Nolan explains his background with PouchDB and shares his fascination with databases and browser technologies. [00:02:58] Richard shares his personal connection to PouchDB, mentioning how he discovered Nolan through his work on the project. [00:03:26] Nolan talks about his blog post form 2017 titled, “What it feels like to be an open source maintainer,” which reflected on the emotional toll and burnout he experienced for maintaining PouchDB. [00:05:33] Justin reflects on the impact of Nolan’s blog post, describing it as a “shot heard around the world” in the open source community. [00:06:48] Eric asks why Nolan and other maintainers stay involved in open source despite the challenges. Nolan explains that reputational benefits and personal interest in the technology were initial motivators for staying involved. [00:10:27] Eric asks Nolan how he realized it was time to step away from maintaining PouchDB. Nolan shares that personal life changes helped him reassess his involvement in open source and reflects on advice he received from other maintainers. [00:14:36] Richard emphasizes the personal and emotional investment many maintainers have in their projects and Nolan acknowledges the privilege of being able to work on open source, but also the challenges it poses for maintainers who feel they cannot leave. [00:21:13] Nolan shares stepping away from PouchDB has improved his mental health and personal relationships and he maintains smaller open source projects. [00:24:00] Nolan explains the importance of being personally invested in a project and realizing when it’s time to move on and Justin reflects on his own experience of stepping away from maintaining a project after years of involvement. [00:26:00] Eric asks if funding could have made a difference for Nolan’s involvement in open source, and Nolan shares that he avoided funding, preferring to keep his work as a “labor of love.” [00:26:52] What is Nolan currently doing? He talks about maintaining a Mastodon client and focusing on personal projects that bring him joy. [00:30:00] Richard discusses the importance of balancing open source work with personal life and the need for a sustainable approach to maintaining projects. [00:30:46] Eric highlights the vulnerability and self-awareness Nolan has shown in discussing his open source journey, thanking him for sharing his experiences. [00:33:13] Find out where you can follow Nolan on the internet. Spotlight [00:33:41] Justin’s spotlight is Metabase. [00:34:16] Eric’s spotlight is Parametric. [00:35:08] Richard’s spotlight is IPFS. [00:35:22] Nolan’s spotlight is fake-indexeddb. Links SustainOSS [email protected] [email protected] SustainOSS Discourse SustainOSS Mastodon Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) Richard Littauer Socials Justin Dorfman X Eric Berry X Nolan Lawson Blog Nolan Lawson Mastodon “What it feels like to be an open source maintainer” (Blog post by Nolan) PouchDB Pinafore Salesforce Working in Public: The Making and Maintenance of Open Source Software by Nadia Eghbal Metabase Parametric IPFS fake-indexeddb (GitHub) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound Special Guest: Nolan Lawson.