Hello and welcome to sitcom geeks, I'm James Kerry. I'm Dave Cohen and thank you for joining us We're going to talk this week about doing it yourself And this is something we've talked about a number of times in the past we have and each time we've talked about it Something new has come up. So we've gone I've certainly gone from being the person saying never never do it yourself It's not worth the hassle you can never make anything that's as good as what's already out there And kind of over the course of doing sitcom geeks really every day something new comes up and the more The more that I see of it the more I think this is actually the way ahead Yes, I'd also I mean you you say this from to the doing it yourself you a have done Edinburgh shows for decades true Which you write about in how to be average a successful at comedy which I recommend anybody buys and reads if they think You don't think about doing an Edinburgh show and that reminds me. I had this great I put up a link to my book on Facebook I basically quoted somebody from one of my Amazon reviews Which was basically I was hoping for a book that was a bit more inspiring because this book really keeps your feet on the ground For my book how dirty yes, but you know he enjoyed the book Yeah, but yeah a lot of it is so I think we're doing an Edinburgh show you have to read a table book to really prepare you for What a slot I just read a review of my book on Amazon right which and it's the one that's at the top You know I've got lots of really nice five-star reviews and things and then this top one says he waffles a bit Which I'm sure you all know is true listening to some gigs, but I just thought can't you put one of the really nice ones?
You know absolutely necessary got me to put yeah, but I but also you so a you know a we do our own podcast B You have written books and done it yourself as it were and see you've done Edinburgh shows and D You know you sort of just sort of makes makes stuff happen So for my point of view even though also you made that well you made that thing with a web series Seven years ago. Yeah, which was a huge history in history in internet terms I've always been sort of very skeptical about making your own stuff But having said that because I always think that if you're a writer But it's been to be not a performer you should just write a script because really good scripts are pretty thin on the ground And they a good script will get you work and I in a way I still believe that and if you if you can't if that's if that's your plan a and you haven't given plan a go yet I would stick with plan a for a bit But having said that one of the things that got me on the on the way is it were is doing an Edinburgh show Which got nominated for the perio best newcomer award that helps me get a radio for commission But also since then I've produced a number of live stage shows I've written and produced a play called the God Particle I've written and produced another live show called amongst tail and produced at nine and And That's amongst that's about Martin Luther all right and then and I'm writing a new show about Thomas Beckett Right 20 20 because that's the two hundred fifty thousand Twenty twenty you have this you have the religious comedy genre so not really yes I do I produce it not actually in a way I don't see it as career enhancement for me because the wider the wider comedy world and the wider media are Uninterested in the religious stuff that I'm interested in and so I'm doing this stuff as a side thing Because to me it's important stuff and the stories need to be told and I'm interested in Martin Luther I'm interested in talking about it and all that kind of stuff, but what I'm saying is I am actually Doing it myself. Yeah as well as I've just scripted to the CBC show and you know and another bits and pieces and also working for a company That I'm making some direct to audience stuff again in the church world in the Christian world But stuff that people might want to buy on DVD because it's a sort of stuff the BBC But couldn't make the kids because it's of one faith and they don't do religious broadcasting for kids because you know for fairly obvious So everything is changing yeah, yeah, I think without wishing to make this a big Publicity stunt for our books your book is coming out in January and again It's a religious yeah based book my new book about writing comedy is coming out quite soon I mentioned this now because as James and I have been saying over the last sort of couple of years You know it's what we know how hard it is to try and get stuff made and you know We have a lot of meetings with producers and commissioning editors and we haven't had anything on for at least a couple of James not a couple of years me for a little bit longer than that I would say And so when it came to the idea of the book and I know you know I've got friends and people I know who are published writers with big publishing companies and they can't get published It didn't even cross my mind to try and go to a publisher I just thought I will do this and in the six months or so that I've been spending learning about Publishing your own book. I mean every day something new comes up that's all right I could be trying that and I've got so much in place with doing this book and I'm realizing now that actually this is This is what I should have been doing You know and as you say I was doing when I was putting on my shows in Edinburgh.
So yes, it is It is all changing the BBC is still there the BBC is still the best place It makes the most comedy in the world probably still they have some element of training up people still in the way And they have the sketch shows for radio shows like News Jack at the moment and other shows I'm not sure I was there another sketch to Tokyo. I think is another show at the moment. It's taking non-commissioned writing So it's still the BBC is still the bigger company that you can actually get in off the streets on But and they're spending tens of millions of pounds on scripted comedy. Yeah now They're giving most of it to pull White House and Harry Enfield and a Vic and Bob and Steve Cougar and stuff as you'd expect because they're you know They're funny people who are very well established names, but they do keep making new stuff like this country and like Fleabag people just do nothing.
So all of these shows start somewhere Yeah, so it's worth bearing in mind that you know and this is the beauty This is why I don't work in features because a feature film has to speak itself into existence There has to be funding you have to you know It can take you three four five six years just to raise the money to make a movie because a movie has to have a reason to exist Whereas BBC one have to show TV programs. Yeah, they can't not show anything Even that reminds me of a very funny short story by Alexi Sale about a commissioner who basically couldn't make a decision about anything And so that was literally nothing and he was visiting prostitutes and getting them to read scripts for him And this and these process prostitutes had excellent notes, right? And this guy is a very funny story. I think it's in the dog catcher book But the beauty of TV and radio is they have to produce dozens and dozens of hours of comedy every year TV and radio and online so But in terms of accessing that you know a you can just go to them with an idea and they might do it or be you can show what you can do by By doing something yourself.
You can also build your own audience It may even become self-sustaining to the point where for a lot of youtubers There's just no point in them going on television because they have less control and it doesn't make as much money And so you know and also you're then more attractive to TV because you bring an audience with you So all of these things, you know and now much bigger factors than they were even sort of three or four years ago Yeah, so that's why we're sort of spending a bit of time thinking about it now And we're talking of which last week I went to see a screening of a sitcom which is called old and it's by Joe Tilly and Joe is not with channel 4 or BBC or anything She just thought I've got an idea for a script and I want to make it And I think she probably went around touting the script around for a year or whatever I'm not getting anywhere with it I just thought why don't I just make the whole show myself which is like a massive thing to do massive undertaking She's got the finance for it. She's got finance. She's got the performers she got a place she got a director in and you know they made a perfectly good episode of a sitcom I went to see this half hour episode Peter Straker was in it too You may remember from various TV shows I remember him as a Booker of a comedy club But I don't remember him being a god that's Peter Straker I can't remember what it was like he was in that he was very successful actor But there's lots of you know lots of good actors in this in the show and it's all set in an old people's home And there's some nice little stories in there What's I you know it's not in that form I'm guessing it's not going to actually appear on your screens because it's no But what what it will have done and what it's done for Joe I think will have made her realize actually you know It's one thing to just write something and send it out there and hope that you know hope that somebody likes it But then to just say sod it I've written it. I like it.
I can make it I can go out there You know, I'm a professional person making comedy and again This isn't something that I've been saying a lot in the last year or so and I said it landed know the comedy festival This you know, you've got to be business like you've got to be a little bit proactive in one say the word write a printer right over Now, oh, it's a sense of shivers up my smile. I didn't invent the word god Yeah, somebody had already come up with it, but that's that's what you have to be and in fact we there are you know There are more Opportunities out there now for people and there's a lot of websites now that and particularly American websites that you can send One Liners to if you've got if that's your thing that you've got a writing one line is there's a cycle comedy wire in America Which I know that a lot of British writers are going to it's a little bit I mean the problem with all of this is it is a bit like the Wild West at the moment and You know, you can send your one Liners to comedy wire and I think they pay Depends who's someone's offering 30 dollars for you to write your your one Liners and then you find out well Actually, it's 30 dollars for 10 or something And so you'll kind of end up with $3 for your one liner which to be fair is $3 more than you get if you just put it on Twitter So, you know if you are someone who likes writing one Liners and you need you know, it's a good it's good practice And one of our Patreon members John Rans. He's he's written Some he's told us a little bit He's been writing some lines for comedy wire and he says, you know, if you want to try and get stuff on News Jack If you want to get stuff used elsewhere, you have to practice and this is a good way to practice I don't know if you there's also we have a couple of people This is a guy called Chris Ballard as well. Yeah, we sort of put out asked people if they're what their experience was a comedy wire basically The main headline is well, it doesn't pay brilliantly, but it's a great place and it's a good place to meet other writers as well Yeah, and again, it's just a question of getting match fit for writing jokes Which is something that doesn't come naturally to you as in for most people it doesn't I mean if it does then then great and you're probably already working in that field in your professional But for most people it's a lot of graft and so it's it's inherently worth doing I mean the alternative is if you don't if you want to own everything that you put out then start your own Twitter feed Yeah, and treat your Twitter feed as if it's a proper joke thing And you know don't put out everything that you think of just you know be selective right loads and put out bits and I mean if you're a patron subscriber you can go listen to our interview with Moose Allen who is a Full-time cartoonist and artist who has built up a huge demand for his his visual work through his word use on Twitter Yeah, he actually doesn't put up that many pictures of his own work doesn't he?
And so you know that was a really smart move of using his comedy ability to draw a crowd And actually wouldn't surprise me if he was starting to get gag writing work as well Well, he's certainly he's getting cartoons in private eye now as well and yeah He's I don't know if he's too busy to do gag writing work maybe But and also forget that it's already coming gone, but there was a Twitter feed called shit My dad says and it became a sitcom. Yeah, it didn't last very long. No, I think I would have William Shatter in it. Yeah, I'm very British problems Is that another one or something?
Oh possibly that's coming TV show. Yeah, and so all of these things can become something else But in a way, it's again. You have to see it as a it's a marathon not sprint You're trying to it's not like you're trying to set up a startup and then cash out for millions of pounds So that you don't have to be a comedy writer because that's the thing you actually want to be and if you're doing if you're doing this for the money There are so many other better ways of making money like pyramid selling for example You know start selling cleaning products or good doing being door to door or crying, you know I mean all of these things are more profitable in the short term. Don't steal other people's jokes.
No, that's right Exactly. Yeah, you have to be quite quite famous to get away with that. Yeah, I think and to come back to again my experience the overwhelming body of work that's come out now about self-publishing and You know, I probably now I probably cut down my habit maybe to about two or three articles a day But you know that you could spend the rest of eternity just reading every single article about self publishing the whole time I'm aware that actually unless my book is gonna be good enough. Yeah, there's no point for this There is a lot of stuff out there that tells you how to be a successful self publisher and get on Amazon bestsellers Because there's about 10,000 Amazon bestsellers You can now if you're if you have a kind of niche I'm I can probably guarantee that James's book will become an Amazon number one bestseller Yeah in the in the genre of comedy and religion.
Yes Yes, one other thing Yes pretty much yeah, they're almost no book. That's one of the reason they've written it and yeah So we do come back to this you've got to put the you've got to put the work in remember that the content is always the most important thing I mean it is incredibly exciting and it is all incredibly new but it is also very easy to Run away with the fact that it is that you can actually you can now publish a book from for nothing Yeah, if you if you so desire you for not you know, of course you not paid to publish a book And you can probably make a YouTube sketch now for not much money, so Right, you should be funny. Yeah, you can make a positive zero You can make a crap one for no money. Yeah, you can also write a good one You can also make a good one for no money as well Yeah, especially if you come up with a persona or a format which suits zero budget and you know Jenna Marbles a youtuber She did some really and literally just her talking into her laptop or her phone And it's just really funny.
Yeah, the other thing I was gonna say is That the reason that you can get top of an Amazon bestseller list is because you do have a niche And I think that's something that's kind of overlooked slightly So if you and again even with Edinburgh shows for example, so so last year I did a show Edinburgh called amongst tail and it was about Martin Luther and the 95 theses which Incidentally is one of the single greatest cultural events of the last thousand years in European history So but no one cares about that. I guess A lot of articles saying that it was a big deal Especially 500 years ago thing is you know, two million people go to Edinburgh festival and buy tickets I don't need two million people to see my show I only need about a hundred people a day to see my show and actually the appeal of a show about that is If you happen to have if you're if on any given day a hundred and fifty thousand people buying tickets I only need one of a thousand who's even heard of Martin Luther not Martin Luther King and who knows what the 95 theses are If you have a particular interest in something and you see a show about it You go, oh, that'll be interesting Just as I also know about comedy and if there was another show if Rob Long did a conversations with my agents type show at the end Refring I go and see it because I'm really interested in comedy And also if there was a show about the New Testament or whatever I don't see it because I'm interested in the New Testament So the reason I say that is because an awful lot of podcasts are started and YouTube channels and books are written But actually a lot of them vanishing to know it because they don't actually have a selling point that will get you to a niche From which you can then build the base and therefore I would argue that if you're interested in anything It's worth just working out how you can turn that into a blog or a podcast or a YouTube channel or An Edinburgh show ideally all of the above so my new show about Thomas Beckett is going to be an Edinburgh show and a live touring show And also an audio project and also you know My book the Sacred Art of Joking comes out in January and I'm gonna do a whole load of other audio for that and write loads of blog posts about it And also do some live speaking and turning up and all that kind of stuff and you have to see it So it'll be open so I think it's just worth thinking What are you passionate about what are you interested in and and go for that if you are interested in beekeeping? Is what what you could be the funny beekeeper? Yeah, if you're interested in string theory You could be the funny string theory lady.
Yeah, or the only lady in the world who is interested in string theory For example, so there are all these different Things about you know, so just doing a sketch is great That's fine But if there's any way in which you have an angle you have an area that you can then write a book about and become a top And I'm the bestseller list and then great. I would really think about about that as an angle Just what you've been saying that's only made me think of the Edinburgh fringe as a sort of metaphor is like a is like the Internet's really yeah, very very small version what you're saying the idea that there's two million people there and You know at the top of the Internet you've got Ricky Gervais Yeah, yeah, whichever big person happens to be out and you know that all the That's they're not going to get two million people but they're going to get ten times more people applying for tickets than can actually go So you've got the traffic there like you have the traffic of the Internet and nobody's you know Nobody's trying to get more traffic on the Internet What you're trying to do is get that traffic to come to you and that's that's really what James is saying there so Of those two million people that are buying tickets There are quite quite realistically two thousand of them will be into beekeeping and so if you get those two thousand people and their Partners or whatever to come and see you you know, you have got a Show that you know, you might not get reviewed or anything But you've got a show that is going to make financially make it worth your while to be there plus you've got the book that will come out of that And everything else so it is all about You know selling selling the thing that you have yeah, really I'm sorry to be that right up in a character Well, there's another thing on top of that which Edinburgh kind of made me think about as well Is of course the other thing you can do is go to Edinburgh and not to do a show I mean obviously most famous examples of that is Tim Vine buying a poster And he nearly won an accommodate award for it because there was a massive poster in Edinburgh a billboard that said with a picture of Tim Vine Arms out stretch and it says Tim Vine the bottom says will not be appearing at this year's French Yeah, this is about five or six years ago So massive picture poster on cowgate or something like that very very prominent and so Tim just thought I can't I'm not going to Just here, but I can at least do that yeah, and they in the end I think they were gonna give it an award and they thought you have to actually be an Edinburgh for us to give you the award So we're not gonna get like that But the other thing is like Arthur Smith used to do tours And it reminds me also I think the systemic comedian I want to say no Britain who I think used to do stuff in Bath He used to be a street performer and I think also used to do bizarre bath tours Yeah, I might conflate some things there. Yeah, but for example another thing you can do is comedy tours or a comedy ghost or a comedy You know your version of you feel very knowledgeable about an area or a place And then you can turn that into a podcast or your own audio guide at all of that place or something like that All of these different things have got to start somewhere You know the onion started out I think as an advert for a pizza place I think it was sort of I can't remember the pizza place or the content the funny content came first or whatever But it was a very very very small thing and it just got bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger It feels like it's sort of come and gone now. Doesn't it?
Even though it was ended up on TV at one point. Yeah, and there's a Christian version called the Babylon B Which is basically if you know anything about Christianity You'll find the Babylon B funny and then there was the local newspaper British League of News Page version called the family examiner Where Jason Hazy and Joel Morris and others and I think you need Joel's brother and people like that Pioneer as well. Well, of course the Daily Mash is another one that if you can write those kind of The story is always the hardest way we've got an interview coming up with Tim Telling who's been involved from the from the early days of the Daily Mash website to the TV Yeah, and you can listen to it now if you come and subscribe on Patreon because all of these episodes are sitting there waiting to be listened to by patreon subscribers before they eventually go out to the wider public Tim has a lot of very good advice for people who and Tim Tim like me comes very much from the sort of the the punk approach to comedy which is you know, it's Very much the DIY the world of do it yourself and don't you know, just ignore everybody else Obviously, you're still trying to get your shows on the BBC, but as we said right at the start of this podcast, you know You are taking the initiative as well. Yeah, one other thing.
I forgot to mention actually there's a cut thing called the comedy crowd Which is again, it's an exciting development and there's like a lot of people they they run a competition a short movie competition And in fact the writers Guild Awards last year introduced an award for best short film So if you could if you've got a penchant for doing those is a chance you could win an award and they're pretty you know Kind of high prestige now the writers Guild Awards So there are a lot of places now where you can go and you can start to get a bit of publicity and a bit of exposure Yeah, because if you do do a short thing and you get a writer's Guild award or any other world But writers guild one let's say with my friends nice skills brilliant You get to turn up to a if you're even just nominated you get to turn up to a a award ceremony with Comedy producers and everybody like that they'll be there They'll see you nominated and then you might win the award or they might think that you're robbed and they'll go look up your thing that you did But you won't get that if you don't actually do anything You don't actually make it if you don't actually get around to putting it up keep writing keep doing things keep You know keep keep working at your script or whatever. That's always that that's always got to be the number one priority Yeah, is you want to write what is the best possible thing that you can't cut corners on that? Yeah, but be aware of everything that's out there and try not to be overwhelmed by it because there is so much stuff out there now You've got to start small you've got to start somewhere You know when we started this podcast we didn't know a we'd still be going now and be You know where it would lead and when we now do and all that kind of some patreon subscribers and all that kind of stuff And so you just want to just do it and the things there's an excellent Resource Dave's is confess to listening to lots of advice and self publishing and that kind of stuff There is so much out there and actually a very effective way of making a living on the internet is to tell people how to make a living on the internet I'm aware of the of the picks and shovels a gold rush. Yeah similarities there but there's an Australian blog called pro blogger and he also does a podcast as well and He does sound exactly like that.
Oh my son. Oh, but it's like he's in the room. It's like Darren His name is he's lovely and the met him, but I've listened to all of his podcasts So he's his primary about blogging, but he now podcasts as well and in a way He's sort of it gives really good advice to how to go about just starting from a blog or a podcast or a podcast Whatever it is and sort of turning yourself into a brand and expert It's not about being a comedian necessarily, but you know again, you could be the comedy beaker And you know, this is how you go about becoming you know making a living out of that And it just becomes something you do in the evenings and eventually people start You know cutting down their hours at work and after sort of three or four years sometimes people end up sort of doing it professionally So there are loads of opportunities out there and in a way now everything's online It's sort of harder to be seen but again if you're if you've got a niche if you've got something and if you've got something that's good Because ultimately the best thing that does the best is the stuff. It's good I know it sounds a bit silly to say that when people talk about how do I market my show at the Edinburgh Fringe and people ask me Advice one have a show that's any good.
Yeah, I cannot stress that enough because most shows are not that good Yeah, some are quite good and some are excellent It has to be great actually for Edinburgh Yeah, you know you kind of that that's again as I keep coming back to it all the all the hype all the best selling Amazon stuff is Is for nothing if you do not have the great script. Yeah, yeah Go in a completely opposite direction from where the technology is now So as I say do a comedy tour start an actual magazine, you know a newsletter something It's posted to people to me So I'm going in the Yeah, going in the opposite direction often can pay dividends because you know you create some kind of scarcity or whatever it is You but again these things have to be done for the right reasons if you're doing it to make money again may I suggest crime and Yes, or a count and so There's quite a big overlap between all of those things crime accounts in law So and there's also just one other thing that's answering is news review Oh, yeah So news review is a thing that runs at the canal cafe All the time and it's taking new material and again, they've never asked permission to do it It's just a small French theater in West London in made available delightful surroundings and they just do it every week That they want jokes. They want songs. They want funny stuff that will make an audience laugh So you can start a comedy club in your town if you're outside London particularly Well, I think a lot of people have done that and I think I mean it's one thing I would say is possibly that the world that where the sort of the Wild West aspect has kind of It's been and gone almost is stand-up comedy Yeah, because I think it is now not as easy to have a stand-up comedy show But I would say as well actually sketch shows improv shows and fringe It are coming pretty well coming back really now in the same way that it's cheaper to you can make your own YouTube sketch now It's now not as challenging to do a fringe theater show as it was say 10 15 20 years ago Yeah, we talked about that in another podcast I think that fringe theater is actually you know, it's where a lot of really interesting comedy is happening It's right and previously it was rep theater in the days of porridge and that kind of stuff and all these great comedy actors were rep actors That's where they learned yeah, but yeah fringe theta seems to be more of a thing I think it's partly the more the more virtual things are the more things we are online because we sort of crave human contact Yeah, we're actually now more likely to go and see somebody perform live because you know, we don't want to be huddled in our own homes Although that's convenient.
It's ultimately quite lonely So and that is one of the most big problems. I believe in the country is loneliness great The other things we're talking about speaking about is writers and loneliness So I don't know whether there should be a whole episode or not fully enough I am writing more than the last chapter I have got to write for my book is about writing and comedy and mental illness Okay, an area that I've become particularly interested in but yes, I think there's definitely a whole episode Yeah, I don't want to be a pre-end to talk about that No, also just in terms of there's also the other thing about self care as well and looking after yourself and all that kind of stuff So and getting into good habits really and That's that's probably one for another time. Yeah, we should probably talk when we talk to other writers We should probably ask them more about you know, not just how when they write But also how they write it, you know what their office looks like or what they're whether they are people who go out to write or stay in or Only write it two o'clock in the morning all that kind of stuff But I think all of those things especially if you start to get a family or whatever a very busy job a demanding job Those things all start to take their toll on you and actually you can go a little bit mad Which from a writing point of you is sort of okay? I feel earnest Hemingway for a while.
Yeah, but it's a long-term life plan. It's not no. It's not great And I don't think the art is worth it. No So this is exactly what I'm talking about in my Chapter well, so what's that book actually called and when it's called funny up?
Make your script sitcom stand up double screenplays 62% funnier. Wow. Yeah, so that's the that's the plan It's a specific it's funnier. Yeah, yeah, and it's Again, I've been I haven't quite worked out what the lawn just gonna be yet That's because I've got about ten choices that I've read and blogs and listen to webinars.
It's another word I never dreamed I would hear myself saying part of you guys when you say yes exactly But there are I think I'll probably launch it as an e-book in a couple of weeks So a few weeks time and then and then a print version of it. Yeah, so over the course of the autumn It will be coming out in various forms. Yeah My book is called the Sacred Art of joking it comes out I think it's being launched on Blue Monday in January so the the saddest day of the year right is when my book is out and it's about Comedy and why comedy why jokes go wrong and can potentially get you fired or killed And in particular, you know, how religion has to carry the camera some of that And there are a variety of faiths which have a portrait record when it comes to having a sense of humor and my own Christianity is one of them So I spent some time on that. Yes, exactly.
So so it covers that and also I did a sort of quite a lot of stuff on Jerry Spring of the Opera and what people exactly were offended about and upset about and when they complained who were they complaining to And why and what they're expecting to happen and then sort of another example of that being the Book of Mormon Which is you know a textbook case of how to take a joke, which is the Mormons did pretty well But that's partly because they're so flipping nice that they're very polite. They're not gonna say how much they actually hated it Because it's very rude about about God, but particularly about Mormonism. Yeah, so anyway, that's all to come I'll be making hopefully I'll be interviewing people in this kind of in this kind of space about that book and launching it And one of the reasons I'm doing that is I want a I'm really interested in it and be you know I'm leveraging the things I've got with his access to you know comedians who have an interest in this kind of stuff and other writers and That kind of stuff and sort of leveraging that to sell to sell my book. You're doing it yourself And even though in a way SBCK doing it they're publishing it And they're a legitimate publisher and they publish the Archbishop of Canterbury previous and Other people You know, I'm just assuming that I'll be doing all the publicity myself And I'm thrilled that they want to publish it and I probably would have self published it anyway But it's great to give them a bit of a shelf It might be less money out of it because they published it I don't know But there are other reasons for going and again just to round up the DIY stuff The reason it's good to have a legitimate publisher is it still looks good to have a legitimate publisher and self publishing still has a tinge of Alex Jones for oil hats And you know this is that this is the book that no one published well Yeah, there's one obvious reason it's my own my publisher.
I think that's partly true I think that's getting less and less true as time goes on and I think it's There's now pretty much I think Whilst that may be the feeling in the same way that people in television who were you know That's a sort of top-commissioning editors will not say oh, you know kind of going out and doing it yourself That's not the way we do things. Yeah, but they kind of they're aware they are aware even as they're saying Oh, I'm top commissioning. You see whatever they're aware that actually Everything that's happening is is changing to their disadvantage and they have to find new ways of looking at it But I do think that Nothing would have pleased me more than to get a publisher for this book But actually I looked all the obvious thoughts about it Which is first of all that I'm probably I know more about who the audience is I can probably get to that my audience Better from a marketing point of view better than they can yeah, I can get it out I'm writing and rewriting it now knowing that I'll be right writing rewriting it up to the point that I load it on to Amazon So it will be 24 hours after it comes out. It will be a day and I'm in fact You can you know you can update it and things like that So so there are just it's just a phenomenal the changes are so big that they are starting to make thoughts like always self-publishing Just like I'm accomplishing that's kind of becoming irrelevant now I think that's true and I think so for example writing that sitcom which is my my ebook very good Look at this too In a way, it feels like you're funny up is almost the sequel isn't it?
It's like you've got a dot of the script now what you do And so my script is about going from your original idea to an actual script and what to do with it once you've written it And who to send it to and stuff, but mainly it's about taking an idea and also if you want to hear us do that if you become a patron subscriber But we're starting a patron only series called soup to nuts in which we go from a basic idea to hopefully a finished product We are creating a sick we are creating a sitcom before your very ears But the reason I mention the book is because in the end my agent found a publisher for it Right and they offered me some money for it and they said we'll publish it in a year's time For this much money and I sort of did the mass and thought well hang on so a year's time That's a year's worth of sales lost. I I have a blog and a podcast that's basically going to sell 85% of the copies of this I don't quite see what I'm getting out of this deal and also once you take in advance And a percentage of royalties or whatever you then have to sell a lot of books I think in order to make more than the advance I would have had to have sold eight 10,000 copies of my book now There aren't 10,000 people in the world who want to read my book I don't think so because there aren't that many people who want to know how to write a sitcom from basic idea to me It's a technical book. So I thought well, I'll just sell it as an e-book for a fiver and that way I get probably three pounds 75 Or four I don't know how much I get from it and over the course of two three years I'll probably make the advance of what I got I still own the book in its entirety and they've copyright and everything and If it's so if I sell eight thousand copies online, I'll make considerably more than the advance So in a way, I just thought I don't actually need the advance amount of money. I've written the book anyway Well, I'm going to write anyway, so I'll do it Whereas with the second book opportunity came up.
Well, she came up and the other tell you what again these things come out the reason that SBCK Publishing it is they heard me on the radio on radio to promoting my stage play amongst tail, right? Which was a which is my DIY show that I did at the fringe with no prospect of ever being broadcast or published or anything I made my own CD and stuff to go with it and all that kind of business It's a different attempt to make money absolutely but because so that created me the opportunity to go on clebalding show on radio to And talk about it. I also talked about the idea of writing a book somebody from SBCK heard me on radio to contact me and said Oh, we'd be interested in publishing that book. Right So you never know what will come as a result of doing something as opposed to just writing something so right stuff great Continue to write stuff for me that will always still be planning anyway, but plan B is looking pretty good these days.
Yeah Look forward to seeing your book and I hope that we don't we don't cross over too much because I've got a little bit about Some I've got a lot. Yeah, I'm sure you have probably far more references to incidents in the Olden New Testament Right, yes, you have if you've got one then you've got one more than I have this is right I've even got one about Moses come on. No, sorry terrible last you all contemporary. Yes.
Okay, great. Well, I think that's our show And thanks very much for listening. Thank you. You can find us on the twits and we are sitcom geeks on Twitter You can also find us on Facebook that big blue portal which sometimes shows you things we put up and more often than not doesn't So if you follow us on Facebook, why don't you just look us up again and go and look at the posts and maybe follow us rather than like us?
I don't know if that makes any difference If you want to hear our sitcom as well come sign up for patreon. Yes Again, we have in the archive as it were ready to go and we were Steven Moffat and with al Murray and you know loads of other things besides we do patreon only podcast about the first 10 pages so if you are subscriber will read your first 10 pages and do a little podcast about it and Yeah, and also suit to nuts which is our series on just on creating a sitcom from scratch So all of those things are available You can also email us and if we're not talking about stuff You would like us to talk about email us sitcomgeeks at gmail.com. That's right. Yep, I've even got it right.
Brilliant. Well, thanks for listening I want to thank you. Thank you very much James and speak to you soon. Bye.
Bye