Secretary Wright, thank you so much for your time. Glad to be here. Thank you for being here. Absolutely.
Well, we appreciate the conversation. Let's dive right in with the big picture. If you are sitting at home in the United States, why should people in America care about what you're doing here in Venezuela? Yeah, I think it's a great example of this groundbreaking diplomacy of President Trump.
You know, Venezuela has been spiraling downhill for 25 years. Traditional efforts have really led to no progress. In fact, the problems for Americans in crime and drugs, illegal immigration, increased risk to the Caribbean neighborhood. A lot of downsides to that.
And President Trump's entirely unconventional way. Here we are at a pivot point of history, a dramatic transformation of the condition in Venezuela. No American troops here, no taxpayer dollars being spent. Like, I think it's the first of the kind.
And how is being heavily engaged in Venezuela consistent with an America-first vision and foreign policy? Because this is the Americas. This is Venezuela. This is our hemisphere.
What happens in our hemisphere is much more important to what to American lives than something halfway around the world. Not that something halfway around the world doesn't matter. This matters a lot. Eight million people have fled Venezuela.
Eight million. It's the first time in history millions of people have migrated away from a low-income country into lower-income countries. And of course a lot of those have come to the United States, and particularly a lot of the criminal elements were sent intentionally to the United States, growing gang activity into the United States, and of course to have a major oil producer, have its oil production collapse. That's an upward pressure on prices, on gasoline prices, on diesel prices, on jet fuel vacation prices.
I think everyone felt that during the Biden administration. President Trump, of course, hasn't crossed the board agenda to drive down energy prices. I'm proud of where we've gotten there. Gasoline prices are quite low today, but there's always more we can do.
There's always more energy you can bring to the world to lift up people's standards of living and grow job opportunities. And we are going to delve into your efforts to rebuild the energy sector in just a moment. But let me ask you a big picture, Mr. Secretary, who is in charge here in Venezuela?
Is it the United States or the Venezuelans? So the Venezuelans are in charge here in Venezuela, but the United States has enormous leverage over the inter-authorities in Venezuela. The largest revenue source that funds the government, that funds the government of Venezuela is now controlled by the United States. If they're driving positive change that benefits Americans and is improving the life opportunities of people in Venezuela, that money will flow.
If they steer off that path, we have to simply tremendous leverage. Again, tremendous leverage with no soldiers on the ground, no taxpayer money being spent. And within that framework, does President Trump have the final say? Of course, he's the president of the country.
Of course, he has the final say. Over what happens here in Venezuela, though? Well, over the flow of funds into Venezuela. Not what happens here in Venezuela.
But look, we're five weeks into it. And the progress, I think, has been pretty astounding. Let me ask you, because the United States did start overseeing the first sales of Venezuela and oil last month. The president said some money would go to the United States, some to Venezuela, and some to the oil companies.
How much exactly, Mr. Secretary, goes to the United States, how much goes back to Venezuela? So he's talking more broadly about, as you reopen Venezuela for business, you're going to see huge American investment in here, huge growth in corporate profits that will pay more taxes in the U.S. that will go to those companies.
But the oil sales, all of that money, is returning to Venezuela. So just to be very clear, can you guarantee that the oil revenues sent back to Venezuela will be used in a way that benefits the people here and not the regime? Oh, no guarantees in life, of course. No guarantees in life.
But what I can say is if you look at what's happened over the last 25 years, you just see a plummeting in the standard of living for Venezuelans. It has been simply tragic. We know where that path led. It led to eight million people fleeing the country.
Now we have such enormous leverage. Hundreds of political prisoners have been released. There's a free press again here, as demonstrated by our talk right here in Caracas. So we're still a long way to go.
But enormous positive progress is happening. We have auditors over the money when it comes into Venezuela to where it goes. So no guarantees, but is that President Trump's directive that the money be returned to the people of Venezuela, not necessarily the regime? Absolutely, absolutely.
This intervention, it is about changing the condition of life in Venezuela. So we don't have eight million people fleeing the country and causing problems elsewhere. In fact, one of the things I heard from business leaders today is that they're incredibly optimistic about their prospects to better their lives and their businesses in Caracas. And one of the things several of them pointed out is they expect a steady stream of returning Venezuelans.
Now the conditions are starting to pivot to the better right here. President Trump called Nicholas Maduro a, quote, illegitimate dictator. The interim president, Elsie Rodriguez, was his number two. Do you trust interim president, Elsie Rodriguez?
Ronald Reagan, trust but verify, trust but verify. We've been dealing with Elsie for five weeks now. It's been an amazing cooperation. She's delivered information.
Everything we know so far has turned out to be true. She's made enormous positive changes, including already changing the hydrocarbon law in the country in the first few weeks. So I would say that cooperation is off to a tremendous start. You already feel it as you walk the streets of Caracas today, that after so many years going the wrong direction, things are going the right direction.
I think it's the start of a long and very fruitful cooperation for Venezuelans. According to the Financial Times, the top oil trader at the company in the first sale was a mega donor to President Trump's campaign. Do you think it's appropriate for a mega donor to benefit from the sale of oil here in Venezuela? Oh, the choice of the oil traders is absolutely nothing to do, whether anyone donated to President Trump or no president Trump or doesn't like President Trump.
I made a very simple decision to engage the two largest oil traders in the world who also could move quickly. You know, this operation launched on a Monday, and we had $500 million in a bank account on Friday. Obviously, oil doesn't move and get to refineries that fast, but we did it to get maximum geopolitical leverage here in Venezuela. We get money in a bank account quickly.
We can start to improve the conditions in Venezuela, prevent it from being a failed state, and start going on a positive trajectory. But does that create an optics problem to have a mega donor benefit from the oil sales here in Venezuela? These oil traders coverage are gigantic. These sales of oil they're going to do in Venezuela.
It'll be a rounding era in the profitability of these companies, and certainly had nothing to do with that. You can find business everywhere that has a connection or gave money to someone. I can assure you, as someone who made that decision, had absolutely nothing to do. I didn't even know that fact.
You just gave me. That's news to me. But no choices that we make on energy and business and the way we do policy has anything to do with who donated to who. But we know, as you just cited, that the first sale was for $500 million.
What right does the United States have to that oil? Well, we didn't take that oil. We sold that oil, and we returned to those funds to Venezuela. As I said, President Trump's iconic classic.
He looked at traditional diplomacy sanctions, taking off sanctions, threatening this, carrots here and there, and we haven't seen meaningful progress in Venezuela for 20 years. He said, hey, look, let's use commerce and trade and particularly energy to change the trajectory of the country, and amazingly it's working. So you're saying from that first oil sale, $500 million that all of the money went back to Venezuela? Correct.
And what about the oil? Oh, the oil is going to refineries in the United States. Some of it's actually going to Europe. Right.
And what right does the United States have to that oil? This was a discussion we had with the leaders of Venezuela. We put a quarantine on their oil to stop them from exporting oil. They've been under sanctions for many years.
Their oil was sanctioned through most of the Biden administration. They just never enforced the sanctions. So all we did was say, step up, if you're going to have sanctions, you better enforce them. Well, we started to enforce the sanctions and they said, let's talk.
And we talked and we have an arrangement today that's a win for Americans and a win for Venezuela. Any of the sanctions being rolled back at this time as we're having this conversation? What we're doing right now is issuing specific licenses that gives a broad range of companies. We're rolling back sanctions in specific areas, but that that's happening as we speak today.
Selling this oil is one of those things. We had to remove the sanctions from selling the oil. So this is legal with American law. We're going to bring, we're going to have to see businesses inject investment capital in here.
All sorts of products and parts and services that need to come into Venezuela will start flowing in. Let's just drill down on the flow of money a little bit more because reports are that it's being sent to Qatar and not Venezuela. Why is that money going to Qatar and not Venezuela? So when you sell oil, you've got to deposit it into account and we have a thing in the U.S.
treasury called OFAC, which is an office that investigates foreign asset control. So this is to prevent corruption and make sure business is done right in the United States. So we wanted to put that money in a treasury controlled account and funnel it down to Venezuela. But since Venezuela has so many creditors and they owe a lot of money, we had some risk.
If we put it into a U.S. bank account, set up quickly, that creditors could freeze that money. We want those creditors ultimately to get their money back, but that money urgently needs to get to Venezuela. So an account was set up in Qatar controlled by the U.S.
government the whole time to land that money in and then send the money from there down to Venezuela. Now we haven't accounted the U.S. treasury and money won't go to Qatar anymore. So has that money actually going to Venezuela at this point?
It has indeed. Okay. And you said earlier in this conversation that American taxpayers are not going to pay for rebuilding the energy infrastructure here in Venezuela. I just want to be very clear.
Can you guarantee U.S. taxpayers are not going to pay a dime for the effort to rebuild the energy infrastructure here in Venezuela? Yes, they will not be rebuilding the energy infrastructure in Venezuela. That'll be rebuilt by American companies, by European companies, by other companies that are coming down here to grow their businesses.
But President Trump had told me earlier that the United States might need to subsidize some of the work that U.S. companies are going to do. Is that accurate? And wouldn't that come from the U.S.
sector? I would say President Trump is passionate about bringing peace, removing these pressures from American citizens and improving the quality of life in Venezuela. And he's willing to do what it takes to do that. I think the great news we can report back, and I have reported back to President Trump, we don't need to do that.
Private businesses will do it. We don't need government funding to fix the situation here in Venezuela. You've gotten that many guarantees from private businesses such that you don't think that U.S. taxpayers will have to pay a dime?
Exactly. Interest has been overwhelming. Absolutely overwhelming. Have there been any other oil sales since the initial sale?
Absolutely. Sales today are over a billion dollars. And in fact, we have sort of short-term agreements over the next few months that will bring in another $5 billion. Okay, and that money will go directly to Venezuela?
Well, that money will go into an account controlled by the U.S. government and released to authorities in Venezuela subject to audit in Venezuela and subject to continued positive progress in addressing American issues with Venezuela. So as long as progress continues down here, and I believe it most likely will, almost certainly will, the money will continue to flow here. Okay, I'm going to talk about the outster of President Nicolas Maduro.
What was the reason? Was it illegal drug trafficking or was oil the reason? Definitely not oil the reason. The United States is by far and away the largest producer of oil in the world.
In fact, we produce today more than Russia and Saudi Arabia combined and 20 times more than Venezuela does. It was not about oil, but the fact that they had oil gave us a great tool to drive positive reform again without soldiers and without taxpayer money. So, Nicolas Maduro was arrested because he has been a gang leader, a drug trafficker. President Biden raised the bounty on his head to $25 million.
President Trump raised it to $50 million. So, probably the most sought-after single individual in this world. So, not only was he impoverishing his own nation, but he was a major drug runner in the United States. So, he and his wife, complicit in that activity, are now arrested and will face trial in the United States.
You're saying this was not about oil, and yet you are the highest-ranking official to visit Venezuela in the wake of the outster of President Maduro. What message do you think that sends? Does it send a message that oil and rebuilding the energy infrastructure is the key priority? Oh, I think it absolutely sends a message that oil is tied here, and it is.
We removed a criminal, a destructive criminal for the United States of America, and because their major source of money is selling oil, gold, and drugs. We want to stop the sale and traffic of drugs through Venezuela. We want him actually to sell more oil because that drives down prices for Americans in the world. And so, he was arrested for his criminal behavior, but we're using oil as the biggest export of Venezuela as a way to control and steer Venezuela into a positive direction.
While at the same time, lower energy prices for Americans. Pretty much a win all around. Let me ask you, because the President has signaled that the United States is prepared to be in Venezuela for years. Mr.
Secretary, how long should Americans expect the United States to be in Venezuela and to play such a significant role? Well, my hope is, American business isn't tourists being in Venezuela not just for decades to come, but for centuries to come. But how long will the United States government need to be in Venezuela in the capacity that it is right now? Well, we're not really in Venezuela except opening up a small embassy.
We have far more people in Colombia than we have in Venezuela. But we do want to reestablish a diplomatic presence here, and we will continue to control the sale of their oils and the flow of their funds until a representative government is stood up in Venezuela. And we again have a prosperous American ally that's not a threat to our country. But President Trump's been very clear.
He sees the United States role as overseeing what happens in Venezuela. How long should Americans expect that role to continue years longer than a decade? No, no, no. I think that'll be concluded during this administration.
But yeah, that's, yeah, I think you will see this operation concluded during this administration. And I think we will see just a dramatically different Venezuela than by the time this administration leaves oil production will be up 50 to 100%. Natural gas production will probably be at least doubled. Venezuelans will get electricity not just a few hours a day, but most hours of the day.
We'll see incomes rising. You'll see millions of Venezuelans returning to this country. And you'll see this northern part of South America again, a prosperous, peaceful American allied region of the world. We all, of course, saw President Trump meeting with oil executives at the White House about a month ago.
And he talked about his plan to have them invest in remaking Venezuela's oil industry. Have any of those CEOs committed to the President's plan? Oh, absolutely. Absolutely.
Well, the incumbent, all of the incumbent players, Chevron, is in the midst of large expansion plans down here. Huge amount of capital, dramatic growth in their oil production. Pretty aggressive move for a big tamer company. A lot of the smaller entrepreneurs that were in that room and dozens more that were not in that room are coming down to Venezuela, are gathering data, figuring out what their niche is going to be.
Where can they add value? How can they do business? The great thing about the oil and gas business is it's done in, you know, 120 countries all over the world. Is the administration going to give oil companies security guarantees as they seek to rebuild the oil industry here?
No plans at all to do that. No plans at all. The security situation in Venezuela today is just dramatically different from what it was two months ago. People were operating here two months ago, and today the security situation, in fact, it's so great that the NBC anchor is sitting down here in Caracas.
I think that's a symbol of the change in the security situation in Caracas already. Well, let me ask you because in that meeting, Exxon CEO, as you know, Darren Woods, he said that Venezuela today is, quote, uninvestable. Do you agree with that assessment? Well, think about what he said.
This is a couple of weeks after Maduro and his wife were arrested 20 years of horrible business conditions in Venezuela. If you're a new entrant that has to deploy capital in billions of dollars at chunks, would you have dove into Venezuela on January 20th or whatever that day? Well, of course not. Darren's comment was technically true.
I will tell you Darren and Exxon or invest their engagement, their discussions with the Venezuelan government, they're gathering data, they're looking at things, they're a big company. So they're going to move slowly and carefully. But it was uninvestable, but it's on the road to becoming investable. So it's not investable yet?
There's a great nation of risk and reward. Two small capitalist, mid-sized, oil and gas companies, 100% is investable. We will see a flood of deals done this year. To a giant company like Exxon that's had its assets seized here before, that when they come in, they need to come in and scale.
Is that going to take more than a year or so for Exxon to come back? Yeah, probably. But lots of American companies and other international companies will be investing in Venezuela this year. Do you think that the Trump administration is now responsible for what happens in Venezuela?
In other words, if you break it, you buy it. I think we do have a meaningful co-authorship of the future of Venezuela right now. President Trump wants to drive peace and prosperity, and he's willing to take a risk to do it. Again, a great example is a wonderful outcome here guaranteed, of course not.
If you're not willing to take any risk, you're stuck with a status quo. Status quo in Venezuela was really horrific. So bad, it was spilling over to our own country. But I personally, and I would say across the administration, quite optimistic about the trajectory of Venezuela.
I think it'll be probably one of the proudest achievements of our administration when we leave office. Does the fact that the highest US ranking official who is here is the energy secretary send a message that oil and energy is the top priority over democracy? No, oil and energy are the top economic engine in Venezuela, right? If you want to have Venezuela going in a positive direction, you've got to have a successful oil and gas industry that will lead to a successful manufacturing industry and a rebuilt electricity grid and rising wages.
So it's the core industry to lift the boat up in Venezuela, but Venezuela had a long history of democratic elections, representative government, alliance with the United States. The plan is to get back to there and pretty confident we will. You take me to my next question. When can the world expect to see what has been touted as free and fair elections in Venezuela?
You know, these things take time in a society that hasn't had a free and fair election in quite some time. It held elections, but they weren't free and they weren't fair. So that's a process. You know, that's meant, you know, as I said, I think within this administration, but that's many months.
So you think that there could be elections here in Venezuela before the end of the second Trump administration? Yes, I think that's quite likely the outcome. And in terms of the opposition leader, Maria Carina Machado, who of course visited with President Trump, she's been very clear that she would like to return to Venezuela. She has not ruled out the possibility and in fact would like to seek the presidency.
Is that something that the Trump administration would support? That's for Venezuelan people that decide not us, but absolutely no opposition to that at all. In fact, I listened to her on a podcast a few days ago and she was asked that question. How fast can they hold elections in Venezuela?
What do you think should happen, Maria? And she said to get it, that probably the fastest it could be done, it probably takes nine to ten months to get there. So I think she's realistic about what the changes that need to happen. There's some that say we have elections tomorrow.
Like those have no chance of being free and fair. So it is a question of a process to get there. And ultimately what the long-term political leadership in Venezuela is going to be, it's going to be up to Venezuelans. We thank you for watching and remember stay updated on breaking news and top stories on the NBC News app or watch live on our YouTube channel.
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